Warning. The following episode contains stories of extreme violence. I didn't know it that I would go anywhere or not. I was just enjoying the independent state, saying all the final about and they were we were dunking on the on the road. I don't know. I didn't know what to be left for our next day. That is my grandfather or my daughter John speaking. I called him recently over what'sapp to ask about something that happened many years ago. He's eighty nine years old and he lives in Karagi.
Even though the connection wasn't very good, what he told me brought me back with him to his teenage years. It was June three and he was fourteen years old when he found out that the country he called home was going to be severed into pieces. He heard the used from his father, the newspapers and on the airwaves, but had no idea what this meant for him or his family. What was this news? Britain was finally going to grant India independence and in the process a new country,
Pakistan would be formed. With this information, a difficult choice was rapidly approaching. Were they going to stay in India or would they make the trip to Pakistan, so many factors were still at play, the official boundary lines were still unknown. There remained that way until a few days after the official independence days of each country August fourteenth for Pakistan and August fift for India. Imagine the gravity
of this situation. Most of us on any given day can't decide on a place to grab food when we're hungry. But this decision is one that would not only impact my grandfather, but future generations of our family. For many, this was not a leisurely choice, but one made on the basis of survival. If you have no idea know what I'm talking about, you aren't alone. From I Heart Radio, This is Partition, a podcast that will take a closer
look into this often forgotten part of history. Seven Partition of India is a story of panic, chaos, and violence. The partition created two independent nations, the Muslim majority Pakistan and the Hindu Sikh majority India. When the British left India, they made these divisions along religious lines, even though Muslims, Hindus, and people of other faiths all had lived together in the same communities for generations. Over fourty million people were displaced,
making it the biggest mass migration in history. It's estimated between a half a million to two million died in the ensuing violence seventy five years to the day, and we still don't know the exact number of lives lost, and it's safe to say we never will. My name is Najazi's a writer, podcaster, and film programmer living in Austin, Texas. I was one in Karachi, Pakistan, and came to the US with my parents, my sister, and eight suitcases when I was just eight months old. I'm going to be
real with y'all. As an immigrant and Muslim growing up in the South, especially when eleven happened, I very much shied away from these parts of my identity. I didn't have any interest in learning about my culture or where I came from. It wasn't until my first semester at the University of Texas at Austin where I truly found a space where I was able to embrace these parts of me and take the time to discover myself more
as a person. I didn't get the opportunity to go back to Pakistan until I was twenty seven years old. Both my parents had been back on separate occasions, seen was the year we were all going to be together. It was like a homecoming of sorts. I was so excited that not even the combined seventeen hour flight was enough to get me down. When we landed, it was about four am. I had barely slept, but it didn't matter.
I was wide awake and taking everything in. During this trip, I got to see where my parents went to school, museums, and markets. I would be in a car and look at the window and there'd be a camel next to us. I didn't write a camel then, but I did on my second trip, and let's just say I don't think
I would do it again. I saw relatives that I haven't even seen since I was a baby, and didn't even have any recollection of They would tell me little antidotes of what I was like in those first few months. Apparently I smiled a lot, which I find very easy to believe based on the handful of photos I have from that time. This trip was everything I could have wanted my first trip back to my home country to be.
From exploring the Arabian Sea down south to the mountains and snow up north, but I also found out something dark and sinister. It was something that had changed the lives of every single one of my family members, including Line. The malls in Pokistan are a lot different than the malls in the United States. They kind of act as a nightlife for the cities, since many Asian countries are dry. The handful of nightclubs that do exist or mostly for
the extremely wealthy or for tourists. The malls are open super late, usually until about eleven PM, with the food courts closing around one AM. So when I stumbled upon an exhibit that was being hosted at the Dolman Mall, where I was now a frequent visitor, by filmmaker Charmin obeyed Chnoi, a two time Academy Award winner, I knew I had to take a look. This is where the story really starts. I'm not really sure what I expected when I walked in, but I certainly didn't expect to
be so shocked. The exhibit in question was called Home and it's about the partition of India. I had been aware that Pokistan used to be a part of India, but I didn't know the stories, or more accurately, the horrors that surrounded this event. I just remember getting more upset, agitated, and confused. As I walked from room to room, I kept looking back at my parents. They seemed immersed in what they were looking at, but I couldn't really gather
much beyond that. Toni's exhibit featured oral histories, objects, and so many different stories. I was sitting next to my parents watching a video about a survivor giving their account of how they had to flee their village, and another being separated from her loved ones. Afterwards, we made our way to the food court for lunch, and I distinctly remember freaking out in every possible way. I am someone who wears their heart on their sleeve, so my emotions
were very much on display. I never knew this, not even a little bit. I'm sure whenever I read this exhibit was happening and mentioned some of the awful statistics about partition, but I guess I must have really skimmed the section. We were eating our food, and it was just this insane picture of us having this intense conversation over KFC and ME repeating over and over, why didn't I know about this? Why didn't anybody tell me this?
While waving a chicken strip in my hand. How could I be twenty seven years old and consider myself proud to be South Asian and not even have the slightest idea of how a major event in our history truly unfolded. I felt like a fraud. How would I even begin to come to terms with this information? We saw this
exhibit towards the tail end of our trip. We obviously still had a lot of fun in our remaining days, but I did feel like there was a dark looming cloud over me until I returned back home, and to be honest, it still feels that way sometimes. After our simultaneous out of body experience and a hard dose of reality, I began to look into partition. What else didn't I know? The first thing that became abundantly clear that it was a ridiculously hasty decision. Britain was broke after the war
and they could no longer afford to rule India. They exhausted all the resources they could and wanted out. In fact, India was a world's richestination from one to d But when the British left, India's GDP plommeted Lord Mountbatten, the Viceroy, a representative of the monarch was tasked to oversee the severance of India. I don't think anyone could have summed up this event quite as well as British historian Yasmin Khan. She noted in her book The Great Partition was the
perfect storm of hope, disaster, leadership, and blunder. Prior to the announcement on June third, there have been numerous meetings between the Muslim League, Indian leaders and the British to come up with the plan to disillusion the British Raj. There was never going to be a perfect solution. Each party involved had their own desires and motives and were unwavering in their fight. Key players included Mohammad Ali Jinna, the founder of Pakistan, and jal Wal Herlala Route, prime
Minister of India after independence. These two men, along with others, were one complicit in this decision. However, their roles I don't think can compare to the British. That being said, I'm not really here to discuss men and their soul called accomplishments or feelings. That is a story that gets touted around far too much. When I set out to do this podcast, I wanted to tell just the facts that quickly became an impossible task. How can you be
impartial to a story that is your own? Those are the people I want to hear from, ordinary people, the ones who have been ignored and silenced for decades. The more I found out about partition, the more questions I had, especially in relation to my identity. It's super wild to think about how divergent my life could have been if my great grandparents didn't decide to move. Our culture and
religion could be completely different. This notion is even more fueled by the fact that these two countries still have an incredibly tumultuous relationship with each other, especially in regards to their borders. I will take a deeper dive into this topic in another episode. Another big question that came to mind was where was this history when I was in school. I don't know about y'all, but the formation of a new country is a big deal and probably
warrants a discussion of some sort. As far as my memory serves, we learned about Gandhi and how he was a pacifist and stood up to the crown, and that's about it. I wanted to confirm this information, but when I reached out to the higher ups from my school district in Arlington, Texas. My queries went unanswered for the most part, and when I did receive an answer, the only information I was given was where the subject could
potentially pop up in a standardized test. We learned about so many outrageous injustices like the Holocaust, but for whatever reason, Partition has been continually erased from the narrative. While it is true that history holds more catastrophes and we could possibly count, Partition is unique because we have no memorials in either country recognizing this traumatic event. In A Partition museum was created, but it's in India, making it essentially
impossible for any Pakistanis to visit. There is no easily accessible communal place to reflect on this grief. Partition isn't something that just happened in the past, but in actuality is more of a living, breathing thing that comes to haunt our daily lives. I am a grandchild of Partition. The hardships of those who suffered before me are always
on my mind. In return, I believe it is our duty and our legacy to ensure the world knows what happened in I don't want unsavory facts swept under the rug, or to sugarcoat atrocities to make them seem not that bad. Ignorance is not bliss. Early on, I conducted a Twitter poll just to gauge where people were at. I asked, without looking it up, does anyone know what the party Shan is? One? People voted, with thirty one nine percent saying yes. Well, sixty eight point one percent, so they
had never heard of it before. I want people to know this history and to learn the notion that just because it didn't happen to you or anyone you know personally, doesn't mean it's not important. I ask everyone to read the paper, watch the news, open an app on your phone, and look at the countless immigrant and refugee crises around us. It isn't just a matter of countries not having it together, but the years and years of colonialism and imperialism that
took place to make them that way. I was in the dark for so long, and I don't want that to be the case for anyone else. My grandparents on my dad's side lived with us for a few years in Texas, and not once did I ever ask or think to ask what their lives were like back then. Now only two of my four grandparents are still alive and their memories are not what they once were. You could consider this my attempt at atonement. Earlier, you heard my grandfather tell you the state of confusion he was
in when he learned about partition. He lived in Bombay, and while this area wasn't as hostile as the others, he still had his fears as a teenage boy. Unfortunately, the audio for this clip is a little rough, so my dad is going to read his words aloud. He says the words they many times, and he's referring to both Indians and Pakistani's. Bombay had very minor violence between the gundas. You know, they were shouting. One was shouting against Pakistan, the other one was shouting against India and
the leaders and everything. When a few people get together Europe there they would start shouting. The other side also threw stones and soda water bottles. If they saw anyone alone in the Muslim or Hindu localities, they would kill them. They would step them. That happened once in a while. This one. I used to get scared going to school because a school was by the border in one of our conversations, my grandpa casually mentioned that my great aunt
was born on the day of partition. I was gobsmacked. I am still finding out so much information from my family and about my family by accident. Even though my great aunt Pervine would obviously have no recollection about what happened, I did want to ask her what people told her. There were a lot of rights over there, and then many hundreds and millions of people were killed at that time, more than a million people were killed in fifteen million people.
They moved from from India to Pakistan and some from Pakistan to India. The rights were so bad they killed everybody. Bussus a lot of people were killed. Everybody was trying to get on train, but maybe thousands of people they couldn't make it because they were killed between the roads. Like traveling from here to day again, try to latch onto this information. This is one of the biggest refugee
catastrophes in the world. Numerous accounts were called. People waiting to travel on trains, desperate to leave, and when many of the trains pulled into the stations, they were already filled with passengers, but they weren't alive. Article from the New York Times mentions just some of the scenes people
had to enter so there. Shaanna Kumari watched a mob and pale her one year old cousin on a spear, almost want His father held a can of fuel and some matches, instructing her to set herself afire if friars broke into their home, and a k and Nn saw terrified family leeing villages by foot, in ox carts and on horseback along roads littered with corpses, picked apart by dogs and bloated from the rain. Were these harsh truths detailed on screen or were they glossed over? I'll give
you a taste after the break. Naturally, when researching anything, I wanted to see what film and TV depictions were out there. And it's not great, so much so that it warrants its own episode. But I will tell you all these tidbits. Barely anything I watched addressed women, children, religious minorities, or wreck fugees. Most of what I saw were men talking, or rather complaining about everything under the sun, except how partition would actually affect the people living in
the places they were eager to tear apart. Partition doesn't have a Schindler's List, something that is widely available to the masses to consume. Where's our epic, our, PBS miniseries or HBO drama, whereas AMD this could be your next project and I'm completely available to write interact. Of course, there are books. Books are always great, but I'm willing to bet the majority of us aren't going to go
that route when learning about something new. Our attention spans are so minuscule that new information has to be doled out and digested in tiny pieces with the hope that these stories will resonate. There are so many important facts that are either skipped or half ascidly thrown into the
media depictions just to check it off a list. What if I told you that no one visited the communities that would soon be separated to see whether or not the proposed solution to divide India made any sense, or that the United Nations was deliberately left out of the conversation to avoid any delays. What if I told you that the boundary line was to be drawn out in five weeks by a lawyer who had never even been to India before. What if I told you seventy women
are thought to have been raped and abducted. We never get the terror, anguish or heartache. I did witness these emotions in home, n but this was a temporary exhibit and again not something that is incredibly accessible to everyone. I can't remember if photography was allowed Either way, I don't think I would have brought myself to take any photos, but I did end up taking one of my mom. When we were leaving. By the exit, there was a question posed on a wall with hundreds of sticky notes
littered with answers underneath. Some of the answers traditionally would be considered mundane, but not in as context. My dad and I were heading out and I was shocked to see my mom write something down. I didn't know if she would remember this moment, but I decided to call her and ask her about it. Hi now, h Hi Mom,
thanks for coming on the podcast. Um, So, do you remember when we went to Pakistan for the first time and we want to that exhibit at the mall and it was about partition and I was very shocked by everything that I saw. But it's obviously a story that you and Dad know very well. Can you tell me how you felt when you saw what you saw um.
I felt really sad. Although I was not a part of that partition, but my parents and grandparents and many other families got rooted out of their homes, and unfortunately, memories of what my parents and grandparents told me hazy or they are no longer there. And although we've read about them in school and colleges about the history of seven, but looking at these brought back a lot of emotions and sadness to see that how people survived, how people
moved on, and what they must have faced during that time. Uh. Usually you don't really participate in a lot of things. But when you saw a question that was posed on the wall when we were leaving, that said, what would you take with you if you had to leave your home in seven? I was really surprised that you actually
wrote something down. Can you talk about that? I felt compelled to write something on that wall, and what I wrote on it was that I would take my family pictures with me because they would remind me of the times that we had spent in our that home. It would remind me what we were left off was memories. Everything else can be replaced, everything can be bought, but the memories that we've shared the memories that we have.
The pictures would tell a story, and that I think is the most important thing that I would ever take if I ever were to leave a home. Thank you for talking to me, Thank you Nihah for inviting me to be a part of your podcast, and I'm anxiously waiting to listen to it. This season on Partition, I navigated a whole lot of material which really tested my limits as a person. The sheer brutality of what I heard, read, and saw was more than enough sadness to last me
a lifetime. You'll hear from survivors we just escaped because you know, all those headless bodies and all the people who were massacred were there around us. We just had to hide in the train. Historians there is also really feel that these stories will get lost if their not know. I really felt that that I didn't want these wants
is to be released. Filmmakers, I think as children of parents who went through partition and who won't talk about it so much, a part of our healing is to understand what happened on a micro level and a macro level. How did this affect our family in ways that we have to investigate when they won't talk about it, and many more people who are also trying to shed light on the truth about what happened in until now nex Week,
I'm ness and this is Partition. Partition was developed as a part of the Next Up initiative created by Anna Hosnier, Joel Monique and Sina Median. Partition is produced by Anna Hosnier, Tricia Mukerjee and Becca Ramos. It is edited by Rory Gagan, with the original score composed by Mark Hadley.