#266 Packers Unscripted: Last chance

Hall of Fame. Those decisions on the Hall of Fame class are made the night before the Super Bowl. They'll be announced on the NFL Honors Show on Saturday evening. The inductions then would take place the following summer. Jerry Kramer, for the eleventh time, is a finalist for the Hall of Fame, the second time as a Senior Committee nominee. And I know you and I share the same opinion on this. It's got to happen now. Well, and here's the It absolutely has to happen now. I mean, this

is it. Um. Jerry just turned eighty two years old last week, I believe so, uh, this is his final crack, probably um. And here's the thing about this, this argument, because I've heard it for a number of years, as long as I've been covering the Packers, it's really hit fever pitch and I don't know what it was like the last time he was up as a senior finalist and the conversation, what the narrative it was like. But here's my argument. I laid it out an Insider inbox

on Thursday. Jerry Kramer stopped playing football fifty years ago, be retired. This is still a topic. This is still something from when he was thirty two years old, when he was eighty two years old, that remains in the public domain. I don't want to get into the minds of Hall of Fame voters or why we're at the point that we are, But if popular opinion, if overwhelming public sentiment has us to this point, why is this

still a debate? It's an honest question because it's it's like, are we doing what is right for the game of football? And I think there's a lot of Pro Football Hall of Fame voters, and I know several of them that feel like everything up to this point has done that. But it just seems to me that if this is still a topic in two thousand, eighteen, fifty years after

he retired. Something in the program didn't work. And I think that's why, as I said this Saturday night, the Pro Football Hall of Fame voters have a chance to write one of the game's biggest wrongs. Yeah, and I simplify this in a different way, because you're talking about that fifty years have gone by a perfectly and I like the way you phrase that, a perfectly valid way

to think about it. I go back to the very beginning in the way I simplify this, and that you can talk about all the all the noise, and all the reasons and all the comparisons and this and that. But back in the beginning, essentially nineteen sixty nine, Jerry Kramer was one of fifteen players fifteen players in the league voted by the Hall of Fame voters onto the NFL's fiftieth anniversary team. One of fifteen players. Fourteen of those fifteen are in the Hall of Fame. Jerry Kramer

is the only one who is not. And if you want to compare the number of all pros, and there's the talk about, oh, there's too many Lombardi Packers in the Hall of Fame. I mean, I just I'm sorry. I toss all of it out, because if the guy was voted to the NFL's fiftieth anniversary team, why is he not in the Hall of Fame. It just to me, it absolutely doesn't make sense if he was good enough

from that the same type of voters. And I realized that people on the committee change over the years, but if the same essentially the same voting body voted into that fiftieth anniversary team, how can you know all these these ten times as a finalist later he not get the votes to get in. I don't understand it. And I think you bring up a good point, Mike, because

it is the way that I view this thing. I honestly, in two thousand and eighteen, I don't view this as a referendum on Jerry Kramer, as strange as it sounds, because he's the one that's up to be a candidate and inducting in the ProFootball of Fame. I honestly, and I'll say this to all my friends that are on that voting panel, I honestly think this is a referendum

on the Pro Football Hall of Fame. Itself, because I think for too long the conversation about has been about why Jerry Kramer doesn't deserve to get in, rather than why are we standing in the way of it? And I think a part of it is that not enough people have gone to bat for him over the years. And I commend his daughter, Alicia, I commend his family for continuing to push his cause because you know how

Kramer is. For as much as you know the Instant replaybook and things like that, people at times criticized him for his outspokenness on certain different avenues. He's really not a big self promoter in regards the pro football fame. You talk to him earlier this year, he doesn't want to talk about absolutes and I need I deserve to be in. It's always been about I'm gonna be happy at the end of the day if it happens. It happens, if it doesn't, it's not going to change the way

I live. And I'll be honest with you, Mike, I just feel like after this amount of time that if we're still talking about this western Hockwitz, who wasn't born in n Let six is in this conversation, it should have ended a long time ago. Yeah, And I commend Jerry Kramer frankly for the way he's handled this over the years because I've I've had multiple conversations with him about it, um for interviews on packers dot Com and whatnot.

And his his answer up until this latest opportunity now to be a finalist again, his answer has always been, the NFL has been so good to me and given me so much in my life, because it hasn't given me this one thing. I'm not going to let that ruin everything. I'm not going to let that, you know, affect me on a daily basis as as as as he goes about it. And as you said, now it's been fifty years since he's been retired, it's been twenty years since he was last a finalist in via the

Seniors Committee. Um, you know, I would I I personally for him, would hate to see him go through this again and not get it. I mean, it would almost be better if he's not going to get it. It It would almost be better if he had never come up as a finalist again. In becomes the last chapter. So I'm really hoping on a personal level for Jerry Kramer. Referendum on the Pro Football Hall of Fame and all that aside, which I agree with. For Jerry on a

personal level, he's got to get it. There's a human being involved with this at the end of the day. And I want to point out two more things here because I know we're gonna have to get to a break Pro Football of Fame is about guys who changed the game, right, Yeah, that's that's who is supposed to be included in this illustrious group. You can talk about the sweep, you can talk about the fact he was

a place kicker. I mean, there's so many different things that you can mention in terms of what his credentials are. That the team that you mentioned, the Pro Bowls, the All pre Os. The other thing I go back to two is that he is one of the greatest ambassadors

of Green Bay Packers football. Whether it was in the sixties or whether it's been in the two thousand's, he is the face along with bart Starting a number of other people, but he is one of the faces of that generation of Packers and I just think that has to come for something. Yeah, I think so too. With that, we do have to go to a break back with

more and Packers unscripted. Right after this Welcome Back to Packers unscripted, Mike Spofford alongside West, hod Kowitz and West, continuing our discussion of the upcoming Hall of Fame announcement. To put Jerry Kramer's case aside for a minute. You've got fifteen finalists for a maximum of five spots in what they call the Modern Era class for the Hall of Fame. Kramer is a Senior Committee nominee. His case

is considered separately, just so people understand. When you look at this group of fifteen finalists, maximum of five can be chosen to be inducted. To me, this looks like a tough class to crack. In the sense of what I mean by that is, Brian er, Lacker, Ray Lewis, and Randy Moss are all eligible for the first time to get into the Hall of Fame. I think all three of them are Hall of Famers and have a

very good chance of getting in. And then you add Terrell Owens, who came like one or two votes away last year from getting in. That right, there might be four of the five in this class. Now, there are some voters who don't necessarily always fully support guys the first time they come up, they like to consider some of the other guys who have been on the list longer because they know that those guys who are newly eligible basically have twenty five years potentially a twenty five

year window to get in. But that being said, those those guys who are finalists and who are eligible for the first time, those three plus Terrell Owens, that might be of this Hall of Fame Modern era class, Yeah, it very well might be. I mean, I look at in my mind, I don't know how you can have a Pro Football Hall of Fame class this year that definitely doesn't have Ray Lewis and Brian or Lacker, and

I just think those guys completely changed the game. Randy Mossa had just a phenomenal career, and then obviously that resurgence with the New England Patriots that I kind of like in a little bit to what Charles Woodson had with the Packers, where he probably had the credentials to begin with, but that just puts it over the top.

The twenty three touchdowns that one season. I know it it ended kind of quietly in two thousand and ten and two thousand twelve, but I'm guessing if he didn't actually end up coming back with the forty, he'd probably be in the Hall of Fame already. Owens is such a unique case just because of the ups and downs of his career and certainly trying to figure out, you know, the balance between his physical athleticism and some of the

controversy that followed him. Uh. I basically, I'm putting it down to this, I'm very curious outside of those top three new candidates, who I think are all first ballot Hall famers, who potentially fills out the rest of that class some really good offensive linemen that deserves consideration. I think several of them will eventually get in. Um. I mean just it's all over the board right now in

terms of what they're going to be looking for. I know so many times when I talk to these guys, they mentioned how they wish it we were voting for ten guys. You know that that what you have to limit it to is so exclusive that it really makes those decisions heart wrenching. Yeah. I think one of the one of the cases to follow that's very interesting. I was reading a little bit about is a former Dallas

Cowboys cornerback Everson Wats. He's a finalist. And what makes his case really interesting is he's at the end, I believe, of the twenty five year win or the twenty five years since he retired. This is his last chance to get in through the modern era process without having to to go the senior route later on. And there's you know,

him getting to the finalist stage. Now at this point, there's been you know, an uptick in the interest in revisiting his career and what he did for was Tom Landry Cowboys teams and what he did with, you know, on a defense that also had some some other Hall of Fame players like Randy White and Too Tall Jones and and guys like that. I just I think his I think his case is interesting. I remember watching him play for the Cowboys on television as a kid. I

don't know, you know, I mean back then. I'm not looking at these games thinking about who's going to be in the Hall of Fame, but he was definitely an upper echelon cornerback and uh. And I'll just be very curious to see what happens with his case because this is sort of his his last chance by the regular route. Yeah, And I think the one thing that's really interesting to Mike the last few years, it seems like the narrative and sort of the argument for defensive backs has changed

a little bit. Yeah, when you look at not only I mean, safeties are a position where have really been difficult to gain traction. But to some extent, if you're not Dion Sanders, it's been really tough to get the cornerbacks in there as well at times, just because you know, being able to judge who really was the true, uh you know, elite of of those generations. And I'll be honest with you, I don't know a whole lot abouts, but I do know those defenses he played on in

Dallas and then obviously the New York Giants. Um, there's some talent, some really talented players around him. UM, so it will be interesting. This is I think probably the most difficult thing for a lot of these these voters is that it really you can have that twenty five year window, as you said, where it's like, okay, well the first time, and he'll have another chance next year. But when you get to the end of that, um,

you really have a decision to make again. He can go into Kevin mill lies up, I mean, ty Law is up. Edgar and James Joe Jacobe from the Washington teams over the years. I think another guy to watch too that I'll throw in is is Tony Boselli and say that because his career was cut short by injuries, he was considered the premier left tackle in the game during his time. The fact that that Terrell Davis got

in with the shorten it opens another door. Now. I still think Terrell Davis getting in a lot of that had to do with his postseason domin on top of what he did in a in a shortened career in the regular season, but the fact that he got in it changes the perception on a guy like Basselli who was at the top of his game and at the top of the league but then didn't play as long as other guys like a Sterling Sharp people for that matter as well. Yeah, I mean the fact that he

only had really six seasons. He wasn't expansion picked then by the Texans, Don Papers Texans. The hope was he'd be able to, you know, put everything behind him and keep playing. He didn't. Um, So it'll be very interesting to see this year and if it happens, you know, proceeding on the next year's how people view his career. Yeah, well, we gotta get to another breakback with more on Packers

Unscripted right after this. Welcome back to Packers Unscripted. Mike Spofford in this chair, Wes Hodkowits in that one, and West. Since it is Super Bowl weekend upon us here, we should probably talk about the Super Bowl has been a lot of time. I'm talking about the Hall of Fame stuff, which I think is interesting debate. But Eagles against the Patriots.

The overarching storyline here I think is really interesting in the fact that you have Tom Brady and Bill Belichick going for their sixth Super Bowl together against a team that is searching for its first Super Bowl championship in the Philadelphia Eagles, a team that has not won an NFL title since the pre Super Bowl era, that being nineteen sixty. They beat Vince Lombardi's Packers at Franklin Field.

That turned out to be the only postseason loss of Vince Lombardi's coaching career, by the way, but six the last time the Eagles want a title. They're trying to break that drought, and uh and the Patriots trying to simply add to an impressive legacy for me, Mike, this is one of the most intriguing Super Bowls I think in recent memory. And the reason I say that is because you have two imperfect teams vying for what I think a lot of people refer to as perfection in

terms of winning the Super Bowl. And I say that because you look at this this Patriots team and how they've had to sort of pull it together on defense a little bit. I think they finished the regular season like twenty seven and total defense, but you know the way that they've kind of made the pieces fit in the playoffs, and you know, you bring in James Harrison, he's playing significant snaps after not being on the roster

a month ago. Kyle van Noy, who was sort of a discarded seen as a bus player coming out of Detroit, he ends up being there starting outside backer. Uh. And then you look at Philadelphia. They lose Carson Wentz, they have to turn to a backup the running backs. They've had a carousel there throughout the course of the year, lost their starting left tack, lost their starting left tackle. Um, all those things together, you still have to pull it. Oh, you have to be able to find a way. And

I think both of these teams have done it. To me. I think you look at the Atlanta Falcons from a year ago, you look at a lot of these teams. It's not a guarantee you get back, so when you're there, you have to make the most of it. I think both of these teams. Whoever comes out on top ultimately is the team from this particular season. Yeah. From a chess match standpoint, what intrigues me about this game is the fact that we saw in the NFC Championship game

the Eagles change the narrative. They changed the storyline with what Nick Foles and that offense was able to do against the Minnesota Vikings, the number one defense in the league, that game plan with Doug Peterson, Frank Reich, that coaching staff, what they put together, and the way it was executed by those players to explode for that many points against

the top defense in the NFL. On the other side, the customary procedure, I guess you'd say for a Bill Belichick defense, when he's got two weeks to prepare and he's been in these super bowls before, is they come out with defensive looks that have not been on film that the other team cannot be prepared for they haven't seen it before, and that offense has to be able to adjust on the fly to what the Patriots are doing, because they're going to dig deeper in their playbook and

find some things that haven't been used, and they're going to try to surprise the opponent with it and see how they react. From a chess match standpoint, that makes this really interesting. It does. It's a very compelling matchup. I still think, in my opinion, though, that the Patriots are the team with the most amount of pressure on them because, as the Eagles up said, I mean, they're the underdogs. They're gonna ride that all the way through.

Even though they've been a number one seed in THEFC, they've been an underdog every single week. The reason why I see the pressures on the Patriots is because Nick Foles in that Philadelphia offense that was not supposed to do anything against that number one ranked defense in the NFL. They surprised a lot of people. They opened up a lot of eyes, and as you were seeing in our pre production meeting, Doug Peterson, Frank right that the game

plan that they put together for that contest remarkable. Now, the question is can Doug Peterson, the lifelong backup, the former high school football coach. Can they do it again against one of the game's very best it, I think to me, I'm going to be glued to the television

for all four hours however long that thing goes. Yeah, And Doug Peterson, the former backup quarterback in Green Bay, he's got Brett Farve coming to get us to the Philadelphia Eagles in their final team meeting on Saturday night. You know, maybe those little inspirational things, you never know how those can go. Yeah, and hopefully that that pre whatever meeting actually wraps up at the time kickoff starts

on Sunday. Who knows how long far we'll talk. Right with that, Let's take care of a little sponsored business. Today is a perfect day to fill up with some new Campbell's Chunky Max Soup. Chunky Max is loaded with more meat than you can handle, a lot more. We're talking more than a comparable Chunky soup. So go on fill up with new Campbell's Chunky Max Soup. Campbell's Chunky Soup, the official sup partner the Green Bay Packers back with more on Packers Unscripted right after this welcome back to

Packers unscripted Mike Spofford. Here, West, Hodko, It's over there, okay West? Quickly before we go Super Bowl fifty two Patriots against the Eagles, I want to know who you think an X factor in this game is going to be, and then I want your prediction on what you think is gonna happen. I think the X factor is gonna be Rick Lovado, the former Packers long snapper that was serving sandwiches two years ago and now the New Jersey sub shop. Yeah, he's gonna be snapping in the super Bowl.

And no credit toil Rick. I really liked him during his time. A good dude. I wish him well. But to me, I think the biggest X factor honestly is going to be Nick Foles. And if Foles can can really I don't want to say chop up, but I mean he just did everything so darn effectively against Minnesota. There were no holes in his game. In that game he put that he made the plays that were there down field, and he was smart with the football. You have to do that against the New England Patriots, I

think you saw the downfall. Even when Blake Bortles played a perfect game for fifty five minutes. When it came down to crunch time, the Patriots defense, they had the right calls. Bortles wasn't able to make enough plays. That was the difference. I think if if Foles is able to protect the football, I think that the Philadelphia Eagles are going to get their first Super Bowl victory because I see even with as you mentioned, all the changes that the Patriots are gonna make it, I'm fully with you,

they're gonna show a lot of unscarted luck. I still think this is a They played the best defense in the league last week, and if he did that to them, if you could find a way to replicate that again in these two weeks that they have to prepare for it, I think the Philadelphia Eagles call it on top. Yeah.

For me, the X factor is also with the Eagles, and I'm going with running back j A Gi if I'm saying correctly, because when you talk about protecting Nick Foles protecting the football, I think I think A Gi and this running game of the Eagles is what is going to be Nick Fole's best friend and his and his potential protection against Matt Patricia's blitz is and whatever

that New England defensive coordinator is gonna throw Adam. As far as a prediction, I'll say this, I think when the Patriots are in the Super Bowl, it's extremely hard to predict what's going to happen because if you look at the if you look at Tom Brady's career in the Super Bowl, He's lost two Super Bowls, the David Tyree helmet catch and the Mario Manningham diving sideline bomb catch,

and he's won two Super Bowls. When the Seattle Seahawks decided to throw the ball from the one yard line instead of run up with Marshawn Lynch and then last year coming back from to three and the Julian Adelman bounce all over the place, you know, catch in the middle of the field. That was such a huge part of that comeback. So prediction wise, I tell you, you know, anything can happen. The Super Bowls with the Patriots have shown us that. But I'm with you. I think the

Eagles pull this thing out. Yeah, And I'd like to see if their backfield, as you mentioned, can outduel the backfield of the Patriots. I think there's a ten or eleven running backs playing in this game. They both have stacked really use a lot of different looks. If Jay and you know, Corey Clement, all those guys can pull it together, I think they're gonna come up with a victory. All right. With that, we will call it a rap

on this edition of Packers Unscripted. Be sure to follow all of our coverage of the team on Packers dot com on Twitter. He's at west Hot, I'm at Mike Spofford at Packers for the m account. Thanks for tuning in, everybody. We'll see you next time. M hmm.