Cookie Crumb Day

immediately comes to minds Dick Weston. It would not be unimaginable to think the guy who has to spend the rest of his life in prison would want some retribution against the mastermind walked free. As Detective Tom Cooper tells me, even though Dick Weston was locked up, the guy was known to have ties to the outside. I'm sure he had connections through the prison system because he was spending his time down terror hate be for spending the rest

of his days serving four consecutive life sentences. Dick Weston had the first complete the federal government's twenty five years sentence at the prison in Tara Hape, Indiana, and he was supposed to come to us after they never got to us. The theories of Dick Weston taking out a hit on. Ron Thomas ended in when Dick suffered a massive heart attack and died in prison. Previously on Paper Ghosts, and we come to a kind of like a dead end, and we spent around and guess who was behind me?

Ron Thomas. He had followed me. He had literally turned around and followed me down the steps. You don't know where if you lay down to take a nap or lay down good to street where you going like up or not? You don't know where your kids just gonna be where you left him or not not With everything that was going on, and I'm convinced that he knew his killer. There was no struggle in the home, and it didn't appear to be My name is m William Phelps.

I'm an investigative journalist and author of forty four true crime books. This is season two of Paper Ghosts. Burned. With any question of the mafia's involvement or Dick Weston's attempt at retaliation now off the table, the pool of people who could have killed Ron Thomas was shrinking. Those involved have their theories, as do I. It's been sometime since I last spoke with Carol Thompson, the daughter of

victims Linda and Billy Stevenson. After hearing her admit that she wanted to shoot Ron tom is dead on the courthouse steps, and now learning that a potential hit was put out on Ron, I needed to call Carol and asked the obvious question, So knowing what happens to Ron later, I mean, a fair question is because it's an unsolved case, did you kill Ron? No? No, I did not. I um, you know, I understand, I understand you're asking that question

to me. That doesn't even enough an me. I've never I didn't understand at the time why the police didn't contact me earlier. You know, this piece of information has always surprised me. For as diligent and tenacious as the Claremont County Sheriff's Department and FBI were in investigating the Stevenson case, It's bizarre why no one in law enforcement thought to question the surviving family member who made no

secret wanting to kill Ron Thomas. No one contacted you, no, no, no no. I was laying at Baud asleep and it was about I was two in the morning or something, and my phone rang and it was my daughter, you know, my oldest daughter, Shannon, and uh, she said to me and her mom, you need to wake up, Like I say somethinghere, this very important. And I'm like, she's two three in the morning or something. She's like, gets to

your computer. Go to your computer now. She immediately, uh sent me a link and I click the link and it talked about, you know, this cold case murder of Ronald Thomas. And I'm like, this can't be the same this, this can't you know, I mean, come on, I'm blown away. He's murdered. So I did call the the policeman over the cold case. Carol spoke with Dave Bell, the former South Carolina detective who you've heard in the last few episodes.

I was about to be very, very happy, and but he's know for sure, you know, it was the right guy. And so I asked him, I, you know, I need to confirm that this is you know, the same wrong from you know Berkfield. And his answer surprised me because he said, um, something the effect of, if you're referring to the man who was in some ways linked to the Stevenson murder in Bethel, Ohio, then yes, this is the same man. I said him right away. You know,

I'm shocked. Why didn't you know. I'm I'm surprised, you know, I wanted demand dead. I'm surprised thatybody called me. You know, this is a cold case. I'm shocked. And he kind of he kind of chuckled, and he said, you know, you know, Caroline's done. I understand that. He said, so let me ask you a question. And I said, what's that? And he said, did you murder wrong pass? And I said, absolutely not. But if you find out who did, let me know. I would like to send them some cookies

and flowers and anything else they might need. And I wanted to thank them. My fear was, you know, this wasn't a man that was gonna stop if he saw money in the future. It wouldn't matter if it was a one year old, you know, hate hap kill him. I didn't want anybody else to get through it. There are three fundamental motivations behind murder. Love, money, revenge under the money umbrella. Greed factors into about homicides in this country.

According to experts and crime statisticians, It's clear to me Carol Thompson did not kill Ron Thomas. I am certain she can be ruled out as a suspect, but there is one other person who had a solid motive to want Ron dead. In the eyes of Dave Bell, who took up Ron Thomas's homicide case in the early two thousand's, history seemed to be repeating itself. You know what what when we first looked into run Ron's death, we we we looked at his wife as a suspect, Irene in

his in his murder. It didn't take long to realize that, yes, you are number one suspect in his murder because of the pattern that she had and uh in her first and second husband's untimely death. Looking back, Irene's first husband was accidentally killed by a train while trying to outrun cops after a domestic dispute. Her second husband was severely beaten, survived, but then reportedly committed suicide by firing a shotgun with his paralyzed toe. Now Irene's third husband has been murdered

while sitting in his living room waiting for someone. If there's one axiom good investigators rely on, it's that previous behavior as an indicative predictor of future behavior. Because, similar to what happened the last time I hit was put out on one of her husband's Irene was conveniently far away from the crime scene when Ron Thomas was killed, and of course you know, Irene left Ron home by

himself to give herself an alibi. Uh so, But when she could be home and found Ron murdered and called one the investigator where he arrived and started talking to her the crime scene and asking her questions. She stopped him at one point and says, well, do I need an attorney? And the investigator I don't know. Do you think you need an attorney? And as soon as he said that, she said, I'm not gonna say no more,

hour on my attorney. Most people whose significant other has just been found murdered are usually beside themselves, stricken by shock and sorrow. They can react in unexpected ways, yet predictable under the banner of acute emotional pain that generally accompanies shocking loss. If Irene's reaction wasn't suspicious enough, what she did in the weeks before Ron Thomas's murder more

or less confirmed her involvement. The funny thing I found out was I thought really unique, was Irene had taken a big insurance policy had on him, like a hundred and fifty tho dollar insurance policy had on Run, and a month before Run is murdered, she calls the insurance her insurance agent who she's had for years, and asked the insurance agent that if if Ron would would just so happened to be a shot in the death, which she still gets the hundred fifty thou dollars if he

died in that matter in the in the insurance agent actually told, oh, yeah, sure you will. You know now, if that's not suspicious, I don't know what is. It was actually three hundred thousand dollars in life insurance that Irene ended up collecting after Ron Thomas's murder, a considerable bump from the ninety thousand she pocketed after her second husband's suicide, and a seemingly larger increase from the undisclosed

sum she made from her first husband's untimely death. Well, she got that all that big self clumps of money because of her behavior and her decisions. Then that showed her out easy. She get money with the insurance, and that plan of that seat in her brain is That's what I'm thinking with Ron Thomas. Do you think she hired somebody or I think she promised somebody? Yeah, I think she promised somebody some of the insurance money once

he was murdered. Is it possible that Ron could have been killed by someone Dick Weston sent there because Ron got away from being charged in the in Stevenson murders. Uh, well, you know, I would say, I'd say it would be more weld than likely. What Irene. The name David Bell mentioned seems to come out of nowhere. It's someone close to Irene who was never named in any official documents. I trust Bell's investigation in the off the record information

has provided me. This is why giving cold cases a second look is so crucial. Detective Bell stepped in with a new set of eyes, a new way of looking at things. It's these reasons why the name he mentions. It's credible to me. I got a written statement from a guy who said that his former wife was a friend of Irene's and it was his understanding and that I read killed William Floyd. If so, if he would

kill William Floyd, he sure killed Ron Thomas. Why would this person carry out such a heinous act for someone like Irene knowing her pension for cashing in on insurance money was an obvious motivating factor, as well as the common theme that connects us back to why so many people in this story have wound up dead greed, I mean, people did have set up for murder. Your husband's to be construed as a black widow. I will admit that her first husband was trying to She was just indirectly

involved with his untimely death. She didn't plan on him trying to beat that train, you know. But I think it's I run that not only did she claim the insurance, I think she also uh found a civil suit against the train company, you know, the uh and then the same thing with the motel. She fild a civil suit for William's death. Well, she's in unders initiated, you know, and caused it. And in my opinion, I mean, I think, in fact, I think it was the FBI that Penderwood

the black black woodow the title. You know, she's the one who confesses to the FBI about all this with William Floyd. As it turns out, Irene Floyd met with the FBI on three separate occasions back in Nino. She confessed her role in the near fatal beating of her second husband, William Floyd, and admitted to receiving instructions from Ron Thomas on how to tip off the assailants after she and William arrived at their motel room in Memphis. And of course, you know, she did a recamp her

confessions to the FBI. She never gave uh reason why she reacan that. She just denied, uh that she ever confessed to the FBI. Of course, you know I confirmed with the FBI that she, in fact did. Irene made official statements to the FEDS. She couldn't take back what she admitted, but in a twisted bit of luck for Irene, the documents were filed away and seemingly lost within what can be an endless system of too much information and

too small of a budget to hire more investigators. That is until the early two thousands, when the Richland County Sheriff's Department in South Carolina decided to reopen Ron Thomas's homicide case. After coming across Irene's damning statements as well as her lawsuit against the motel, Richland County decided there was enough evidence to charge Irene Thomas with conspiracy to commit murder in the near fatal beating of her second husband.

That's when I got her indicted for or for the conspiracy to kill Bill Freud because she did all the conspiring in Columbia and Richeline County, which was our jurisdiction. Irene Thomas was arrested and detained for five days before being released on twenty five thousand dollars bail. If convicted, she would face up to five years in prison or a five thousand dollar five This shocks and disturbs me.

Conspiracy to commit murder and the worst punishment is only five years in prison, of which we know will be decreased to less time. The system is broken. Did she ever do any time for that crime? Doctor? My knowledge?

You know, we had a sorry excuse for a solicitor at the time, you know, a prosecutor and he uh, he wasn't real big on cold cases and trying to prosecute coal cases because he thought it would be too much effort and he was afraid of losing a cold cases are harder to approve and and not yet reelected.

That was his problem, said, I understand she was never brought travel So you really believe that Irene was the one who had a hand in Ron Thomas's murder, Oh, no doubt there's no doubt in my mind to think about all the pain and suffering, not to mention the innocent lives lost at the behest of Ron Thomas, is to truly understand that a sociopath lacks the basic emotion to love, to care about people, that he puts himself

as narcissist do ahead of the world. The torment Ron Thomas had planned, caused, and inflicted lasted law after he was killed. Despite Ron's death in n it would be thirteen years before Carol Thompson and her daughter Shannon would learn about the fate of the second man responsible for killing their family. Imagine over a decade and nobody called them,

nobody sent the letter, nobody emit nothing. You know, this whole time, my mom's watching over her back, scared to death, her whole life, and angry and just It was about two o'clock in the morning and I remember I dropped everything. I called my mom here in Ohio, got her out of bed. I'm like, you have got to go downstairs. I have to get this to you. So she goes down, she fires up her computer and I don't tell her. I just send her the link. And oh, it was crazy,

like She said, it was a bombshell. It was insane. We never imagined in a million years. After learning about Ron's death, Shannon called the prison to get an update on the other man who killed her family, Dick Weston. The prison informed her that Dick had been released. Shannon absolutely lost it. How could this be happening? The d o J ultimately called back and said they made a mistake.

Dick Weston had actually died while in prison. There's no explanation for how such a mind blowing misstep like this can happen. It's a seemingly innocent mistake, but one that can set off a debilitating new wave of trauma and fear for victims families. My mom and I made a holiday of the day Rohn was murdered. I mean, it's horrible, but it's cookie crumb day. It's the day to be thankful for the little cookie crumbs that life gives you. You know that, I don't know. I just meant a

lot to us. It never surprises me how victim family members react to trauma of losing someone to murder, or how victims families are treated. Each person deals with the shocking realities in their own way. I've seen this in my own family. My brother, for example, after his pregnant wife was strangled to death, spent the next several years killing himself with drugs and alcohol. He succeeded. So I never judged those who, like Carol Thompson, find ways in

which to deal with this sort of consuming grief. What did you think when you heard that Irene might be behind Ron's murder? I loved it because the reason that I loved it, I mean, there could have been a better person. I really hope it was her, because he betrayed my family. He was their friend or trusted friend, and he betrayed them and killed them for their money. So it's his wife betrayed him. Oh my gosh, that's there's just no better. I mean, if I couldn't do it,

that would be the next best thing. Yeah. Absolutely. Carol presents herself as a resilient, irrepressible. To some. She can come across as too animated or blunt emotionless if you will, when recalling some of the darkest moments of her life, but it's her life, her story, her experience. Carol gets to respond in any way she needs to. I'm glad if she is the one who did it. I'm really super glad that she betrayed him, and I hope he knew that. I hoped in the last seconds of his

you know, his musical life. I hoped in those last seconds. But you know, he knew he was betrayed. I think that would be a little bit of justice. You know, it's just a shame that Ron skates right under the you know, he skated, but in the end, he you know, he got a bullet in the back of his head. Yeah, it's not good enough, but it's good. I mean, that's what it is. I wish it was. I mean a trial. A trial and life in prison would have been better, I think would have been great. Yeah, or or me

to actually call him, because I truly did. I wanted to kill him right on the courthouse steps. That was my fantasy. And I don't get him on the courthouse steps where everybody could see. And you would have done it, Carol, Absolutely, yes, I think I would have done it. I mean, it's it sounds terrible. Could you be that cold? But yeah, you know, when I think about it, you know, the flashes I get pictures in my head of of Mom's

body and little Billy, you know, a little billy. All I gotta do this thing about little Billy And yes, that cool trigger absolutely because you know what, there's other babies out there. And he he was dangerous. I don't care what anybody said. He was dangerous and they weren't getting him, you know. And it's just a shame because I don't know if they knew who he was and that I mean, I understand that you can't get evidence on somebody, but I don't know. You know, there was

quite a bit of circumstantial evidence. I would have rather them taking to court with the circumstantial evidence and lost. Might have tried it on. Luckily for David Bell, he picks it up like ten years later and you know, pursues it and and David Bell, he's like, look, I brought this case to my prosecutors and they didn't want to do anything. I told them Ron, I found evidence Ron was involved. How can they do that? How can you know? How can you do It's up to them.

It's up to them to say I know that. You know what, it doesn't make any sense to me in the in the grand scheme of the world. It doesn't make any sense to me. How you can let a person who planned and and actually you know, made it happen, a quadruble murder, including that of a child, and you know who this person is, and you if you've got this evidence, you've got these police, you know, bring it to your desk, and you know that this person will probably do something like this again, how do you not

pursue it? Not everyone grieves in the same way. Carol has offered through horrible trauma, the likes of which most of us will never experience. She's felt the shock, the denial, the guilt, the anger, the fear. But there's no magic solution to help escape the kind of pain you feel when your entire family has been executed and justice has not been served. Having told Carol everything I've uncovered during my investigation, I asked her if the information has helped

in any way. Absolutely. I mean that's all I've ever wanted was you know Ron's dad. I can't you know, they can't do anything with him now. But yes, I mean I've always wanted the story known for what it truly happened and who who did it. One of the things that has always haunted me is, you know, a hundred years in the future Ron's great great grandchildren. You know they're gonna look back and they're gonna go, oh, are poor great great grandfather. He was a good of

standing man. He was such a good man, and he was murdered and they never even found out who killed him. Poor poor man. Now, no, I don't want that. I mean, and that's always been my driving thing, really, that's always been in my head. Dick Weston was dead. Ron Thomas was dead, but the woman authorities believed orchestrated Ron's murder managed to somehow evade any repercussion, same as he did. Yet, like Ron, Irene Floyd's life of freedom wouldn't last long.

And one of the more bizarre twists in this entire case, alas dose of karma, perhaps what ended up happening next is the moment you look at and just have to ask yourself what the hell is going on in this case? Because, for one, it was well known among friends that Irene Floyd was terrified of water, and yet in two thousand twelve, Irene Floyd, the Black Widow, was found dead in a

friend's swimming pool. The cause of death drowning Paper Ghosts is written and executive produced by Me and William Phelps and I Heart Radio Executive producer Christina Everett with script consultant Matthew Riddle. Audio editing and mixing by a Booze Afire thanks to Will Pearson at I Heart Radio. The series theme number four four two is written and performed by Thomas Phelps and Tom Mooney. And one final thank you to Lauren Bright Patio, who I cannot thank enough

for all she has done for me. For more podcasts my Heart Radio, visit the I Heart Radio app, Apple Podcasts, or wherever you listen to your favorite shows. H