Pats from the Past: Episode 3, Dan Koppen

when I was my senior year. Yeah, I'd played another year after that, but two thousand and one, Um, you know they had a pretty good year that year, right, And that's probably where it started with a BC center, right. True? Were you just were you excited just to be drafted in the NFL at that point in time? Yes, yeah, and no doubt about it. It's just it didn't for those guys coming out of college and for everybody for coming out of college. It's just an honor to be drafted.

That's what you worked for and you know, that's what you dream of it as a little kid. So whether it was a Pats or you know, the Raiders, or hell, the Bengals for for that matter, throw them in there. You're gonna go where you're told, right, we're football players. Did you have any idea where you'd be drafted and you were in the fifth round, obviously we were hoping to be hired. Did you care? In the end, I

guess it really doesn't matter. Um, I think you always want to be you know, there's a little bit of competition, and you know you got some pride, so I guess you'd always want to be higher. But um, you know, fifth round pick um? You know I didn't. You don't think this was gonna happen. You know, it wasn't one of those kids that in high school, I know I'm going to be playing in the NFL or college. It was just sort of take a step by step and

if I get the opportunity, great. So Um, as far as did I know, you know, I heard the Bengals, you know, we're we're we're interested in the beginning, maybe a couple other teams. But the funny thing is, I had no idea the Pats we're gonna pick me. Never sat down with them, never talked with them. I no. Scar was at my workout at at PC and that's the only thing I know. And they had a relatively

young center, right. They was a first round pick. Yeah, you know I'm going there with the first round pick and coming in and it's like, okay, you know this, this is gonna be tough. I there was no you know, definite that I was gonna make the team. I was just gonna say, what was your expectations did you think? Did you say, I think I can make this team or were you just let me just take it one

day at a time. There was one day at a time, and then you learned pretty quickly you better take it one day at a time up here for the rest of your career. Um, you know, I think luckily, I mean not luckily. I don't think what he practiced, whether you know, his hamstring from the conditioning run or whatever. It was my first practice. I don't think what he was practicing. So I was thrown with the first unit on day one, and that was back when you know you're putting full pads on the first day for a

number of days straight. You know, there's no rules or regulations. You know, Bill could do what he wanted to you. So we threw the pads on first day. I'm with the starting offense. Uh during training camp, and you know, probably pretty anxious, nervous. So wait minute, then, if the rules were in place that are in place today, maybe you don't even emerge or get the opportunities to emerge

and in training camp. Yeah, no, I mean I think you know, obviously you got to prove it, you know, over a length of time, and uh, the coaches need to have trust in you. The guys around you need to have trust in you, uh, in order to make this football team. Um. And it really I think me being in there and be able to function gave me some confidence that they had, you know, didn't put me on the team. You know, you had to sustain that and keep getting better. Did you Did you have a

scar moment? Is there a scar moment that you remember early on your rookie year, you know you sort of can keep your head down. Um, I had a couple moments where you know, there's always plays where maybe you go the wrong way or do the wrong thing. But I mean we were running an outside zone to the right and I went left, the only person on the offensive line, and it's it's it's probably one of the easiest players to run. All you basically have to do

is go to the right. I go to left. There's four guys going to the right and one guy going to the left, and it's just you know, you come back in and it's you look at the the the images on the play after in between series, and that play comes up and sometimes those pictures happen, you know, maybe a second or two into the snap, and sure enough there's four guys going to the right and me right in the middle going to the left. And got an earl earful from Scar on that one. But you

learn really quick too. I mean, you're a rookie. You keep your head down, you don't say a lot. You just try and do the best you can. But you know, those other guys that get comfortable or whatever, you know, you learn that Scars not afraid to to to get in you. It also helped that you could shotgun snap. They didn't have to switch. I think Compton, you know, really appreciated that when I was in there. Yeah, he didn't have to move over to center. Um. Yeah, So

and then what do you went in? Started game one that was the thirty one and nothing game up in Buffalo. Um bred you through a pass London Fletcher came and you know, sort of clear Kolcock Woody, so he went out, he had to Bruce Sturnham, so he didn't play week two in Philly. So I played week two and then Compton, you know, broke his foot or rebroke it from training camp, and then when he came back, they moved him the

left guard and that was it. So did that surprise you or at that point time, maybe Dana you conditioned to not be surprised. I'm not surprised at that point, because you know, when you you're only gonna keep eight or nine guys. If they're dressing you, they're dressing you for a reason. Sometimes we only dress seven linemen in a game, so if someone goes down, you're going in. You don't have a choice. You don't have a choice

when we have two guys suited up to play. So when he went down, it just was one of those natural things like okay, I'm just we're just gonna step in and go. The center has a lot of responsibilities, obviously, with calling out certain protections and whatnot. I've always perceived here that Tom does a lot of that. Can you kind of give us some insight on how that works with the center and the quarterback here? Well, Tom does

a lot here. There's there's no doubt about it. Um, Josh and Charlie, you know, whoever was the offensive cordiner or Billy Oh. You know, the quarterback can see the whole field and they can see the safeties, they can see the corners, they can see the rotation and where where everybody is. So most teams, the center will call the mic point, which is the middle linebacker in every protection. Every run scheme is based off of that. That's he's the middle guy, and everybody knows who's who's who and

who has who after that point. So you know, if I can't see the rotation very well, um, you know, being you know, bent down and you know, touching the ball, you know, it makes sense that the quarterback can do it. That being said, he I identify as the quarterback. The play calls, a play call the protections of protections. Everybody's got to do their job after that point and make their specific call. Sometimes, you know, the center has a

little bit more um, a little bit more control. But here, like everybody was really smart, especially on the offensive line, Matt, like you know, Russ Hoaks tied, Steve, Neil, Joe and drewsie Worth, all those guys Logan forever. You know, they were smart, so you didn't really have to tell them what to do. They knew what I was doing. I knew what they were doing, and um, you know, you really really got in there if it was something need

to be corrected or we switched something up. As you're starting your NFL career, Tom has got a ring under his belt and a couple years on his belt. But Tom's not Tom at that point in time, And so did it help you maybe that as you're developing, as you're starting your NFL career, you're kind of doing it in tandem with him, as opposed to you know, Ferrens, who you know is just getting his first start maybe this week, and he's looking up and is going okay, And I know that that's got to he's got to

get rid of that thought pretty quickly. But it's a different Tom than when you started, when you were playing. Yeah, but I mean France has been here for a couple of years now, right, So yeah, I think he's pretty comfortable and he knows who Tom is. And you're right, Tom wasn't you know the met Galla guy going with you know, the supermodel wife to h you know, to that party. So but it was fun. You see, still quarterback that won a Super Bowl and everybody knew his name.

You know, you go out to dinner at that point and you know, you just really he couldn't even get a Biden at some point because you know he was that guy? Was he? But you meet him the first time and you realize quickly he's not that guy that you see and you know he's just he's a down to earth as they come. Was he demand? Was he? Was? He as demanding that early on in his career when

you started, as he was when you left New England. Uh. I think that's what makes him and you know, not only him, but all winners, winners or you know, competitors, they demand a lot from you every day and you know that's how he makes this team better, that's how he gets better. So you want that in a quarterback, that to be that demanding. Yeah, I mean, let being said, you know, he's a guy throwing the ball and handing the ball after in practice, right, He's not out there

hitting every day. So when he gets when he gets angry and yells in the huddle in the middle of day fourteen a training camp. The lines sitting there look at HS like relaxed, buddy, you haven't been hit for two weeks, so that could get redhaired up. That gets a little old, and it's like, come on, just go over there and play catch. That's oh yeah, hey, go

try and throw the ball in the barrel. Well, every while the offensive line the defensive line are just sitting there sucking wind and you know, their body aches getting yelled at by Scar. Yes, and there was no downtime with Scar, no doubt. During special teams. You go other places. Special teams are like breaks for offensive line. Here we were working on screens, we were working on There was no downtime. And you know, again that's what makes this

team special. They're not afraid to work. And that demanding part of it though, I mean I was focusing on Tom there, but it's not a Tom thing. It's an organization thing. It comes from the top, you know, So Bills demanding, the assistant coaches are demanding your position, coaches demanding their quarterbacks demanding. That has to rub off on

your entire unit. Absolutely, I mean, you're right, it comes from the top and it's Bill, And you see how hard he works those coaches, but in return, those coaches work that hard. So you know there's a respect there. And when you see your coaches doing that, you know you want to to return that respect. Did the best he can for him and the staff and what they do in the hours that they put in. It's a it's amazing. It's funny you mentioned Tom wasn't that guy,

like he wasn't the six time yet. I still remember after your rookie year, I went in the locker room during rookie orientations. There was no media and it wasn't a media time. I was. I had a feature story lined up that I was doing with Tom and I was sitting at his locker interviewing him about the super Bowl and about you know, just his career to that point. And Cedric Cobbs, I think it was running back Arkansas,

he was a rookie. He walks over, He interrupts us, He goes, excuse me, I just wanted to introduce myself, mister Brady Cedric Cobbs and said. He goes, nice to meet you. I'll talk to you soon, and he walks away. I go, mister Brady, Yeah, what was he probably twenty four time looking around for his dad. Now you can get away with it at five forty right now, right, So your rookie year, Dan, you know that's got to be pretty heavy stuff. You know, you get drafted, you

don't know what's going to happen. You know, all of a sudden, you get your insert into the lineup. You guys go fourteen and two and you're in the super Bowl. You'r rookie year, yea, And then you start to everybody talk smack, you know, and you and I don't know if the SAP stuff got to you or you guys, Oh yeah, yeah, because we had a backup, backup guard

playing in the playoffs, right and not a big deal. Okay, that must have been a pretty heavy thing for a kid in his rookie year to be playing in the Super Bowl and playing on this team and having the kind of record that you guys had that year and getting ready to play in that game. It's a long season, you know, you have seventh we were, but nineteen games at that point. You throw four preseason games and um, you're going from the combine into mini camps and OTAs

and training camps. So that first year is really long. And then you throw nineteen games onto that. It is long, and wouldn't have it any other way, but it's it's you're so new to it. You know, you don't really know, you don't you know, first game, first snap, you snap it and the nerves go right, and that's usually how it goes. That's how it was basically from my first game on. But not the Super Bowl. I mean that's just a different game. I think my hand was shaking

for ten ten minutes and well into the second quarter. Wow, it that game gets to you. But I remember at the Rookie Symposium, someone got up on stage and was just like, take a look around. It's all the rookies that got drafted. Just take a look around one of this you know groups you sit as a team. One of these teams is going to walk away with like super Bowl rings. And looking back on it after that years like, holy crap, you know we were the ones that were able to walk away with super Bowl rings,

you realize how special it is. What was it like when during that week when when Warren Sapp was talking about that, I mean, Ross was going up against Chris Jenkins, Pro Bowl All Pro type player, and you know he kind of was that unproven guy. It was filling in and Buckner, Julius Peppers. Yeah, I forget the other defensive end, but that Yeah, that front four was good. And h I think it's it's good Like Russ has played for us before. We had complete confidence in him. You know,

we practiced next to him. It wasn't a matter of oh, we got to back up. It was just like, Okay, Russa is in and he was in for the a FC championship game, and he was in after what he got hurt, and you know they believe it's a Tennessee game or something. Yes, so he played a lot in those playoffs. So for us, it's really just you know, ignore what they're saying, but use it. You know, let's go out there and show him that we can go. I don't think we gave up a sack since he

came in. Maybe I didn't. We definitely didn't give a sack up a second in the Super Bowl. I don't think so. No. So you're talking about a long year and rookie symposium in nineteen games and all this stuff, mini camp, and and so you win it and then you win it again the next year. It was so fun let's just do it again. Yeah. Yeah, that's a out of football in two years. And I guess that's that's how you come in the NFL and just go

back to back right real quick? Did was there a point in time and I don't know if the train's still going really fast and you haven't had a chance for really to catch up, But are you thinking they're going? You know, my first two years we went. I mean, nobody wins back to back Super Bowls. It's a it's a monumental accomplishment to get there, let alone win it. You went it your first two years. Do you do you take a second and go, Wow, this doesn't happen

very often. I might be a part of something special here. Uh yeah, I think so, because I remember talking to Rodney or hearing him say he went to the super Bowl his rookie year and then I don't even think he touched the playoffs and definitely never made it back

to the super Bowl until that year. So you look at how long his career at that point at that point was and how good he was, and how good some of those teams he was on were, and I think that puts that back to back in perspective when a guy like that hasn't been there since his rookie year. It's I mean, this league's meant to be sort of balanced, and these teams are you know, it's supposed to be

competitive and everybody's a professional. Everybody's big, everybody's smart, everybody's fast, and there's a lot of good coaches out there to win. You know, thirty four and four my first two year, ridiculous rings right, that's pretty good. Yeah, that's a culture here. I mean it was people just put their head down and you know, don't worry about last year, don't worry about last week. Let's just what can we do this

week to be this this team. But as you're now out of it, Dan, okay, can you look back and do you look back with it with a little bit of a fondness to say you just said the words that's the culture here. You are part of building that culture here. You know, there are guys who are coming in today who look back at a Dan Copen and go, wow, I remember him, look at how many years he played

here and things like that. I'm not trying to, of course they do, but after this, after this podcast, But I mean, you are a part of that, and it is different now because you were part of something that you did build. Yeah, no, I never looked at it. Someone mentioned that to me within the last year and usually I just say no. But it is kind of cool to see what they're doing here. Obviously we're not

in there working with them and they're going out. You know, it's kind of like Bill, you know, I'm not the one out there making plays. You guys are. They're out on the football field. But to see them doing so well, um, and really acting as we did back then and keeping that culture as he said as uh, you know, it's it's a proud thing and um, you know, I hope everybody that was here that established that has you know a little pride and putting that in here and you know,

instilling it and it's still here. You've got ownership in it, regardless of where you were in that. You know, there's a lot of people who were involved in that. But you've got to look, you've got you all have a little bit of piece of that. Yeah, and you know they see him do well, but yeah, we take pride and not for sure what does it take to be I mean I think you quickly became one of Tom's guys. What does it take to be one of Tom's guys?

Just trust? I guess, you know, I mean, yeah, to just just trust and you know, and when we stepped away from the football field, and it really on the football field from one, there's a there's a relationship that a quarterback in the center half. Sometimes the snaps are just easy and you know, it just sort of fits, and sometimes it's not, and you got to really work at it. You know, from day one when I came in, there was never any issues of snaps. You know, we

were on the same page. It felt good, you know, it just it. There was a good relationship and I think they just carried off the field as well. And when we went out, we had a good time and it wasn't about you know, football time. There was you know, a friendship off the field as well. Sadly, there's probably not a lot of people Brian listening to this that remember this. But I know Dan does. I know that

both of us do. But and again it did a different era, Dan, but you know, you maybe got a chance to um receive or taste some of the spoils that were as being associated with Tom Brady. I hope everybody remembers the visa commercial. Yeah, you know, yeah, and that was protection five Layers of Protection, right. Russ Hochstein was the star of that one, no doubt. But that was a pretty cool thing, don't you think. Yeah, I forgot about that. I actually have a copy of that

at home. But yeah, that was that was that day like that was that was. That was fun because it was with all of us. Um. But it's kind of weird because you're in a trailer and you know, you're the only ones with full gear on and you sit there. He's got regular clothes on and you're taping up or and you got people putting makeup on or something and cameras and lights for the first time and directors, um. But you know, he got that for us, and you know, I was like, he's kind of a big deal. How

come you get to be fraud protection. I want to be fraud protected? Yeah, I want to be coaching at the end, right, right, was it did did that and so you know you obviously wanted in his second year and was you know, you could see the ascent happening, but as you're kind of being a part of that and the rest of the line of everything. Do you see, Hey, something's happening here. You know, this guy's he might be

a little bit better than just a good player. Was there something there after those couple times where you want it? I think, yeah, there's no way you can deny it at that point of how good he was, Um and the great ones do they just out work. It doesn't matter what level he got or you know, he was the best player in the NFL back then, he still worked as he was that, you know, like he was the last draft picker won whatever what eighty one or

whatever he was nine. So you know, it's you see the work that they put into it, and they deserved the success because you know, that's how you get there. And at that point, what he was able to do,

UM win with different teams. You know, we were a defensive team, we were a running team in the beginning, you know, ball control and these tight scoring games, low scoring games, and then we won then and then we won to know seven when we opened everything up and we're you know, probably more of a passing team at that point, Um, but we were able to flip flop and do different identities, and he could he could be the you know the guy and can command them on

all of them. So that's pretty cool. So speaking of hard work, um, I was talking to Dwayne Allen last year at the tight end, who had played for the Colts and was on the team came here and lost forty five to seven, and he said, when he was on the Colts, he looked across the sideline at the end of that game and he just didn't get it, like, why are we getting killed by this Patriots team? They're not better than us? And then he signed here and

he said, simply, I realized they just work harder than everybody. Yes, Is it that simple? I think? I mean yes and no. But that's probably the best way to put it, because you know, when I went to Denver, not to say that they didn't work hard. They did, and you know everybody works hard, but there's just a different level of work ethic or what's expected or what is working hard here is probably out of you know, thirty one clubs,

you know the league. You know, they just they just can't keep up, and it's it's a day to day grind and it's it's expected every day we go somewhere else like this, Isn't that hard. You know you can you can do this and it's fun and you know they win too sometimes. Can you can you define that? Maybe so for people who don't understand what that means, Dan,

because I think everybody assumes that everybody works hard. What how would you define what working hard here in New England means you're expected to know the opponent before you even get a game plan. Right, So the games on Sunday you have, you're in here on Monday, Tuesday, you're off Wednesday morning at eight o'clock, you're already prepared before Bill starts asking questions at eight o'clock in the morning. They haven't even passed out a game plan, you know,

So you're doing that in your off days. Like I said before, with the special team units on other teams, linemen are resting. If you get downtime, you can rest. There's no downtime in practice because they can use that time to get better, whether it's just going over talking stuff, but there's no breaks, so you know that stuff. You know, guys focusing maybe more on you know, their teammates than themselves and not really give and into the you know,

the banter back and forth between other other teams. That happen sometimes and just really, hey, that other stuff doesn't matter. It's it's what we do in this locker room and on that football field. That's not for everybody either, by the way. No, it's tough. It's tough. And I played for Bill for nine years and he'll tell you after every year he appreciates what you do, and you know, he's a hard guy to play for. But after nine years, he's a he's a hard guy to play for and

not everybody can do it. Do you think playing for him as you embark on this other part of your life right now, or there are things that you take from him that you know help you maybe in business or maybe even being a dad for that. You know, I tell people all the time. You know, it's not just the NFL. It's just not the Patriot way. It's

kind of you know, how you live your life. You get a lot of great qualities and values from playing sports, and especially team sports with discipline and accountability and work ethic and uh, you know, teamwork and developing that sense of camaraderie. And that's that you can use it your personal life. You can use it in your business life, and if you're you're honest with yourself and you're trying to be that good person in trying to put it,

you know, an honest day's work in. You know, chances are you going to be successful at whatever you do. You mentioned we talked earlier about you know, first two years back to back and just a thrill of victory and winning two Super Bowls your first two years. Let's fast forward two years into the AFC Championship game in Indianapolis. Does that one still keep you up at night at all? Yeah, there's a couple that one. That one definitely does you

know that that we let that one slip away? Um, you know, unfortunately things happened and they got on a roll, and you know we say it all the time, but they just made more plays than we did in especially late in the game. Um, you get sixty and Kleo scoring that game? Yeah, Cleco Logan Logan scored, I believe for us and the ball bounced right and if it would have bounced left, I would have had it. But then thinking back, it's like, what I really want my only touchdown to be in a game that we lost,

especially the AFC Championship game. So it was Yeah, it was a weird game. They just got on a roll and just couldn't We couldn't make enough places down the stretch. It. But there's I'm sure you know the Yeah, does losing suck more than winning? Is you fork? Short term? Yes? I think absolutely. If you get to the FC Championship game or you get to the Super Bowl and you lose, you know that feeling of missing that opportunity and being able to hoist that trophy again is definitely probably more.

You feel a little bit more than winning it afterwards for sure. Okay, so let's roll into it then. I mean, you're just gonna go. You lost, you lost it. You were eighteen to l you had it wouldn't have been better to lose a game that year? Were you guys grinding too hard at that point? And did it just come to a head. I wish we lost if we're gonna lose a game, I wish we lost one before that. Um, But that but that being set because eighteen and one, no,

no super good chance? All right? But that being said, no, because it really doesn't matter at that point. There's only one game left, right The other games that you played mean nothing. So if we will go seven or sixteen or fifteen and one, and then we make it to that Super Bowl and we're you know, sixteen and two. It's still the same feeling as eighteen and one or seventeen, you know what I mean, It's still that same that that defeat and sadness of losing that game. So I

don't think we are grinding too hard. I think, you know, there's just you know, just ran out at the end and you just can't can't put one more together. And then that's a shame too, because you know, losing that game still is tough, you mentioned, you know, think just thinking about it, and I think the other day I happen to watch and it's going to come out in the next week or so, the Saban Belichick documentary. And

so now Bill's on record. You know, I think people in New England it's almost it's a decent Powler sport. Should they have lost somewhere along the way? Bills on the record now and saying in that document, you know, looking back at it, he goes, I wonder if we would have been better off losing another game. That to me is kind of surprising because everything you guys were conditioned to do that year brew was great about it.

Bill was great about it. It's just it's a one game season and you had sixteen one game seasons that regular season. Yea, that were it was unbelievable. You know what, Yeah, I know what he's trying I know, I think I know what he's saying. I'm not going to speak for him. I never would probably still get in trouble or get benched. I know, I know what he's trying to say, and I know what he means. Um, but I think we really had a mentally tough football team and an adventure

and a veteran game that year. So yeah, I'd like to give us more credit, Like it's not about nineteen Oh we can't handle the pressure. You know, we just played really bad on the game that we couldn't play bad. But it just doesn't It just was that right, we could practice. That wasn't your best week of practice, No week wasn't there. I think that. I think I think, you know, we we went after it a lot, you know,

we you know, we were gasped a little bit. I think I think, you know, guys were just thinking too much. Maybe not necessarily, Oh it's nineteen and oh, but you know, there was a lot of a lot of mental gymnastics going on on that offensive line during that game. Now we were looking for I don't think we were playing as fast as we usually did mentally and seeing things slow because you know, different checks or audibles and all that stuff. There was a lot going on, so I

make an excuse it. And they had a pretty good front they did. I mean, they could get after the pastor especially when they put that you know, NASCAR package in and they're throwing tuck inside or human aura or even straighthand comes down on the three they got. They got four legitimate pass rushers that can get after the quarterback. And then they bring cross stunts every now and then.

You know, we just, yeah, the game sucked. But um, and you're sitting going I'd like to give us a little bit more credit, you know, because you know we did want to go nineteen and oz. Um. But you've also maybe alluded to the fact that you ran out again. I don't mean you personally yea of trying to go nineteen and O. I don't think it was more. I think it was physical, you know, physically. I think we ran out of gas and we're playing a little bit slow.

I don't think mentally. I think mentally, you know, you know sixteen and oh versus you know, we went eleven to five or ten and six. I don't think I ever went ninety seven. But some of those ten and six seasons are easier than that sixteen. And because Bill coached hard that year. I mean it was we're winning fifty five to ten or fifty seven to three or whatever. Randy Moss is going for four or five touchdowns against Buffalo in the first half, and we're blowing teams out.

But we came in on Monday and sure enough, Bill, Bill found a lot of plays. You know, we were striving for perfection that year. I mean, never you know, you can't attain it. And Bill was Bill coached hard that year. Already knew what type of team you had. You know we could handle it. It's just, you know, I think physically we ran out and mentally we were just there's a lot going on in people's heads. You know.

You know, Dan, well, if I go back to the oh one season before you were here, the Patriots played the Rams during that regular season and lost, and but they can emerge from that game saying if that's the best team in the league. We can compete, we could have won. Do you think the Giants did the same thing after the thirty eight to thirty five season finale, Yeah,

no doubt. And and then they had a good team, you know, and they say, you know, it's kind of like a few other few other within the past few years. That team one got confidence against us because they went toe to tell with us um and then and then the game meant nothing for both teams too. By the way we had cleared the best was that was probably the best final game of a regular season, you know, because now you guys rest right, you know, we had nothing to play for. We had first seed, like locked

up first round. By they were already in the playoffs. I believe it is a wild card. So usually teams just rest. That was no, that was one on ones and we're getting after it. So that was a really cool last game. And that tells you about the two guys who are the coaches there, and you know what, we're not going to do this. Let's let's go. Let's compete, because that's that's an essence, that's what this is about. Competing. Yep. And I think it did give them confidence that uh,

no doubt. And plus they got hot. They got hot at the right time. They're playing really good football and you know they made more plays in that game than we did. That's the bottom line. I'm gonna put you on the spot. Second year in the league, you guys go fourteen and too, Corey Dillon's sixteen hundred yards, you win back to back Super Bowl championships. I think there's a lot of people in New England area that think that's the best Patriot team of this era two thousand

and seven. We all know what happened eighteen and one. What's the best? What's the best team that you played on? Oh? There are different teams about I mean the best one probably, I mean, oh four, yeah, probably, because you gotta win it in order to got the conversation. You gotta be. You gotta win it to be the best. I mean, we go nineteen to nine and you're probably you know, throwing us against the eighty five Bears, right, you know?

Now it's I don't you know? And you look at those lists of teams, how far down are the seven o seven team was in the top ten and they just released at like the last two or three weeks, which I was sort of here. Yeah. I think he might have been as high as eight or seven. Yeah, I mean that that team was stacked too. I mean we just did it a different way, right, you know we were opened up, we were spread, we were no

you know, uh empty a lot that year. You had Welker coming in and Moss and uh Stalworth, Um Gaffney thinking yeah, yeah, yeah, Daffney. I mean he caught caught the Ballimore Yeah, right, that was a comeback and team alright, just can't stop being stupid. You know, I hear, I hear in your voice a little bit, Um, Dan, you know the frustration maybe as you as we're making you, we live this a little bit. But I'll ask you this, Um,

with the perspective of time. The old phrase, is it better to have loved and lost when you look back at it and you've had a little time. You know, Hey, I'm glad we went for it. I'm glad we tried to go nineteen and ozer and you know what, we gave it our best shot. We just ran out of gas at the or We got beat by a team that beat us and played better than pay. You can honestly say, you know it hurts and you're angry, but they played better. So I mean it's not like it

was side. Maybe we play him ten times, maybe we beat him nine, right, you know, but that day was the one. So um, you know there's nothing to you know, put your head down about and you get angry, but you still you still made it there. And early on probably like, God, no, I don't even want to get there. Let's just lose in the AFC Championship game and we don't have to, you know, suffer the loss of a Super Bowl. But screw that. You want to get there.

You want to have the opportunity, the chance to play in that game and to win that game. Um, if you don't, if you don't win the championship game, you're not gonna have that opportunity. So you definitely want to get there. I got a question about oh four um in that Super Bowl. I remember after the game at the post game party, I was talking to Eric Mangini and he was like, just relieved that Brian Kinchen executed the final snap. Yeah, Now, I had no idea that

during that week he was a bit of a mess. Yeah, what did you guys? Know? What was that? Like? You know what I don't even because Paxson got hurt that year, and I think McDermott was the second guy who got you. Yeah, I want to say he got a cut or something, didn't cut his hand or something like that, and that was why, like the snaps were sort of like fifty or you know, fifty fifty. I don't know what's going to happen here, So I think he had a cut

or something or stitches, um, which made it. But yeah, when comes down to like a field goal, you just one more time, buddy, just just make one more play. And you got to you gotta hold up the block and keep him out, and Adam's gonna make that kick, which you know complete confidence he would. You had some injury problems towards the end of your Patriot's career and

then you had a chance. Um, not your choice, but maybe at the end it was your choice, and you went to Denver and you had that one kind of magical year a little bit in Denver where Peyton was there. Not many people can sit there and say, yeah, I snapped for Tom Brady, I snapped for Peyton Manning. If they're not the two best quarterbacks in the history of the NFL, It's a pretty good debate about it. How fun or different maybe was that for you after playing

so long here too? That was fun, I really did. I had a good time in Denver, especially that first year. The second year I blew my knee out in training camp, but I was looking forward to playing up there again. You know, the the area is beautiful, the stadium's beautiful, The fans are really cool to play for. They get into it, you know, and the guys on the team were really good. We had we had, we had a good group. We won a lot of football games that year.

And like you said, we had Peyton, which was kind of cool to play with him and get to know him. I knew him for years before that, but you know, really, you know, spend some time with him, which was kind of cool. And you realize again why Tom Brady's Tom Brady and why Peyton Manning was Peyton Manning Because the work that they put in and what they expect out of the guys and how smart they are that football field. So what would you say the differences are? Uh, personality,

It really is personality, you know. You know, Peyton's very serious a lot of things, even though he's a great storyteller and really a funny guy. Great yeah, good actor, good on those nationwide commercials, um, and funny as hell. Um. But he's really serious and it is about football. I mean that's what this guy grew up with with his dad and and now him and you know his brother and you know, I got another one coming up or something like that pretty soon. It's just he is football

and just doesn't take that hat off very often. And and uh, he expects a lot, but he would rather have things very simple because he needed to know. Everybody needed like they knew what they were doing, and he needed to do that. He know that he needed that reassurance and trust um that those guys knew exactly what he wanted them to do. Um. Tommy, Tommy has been in one system his whole career. You know, Tommy's you know, more laid back. You know, you can go out. He'll

get away from football a little bit. Um, maybe I because I had more time with him for nine years. But you know Tommy, you know, we we go five wide, and you know he's he knows that offense and he knows what to do it and he's not afraid to just you know, all right, let's let's go five out instead of I. You know, it doesn't need to be perfect. We'll figure it out as we go. We're talking with Dan Copen here and Dan my last question here is

I think fans would like to know. So now you're in the next phase of your life, um, the non football phase of your life. Yeah. We uh Line Cider Brewing Company. It's in East Grane, Rhode Island. You know, me and a buddy UM started thinking about it probably about three years ago and we've been open for a year now, basically a Black Friday. We just had our year anniversary. So uh, you did a couple other things

beforehand and just really wasn't finding it. But you know, thirty four, thirty five there, six years old, you're two young, retire you got to find something to do every day and start home ruin and there was like found you know, buddies with this guy. He wanted to change and we just decided today let's just take it up a notch and try and open up a brewery. And you know, thankfully for the year last year, you know, we've been able to do that and it's been fun and new

and challenging. UM, and we're learning every day. So my last question, is your beer better than Matt Light's vodka? I would like to think so. And I hope he comes in here and you ask him that question, and I hope he says keel. But the line sider beer is pretty good. We're you know, we figured out a lot of things from going we you know, we started with five gallon batches at home and now we're brewing three hundred gallon batches or one hundred and ten in

our you know, our smaller firm enter. So there's a little bit of a learning curve there, um, But for a year in I think, you know, we're just going to get better as we go. So it's it's exciting. We all need something to get out of bed and be passionate about. You Certainly we were passionate about playing in the National Football League. When you get up today, you're passionate about the brewery and all that beer industry. Brewery, you know, and you know, we got I got three kids,

they're ten, eight and six. You know, my wife owns a gym as well, so you know, when they're at school, we're working. But then when you know they've got hockey practice, my boy plays hockey, and boy, that schedule is not fun. There's I wish it was six I really at six am. If they're not bad, I would I would go to six, I'd go to four thirty. It's the traveling that these kids gotta do, gotta do. We're going two and a half hours the New Hampshire for a game on Saturday.

That's you know, two three hours the main for easy. Yeah, it's a great it's fun. I really enjoy watching it and play watching him play, but the travel is not Does he like it? That's the most important thing for Yeah, for ten year old, he does not complain. For as much time as he's on the ice and practice three days a week and four games on the weekend, he is not complained one time. That's great. If he's not going to complain, I'm not going to complain and he

can play whatever it was and it goes fast. Our guest is Dan Copenkats from the Past Podcast. Dan, Thanks for stopping by, thanks for being here, thank you, thanks for having me. Thank you for downloading this podcast. Subscribe on Apple, google Play, and everywhere else you listen. Like the show, Please rate and review us listener comments and ratings help keep us high in the podcast rankings, so new listeners can find us. Be sure to checkpatriots dot com for more news and more podcasts.