Ordinarily Speaking. You may know me as an intense small forward who played for the Fremantle Doctors, but more recently had to go through family tragedy and how I dealt with it.
Soon time, Hello and welcome to this week's episode of Ordinarily Speaking. Whether you hate him or admire him, or a bit of both, Hayden Valentine is as tough as they come. Drafted as a mature aged recruit at twenty one and standing at just one hundred and seventy four centimeters, Hayden went on to play one hundred and seventy one games and kick two hundred and fifty four goals for the Fremantle Football Club, forging a special relationship with coach
Ross Lyon along the way. Prior to Hayden's final year at the club, he was confronted with the biggest challenge of his life. On Grand Final night twenty eighteen, Hayden's little brother, Brendan, was hit by a car and killed. Brendan's fiance was just up the road about to pick him up. He was just twenty two years old, a father of one and with another baby on the way. This episode is raw and confronting if it is a
trigger for you, please ask for help. Lifeline and Beyond Blue are just a couple of places you can go. Hayden's hope is that by sharing his story it might help other people navigate their way through loss. We caught up at his rural property in Wa, where Hayden is now a horse trainer. Well, Ballas, thanks so much for spending some time with me. I've got to say this is a first for me. We're recording a podcast episode in your stables in Western Australia and you've had a
pretty busy day. You had to put this back at a few hours. Tell me about your date about.
Yeah, so I had the draft through four or five hundred cattle this morning. Well we started in the morning and finished about four o'clock, so I've spent a long day, but yeah, we got here in the end.
What time do you break up most days, I normally.
Got up about five, get out to the stables and work the horses, and then I head off on my day about eight o'clock and do what I need to do. And it's sometimes as long hour today as a long day. But then tomorrow I haven't got a whole lot on, so it all balances out and normally ends up being a normal week for most people.
So this is just something that you sort of planned throughout footy as well. This was going on while you were playing footing.
Yeah, bits and pieces obviously now as much of a hands on roll where you know, I couldn't control it as much as what I'd like, where now I've got full control. And now it's been really good. And I've actually learned a lot more in the last couple of years at post football about how my business has actually work. So it's it's been quite good. A bit of a learning curve, but yeah, things are pretty efficient now, so it's good.
So when you're saying you know you're wrangling cattle, you're actually chasing cattle, right.
I jumped off the motorbike and tackled a calf this afternoon because he didn't have an ear tag, so I had to jump off the motorbike and tackled him. And they're only four or five weeks old. They're bloody strong little things, so this is hard work.
I had a bit of a blowgoing, yeah, solid, what's harder tackling it?
Now?
These things are tough. They're tough little buggers and they're relentless to they don't stop because you know, they think we're going to eat them, so they're pretty scared. And yeah, we had to put a new ear tag in him, and yeah he was solid.
So you don't just nickname them or anything like that footy players or something Scarlet's out there.
No, no, no, no, yeah, maybe a couple I want to give them back to. But we if you know, we've got kids, and if they name an animal, we're not allow to put on the dinner table. So we don't name name any of our animals that we don't want to keep that we want to keep.
I feel like that's a pretty good rule, you know.
I was thinking back before this interview to when we first met, and it was when you were twenty one and you were a favorite for the Sandover. You were working at a surf shop in mandra I was working at Channel seven News and your favorite for the Sandover about to get drafted by the Frio Dockers, and you
were just the most confident young bloke going around. And I spoke to you great mate Aaron Sandalans ahead of this as well, and he said, when you marched into the club a few weeks later he thought, who is this little arrogant so and so? Is that pretty much the way you've always been?
Or what made you that way?
I think something, you know, my statue. You got to have a bit of presence about you somehow. So confidence was my thing, and that's how I played my footy. I played with a bit of a chip on my shoulder, and I didn't make any apologies about that. I had to show confidence or flair in some way. And I remember Aaron did actually say it to me when I later on down the track when we become good mates.
He goes, you first walked in, I thought you little tossa little arrogant little shit and then and then we end up being great mates. So it's I run how that works out.
What was the chip on the shoulder? Is it the height?
Like?
What was it?
I don't know. I just I was pretty confident my abilities and what I could do. And I knew I was pretty I could handle a fair bit. I was pretty tough and could handle whatever anyone threw at me. So I dish it out, they throw it back, and most people can't handle as well as what I could.
It's actually true, isn't that It is pretty true.
Yea, I didn't. I didn't know. I didn't mind if I hurt people's feeling. I was out there to win a game of footy. I wasn't out there to make friends. So and that was my match through footy. I was out there to win, not to make friends.
You were kind of one of those blokes that everyone hated but everyone would have loved to have been on their team.
Is that what you felt when you were playing a fair bit?
Yeah?
And you know, now that I have retired, I do see a few ex players us Stevie Johnson I saw last year after the Grand Final and we had a few beers together and he said that exact same thing. He goes, you know, I didn't like it at all on the field, but I would have liked you playing for Geelong. So you know, when you hear things like that, it wouldn't say it made me feel better, you know, it just made me think. You know, I actually did my job pretty well when when it was my turn to go always went.
Does it ever hurt your feelings when people were being horrible to your social media and all those things.
Not at all, not when it was directed at me, Because I was water for ducks, back for me, but sometimes it was directed at my family and that would piss me off a bit. You know, there's a few tweets in that that would go on of threats and stuff like that, and it was directed at me, you know, happy days, go your hardest. But if it was directed to my family, I took a bit to that.
Yeah, what was the worst, you cops.
Someone threatened my wife or my partner at the time, now wife. Yeah, he was going to bash me and then do something to my wife, and that was that was Yeah, that was a tipping point. And that that person got found. He's in w A, which you know, was a little bit worrying, but yeah, yeah, I never found out his name, so there's not much I could have done about it.
What do you do in a situation like that?
The club and the AFL teams in general, they have amazing resources and they can someone sends out a silly tweet or a Facebook thing of threat someone. They're found straight away and the police got involved. They confiscated all his I t like, his computer, his iPad, call that and made him tell his wife what he said on the tweet, and his wife went berserk I heard, so it was a yeah, I don't think you'd be doing anything.
Like that again the wife it.
Was, and it was, you know, it was just a drunken comment when you know, he's we'd beat his team and I played quite well and pissed off some people and he he didn't like it, so he got he was drunk, said something he probably regretted the next day.
How does.
Daughter horses she wants to go on the MIC's good girl, I love it.
How does that impact your wife at the time or your partner at the time.
But now, wife, you know, you.
Don't need to know what you need to know. She didn't need to know what was being said and all what was being done at the time. It was a little bit disturbing for what for myself, but she didn't need to know at the time. And when it was all said and done, I told her what was happening and she was a little bit shocked. But it kind of goes with the territory.
That's the thing, though, isn't it.
It's you sign up for it, but your family doesn't exactly right.
The one that gets upset the most of my nan who's you know, she's eighty six now. But when I was playing, she'd read the newspapers and on the Facebook and all that and see all the nasty stuff, and Nan don't worry about it. That doesn't bother me. And she used to get a little bit of upset, but she's she's I think I'll get my confidence and a bit of personality from my Nan, so it's not too bad. I suppose she'll deal with it.
See that's the thing.
People never think about the NAN when they're writing the mean tweets.
Exactly right, and they don't think about the impact on the families afterwards, because most players that don't really care what people say, but what the keyboard worries.
So so it never impacted you when it was directed at you.
Not, No, not in the slightest at all. And even it even spurred me on a bit more because obviously I'm doing my job right. If they're getting that upset of what I'm doing on the field and playing well and doing my thing, obviously I'm doing it well.
The moment that always comes up when I talk to your former teammates and anyone really to do with footy other than the Maddie Skull incident is you playing with a broken jaw. How bad was that pain that you were in and how did you play that game?
Which time? Yeah, well there was a few I think when I did it during the game, I didn't feel much. I felt a bit dazed and that because you know, it was fairly big impact. But I was a bit dazed and got through the game. And then after the game it was bloody sore. It was really sore. And they couldn't really give me a whole lot because I'm allergic to some of the the painkillers I give us. I can't. I can only take certain things.
Is that right?
There's one that it's not a bad allergy, but it makes me real itchy. I've got I've got sensitive skin. One sensitive thing I have got, I've got sensive skin, and I'll get real itchy from these, from these tablets, so they can't give it to me. And so all I was panted off through broken jaw. So it was pretty solid until we got until we got back to Perth, and and then I had surgery on the Tuesday. And normally I wake up rat shit from surgeries. I rake
up real bad. I don't do well with the When they knocked me out and I'll wake up feeling good like I felt. Okay did It wasn't blurry or anything I normally am, wasn't saying any silly things I can normally do, and.
Your concussion test is honest.
Yeah that's right. So I rang Ross pretty much straight away. I said, Ross, if fucking get this swelling out, you're gonna play me, because perhaps three hundredth I think it was Perabs three hundred. And he was pretty much no straight away, and I kept pestering and pested him all week, and then pretty much all the swelling on most one side went, and the side that actually broke was still a little bit swollen. And then I said I'm playing,
and he goes, okay, so let me play. They can't really jab your face because you know it doesn't work, So I just played through it and the only isn't really hurt. I got tackled. I tackled sorry Andrew Mackie, and he knew I had the jaw and squeezed my head and something clicked in there and that that hurt. And Mickey Barlow came and dragged him off and made it even worse, so he tried to help, but it didn't help, And yeah, that was that was pretty solid.
And then a couple of years later against Geelong, I tackled.
It's always Geelong.
Yeah it was Geelong tackle Cory in right, and as he's going to handle the ball, his elbow got me in the face and I fractured, had five fractures through my face and there's a photo of my swall, swollen eyelid. I really puffed up. And at one photo of the year, I was told so one little ticket the box there. They were pretty solid, but I don't know, you don't really feel much once you're out there. I didn't really didn't feel much pain at all into half the game.
Is that the most physical pain you've ever been in?
No, the most physical pain was my I broke my foot in a game as well, and because you can jab them up, I couldn't feel anything beautiful played the rest of the game. And then about half an hour of the game it started to creep in this pain and it was it was the worst paint of the been in. And yeah, it wasn't enjoyable, enjoyable at all.
It brought you to tears.
Not quiet, but it was pretty close. You can't walk, you can't move, you got to keep your foot up otherwise just throbs all night and all day and it is just not nice at all. Plus that was the last game of twenty ten and I broke it then. And then the following week we played finals against Hawthorne one, so I missed. That was the first final series I could have been involved in and missed it, So that was that was the most sour point for me. I think of injuries missing that final.
That's the thing about you that your teammates say, it's you know, you can be the arrogant little shit, as Sandy put it, but you never asked somebody to do what you weren't willing to do.
Is that fair?
Yeah? Exactly right. And I was pretty vocal towards people who didn't work hard. And I suppose you're right do the things that I was doing, because if I can do it, why can't you. Pad was a lot like that as well. I think I got that a bit from Pav and Aaron to a degree as well. I see Aaron working so hard, such a big bloke like him, running and trying keep up with me, like he busses asked to try and get as fitness well prepared as you can, like, if that big fellow can do it,
why I can't wait. He's an absolute superstar. I want to be better than him, or be as you know, held up on a mantle like he is around other people. So that's how that's what how hard I've got to work.
Speaking of held up on a mantle.
Who came up with the idea of the chair off at the end of both of your careers.
That was Aaron on the night. So he said, get on my shoulders. So I'm looking at his shoulders. He said, get on my shoulders, and when he says it twice, you don't argue the second time. So I said, I got on his shoulders. And it was actually, you know, looking at all the photos, actually pretty cool getting sentif like that. It was, yeah, really good to be going out with one of my best mates as well.
It was very unique having a rutman just carrying a small forward on top of his shoulders like he was a child.
Yeah, and that's what it looked like to look like I was sitting on dad's shoulders. But the boy like Dave I remember Dave Money and someone else was walking out to obviously come to chair us off and then they end up just helping me get up on his shoulders and walked off like that. So it was a pretty pretty special moment to walk around with the kids as well. It was really good.
Your girls, I hear their little mini Hayden Valentine's. They've got a bit of going them.
They do. They're quite good at their sports, and they're not scared of much, which scares me a little bit. Not much does scare me, but seeing them do some of the things they do, I just think, oh my god, there's going to be broken bones at some point, and it just makes me a bit nervous. Like they love their horses, they're always riding their ponies, they do gymnastics.
The eldest one wants to play football this year, and I haven't pushed them towards football just because of the injury factor, and but you know, he was inevitable, I think, and they're actually quite good at it. So yeah, we'll see how that one goes. I'll be coaching this year to coaching the under twelve pilt Has Skills team, so that's awesome. That'll be fun.
I feel like there's a little part of you that maybe is realizing what you inflicted on your parents.
I know my dad regularly reminds me of that about he sees that his grandkids and what they do, and he goes, hey, mate, that's what you'd did to me when you were younger.
So cop it now, you said before you hand it out some pretty honest feedbacks as a player. Do you remember any of those that stand out to you that you sort of said, I'm not copying.
That towards my teammates. Yeah, I used to ride Brendan Cox quite hard because I can just see how talented, naturally talented he is. He plays such good games of footy and it's like he doesn't even need to try. He's just he's just that naturally gifted, that athletic, and if he listens to this, his head's going to blow up massively. But he actually is quite a unique player and that he's quick, he's agile, he can kick at both sides, and he's got great hands. He's a big man.
So he's one that I think, could, you know, eventually be a superstar. He's just trying to get that out of him. And I used to ride him pretty hard, and what would you say, pull your finger out, you know. I used to push him all the time, like physically push him and say get there and do this and do that. And it wasn't so much what I said, It was what I was doing and trying to get him to come along with me kind of thing. And he did. He did, used to try and keep up
and do it, do as much as he could. But once he actually does click for him and he realizes how good he could be, it's yeah, he could be an actual superstar.
Do you see yourself as a leader.
I didn't really see myself as a leader. I just thought I was doing I suppose I did in a sense, but without trying to be. I wasn't trying to go out there and be a leader. I was just trying to get the best out of myself and hopefully bringing someone along for the ride at the same time. I would always get Sunny Walter's brand and Materira, any of my small forwards around me. After training, we do five or ten minutes of ground balls, five or ten minutes
of touch, just because that's our craft. We need to be one touch players, and I'd make them and Sonny would try to sneak off. Sometimes I'd make him come back out, and we do it pretty much religiously after every main training session, just to get that touch before we got on the plane and went over to Melbourne
or something like that. So that was something I always made sure happen, just for myself one and for the other two boys or whoever was with us, just to make sure we were one touch players and at the top of our game as much as we could.
And watching your daughter just very obediently go and feed the horses, stay quiet and off back to the house as well.
You run a pretty tight ship, do.
But you know, they get they're quite lucky in the sense they get to live on a property like this, they've got their ponies. But I always make sure that it's their ponies. This is your responsibility, and I think it teaches them responsibility early. If you don't give them water and food every day, what's going to happen to them? They die? And then when I set it to them like that, it's like, oh shit, I better take care of them because Dad's not going to do it for me.
But yeah, probably five days of the week they do their own ponies. They do all their own work for them, and I think it teaches them good responsibilities.
What does family mean to you?
Family? Obviously, everything I did and I'm doing now is for my family. I want them to grow up comfortably. I want to be able to retire and hopefully ten years time, take them on holidays all over the world and do everything for them as much as I can. I didn't travel much when I was a kid because my dad was such a hard worker and being a horse trainer sometimes if you don't win many races and
then that actually a bit of cash going around. So I want to My own game is to be able to retire in ten years comfortably and take them on trips and do the right thing by them and set them up as well.
A lot of the attributes that you showed as a footy player resilience, strengths, leadership. It's fair to say you've needed that on the family front the last couple of years. It's been a challenging couple of years. Tell me about your brother, Brendan and what he was like as a bloat.
Very much a knock about. His formal wear was a flanno that was his formal shirt to go out for dinner. He was just a hard working but he got his a lot of genes from dad. Just a hard working person who he actually helped build one of my houses. He was a bricky's laborer and just the Brickies couldn't keep up with him because he was such a hard worker and loved his fishing, love foot He didn't play footy, I think because he didn't want to be seen as being my brother and you have to try and make
afl and put himself under that pressures. They didn't really play footy, but he did love going the footy. And you know he was watching the night he was hit. He was walking home from his mate's place after watching the Grand Final. The Eagles win the Grand Final. So yeah, it was a very solid time for the whole family, and yeah it was Ross. Was something something Ross said to me. He goes, you're the leader of your family,
so you need to take care of them. And it was that that helped me a lot when Ros said that.
Just giving you almost a responsibility to focus on well.
And he also said, you know it's happened, but what's next. What does his dad need, what does your mum need? What does your his sibling, his other siblings need, And that was for the next month. That got me to there, and then after that it was his kids, like what do his kids need? And he's partner at the time, what does she need? And now she's she's got a house, the kids are, she's gonna she was going to start
studying this year. The kids are doing well. You know, we look after them and see them when we can, and so does my dad and his wife as well. So he has been a solid eighteen to eighteen months or two years. But yeah, I still do think about him a fair bit. And playing footy, you are drawn apart from your family a bit, and Brendan was one
I was drawn apart from because he was allowercking. He love going out and having them getting on the piss and having fun with his mates, fishing and that, and he'd hit me up to go fishing all the time. On a Friday night or a Thursday night, they go catch the massive big sharks off the beach. I don't have the lader to do it or not, but they went and did it, and I couldn't do it because I training, I was in Melbourne, and I didn't spend a whole lot of time with him while I was
playing football. And then now I did have that time. I see some of his friends. His friends now, I actually see them. I actually kill a body of bee for him every now and then, and it's just yeah, I see them, and it would be good to be able to, yeah, see Brendan.
What do you remember from that night?
I was asleep on the couch and I had a had a phone call from Dad. It was a miss call, and I rang back and he was crying, and my first thought was my Pop, because he was quite old and not too well at the time. I thought, no, I know Pops passed away. And because he said someone's died, and that was my first thought was Pop. And then I said where. He said the hospital, Brennan's died, and I was like and it was just a complete shock. I just I didn't know if I was dreaming or
didn't know what to think. And and then just kicking to Gear, I'm like, right, I've got to get there, and I went and told Lisa, and Lisa started a ball in her eyes out. I got to the hospital and everyone was just crying, just didn't know what to do or to say it. And I just all I said, I just can't. I just want to go see Brendan, and I went and seen him, and when I seen him, that was when the water works turned on for me.
Then I lost lost control a little bit. And then my next thought was who did it and where where it's he? And now I think about that bloke as well, and I think, what do I do if I see him down the street. I wouldn't say a violent person, but I don't know if I could control myself if I did see the bloke. So, which is sad because I don't really blame him because he was doing his job. Yes he was on his phone and stuff like that, but it was an accident, so to speak. But he
still took my brother. And I still don't really know what I'd do if I did see the bloke, which is a bit scary, I think because he doesn't live too far away.
So your brother was walking down the street and he looked at his phone and veered off.
Basically yeah, So during the court proceedings, I suppose that was what was the evidence that he admitted to was he was playing his phone. He was delivering pizzas that was his job, and he was playing with his GPS and swerved off the road two meters off the road and at one hundred k's clip Brendan on his way past.
And Brendan was at his mate's place on the beers and walking it was easier to jump the fence and walk up two hundred meters and his partner at the time was waiting for him on the side of the road, and he never never made the car.
Just a couple of hundred meters away.
It was probably about another three hundred meters and he would have been in the car and gone home. So yeah, then you just see accidents like that happening. You never think it would happen to you, but when it does happen, it just leaves your speechless. And you know, all these emotions. I was an emotional person, but the wrong emotions, you know, anger, angle is the main one. More rage. I just didn't know.
I didn't know what to do, and I didn't know if I should go looking for this guy or just yeah, life's not fair sometimes, I suppose.
So what do you do with that level of rage?
You got to direct your another thing, right, I look at Ross as a mentor for me and more than just forty but life as well, and your mind is such a powerful thing. And if you direct your mind towards rage, that's what you're going to have rage. If you direct your mind towards something else, that's what you'll do. And that's what I did. I directed my mind to helping Dad get through the funeral and organize in the funeral,
and then the next step was the family. How you know, make sure the kids and the partner looked after and the horses. As silly and self as that sounds, Dad had thirty odd horses that had to be work. So I was going and riding horses in the morning and trying to help out there as much as I could, and just yeah, just focusing on what can I how to make Dad's life things yet more than any just how do I help Dad and get Dad through this
rather than get myself through this. If I get Dad through this, that will help me get through this type thing. So that was what I focused on, was getting getting Dad through it and getting the rest of the family through it as well.
Are you glad you went and saw Brendan that night?
Yeah, definitely. Yeah.
What did you get out of that, Just.
That it was at the start, yes, this is actually happening, and just to say goodbye as well, So see you mate, And I'm sorry we couldn't go catch those sharks and get on the piss together again because it was Yeah, that's that's you know, I'll be able to spend time with your siblings and my other brother he does flying flight and he lives with us now, being able to go have a hit a golf, went to the pub on Sunday and watch the cricket, just things that I
can actually do now before he's finished. I can't do with Brendan anymore. But yeah, like I said, that's that's life. Sometimes life's not fair.
So how do you navigate the next few months then, because that's an impossible amount of responsibility and grief to be going through.
Yeah again, it's just I was my main focus was Dad and getting Dad through, and I knew getting Dad through would help me get through because I knew he was struggling. And you know still now when he mentioned something about Brendan, you see he just goes into a glaze and doesn't and obviously he's just thinking about who knows, whether it's about Brendan or other things. I just don't know, but he just goes into al and goes quiet for a bit and then comes back. So clearly it still
plays on Dad's mind, which he's only fair. But how I got through is just what's next. What's the next thing that I can help with? What's if I went back to thinking, right o, where is this bloke? What's what's that going to achieve? Really it's either gonna you know, I'll end up in jail or you know, just it's not gonna help anything. It's not gonna help any situation. So focus on what I can help with and make a positive thing, which was helping Dad get through.
How do you feel about that bloke? Now?
Like I said before, I I don't exactly blame him, but I still don't know what i'd do if I saw him walking down the street. I don't. Yeah, I would hope I could control myself, but I just don't know.
Is there anything you get out of it? Is there any message that you push through something like this, because it's you know, that cliche thing of don't look at your phones or what ready is?
Like?
Is there anything that you you get out of this in that sort of manner?
Oh, obviously, how dangerous the car is, like concentrating on the road is just it's just a given now. If you're doing one hundred k's down the road and you just veer off a little bit and clip someone, they're gone. And it took it. It didn't take an accent. I've been always been aware of it, but it took it. Took something like that to really make me focus on
it more. And I'll catch myself sometimes I'll hear the phone or something, I'll go look and I think I should I shouldn't do that, and it's just you just need it. It's in the forefront of your mind now. And same as my dad, like he will not even look at the phone while he's striving, and which which is how it's meant to be anyway.
How tough was it the court case and having to live through something like that, and you were very much the public figure for your family addressing the media and things like that.
Yeah, that was probably one of the most disappointing phases my life with respect to media, just the lack of respect they showed towards me and my family. Just getting in your face, constantly calling SHANEI Brennan's partner for a comment or stuff like that. And she's a twenty one year old girl who's never dealt with media, She's never had to be put in the limelight and putting pressure on her. She's just lost her fiance and father to her two kids. It's just it was very disrespectful and
very just very selfish. I think trying to get a story is sell some papers or sell some advertising at the loss of someone's life, I think is absolute bullshit. And there's certain media people who they know who they are, who cop the spray from me, And if I saw him again, they'd definitely be copying another spray because it wasn't needed. They should have showed more respect and they should be disappointed themselves.
I think, what about the court case, how was that for you?
That? Yeah, again, I was two meters away from the bloker hit Brendan and he walked past me and Dad, and I could just see Dad twitching like that, and I just thought, Dad's a he's more of a hot head than me, Like he's he's known known around the race course, is someone you don't pissed off too much because he's there, flies off the deep end very quickly.
And Yeah, sitting through that with Dad and listening to all the oh, what's the word where you give a testimony or something like that, listenings all those from the family. It was just just yeah, very very hard, very gut wrenching to hear how much Brendan was loved from his family and how much they're going to miss him, and as we all were. But when he made his testimony about his family and I just thought, you know, you've taken our family. Why should you or your family get
you kind of thing. I thought, he just needs to go away for a few years and just just to make it feel like Brennan's life meant something for him to get seven months. I don't think the judge is trying to be leaning. I think he handed down the harshest term he possibly could under the laws. But it definitely was enough. And that again the laws is something that doesn't help either. But dangerous driving causing death and you get seven months, but it's just not right.
I don't think so you'd like to say that, you know.
Absolutely there's got to be a mandatory sentence. If you're on your phone and you know the Blake had marijuana any system, Whether he was smoking pot that night or the night before, it doesn't matter, it's in your system. You have done the crime, you've got to do the time. If you've got if there's that many aggravating factors you need, you know, there needs to be a mandatory sentence for that kind of thing.
Was that the first time that you actually looked him either eye in the court?
Yeah, yep.
You're listening to ordinarily speaking with Hayden Valentine all the while you also had to navigate your last year of footy as well, when you went back to playing footy. I've heard when I've interviewed people about particularly family tragedy and footy, some find it like a release and other people just didn't care anymore, didn't want to be out there. How did you find getting back to footy after going through something like that.
No, it was definitely more just a just getting back into that routine, something else to take my mind off of the stuff going on at home. And yeah, it was definitely it was definitely a help trying to go back, Paul, but I did my hammy around one. It wasston grill. That wasn't great. But yeah, getting back into a routine and having having something to really sink my teeth back into outside of, you know, all the grief at home was definitely a helping factor.
Did you ever have moments or it just got a bit too much?
Yeah, at home I did sometimes, but I go at the front and have a bit of time to myself and then come back in and get on with it. So I'm not really someone that puts all my burdens onto everyone else, so I can deal with myself.
I didn't want your girls to say.
That's the main thing. Yeah, I didn't want to see you know, they see me upset, They're going to think something's wrong where something was wrong, but it's not something that they need to worry about. It was more I just needed to get myself through and get Dad through, and the rest of the family too. Bringing them into.
It tough too, because two out of three of your girls are old enough to have understood what happened.
Yeah, I at the time mainly just a Vana. She fully understood what was happening. She was ten at the time, so she fully understood. But Avery was still a bit didn't really understand all that kind of stuff. Like, Yeah, Avanna was quite up upset. She'd never I'd never had anyone in the family pass away, so it was yeah, definitely a big stage for all of our lives.
That's a massive tragedy to be the first time that you go through something like that, Like, are you proud of yourself how you handled it or.
I don't not. Not really, I haven't thought of it in that way at all. It's more so it was that was what needed to be done at the time. Like you know, Dad's Dad's brought me out my whole life to be well. I would hope that he's a person, a hard working person and someone who who stands for something. So for me to help him out through a tough period of his life is the least I could have done.
You and your dad sound like you've got a pretty special relationship.
Did We've had our ups and we've definitely had air ups and downs, but you know, we couldn't be much stronger at the moment.
I wouldn't have thought is that is that?
I mean, there's no positive out of a situation like that, But is that something that you know your family are tighter because of it?
Definitely? Definitely, And you know we're not We're not a huggy family. Dad doesn't give me a hugh, you give me a pat on the back or kick up the Yars. That's about it. So no, that's right. But you know my after my last game and then at the Doig when me and Aaron said see her all the everyone at the Doig, just before I went up on stage, he came and gave me a big argett on the back. So that was that was pretty cool.
You have tears in your eyes when it was your talk about him? Yeah, what'd you say to you just said, he's proud and well done. Pretty much like I said, he's been through a lot, so I've seen him have tears in his eyes are fair a bit lately, So yeah, it's pretty hard to see him go through that because he's bloody tough bloke.
Do you have conversations about Brendan the tour of you?
Oh?
About Brandan has the person, Not about I wouldn't say our feelings and stuff like that, more so about Brandon and bringing him up and the stuff he used to do. And my nan as well. Then she always she does missing a bit because most days after work you'd come out need me to do anything. Then that's the type of person who was. He always looked after that and Pop quite a lot because they really looked after us. When we were kids as well.
Sheep in the background.
I love Itulu, you don't always rely on as sheep's light in the moon.
Yeah, your Nane and your dad and everything you've been through. I mean, it's just such a lot like to deal with.
How do you approach the future with everything that's happened, because you get to the point now where I guess the healing process begins.
Is that fair?
Yeah? Again, like the healing process started for me by helping Dad get That was what helped me. I suppose getting Dad through and be able to say some things at the funeral because Dad couldn't get up and no one else could get up to say to say much, So me getting up and saying something on behalf of our family definitely helped me. I got to say a few things that I wish I could have been able
to say to Brandon, So that definitely helped me. And now it's more now, it's more grieving now because you know, he could have come to the pub the other day with me and my other brother. So it's stuff like that I think about. That's what I think about now, is like the moments that I have missed. I'm not blaming footy, but because you know I was footy was my main priority at that time of my life.
Does it make you resem footing?
Not at all, Not at all. Like foot He's given me so much and you know, he came to games and watch me play, so he was along for the ride as well. So and none of the family do like they understood that was my prior. It was always my dream was to play footy and to be able to get to the LST level was amazing for me and my family. So that definitely doesn't make me resement footy at all.
What did you say that funeral?
Oh, basically what I've said there the times that we missed, I can't get him back now. So that was that was very hard. And I looked out a few of my mates and they are all like all these apparently tough floaks, all bore in their eyes out and I had a frog in my throat the whole time, and it was, Yeah, that was definitely a very hard bit looking at it everyone and seeing their faces was and just how many people were there, like you know people you joke about it saying, you know, how popular way
how many people rock up to your funeral? And you never thought I would have said that about Brendon, but he was obviously a popular plot because there's hundreds of people there and we all wore red flannels because that was his thing to wear, the red flannel. That was our retire for the day.
Did your teammates and did Ross rossline go?
Yeah, I'm pretty I think Ross was there definitely. Well, Aaron's not hard to pick out of the crowd, and it was a few few other teammates and my close mates, anyone that could get there, they were all there, so which is good support.
Do you stay in touch with Ross? Does he?
Yeah?
Yeah, He'll we ring each other out of the blue and just say hello and have a chat about life and actually don't talk about footy that much. I think footy is done. I suppose like we've we've done everything we could in footy. He's an amazing coach. I've kicked a few goals and it was that was that was it. Yeah, we're going So I got interrupted again.
No, that's all right, No, I'm all good. Thank you though.
Do you want dinner?
He's got to ask for dinner. That's the first as well. On a podcast?
What is it? Mitchell chicken vibs.
No, I'm good, thank you though, thank you my loss apparently to the confidence runs in the family. I love it. What did Ross lyine?
You spoke about it a little bit earlier, But what did he mean to you through all of this time? Because it sounds like it really transcended coach player relationship.
So we always were Every player at Freo had someone, whether it be another player or a coach, who you'd go and talk to. And I like, you know, there was the psychiatrists, and then there's all the assistant coach. There's a bloody twenty assistant coaches at most AFL clubs. But the only one I really felt comfortable with was talking with was Ross because he's been through a fair bit himself throughout his career in life. So I don't know, I think we just we were on a pretty similar
playing field. He was a bit of a rough nut from where was he from in Melbourne? He always used to bring it up, Frank Frankston, I don't know, one of those one of those rough, rough suburbs he used to tell us about. And I'm from mandra So we hit it off pretty well, and he was just someone I always felt comfortable talking to it. I knew if I said something to him, it wouldn't be repeated anywhere. I just you know, that was the type of relationship we had.
And he always knew what to say.
He always he did. And but it always related back to what your focuses are and you know what's important to you and what's going to get you to the next level, to the next level, to being good again type thing. So it's just stepping stones. And you know, he always used to use these silly things. He used to stay up shoulder of the wheel and stuff like that. But it's true. You put your shoulder to the wheel, you keep pushing. Eventually wheel turn and things will get better.
Or whether it be life or family or football, just keep on the next step, next step, next step, But eventually it will get better because if you don't, if you stop, then you're up ship Creek, aren't you.
So how now do you remember Brendan with your girls, with your wife, with his kids as well, which I mean is the toughest part of this, I guess, how do you remember him going forward.
Again? It's hard to when you bring him up and want to talk about him, because we did miss so many years of being able to do stuff together, but now it's more so family events having the kids there, Like he's ava who. It's amazing how similar my kids and his kids look like. You look at him first you think they don't look alike, but then you look at the little the nose, the eyes and stuff like that.
Little things like that, you think, my god, they just had the same color hair and not curly or straight or whatever. They just dead ringers. So that's that's something that really hits home when you see the kids and the similarities in them and the similarities and the personality
they're all. They're all very headstrong young girls. So yeah, that's remembering him in that way and trying to make sure his kids are brought up the best we can and help out as much as we can without interfering in what she's doing, Like she's a young girl trying to find her way in life, and being there to support her, not tell her what to do, but you know, offer a hand wherever we can. Is that's I think that's the best we can do.
Bluddy, that's that's a tough line to tread as well.
I don't want to overstep it, And yeah, tell her what to do, tell her how to do stuff. But hopefully I think she does. You know, between myself and my wife A Lisa, she knows that we're there to support in any way we can.
This is bloody tough for you to talk about, isn't it. You find this like it's very raw still it is.
And because I don't talk about it really, I'm not a big talker when it comes to what I'm thinking. I have my ways of getting through stuff, and talking's not one of them. So yeah, it's not something I bring up intentionally.
Do you ever talk to anyone about it?
Not? Really. I have spoke to Ross about it, and he's probably the only one I really need to. I can take it from there.
It's a lot to take on your own shoulders, it isn't.
It isn't because you know Dad's taking on his shoulders as well. His wife, Donna, She's she's someone who's been unbelievable in this whole process, having sort of stuff out, being there for work, being there for dad. Yeah, she's been a rock for him and for me as well. She helps out me in a lot of ways as well, So you know it's not just me. I'm not a. I don't want to be a selfish person thing it's
about me, because it's about so many other people. And I think I'm like Ross said, I'm a leader in my family and I need to take it on my shoulders as much as I can.
Are you doing okay?
I'm doing okay? Yeah, I think I am. I have my moments, but I get back on the shoulder for the wheel as much as I can.
With anybody else out there that's going through tough times and particularly tragedy, like you were talking about, what would you say to them?
Fine, someone you feel comfortable talking to, because you know everyone's got someone, whether you're a big I'm not a big talker, but I have spoken to someone about it, and that's that's all I need. Really. But if you need to find someone, and you need to not focus on the negatives, so you need to remember, Brandon, I remember what happened and why it happened and how it happened. But don't don't think anger. I don't think you know regret. Regret is something I have a fair bit of, but
it's not my main focus. My main focus is what can I do to make things better? If you think negative all the time, it doesn't end well for anyone.
And even the anger, it takes a long time. You know, you have to keep reminding yourself, don't you.
You do you do, And that's my biggest thing, remind myself. You know what if I do something, what happens, I go to jail, or I'll end up in court myself or whatever. So focus on the things that will help, not the things that will hinder.
Someone said to me, it's what is helpful over what is harmful.
And that's that's exactly the philosophy. What's going to help and what's going to hinder the process and being there for your families is something that I'm all about now, is if post football is being there as much as I can and getting the family through.
I suppose has it taught you anything.
He's taught me. I can deal with a bit, I suppose you know I can. I've always known, you know, I can handle injuries and pain and stuff like that. But emotions and stuff like that I can take a bit on. And Yeah, but aside from that, I think it's still I still don't know how I feel. Still Probably I suppose, like I said, I don't know how to talk too well. So, yeah, talking is like a strong point in mind. So the feelings and what I feel is yeah, more I try to point out more towards how I can help.
I mean, I suppose it's just bloody hard to make sense of.
It was, yeah, and making sense of it for me more so than anyone. That Dad and Brennan saw each other just about every day, where I didn't get to do that. So that's that's the regret that I was talking about before. The one regret has not been able to spend enough time with Brendan.
Do you have one story that I was spending time with him that stands out to you?
One that definitely stands out. He house sat one of our properties. He would have been just eighteen. I reckon and I said, have some mates, but no parties. Yeah, no worries. He had to feed the low We had some horses out there. Well, I don't know. I can't remember where we went. I think we went to I can't remember. We went away for a few weeks anyway, came back in the house of our house is down the back the main the small house at the front
of the manager's house. I suppose that's where he was staying. There were motorbike tracks up the walls of this house. There will beer cans everywhere. The fire pit was melted. That he mus had the biggest party and he and I said get now and clean up. You meant your little shit, and he did. He came out, he was I think you still hung over from whatever the party you had, and came out and cleaned it all up. But yeah, I'd probably let him do it now though I knew what was going to happen.
How do you feel about having spoken about it as somebody who doesn't speak about it a lot.
I don't feel too much different, Like I suppose it's more so being if this was to happen to someone else in there, feeling a bit of anger and regret and that kind of stuff. Is there's other ways to help rather than just get upset. Getting upset isn't always the best thing. I'll show you, show that you care, and show that what they meant, But getting upset doesn't fix everything. It's so what can you actually do to help someone else, because that helps you as well. That's
it definitely definitely helped me. Helping Dad and the family get through is what helped me get through.
Thank you for doing this.
I really appreciate I can see how physically tough it is for you to talk about it, so I do really appreciate it.
You're right, Yeah, I'm good. I'm good. You know you probably wouldn't have seen me before. I suppose it doesn't happen very often.
No, it doesn't, but it's it's you're a.
Human, Alisa, my wife doesn't always think that, but.
Thank you.
That's another thing, not that I think being adder. It's definitely brought our family together a lot more in the sense that Alisa definitely holds her siblings closer now I hold my siblings closer. And as much as I want Brendan back to be around, to be around my kids, mate, maybe not to see him with his kids. It has definitely brought us closer as a family, I suppose. So there is no wins out of it, but that is one win that we've had as a family.
This.
We're definitely a tighter.
Group and a lot more present when you are.
There, exactly. Yeah. Christmas is a yeah, there's a lot more presents at Christmas. We want to we want to enjoy it, We want to enjoy each other's company. A lot more and do things together a lot more rather than just work all the time.
Thank you for having me at your beautiful property and for sharing something that he's so intimate and tough.
To talk about it. I really do appreciate it. I always knew you were a tough bugger. This is a bit different to the first interview we ever did at that surf shop, but I appreciate that you gave me the time, you know, fifteen years on or whatever it is.
I don't think I shaved that then. Thanks Valance time.
Thanks for listening to this episode of ordinarily speaking, I hope you got something out of it. Once again, thank you to Hayden and his family for sharing their story. I'm in awe of their strength and resilience. Please remember if this chat was triggering for you, there is help out there. Lifeline and Beyond Blue are just a couple of places you can go
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