#510 Packers Unscripted: Down the stretch

We were just doing so with the forty Niners about a month and a half ago, so we won't necessarily review all of that, but I do want to take a look at before we get to some Pro Football Hall of Fame news later in the show, just to tease that a little bit, but I do want to take a look at the forty Niners season, how it finished up after the victory over the Packers in Week twelve, and when you look at how this unfolded for San Francis Go. The Niners final five regular season games literally

came down to the last play of the game. I mean they were involved in crunch time game. After crunch time game, they went three and two. They lost to the Ravens on the last second field goal. They lost to the Falcons on a last second touchdown, but they pulled out victories over the Saints, over the Rams, and over the Seahawks to win the NFC West and get that NFC's number one seed, which is why they are

hosting the Packers this weekend. It was a really, really uh tough stretch of games, a gauntlet so to speak, that the Forts finished their season. Yeah, and honestly, I think there's maybe one game in there that they didn't play well. I felt like the Atlanta game they just they played poorly in that other ones, I mean, they had a couple of things that didn't go their way, But I mean I thought they put together a good effort against the Saints. Obviously, the game against the Ravens

was what it was. Robbie Gold, I believe, was still injured during that game, and obviously, you know, the Ravens won it on a game winning field goal. And then you go to that Seahawks game, and it's funny, Mike, when you look at how the Packers won that game against Seattle. Now, while they had a little bit more breathing room than the Forts did, very similar in how those second halves played out, can you stop Russell Wilson that one play, that one drive that you need you

to fill, you know, get a victory. San Francisco did that, and it just shows you that it doesn't matter if you're the first ranked defense or the last ranked defense. If you're going up against Russell Wilson, you're in for a long afternoon. And when they needed, I felt they needed to pull things together and make a statement. They did that against Minnesota. That was the game where they definitively put their foot down and said we are the

better team. Because you're right. That was an absolute gauntlet. They won games that maybe they shouldn't have when you look at the Rams contest, and they lost a game against the Falcons that they very much should have won. They were the number one seed, they got the first round by they put it to good use. They're very healthy and had the performance that they did against the

Vikings well. And I think the game that everybody points to as probably the game of the year in the NFL as far as the regular season is concerned, was that forty Niners visit to the super Dome in New Orleans back and forth. One of the highest scoring games in the NFL. The final was forty forty six. New Orleans gets a touchdown. I believe it was less than a minute to go, like fifty some seconds on the clock.

New Orleans takes the lead. The forty Niners come back the other way and they look they're hanging by a thread there at fourth down. The game is on the line, and then George Kittle catches the pass, breaks some tackles, gets a big play down the field, and that sets up the game winning field goal. Not only obviously was that instrumental in the forty Niners ultimately getting the number one seed, it also helped the Packers get a first round by because it tagged a loss on the Saints.

That ended up proving pivotal as far as all of the tie breakers and everything else went with regard to the playoff seeding. But that was one ale of a game, and I think that was the game that a lot of people said, Okay, that's the one that really pegs the Niners as the team to beat in the NFC because they went into New Orleans. Everybody knows that's a tough place to play. They want to shoot out and uh and they did it in pretty impressive fashion yea, and they got a two point stop at the end

of that game. You know, there was the touchdown pass from Breeze with fifty three seconds, that's right, and the Saints went for two. They went for two because they want to be able to persive it absolute point advantage. And for the exact reason that played out, Robbie Gold comes down, makes the thirty yard field goal, forty Niners win. But you know, much like the Packers and and JR.

Alexander getting that sack of Wilson, you know, those those can be such momentum turning plays, even though they aren't always the first thing to the top of your mind. I just felt like the San Francisco forty Niners showed a lot of fortitude and grit during the second half of the season, because, yeah, you can talk about those last five games in the regular season, all of them being one score. Before that, they had to knock down,

drag out games against Arizona. They've really been tested when when you look at how their season has played out. What was the other game too, I'm trying to think of off the top of my head, uh, Seattle beating them on November eleven, twenty four Yeah, that overtime game on Monday night that almost ended in a tie. Like the over, the overtime almost expired before the Seahawks won. Yeah, and so much of this is put on the Packers for,

you know, winning ugly and all these things. I mean, people kind of forget that once the forty niner is lost, and even before that, you know, them beating Washington nine to zero. I mean, they've had to win ugly two. That's what makes this game great and as good as Seattle has been in the second half this year, and how they've won their share of one score games. I think when you look at the true strength and makeup of the NFC right now, as I said on yesterday's show,

it's Green Bay and it's San Francisco. It's these two Titans that are finally gonna clash here, And as Kyle Shannon's talked about, as Matt with Floors talked about, this is going to be a different game. I'm mostly just interested in seeing one what adjustments Anahan makes offensively in this rematch against Mike Petton, his former head coach when they were together in Cleveland, and how Matt Lafleur tries to steer the ship differently for this offense in Round

two against San Francisco. What did he learn from maybe watching the Rams? What did he learn from watching what's the Saints did? Is there certain avenues towards victory there that maybe the Packers didn't explore the first time that would allow him to get off to a faster start. Yeah, and obviously I think the Packers are are looking for a faster start. Things went south early in that that first matchup in Week twelve, and the Packers never really recovered. That.

Being said, you know, you look at the way the forty niner season ended, as we talked about, with all these close games. You look at the way the Packers entire season is gone. With all these close games in the fourth quarter, you just get the feeling, just like with the Seattle game um last week, that that this one, this one's gonna be a four quarter battle. The Week twelve result, notwithstanding the the overwhelming evidence with regard to these two teams is that these are the kind these

are the kind of games that they play. I remember keeping an eye on that. I believe it was a Saturday night game in Week sixteen when the forty Niners were playing the Rams, which of course Packers fans had their eye on because of potential seating possibilities and all of that. And the game is tied, and twice on San Francisco's game winning drive to kick the walk off

field goal at the end, they had third and sixteen. Offensively, they converted it both times, you know, much like you know the Packers hitting the big third down conversions against Seattle to not give Russell Wilson another chance. The Rams were in great shape. You're at third and sixteen, you get a stop, you got a minute or so on the clock. Jared Goff maybe drives them down to to kick a field goal and win that game. But um,

Jimmy Garoppolo converts a pair of third and sixteens. The the number of crunch time, clutch moments that both of these teams have been through throughout the course of the season, I think is what really makes this interesting that now they're the last two teams standing in the NFC. Yeah, and what is an NFL season like? It is a battle of attrition. It's trying to, you know, manage the

highs and the lows of a year. Because, as everyone always likes to talk about it's been what forty seven years now since the team has gone undefeated for an entire season through the Super Bowl. You're gonna take losses, You're gonna take punches on your chin, But how do you bounce back for them? And I think see San Francisco and Green Bay have been two of the most resilient teams in the NFL this year, and it goes back to confidence. Uh, these teams are not swayed by,

you know, certain outcomes of adversity. They if they if they're gonna take a loss, they're gonna learn from it and they're gonna try their best the following week to not replicate those mistakes. That's what stood out to me the most during the second half of the season with San Francisco because it's not like, Okay, you have Jerry Rice and you've got you know, Garrison Hurst. You have guys that you need to feed the football too, and that's your offense. That's not the way they operate. They

got three different running backs, four different running backs. If you want to throw Jeff Wilson in there, that can all take the ball in the backfield. The Packers got a little familiar with Wilson in that first game. You you have, yes, Emmanuel Sanders that came in, but they didn't just start piping the ball to Emmanuel Sanders every single down. You have different areas where they thrive in. I think they have the best tight end in football, they have the best fullback in football. They win in

unconventional ways, and they thrive unconventionally. That statistic as I was watching the game against Minnesota that I wasn't familiar with is the fact that Jimmy Garoppolo's average yards per pass are the league's low right now among quarterbacks. They asked so much in terms of yards after catch from their receivers to get the ball and then create afterwards. Get the ball in open field and let your athletes work.

That's what's made them so I think, honestly dominant throughout the course of the year, because if there's anything that is difficult to beat in the NFL, it's a team that consistently moves the chains and gets first down. In San Francisco for the large part of this season, has been one of the best at doing that. Yeah. Absolutely, And when you look at last week's game against Minnesota, which really was quite a statement by the four Niners.

The way they dominated that game. They obviously used the playoff by to their advantage. They got some guys healthy, and they were in control of that game pretty much from start to finish. Garoppolo made the one mistake he threw the interception to Eric Kendricks, but the Vikings didn't totally capitalize on it. They only got a field goal out of it, and uh and then the Vikings never

were able to completely close the gap. What Minnesota was able to do in that game was limit George Kittle, which not a lot of teams have been able to do. And I'm no xs and OS expert, and I did not sit and watch the game from start to finish,

had some other things going on on Saturday. But in stopping George Kittle, the one thing the Vikings were not able to do was stop the running game, because because San Francisco just pounded the ball I think one of the touchdown drives, didn't They run the ball on every single play, like seven or eight plays for sixty yards something like that. So Minnesota was able to take Kiddle out of the game, but was that at the expense of not being able to stop the run I mean,

that's what makes these guys so tough to defend. And what you said about whatever adjustments Petton is going to make, and as we've talked about whatever adjustments the Fleur might make in terms of trying to get Aaron Rodgers out of the pocket. Look at look at what the Rams did. Uh, you know, in terms of working sideline to sideline offensively to uh to get that defense moving. It all sounds great in theory, but you have to execute it so

precisely against these guys because they're really, really good. Yeah. And the reason I'm gonna agree with you that I think that is what happened. The emphasis on Kittle in the pasting game costs them against the run is because San Francisco had forty seven carries forty three if you don't want to count Garoppolo. Their longest carry was eleven yards. I mean, this isn't Derrick Henry wearing you down, wearing you down and then busting a big one. They were

just ahead of the chains. Everything they were. They were in second and three, second and four. It seemed like the vast, the vast majority of the time I was looking at the screen, I wasn't seeing San Francisco in second and eight or second nine. It was second and four or second and five, second and two and uh. And that's a great way to live offensively, especially with that offense, when you use bunch formations and you're so tight end heavy, it isn't trying to get you know,

stretch plays down the field. It's not trying to to you know, run go routes and outbreakers and trying to do things to make it explosive play happen. They're just they forced them organically, if that even makes sense. I mean, they are just going to keep pushing the ball down your throat until you just can't take it. And that's the reason I think. For example, here twenty one first downs forty in this game, there were seven for the Vikings.

Jimmy Grappil only completed eleven passes. The time of possession was thirty one thirty three. Kyle Shanahan says all the right things this week, and I think people who don't really understand the four Niners and the way they win will say, well, you know, he's just giving his guys the right message that you know, you can't look at that first game with Green Bay. You gotta be focused on this one, yes, but it's also the fact that they won that game in a very different fashion than

they usually win. The Packers dominated time of possession, The Packers ran seventy offensive place at Green Bay was being forced to go the length of the field. I don't even think they got two hundred yards of total offense, and San Francisco was being opportunistic. That's a way to win, and it's allowed San Francisco to be a number one seed and has allowed them to be one of the best teams in football. But that's not their bread and butter. Their bread and butter is doing what they did so

that when you're in the fourth quarter, your will is broken. Yeah, that's what that's that's uh, that's definitely what they're after and they had. They did have some breakdowns in the fourth quarter late in the season that cost him a couple of games. To their credit, they also bounced back from a few of those breakdowns and they did not ultimately give away the number one seed. And that's why

they're playing at home on Sunday. And here's the other thing too, you have to consider with this, and we talked about a little bit, but it's big man. Joe Staley's back for them now, Kwon Alexander is back for them. De Ford is back for them, And there's a certain line of thinking out there. For as much attention as Bosa has gotten this year, that a lot of that attention and a lot of that success is going hand in hand with having DeFord on the field, much like

having both of the Smith bros. When you get those multiple pass rushers in different ways to pressure, that's going to enable your playmakers to make more plays. This is

a big challenge, no question about it. On the flip side, the Viking, sorry not the Vikings, the forty Niners have lost two players on the interior in the trenches, center Weston Richburg and defensive tackle those tackle DJ Jones are both out for the season now, so that'll be a little bit different from what the Packers faced back in Week twelve. And rich Burg would you go back to when John Lynch was building this team and they signed

him over from the Giants. I felt like that was no no antenna, but a Lynch pin for their offensive line because the way they want to run the ball, in the way that he kind of compliments that style that is a challenge, no question about it. Um and it's gonna be a good matchup. Well, quickly, here's some sponsored business. Select Cousin Subs locations are now offering delivery.

Whether you're ordering catering or your favorite sub, they're delivering right to you when you order online at Cousin Subs dot com. Cousin Subs we believe in better. Okay, I said we would get to the Pro Football Hall of Fame news. So that is where we are going to turn the Hall of Fame's centennial slate, this special class that is being inducted as part of the NFL's one season. There were several former Packers that were in the finalist stage,

the contenders for um this honor. The only one who has been elected now to the Hall of Fame from that group is defensive back Bobby Dylan, uh LaVey Wegg cecil isbel Verne Llewellyn, and former head coach Mike Holmgren, who were all strong candidates did not make the cut. Unfortunately, we'll get to a little bit of that later. But I know that this special blue Ribbon panel Centennial Committee that the Hall of Fame put together to handle this

process to elect this special class. Ron Wolfe was on it, and I know Ron Wolfe is a very strong advocate for Bobby Dillon. He'd been on record saying that he thought, as far as any former Packers who were deserving of the Hall of Fame, but we're not in that he thought Bobby Dylan had was the biggest oversight. So I'm sure that Ron Wolfe had a big part in Bobby Dylan getting getting in here. And for those who are wondering, well,

who exactly is Bobby Dylon. You might think the Packers all time leader in interceptions as someone like her Batterlee or Charles Woodson, It's Bobby Dylon. He intercepted fifty two passes during his time with the Packers. That is still the franchise all time record, and um unfortunately for him, it's a posthumous honor. But congratulations to to his family and his descendants who will will have something to celebrate this year. It is quite an honor. However it happens

to go into Canton. I am extremely happy for them and I hope they can take some pride in this honor. And obviously he did pass away in August at eighty nine, years old, and our sympathies and condolences go out to them for that. But it is a tremendous honor. And as you said, Ron Wolf has been a huge advocate for him for a number of years. I know there's a number of Packer players that he kind of took a liking to, just with him being the historian of

this game that that he is. Yeah, the thing I love about Bobby Dylan's story is one you have to understand. If Bobby Dylan would have been eight years younger and been there during the Lombardi years, this guy would have been probably a first ballot Hall of Fame. He really would have been. Can you imagine. Can you imagine Bobby Dylan, Herb Adderley, and Willie would all in the same secondary as you say, if it was the era had just shifted maybe a little bit. And this is the other

thing that's great about forties and fifties. I felt like two of the strongest candidates, I'll be honest with you, the gentleman from the twenties. I don't know much about them, but I know a lot about Cecil Hasabell, and I know a lot about Bobby Dylan. And the thing is they both cut their career short. Uh, Dylan, and for the same reason. Football was different in the forties and fifties. Guys wanted to make money. You didn't make money by playing football. If you were married and had a family.

You got to explain that to your wife, why you're doing this when there's more money to be made. And I think, what was it plastics or whatever. Dylan eventually got into and and cecil Isabel ended up quitting after the retiring whatever you wanna call it, after five years and got into to being a head coach. And the thing that's great about Dylan though, is he played for six head coaches in eight years. Those were lean years

for the Green Bay Packers. He had fifty two interceptions in eight seasons, the second most in the NFL at that time. And the guy, the gentleman that was in front of him, you know, played four more years and and everything else. Uh. It was an incredible run that he got on. And the fact that he was blind in one eye, I mean he only had one eye

he lost. Yeah, remarkable physical attributes that he had and how he played the game with that limitation with regards to his vision, Yeah, and still being able to to lead the NFL all those years, have so many All pros, so many Pro Bowlers, And the other thing I love too about it is he's basically the one guy that kind of said no to Vince Lombardi. Lombardi comes in in fifty nine. He basically had already that being dealing, had basically made up his mind he was going to retire.

Lombardi sees this film of him, identifies that this is one of our best players, if not the best player that I'm inheriting here. We gotta find a way to get him to play. And there's just a lot of you know, kind of pulling and stretching him, and you know, there was fines that were like potentially thrown out for him not taking part in training camp, and the guy was just kind of beyond it. Lombardi eventually does convince

him to come. I think there were some injuries that year, the season didn't go entirely core to plan, but he did get the one season with Lombardi, which also resulted in his only winning season as a Green May Packer. Yeah, that's that's certainly true. I know you you've always been a big advocate for Cecil Isabel and unfortunately things didn't go his way. Our team historian Cliff Crystal has written a lot on our website packers dot Com history section if you want to go check some of that out

with regard to Verne Llewellyn. Um because back in back in his day, Llewellyn was an all around player and he was also a punter, and field position was a huge part of the way the game was played back in the day, and and yeah, Llewellen was a huge weapon in that respect. And so I know Cliff Crystal has written a lot about how he feels Verne Llewellen has been overlooked for for too long as far as

the Hall of Fame is concerned. I admit I don't know a lot about Labby Dilweg other than that crazy reporter in Dallas who tried to ask Aaron Rodgers about it. But uh, but that aside the other one. The other one to talk about two is that unfortunately Mike Holmgren

did not make the cut. This uh special centennial slate as they're calling it, with this Hall of Fame class was to include two coaches, and the two who made the cut who got in our Jimmy Johnson and Bill Coward those who were watching the playoff games over the weekend, both of those guys in the studio shows, but on CBS and Fox, they were informed as a surprise, essentially on live television, that they had made the Pro Football

Hall of Fame. So congratulations them in neat moments. I do feel bad for Mike Holmgren though, and I have no problem with Jimmy Johnson and Bill Coward getting in. Jimmy Johnson not only as a coach, but he was also a big part of personnel wise, of building that

Dallas dynasty of the early nineties. The problem, the only problem that I have really it kind of goes back to my same remember the argument we were having about uh when Steve Atwater as a safety has been a finalist and until this year, Leroy Butler had not been a finalist, And it felt like just because of the Super Bowl thirty two result that the Broncos beat the Packers and Atwater has two Super Bowl rings and Butler only has one, that that's been some defining characteristic in

terms of the process. Well, if the Seattle Seahawks wins Super Bowl forty, is Mike Holmgren in and Bill Kawer not And and to me, that's unfortunate. It feels it feels like one It feels like one game is what is making these decisions. And and I just I don't like that. It should be it should be more about the entire body of work. And and uh, I feel I feel bad for Homegren. He led he got to a Super Bowl three times with two different teams. Unfortunately he only won one of them. And I think that's

what's keeping him out of the Hall of Fame. Yeah, and and I want to first off point out congratulations with Jimmy Johnson and Bill Kawer. I personally feel like the NFL, with with the adjustment that the Pro Football Hall of Fame has made without having contributors, I'm starting to become more of an advocate for just having a head coach make it every year. I just feel like they're for as much of people feel like there was a over you know, so many seniors and contributors that

are not being allowed to get in. I feel like there's really a log jam at coaches too. All that being said, I had one shoe in for this. It was Don Corrielle. Yep. I was. I was totally with you, and that's where I was going to go. So well. I thought Corey Yell deserved, has deserved for a long time to get in and unfortunately he's still not. I've I've always said I it's it's a mantra in a maxim that Pete Doherty developed when I was at the Press.

Because that I've always stuck with it. It's have you did you change the game of football? Yeah, Don Coriel, he was a game changer for the game of football. Yeah, and I know you didn't. I know you you didn't watch those core Yell offenses. I'm old enough to have

said some highlights, Yeah, but I used to. I I was actually as a young kid, I was a big fan of those late afternoon Chargers games that you know that that we're out on the West Coast because watching what Dan Fouts was doing with Charlie Joyner and West Chandler and John Jefferson and Kellen Winslow and Chuck Munsey in the backfield. I mean, what those offenses were doing.

Nobody else was doing that at that time. And that's what you say, like, did you change the game, Don Coorey Yell and that that air raid type of you know, before the current air raid. His type of air raid passing attack was revolutionary at the time, and it really did. It did change the game. It made the game a

lot more exciting. And uh, and I think it's unfortunate that he got this far in this process with this centennial slate thing, and then he's still he still is not considering how close he's gotten in just the normal yes, and yeah, because he's had he's had other opportunities, but it has never fallen his way. So so that was my shoe. And I had Jimmy Johnson and Mike Homebrand as the number two. Yeah, I felt like those are the two other ones that were compete. That's where that's

where my mind was as well. Johnson for everything you just said, and Homegrown from the standpoint of you have to understand this organization where it had been, at the moves that he made not only just with this roster in getting the most out of Brett far but his coaching staff and what he had built in Green Bay. And then honestly, going to you talk about Super Bowl thirty two, he goes to Seattle and makes another Super Bowl there if he wins. That's that's what I mean.

Like Super Bowl forty was Homegrown against Cower, and and that was Cowers Super Bowl Championship with the Steelers, and hats off to him. Homegrown doesn't win that one. And yet here we are in this Hall of Fame decision and Cowers in and and I think, honestly, you win thirty two or forty. I think either way, homegrons in there. So this is the problem I think that this Cower situation creates. And again that I congratulate him on this honor,

but it does open sort of the floodgates here. I think there's a lot of resumes that need to be considered, including the coach that came after him now and Mike Tomlin. There's a certain train of thought out there that Mike Tomlin's Hall of Fame candidacy is probably going to be better than what Bill Cowards even was. And I hope

the voters remember at here whenever that that day comes. Yeah, I agree, Sean Payton, Mike McCarthy, there's a lot of coaches now that you're gonna need to really consider here. I think because of the decision to put Bill Coward in. Yeah, I think so, I think, and I think that is something that that's going to be discussed now in the years moving forward, So we will see. But we've gone a little bit over time, so we're going to call

it a wrap on this edition of Packers Unscripted. Be sure to follow all of our coverage of the team, everything going on here on NFC Championship Week on Packers dot com. You can subscribe to us like us on iTunes and other podcast services, and there's all kinds of great video content out there on the Packers YouTube channel. For Wes, I'm Mike. Thanks for tuning in, everybody, See you next time.