#253 Packers Unscripted: Defensive dialogue

the Packers defense will take in. So it's a good time to maybe look back on some things that happened defensively in and uh and try to pinpoint exactly maybe what what to look forward to in the coming year. When you look at this Packers defense statistically twenty second yards allowed, six points allowed, is there one thing that jumps out at you as the biggest hole or downfall or for lack of a better term, well, the thing that looks And I don't want to just point to injuries,

because you know it's it's more than that. It's not just injuries. But I thought it was such a great point that was made during the final stretch of the season, the Packers Week sixteen taking on the Minnesota Vikings, and when you pull up there the game packet and you see the starting lineup for their starting eleven on defense, it's almost a mirror of what it was in Week one of the season. The Vikings were just ridiculously healthy on defense and that allowed that defensive gel and become

the top rank unit in the NFL. Packers are almost the exact opposite of that. When you look, especially in the secondary, how much different they looked. Um, the edge rushers and the Perry going down late in the season, it was tough for the Packers to get that unit together to gel, to have some some continuity and consistency

chemistry with those defenders. So Um, looking ahead, I think you look back, Mike, You look at some these best defenses the Packers have had during Mike McCarthy's tenure here has head coach. They've had units that have had playmakers, And I think when you look at the way that the Packers are going in down to two thousand eighteen, there's bound to be changes, no question about that, But they have a lot of the same core coming back.

Your your Mike Daniels, you have Blake Martinez stepping up, Kenny Clark, Kevin King will be coming back hopefully stronger after having that solder surgery. Ha ha Clinton Dix is under contract for another season. There is the potential, I think, to to see those guys really break out and looking for them to make those jumps going forward. The biggest thing is going to come back to, though, is being able to gel as a unit and also to some extent, being able to stay healthy. Yeah, I think. I do

think health is a big part of it. But aside from that issue, when I take a look at it, you look at top defenses around the league. It's really difficult in the NFL to have a defense that say, is going to rank in the top half of the league if you don't have a true number one boundary cornerback. And the bottom line is the Packers haven't had one for the last two years since Sam Shields went down with that concussion in Week one in Jacksonville. Of the

Packers haven't had one. Now. They tried to address it in the draft. They drafted Kevin King with their first overall pick, but then you know, healthwise, he was in and out. He ends up getting shut down with the

shoulder problem. As you said, hopefully he comes back healthy and he continues that push to be a number one boundary corner We saw Damarius Randall obviously take a big step forward in the second half of although I think his best position is still in the slot, He's not necessarily that number one guy on the boundary that that I think is the one that you know that makes quarterbacks shy away, you know, because that guy on the boundaries is trying to take away that number one receiver

for the other team. The Packers have had this hole for a couple of years, and it reminds me it's not exactly the same situation, but it reminds me of what happened at the safety position when they lost Nick Collins back in two thousand eleven. It took too long to recover from that as as a unit to recover from losing such a key piece, And as I said, I think the Packers addressed it much sooner this time, but it didn't work out because Kevin King was not

able to stay healthy. He was he was their top pick. But I think that's that's the thing that's got to happen for this defense as a as a as a starting point to get back to being a playoff caliber unit. And there is no ready made solution to making up for the loss of a Nick Collins or Sam Shields

to some extent. Yeah, there's not exactly a playbook as to how you go about it, because you can have guys who are already on the roster step up, which is you know, eventually what happened with the Packers at safety when you had Morgan Burnett become the player he did you draft ha ha Clinton Dicks. They became deep at that position in a number of years afterwards, after they had the failed experiment in two thousand thirteen and in trying to move over to Charles Woodson in two

thousand twelve. I look at the cornerback situation in very similar light now with where they're at because a guy like Sam Shields, why he was so valuable is because he was a great press man corner, but he also had tremendous speed in recovery speed and he did get beat. Uh, those are things you can't just teach. And to be quite honest with you, Mike, the Packers could go out

in the free agent market. They could sign the number one cornerback who's going to be out there right now, which at this time I'm not even sure, and that's still not a guarantee. You saw even like with Gilmore this year with the Patriots, that was kind of a tough transition for him going to that defense as well, and he was one of the most coveted free agents last year. So I think the Packers have done a

nice job of building up their depth at cornerback. They have to keep that position healthy, though into the original point, they probably need to add another piece to that spot this year, whether it is the draft, whether it is free agency. I think the one thing these past two years have taught us since Sam Shields had that ultimately would end up being a career ending injury with that glass concussion, is they need to there's really no shortage

of cornerbacks. You need as many as you can get. Yeah, absolutely, you can never have enough of them the way things usually go. But with that, we're going to toss to a rank back with more and Packers Unscripted right after this,

Welcome back to Packers Unscripted. Mike Spofford in this chair, Wes Hodkowitz in that one in West, continuing our discussion with regards to the defensive issues in that the Packers obviously will look to shore up in There was certainly some struggles with the pass rush, and yeah, there were some good sack numbers, Clay Matthews eight and a half leading the team overall, it wasn't it wasn't about the number of sacks though necessarily. It was about the I

think anyway, the consistency of getting after the quarterback. There were too many times where there were long stretches in games. At least from the way I observed it that quarterbacks got too comfortable because the pass rush was so inconsistent. There wasn't enough consistent pressure to just keep that guy on his toes maybe a little bit more. And I

think that's something the Packers have to address. Yeah, and I think, you know, the Packers did their best going into this season to try to fill out that position as well as they could. They made the decision to bring in a Moad Brooks once the season started after he got cut loose from San Francisco, and you know he he had his issues there too, trying to work through the back injury, having the concussion right off the bat. Wasn't really able to be that number three guy. I

think they were really hoping for this season. But you look at a guy like Nick Perry, and I remember talking with Perry in this very studio after he signed that contract going back to March, and there was nobody who wanted to perform more. There was nobody who wanted to stay on the field more than Nick Perry in two thousand seventeen. But as he kind of admitted afterwards in the final locker room session on Tuesday, do you get banged up in this league? And it happened again

to him this year. He had the broken hand earlier in the season, had to get surgery, missed a game, played with the club for or five games, comes back, ends up having the shoulder, plays the end of the season on a foot injury, finally gets put on injured reserve. Finished the year with seven sacks, But I know, if you talk to him, wasn't happy with the consistency side of it. And you're right, it's one thing to get home. It's one thing to get those sacks. It's another thing

to have that consistent pressure. It's kind of an immeasurable stat that's out there. And even though the Packers were seventeenth in the league in sacks, I think there was still something left to be desired at that point in time. Um even looking specifically at Matthews. I mean, I thought for all intensive purposes, I thought Clay Matthews had a fine season and he excelled in a lot of areas that didn't necessarily have direct high ins with the pass rush.

But that's the thing is that they're still really looking for that consistent down in, down out pressure and it's something they're going to continue trying to find now going into the next season. Yeah, and consistent down in, down out pressure comes with a deep rotation. And you mentioned, you know, things didn't work out with the mob Brooks.

They did bring him in to really be the number three guy, to be the guy who could spell either Matthews or Perry on either side, or if you want to move Clay Matthews to the middle on a third down situation, for instance, then you have a mod Brooks on the outside. That didn't work. The Packers didn't really have the depth there to be as effective as they

needed to be. That's just the bottom line. The other issue that I think when I look back statistically at what was going on with this Packers defense was was what happened in the red zone. Packers end up thirty feet in the league and touchdown percentage and actually allowed either a touchdown or a field goal on one pcent of red zone possessions by the opponent. That's just that's

just ugly, there's no two ways about it. And when we've seen over the years West, even when the Packers have had their struggles on defense, you'd see Green Bay defenses get stops in the red zone, maybe get a turnover in the red zone. That takes some points off the board for the other team. You can give up four hundred yards in a game, but if you only allow say one touchdown in four red zone possessions and there's three field goals in there, that, uh, that's still

a win formula. You can win games with Aaron Rodgers at quarterback playing defense like that. The Packers didn't play defense like that. The touchdown percentage was way too high. They didn't get any turnovers, fourth down stops, missed field goals, blocked field goals, nothing like that happened in the red zone. And it just adds up to season long struggles. Yeah, and that's one of the things too. I mean, you look at the defenses that did excel this year, the

Minnesota's we're pretty stout in that area. When you're working

with the short field. One of the things I think people sometimes don't always quite understand is when you as much as you don't want to give up yards, it's a lot more difficult to defend the field when you're at than when you're at your and you know, you have to sometimes use that to your advantage with the zone defensive calls and in those type of things, and you know, defensive backs understanding there's going to be more opportunities for you to make a play because you're dealing

with this, you know, yards that you have to defend. Um. That was probably the most disappointing I think part of this for the Packers this season is that, and Blake Martinez said it to during the final locker room. Defense was often running, they were clicking like they wanted to.

In the first month of the season, I think they were six in total defense, fifth maybe in passing defense, But it just seemed once they got into October and then's more specifically, once Rodgers was out of the equation, something that's just changed a little bit there that they weren't able to maybe find those stops in the red zone that they had found in the past to keep you know, seven off the board and just keep it to three or even get the ball taken away. Um,

that really is how far this thing goes. I mean, a lot is made out of total defense. A lot is made out of total yards. It's an important stat to some extent, but that's scoring. Defense is just such a big thing because as you and I both know, you look back at that Chargers game two years ago, the Packers gave up i think five total passing yards to Philip Rivers. They won that game though with a defensive play at the end because the offense did what

he needed to do in the Packers defended that end zone. Yeah, and that that the scoring still stayed in the low twenties because you got some red zone stops and you're able to win a ballgame like that. But with that, we'll toss to another breakback with more on Packers Unscripted right after this. Welcome back to Packers Unscripted. Mike Spofford right here, West, hod Kowitz, all the way over there, West.

We're continuing to talk here about the Green Bay Packers defense in and maybe trying to look ahead a little bit to as far as what direction things will go. One veteran player in particular, that we can't say for sure whether he will be back or not, and he's kind of an uncharted territory personally as far as where he is in his own career. I'm talking about safety

Morgan Burnett. He is a pending free agent and he's actually never really been in this position before because when he got his second contract, it was an extension, you know, while he was still I believe, had one year left on his rookie deal from when he was drafted as a third round pick in so um, kind of a whole new situation from Morgan, a veteran leader, a respected leader in that locker room, and on this defense, I know he wasn't as healthy as he would have liked

to have been. In just your thoughts on maybe where this goes for number forty two, Well, here's the thing about Morgan Burnett that you have to understand it, and people were asking him about this in the final locker room as well. Morgan Burnett could very well potentially be in a better spot going into free agency right now if you'd have just played safety, if you'd have just did what his job description says, if you read his little box score in NFL dot Com. It's his strong safety.

He might have been very well better off, but the Packers needed him for more than that. They needed him to play hybrid linebacker inside linebacker in the Nitro Nickel package the last month of the season. They need him to play star slot cornerback. Um he played boundary cornerback at one point in this season due to injuries and in different things of that nature. Morgan Burnett never never complained about it, and something. He's a two time playoff captain.

He's one of the most revered men in that locker room amongst his teammates. And I asked him about that, like why exactly he thinks that is. And he's a humble guy. He's not going to be giving, you know, he's not gonna be everyone to give himself a pat on the back. But he said, you know, it probably comes from his late father, cap and the way that he was raised in terms of just doing what has asked of you, you know, coming to work, giving an honest day's labor for an honest day's pay, and just

being a good, accountable human being. And I think that's one thing is you look at his years here from two thousand ten all the way until now. Um, that's he's been so incredibly consistent. No, it never gets too high, it never gets too low. And you look at the guys that have comes through that locker room, Mike the Micah Hides, the ha ha, Clinton Dix is of the world,

even Charles Woodson. I mean, so many people talk so glowingly about Burnett because he's just always been a guy that has been there, has been a shoulder for people when they've needed him, and he's willing to bring people up. He's just a really solid human being. Now, as you said, from the contract perspective, the Packers Morgan Burnetton to figure that out because for the first time in his career there isn't anything on the docket for next season. Yeah,

he is going towards free agency at this point in time. Yeah, And you mentioned how humble he is. And I've obviously known Morgan since he was drafted in the third round, and I say this in a very complimentary way. He's humble to a fault. He never takes credit for anything. Um, even the great plays that he does make. He's always more willing to talk about any everything. Being a team effort with the defense and with all the different positions he played that you mentioned. That's the type of team

player he is. That's that's the way there wouldn't you know, No, absolutely, and they would. They would have groused about it. They would have found a reporter in the media. They would have gone to somebody in the media to get to get their anger or their frustration over the situation out there. That's not that's not Morgan. I would certainly, And this

is just strictly from a personal sense. I don't know what the front office is going to think in terms of whether or to bring more Morgan Burnett back, But if he doesn't come back, I'll miss him just as a person as well as as well as somebody to talk to about the defense and and learn something about what's going on out there. Yeah. I learned a lot about the game from Morgan Burnette. And at the time which we're taping this, Mike McCarthy hasn't had his season

any news conference. I don't know if he'll be asked about him, but going back even the last season, how complimentary he was of how Burnett moved into that new role for this defense, how big that was for the Packers down the stretch in two thousand and sixteen, and while they were kind of taken out of that due to the injuries in the secondary, the fact that he was that willing to take that on for the first half of the year, playing out of position, absorbing a

lot of contact, getting injured in a couple occasions, never once complained about it. And I think that's one thing. Depending on whether number forty two is in the locker room or not in two thousand and eighteen, a lot of those teammates that knew him were better off because

of it. Yeah, and you talk about one of the veteran guys in the locker room who and he doesn't talk about it this way either, but you know he's got that hunger to get to a Super brit because because his rookie year he goes on injured reserve after the fourth or fifth game of the season with a knee injury. He's really not a part of that Super Bowl team in even though he was you know, he was drafted, he was on the roster. Then he gets put on I R and all that, but he wasn't

on the field for it. He wasn't really a part of it, and he's been a mainstay in this defense ever since. And all of the playoff heartbreaks, the playoff close calls, everything along the way, He's been a part of every single one of them. You know, he wants to be maintained that leadership role in the Packers locker room and help lead this team back to a super Bowl. Yeah, and I asked him that too, because you know, he

came up with Jared Bush and Charles Woodson. He likes being that guy for Clinton Dixon to maryus Randol, the young guys to look to. And now we'll have to see exactly how it's going to play out this offseason. Yeah, one of those stories will be keeping an eye on. But with that, we'll toss to a break back with more and Packers Unscripted right after this. Welcome back to Packers Unscripted Mike Spofford alongside West Hodkowitz and West. I

neglected our sponsor at the end of three. So before we continue here, today is a perfect day to fill up with some new Campbell's Chunky Max soup. Chunky Max is loaded with more meat than you can handle, a lot more. We're talking more than a comparable Chunky soup, So go on fill up with new Campbell's Chunky Max Soup. Campbell's Chunky Soup the official soup partner of the Green Bay Packers. Okay, Wes, we've devoted this entire show to the defense and talking about a lot of struggles through

trying to look ahead a little bit. But let's end this one with something to smile about. I want to get your thoughts on the Green Bay Packers defensive play of the Year in because there were a few big plays out there. Yeah, and there was, you know, before things took a turn in Carolina the Packers. I remember seeing this couple times on Twitter, some Packer fans saying that they sort of become the cardiac pack all over again.

I think was kind of a mantra because there was some really tight games and I think you look at that Cleveland game, Uh, certainly, I know that wasn't a game the Packers wanted to be in a shootout with the Browns over But the thing that was impressive about is how they responded at the end of the game

and more importantly the overtime. Clay Matthews, who had been dealing with the growing issue uh bounces right in there not only is able to get the pressure on Kaiser, but is able to stay with him long enough as he's kind of scrabbling around back there to get to hit his hand, make that ball kind of just hang up there a little bit. And then Josh Jones and a horde of Packers defenders kind of circling around, vulturing

around that ball. Game of five hundreds. I was quoted saying to uh and and Josh Jones comes down with it the biggest play of his young career. That locker room You got a chance to be a part of it too. I mean that locker room atmosphere, what that celebration was like for that team. The records didn't matter at that point in time. They knew at that juncture

the season. This kept them in the playoff hunt. It made it viable for Aaron Rodgers to return this season with play meaningful football um And while ultimately that didn't end up getting the Packers into the postseason, that moment I think probably didn't go down as one of the highlights of two thousand seventeen. Yeah, it definitely will, because it did keep the Packers in the hunt at the time. There are two of them that that jump out at me.

They were both uh, defensive touchdowns in victories for Green Bay. One was Damarius Randall's pick six in Dallas, which uh, you know, kind of gets overshadow a little bit because of Aaron Rodgers just epic final drive on the road with the crowd going crazy and all that to take

the Packers down for the victory. But the pick six earlier in the game by Randall, and I know he ended up getting, you know, a penalty, but I actually kind of the whole mocking of Derek Prescott celebration with the crossed arms, you know, I actually got a kick out of that. But um, the other one, though, is is big Number ninety four watching Dean Lowry rumbling, bumble and stumble as as folks like to say, down the

field against Tampa Bay for that defensive touchdown. And I'm trying to remember now, Jamis Winston loses control of the ball. Was it was it was it Daniels or Clark Clark Clark, Yeah, Kenny Clark knocked it out of his hand, and uh, Lowry, it's it's like, you know, Merry Christmas. There's the ball right in his hands and and off he goes and hey, nobody caught him. No, they didn't, and it was funny.

Clay Matthews had one of the quotes of the year afterwards, saying, well, that's a guy with the eight forty or whatever it was of the combine coming out of Northwestern. But a huge day for Dean Lowry. The Lambeau Leap didn't exactly go the way he wanted it to after running sixty one yards down the field. His tank was a little empty at that point, but it was It was a big play in a season I think, a big place

for that defensive line, especially those young guys. Yeah, alright, well with that, we will call it a wrap on this edition of Packers Unscript. Would be sure to follow all of our coverage of the team on Packers dot com on Twitter. He's at west Hod, I'm at Mike Spofford. You can still find the team account at pack Cars. Thanks for tuning in, everybody, We'll see you next time. H m hmm.