Pastors' Perspective - 06/05/2025

whatever the case might be. Call us 888-564-6173. Answering your questions today, we've got Pastor Brian Broderson from Calvary Chapel, Costa Mesa. How's it going, Brian? Well, Brian, it is going quite well, and I'm so delighted to be sitting in the studio, not only with you. But with our dear friend Phil Metzger, who made it up from the deep South, the deep, deep South. The different deep South San Diego. The other deep South, exactly deep South to us, yes, yes, I'm glad to

be outside. Phil and I were together. We were on a platform in the city of Budapest at Golgatta, the church there that Phil used to pastor, and we were having a fun time. That was a great time. That was great. Yeah, golly, that was fun. Well, it's good to have you here, man. We normally see you on the screen there, but, uh, you came up here today. It's so much better to be in person. Oh, totally. I, I love it. It's great to be with you guys. It's fun. Great to

have you here. 888-564-6173 is the number to call if you've got questions for us today. Totally, totally. Oh yes I got questions for us today. Oh, you do. You're sounding like the Encino man a little bit, you know, the total.

Bummer, dude. All right. uh, there's a few other ways you can get your question to us, and you can go to, uh, Facebook, find the Pastor's perspective page, and you can send us a message there through Messenger, or you can go to the pastor's perspective Instagram and DM us, or you can go to Kwave.com. And flick on my forehead and, uh, no, seriously, no, not, not in person. It doesn't work in person. Uh, only if you go online, uh Kwave.com, and uh that takes

you to the page where you can submit your question. Now, if you're watching us on Facebook or YouTube or Instagram right now, do you see that little QR code there near the bottom of the screen? Yeah, you can. Zap that or whatever it is you do with your phone, and, uh, it'll take you to that page, so you won't have to flick my forehead. And I appreciate that because the more you guys flick my forehead, I'm getting all these divots. I'm starting to look like a golf ball, and that's

not good. Uh, so, but the best thing to do is to call us at 888-564-6173. Nevertheless, Brian sent in a question, not you, or did you have a, uh, no, I had a comment. Um, so I, I just wanted to say I met some people today. Who wanted to tell me how much they love this program and that's great yeah and that's always fun, you know it is so a couple of guys just said, hey, love pastor's perspective uh another guy just moved out of state. Said, listening to you all the time, got the app

on my phone. Oh, cool. Very cool. Thank you. Wherever you are, you can listen to us when you got that app. So here's Brian's question, not Brian Broderson, a different Brian. He wrote in and said, I'm finally at a place in my life where it seems that I've achieved most all my dreams and goals. Do you have any advice on how to refrain from becoming prideful in heart and therefore killing my witness to people who are still going through it?

Now my advice to Brian would be, uh, go therefore sell all you have and give to the poor, but I'm not one to give answers on the question. I'm kidding. That's that that wouldn't be. But is this really Brian Perez asking them? No, it's a, I'll, I'll show this. No, I don't, I don't want to hold that up to the screen because then people would see his name and his phone number because I can't think of many Bryans that have succeeded in life and it's not a name. They're at the top. They're game and.

I mean you are like rarefied air. I'm gonna, I'm gonna, I am in a good place right now. Let's do that. Yeah, I mean Brian Wilson, you know, you know, in the Beach Boys heyday, he arrived, yeah. So what do you guys say to this, Brian? OK, what, what's the last part? How do you, is it like do you not be prideful? How do you not be prideful. Well Um, I mean, in some ways it's, it's, it's easy.

You know, I, I was listening to this thing the other day, it was really fascinating, you know, uh, the first official sort of pope of the Roman Catholic Church was Gregory the Great. He, he wasn't actually, he was the bishop of Rome and you know, so people look back to him as kind of, well, actually Catholics look back to Peter as the first pope, but anyway, kind of officially, yeah, yeah, so anyway, um, Gregory wrote this.

Unbelievable, uh, text on like pastoral leadership. And it like for 500 years, it was used far and wide, not just in ministry, although he wrote it for ministry guys, it was used in the, you know, various courts of the monarchs throughout Europe and, you know, all this crazy stuff. And for Gregory, the key to everything when it came to leadership was humility. So he, and he said at one point, he said, you know, it it was funny the way he described it. He said, you know, even

just the average person could, couldn't become prideful. That's just part of human nature. And he says, how much more someone who is in a position of authority that people look to, that people praise, that people tell them. You know how amazing they are and they are. I'm thinking, well, he's just describing exactly, you know, the life of a

pastor and other people who are in that position. But what he said, and of course this is going back to Jesus as our model, um, remember the story in John chapter 13, the Jesus is washing the disciples' feet, right? And as he's washing their feet, he says, Um, you know, what are you doing, Lord? Peter says, you're never gonna wash my feet. If I, if I don't wash your feet, you have to part with me,

Jesus says. But he says this, he says, um, you call me Lord and master, and that's right, because that is who I am. And if I, your lord and master, have done this for you, then you should do this for one another. And so I think we just have to remember, you know, one time it struck me, Matthew 11. Where God says I am meek and humble in heart, and I thought God is humble, right? That's like it's insane.

Is that possible humble be, you know, and, and so let's just remember, whatever, it's like Paul the apostle said, you know, whatever I have, it's, it's, it's been given to me by God, and the same thing is true with you. So if it's, if it's been given to you by God, why do you boast about it as though. You know, you somehow made it happen yourself. And I think everybody, you know, for Brian, Brian, whatever you've done in life and your success, all of that is great, it's wonderful. Just remember.

Why it happened? Because God in His mercy allowed it to happen. Don't take any credit for it. Don't walk around with a fake humility going, oh, don't, you know, don't congratulate me. Praise the Lord, that's weird. But just have a realistic, just have a realistic perspective on. By the grace of God I am what I am. That's the bottom line. What do you think? Yeah, totally. I'm thinking too like, you know, that that verse where it says like, what is the profit a man if

he gains the whole world but loses his soul? It's kind of like, and I'm I'm in the presence of two Brians, but I'm saying Brian, the other Brian, OK, the third Brian, the unseen Brian in the room, um. Dude, if you've accomplished every goal that you have, here's one way to stay humble. Your goals are too small. If you could finish them in your lifetime, there's much bigger,

like there's so much more to life then. So like if you've accomplished a work goal, that's That's great, kudos to you, but then like, like relational goals never have a cutoff. It's like our friendship is gonna like like we've arrived, it's constantly growing, right? And so if I think of my life as goals accomplished.

Then, you know, there's nothing beyond that. But if I think of my life as process that God's just walking me through different seasons, different opportunities, new challenges, new things to be a part of, then there's humility because it's like I haven't been on this road before. I've been on 52 roads that look like it, but the trees are different and the cars are different, like it's a new road and so I think we gonna have bigger goals if we're already accomplishing them all.

Seriously, I mean, like, yeah, and, and move the goalposts and like, exactly. And OK, so like you said, maybe, maybe and you know, seems to indicate like in maybe in his profession or whatever, a lot of success there in life in OK, yeah, that's good, which is cool, by the way, yeah, but our, our goal, you know, it's kind of like Paul said to the Philippians, he, he's talking about um. You know, he, he says that God has called him.

Um, ordained him to be conformed to Christ, and he says, not that I have already attained. So Paul, heats in attain. And you know, he's kind of toward probably more toward the end of his ministry, but he still hasn't attained to all that God had apprehended him for. That's what he says. He says, you know, Christ Jesus apprehended me and so what am I doing? I'm forgetting the things that are behind and I'm pressing toward the goal for the mark. are the mark for the goal of the high high

call of God in Christ. And so I think that whatever other things you might have accomplished and you feel satisfied with, that's fine, but there's still this attaining to all that God has apprehended you for that you haven't attained to. And you won't, but you will keep pressing forward. I love that, yeah. I remember several years ago there was a young either singer or actress in her twenties or something, and They had asked her to write her autobiography, you know, or,

or whatever, and she's like, I'm only 22. If I wait till I actually, I mean, if the, if you want to hear my life story now, this, this tells me that you don't think I can do more, but let, let me, you know, come back in 20 years and let's see what I can. Accomplish, but, uh, yep, Brian, thank you for sending in your question on Kwave.com. And now we're gonna go to the phones beginning with Dina in Highland, California

But anyway, um, There's a particular show I like, and it seems like this man likes to use the Lord's name in vain. And I'm, it's like an arrow to me every time I'm watching it, but are we grieving the Lord when we're, you know, Listening to that. I mean, it's not excessive, but it's there, but it seems to be everywhere now, even more so.

And Just wanted to know because honestly, I remember a Kwave pastor saying that uh even though the Lord's name is used vainly, that there's still power in His name, the fact that people are hearing that name above all names, and that's it. Thank you.

that other Christians can't? No, it doesn't. Other people have liberties. It doesn't seem to me the way you described things that you have that liberty. So to keep taking advantage of that liberty you don't have may not do good

for your own spiritual walk. As it relates to other people, not everybody's gonna have that same, I don't wanna say conviction, but that same like feeling about it, like, I mean, obviously the Bible talks about not taking the Lord's name in vain, and I believe that's maybe more important to believers than it is to unbelievers. I'm not sure that I totally agree though I couldn't speak to what that other pastor had said, the idea that like, even if the name of Jesus is being

said in a bad way, it's better than nothing. I, I don't really know if I feel that way. Uh, in fact, I'll just say I don't feel that way. Um, I think, you know, talking about Jesus is something really holy. And um you're not in some like weird mystical way, but just I think using it in a swear context wouldn't be somehow the power of God able to work

through that. I think it's a bad bad usage, but for you, Dina, I think I'd avoid the show and um, but for others, you know, people have liberty and just need to kind of ask the Lord what's what's best for them. Brian. Yeah, I, um. Uh, for one, Of course, maybe it is heightened today. Obviously television entertainment, uh, is much different today than it was when I was young, you know, and did they have TV back then? Sorry, it just they get they get shots fired invented shots.

Um, joking. So, you know, back then you, you didn't hear that kind of language, especially on your TV. I mean, if you went to a movie that was R rated or something, then you would, you would hear it generally. But, but I grew up in a context where I heard that language all the time. So it was just like, you know, it was what it was. And, and so again, I think it is, it's, it's more prevalent today because of just how communication has exploded. Um, so it's like on one level we're surrounded with

that and it's inescapable. And even like TV shows, series that I like, uh, you know, they will use the Lord's name quite freely, unfortunately. And I think, you know, you could, um, if you have a deep conviction about it, like Phil said, then I think that you probably say, well, you know, I'm I'm just not gonna do that out of principle.

Um, if you don't have that same kind of conviction, because I don't think everybody would, uh, and if you're, you know, inclined, you might even say, you know, I, I really, you know, of course, this person's an actor and this is, you know, this is part of the script,

and this is what they're doing. I have a friend who's a producer and he and his, you know, he, he ends up producing these programs with a lot of vulgarities and language in them and stuff, and his mother it's just like Son, why, why do you have to put these words and he's like, Mom, I don't write the script, you know, they, they give me the script that's written already. I don't have any any power over it. And so it's like, OK, um, I, I mean, what I was gonna get at is you could say.

Uh, every time they do that, I'm gonna say a prayer for them, you know, maybe, maybe that would be a, a kind of a some shows you'll pray a lot. Yeah, yeah, I'm just gonna put it on pause and pray, pause and pray. That is a great idea. And it also really depends on culture too, right? I mean, like.

You go over to Europe and things are said in ways that like maybe it's totally different than here so like you have like British or German or Italian and Hungarian and they say things that like we're like wait I don't think you could say that, you know, or the fre and years and years ago we were flying home from when we lived in England, we were flying back for a visit.

And my youngest son was probably like 6 at the time, you know, and he's sitting next to this, this woman who was like in her twenties, you know, nice, nicely dressed, nice looking, and he, he was an amazing kid. I mean, he just was like sharing the gospel with her, you know, he was actually debating with her and she kept using the F word and I'm just like, who, who is this woman and what is she doing? So finally I'm kind of like, you know, where are you from? I'm from Ireland, uh.

What do you do? Uh, I'm a school teacher. I'm like, you're a school teacher, first grade teacher. I mean it was like, uh, you don't teach English, do you? So anyway, um, but here, here's a passage that I do think is relevant to this, uh, question. Um, so Paul, he's writing to the people in Corinth and you know, Corinth is a A city that's full of all kinds of um idolatry and immorality and so forth. And he says, he says, I wrote to you in my epistle not to keep

company with a sexually immoral people. Yet I certainly did not mean with the sexually immoral people of this world, or with the covetous or extortioners or idolaters. Since then, you would need to go out of the world. But now I have written to you not to keep company with anyone named a brother or sister, who is sexually immoral covetous, an idolater, a reviler, a drunkard, an extortioner, um, don't

Even eat with that kind of a person. So, you know, here Paul is, he's talking about the reality of life in the church and life in the world. Uh, you're never gonna escape this stuff. This is what the world is. And so we have to Navigate the the world that we live in. And I think like you sort of indicated, Phil, this is a this is a personal uh decision that I don't think there's one answer that applies to everybody on it. And I think you just have to go with your, with your conviction.

Dina, thanks for calling in today to Pastor's Perspective. 888-564-6173 is our number. I'm Brian Perez sitting in for Bobby Conway, and that's why I'm making fun of Brian's age, because that's something Bobby would have done. I would never do that, but Bobby would definitely have done that. So that's why I did it. Uh, Brian Broderson and Phil Metzger are here too, and we would love to chat with you at 888-564-6173. Have I mentioned Brian Perez's hair lately?

It's not as cool as Bobby's, so yeah. Here's Philip who is calling in from Alhambra, California. Welcome to the program, Philip. Oh, hi guys. Hope everyone's doing good. We are, um, I just was wondering if you guys could comment on the other, um, sins that cause Sodom and Gomorrah to be condemned, and that's about it. The other sins, so we know about the major ones, or at least we think we do, and, uh, but

were there others? We, yeah, I, yeah, at least, I mean, the one that always, you know, first and foremost pops up on social media or anything, uh, one side uses to choose another side. But so I was just wondering, I know it's a, I know it's a bigger picture. Yeah, I wonder if you could elaborate on that. Yeah, there's a passage um in Ezekiel.

Where is it, yeah, I'm not sure exactly. I think it is the address, but um, yeah, the, the maybe maybe it's here, yeah, where he's talking about the sin of Sodom. And so let's see if this is the passage here. Um, yes, she and her daughters had pride. Fullness of food and abundance of idleness, and neither did she strengthen the hand of the poor and the needy. So that was the, that's kind of the extended perspective

on the sin of of Sodom. When you read the story, of course, in Genesis, you find that it's the sexual immorality that is, that is uh kind of front and center in that part. And then when you come to the New Testament, uh Jude mentions the destruction of Sodom, and he attributes it to sexual immorality. So, I think what what I've seen happen is Those who want to advocate.

Um, say for same-sex relations and stuff and uh to respond to people who say, oh, but you know, God judges homosexuality, they would be the ones quite often to point to the Ezekiel passage and say, no, Sodom wasn't destroyed because of sexual immorality. Sodom was destroyed because they were idle, because they were prideful, because they didn't take care of the poor. Um, it's actually both, it's not order which um was written first Ezekiel or Genesis.

Genesis. Genesis, yes, much, much earlier. Chronologically, it was written before Ezekiel. Yes, I mean actually written or recorded, I mean. Yeah, yeah, well, the Genesis or the part of the books of Moses. I know it's it's going, I know it's going back to the very beginning, but was it? Yeah. Yeah, it's it's definitely written before, yeah, by. Moses and Ezekiel is, um, you know, he's centuries after

Moses this time, so. OK, so. But, but finish your thought of what you were saying that people will look at Ezekiel and point. So people will look at Ezekiel and say it wasn't because of sexual sin, it was because of these things. And yet, it's because Genesis gives us the actual historical narrative on it. Um, and, and we see these, the men of Sodom are trying to sodomize, that's where the word comes from, these angelic beings and God destroys the, the city because

of that. And then when you come to the New Testament reference to Sodom and Jude, um, Jude says that they went after strange flesh and they were um committed sexual immorality. So the strange flesh there would be that these men are going after other men. And so that would be, wouldn't be the angels, the flush the angels. Well, the angels, uh, no, I don't think it would be the strange flush being the angels because I think it would have just said the angels if it was, yeah.

All right, Philip, thank you for your phone call today on Pastor's Perspective. Speaking of angels, Joseph and Orange has a question about angels. What is it, Joseph?

It's very clear that there was choice that he had, and then later in the book of Revelation, we read about a third of the angels falling with Satan, so there is, there's every reason to believe that the angels had free will, or at least those described. The question is, is now do they today or do they still, and the, the best I've heard that I, I think I subscribe to is the idea that they did have free will, but that that was sealed upon.

Choice. So those who chose to follow Satan, that fate was that sealed, you know, free will, and then those who chose to stay with the Lord, that sealed free will and um. I was actually looking this up because I was curious about I was looking at a quote from Wayne Grutum on that, and he said that scripture indicates many angels sinned and fell from their position. It implies that they had free will, at least initially and that they were

morally accountable. So the, I think there's a, there's a good base to say that most many theologians would say they did have it, but that they do not. After that one initial choice, yeah. And I, and I think too, you know, there's the references um all through scripture uh concerning the holy angels. And I think that that is, right? Yeah, yeah. And I think that's a distinguishing factor between the two. And so it's not like

there's going to be another moment. I think that idea that this was a moment in time and forever sealed whatever decision was made. Yep. All right. uh, thank you, Joseph. Does that answer your question? Yes, thank you so much. Thank you for calling 888-564-6173. Here's one that was sent in on Facebook really quick before we go back to the phones. It's, uh, Mark. He wants to know, uh, why is Acts 9:6, it is hard to kick against the goads left out in the NIV, but later, in chapter 26, it's there.

It's a manuscript issue. So the manuscripts, um, the the manuscripts at the NIV are based on the critical text do not contain it in chapter 9, but it is there in, um, chapter 26, I think. Um, and so it's just uh it's funny enough, I just, I, I literally taught this two weeks ago because I was teaching Acts 9. And I was using the, um, I was actually using the New King James, which includes it. And so the what's called the text receptus or the majority text contains it,

but the critical text doesn't contain it. So, um, but I said as I was teaching, um, you know, obviously Jesus said it because Paul later says he said it. Uh, did he say at that time, or, or, you know, should have been, should it have been recorded in chapter 9, That's a debate that's just purely based on it's in some manuscripts and it's not in it do you see

that changing anything? No whatsoever. There's a key, and that, that's a thing, you know, when you start looking at and I've, I have gone all over the map with uh translations and versions and um looking at the, the critical text which is almost every single. Bible except the King James and the new King James is based on the critical text and where those are based on the text receptive as it's called, or the majority text and, and yet when it's all said and done,

you're reading the same thing. Yeah, I mean, it's just I, I was, I was recently with a friend in England and he gave me, he gave me a copy of the majority text. He has it in English. And the first part of it was just an introductory thing and the, the scholars who wrote it, they were basically pushing back against a critical text saying, you know, the majority text is superior. And as I'm reading and I said, well, OK.

I said, but in the end, what's the point? It's just an academic argument because if you're gonna, because I was reading it, I said, I, this is just like I'm reading my NIV. It's no different, you know, right? Yeah. All right, Mark, thank you for sending in your question through Facebook, and we're gonna take a break now. We'll be back with more of your questions in just a little bit. 888-564-6173. Got about 30 minutes left to call in and ask your questions. We've got Pastor.

Brian Broderson and Phil Metzger here. 888-564-6173. If you're watching on Facebook, YouTube or Instagram, we've got the number posted right there at the bottom of your screen. Call in, participate, 888-564-6173. 888-564-6173 is the number to call if you've got a question for us today on Pastor's Perspective. We've got Pastors Brian Broderson and Phil Metzger here ready to take your question,

so give us a call. But before we go back to the phones, let's tell you about the Calvary Chapel conference, the CGN International Conference. It's happening later this month in Temecula. It's open to leaders, pastors and leaders, and Brian, why don't you tell us more about it? Yeah, well, it is a ministry conference, which means that we are seeking to, to encourage and strengthen people from

all different walks of church ministry. So it's not just exclusively pastors, but it's those who lead in other. Uh, areas of ministry, but of course there'll be plenty for pastors. We have a spectacular, uh, lineup of speakers and,

you know, main sessions. We're going through our, our theme is the way forward, a ministry according to Jesus, and we're looking at those great chapters in the Gospel of John, uh, basically chapters 13 through 17, which are some of my favorite chapters in all the Bible.

So we'll be looking at that together in the main sessions and then we just got tons and tons of great, great workshops on every different aspect of ministry from, you know, assistant pastors, executive pastors, children's ministry, youth ministry, worship ministry, uh, family life and ministry, things like that, so. Yeah, all kinds of good things and we'll kick it

off on uh Sunday evening, the 22nd. We, we start off with just a great time of kind of preparing our hearts in a time of worship and waiting on the Lord, and then we'll jump into the full schedule on Monday and you can get registered if you're interested, and you can find out all the details at Calvary. Wait, what is it? Conference? Conference. Calvary Chapel.com. That's what it is. That's what it is, conference. Calvary Chapel.com. Don't wait.

It's coming up soon. 888-564-6173. Linda, in Oceanside, thanks for calling us today. How can we help you?

sad and discouraged and those sorts of things. And she's just saying to me, I would really like to just kill myself, and I don't think I would send me to hell if I did, because I have no hope in this world and. That's the conversation last conversation. He was crying on the phone when they came in to take care of her, so I had to hang up. Yeah. So she wanted scripture.

That would reassure her that she wouldn't go to hell if she um, she killed herself and the reason she's not living out here by me is that she knew that I was not OK with euthanasia and, you know, mercy killing, etc. because that's what she wanted. No.

long as they're going on. And of course, if you're in her state where she's injuring herself and she's in pain and all that, so I, I would just say the best thing you could do is, is just keep praying for her and and just trying to coach her into the fact that God has, um, God knows her plight, he loves her. He's he's watching over her despite these things and in his time, she will go. Yeah, so, yeah, um, Linda, I'd love to pray for your aunt and then also pray for you and just how,

how you navigate kind of that conversation. Those are hard. It doesn't sound to me like she's asking the question. As much from like uh, you know, official position more like it's emotional, it's an emotional thing, she's hurting and she just doesn't want to be alive and we all

understand what that feels like, uh, especially if you're 98. Yeah, I mean my gosh, you're 98 and like you don't recover from wounds and injuries so I may God really bless her so let me let me pray for you Linda, and pray for your aunt Lour I do want to pray for Linda, thankful that she's called in, and this has gotta be uh just a burden for any of their family members as well. We just pray grace over the family, and we especially pray for her aunt who's who's been suffering and hurting,

and we just pray grace over her. We do pray, Lord, I'm thankful. What the good news in all of this is that her great concern is that she wants to get to go be with you, and so we're thankful that she's gonna one day be with you. We just pray you'd you'd ease her pain and her suffering. And that you would just do something miraculous since in her Lord bless this family, Lord, for their desire to want to do what's right before you. Bless them in Jesus' name. Amen. Amen. Amen.

And if everyone listening can pray for Linda and her aunt, that'd be great. So here's an interesting, um, on, on that, euthanasia. Also known as mercy killing. It is illegal in all 50 states. However, oh, here it is, physician assisted suicide is legal. In several states and Washington DC, so how do you distinguish between those two things? Yeah, isn't euthanasia just a

physician assisted suicide? It seems to me that, I guess the, the lack of messing with words, the lack of medical doctors at this table. So according to AI, Phil's best friend, euthanasia involves a doctor administering a lethal injection or other means to end a patient's life. Assisted dying involves a doctor prescribing medication for the patient to self-administer. It's self-administered. Got it. OK, well, we learned something, see. Yep, still don't like AI, but hey, it probably doesn't

like you, and it'll win, Brian, so be careful. AI could be your best friend. I don't want it to be my best friend. Just wait and your therapist and your AI is, it's really, I, I was actually just listening to, um, a great conversation with our, our good friend Scott Ray from uh Iola Talbot and him and uh Sean McDowell were interviewing another professor from Biola who is a kind of an expert in tech and AI and stuff and.

You know, he's talking about like the amazing capacity of AI and and all the great things, good, good things it's gonna do. And also the really negative side of what it potentially could if in the hands of the wrong people or, you know, the wrong government that says we're gonna use it this way, um, it could be obviously very, very, very concerning. That's for sure. Uh, I just found that podcast. Uh, it's called Think Biblically.

Anybody wants to hear that episode and it prospects and perils, yes, yep, check that out. 888-564-6173. Danny and Covina. Welcome. How can we help you? Hi, pastors, thank you for taking my call. Uh, I was just reading in uh Leviticus chapter 4, that right after God said that, uh, Go to Egypt, go get my people. That verse 24 says, and on their way to the encampment, the Lord sought to kill him. I'm assuming him is Moses.

I was wondering, later on, it talks about a circumcision, but God would kill Moses over his son's lack of circumcision.

I didn't understand that. OK. And just to be clear, it's Exodus chapter 4, not Leviticus, but um, yeah, and, and I think to answer that question kind of just like would God have killed I think the answer is yes, and I think it's because, now obviously that didn't happen and God also knew that, so we have to take that into account, but there's a covenant that God's made with his people, and this was a part of that covenant was that they were to be a people marked

by circumcision and the lack of that. You know, this is kind of like a a holiness issue and Moses failed to walk in the ways of God. Now again, that's an old covenant. I don't wanna have

anybody mistake that for the new covenant. That's not a new covenant thing at all, that we are totally and completely made whole in the blood of Jesus in the cross of Jesus Christ, but when you talk about that in Exodus 4:24, it is kind of a Yeah, one of those like kind of curious passages, but yeah, I think the answer to your question is would God have done that? Of course. And but he also knew that he wouldn't need to do that, but covenant matters

to God. He's, he's a God of covenant. He, he has made a, uh, an unconditional promise through his Son Jesus that those who put their faith in him will by no means be cast away. So he does care about his covenants, and that was a covenantal promise between him and his people, the people of Abraham, and Moses was a part of that. He failed to keep that covenant. Yeah. Does this help you, Danny? Yeah, very strict, but yes, yes it is. Any thoughts, Brian?

Um, No, I, I, no, I mean that was a great answer. My only thought is, amen. Yes. I mean, I do, I, I think we live in a time where people don't want God to be that way at all. And I think we just have to take God as he reveals himself, not as we, you know, think he should have been.

And so, yeah, he takes his covenants very seriously. I'm, I'm just reading in um Leviticus right now and You know, all, all of these things, uh, even before in Exodus, the tabernacle, the priestly garments, everything, see that you make it according to the pattern. Don't, don't deviate, you know, this is do it exactly the way I say to do it. And you know, there is a reason why God gave these really clear cut strict. Guidelines and commands and so. It was all obviously pointing to Jesus.

Um, but like you said, Phil, the the covenant, I mean, this is, this is like the most serious thing. God makes a covenant with Abraham and the sign of the covenant is circumcision, and Moses is gonna lead the nation, but he's, he's disobedient, neglecting to circum his kids, obviously because his wife is not for it. And so, you know, it is a It's a crazy moment though. Also, you think like, had they done that when they should have done that, it

wouldn't have been nearly as bad. It wouldn't have been as terrible as when he did it to do that, you know. Danny, thanks for calling us today on Pastor's Perspective. Let's go to Vegas now. Here is Monica listening on the Kwave app. Hey, Monica, thanks for calling in today. How can we help you?

God is having me tell this story now. Um I had my eyes closed and I was reaching up towards heaven. And I I was there in heaven. Everything was white. There was, there was a lot of people and there were outlines. I couldn't see their face, but there were, I outlined, um, a lot of people and everything was pristine white. Um, somebody was standing. God was on the throne. Somebody was standing on his right side. At the time, I didn't know that was Jesus because I had just got saved,

so I didn't know. Um, and when I read it in the Bible, I'm like, oh my gosh. So anyway, my head was on God's lap, and I was crying and crying and I was, and I felt such peace that I've never felt before in this life ever. The piece that's here is junk. My head was on God's lap, and he was rubbing my hair and I was saying, I felt so much like, please let me stay, you know, I tried to look up at his face. He said, No, he spoke to my heart, no, you can't see me now. And I said,

Can I please let me stay with you? And he said, it's not your time. And I said, Please. And I begged him. And then, of course, I'm still here. And um it was years after that experience that I found out that Jesus was standing on the right hand of God um at the throne and um he's told me um I've been praying and I'm still say I'm always gonna be saved, but I'm in the church and everything and he told me to tell my story now and, and so I've been telling people and um.

People may think I'm crazy, I'm not, um, and like I tell people, well, when you get to heaven one day you ask God, was she there? And I said, he's gonna tell you, yes, he was, she was there.

Because I think, you know, a lot of times we, we wanna, uh, and this is, this is even speaking of Christians and sometimes, uh, I've noticed this where, um, you know, Christians, it's like I, I love God on the pages of the Bible and that's really great stuff and I'm gonna study that and know that and I'm gonna be able to communicate that. But, uh, I don't want him to get too close cause that's kind of can be a little bit uncomfortable.

And I think the reality is we, we serve the living God and everything that we read about in scripture where God meets with people and speaks to them and so forth, um, I think that, of course, those things could still happen today. And what we would always have to do if we say, oh, you know, the Lord appeared to me and spoke to me, we just have to measure what God said to us

over against scripture. So God's never gonna appear to us and tell us something that would contradict what he's already told us in in the Bible, but he will certainly appear to us and affirm to us things that he's told us in the Bible, or maybe show us things that we didn't know were in the Bible, like, oh, that's Jesus at the right hand of God. Um, and then we find out, wow, that, that was the case. So what do you think, Phil? No, I totally agree. I just, I wanted to just jump in

with all your guesses. You just, you just came back from Africa, where it's a different world in Africa, right? And they're, they're not necessarily asking the questions about does God speak to you? Does he, you know, yeah, I mean, they're kind of wondering like how, how have you not

heard God speak, you know? I mean, literally I was talking to some people who one of our pastors in kind of a remote area was talking about how He came to faith through a dream God gave him, you know, and that's not an unusual story, but you know sometimes I kind of hear those stories and you go, well, it's great to hear those, but then when you talk to somebody face to face who's telling you this is my story, so I, I, I, I agree. I think like.

Help, God help us to never get to the place where we don't see that this is a really, this is a living faith. I mean, it's a living God. Yeah. You know, I, I heard my friend Matt Chandler some time ago use the term, um, Western plausibility structure, right? And what he means by that is that we kind of see things through. The lens of Western life and culture, which is highly materialistic and you know, kind of just dismisses the spiritual.

So we, we determine things based on that plausibility structure. Uh, I don't know if that's plausible. I don't, I don't, I just can't see how God would appear or you would be at his throne on, you know, your head on his lap and he's rubbing that that doesn't fit in my western plausibility structure, right? OK, we'll blow your Western plausibility structures because that's not the,

that's not the standard. The Bible is the standard. And, and, and one of the other thing just kind of going back to Africa to your, your point on that, it was so interesting, you know, I, I get questions from people, you know, just kind of the leaders there, they're like, well, what is life like in America? Like what, you know, and it's like, where do you, where do you start this conversation, you know, and Prince, who's Nigerian but has been here several times.

You know, he starts with like where I would never start. He's like, let me talk about the roads. Let me just tell you there's like 6 lanes that are all paved going in one direction with, you know, he's kind of like starting there and and and I realized like as we're as we're having these conversations like people's lives.

They're so in need of God in ways that like honestly, we should be jealous in the Western world, you know, we, we don't now take this as what I what I mean it to say, we don't need God when it

comes to just like daily living. Now of course we do, but we, we have this functional ability to just live as if, you know, I'm gonna get in my car and drive on a safe road and there's stop signs and there's, you know, all these kinds of things and but when you live somewhere where you're like there's no. Like I need God for like survival just to get and I gotta tell you, man, I, I'm inspired by people like that because I go, oh Lord, I've mistaken

comfort for sovereignty and I need a sovereign God still very, very real in my life and, and this is where I think we have to. Also recognize that, you know, we we tend to just think inside of our, our own cultural moment, right? And and like our own political moment. So, well, you know, this is how you navigate this stuff and yet we forget there's a global church there are people that have, you know, the stuff that we think we're going through, which we're really not.

But you know, these guys have lived it 10 times more intensely than we have, and they actually navigated it by by trusting God. I think, you know, we, we, there's a lot for us to learn from the The bigger world, yeah, just from others, even the people in our world, in our world here this gal, this great gal calling who's having this great, you know, meeting with God and that it's gonna be like discredited, you know, simply because it doesn't fit kind of with everybody else

around her and that's an unfair thing. God's a big living God. In fact, a word of warning to Monica because she says that she feels like God is telling her to tell her story. She's gonna be telling her story. A lot of people are gonna deride her. And that might discourage her. And I mean, don't, don't

be discouraged. Yeah, because more people are gonna be blessed than people who are gonna be negative about it exactly right, yeah, it's too easy to, it's too easy to feel that like I need to like to be shamed into quietness when really it's OK to speak out, it's cool. We're hearing more stories of like Christians and South Korea and Africa and places like that, sending missionaries to America and that's just one of those things like, wait, we're the ones that are supposed to be going over there.

It's just like, no, they see that we're the ones that are kind of Well, think of this in in the last 110 years, the gospel, and there's the just the like kind of unknown Christians in Africa has gone from 10 million to today over 140 million. I mean it's it's the fastest. you know, that idea of Timbuktu, right, we always say like Timbuktu, based on like kind of mission understanding is

the epicenter of global movement around the world. It's no longer the furthest, you know, I mean, arguably people in Timbuktu are saying someday Costa Mesa, right, or California. I mean, seriously, the the fact that God's just doing this big thing all around the world is beautiful.

There was this article recently. Pastor Rick Warren, uh, the founder of Saddleback and author of Purpose Driven Life, Purpose Driven Church, he addressed the General Assembly of the Association of Evangelicals in Africa, calling on African evangelical leaders to take the lead in completing the global mission of the church. Um, he emphasized Africa's central role in the future of Christianity, urging the continent's churches to step forward in global leadership.

He said there are more Christians in Africa than there are people in the United States. Africa is now the most Christian continent on Earth with over 430 million believers. You were wrong, Phil, by about 300 million. I was off by the size of America. Yes, the church in Africa must lead the rest of us, is what, um, Pastor Rick said. It's great. Yes, indeed. All right, Monica, thank you for calling in today here on Pastor's Perspective. I don't think we have enough time for a

Another phone call. Ah, here's a quick question. Kimberly sent this in online through email. Do I have to wear a headscarf, according to, uh, 1 Corinthians 11? I just read this. Never heard of it before. Am I dishonoring my husband, myself, and my God for not wearing a headscarf? Uh, no, no, this was, uh. If you, if you continue to read the, the portion of scripture there in First Corinthians, Paul makes it uh clear that this is a custom that was, um, Relevant at the time, uh, and a custom is a

non-binding practice. So it's something that, you know, it's like a tradition. You might, you might do this at your church and you can take it or leave it because it's non-binding. God didn't say, hey, you gotta wear the head covering, so. All right, Kimberly, living in freedom. Take off that headscarf. Thanks for writing to us on, uh, via email, on Pastor's perspective through Kwave.com. We're out of time. But uh we'll be back tomorrow. We're gonna archive today's

episode on Facebook, YouTube, Apple Podcasts, and Spotify. And uh Phil Metzger, thank you for, uh, driving ins for having me. However you got here. Yeah, I did. I did drive. I'm surprised that you're kind of back in your time zone. Are you? I know it's been one week and I'm feeling great, good, great. Brian Broderson, good to see you as always. You'll be back tomorrow. I will be awesome. Lord willing. Talk to you tomorrow on Pastor's perspective.