Patriots Catch-22 10/26: Defending Mobile QBs, Jets Preview, QB Situation (Where Do We Go From Here?)

regular time. We got some extra time too, because locker rooms not until four pm, so we'll have some time to talk to you guys over the next hour or so, let's call it an hour plus. But not not what I was expecting to be talking about today, Alex. I thought we were going to come into the show today on a three game winning streak, with the conversation being

were driven by Okay, how real is this right? Did they just beat up on bad teams like they did at times last year during that seven game winning streak? And how much can stock can we put into it? In all this type of thing, I could never imagine that we would be sitting in a position not necessarily look at any given Sunday or any given Monday in this case, that things can happen and you can lose

games to any team in the NFL. But this really feels like a franchise altering sort of moment, right because you drafted this quarterback in the first round of the draft last year. And I don't think that the decision to not go with Mac moving forward at least for this season, if that is the decision, is ankle related, right, I don't think this is an injury related decision. I

think this would be more performance related decision. And that means that you're kind of pressing the reset button at that position, which obviously means we're in a totally different charted water then if they had just played poorly against Chicago and lost the game, right, this is a much bigger conversation than that. I do want to get into how each quarterback and specifically Mac actually played in the game.

Not necessarily all the drama, but I think you have to address the elephant of the room off the top, and that this is a dramatic moment for this organization right now. Yeah, yeah, you know, everybody's kind of I've seen people trying to nail down what did this game feel like, what it looked like. The game that came to mind for me was the twenty twenty game against the Niners. Yeah, and the Patriots had had some success early in the year. They lost that tough one and

you know, they lost late in Seattle. They lost the tough one against Kansas City when cam at COVID. They came back the next week they played a close one against the Broncos after a COVID riddle week, and it was like, hey, you know, there might be something here. They've had some stuff to overcome, but they've put some competitive football on tape when they're healthy. You know, the Niners weren't great that year. They were three and three coming into that game. They end up finishing six and

ten and it was twenty six six. The score didn't, i would say, accurately reflect how lopsided that game was. And that was the first time in that season it was like, Okay, they might need to hit the reset button on this. And I'm not saying that it's totally time for reset, but that game really had you. I don't think you're looking at that game and thinking, okay, like you know they, like you said, it's not like they played poorly, and it happens any given Sunday. You

move on. That game kind of makes you reflect on the bigger picture outlook of the team. Yeah, I think that's where we're at, unfortunately. And you can give us a call. Two calls already Alex on the call screen right now, so already calling in. We're gonna get to you guys here in the second after we break down these two quarterbacks. But five pats, five hundreds the number web radio at Patriots dot com if you want to

email us, already have an email too. So we got we got a lot of feedback from fans here that I wanted. I think we need to hear from the I know we're gonna get into the quarters. I think I need to hear from the people today. I think it's that kind of show. It definitely is. So I want to talk about how mac Jones actually played in this game and sort of break down the nine dropbacks eight if you want to take the penalty negating play

off the board that he actually had. And I think what I've come at this all the time in the same way, and that is from a coaching standpoint when you chart when you watch, even at home. I think a lot of people can watch this game live on Monday night that probably don't dive back into the All twenty two or even a replay of a game like we do and really dissect what was going on on the field, can watch it at home and say, this seems like a much different style of offense that they're

playing with one quarterback versus the other. And the best way that you can break it down is that mac Jones, for all intents and purposes, is running a vertical passing offense. And I can't. I think the first play of the

game for both quarterbacks sums it up perfectly. First play of the game for mac Jones, he gets the line of scrimmage in shotgun eleven personnel, three wide receiver, and he comes to the line of scrimmage and they had a pass play called in the huddle to pass the football out of that formation, and he didn't like the look, and he checks in to a run. So we're already making changes at the line of scrimmage, right He's already

coming in. He's changing to the play, changing the play to a run, resetting them point you can see the communication happening on the broadcast. Very first play of the game, he's already changing plays. He's already making these types of decisions at the line of scrimmage. He's already spreading the field. They're already three wide receiver gun, all that kind of stuff.

And then Bailey Zappy gets into the game. He's also in the shotgun, but they snapped the ball and he's got a slant to his left, he's got a stick or hitched to the tight end, and he's got a flat route on the backside and a vertical just clearing it out. But basically nobody is running down the field for Bailey's abby right, it is all easy, digestible reads and throws, and he hits Johnny Smith for like a four yard completion. I'm not saying it was some crazy

throw or crazy read or anything like that. But when your quarterback going back to mac, when your quarterback hasn't played in three weeks and your bomb's away as soon as he gets back into the game, that's not easing your quarterback back in, right, that's throwing him right back into the fire. But then when Bailey comes in the game, they eased him in right, they run. They run a quick game concept and they're back under center and they're

they're managing it for some play action in there. Yeah, with Mac, you know, they're running why Cross, They're running nine eight nine, they're running you know, all these are all vertical concepts, right, These are down the field first down, first and ten. I talked about this unfiltered. They run y cross, which is you know, it's really z cross, I guess for them. But Jacobe Meyers runs a crossing route.

Tai Kwon runs a vertical, and the idea is it's single high safety, so the safety can only help to one vertical. Right, you can either cut off the crossing route or stay over the top of the vertical. But he can't do both. And that's sort of the stress that they're trying to put on the defense. But either way, that's a twenty yard plus pass no matter what. So first and ten from their own twenty three yard line,

they spread the field. They run a vertical passing concept with Mac Jones, and they're pushing the sucker down the

field and I'm thinking to myself, where's the drive starter? Like, we're not in a shot play area right when we talk about shot play as we think about maybe like the thirty to the forty five of the opponent right on the other side of the field, Let's take a shot here and dial something up to get to the end zone, like the touchdown that Zach through to Jacoby Myers, right, Like those types of down and distances are good for taking shots down the field because you're trying to get

it into the end zone. But when you're on your own side of the field and it's first and ten, they just kicked it deep and you're just playing football at that point between the twenties, like can we get something easy? Can we get a slant? Can we get a hitch? Can we get some play action? Like just something that makes Mac feel good about himself, Like I got a completion, we got some positive yards, we're moving

in the right direction, and then sever bombs away. And I think the biggest takeaway that I'm getting at here I get your opinion on it, is this is the

playbook on how to ruin a first round quarterback. And we used to make fun of other teams, Like we used to sit here and say, oh, like that's this team doesn't know what they're doing, right, Like this is this is bad, Like, this is how you know this kid was promising at one point or he's a good prospect coming out or whatever, and they just completely botched his development. So now for Mac Jones, from year one to year two, he goes from Josh McDaniels to Matt

Patricia as his offensive play caller. They've completely changed the scheme. Now he's in a vertical passing offense when he was in a short and intermediate passing game last year with McDaniels. They're not running play action, they're not dressing it up for him at all. So they're making him basically just read a full field progression and make a great throw somewhere. And then they're making it easy on Zappy. And I think a lot of people say, well, shouldn't it be

easier for the rookie? Right, you got to you gotta

make it easier on the rookie. But can we find a middle ground, like, can we can we strike a balance like because right now it feels like they from year one to year two, they have made Mac make like a leap that you probably make from like year one to year five, right right, like they've expedited that process for him and now as a result, his decision making is all thrown off, Like he's making poor decisions with the football, he's locking on to first reads, not

progressing past the first read. He's not playing good mentally as well as physically. And when they drafted him mentally was the whole thing right, Like accuracy decision making that was supposed to be his calling card and they've completely ruined his brain, Like his brain needs to be recalibrated and refocused and it's just not at the moment. But what's your read on I guess the two different styles, right, like how they're kind of catering to Zappi versus how

they're putting Mac into this vertical based system. Yeah. I mean we talked about this last week. When Mac comes back, are they going to go back to the week one through three offenses that the Mac offense or did they realize that didn't work? That was kind of the big question and they've gone back to it. It does feel like when Mac is in the game, and I think Mac feels this way too, and I think this is where some of the problems stem from. They're just asking

him to go out there and make a play. They're asking him to go out there basically and beat Patrick Mahomes, and I think he feels some pressure to do that, and that's not who he is. That's not to say he can't be a good quarterback. You can be a good, starting caliber coack and not be Patrick Mahomes. Those players exist, But it almost feels like he has all this what just watching him, it feels like he has pressure on him to make that play down the field, to fit

that ball into a tight window. That's why he's taking so many risks. And now you add to it, well, now he's playing for his job. At least that's kind of what it looks like, right, So I think you just you just used a good a good term. They're like, it's like from year one to year five, right, they're just suddenly putting the entire offense on his plate, And look, is it nice if you have a quarterback you can

do that with? Sure, that's what three four guys in the league, if that even even good quarterbacks, and even for the best guys, even for a guy like Patrick Mahomes, the Chiefs still build the offense around him and build it to his skill set. They're not asking him to do things that he can't do. There's not a lot that he can't do, but they're not asking him to do things he can't do Lamar Jackson, they're not asking him to do things he can't do. They've built that

offense around him excellently. It's not a knock on a quarterback to say, oh, well, the team built the offense around him and his skill set. That's just what smart teams do. If you have a player who's good at something, don't you want to maximize what that player can do instead of trying to make him do other things. And it just feels like it felt like last year that's exactly what they did. They built this thing around mac Jones and they went out, they got him a fifty

fifty guy Intavante Parker grade addition or mandree. With another year, they'd be able to do somewhere that run play action stuff. It felt like, you know, they were really making progress towards that, and now the whole offensive system just it feels like mac Jones is fighting the system, where last year it felt like the system was helping him. That doesn't mean system quarterback, but a quarterback and the right system can take it to another level. Any guy. And

now it feels like Mac Jones is fighting the system. Yeah, and to go kind of play by play with it a little bit more. And I guess sorry, let me just add this too. What makes it so frustrating is with Bailey's Appy, they are playing to a skillson, right. They are kind of, you know, putting things around him and putting him in a spot to succeed. So it's not like they can't do it because the skill sets are similar. And that's what you want from your starting

quarterback and your backup quarterback. You want them to have similar skill sets. So if you have to go to the backup, not allow us to change. So that's what makes it so confusing, is it's not like, oh, well, they're running an out offense for Zappy that works for him, but not one for Mac. But they have two different skill sets, so they'd have to change the offense. That's not what this is. Yeah, And to your point about

running an offense that fits your quarterback. So I think the play that's going around Twitter right now is the one where Jacobe Myers puts his hand up on the sideline and looks like he's open. I mentioned nine to eighty nine. That's what that is, right, Two verticals on the outside, a poster seam up the middle of the field,

and it's under center play action. He comes off to the seven step drop play action and his first read is up the seam, and the linebacker in the middle of the field of the Tampa two defense cover to Tampa two does a great job of carrying Hunter Henry up the seam, so it's not there ideally. You see the safety cheating in, you see the linebacker working over the top of the seam. You get out to the

boundary and you hit Jacobe Myers right. The problem is is that the down and distance is around the forty yard line of of the Bears. It's second down. The problem is is that that throw into the cover two hole to Jacoby Myers with Jakwan Brisker who picked him off later in the game, trying to fit the ball into his own coverage hole. That is a heck of a throw. If he makes that throw, it's not just

the read, it's not just seeing the receiver. It's also dropping that ball into that cover two hole with the velocity that he would need to do it with. After it's not even his initial read on the play, so he's late a little bit to it as well. I think there's probably like four or five quarterbacks in the world that can make that throw. If it's Josh Allen, it's Herbert, it's Mahomes, it's these cannon arm quarterbacks. That's

not Mac Jones, Like, that's not his game. If you're asking Mac Jones to fit a ball thirty five yards down the field into a cover two hole to find explosives, then you are doing him a disservice. So we can sit here and say all we want that, Oh he missed the read or oh he you know, he had myers and he should have come off the seam and he should have seen this and he should have thrown

this football. That is a throw that if you make that throw, the defense tips your cap right tips their cap, and you write it down PFF would log it as a big time throw or a wow throw or whatever you want to call it. That is one heck of a seat. That's the problem that I find the most with what they're doing with Mac is that they're asking him to be that guy, right, They're asking him to

make those types of throws down the field. Okay, if you want him to throw a fade from the slaughter or a fade from the outside where he just has to put some air under it and drop it in the bucket. That's more his game. But if you're asking him to drive the ball in between two zone defenders, that is a really difficult throw for anybody to make and it just doesn't fit the skill set of your quarterback.

Later on, or it might have been before that, but at some other point he hit Hunter Henry over the middle on like a twelve yard completion. It's twelve personnel. They were on Hunter Henry on the dig route, Johnny Smith on a little under to hold the defense underneath it, and he, with anticipation hits Hunter Henry in the chest. Twelve yard completion. Stay on schedule, let's move the chains right. That's Mac Jones. Like when I saw that play, I

was like, that's the Mac that we saw last year. Like, that's the guy that we saw last year. Quick read, accurate, throw, ball is out on time, Like that's the type of quarterback that he is. Short intermediate, take your shots with fades and things like that down the field with some touch and not just with velocity, Like that's the type of quarterback that you drafted, So why are we trying

to make him into this other thing? And it's funny because you know, Justin Field is on the other sideline, and it's like, okay, well, if you wanted the big arm quarterback, and he should have just drafted the guy you're playing against tonight, not the guy that you have. So I understand that he did that at Alabama. I understand that they had success with it in moments in the first three weeks of the season. Certainly against Baltimore stands out as a game where they were able to

push the football down the field. But that is not his bread and butter. His bread and butter is the Hunter Henry play. It's not the cover two whole forty yards down the field. And what I would add to that is I think there is a room, there is room for mac Jones to make that throw in the offense,

and like you said, he did at Alabama. But the trick is you set it up with that underneath stuff, right, and the defense cheats up, you know, and you get cover one and you're coming down underneath, they're bring a robber and then all of a sudden, that stuff down the field opens up. I do think mac Jones has the arm to make those downfield throws, but like you said, he's not gonna fit it in between two guys. Right, there's three or four quarterbacks in the world that can

make that throw. They're running. It's it's almost like they're doing the second the second it with a quarterback like mac Jones, and their offense was built like this for years, even with Brady. Throw the ball to the short intermediate and just keep hitting the plays the defense will give you, and when the defense steps up to take those away, then you burn him over the top. Right, It's pretty

basic there. It almost feels like what the mac Jones offenses this year is just skipping that first step of the short and intermediate and just going over the top. Oh yeah, and when you don't set up that way again, you're just asking the quarterback to make throws that nobody

makes on a regular basis. Yeah. I mean, he's ten point four air yards per attempt second in the league, right, and average air yards perttempt is that is that what's best for mac Jones to be second in the league and air yards per attempt and to attempt over twenty passes of twenty plus yards in the air on one hundred and twenty drop backs in four games. Like, that's just not the player that that he is and the

player that you drafted. And maybe, like like we've been saying, maybe he did that at Alabama, but this isn't Alabama, right, this isn't the it's also Alabama set it up. You have to set it up first, And this isn't the SEC. And he's not throwing a Davante Smith and John Metchi and Jalen Waddle and all these guys that are significantly better than the guys that they're going up against in the secondary. This is a this is the NFL, and you have to adapt to the skill set at the

player that you have. And I just don't feel like they're doing that. And that's an excusing mac for some of the mistakes he made. You know, the wire throw is what I'm gonna call it from now on. Right that he span is already the bunk that it didn't hit the wire, Okay, I know it. The wire shakes the wires, the LEAs the wire, it's not what illusion. The wire's actually fifteen yards above the ball source. Well,

we're supposed to believe you. Well, they do have next gen tracking data that can probably tell you if it hit the wire or not. And why, well, why didn't they put that data out? Then you want I'm not you want Wiregate in context right now, I'm not do for me I do. I'm not saying that this is what lost in the game. I'm not just being the Patriots. But I love a good controversy like this that I know what. I saw that wire, and but don't tell me it was the wind. I looked later in the

game when they were having the issues punting. I looked up the wind when they were having issues punting. It was two miles an hour. Those wires are thick. Those are big wires that hold that camera up. So it didn't hit the wire fifteen yards above. Get out of here. Regardless of if it hit the wire or not, it's a bad decision. It was a bad decision, but it hit the wire. So again, I think we're we've hit We've beaten this one enough that I think people get

the point of what's going on. I don't think you get the point that it hit the wire. Oh my god. Okay, let's take some of these calls and and then I do want to talk about the defense. I think that you know, obviously there's a lot of issues to talk about from Monday night there as well, but I want to get to get to the people. Todd North Carolina, Todd, what's up man? Well, I think Barths hit on it earlier. The biggest problem with this team is it's not prepared.

You know, people talk about the transition to Brady and all this stuff. Well Brady went into a team that was prepared and it was loaded for bear. Our line, our d line, our old line, it is not there, and it goes are your core things. If you can't have line play the rest of your it doesn't matter who you got in your defensive backfield or your offensive

backfield is point line. Neither of these quarterbacks are going to succeed until they fixed the on line and our dbs and we're gonna get in our run defense, it's all going to be toasted. I'm totally fixed the lines, and I don't know if it's a speed issue or if it's an old age issue or one on both sides. And I'd like to hear what you guys have to say. Thanks guys, great show, Thank you. Yeah, thanks, Ton, I

appreciate that. Yeah, the line of scrimmage talk is important, and this is sort of where I think we were headed with this next thing on the defense. But we can start with the offense because I had the offensive line issues written down as well on the rundown here. First of all, I would say that the blocking, especially the run blocking the pass blocking was good in the

two games that they won. But the run blocking has been on my radar for a couple of weeks now because the Detroit game I felt like was and you know me, I'm anti running back, right I running backs don't matter, Like I subscribe to that theory. That was one of the first games in a while that I can say a Patriot running back actually like put the

running game on his back and mattered, right. Romandre Stevenson against Detroit mattered one hundred and eleven yards after content at nine forced miss tackles Like that wasn't necessarily that they were blowing Detroit off the ball, and they were, you know, no one was touching Remandre for twenty yards, right, Like that was Remandre making things happen with the football in his hands. That was an excellent game by running back. So I actually thought that blocking in Detroit was so so,

or against Detroit here at Gillette was so so. But Remandre just put the team on his back and went full beast mode and was able to rush for one sixty. Anyway, they didn't run the ball well against Cleveland. They didn't

run the ball well last week against the Bears. We are trending in a direction now with this offensive line where I think there are multiple spots of issue, and then there's also a five man unit or a six if you want to count the tight end, seven if you want to count the tight end, and the sixth offensive lineman when they do that whatever with the whole blocking scheme in general, and I think the biggest thing that you see that has the personnel concern is obviously

what's going on a tackle right. I mean, Trent Brown has completely regressed six penalties, four penalty is on Monday Night, six quarterback pressures allowed in the last two weeks, like has kind of fallen off the rails here at right tackle, Marcus Cannon, I think is less mistake prone right, Like he's not getting the bad penalties, the bad pre snap penalties that Isaiahwin was getting and the sacks or the pressures that he's giving up aren't completely leading to huge sacks,

or you know, horrible plays for the quarterback right injuries and things like that. But he's a limited pass protector and he gave up three hurries in the game on Monday night. One of them was on Max pick where he didn't pick up the stunt and the guy came in front of him and sneaked inside. Those are the types of things that you see with Kennon when he has to redirect and move his feet to recover to a spot he has issues with doing that is with foot speed and with a change of direction at this

stage of his career. So I think bold tackle spots are issues. I think Cole Strange is fine, but I think that he's somebody that you're supposed to be carrying with the other four guys on the line. He's not supposed to be Day one. You your superstar, your top lineman. So they've got to get the tackles figured out and they got to get those guys playing better football. And now you have David Andrews in concussion protocol, which adds insult to injury here as well. Yeah, it's more of

the tackles. To me, I think the interior. We'll see what happens without Andrews with that. Looks like the interior has been fine. That's It's if the interior was their biggest issue offensively, they'd be in pretty good chape right, Yeah, I guess is my point. They got to figure out what's going on at tackle. And Isaiah Wynn was it practice today? We'll see, you know, so was he benched, was he hurt? He was inactive? Yadi kad Juice came

back as well. I don't know, you know, if we want it's Yady could Juice coming back to save the day, if that's kind of where we're at. But at least he's look, he's not gonna save the day. But I think with Marcus Cannon, Marcus Kenne can still get on a double team and move people. Yeah, at the NFL level, right, him and Mike on Wining want a double team is

a people moving block, right that is still effective. But Yadney could use The one thing that you can say about him is that he is athletic and he's got

good foot speed. So maybe there is a world where Yadne is active and they go six o line a little bit more like they were doing with Win and Cannon, And maybe Yadney is the right tackle and Cannon's technically the tackle eligible right as the sixth guy on the line, or whatever way you want to line it up, but you maybe put Yadne in more positions to move his feet versus Marcus Cannon just blowing people over, right. I

think I think that could be some help there. It's kind of what I think they are going for with Isaiah Win, right, Like he's got a little bit more athleticism, a little bit more foot speed, and Marcus Cannon's kind of the bulldozer and those two work well next to one another. Well, that's another thing they missed, you know, when you talk about the Mac offense versus Appue offense,

that's six offensive line set. Granted they couldn't do it the only at two tackles dressed, but yeah, getting getting carojuiced back be big. They need to figure out something because when you start moving around too many pieces on the offensive line. Yeah, continuity is such a big part of it. Right, when you start moving too many pieces around, right, and now you know, right tackle, we're not sure center

there's going to be a backup. It's it's just you're putting a lot on everybody's plate, not just the offensive line, but everybody, the quarterbacks. He's got to communicate calls, all

of that. Yeah, it's a really big undertaking for James Ferns and potentially chasing Hines if it's not James Ferns, that those two guys are gonna have to really step up with the calls because you're not gonna have you know, the other guards like Mike on when you I'm you know, his year three right in the system for him, So maybe he could help out, but Colstrange is certainly not

going to help out. And he's got Quinnon Williams lining up over him this week, so he's got enough on his plate to not throw making line calls into the equation as well. So certainly that that line has crept up on them like it was a strength for a little bit there. It was a weakness early on in the season and they seem to figure it out there for a little bit. But you mentioned the max protect stuff or the extra protection, I guess is a better way of putting it. I think that's another really good

point of this. Zappy Mac conversation as well. When they bring Zappy in the game, take out forget about the play action for a second, right, because that's obviously help any as well. But not to harp on that point anymore. When they bring Zappy in the game, they are only using a five man protection fifty percent of the time. With Bailey Zappy, a lot of the time they're using extra guys, right, They're using six seven blockers in to

help him and keep him clean. When Mac is in the game, they're five man protection eighty percent of the time, a thirty percent difference. So not only are they catering some of the route concepts and some of the dressing it up differently for Bailey Zappy, but they're also protecting him differently. And by the way, some people will I think hear that and say, well, why does Mac need to be protected and protected more? He's supposed to be better, he's the first round pick. That's not what it is.

What it is you have essentially a rebuilt offensive line, four new starters from last year. And look, we're seven weeks into this thing now, but things are still moving around. Like I just said, you're gonna have a new center next week, maybe a new tackle, a new tackle last week. Adding you know, adding to the protection is not necessarily about the quarterback. It might be about the line, right the offensive line we knew from camp was going to

be a question. They didn't bought, They didn't do anything to kind of help with that issue when Mac was in. Then suddenly when Zappy was and they did. It's it's weird. Yeah, it's weird that they made that switch when they did. I get, yeah, rookie cornerback, you want to protect him more, of course, of course, but it's not like Mac didn't need the elevated protection. It's not like he was getting clean pockets all the time. Was five blockers. He's being

rushed constantly. So that was a weird one for me. Yeah, I mean you go out there and some of the players I broke down already with Mac like it's five man protection. He's got pressure, you know on the pick that he threw pressure. And then you look at Bailey Zappi and when they dial up things to go down the field, it's six seven guys in the protection. You got six guys in to protect you keep the tight end in the back. Also is sort of although the you know, a lot of its play actions. So the

back is involved in the fake. Once he's done with the fake, he's not running a route, right, he's staying in and kind of playing like a personal protector type of role in case anybody leaks through. So you have all this protection loaded up. Mac It's like, Okay, we're gonna go three wide and we're just gonna throw the ball down the field and make him read the full

field in YadA, YadA, YadA. Then Bailey gets in the game and Dave probably drew up the best play they've had all season on the Meyers to touch Myer's touchdown. And there, you know, it's three guys in the route, it's seven guys in to protect, and it's a game plan shot not on top of that, right, it's like a scheme wrinkle on top of that. So it just

seems like it's so different. You know, DeVante Parkers throw down the field again as seven guys in the protection, hard play actions, Evan in to protect, three year in the route, like it's it's simplified and it's protected. And then with Macko's like, oh, we're just gonna spread out the field and we're gonna make you throw the ball deep.

And again it's not necessarily about Oh, we're gonna make more of an effort to protect Bailey's appiots with the offensive line can't block him with five, right, so why are you still trying to block with five with one guy and not with the other. All right, Patty and Aguham, thanks for hanging on with us. How you doing, Patty? Pretty good? How you guys doing, We're doing well. Thanks

what you got? So? I got a MAC question. Um, I just want to know with my eyes, are are telling me the truth when I when I've been watching him playing, when he's been out there, to me, it looks like, um, and you guys, I mean, you guys are much more nuanced than and breaking down games film. So it seems like he's sort of predetermining where he's gonna go with the falling. He's not really going through

his reads and am I like Mike close there? Does it look like he's sort of just locking on the one guy pre snap and that's no matter what, that's where he's going. Yeah, Honestly, I didn't think he was doing it as much in the first three games of the season as this is something Patty that I think people are starting to catch on, right, what's going on in this game against the Bears. I thought he did it a lot more. Yeah, where a lot of things

were predetermined. Now I mentioned the thrower earlier. I think the faith that he threw to Taekwon that they almost hit on. That's a blitz, right, So in that situation, Taekwon's the hot receiver, right, So if you get the blitz and you get the single high like, that's your hot so you're just one step dropping the balls out to the vertical. So that's a kind of like a

predetermined thing already on its own. But we mentioned the one with Myers, like, that's the same play that they called for Zappy against Detroit and they hit it for a touchdown. Remember, now the down and distance was different, right, because there are you know where the situation the game, Zappy was on, like the twenty three yard line, right outside the red zone. So that's not a very far our throw, right. That's now like a twenty yard pass in the air instead of like a thirty five yard

pass in the air. So that's a big difference. But Zappy was able to come off the seam and hit the vertical on the outside when he saw the safety cheating into the seam, right. So these are sort of those second or third progression reads that Zappi is getting to,

maybe a little bit more than Mac. But I do think some of it again points to what we were just talking about with the offensive line and the protection, don't I think on that play that with Mac, although it's the same play, I don't know if he necessarily had the same protection at the same time in the pocket to get off the first read and get to the second. But I have noticed him hang on to the first read a little bit longer than what we saw at times last year, which is another part of

this whole equation. Yeah, I think it just goes back to being sped up, right, which is quarterbacks have that internal clock, right, they know based on their offensive line, the defensive line, the play call, what they think the defense is running. All Right, I got three seconds to get this ball out. I got two and a half seconds, I got you know, two point three seconds. Whatever it is.

You have an idea in your head as a quarterback of how much time you have to get rid of the ball, and that clutch that's called the internal clock, that clock can get sped up with pressure. If you think you have two point five right on a play and you run that play and you're not getting the two point five on a regular basis, or whatever number you think you have in your head. If you're consistently not getting that much time, you're going to speed up

your process. And what can happen is it just throws everything off because it's all based off that internal clock. Everything the quarterback's doing. Mac started looking sped up this past summer in training camp, and I think that's where this happens, where he's taking more time or less time with different things, just because I don't think he's totally

sure how much time he has in the pocket. And the other element of it is he has been blitzed quite a bit this year, and you don't go through progressions when you're blitzed, Like you said, you throw the hot receivers. So I think some of the talk of him not going through his reads is probably more circle, I'm stantial than anything else. Yeah, Yeah, thanks for the call, Patty. You really appreciated one of our regulars right there, Patty from Agawam so appreciate the call. J in Providence. Your

next up, Jay, what's going on. Hey guys, big fan, I've always focused on your podcasts and stuff. It's great to have you back together. Thank you, thank you. The first thing I want to say is it seems unusual

to me the way that they're handling Mac. If you want to force a player into a vertical offense like the one you describe, trying to get him to hit cover two holes and things that require a strong arm or at least a lot of confidence, while also sending him the message that if he seemingly sending him the message that if he turns the ball over once, they'll be pulled for the backup who's running the baby offense made him look like take him to the Pro Bowl

and the playoffs and so forth. I I don't quite understand why you would be asking a player to do that. It seems like he's going to be pausing on those reads or you know, seeing Jacoby Myers running up on

the sideline and not wanting to pull the trigger. Um. I also think that it seems to me that a lot of the Patriots fan base has been criticized for latching onto the Brady bled Zoe mythology and applying the kind of like the logic of the dynasty for the last twenty years, for the last two or three years, it's weird to me that Belichick is looking at Bailey Zappy coming to the game and running the baby offense and hitting wide open receivers, and maybe he's buying into

his own mythology that Zappy could be the Brady to Mac bled Zoe. I hope that he saw the Bears game yesterday and concluded that maybe he had deluded himself. After all, Mac is speaking today at four pm at the Wednesday presser, which usually is reserved for the starting quarterback. So I'd like to know whether you think that that maybe means that Bill is going to do what a lot of fans want him to do, which is stick with Mac and live or die with him. Thanks so much, Yeah,

no problem, Jay, Thanks for calling. It's an interesting question about you know, this is sort of gets into the where they go from here, right, And I think that's that's a good logical next step here. And I look, we've been harpy, Harley's I've been harping, and I think we share the same we agree on this is that it's a balance, right, Like there's gotta be a middle ground where you can open up the offense a little bit more for mac Jones to make bigger plays down

the field. But you're doing so while still keeping in mind that this is just a second year quarterback with twenty two starts under his belt or whatever the case is. I think it's twenty two. So at some point there has to be a balance, right, And some of the training wheels stuff or the you know, I think what Jay called it, the baby offense or whatever, like, some

of that stuff still has to be present in every playbook. Like, it's not like Aaron Rodgers is going out there and running all these full field progressions every single time he dropped back. You know, they have a lot of RPO, and they have a lot of motion plays, and they have a lot of early down just easy throws for him to get to football out quickly and stuff like that. And it goes back to as well and not I'm not comparing Brady to these two guys in terms of

their play. Remember Brady's first like eight to ten games in Tampa and he's running Bruce Arians's offense and he's changed, well, he's changing who he is, right, he's right to fit their offense instead of bringing his playbook, he's trying to run the Bruce Arians offense. And the two things that you heard about that situation were one, he's getting killed, right because you're you're holding the football for all this vertical stuff to happen down the field, So you're getting killed.

And that's another element of the protection too that I think is important to mention is that these downfield you gotta hold the ball, right, You gotta wait for a develop so you gotta hold the football. So he's getting killed doing it. Yeah. And then around what like week eight nine, all of a sudden, you start hearing these rumblings on broadcasts and from Tampa reporters that they're running more Brady stuff. Right there, I think somebody said metaphorically,

he kicked Bruce Arians out of the world. Yeah, they're running more vintage Belichick Brady Patriots stuff, starco more off play action right kind of thing, more short intermediate stuff. Like one wasn't involved at the beginning. He was really just a blocker. Yeah, until that that switch and they

start gett him involved along. So to me, it's nothing to do with comparing the situations or comparing the players, but I think the scheme is what we're comparing, right, And I think Brady told you, like, this is not a sustainable offense, like this is a chucking duck, no risk it, no biscuit, as Bruce arians is like famous line the thirty thirty offense Jamus Winston, Right, this is

not a good NFL offense in terms of efficiency. That yeah, you might hit some big plays down the field, but in terms of efficiency, this is not a good offense. And they moved away from it, and then they won a super Bowl. I'm not saying the Patriots will win a super Bowl if they move away from it too, but they had a lot more success with it. So look the back talking this afternoon. Do you make any

thing of that? And last week it was Bailey's I think it's Ben Bailey zappy pretty consistently since Mac got injured. I think maybe we had one week where it was Brian Hoyer the Packers game. Going into the Packers game, it was Brian Hoyer, But the last two weeks it's been Bailey zappy. This week it's Mac Jones. Do you do you make anything of that? I don't know, not not definitively, Like I'm back and forth in my head

of what it could mean. So, you know, does it because they don't have to give the starting quarterback, right, just a quarterback. The obligation is a quarterback. But I do believe that it's technically written as the starter, but it's not necessarily if Bill, like Bill said this morning, we'll see who the starter is. He hasn't named a starter yet. So these are all all these media rules are are like more like guidelines. Look, it was happy last week, Maybe it's Mac this week. Maybe they go

back to zappy next week. Maybe it's a rotation. Maybe Max's gonna do they're platuning the press conference. Um, I don't make a ton of it, you know, may maybe it is Bill kind of you know, it wasn't a good look when he pulled Mac. It wasn't a good look. Maybe this is a hey, you're still the guy, You're still the starter, like that sort of thing. But I don't know. I don't read into that stuff too much.

I don't read too much because it could also just be Look, this is gonna be a tough press conference for whoever it is, Mac or Bailey. Right, it's gonna be a lot to handle. I feel I feel for whoever it is. Maybe this is Max. Max's been here for a year and a half, he has more media training. They just trust him more in that spot, yeah, to answer the questions and say not that they don't trust happy to answer the question. He's a rookie. You're throwing

him into a lot. He also said some things on the EI that I think they would have rathered him button it up a little bit. But that's besides the point. I think, you know that's that's exactly my point, like Max's gonna be more prepared. I think the other thing, though, is is too is this morning or this afternoon in twelve forty five Belichick press conference, I get it looked they haven't practiced. He hasn't talked to the team. Maybe.

I think that was a good point that Paul brought up or Fred brought up that, Look, maybe he wants to address the team first, and they weren't in. The players weren't in yesterday, so they didn't get a chance to tell the team first, hey Max starting, or hey Bailey's starting, and then you go in tomorrow. We talked to Bill again. Maybe tomorrow Bill names a starter for this weekend at least right, maybe that's how they're going to handle it, and maybe that's the way it will go.

But by getting up there this morning and giving the we'll see, we'll see, we'll see response. Now when Mac gets up there at the podium this afternoon, he's gonna get peppered by with questions about it. I think it's a much different mood and that Mac Jones press conference, if it's Bill named him the starter this morning, and then he gets up there and he's just asking answering questions about starting on Sunday, right right, Like now we're

almost back to normal. This inviting, I think in a lot of ways, is inviting the same peppering that Belichick took at twelve forty five over the quarterback situation. Is now they're now bringing it upon Mac. Right now, Mac is going to have to answer the same questions too, and be asked the same questions and kind of fall on the sword here today for the situation right from a player perspective, and that I think is really difficult. Yeah, for a player, I do all right? What stands out

to me on it? Sorry? One quick point, Yeah, you go back and I talk about this all the time, historical context, right, find the patterns. Bill has been doing this for so long, there's down to be tendencies. Last time they had any sort of uncertainty at the quarterback position was twenty twenty, right, right, And do you remember how Bill handled that. Camasas start every chance he got and I get The team finished seven to nine. They didn't finish where anybody wanted them to finish. But I

actually think it could have been a lot worse. Yeah, I would would would build did by continually reaffirming camas to start. Was there was direction. Everybody got behind him. Cam was a clear leader on and off the field. And say what you will about Cam as a player, but it never felt like that locker room fell apart. It never felt like those guys quit that season right where I think it would have been really easy to kind of create a battle in the locker room over

who the quarterback should be. Fast forward to now, I would say, there's even more reason to stand. You just took Mac Jones in the first round. Right, Cam Newton, he didn't have a long term future in New England, even if he played well. He was thirty three years old, he was on a one year contract. He was not a ten year plan kind of guy at that point in his career. He wasn't mac Jones could be. Mac

Jones could be. But you're adding a level uncertainty to an inside the building the way and look, maybe Bill's gone in there and told him that Max starter, Bailey start or whatever. But it's a little striking to see how he handled in twenty twenty versus how he's handling it now. Yeah, absolutely all right, last caller here on the screen, Ben, how are you doing. Hey, y'all, big fan of both of you. Quick question, why did Jamie Collins open the game at lineback to like against the

athletic quarterback like justin fields? And who was the quarterback spy? Because it kind of felt like the Patriots did not have one. And then um, I think it's under the radar, but it's Stevenson taking over for David Damian Harris as the started. Thanks guys taking it off. Thanks for calling, Ben, appreciate it. First question. I wanted to move over to the defense, so that's a good segue to answer the question about the spy. No, they didn't happen. They didn't

have one in man coverage. The didn't play a lot of man coverage. They played nine snaps in man coverage, nineteen in zone, so they didn't play a ton of man. But when they did play man, I think I sent you the third and fourteen, yeah, where Justin Fields runs for for twenty yards and picks up the first down wide open. No spy Adrian Phillips is playing robber at the sticks. I don't think he was a factor as a spy. It's a four man rush, it's man coverage.

The defense that you know, the secretary has their back to the quarterback, non factors and they're just trying to keep them in the pocket with the rush and they weren't able to do that and they let them out. So no spy in man. I thought, from just a designer a planned standpoint that was obviously not a good one. And this issue that they have with mobile quarterbacks and zone coverage is all pass rush related. It's all pass

rush related. And what's happening is is that you're either having guys over pursue or get up the field too far and allowing the quarterback to escape through the middle of the pocket right the A and B gaps, let's call it, or you're just having guys stand there and watch the quarterback play quarterback from the pocket, and yeah, you're making him throw and beat you from the pocket technically, But a lot of NFL quarterbacks, most NFL quarterbacks can

make throws down the field when they're kept clean if there's no pressure. Guys like justin fields, the guy they're they're going to play on Sunday that we're going to talk about at the end here, Zach Wilson. Zach Wilson's numbers when he's kept cleaning the pocket are terrific. When

he's under pressure, he craters right like that. That's a lot mac I think it has similar as so, just because you're keeping him in the pocket, if you're not getting any pressure on him, that doesn't matter, and then he can sit there and make throws and all that kind of stuff. But the players that really kill them are the ones where they let him out of the pocket and he moves the zone with his legs right,

because all of a sudden he breaks contain. Now he's on the run, and guys in zone or pulled towards him right, so the whole zone is moving towards the quarterback, and then all of the receivers have to do is find the soft spots or find the openings and sit

down and Justin Fields hits them with throws. Those are the ones that really kill you because you have good initial coverage, you have a good initial rush, and then you let him out of the pocket and now he's creating almost like a playground scramble drill at that point, and those are the ones that are backbreakers, and along with like the scrambles on third and fourteen, when you give up a first down to on a scramble like those are just can't happen because they're so deflating for

the defense. But we saw this with Justin Josh Allen excuse me last year as well, especially like the playoff game. I kind of throw out because they were banged up and it was just a disaster, right. But the game in Foxborough zone coverage, everybody looking at the quarterback and people know pressure right, like he's got all day to throw behind the line of scrimmage. So those are the types of things that they have to get out of.

And you know, I've always been an advocate of just rush them and maybe put a spy out there in man coverage, like I think that that's probably the best

way to handle it. But I think it's sometimes like you just gotta gett after him, you know, Like I think at some point in time, like I think a really interesting quote that Davon Godshaw gave me after the game was that Justin Fields wrecked their third down game plan because people, the players, the coaches, everybody was thinking so much about not letting him beat them with his legs and not getting out of the pocket that their usual dynamic third down rush package was completely neutralized just

by Justin Fields's threat of him potentially taking off. And I think that they get caught in this no man's land of well, we gotta contain, but we got a pressure, so we're really kind of doing neither right. And that's like what happens so much on these tapes against mobile quarterbacks and then the design thing. Runs are a whole different ball game, But in terms of passing plays and how the mobile quarterbacks affecting it, I just don't think that they have any a great grasp on what exactly

it is are they're trying to do. Are they trying to pressure him or they trying to contain him? Like which one are they going to go with because right now, guys are doing different things. Some guys are going after him, some guys are staying back, and it just looks kind of like a mess. Honestly, Well, I think what's hurt them. They do have some guys who aren't talented enough, and it's not easy to find guys like this, But there are some guys who are talented enough to do both.

You look at Matthew Judo, who's a very disciplined rusher right can stay in front of a quarterback as long as he needs to to ultimately close in and get the sack without too much of a risk. Another guy like that as Christian Barmore, and they missed him badly in this game because Daniel Aquala got turned around a couple of times. Sam Roberts on one on his one defensive Snapcott turned around. They just they didn't. I almost feel like they recognize they didn't have the athleticism to

go after him, and they were two hands off. There's a certain element of you don't want to aggressively pursue him too much because when he breaks it, he's going to be able to run forever. But by staying as

off as they did they just naturally created those opportunities. Yeah, I mean the old adages, you don't want to chase the chicken, right right, Like you don't you don't want to pin your ears back and chase him around the field and turn it into a game of tag, right right, because Destin Fields is going to beat you in a game of tag every single day of the week. But unfortunately he did turn it into a game at tag because either they were coming after him undisciplined, or they

weren't coming after him right. They were so far away from him that he had room to run anyway, right, So it just they got to find a better way of striking that balance between the two things. And maybe it's by not balancing at all, Like maybe maybe it's just like, Okay, this is too difficult to strike a

balance on this. So instead of trying to do the old Star Wars trash compactor and just kind of collapse the pocket around him and not let him out, because it's kind of hard to push a pocket like that consistently, right, So instead of doing that, like we're just gonna let four guys go after him, We're gonna put Mac Wilson or Kyle Dugger or Adrian Phillips as a spy of one of our faster, better tacklers in the open field is gonna spy him, and we're just gonna play football, right,

And I think that that's I hope where the adjustments start to come now, Zach will I will say again though, getting you know, there's some things in the game you look at schematically and how do they change this, and that getting Christian ball more back will help with that. I think that's that's an issue that maybe you know, once they get their personnel back, they'll be in better shape. Yeah, quickly On the design quarterback rounds than I want to

talk about the Jets, yea. The design quarterback rounds I think are interesting as well to dissect because well, first of all, design quarterback rounds are tough to defend, Like, yeah, everybody's got problems with design quarterback rounds, especially when you have a guy like Lamar or a guy like Justin Fields who for statistically and I would say, for my money, are the two best running quarterbacks in the league right now, and just in terms of pure skill with the ball

in their hands, right, So, yeah, those guys are just tough to tackle. Like they're they're very very good at what they do. Now from a numbers standpoint, would would always challenges, and the Patriots took advantage of the numbers count with Cam and the whole twenty twenty season. The one thing they probably did well on offense was taken advantage of this, Like when they go empty for instance, like they did on the touchdown, and they did it

again on third down on that QB sweep play. You're you're just it's five on five blocking and he's the sixth guy and there's unless somebody gets off a block, he's gonna pick it up right, Like it's just numbers, it's just math, Okay. Now. The one thing that you see though with some of these read plays like counter reads or gap reads or zone reads, the second read, the second level of the defense. I think at times we've seen it with Mac Wilson. There was a play

that I highlighted in my post with Jawan Bentley. I discipline is huge because what's happening right now is that second level is getting caught trying to read out the mesh point like instead of Juwan Bentley just saying I got the B gap right, like the poller comes to me. I'm meeting him in the gap, and that's my responsibility. He's standing there and trying to scan right like he's trying to read out and react to the play. So what's he ended up doing. He ends up false stepping.

It makes him easier to block. They get the crease on him, and now it's a big play, right, Like those are the things that are happening with the design quarterback rounds. So run defense in general, it's you know, it's it's obvious, like in the fit, like you have a responsibility and you got to play team defense like your job is your job. My job is my job.

But even more so with design quarterback runs, you have to just I know it's cliche and I know it's their mantra around here, but you got to do your job right. You can't be a hero. You can't try to read out the play. Oh he's given it to the back and now I'm going backside b gap to you know, the the edge and making the tackle Like, don't be a hero, Like just play your gap, Like,

just play your assignment. And I think if they can get back to assignment based football like that, you know, I think a lot of people think, oh, you know, they don't have the speed, right, how many times do we hear that they don't have the team speed, They don't have the athleticism in the front seven. They need a playmaking linebacker. They need better eyes. That's what they need right now. I mean, like, you know, I don't

mean that literally. I just mean like they need they need to be more disciplined with what they're reading and how they're playing the scheme. So I don't necessarily think that it's like an athleticism thing as much as I think it is a eye discipline in a reading thing. And those counter read plays, that's what they ran that Baltimore ran, and the Bears just copied it, right, they just literally took it and they copied it into their game plan and they ran the exact same play against

the Patriots and the exact same results happen. So if you can just get the linebacker level back to just playing their assignment and not trying to be a hero and read out the mesh point and find the football and all that kind of stuff, Like pollers come in, you gotta press the pollar right, like you meet the pollar in the gap. Like that's simple don't worry about the handoff. Go in the other direction. Like we got

guys that are worrying about that. Your responsibility is over here, and that I think is what's happening a lot of time on the design quarterback rounds. Yeah, anyways, Jets, Jets, got to talk about the Jets. I looked up some of these numbers this morning. The Patriots won twelve straight games against the Jets. Yeah, going back to twenty fifteen. The last quarterback to beat the Patriots in a Patriots Jets game was. Oh, man, I'm usually good with this thing.

I know on the spot twenty fifteen. Wow, it was it. It wasn't Hackenburg take I don't know who was it? Fits magic? Oh, I should have had Ryan cat Track, who's now retired. I know what game you're talking about. I know exactly what I think. They won by field goal right in overtime. Do you remember who the head coach of the Jets was that day? Wasn't Ryan anymore? Nope, it was it was Todd Bowles to So they've gone

through since that game. They're on their second head coach, right because they went to um of course, now I'm blanking. Now they're on Robert Sala obviously, and h Adam Gaze Outam Gas. That's right, yeah, Adam Gas. Right, So they're on Adam Gays and they go to Roberts. They're on their second GM, right, because mccagny gets fired. Now Joe Douglas is the general manager. They have started ten different quarterbacks since that game. Ten ten different quarterback I started

what four guys last year? I think, oh yeah, even post Brady twenty twenty and twenty twenty one, yeah, four or no ye? An average margin of victory of nineteen points a game one third. Seven to sixty is the aggregate score in those four games with Cam Newton and Mac Jones at the quarterback for the Patriots. So even post Brady, the Patriots have dominated the Jets. That's the one team they've always beaten. Even with all the rebuilding and you know, the post Brady stuff, they're still beating

the crap out of the Jets. But this feels like a game the Jets would be favored in. And this feels like a game that I'll put you this way. This feels like a real football game now right, Like this doesn't feel like oh they're playing they get right, game right, like they got any easy one this week. Guys, don't worry about it. It's the Jets, right. The Jets defense is trending in a really positive direction. They're tenth in dv OA now their second in this windstreak and

epa per play. They have a budding defense. Are gonna get to Zach in a second because he's still a disaster, But their defense is fantastic, And I think when you look at the way that they've built their defense, you have to give Joe Douglas and Robert saw a lot of credit because some people play Matt right and they just pick guys off the draft board that are, you know,

a talented right, Like for the Jets. I think Stingley went three right, so they didn't have a chance to take to take him right and then and then Sauce goes forward to the Jets. But like that would be like if they had both corners on the board and they pick Stingley instead of Sauce right, because Sauce fits exactly what they do, Like he's Richard Sherman two point out for round sala Stingle's man coverage guy. Like it wouldn't have been a good fit in the in the

zone scheme that they run. So they've about it's about collect it's it's not about collecting talents, about building a team. They've built a team. They have on defense. Defense, They've

built a defense. So I think the couple moves that I had, I'll highlight retaining Quinnin Williams and John Franklin Myers through the rebuild great decisions by that front office, because both of those guys, if you're gonna run this Seattle three system, which is what they do, they're play zone in the back end three quarters, things like that,

you gotta have four man pass rush. You gotta be able to get home with four because you don't want to take guys out of coverage because you're trying to cover in zone right, so you don't want to have to only drop six or drop five into zone like they're gonna be screwed. So you gotta be able to

get after the quarterback with four. So they retain Quinnon Williams and they retain John Franklin Myers through the rebuild, two really good moves by them, because those are two guys that can get after the quarterback without much bells and whistle right they don't need to place, they don't need to do stuff like that. At linebacker, Quincy Williams is a player that I don't think a lot of

people know. He is a very athletic linebacker. And when you're gonna play zone, you need linebackers that can cover space, right, So he's somebody that can do it. And then obviously c J. Mosley is a really good and athletic player as well. And then what they did with the fourth overall pick last year in the draft was draft Sauce, who I know a lot of people I put some praise for Sauce on Twitter. The boss, Fred Kurch told me to be quiet, right, he said, don't don't be

praising Jets players. But a lot of people came at me. All you know, Dpi, right, Like he's always holding guys. Go watch Richard Sherman play. He's always holding guys too, right, Like that's just he's long, he's physical, that's his style of play. But he's six foot three. He's got great length to disrupt the catch point. It's almost like throwing to it, like buy a soccer goalie, right, because he can stand there in zone coverage and just covers so

much ground with his length. He's got great route recognition in zone. And then when they play like some of their locked coverages, like their Mabel coverages and things like that, where they locked the backside in man, he can cover guys in man because he's got the fluidity do that as well. He is a Richard Sherman clone. He literally he really is. Now we'll see if he ends up having that type of career. It's he's seven games in, but seven games in fifty one passer rating into his coverage.

Ten pass breakups through seven games as a rookie leads a league in pass breakups. So they got their corner and he only plays exactly like Sherman plays his side. He's a left corner. He doesn't move, he doesn't travel right like he's just going to play his side of the field. So that's what they've done defensively. They've really

built this defense. They're not collecting talent. They know what scheme they want to run, they know what Robert Salad does, and they have built this defense in Robert Sala's image of what the defense should look like. To their credit, and I think that they deserve some of the flowers that they're getting for the fact that they've built a really good roster. They haven't really gone out in free agency and had any real terrible contracts, Like I guess

you could talk about the Corey Davis contract. Maybe not the best signing, but they needed receivers and they got a receiver kind of like the Patriots the Aghalore and Kendrick Bourne or Davante Parker. And they didn't pay him twenty five million dollars a year or anything like that. He's making manageable money. And they've really done a good job in free agency as well of spending but not

just spending to spend and spending calculated. Now, with all that praise aside, and you can for your opinion on the defense if you want as well, but all that praise aside, Zach Wilson is still Zack Wilson. Yes, And that is I think the biggest thing that you look at in this game and you say he's not Lamar, he's not just in fields. He can move, but he's but he's not straight line fast like those two guys are, so you're not as worried about him getting out of

the pocket and running away with the game. So his splits when he's kept clean versus under pressure insane. It's like him and Mac Unfortunately Mac as well are near the bottom in the league and pretty much every metric when it comes to pressure, right passer rating, turnovers, p F grade, like whatever you want to use. So really, you know, when you look at Wilson, it's still a big time question mark of whether or not they have

the quarterback. And you look at their receivers. You know, Garrett Wilson, I weird did a lot of Garrett Wilson talk and on the old Pod pre drafted. I'm not like the biggest Garrett Wilson fan, but he's a good player and he's a good receiver. Corey Davis I mentioned Elijah Moore is unhappy, but he will see what the deal is with him. Yeah, but he can play when he plays. They have some receivers. I know Breece Hall is a big loss for them, but overall I'm getting

outs their skill positions are pretty solid as well. Their line is still a problem, Zach Wilson's still a problem, but pretty much the rest of the roster is in pretty good shape. And I think once they addressed the line, I think that probably comes first, and then they probably, if they're smart, eventually I think they build the line out and then I think eventually they move on from

Zach Wilson as well and restart there too. But it goes to show ultimately, you know, look, they've won four straight, so they're not exactly in a terrible spot, but it goes to show that, like if you don't have the quarterback position and figure it out, it still feels like a winnable game. Yeah, yeah, I get because they've got enough around and it all makes sense what they're doing around. I mean, sounds crazy to say it. Jets are kind

of a well coached team right now. They are outside of whatever's going on with Elijah Wis Elijah Moore, But I think that's more about Elijah more maybe than the coaching staff. It's a bizarre one. Yeah, they know what they're doing. Again, they've got to cover up for Zach Wilson. I think if you're the Patriots, I think you had texted me this like this could be a scene ghost

game again. Yeah, but you got to take an opportunity because if if you get I don't know that the Jets are gonna come out and win the game straight up. But if you in the past, you could give the Jets a couple chances to get back in the game and they wouldn't be able to take them. Yeah, if you give the Jets chances, they're gonna get back. They're gonna get in this game. So that's what it comes

down to to me. And they're gonna play great defense. Yeah, they're pretty clean on special teams as Belichicks, They're gonna keep that margin of error very time, right, So they're gonna make you drive the field most of the timeless you can pick Zach Wilson off, which is maybe possible. But this, to me is one of those games for the Patriots to kind of get into, like how the Patriots attack this, right? I think this is one of these games for the Patriots where if you're the Patriots defense,

you have to come after Zach Wilson. You have to basically dictate the terms of the game by being aggressive defensively, and you really need forget about like, oh, we gotta put the pressure on Zach Wilson and put the game on his No, no, no, you'd have to come after him like right off the bat, because the one thing that you're gonna need to do is You're really gonna have to find ways to give the offense short fields because I don't think that the Patriots offense and the

current state that it is in, is going to drive the field consistently against this Jets defense. The defense is playing out of its mind. So I don't think you're gonna go seventy five yards on the Jets defense too often right now, especially the way that they play. They really limit explosive plays with the zone, so like they don't really give up chunk yardage. So you're gonna have to matriculate your way down the field if you're gonna do it. So if they're in the Zappie offense is doable.

If they're in the Mac offense, that's that's not how the Mac offense operates. So it adds to kind of the weirdness of all right. So but ultimately I think you really need to This needs to be like a seeing ghost kind of game, right, Like you need to pick off Zach Wilson two or three times. They had a game like that last year in Week two, right, they offense didn't really play very well. Mac is his

second art in the NFL. Wasn't one of his better games as a pro, and they were able to pick off I think they picked him off three times by like the first drive, right, it was twice name JC at two right, I think j C had too, and I think the first one that Jac had was like

the second play of the game. Right. So you have to have a couple of those types of turnovers or field flipping type of plays by the defense where you're able to really put the offense, put it on a silver platter right for the offense and say, now you get the ball at the at the Jets thirty yard line, like please get a touchdown, right, you know, one of those types of things, or another five Nick Folk field goals. Yeah. Sure, but this Jets defense is legit. It is and I

did against the Packers. They did it last week obviously as well against Brett Rabin. So I'm not going to give them even with the pack has been But yes, it's a good defense. It's still it's still the Packers. And they dominated the Packers. It wasn't like they you know, played decent against the Packers. There was a flat out

domination defense side of the ball um. But yeah, look, I this is you need to take the game from Zach Wilson, right like you need to force Zach Wilson to give you the football game because straight up right now, like this is a tough game for the Patriots, Like just looking at their tough matchup, Yeah, tough matchup, looking at their offense against the Jets defense. I have to give it to the Jets right now, Like I have to say that the Jets defense is better, and kudos

to them. They They've built a good d and they have a lot of young talent on both sides of the ball, and some of it's hurt, right like Elijah Vera Tucker and Breece Hall are hurt, which hurts them on offense. But they have a lot of really good young talent on this roster. It's a fun team. I hate to say that. It sounds like disgusting coming on the bath, but it's a it's a fun team. But if you're the Patriots, you gotta hang your hat on the fact that they don't have a quarterback. I still don't.

I still it all goes back to that. Until you know, as long as you can take advance. We kind of saw this with the Patriots last weekendst the Bears. If you can take advantge of the quarterback situation, any game is winnable. Yeah, And I also would say that, you know, we mentioned that that Wilson can move around a little bit. They do move the pocket right, so they they're they're shanahan ish. I wouldn't say that it's like full on Shanahan, but they do have the bootlegs and stuff like that.

At times. They run some RPO on early downs as well to get the ball out of his hands quickly, and he's pretty good at those um But he's again the type of quarterback that I still think you can pin your ears back, like. He's not totally like he's not Jared Goff right, Like he can move around a little bit more than that. But maybe he's like Jacobe Rissette right, like you know, you're still not deal. He's more mobile than Jacoby, I would say, but yeah, he's not.

He's not justin fields or Jackson. So I think this is one of those games we're talking about earlier where you might just need to let the pass rush pass rush right, like you've gotta let them. The one guy who really looked good on defense for the page well there were three. I thought Marcus Jones and Jacket Jack Jones both had good games, but Matthew Judon is the one guy who's kind of been impervious to all of this. Yeah, you need him in this game big time. Yeah, let

stunt the line. Let Judon go after him. Like you know, Joon says he has those plays or he just has a full go, right, they don't tell him to contain or anything like that. I need like four or five of those in this game. It could be it could be like just well, I bring up the rookie corner Zoe specifically, Jack could be a big game because, like you said, you're gonna need a blitz in this one. Yeah, those guys are gonna be out on an island, I think quite a bit if you can't play it the

right way. And you know, it's not the Bengals or or the Rams in terms of the receiving core, but they've got some real NFL talent there, and we know what Jalen Mills can do. But for Jack Jones, for Marcus Jones, I think this is gonna be a big test for them. They're gonna kind of be putting spots where the team's really going to rely on them without

help to be able to lock some of these guys down. Yeah, and I think a lot of it too, will be off man, which is Jack prefers where Jack wants to be, and that allows him to not only you know, you're playing man coverage, but allows him to see the quarterback. Right, So there's gonna be opportunities to intercept balls, Like, there's gonna be opportunities to pick him off. Yes, and Jack Jones.

I if Jack Jones doesn't have an interception in this game, then I'd be surprised, and that's not good for the paper. That's that means that they didn't do the plan, Like, they didn't execute what they were trying to execute, all right, So we'll see, Well, we'll come back next week and

see what this game looks like. I still don't think either one of these teams are in an elite tier where this is like a statement game of any sort for either one, right, Like, I don't know if like I'm gonna come out of this game and be like, oh, well, maybe the Patriots aren't what we saw on Monday night like and be fully all in, or if the Jets win in rattle off five straight like, I still don't think I'm gonna be like, oh, well, maybe the Jets

are contenders, right, they'd beat the Patriots. But at the same time, like that, you know, I think that this is a big game for both teams. The Jets need to get the monkey off the back, right, like they need to beat the Patriots for the first time since Ryan Fitzpatrick and Todd Bowls are running the ship in New York, and for the Pats, a big bounce back

this week for sure. Yeah, all right, So we'll be back next week, same time, same place, two to three pm, or on the re air on the anywhere you get your podcasts, right Spotify, Apple, Google, anywhere you get your pods, you can find Patriots Catch twenty two. But until next time. Signing off for Alex Barth, I'm Evan Lazar. Thanks for

listening everybody, and we'll see you next Wednesday. Thank you for downloading this podcast, Subscribe on Apple, google Play, and everywhere else you listen like the show, Please rate and review us. Listener comments and ratings help keep us high in the podcast rankings so new listeners can find us. Be sure to Checkpatriots dot com for more news and more podcasts.