#294 Packers Unscripted: Bigger picture

their rookie deals. That leaves at this point only third round pick or In Burke's unsigned, and by the time some people watch this or listen to this, he might be signed as well. Because these things are happening rather quickly, and it's because of the current Collective Arty Agreement post two thousand eleven. This issue with rookie contracts and training camp holdouts and all this kind of stuff really things

of the past. The thing that's so funny, Mike is I started on the Packers beat full time in two thousand and twelve, and I think the greatest gift that was given to me was that c B A and the roughie wage scale. I mean, I have heard so many horror stories from Beat writers about what those days were like when not only are you chasing the contract, but then you'd get to training camp and then eve of training camp and you're not sure if guys are

gonna be holding out or just sitting out. Because throughout the offseason program you can sign a waiver to participate in things. Once you get to training camp, you have to have an actual contract to be out there. Um Now, now, in this current environment, it's not as much of a big deal because of the rookie wage scale really basically slots players where they are in terms of what they're

gonna make. But back in the day, man, it was sort of like the Wild West in terms of what these guys were going to get in every all these agents, all these players were kind of just sitting around waiting to see how things unfolded, so to make sure that their guy got as much as they could potentially command. Yeah, there were agents and players, uh, you know, waiting to see what guys drafted near them would get to. You know, they didn't want to short change themselves. They you know,

so they didn't want to jump into early. Everything ends up getting delayed and then you end up with players these rookies who you know, end up as contract holdouts or training camp holdouts. They get that label when really they want to sign their deal and they want to play it, and it's it's just, you know, the economics

of things were always difficult. I remember Nick Barnett, I think it was the first round draft pick for the Packers in two thousand three, was sitting in his car watching the first training camp practice out his car window because he couldn't be there, He couldn't actually even be on the sideline to watch it without a contract. But he was just waiting really to get that phone call

from his agent. Okay, it's all set. Go sign it, you know, and put your uniform out there and go play so good that that you know those days are are behind us, because it definitely I think anytime rookies missed time and training camp, it hurts them. You don't want them to miss those first couple three four practice even if they're back before the first preseason game, anytime

they miss in camp is valuable. Well, you and I were talking in our pre production meeting about since they did the new CB, if they've had any issues whatsoever with rookie contracts. I can't think of one. I can't think of one either, not not since two thousand eleven, the new C B A, and you go back to the two thousands, I mean Ted Thompson, Andrew Brandt and Russ Ball. I mean some guys are the best in

the business and what they do. They still had Aaron Rodgers sitting out, and I believe also b J Roji guys because their high picks and they want to get what they believe they're worth. But there wasn't really any guiding force whatsoever. So I think that this is one of the most positive things that came out of the most recent collective bart In agreement because it protects veterans. It makes sure that veterans are still not getting short change.

You're getting cut to make room for guys that have never done anything, never played a snap in the NFL before, while also being respectful to what these rookies should be making for really the attention that they're getting and even when you look a guy like Baker Mayfield, the expectations

that get put on him right away. Yeah, And it made sense for the players Union back in eleven to agree to this because they were seeing veteran players as you mentioned, getting cut, their careers not extend perhaps as long as they should because you had number one overall draft picks, for instance, like Sam Bradford and Matthew Stafford in in two thousand in that range, who were getting fifty million dollars of guaranteed money before they even took

a snap in the NFL. Things got out of whack and then C b A, you know, kind of put things back in line a little bit to where the veterans are getting what they should and the rookies are going to have the opportunity down the road. One of the things I think Martin Mayhew and I know he did end up getting let go as the GM of the Lions, but people got to understand how terrible that situation was because they had that O n sixteen seasons, so they had all these early draft picks coming up.

But you know, Matthew Stafford and Dominican sue that put them not only in a hole where they were signing these guys, but then when you're looking at second contract, because nobody's gonna want to play out that first contract can take less. They want to get more they want and you push that cat number four. It was causing a lot of problems. Now you look at the way

it is now. The fact that these deals get done, these rookies get into camps, they could start preparing, they can start preparing for their next face of life outside of football. Um, I think from all every avenue outside of maybe the running back position, where you can make a case that this has been something that's really benefited the whole Yeah, it doesn't put teams in salary cap jail to go a couple of years with a top

ten draft pick, and that's what used to happen. And you go to three years picking in the top ten or top twelve, all of a sudden your cap is blown on all these rookies. Imagine where would be right now, you know if that was how it worked out? Right? Yeah, exactly. With that, we'll go to a break back with more and Packers Unscripted right after this. Welcome back to Packers Unscripted. Mike Spofford in this chair, West Hodko, it's in that one. West.

We don't have a whole lot of other Packers news to disc us, so I want to spend the rest of this show broadening our horizons a little bit. Let's talk a little bit more league wide in general. Here.

There was an interesting question I got in our Insider Inbox column recently, and it was someone asking within the context of the fact that the Los Angeles Rams went from kind of an afterthought to a division champion in a playoff team, and the Jacksonville Jaguars went from three and thirteen to the a f C Championship Game in

one year. Is there one of these turnaround teams on the brink, so to speak, of a big turnaround in you got one in mind, it's Houston Texans, without a doubt, and again I'll add the caveat that if Deshaun Watson is back makes the recovery they need from that a c L surgery. Here's what's funny, Mike. That could have been a disastrous trade for the Texans last year, trading their first rounder for this next year so they could

get up trade up to get to Shaun Watson. I didn't hear one single person anywhere in the country mentioning that narrative, though, because how well Watson played before that a c L. You're willing to give up that number four overall pick to the Cleveland Browns if you saw what you saw the last year from Deshaun Watson. If you've got your franchise guy, you've got no complaints. Yeah,

you're not complaining about it. And I think they're excited about what his future holds, assuming everything turns out okay coming back from the knee injury. The fact that j J. Watt could potential to be back. I think Jadeveon Clowney has made some strides. There's a lot of talent there, and I think they're better than what their record indicated

last year after they lost Watson. So for me, especially looking at that division, considering if you go back, it's sort of been anybody's division, and then get any given year in the fact that two teams actually made it in the playoffs last year because of you know, some of the death concerns from the NFC I have. I see no reason why the Texans couldn't be back in this thing, all right. I I definitely agree with that pick.

I'm gonna throw another one at you though, that maybe a lot of people aren't thinking about, and that's the New York Giants. I say that for a few reasons. One, this is a team that was just in the playoffs. Two years ago. You've got at a quarterback. I know he's on the downside of his career, but you've got a quarterback who's been there, done that one a couple of Super bowls. You've added Sae Kwon Barkley to that offense.

And if there is one issue, I guess I would say two issues with the Giants offensively over the last couple of years. One has been receivers staying healthy. So if those if those receivers stay healthy, Eli Manning is a different quarterback and number two and put him in whatever order you want, maybe this should be number one is pass protection? Well, there might be no better help for pass protection than a running back like Sae Kwon Barkley who's going to make defenses have to stop the run.

That may be the best protection that Eli Manning is going to get. I know they have a new head coach and Pat Shermer. You know the Giants are not defensively certainly what they were in uh in those Super Bowl years. But I'm telling you I'm not blown away by anybody else in the NFC East, aside from obviously the Super Bowl champion Philadelphia Eagles, which is going to make it difficult for uh, the Giants to jump back wherever they were last year into the playoffs or something

like that. But I don't sleep on the Giants. Yeah, and it's a good pick too, Mike, because the Cowboys came back down to Earth last year. They're going through kind of uh, I don't want to call it rebuilding, but definitely trying to retool what they have their Washington now going to see what they can do with Alex Smith. My biggest issue with the Giants um se Kwon Barkley

might be a once in generation player. They drafted Will Hernandez to block for him out of Utah, the former guard for for Aaron Jones that we talked so much about in the pre draft process. I really really really wanted to see them take Sam Donald and instead he goes to the across the you know city team with the New York Jets. Only time will tell us which

one of those moves was correct. Maybe Barkeley becomes the next Adrian Peterson or Barry Sanders and you know, it was a moot point, but I really did think they needed to improve their holdings at quarterback. Now. They also got the kid from Richmond. I forget his name, but they're really high on him. The fourth round pick. Yeah, I'm d a blank for Kyle Lenetta Leonetta. Remember seeing him at the combine. He had a table full of press there because people thought he was gonna be the

next Patriots quarterback. So it's not like didn't find another one. But they've gone the fourth round pick route before and it hasn't pushed Eli Manning at that spot. So yes, you're right, they have a veteran quarterback that's one two super Bowls. I just would have liked to have seen them gotten Donald and start building for the next chapter. We'll see which one ends up being right. Yeah, all right, Well,

we've got some more bigger issues league wide. I want to throw your way, but we'll do that after the breakback with Moron Packers Unscripted. Right after this, Welcome back to Packers Unscripted. Mike Spofford Here, West Hodko, it's over there, okay, West. We spent some time earlier this offseason talking about the coaching changes in the NFC North. The Bears and the Lions both getting new head coaches, but they're a handful

of other new head coaches around the league. I mentioned the Giants, in the last segment, Cardinals, the Colts, the Titans, and the Raiders also have new head coaches. Is there one of those new coaching hires that intrigues you the most? Screwed in of course? And and the Raiders. I always tell this story. Um, it's now three and a half years ago. My old colleague at the green Bay Prescausette and Night, Scott Vincy Uh, we shadowed John Gruden around

Green Bay before Monday night football game. He was given away a donation through his charity, the in the Fired Football Coaches Association to green Bay East and green Bay West. We followed him to this presentation and the entire time we were grilling him about whether or not he was going to come back, and in so many words, he said, no, I like what I'm doing too much. But you always knew it didn't matter what he said or how many times he declined it. You always knew that there was

that outside chance. And seeing how much money, my goodness, you know, has was thrown at him by Mark Davis there, you had to do it. But the reason it's not even just Gruden coming back that intrigues me, it's the moves that they've made since then in some of the changes that they made in in in how they're constructing

their roster and the players that they have. I want to see how all that eventually settles out right, And in some ways I would I would issue a word of caution in a sense to the folks in Oakland because Reggie mackenzie, and I'm I'll admit I'm biased. I really liked Reggie and he was here. I was sad to see him go, but happy for him in a personal sense that he got a chance to become a GM. But he pulled that franchise out of a salary cap

mess of gargantuan proportions. And then you know, with the drafting of the quarterback Derek Carr and some other really good moves, he's gotten them back to contending status in fairly short order. When you look at it in the bigger picture, things that we're hearing out of Oakland, and you and I aren't there every day, but it sounds like John Grew is starting to have a little bit more say over personnel and things and treading into that

GM territory a little bit nicely. Just watch it, watch it a little bit, because Reggie Mackenzie knows what he's doing. He does. And it's funny too because I think if John Gruden had that power when he was in Tampa Bay, the situation is completely different. Aaron Rodgers is probably down Brett Farve is probably down there playing football, former Aaron Rodgers or somebody. But by the times he's talked about that. But that being said, personnel guys are personal guys for

a reason. And I think, you know, one of the reasons the Raiders were so patient with Reggie when he went down there is just because how muddled that situation was terrible, with how short the lifespan is um you know, for for you know, contracts only five years in terms of the pro ration of bonuses. Guys aren't signing twelve year contracts like Major League Baseball. But even then, it still took so long for the Raiders to pull themselves out of that because the year after year they were

making bad deal after bad deal. Mackenzie cleared the slate, they got a twelve and fourth season out of it, looked to be going in the right direction. Took a step back now are trying to reset. I think it's still very important to stay with those principles. Uh that that got them there in the first place, and also got them Derek Carr, you know in Khalil Mack, the

prospects that Mackenzie found. Yeah, Mari Cooper, I mean the fact that he projected Khalil Mack to go from doing what he did at Buffalo and the third or overall pick or whatever it was and making him a star in this league. It says a lot about his scouting acumen. Yeah, no doubt about it. Another of the coaching changes that intrigues me, it's another one in the a f C. And that's what the Tennessee Titans. And I say that

for again a couple of reasons. One, this is a team that not only made the playoffs last year, but one a road playoff game in Kansas City, not an easy place to go and win in the postseason on the road. But yet they decided to part ways with

Mike Mularkey and they've hired Mike rabel Um. I'm always curious to see how the guys, I guess you would call them from the Bill Belichick the Patriots tree, how they're going to fair because you know, Josh McDaniels had you know, didn't work out when he got his first head coaching job in Denver, and then now he passed on another head coaching opportunity obviously this past off season, but then also with the Titans, you mentioned the a f C South, how that division can kind of be

up for grabs the way things go. And then their quarterback Marcus Mariota, very high draft pick, a guy who has definitely improved. You know, is his arrows still pointing up? Have we still not seen the best of Marcus Mariota in the NFL? Or have we? And then maybe getting to the playoffs and winning one game is is they're seiling? How they're currently constructed, I don't know. I just think

they're an intriguing team to keep it up. If if you're the Titans, you better hope that you haven't seen the best out of Marcus Marriott's because last year, honestly, to be quite honest, wasn't very good until the playoffs. Until the playoffs, you played well, But you look at that regular season, uh it is It is impressive that they made the playoffs, but they had a lot of things working against them. The reason I bring that up is because I think they put a lot of this

at Malarkey's feet. They put a lot of it at Dick Lebo's feet. Um. But at the end of the day, it's a quarterback driven league and they have put talent around him. Now, how does that talent further develop and grow? They made some acquisitions this offseason. Me personally, and this is just me, I would have dedicated myself to Derrick Henry, but you know, they made some other changes there. They don't want him to be the soul back, but there is a lot of talent there. Um. They're looking for

consistency now and that starts at Mariotta. Yeah. All right, with that, we're gonna go to another break back with more on Packers Unscripted right after this. Welcome back to Packers Unscripted Mike Spofford alongside Wes Hodku. It's okay, West. One more topic I want to throw at you here as we wrap up the show for today. I found

something interesting the other day. Was just doing a little quick research something I was working on for Insider Inbox, and I noticed, you look at the last four years in the NFL fell the m v pen Tom Brady, Matt Ryan, Cam Newton, Aaron Rodgers, turns out those are the only four active quarterbacks in the NFL who have won an m VP award. Obviously, Brady has won multiple,

Rogers has one multiple. So it leads me to this question, who do you think is the next quarterback currently active who is going to win an m v P. You can go a couple of different directions with this, because you have the old guard, Drew Brees, Ben Roethlisberger, those guys who have not won an m v P yet, and you have a slew of young up and coming quarterbacks that nobody knows just yet how good they're going

to be. Who do you think. I'm want to just say, it's incredible to me when you pointed this out that Drew Brees hasn't won an m v P. When you think about it, it makes sense. Yeah, But considering the way that that offense is structured, him throwing for five thousand yards as many times as he has, it actually is surprising. But I get it. There were seven and for like three or four straight seasons there was some

rebuilding that had to be done there. Fine for me, though, I still think Ben Roethlisberger has one in him, even though there's been sort of this hovering, floating theory that you know he might be getting near the end, we might want to retire soon. Roethlisberger has the capability. I

still think. I know that Aaron Rodgers is more athletically gifted than Roethlisberger, but Roethlisberger is the closest thing I've seen in this league to encompassing what Aaron Rodgers does UM, and probably is even more untacklable if you want to use that. He might be one of the hardest quarterbacks to sack, and just in terms of physically getting him on the ground, But it just seems like he has that ability to to extend plays one way or another.

Not maybe with his feet as much as Rogers, but he just he has that X factor that he always keeps you in ahead on things. I've I've been a huge fan of his ability on the football field since he came out and replaced Tommy Maddox. I believe in two thousand five whenever that was UM. But I think I think Roethlisberger, one way or another, UM, I think

he still has a Yeah. I've had a hard time with this question because I still can't decide which direction I want to go there's a part of me that says Drew Brees has got an m v P and him the way they have retooled some things on that Saints defense, we saw how close they were. They were a fluke play essentially away from playing for the NFC Championship in Philadelphia last year. When with what happened in Minneapolis on the last play of the game, I think

Breeze potentially has an m v P in him. But then the other guy that I think is definitely headed for an m v P sooner rather than later might be Carson Wentz in Philadelphia because before he got hurt last year, when I did get a chance to watch the Eagles, I was really impressed with how difficult he was to sack his escapability and not only just to keep plays alive, but then also to run and rush for yardage. His a c L was not because of getting sacked in the pocket. He was diving for the

goal line for a touchdown on on a scramble. And he's still awfully young. I don't know if the a c L surgery is going to change the way he plays. My guess is that it won't, and I think that's the guy who's got an m v P in his future. I've always looked at this as stages like the Quarterback Club, right with Farv and Young and Aikman and and then you always have these generations where these guys are the top quarterbacks in the league. I thought, for a while, Okay,

after Roethlisberger and Rodgers, who's the next guy? Um? And there's guys that are very good Pro Bowl All Pro type players, but who's going to be the guy that really drives the league? I think Wentz has that ability. I think he's the best quarterback prospect that's been taken arguably since Cam Newton in two thousand eleven. Different types of players, but in terms of what they offered and

bring to the table. Uh, he was exceptional. He was exceptional as rookie season to step in there, going from FCS football, improving everybody wrong that he his skills could translate a guy like Josh Allen getting picked out of a smaller school like Wyoming. I think that's a product of what Carson Wentz did a few years ago. UM. I also think, to be honest with you, Mike, I think Nick Foles is going to be a starting quarterback in this league too. I think he's finally at that point.

I think he's matured enough that after this season, if Wentz can come back from the knee, that Fools is going to find a home. But that one to punch together. What Whence did to set them up last year and how Fulls finished it. That's that's a big driving force for why the Eagles were able to win that Super Bowl last season. Yeah, just to go one other quick thing.

Out of those five quarterbacks taken in the first round this year, including Lamar Jackson taken at the end of the first round, who do you think big picture is going to have the best career out of those five. I still love Lamar Jackson. I've loved him since the beginning. I think the guy can play quarterback. I think he's

going to be dynamic. I think the safe money in my opinions on Sam Donald just because of his makeup and and exactly what he offers as in terms of the physical prototypical quarterback that you look for in terms of size. I'll throw my lot in with John Dorsey, Elliott Wolf, and Alonso high Smith and go with Baker Mayfield. But who knows. I guess that's something to watch for years to come. With that, we will sign off on

this edition of Packers Unscripted. Be sure to follow all of our coverage of the team on Packers dot com on Twitter. You can still find him at west hot I'm at Mike Spofford at Packers for the team account. Thanks for tuning, and everybody, We'll see you next time. Hmm.