At the end of the day, doesn't matter how many Instagram follows you've got, Everybody still needs to do the same if they want to see results.
Be like master your craft first.
Secondly is do not be afraid to ask, because if you don't ask, you'll never find out. Once you get over that fear of failing or rejection, then so much good stuff happens.
The common misconception with a lot of girls is.
That if they live place, they're going to get bigger, bulk, or it's going to be it's going to make them gain light or whatever, and it's just not the case. So being able to see firsthand girls kind of buying into the fact that strength training is a good thing is really enjoyable.
And you know, when we go and do these tours.
And stuff like that, you get hundreds of people's hundreds of people at the workouts to come and train. When you see more come in person, that's not pretty especial experience as well.
Hi, and welcome to Outspoken, our first Under the Influenced episode of twenty twenty. You're joined as usual by journalists Amy and Sophie Torber, and today we're excited to have Dan Kennedy on the show. Dan Kennedy is a powerhouse in the fitness world. The twenty six year old is a certified pet and strength and conditioning coach with a fresh and simple approach to wellness and fitness. With a thriving online coaching business and chart topping podcast, Dan is
making waves in the industry. Many know Dan as the trainer from hugely successful fitness Juggernaut Keeper Cleaner run by Steph Claire Smith and Laura Henshaw. We spoke to Dan about how he forged a name for himself in such a saturated market, his career defining moments, and his top tips for fitness and training. So, thank you so much for joining us today.
Danger So is a.
Huge kick fangirl, So I think she's in her element getting to ask you some training questions. Yeah, I did one of your workouts yesterday, so.
I hope you saw today. Then I am actually.
I am so to kick us off, we wanted to find out more about your journey into the fitness world. Can you take us back to your school days when you're at Horsham, when you discus at the gym and basketball for the first time.
I started basketball at quite a young age and it was always basketball and footy growing up while I was at school, and then it was probably at about I think it was fifteen or maybe just as I turned sixteen, that I went to the gym for the first time. So, you know, naturally I'm quite skinny and playing.
Sport growing up, I was. I just happen to be once my muscle mass so irobically I was. I was really good, but I was just trying to get it knocked around a bit easily.
So I went to the gym for the first time, he had around fifteen or sixteen.
And.
Initially I abstolutely hated it because I had to go.
But then after you know, a couple of months, I.
Really fell in love with with training and started seeing results, and like a lot of people that start going to the gym, I kind of got addicted to seeing progress and knowing that the work I was putting in was was giving me the results that I wanted, and I kind of quickly felt in love with that, and then it just progressed from there really, Like I kept playing footy in basketball all the way up until I guess the end of school, and by that point I was
right into the gym. I was doing, you know, a ton of my own research and stuff about training and nutrition. And I actually did my PT qualification separate to year twelve while I was in year twelve, just so I had that as well. And then yeah, I got to the end of school and had to pick footy of basketball, and I actually picked for the first time ever, I chose footy over basketball and was going to give basketball and miss.
And then within about a day of making that decision.
I got asked to move to Melbourne for basketball, so that thission changed again pretty quickly.
And yeah, it within about a week I was living in Albourne.
So and yeah, I liked happened since then, But that's kind of I guess how it all started anyway.
And when you were training at the Australian College of Basketball, you suffered an ankle injury, I believe, and that out to be a pretty defining moment in your career.
Yeah, for sure.
Like I said, like anyone that knows me that knew that kind of all the way up until that point, basketball and forty tow any extent was literally all I did.
So for two years after your twelve.
I was here at the Australian College of basketball, and we were training, you know.
Two to four hours a day most days of the.
Week and pretty much just living as living like a professional athlete, but not getting paid to do it. So we're studying at the same time, and obviously my goal was to do something with basketball and eventually finish up my two years here and then play play somewhere and get paid to play somewhere and keep kind of building
on my basketball game. And at the end of the two years, yeah, I found out and an anchor reconstruction, which at the time was quite devastating and kind of a bit depressing, Like I went from just living and breeding basketball to not.
Doing any of it at all.
Were not doing anything at all really for a fair period of time, and and you know, everything happens for a reason.
It was a blessing in the skies that you know, started personal.
Training full time pretty much as soon as I could start walking again, and then.
I had a few.
Setbacks with the ankle, so that made me actually make the decisions to stop playing, which was a big decision at the time, and focus on building up her career and the fitness industry and then and then just went from there, tried did a number of different things after that.
I ended up doing some phyz.
Competing and all different types of things that I'd never had the time or the chance to do while I was pretty much doing full time basketball.
So yeah, at the time it was very.
Very very disappointing and a massive change, but it all worked out for the best.
And talking about the bodybuilding, for those I suppose who have never actually competed or in that way, how difficult is it to get your body to that end result?
Yeah, it looked it's hard.
It's the thing I liked about it is that it's it.
All comes down to you, Like, if you're put in the work, you'll see the results.
If you don't put in the work, thing, you're the only one that you have to blame for not seeing the progress and the results that you're after.
And that's what I liked about it.
I'd come from playing obviously all team sports, where no matter how much work you put in, it's it's not always up to you, the results not always up to you. So go into more of an individual sport, I guess you'd call it where it comes down to how disciplined you are with not only the training, but obviously what you put in your mouth as well, So the nutrition
side of things is definitely the hardest part. I really enjoy training, so I never would have I would never say that the training was that the hard part.
To stick to.
Definitely the hard sessions, but that's that's the enjoyable bit. But you know, and I think a lot of people when they hear the term bodybuilding in particular, I think I've someone absolutely huge, like anyone has seen me quite clearly, I am not huge, but I done know.
I built up a big.
Foundation of doing strength training for a long period of time, and my goal was basically just look as lean and athletic as and you know, as muskelars are possibly could in these shows. And I usually give myself between kind of twelve to twenty weeks to get ready for these and it'd be extremely disciplin like not so much not so much what I was eating, but just the specific amounts and how structured my training I was, and how discipline I was with getting enough sleep and drinking water
and all that type of stuff. So there's a lot that comes into play with the end result. But it is an awesome challenge and you definitely learn a lot about yourself in that period of.
Time and.
It's very very challenging, not only physically, but particularly mentally as well.
And going back to your business, you have built an incredible client base over the years with not only sports stars, but models influencers who are some of the biggest names that you work with at the moment.
At the moment, obviously I'm doing the Cubic cleaner up at the moment, so in terms of influencers and stuff, working with Steph Clai Smith and Laura Henshaw athletes, while I've done a lot with footy players over the years, guys like Guys Pepple and Scottie Pennilbury and Tom McDonald and a few other AFL athletes, basketballs.
I'm good mates with Mitch Creek, which I know you guys will know that name quite well being an adelaide, So Kreaky and I've done a little bit together, and even Shawne Bruce from Horsham. But other guys like Michael Clim obviously a very successful Olympian, currently working with Dylan Orcott who just won the twenty twenty Australian Open Wheelchair
for wheelchair tennis. And yeah, there's just I've been pretty pretty fortunate with being able to work with with not only not so much high profile people, I guess because everyone's exactly the same at the end of the day, Like doesn't matter.
How many Instagram follows you've got, everybody still needs to do the same if they want to see results. But I've just been likely to work with good people, like people that are just genuinely enjoyable to get to know.
And in terms of working with athletes, it's fun because people they are so specific because with what their goal is, and you know they'll do exactly what you ask them to do, and it's fun to see that payoff, like for example, watching them doing when the open and the weekend after training together and seeing how much is improved. It's rewards. That's definitely the rewarding part of the job.
Oh, he's incredible. I mean there's obviously so many big names there. How did you actually get some of those people on board? Because I'm sure you know when you're first starting out, it's probably difficult to just pick up the phone and be like, hey, Steph klas Smith, do you want to us come into the gym. So if there's other people out there who I suppose aspiring to be trainers like yourself, what would be your advice to getting some of those people on board.
Yeah, I guess my advice would be, well, firstly, you just have to become extremely good at what you do, so it doesn't matter like the names that obviously it's enjoyable, like you said, training these types of people, but if you're not good at what you do, then they're not going to come to you anyway. So the first thing is you just need to focus on actually mastering your craft so that you have a reason for them to
come to you in the first place. You know, even guys like someone who's one of my good mates now, Mitch Mitch Obel, like he I remember he put up a post on social media asking someone help with nutrition.
I got tagged in it, so I just messaged him.
And you know, for me, it was nothing to do with the fact that he had an Instagram following. It was the fact that I genuinely wanted to help. I message him and said, hey, mate, I'd love to help you get results, and that's it, and he said, yep, Like I didn't mention anything about you know, I want you to take me on Instagram or any of that stuff we got in results. And he actually said to me at the start, He's like, yeah, I'll tag you in a post on Instagram and stuff. And I said
to him, like, that's not what after. Like, if you see results and that's what you want to do, then that's what you do. But you know, I've never ever kind of work with these people purely for the fact that they have a profile. So the first the first thing, like I said, would be be like master your craft first. Secondly is do not be afraid to ask, because if
you don't ask, you'll never find out. I said this on a podcast the other day, where you know, people are worried to ask a certain person if they want to train with them or if they can help them out for free, because they're worried they'll say no. But even if they say no, you're in the exact same position already because they're still not working with them.
So you're in the same position as you would be if you've failed.
So once you get over that fear of failing or rejection, then so much good stuff happens. Like the amount of the amount of opportunities I've been lucky to have, and I wouldn't even call it luck.
It's just it's just pure.
Like the amount of times that I've kind of asked certain things and they've come through, which would never have happened if I hadn't been willing to, if I hadn't been if I had been scared of rejection or scared of failure, than it just wouldn't happen. You know What's another good example, And the other part of this as well, is is that you shouldn't you shouldn't be doing it for the purpose of the fact that these are high profile people, Like in the end of the day, they're
the same as everybody else. And something that I think is worked in my favor is that I've never reached out to people and said, you know, I want you to pay me x, Y and Z to do this, or like I said, I've never asked for social media posts or whatever. A lot of the time, you've got to be willing to give up your time and give up your advice, your best advice and value for free. Like I will say to someone you know, I'd love to help you out, you have to get results, and that's it.
And I so fair results.
And then when I come back then they come back and you build a relationship and you go from there, and then after that it's obviously a bit of a ripple effect. You start to build up a bit of a reputation, or you build up a network of people in the similar circles, and it becomes a bit easier, But definitely at the start, it's just about reaching out and asking. Even with the podcast, like even if you guys asking about this podcast, like you've reached out and here we are, we're doing it.
If you hadn't hadn't have asked, and we would be doing it.
Yeah, that's such good advice. I think sometimes I totally agree. People are too scared to ask the question. I'm going to ask the question. I'm not going to ask you to train us, but I'm going to ask you to throw potentially some of your clients under the bus. Are there any funny stories you can think of that our audience might like to hear. Maybe maybe the kid or Mitch Creek story. We could stitch him up here.
Funny stories, there's plenty of them.
No pressure here.
Oh, there's too much you're putting on the spot.
I actually don't know. There's just too there's too many of them.
There's been plenty of I've got this point. I actually don't have any real funny stories to say, but they're definitely some of the funnier people to tay Is by far. Guys like Major and even Will Spark like him and I have had slenty of sessions together here in Australia, but even we went over and went kind of toured with him for a couple of weeks over in Greece last year and something. He's just a very, very very funny person to be around. Guys like cleaning.
He's always great fun to hang out with them.
And obviously, you know you girls have obviously seen a lot of the Kick stuff. Anytime you're doing any workout or basically anything around Laura, something funny happens.
It's it's quite bizarre, but it is.
She's quite funny to film with most of the workouts, So a kick just that I don't even know what we're doing with the workout by the time we're finished, because because he's talking about something that nobody has any idea what you're talking about, but it's.
It's quite funny.
So I'm going to have to disappoint you that I don't actually have any great stories, but yeah, I'm lucky to work with some.
People that are.
And as I did tell you before, I am a kick girl and do follow your program religiously. How do you feel that you're helping to inspire so many young women out there to get into fitness and also strength training.
I love it, you know, Like I was initially working with Laura on some strength training, which is funny because now she she really does any strength training, But I was training her before the key program started, and she asked if I'd be interested in joining with her and stuff, and obviously said yes, the opportunity sounded great, and since then it's obviously just kind of just grown and growing, and you know, knowing now that the workouts get out
to so many people, because that's my whole goal with with my business, whether it be online or with the pet stuff or my podcast, is just to try and add value and help as many people as I possibly can. So being able to reach such a large audience, and in particular with it being femail and a lot of the time girls that have actually, like you said, never really done strength training or even done any training really, So to be able to have an impact on them.
And I get a lot of messages or emails and stuff from girls that are doing the program that likes the strength training side of things and want to learn a bit more about it, which is awesome to me because it's obviously what I that's the part of items are the most is the resistance and strengthenening side of it.
So being able to get messages from people saying, you know, particularly girls, because I guess the obviously the common misconception with a lot of girls is that if they live place, they're going to get digg in bulk or it's going to be it's going to make them gain weight or whatever, and it's just not the case. So being able to see firsthand girls kind of buying into the fact that
strength training is a good thing is really enjoyable. And you know, when we go and do these tours and stuff like that, you get hundreds of people, hundreds of people at the workouts to come and train. When you see more come in person, that's a pretty special experience as well.
Definitely, and you have such a strong online presence. You obviously got your podcast which is hugely successful on your Instagram platform and YouTube well social media a big part of your business strategy and growing your PT and obviously your online courses.
Yeah, for sure, without a doubt, my business would not be anywhere near where it is today without particularly Instagram, but also the podcast. The podcast has been amazing. It's I'm so glad I started it when I did. It's brought about.
So many opportunities.
But Instagram, like by far, don't have the biggest the biggest following. But what I've remained consistent with the whole way through ever since I started, is just trying to provide some form of value pretty much every single post as often as possible. So there's being really consistent with it, and it's taken a long time, but it is starting to pay off and a lot more people are starting to see the content, which is awesome.
It's helping more people.
But just the brand awareness and being able to reach people that you wouldn't be able to reach otherwise is, like I said, the Instagram for me at the moment, particularly Instagram Stories.
Over the past twelve.
To eight months, I just put a lot of time into not particularly making good content for stories, but just documenting what I do with clients and putting in random stuff about nutrition or programs or whatever. The podcast is great being able to reach an audience through audio.
As you touched on, I.
Did a bit with YouTube, which I enjoyed it. I think it was pretty effective, it had a bit of impact.
It's a lot harder unless you've got a huge following on YouTube.
It's a lot of time that goes into making the videos, but it was definitely enjoyable.
And then for me as well my email list.
I love being able to communicate with people via email consistently because you just build up more of a relationship and you can get responses from people that probably wouldn't particularly message back or comment on an Instagram post because they're worried about what other people are going to say or whatever it is.
So it's a bit more personal with the email and.
Podcasts to an extent because people start to feel like they build a better relationship and more trust with you, which is which is fun. But yeah, so definitely social media has definitely been a huge, huge influence on my business, a positive one.
We're talking about social media, I'd love to hear your take on TikTok. Are you a fan or are you just it's weird isn't it.
It's yeah, looks like could be perfectly honest. I don't necessarily like it only because only because I just it's is not the type of content that I would put together. So that's the only reason I.
Don't like it. To say, it's definitely not.
Going anywhere, and it's definitely growing a lot. I think there's a lot of potential for it to do extremely well. And you know, I've played around with it a little bit. I've put some content on there. Like I said, a lot of my stuff coming from Instagram. Anyway, it's very informative and not so much for entertainment, which TikTok is definitely more of an entertainment app, So I think the creative side of things, if you're as a creative.
Person, then TikTok is awesome to you. And obviously younger younger.
Population are doing really well with it in terms of engagement and stuff. But because it's so new still, even though it has been out for a while, it's still so new. So it's kind of like what Instagram was when it first started to get popular.
So the potential for it.
To grow now is massive, and just like Instagram, just like Facebook and even Snapchat to an extent, regardless of whether you like or not, it's definitely not going anywhere. So if your goal is to do well with businesses, your goal is to do well with reaching a larger audience, then you kind of have to suck it up and at least have a go at it, and otherwise you will fall beline Like. There's just no kind of two ways about it. I was talking to someone about this the.
Other day, my dad. Actually we're talking about phones.
Everybody's on their phones now, and although it may not necessarily be a good thing, and people may not like the fact that you walk around and literally everybody's like zombies on their phone, it's just not going to change. It's not gonna that's not going to go away anytime soon. Like,
pretty much your whole life is on your phone. And if you're just purposely not using how you're purposely avoiding using these apps and stuff like that, and you know you have a business or you have the goal of reaching a larger audience, then you'd be silly to avoid it. So yeah, very long answer to that to that question, But TikTok is I can't say it going anywhere.
Yeah, definitely is getting.
Popular, and I'll just keep putting out content on it and see what happens.
Are we going to see any dancers or sort.
Of mind zero change? Absolutely zero.
Now we have a predominantly female audience, so we thought we'd finish off the episode by picking your brain on a few health and fitness questions. So the first one is at the moment, it seems like it's all about glutes for young women? Is about that? Kim Kaber say, yeah, so are there any tips that you would give for the most effective ways to train your glue?
Yeah?
Well, to answer that, like the first, probably the most important thing before you even worry about training them is making sure that you can put your that you can put them in a position to actually work when you train. So so many people have underactive and lazy glutes, and that is mainly because of the.
Fact that hip flexes are so tight, so our hips are so tight.
We spend so much time sitting down throughout the day or in a position where we're shortening hip flex and
muscles and even out the side of our hips. To your sales, So the first thing I always do before any lower body session, and you would have seen this in the kick app as well is try and mobilize the hips, so stretching the hip flexes, doing release work through the hips to bring out powers back to a position that when we train we can actually use the glutes properly, because a lot of the time that we people get this lower back pain or even knee pain and stuff like that.
It's because we are not utilizing our gluts and hamstrings enough.
So maybe the first part and then other than that, I'm a big, big fan of activating groups for us, using bands with things like cloud walks and hip thrust even kind of clamshows and all those different types of activation exercises. But after that, it's you've got to understand that the big the lists that have been in like every program since gym workouts became popular, there's a reason
why these exercises are doing there. So things like squats, dead lifts, hip thrusts, step ups, lunders, all these main exercise that everybody has heard of before. The reason that in every program is because they work. So it's all well and good to see these fancy exercises you'll say on Instagram or exercises that look really cool, but they're not the ones that are going to help you build your glutes the most.
Like to this day, the.
List that I think are going to help you build your groutes for the most squats, we got it doubt dead lists in particular. I love Sumo dead list because they make you use your groups a lot more. Barber hip thrusts or even just hip thrust using a plate or band whatever whatever you'd like. There some form of lunch variation, so either or reverse lunch, Bulgarian split.
Squat or something like that are fantastic.
But the key is, like any the way to build any muscle is to overload over time. So you know, he's doing a heap of body weight squats. Although it may puff you out and make you feel like you're getting a bit stronger, in the end of the day, you're going to kind of reach your your cap in terms of how much you can actually.
Grow your goods doing that.
So the key is to get stronger over time, whether that's more weight or sets, whatever it is. But stick to those big exercises that you know work, and just be consistent with it, and don't be afraid to lift weight. If you know girls are listening, don't be afraid to actually lift weights. It's not going to make you big and bulky. It's going to give you the shape and the strength that you that you've always wanted, the reason why you've probably gone to the gym in the first place.
That's some great advice. What about in terms of diets, because a lot of people say on flexible eating and diet plan everything, what would you say the biggest mistakes are when I suppose women do flexible dieting. When they do it, yeah, like do they overindulge or ah.
I think the biggest misconception was flexible diving straight up is people thinks that that's just a license to eat as much crap as you can, as long as it.
Fifth within your calorie and cake.
But you're pretty you know you'll work out pretty quickly.
That's it's not how it works.
So I'm a big advocate for allowing eighty to ninety percent of your eu carory intake to come from nutrient dense whole foods.
That's that's the stuff that's.
Going to give you. You know, it's going to be best for your skin, it's going to best for recovery, your mood, your hormones, all that type of stuff. So it's like a sports car. If you feed it crappy fuel, it's not going to run its best. If you give it the fuel that it needs, like a high quality fuel, it's going to perform it's best.
It's the same as our body.
So the mistakes, like I said, is just trying to eat as much crap as you can or avoiding foods that you know are good for you. So I think it's really important to fuel your body properly, but also allowed that ten to twenty percent of calories for food and even drink that you may typically kind of crave, whether that be a glass of wine with dinner, whether that be some ice cream before bed, or it could just be having milk with your coffee, things like that.
Like it's it doesn't mean that you need to purposely try and eat crappy food. It just means that you have literally the flexibility as a namer suggest to eat the way that you want and still see results, because in the end of the day, it doesn't come down to what you're eating. It comes down to how much
you're eating, and that's just sight. That's one of the main things that I've really worked on with my nutrition knowledge over the years is to try and figure out exactly how to lose body fat and how to gain weight, all that type of stuff.
And that's as simple as it gets.
If you're burning more energy than you're taking in, regardless of what it is that you're eating, you will lose body fat. And if you're consistently taking in more than what you're burning, then you're going away.
And you mentioned drinks. If someone's looking to lose weight, would you say you need to cut them out altogether? Or would like alcoholic drinks?
Sorry?
Alcoholic drinks?
Yes?
Alcohol? Is that the sort of first thing you think people should get rid of if they're trying to sort of lean down.
Look, you can definitely lose that still drinking alcohol. I don't think you don't need to cut it out. It's not necessarily to cut it out completely. But what I would be looking at is that if you are abouwd to be heavy drink or you're somebody that drinks quite often, then you've got to keep in mind that a lot
of your calory intake is coming from those drinks. So if you know that, you know majority of calories are coming from drinks, and you're not willing to drop down your food to an extent where you're still in a deficit, then it'd be a wise idea to reduce the amount of drinking. But you know, if it's just a couple of drinks here and there, it does not make a difference as long as it's your intake.
So, you know, even when I was doing the physics shows, like.
I remember one of them, it was my sister's twenty first, twenty first, she's not in twenty one, eighteenth, eighteenth, Sorry, we've got eighteenth birthday. The week before one of my competitions, and we went out for dinner and I got a couple of glasses of wine.
This for a week before my show.
I just made sure that I worked the rest of my day around the fact that I was going to do that, and I accounted for it, and you know, the next day I didn't feel bad.
I didn't try and make up for it by doing a heap of cardio or anything like that. It's just.
You've got to keep in mind that, like I said, there's no such thing as good and bad food. If you're taking in too many calories, which the chances are you probably are, if you're drinking a lot, then you will.
Not lose body fat.
But if it's just a few here and there and you're accounting for it, then you've got nothing to worry about.
And Lassie, what are some of your top tips on finding motivation to train.
Having a very specific and clear goal in mind, and keeping yourself I guess staying in align with what that goal is and revisiting that as often as possible, because it's easy to you know, we actually talked about this on the Keick podcast the other day.
It's easy to sit down on jaen first and write down goals and then never.
Look at them again until December thirty first, But if you're constantly making yourself aware of what these goals are.
And figuring out the small steps you need to.
Take to achieve those goals, and the likelihood is sticking them, sticking to them is.
A lot higher.
So to stay motivated, I think is you constantly got your goal in your mind, then it's going to be a lot more likely.
And another thing is to keep yourself accountable. So find a training.
Partner, find somebody that you have to be accountable towards, whether that be a friend, whether that be a family member, you love one whoever it is whether be yourself, you know, if you're just so used and never following through the goal and sticking to it, stay accountable to yourself, make
sure you achieve what you see that to do. Other than that, in terms of motivation, I think it just has to be your If it's not your goal, if it's just a goal that everybody else is doing and you think that that's what you need to do.
Then you'll never be motivated.
I honestly think that if the goal means enough to you.
Then you'll always be motivated. Yeah, there may days where you probably.
Don't feel like doing it as much as the other days, but that purpose.
Will always be there and that's what's going to drive you to do it.
And if it's not, then it's probably not that important to you in the first places.
That's my opinion anyway.
Like I've always been quite lucky in terms of being pretty self motivated, never really having to have anyone to push me along. Obviously, I appreciate it when people do, but I'm more than I'm more than capable of keeping myself motivated. But I'm a big believer in if it does mean enough to you, then you won't need someone they're holding hands.
That's so true. God, I feel like hitting the gym after speaking. Yeah, I'm motivated now. And lastly, I guess we just wanted to find out what you've got planned for twenty twenty. Is it going to be a big year for you?
Yeah, every year's big year. I'm really looking forward to. I'll just want to continue to build on that number of the amount of.
People on marketing impact with the podcast, social media and my online coaching. I really want to continue to grow my presence online purely for the purpose of being able to help out more people, you know, with the cabit clean and stuff. That's going to continue to grow as well, so hopefully reach more girls and help more girls get into the gym for the first time and start lifting some weights and really start to build up some confidence
and self esteem. And like I said, just for me, it's just an impact.
So the more I can do, the better. I'm trying to do as much as I possibly can.
So everything always works out for the best, and everything happens for a reason. So we'll just see what happens in twenty twenty.
Great, Well, we'll definitely leave a link below in our show notes to your podcast so our listeners can check it out. Thanks so much for joining.
Us Absolute pleasure. Thanks a lot for having me on. I really appreciate it.
Thank you so much for listening to the episode. If you did enjoy it, we'd love if you could share it on your Instagram and please remember to tag us at Outspoken Underscore the Underscore Podcast, and if you could leave us a review, we'd really love to read it.