UAP: Where do we go from here?

The goal of this podcast is to provide credible news and information to ground this cosmic conversation. Welcome to Open minds UAP News. My name is Alejandro Rojas and I'll be your host that Open minds YOUAP News. Some of you may have been longtime listeners to the show. In fact, we've been doing what We launched a show probably thirteen fifteen years ago, something like that, and I've got exciting

news on the next episode. My co host from the original Open Mind jop News, Jason McClellan, will be joining us on the next episode. The format for this show going forward will be to go over the latest UFO news. We'll have a guest or I'll go over some information. In fact, on this episode, I'm going to kind of ground us on what is the status of things, how do we move forward, what I think is important moving forward,

and what you can expect from this show. The last segment of each episode, we'll look at some videos where we either can't explain what it is and it's kind of an educational moment for all of us for what's going on in our skies, or more exciting, perhaps some videos at least that I can't explain that either you can help me with or perhaps we'll just go on explained and that's exciting. That's what we're looking for. Most of these videos will come from the Enigma app. It's

an app where you can report UFO sightings. And what's cool is because it's at base, we're getting a lot of videos. I work with Enigma as a consultant and every day I look at the cool videos that are

coming across. So that's why I have all these videos to look at, and of course I think, as all review momentarily that you know, when it comes to this topic, one of the most important things we can do is try to use center data such as the data we get through our phones to get that data analyzed and then hopefully, you know, get scientific analysis and papers written so we can have a consensus among the scientific community that at least one of these cases is truly anomalous.

But first, let's go ahead and get into the news. I do want to inform people that if you're not following Open Minds on social media, you should, because if you see here on the right, you're going to see our Facebook posts and these are all the latest breaking news on UAP, updated on a nearly daily basis. But let's get into it. This is a new paper that

just came out on Nature, really important. Nature is one of the most respective scientific journals, and this one is about UFOs, not necessarily in the light that many of us want to see it, but I wanted to review this news because I think it's really important, because this kind of sets the tone for the show that I and as people know my perspective, but it gives us more guidance on how to be careful and credible and make sure that we're sticking to science, so we're not

just creating more conspiracies based off of information that really doesn't help anything. It doesn't help us get to the truth. It just keeps us chasing our tails, so we're not focused on gathering real data to really understand what's going on with this phenomenon. This paper is of course titled Exploring Expert Figures in Alien related UFO Conspiracy Theories, and they kind of review how these conspiracies theories get created.

But the beginning of this paper goes over the whole idea of conspiracies altogether, for example nine to eleven conspiracies. In particular, it goes over conspiracies such as vaccines. It talks about how scientists, and you know, the belief of individual scientists is kind of conflated to verify scientifically some point of view, or papers that just have zero credibility being touted as science when they're not. The idea of autism being created by vaccines as an example of that.

And yes, we're going to be looking at real science here, not conspiracy theories popular ideas. We're going to be looking at the data, and the data shows that that's not the case. But a paper written by some non credible people got out and it gets touted as science when it's not, And of course that happens in this field a lot. The other thing that this paper goes over is scientific validation versus consensus, and you often hear me

talking about that. Just because a scientist comes out and says they believe X, Y or z, it doesn't verify the phenomena that they're referring to. When we're talking about science and really understanding, we're talking about a consensus among the scientific community. So what we have to do as a UFO community or those interested in UAP and going forward.

I'll use that term mostly, which kind of essentially really means the same thing as UFO, but these days is looked upon as kind of the credible or scientific investigation of UFOs. But a consensus is what we're looking for. So what you want is a paper to be written, You want a community of scientists to look at it and to agree or to argue and debate it back and forth to be able to get to some sort of consensus. That's the goal, not just having one person

here or there. And when it comes to UFOs, a lot of times you have scientists that are talking about fields that they don't really have expertise in and trying to make claims about these things. So this kind of goes over that. Some of the other things that it goes over is looking at social media. They found that there was a big problem with conspiratorial communities, especially UFO communities, sowing distrust and authorities, something that I've always talked against

that I think is really dangerous and unwarranted. In my experience, I seek to work with authorities to see what they have to say. We'll interview people who are in positions of authority and in that they work for institutions that are credible. I've always sought to do that and get their insight and my experience, these people are very genuine, they're looking for answers, They're devoted to looking for answers.

They're not prone to at least that wanting to just kind of make information out there and push an angle without that evidence. It also talks about the urgent need for enhanced scientific literacy and critical thinking, something I think is absolutely necessary, a very important point, and that's kind of the whole point of this show is to try to educate ourselves to enhance our scientific literacy so we understand what science is and how things work and why.

You know, there's a perspective that you may not understand uh, and also critical thinking, you know, as opposed to just kind of going with whatever is popular out there using your brain, you know, to try to sess out the real kind of media information. That's the perspective that we're going to be looking at. And when I get into my talk and just a little bit, I'll go over more of how that works specifically for what's going on in the UFO community and how that's important. But I

think this paper is really really good. I think it's great. It doesn't really talk about the evidence or whether UFOs are a thing or what they might be. It's more talking about how how alien related UFO conspiracies start and gets spread. All right. Next, so getting into some of what's out there and kind of an example, here is some of the news that is coming from the media on this event. So here is Jeremy Corbel. You know,

I've interviewed him many times. Of course he goes way back with open minds, but we always don't necessarily agree on things, and that's certainly the case here where they're putting out this new video saying that it's an unidentified tic TAC object, that it was off the coast of

California in twenty twenty three when this occurred. I'm going to go back so we can look at the object a little more in free s frame on it, and the reason being that so this object looks like a TikTok in this video, but there's a problem that get and something that gets lost in this messaging. And this is where it's really difficult and unfortunate the way a lot of these people are putting this information out and it doesn't help the situation. In fact, it hurts it

many times. And what I mean by that is this is a fleer video. We should by now start to educate ourselves and know something about flair. Flair is where we're looking infrared radar. What that means is that this is a camera that's looking for heat signatures. In this case, you have a tic tac shaped or an oblong heat signature that is not an object. And that's what's really unfortunate for people like Jeremy and others to go out and say this is a tic tac object is completely inaccurate.

We know this because we've looked at different cases. In fact, there's some flear cases that I think are mysterious and great and we'll review those over time. We have in the past, but you know, we've got to make sure we know what we're looking at to understand the sensor data that we're analyzing. In this case, this is only a heat signature. No indication here at all that we

can see the actual shape of the physical object. So we don't know if that's a tic Tac shaped object, and it's inaccurate to go out and say it is a tic Tac shaped object when we just don't have that information with this video alone. The other thing with this video is uh that it just doesn't show the object doing anything anomalous. So it comes down to and

we'll hear this a lot a lack of data. We don't really have enough data to show what's going on with whatever this object is, let alone to say that it's something anomalous or you know, something that could not or is not man made. Another problem with this new story is that there are a lot of alleged witnesses who saw this or that, and going forward, I'm not going to be covering a lot of whistleblowers and people unidentified people saying this or that because it's not reliable information.

What can you do that with that. We've been getting that for decades. That's what I've been covering and writing about, and it gets us nowhere. So I'm you know this, obviously, I'm very critical of this situation. I think it's great that these guys are out there taking an interest in this and looking for data and collecting this data, but I wish it'd be a little bit more disciplined about how they release this data. You know, I'll be going over well, I'll be going over more about this in

detail in just a minute. Another case sets out there, and I should back up a bit because I don't have it on here, but there was a group called the Skywatchers. They also have released some videos lately. But I've released a video and I'll put a link to it up here on the top ten and Enigma videos at re received according to me in twenty twenty four. And I feel that our videos are more interesting than what the Skywatchers got. Of course, we're collecting video that

people are recording, mostly with their phones. That's what they got. The problem is that I think that they're just a little newer to this, so they are mistaking balloons and other things for UAP. The other thing that they do is that they say that they try to psychically call in aliens and then they get these objects. That's been going on for a long time too. I'll do a video in the future here, we'll all attempt to do that.

But here's my prediction, because this is what I've experienced myself going out in the field many many times to look for UAP, is that when you go out and you meditate, you see things in the sky. You see planes or balloons or things that you can't understand that you record and can look like what the skywatcher's got or that we get at. I think a lot of times you can also go out there and not meditate and get the same thing, still get odd strange things.

So I just don't feel that the the meditation or the psychic connection has been established. I think what I just described is the sort of work where you have a control and then you do your experiment, you know, is where you can kind of validate that sort of thing. That's really kind of how science works. So I wish, although these people are kind of espousing to do science, that they would do that sort of thing to verify whether there's some veracity to what they're saying, this is

the kind of thing we should be doing. Here's a paper in Science Alert, an article in fair AI camera proposed to scan Earth's skys for science of alien visitors. In fact, that's what my talk is going to be about, why this is the sort of thing we should do. We need to gather data. If we don't have enough data, if all of these cases come down to a lack of data, then obviously we need to gather more data. How do we do that. We put out there more

sophisticated technology sensors. So in this case, they are using what others are using out there, and I'm going to review some of the programs that are out there that are similar. But this one they call Daylek because their system that they've created looks like a Daylek from Doctor Who. But what they have is a system where they have an all sky camera, a bunch of other cameras, a bunch of other sensors that are detecting a bunch of

information about UAP. So they can deploy these things and then hopefully capture something, and when they do, they've got a lot more telemetry and then just the video. As it says here it's multimodal, it's multi spectrum, it's ground based. And this is really this is another great point. And this is kind of frustrating because it's a preview of what I'm going to be reviewing with you all later.

But Aviy Lobe says here, often in the US government data is classified, either because it was collected by classified sensors or because it is not fully understood and could potentially be relevant for national security. When in doubt, they decide not to release data. Alvi Lobe is a professor at Harvard who is actually in charge of the Galileo Project,

which is a group that is putting this together. Incidentally, next month, I will be on a panel at Arizona State University with Abby Lobe, Micwest, and Lincoln Tai and we'll be talking about this sort of thing. But I agree with them one hundred percent. If they're not going to give us data, then we've got to go out there and get the data ourselves. And so that's what

this is about, is them deploying a new system. So a really great article, and this is a direction that we need to go next an ad All right, let's see what's here. Here's more science and I love this UFOs in space is it possible to launch a flying saucer into space and return it to Earth? And what he's talking about is the shape a saucer. Is that really a shape that is conducive to flying around in

our atmosphere or in space. He analyzes different projects that are similar to discs, and he talks about, you know, acceleration, whether or not it's a shape that kind of lends itself to being able to provide lift that sort of thing. So it's a very interesting article, something that I think would be interesting for everybody to look at. But this is a great one. This is just from today, or actually this video is going to launch tomorrow, So this

is from Wednesday. So a really exciting piece of news that came forward. And this is scientist hailed the strongest evidence so far for life beyond our Solar System. So an astrophysicist team say, observation of chemical compounds maybe the

tipping point in search for extraterrestrial life. So the James Web Telescope is able to look at planets at vast distances and they can use different things such as the coloring and other things to detect like what sort of gases are in the atmosphere in this case, and this planet is called K two eighteen B. Hopefully they come up with a more fun name than that. This planet is showing possibilities of having gases that are similar to ours. They call it a chemical fingerprints similar to those on

Earth that have produced life. So they're saying that this right now is the best evidence that there could be life out there, extraterrestrial life. I think this is really important because if scientists, whether that beyond Mars, the Moon, or K two eighteen B, I think if they discover even micro or the possibility that life did exist on

another planet, that's going to be really important. I think if people discover, hey, there actually is some life out there, then it will lend people to think, well, how advanced is that life? Where else can that life be? And I hope that will also try to begin to invigorate people to or begin to influence people to do more research into UFOs and UAP and investigate those the way that Avlobe and Galileo are and other organizations or the way that I'm going to be proposing here coming up

in just a minute. So this is really exciting news However, you always need to temper your expectations when it comes to science or otherwise. If you hear things that are too good to be true, especially in UFOs, it's most likely they are not only too good to be true, unfortunately, sometimes they're just flat out life. In this case, the NPR story's title is is this a hunt for life on another world? Or just a lot of hot air?

The article is similar to other articles that are coming out in the New York Times and the Wall Street Journal, So lots of really important news outlets are covering this story, but this one they're also saying, you know, this isn't completely confirmed, so hold on, We're still doing work to confirm this. But if we can confirm this, it's going to be really exciting. And it does bring me to

a quote one of the scientists said. She said, this is one of those cases where extraordinary claims are going to require extraordinary evidence, and we may know that. There are some people, especially in the UFO field, who don't like that, saying they're like, that's not it's not how science works. Science doesn't require extraordinary evidence. I completely disagree, and pleasure you're looking at the term extraordinary the idea that life is out there and we can confirm it.

I think that's extraordinary. So any evidence we're going to have to that end is going to be extraordinary kind of by nature. But let's even back up a little bit and say, well, why does something Why do certain categories of scientific discovery need more evidence than others. Well, if they're remember we're getting back to this scientific consensus.

Scientists don't want to be wrong, and you know, there are times where we get really excited about something that could be extraordinary and then it turns out to be wrong, and that's a huge letdown and it can be really damaging to that field of study. So you always need to temper expectations and you need to be really, really sure. So in this case, they are going to be looking for more evidence and for this extraordinary claim. It's just

the way it goes. If you're looking for a scientific consensus, we're all humans, you're going to need some extraordinary evidence. Sorry, that's the nature of things. But it's probably better it's that way, because if we go off of bad information, we can make big mistakes, and we don't want to be doing that. We need to confirm these sort of extraordinary possibilities. So that's the news for this week. Exciting

stuff for all of these news items. If there's any updates, I'll be sure to be letting you know in future episodes, and I'll bring on some people friends and researchers to talk about some of that news and experts that have something to do with that news that we're reviewing, including people from galawat Leo or otherwise. But next, let's get

into my presentation. So this presentation I actually delivered at Phoenix MoveOn last week, and I really kind of felt that it was a good outline for my perspective looking for some common ground and looking for opportunities where we don't have to sit and wait for others to do the work and hopefully come up with something and we can do it ourselves. So I called this UFO Videos and the Need for UAP Data Collection and Analysis the

UFO Video part. I reviewed some really cool Enigma videos that we got a lot of those you could see in that top ten video I talked about earlier. But I will also at the after we're done with this, we'll end with reviewing some cool Enigma sidings, so stay tuned for that. But let's take a look here. First

of all, who am I? Just in case you're tuning into this new if you're from the Den of Geek group, Den of Geek is now sponsoring I'm partnering with them on this podcast, So if you're new to my show, who am I? I am the host of course, of Open Buying UAP News. I'm an editor and webmaster at Openminds dot tv. I'm a consultant for Enigma Labs, the app that we got these videos on that we'll be

looking at later. I'm also the founder of UAP Discovery of five oh one C three, and I'll be talking more about what we do there in just a minute. And I'm a blogger and freelance journalist, so I've been writing about this topic for a long time. I've also been writing about science and sci fi, a lot of that on Huffington Post and much of it also on

Den of Geek and others. Also. Formerly, some of the stuff that I've done in the past is I've been the director of education and a spokesperson for the Mutual UFO Network they're headquarters. Also, i was a host and coordinator of the International UFO Congress. Maybe some of you got to go to that, but that was kind of old school, one of the bigger conferences, and a lot of people say one of the best UFO conferences in the past, and that's me and my Like I said,

I'm on a lot of television shows. I've been on Ancient Aliens quite a bit, and one of the time last times I was on was I brought my dog because he was really old, and they were really cool about it, and they were like, hey, bring him on set so we could get a picture and everything, and that's what this is. So that was a lot of fun I love how the backgrounds of the slide kind

of fit the background of the show. It's kind of funny, not intended, but the point that I really want to make, and this is what my point is a lot of people think that I'm kind of nacying and I'm saying, oh, you know, these people are coming up with bad stuff or their stuff is no good or whatever. I'm not

necessarily saying that. What I'm saying is that eufology, the search for the meaning behind UFOs or what's going on with the UFOs, its biggest asset is you you can do something, you can do more than just listen to You can do more than just you know, get on social media and hopefully are not fighting with people like crazy, because that's what social media, unfortunately is turned into. Stop

that it's not helping anything. What we need to do is work together and you need to hit the ground and do what you can do to figure out what's going on. I like to say this, and if, of course this is to a local move on group, which is a pretty big group, but I've been you know, speaking to this group for a very long time. But I talked to them. You know, we were here before UFOs were cool, and we'll be here even if it fades from public attention again. And that goes for me too.

You know, I've been doing this a long time. A lot of us have, some of you who listen to my show and our longtime listeners. You know, you know that we've been here a long time. We're going to

be here a long time. We've seen a lot of people come to this topic recently and then leave, and then whenever there's a new news cycle, there's a bunch that come and they get all rowdy and crazy out something, and then when they get disappointed, they all leave, but a lot of us are going to be here for a while, and when I'm going to be sharing with you our learnings from just you know, doing this for for such a long time and the type of things

I see. And this is why I say, you know, temper your expectations, because I've been hearing disclosures around the corner, you know, for years, for literally every year, there's somebody a big name in the UFO world, disclosures around the corner. I've got an anonymous witness who says this or that

and nothing comes of it. And I know a lot of you have gotten frustrated lately because you know, we got all this big news and there are these big you know, whistleblowers coming out and saying we're going to find this and that, and nothing's come of it. No surprise to me. That's why people got frustrated with me. And when I'm like, hey, guys, chill out, I'm skeptical anything's going to happen. And it didn't. But people got

frustrated with me kind of sharing that expectation. And I'm glad I b my expectations and didn't get myself excited about any of this because I learned the hard way. Getting really excited and let down is no fun. But if you temper your expectations, focus on on the road ahead,

you know, we can make some progress. But let's look at some of the areas where information could come from or where people are expecting information to come from, and I'll kind of review, you know, some of the aspects of this information that I think people aren't paying as close attention to as maybe they should. So for example,

ASAP and the UAP Task Force. So who's that? Well, that New York Times article in twenty seventeen that came out and kind of blew up everything that the government had a secret program that was looking into UFOs, even though that article was wrong and it said the name of that program that received all that money was a TIP, the Advanced Aerospace Threat Identification Program. That wasn't the name, and that was actually a nickname for the bigger group.

It said this group was some kind of official secret UFO program. That wasn't true. Most of this article was really really off. The actual program's name was os APP, the Advanced aerospaceed Weapons System Application Program, And what this program was built to do, on its face was to analyze weapon systems, theoretical science and weapon systems that could be created and deployed by our enemies, or perhaps something that we could deploy had nothing to do with UFOs. How do I

know this? Go look at the contract, Go look at much of the information out there, including the members of this group who said we wanted it to look like it was kind of this mundane theoretical science research sort of group or project, when actually we were going to take that money and go look at UFOs. You know, Harry Reid and other senators put their blessing, they put

this together. They were part of this whole plan. Even Robert Bigelow, a Nevada real estate tycoon who's really into the paranormal and has funded different paranormal programs for a long time. He owned famously the Skinwalker Ranch. He's the one who started investigating that. Of course, there's a big History Channel show on that where there's all this paranormal stuff happening. That's where this all comes from. These guys decided, Hey, we want to investigate all of this weird paranormal stuff

at Skinwalker Ranch that we think that we're seeing. And UFOs. But when they put together this program, it was under the guys that there wasn't it was not a UFO research group. The other problem, of course, Skinwalker's weird. They wanted to do all this weird paranormal research stuff. But another member, the head scientists, his name was how put Off.

Now how put Off was the guy who helped create remote viewing, which is essentially a psychic kind of law enforcement technique or intelligence gathering, where with the CIA and the Stanford Researched Institute they developed this program where they felt they could teach these remote viewers how to look for stuff and find, you know, solve crimes, solve cool cases.

They claim that they did solve some cases. I've interviewed, you know, in my huge archives of previous versions of this very show, Joe McGonagall and others who were involved with that program. Joe McGonagall was supposedly the most prolific or the best at it, and he said he was only right twenty percent of the time. It doesn't sound like much, and it doesn't sound like much more than chance, and somewhat people will argue it wasn't more than chance.

But either way, this is weird stuff. This is weird, fringy stuff. Now I say this having spent many, many years defending this group and defending their work because Robert Bigelow, for the longest time in the uf FO field, was the bad guy. Everybody loved to hate them. Everybody love to hate these guys. Their government. They're lying to us, they're the secret keepers all of this kind of thing.

But I knew all those guys. I've interviewed them, I've worked with them, and although I do not agree with their findings, well I do agree that I don't agree that they can prove anything that they say is existing. They don't have findings. They have stories, and they have things that they say allegedly happen, and they say we can prove this or that, but they don't. But my point was, let them do their thing. I think it's great that they're out doing the research. I wish that

they would temper expectations. Their big thing is to overpromise and underdeliver. Same goes with you know, I would have to say Jeremy Napp, George or Jeremy Corbellen and George Knapp kind of in that group where you know, a lot of big promises and they don't give us the full story. They often gloss over and spin these stories. What do I mean by that? We could get into more detail, but I won't want to bumm you guys

out too much. But stories like Bob lazare who has a history of lying and criminality, and for some reason they don't cover any of that, which speaks to the credibility of this One soul witness who claims that he

saw aliens at Area fifty one. Interestingly, he said this after some guy who said who worked for the Air Force and will go over this in a minute, said he was spreading disinformation and he said this for the very first time on LIFETV, that there's aliens at Area fifty one and they took this roswell crashed alien spacecraft to Area fifty one where they took over the base and we're battling people. All this crazy stuff this guy says on TV, which he says is disinformation his claim.

Within weeks, Bob Lazaar is out there claiming that, oh yeah, I worked at Area fifty one on the spacecraft and with these aliens and talked about all these alien and battles and stuff. Information he's walked back since you know, it's just not very credible or substantial information. And I'm rooting for these guys. I want them to financers, but they haven't. Like I say here, anomalies confirmed zero, they have not confirmed anything. And I do want to back

up to that last bullet point real quick. When it comes to government confusion about OSAP and a tip, you know them claiming, oh, they did look at UFOs. They didn't look at UFOs. They weren't an official group. They did look at UFOs, and the governments admits that. And this is where people get confer because there's nuance here. They looked into UFOs, but they weren't supposed to. This wasn't an official UFO research group, which makes that New

York Times even more wrong. This was a Advanced Aerospace Weapons Application project where they were looking into advanced weapons systems, but behind the scenes they were looking into UAP. That's the confusion, and this is where people get mixed up. So it's absolutely accurate when the government says, and at least what I'm speaking to is the evidence we have right now, we have no evidence. If you look at the contract in the paperwork, this wasn't a UFO program.

It was on the back end. People didn't know about it. And that's kind of difficult too, because it's disingenuous, dis ingenuous for someone to say, oh, I was hiding from the government when I was working on a government program that I was working on UFOs. I was telling the government I was working on these Advanced Weapons system's papers. And then later on when the government says, you weren't looking into UFOs in that program, we didn't tell you to do that, to say, oh, you're lying, I was too.

You know, that's silly. You were the one hiding that information, and now you're blaming the government for not knowing that. Finally, the UAP Task Force, the UAP Task Force was obviously it's in their name, an official program to look into UFOs. Most of the members of the u I shouldn't say that because I don't know that for sure, but many of the primary members of the UAP Task Force, including the head of the UAP Task Force, worked with Robert

Bigelow on Skinwalker and other places with ASAP. The head scientist for the UAP Task Force is now the lead scientists on the skin Hunt for the Skinwalker television show on the History Channel, So you know, they're totally connected and they're still chasing this weird paranormal stuff. But this

is what's really interesting. The UAP Task Force were the first to write an official paper on the state of UAP for the government, and their conclusion was, when it comes to aliens, we don't have enough data to prove what's going on. This is difficult because now these people are coming out and saying we know it's aliens, and I think that they're speaking about their own personal experiences, which is completely fair. Who am I to say that

their personal experiences didn't really happen. I don't know. Maybe they did, and that's probably what's driving them. A lot of these people in this kind of bucket on the left that I'm talking about have had personal experiences that we can't verify where they felt that they've had, you know, interactions with wolfmen and Dino Beaver's famously, and being abducted by aliens or whatnot. I can't say whether or not that that has occurred or not. I personally find these

guys that I've worked with. I like these guys. I think they're, you know, their hearts in the right place for the most part. As far as I know that they're just trying to investigate and prove something that they think is real. But my point is we have to be careful about the way we go about that. And I think this was an absolutely accurate statement when these guys admitted they don't have enough data to say it's

aliens or what it is. Erow, this is the latest version of a UAP research group that for the Defense Department. This is the All Domain Anomaly Research Office, all domain

meaning that. And this was an important point because you know, there was some stonewalling coming across where they were saying, you know, we want to look at UAP, what about what's going on in space and being told well, UAP means unidentified aerial phenomena, So space is not aerial, it's not in the air, so that's none of your business.

Congress made it very specific that UAP means unidentified anomalous phenomena, and that includes objects from every domain and trans medium objects, meaning that the domains of the atmosphere, space, water, you know, those are the separate domains trans medium meaning objects that then go in between all of those domains. So objects that go from the air into the water, or from the water into the air, or from the air into space or maybe all of those things. So that's why

the all domain is in there. What has Aero said. Aero has said UAP are real. There are real phenomena and something that we should take seriously. People who say that Aero says UAP are false, even congress members like in the House, people who are part of these disclosure groups who are supposed to be leading the UFO field on all of this, Congressman Luna, are saying things like Aero says UAP are not real. That's not true, and you're not educating yourself on the very topic that you're

trying to champion here. No aliens are separate from UAP. UAP has unidentified anomalist phenomena, and Arrow is very clear that they are real aliens. However, is what they say they don't have enough data for, just like the UAP task for us, so they agree that we don't have enough data to say that aliens are involved. Arrow also was supposed to come up with a historical report when they got into the history of UAP, such as Bluebook.

I think that's a complete fail. That part of their report was really kind of littered with errors and things that were wrong. I think that they need to take another look at that and clean that up because I don't think that was an accurate representation of what was going on historically. I think that, you know, there was seemingly kind of some whitewashing when it comes to Bluebook. They got mostly military cases. They had twenty thousand cases.

There were seven hundred cases when Bluebook closed in nineteen sixty nine that they could not explain. And this is after thorough investigation where they felt they did have information. Seven hundred cases. These are really good cases of military people police law enforcement having you know, multiple people law enforcement chasing objects over several counties. These are really good cases.

And this is what I mean. And actually this term was used by the Air Force when there was an incursion over Washington, DC and airport in Washington, d C. Having on several occasions UFOs flying over the airport and jets coming in and chasing them away or really not chasing them away. That jets say we were outclassed by what was ever flying out there, just like our jet pilots have said more recently. You know, that's very credible

stuff that warrants this worth a look. And I think that it's unfortunate that you know about more recent cases they say, hey, this makes it worth a look. A

lot of this historical cases make it that way too. However, when they did review the history of ASAP and this alleged project ConA that never went anywhere because they didn't have any of the alleged again this ASAPP group that did not provide the evidence that they claimed to have, and that's really frustrating, imagine, you know, and this is where it creates a lot of this friction. Quick claiming things you don't have. Why do that, I don't understand.

Just do your analysis, do some real regular science and say hey, we don't it doesn't indicate this, but it doesn't indicate this. Here are some possibilities. Instead of sexying it up and sensationalizing and saying we've got this, we've got that and then it not turning out to be the case, stop it, you know. And that's what happened. They said, oh, we've got evidence of materials of from extraterrestrial spacecraft or unknown craft, and sure enough they didn't.

And then ASAPP this whole history I reviewed where they even say, you know, OSP was not tasked to look into UFOs and paranormal things. But the uh DA agent who was in charge of the program uh allowed them to and participated in doing that stuff, and so they did it, you know, and and that's what happened the historical So that part of the report I think is accurate from my and I've got for experience with a lot of that. At least, I saw a lot of

this happening in real time. And you know, we've been able to examine the paperwork. So far what they've said seems to be accurate when it comes to the more recent, contemporary side of that report. The older stuff was really bad. The historical report is also incomplete. It was due completely on June twenty twenty four. So far they submitted part one, but we have no idea when they're going to do

part two. That's important because there should be some other interesting information in part two and I'll look at that in a second. But my point being here is that, well, let me get into the next screen. What if either of these groups actually do find something, well, just like Jeremy released today or this week or others, what is everybody going to say, you got any proof? You know? And that's what people should say you know, prove it. And I don't think any any of us are going

to take anybody's word for it. Certainly the scientific community isn't going to say, okay, Arrow, you say you've got evidence of something anomalous, show it, prove it. So you're going to have to have proof. You're still going to need to do the science. But what can the government responsibly share? Should we expect anything from the government, And this is where we talked about this earlier, and Abby

Lobe had a great quote in that article earlier. No, you know, I don't think, but look at when I say responsibly. Let's say that you are in the government. So if you come across an object that you don't know what it is, an aircraft or some sort of craft or technology, that's going to go into the Foreign Technology Division, which is where it's supposed to go, where they analyze it try to figure out whose it is.

But maybe even more importantly, and I've interviewed people in defense who say what takes priority over figuring out whose it is is how do we build this ourselves, how do we back engineer this, and how do we take this technology and exploit this technology as much as we can ourselves to enhance our technology. If you're part of an organization doing that, how do you responsibly say something you don't know what its origins is, is not Chinese or Russian or not, you know, an enemy of ours?

It would be difficult and possible to say that. So can they responsibly even give us information without you know, tipping their hand or giving classified information. It makes it really difficult for the government to share information. And I don't expect that we will see much from them, and to be honest, we haven't seen anything from them. All of these videos that they've been analyzing have been retrieved

from they've been leaked. They've been either leaked by the ASAPP group or you know, one of them was leaked to some researchers I was working with. The most recent analysis they did on the Aguada Puerto Rico case that was leaked from Homeland Security. These are leak cases, so they're not sharing anything as is. They're just looking at stuff that's already been leaked, and I don't expect them

to share anything. In fact, the pr person for the DoD when it comes to UAP, Susan Goff, has said that they are not incumbent to share anything that they're working on or their findings that they do not plan to share anything. So I don't think we're going to

see much there. The other difficult part is disinformation. This is something I harp on a lot, and we'll continue to harp on, and Congress mandated that in the aerow report they include disinformation any instances where the US government actively obfuscated or you know, put out bad information about UFOs, and AERO needs to address that. It's very important, and I've got cases where there is something there, there's something

to write about here. In fact, the CIA wrote a paper in the nineties about how they spread disinformation about UFOs in the past. So the CIA was working with the Air Force when they were working on Project Bluebook and investigating UFOs, but they didn't want the public to know about it, so they lied to the public about it, and they asked the Air Force to lie about it

as well. When it came to the U two space aircraft, which was created by Lockheed Skunk Works, which is what was actually going on at Area fifty one in the fifties. The U two started to be tested in the late fifties and when it was tested. You know, this was a spy plane that was flying really high with camera systems that could take pictures of like Russian assets, without the Russians being able to send missiles that high to take it down. Eventually they did develop them, and famously

shot went down and captured a pilot. But the CIA had light about this, and when youtubes were seen by commercial airliners, because commercial airliners are like, hey, I see something really high up there, what is that? And they'd be like, oh, reported to Blue Book, it's a UFO. They wanted people to think it was a UFO, like I said. The CIA had the US Air Force also live. But in this report that the CIA wrote where they reviewed all of this history of their deception, they concluded

that all of this made everything worse. They should have just told the truth about it. Eventually researchers started to realize the CIA was involved. The Robertson Panel, for example, was a CIA group that people knew met to talk about UFOs, but the CIA kept denying it. So it was really more and more people started to realize that the CIA was involved, yet they kept denying it, and sure enough created a bunch of conspiracy theories and just

made the situation worse, as this paper concluded. The other thing, and this is something that I cover quite a bit that you can find on Open Minds, and I will continue to cover because I really think the Air Force needs to answer to This is another disinformation situation, which is Richard Doty. Richard Doty worked for the US Air Force Office of Special Investigations in the eighties at Kirtland Air Force Base. During this time, according to him, he

was putting out disinformation, false information. That information included things like that there were aliens at Area fifty one, that there was this scroup Majestic twelve that was hiding all of the secrets. Sorry, people, these are total bs. They were made up by Richard Doty, enforced by people like Rob Bob Lazaar who lied about it and created these fantasies about it. This is all well documented. I've got

articles on Open Minds. You can find I think a link even on the front page to my open letter to the Air Force about this, because he was really committing crimes and saying that he did this at the behest of THISDIA agent called Falcon. Interesting enough, in that television show that I told you about earlier where Dody actually went on television and spouted all this crazy stuff

aliens like strawberries. You know, there's aliens and battling the military at Area of fifty one and all this crazy stuff. He said this on TV while he was anonymous and he was blacked out, and he was using the name Falcon. How do I know for one hundred percent it was Dody. Go on IMDb right now, look up this nineteen eighty nine television show UFOs Live, and you'll see in the credits Falcon is Richard Dody right there in the credits. It was obvious if you know who Dody is, many

of you. For some reason, the UFO field still likes to interview him, so silly. This all goes back to that credibility in that paper about the UFO conspiracies and stuff. But yeah, people still air interview and take him seriously for some reason. But these were all lies. This was if Dody is telling the truth, and I don't know

that he is. If Dody was telling the truth, and he started to do this at the behest of his boss, he said that he did this because there was an engineer or a actual vendor of theirs who is providing technical equipment, who lived near Kirtland Air Force Base. His office was right there actually, and he was recording videos

and getting signals from the base. He thought they were aliens and yous, but according to Doty, he was actually recording stuff from top secret projects that they were doing so in order to throw them off, they made him believe that in UFOs and aliens, he was actually entrenched with the UFO community, so he was spreading this stuff out to the UFO community. Doty also brought someone and he lied about this. Linda Howe to the bait at Kurtland Air Force Base, gave her a bunch of disinformation.

She believes this really wild stuff about Jesus being an alien and stuff that he gave her is real. But he often denies that he ever did this gave her this information, but sometimes he doesn't. He changes his story on a regular basis. But my point being is why did this OSI agent active OSI agent for many many years during the eighties, actively put out disinformation and then immediately after he retires goes on this television show and shares all this bs with people. How could he get

away with this? How could the Air Force not have known and how could he have gotten away with it? And then if, of course he was doing this as an official project, well then he was committing crimes for the government. This is a big deal. But this is another area that they can look into. So there's stuff there to write about. Disinformation with the government we do know about without getting into crazy conspiracy stuff that is not verified. And I've got, by the way, FOYA documents

and everything documenting everything that I said. You can find it on the website. Here's just a little bit of information. This is that article that the CIA wrote that I was talking about. You can find it on the CIA website. But this is a direct quote from it when they're

talking about the U two disinformation. This led the Air Force to make misleading and accept this statement to the public in order to allay public fears and to protect an extraordinarily sensitive national skecurity project, of course, you two project, But they lied. It's right there and literally black and white.

And this is what's funny too, because a U two aircraft was painted silver, so no wonder it was reflecting, you know, way up there in the sky, and it was flying about like like twice as high as commercial aircraft were flying at the time, so it was way up there. They no longer painted them silver. Soon after the testing, you know, they started paying a matte black

so they wouldn't be reflective. Is theara there there? I'll go over this possibility really quickly, meaning, you know, while Aloandro, is there even something to the UFO mystery. I believe that there is. I think most of you listening probably believe that there probably is. I don't know for sure. I can't prove it, but that's what we're seeking to do. But what are the possibilities. Remember, there's more than aliens when it comes to possibilities, even with exotic possibilities. It

could be aliens, could be people from the future. There's a professor at Montana Tech who has written a book and talks about this, and he's done research to justify his or to buttress you know, his argument other dimensions. There's actually a lot of scientists who feel there's you know, more of a probability that we can travel interdimensionally than travel vast distances in space, So that could be it. There's this inside the Earth kind of theory that there's

people coming from the Earth. So these are the kind of the fringy, exotic ones and not so exotic. I've had a ball scientist, a ball lightning scientists on the show. Some of you might have heard a few months ago about a year ago. Ball lightning as this phenomena of these balls of orbs of light that fly around during lightning storms for about ten to twenty seconds. So it's a phenomena that has been observed but has not been proven.

Earth lights, this is a phenomena that can be reproduced in a lab where you know, earth, or granted, is kind of smashed together and these little plasma orbs come off of it. So that's another phenomena. Everything on this list, though not one of these things have been scientifically confirmed, not one, So any of these things could be the possibility. The low hanging fruit, of course, is the ball lightning and the earth lights, which we have more kind of

data for that they would be real. And that's what I think is really exciting. This work can help prove that there's some scientific validity to this work if we can help these people working on these areas to prove their point. But nothing on this page has been confirmed, So how do we do that? We need to do that well, NASA put together a UAP study group, and this group was just to give an advice to NASA on how whether or not to take on UAP and

how to move forward if you do. Their conclusion in their last paper was the study of unidentified anomalist phenomena presents a unique scientific opportunity that demands a rigorous, evidence based approach. I agree with that one hundred percent. So they're saying that UAP should be investigated, and we should do it from an evidence based approach, not hearsay, not

videos where that are being misrepresented or misinterpreted. And I'm not saying maliciously, but just you know, they're not demonstrating what we're being told is in the video, namely that flear tic TAC. We don't know that that object was a tictac. They also recommended a strategy that encourages citizen analysis of UAP data that would bring an element of transparent transparency to the field that could help combat biases,

preconceived skepticism, and mistrust of authority. I absolutely agree, and I think we all agree that this needs to be transparent. Science is mostly and best done when it is transparent. Why when you say that oh, you know science is done in secret. No, you can't. It's difficult to do

science in secret. Even if you listen to my interview with when of Bigelow's lead scientists, Eric Davis, he talked about doing science in a black project is really difficult because you can't work with other scientists, and when you're doing science, you have to rely on the expertise of many other people with different disciplines, and you can't do that if they're not read into the program. So not a lot of real science can be done on black projects.

It makes it very difficult, and that's why that coupled with that, there needs to be a consensus in order to prove something scientifically. You just don't do it in your little lab in a corner. You write a paper and then the scientific community needs to look it over and bash it and try to come to a consensus on whether or not you know what you're writing is valid. So it needs needs to be done in a community.

So science away, NASA does it. Science the way science has done best is transparent, and that's why this realm is what's most important. So this is where I fullheartedly believe we need to go. You and I can get involved with this right now enigmas an example. You can download this free app and you can upload videos and reports right now, and then my job is to look

at those to recommend the best ones to people. But on the back end, I'm also getting those to scientists to hopefully get them to invest these gate these cases, write papers on them, and then get those out to the scientific community so we can get a scientific consensus. That's what we need to do, and that's what we can all work on. Other groups out there. Mofon is

doing that, the Mutual UFO Network. It's kind of the largest kind of civilian group that kind of has boots on the ground doing this kind of work because a website that collects sidings, so these are all the groups collecting sidings. Then we have Galileo doing the both. Really Galileo, like we talked about earlier, putting together suites of sensors to try to gather data from the UAP to figure out what's going on with them. But they need the information from the other groups to know where to put

those things. They've even asked us where do we where are the UFOs? Where should we put our devices? So we all need to work together on that. The Scientific Coalition for UAP Studies, you know, that was the group that I've been a part of and a board member. I was a founding member and I've been with them since the get go. But you know, we've collected scientists to analyze the data out there, and the SUS put together papers or helped in the creation of papers. You

could go to their website and find those papers. I know. I'm forgetting others like the UAP X has done something similar as Galileo. That's an organization gathering data, the UAP Data Acquisition Project, And I love these guys because what they're doing is they're putting together systems like that Galileo Dale like system that we looked at earlier. But these are systems you could purchase and you could deploy at your house. You could put one of these up. So

I love UFHODAP, the UFO Data Acquisition Projects. So I think that's really important because then we can have people all over the planet putting up these systems, getting getting sensor data, getting and what I mean by that is video cameras that have higher spectrum that can get video that is not visible flear, you know, things that are gathering, temperatures, radiation, all of these different types of systems, and some of the people out there have been like, well, you know,

we need a the state. What are what is the scientific threshold to be able to prove something as anomaloists? And that I think to me is those people don't understand science. That's not how science works. You can't say we have something unknown out there. I need you to write a paper to tell me what we need to look for, and I what is my goal to prove to you that it's real. Well, we don't know if it's unknown, we don't know the nature of the phenomena

at all. We need to start putting out these sensor systems in order to figure out what are the sensors that hit when a UAP flies over. If you get one for real, you know something that is demonstrating anomalist behavior. Not all your sensor systems are going to go off.

It might not be any unique temperature. Maybe the temperature is the same temperature as you know the ambient air, but we're getting a weird type of radiation reading That means we need to look at that radiation and then that threshold is going to be based off of radiation readings along with maybe some other like cent data like video or something, or if it's something that creates heat, it is hot, you know, we're getting higher temperature readings

when these things are around, but we're not getting radiation. Well, then we need to look at the temperature aspect. We don't know enough information to do. A lot of people feel like, oh, they're changing the goalposts. Nobody is changing any goalposts. We're just making better plays. We're getting further down the field, but we're not even close to being able to kick a fill goal. So to say the

goalpost is being moved, it's just the wrong perspective. What we need to do is keep gathering data because we don't have enough information to say what those thresholds are. Science is the study of anomalous things, and there's many different manifestations because there's so much out there that the data can take. So we've got to gather data before we can get to that. And then finally I have here UAP Discovery. So that's a new five oh one. See I've created I've created it for doing what I do,

gathering those videos and data. And this group is specifically focused on gathering data using sensor systems and then doing that analysis. So it's crowdsourcing data and crowd analyzing that data to get that too, scientists to hopefully find those needles in the haystack so that we can get that verification. And I think this is the common ground. This is what we all want. Whether you're really fringy, whether you're saying, hey, aliens are here and not being abducted, well, I'm working

to prove that. Then we're all working to prove that by gathering this data and then getting that analyzed. If that's not happening and it's something else, well then we'll show that with the data. The point is is that all of us want to know, right, and so all of us needs, all of us benefit from this, and we don't have to necessarily. Maybe you're not interested in the scientific investigation of this, that's fine, you don't have to get involved or even pay attention. But we don't

need to fight and call each other names. We can have a space where it's very inclusive, where we're all working positively together with NASA, with ARROW, with the debunkers, with everybody. And that's the plan. That's what UAP discovery is all about. This is just a picture on the left of kind of a Galileo system where they were putting and this is extraordinary to me. So this is a bunch of UFO hunting sensors on the top of

a building out Harvard. Who would have imagined ten years ago that Harvard University would have all this UFO hunting stuff on it. On the right are the UFODAPT type of systems where you could purchase and put those together. I want to also encourage kids and students at universities and high schools to kind of do the work to put these together too and aid them. And that's what UAP discovery is about. Where we can all get together and do this sort of thing and gather this data

and hopefully solve this. I think that we all together then solve this mystery. I think that all of us together doing this sort of work, have the best chance at discovering something. And I argue, you know, I love SETI I'm all for the search for extra terrestrial intelligence. But what have they gotten so far? Nothing? They haven't gotten anything. But I think people argue it's a worthwhile effort.

So I think what we want to do looking closer to home for not just aliens, but other sort of anomalous phenomena is even just as valid, if not even even more valid effort. So I think it's worthwhile to look. It's fun, it's interesting, and I think it can even get students and people more interested in science. So that's why I love this, That's why I created UAP Discovery.

I think it's the type of space that even NASA can be comfortable with, and to be honest, it's a model for what NASA could be doing to help in this area. But with the state of the DoD and the cuts and everything, I don't know that we're going to get anything or movement on any of that anytime soon. But this is kind of the focus, my focus, and the tenor in perspective that you will be getting on

this show. I know it's a niche type of thing, and if it's not your cup of tea, that's fine, but you know, I want to make some real headway. I don't want to sit around listening to stories that never can be proven. I've done that for a very long time. I'm way past that. It's time to get evidence improve this stuff. Speaking of data and evidence, it's time to look at some UFO cases. All right, let's take a look at these. So, oh, this is a really fun one. Let me start this over. So this

is new. We just got this. This was just taken April sixteenth, so just this morning. Actually, that's how new this one is. Of course, this is going to air on the seventeenth, but I'm recording on the sixteenth. This is over Arlington, Texas. And what is that? So we've got these blinking lights kind of a square configuration beaming

this light down. What that is a drone? And I learned this weekend from at Movefund from some former law enforcement and others that you know, this is kind of a common thing these days that the law enforcement are flying around drones and they do have lights that can shine down like that. This is good to know because let's see if we can get a little more of them. But this is good to know because I it was recently on a PBS special PBS Nova, where they were

looking at some of our Enigma cases. And on that show we showed this one here, this weird one from July third. This was actually Elwood, Pennsylvania. And in this object, you see this object coming to the screen, just this light and then later on it beams this very strong lightdown. This is from July third. Let's see if I can get that beam part again. But it's beaming this light down and I think this probably was a law enforcement drone.

Now I wasn't sure what it was before, but it probably was a law enforcement drone and it would make sense that they're checking out fireworks on July third, you know who the heck is out there shooting off these fireworks and then it slowly moves away later, so that was probably. So this is an unknown for me that is solved. Maybe some of you out there are like, uh, duh, I always knew it was a drone. I wasn't sure,

and you know what, that's fine. A lot of times I'll post some of these videos and people will be like, you idiot, that's a drone or that's this or that's that, and then I look at it and like, okay, it looks like you're right. It's okay. I think, you know, we got to quit beating each other up for stuff like that. It's okay to post something that you don't know.

The Congressional definition for a UAP is something that is not immediately identifiable, and these were not Some of these are not immediately identified viable to me, maybe they are to you. A lot of people agree with me when I show these videos and they're like, wow, that does look weird. But that's part of the learning process. So I think we need to make a space where we're

not embarrassed. And I'm not going to be embarrassed to post something that I don't know what it is, because I know if someone does figure out what it is, and I'm going to be educated on that now, I'm going to know going forward, and that's what's important. That's what analysis is. So that's that one. So here are a couple more from this year. And this is a really weird one to me. This was from January. And look at this. So this guy says he sees a

blinking light, he zooms in, probably a plane. I don't know that that light's interesting. And then look at those two things shoot up in the air there together maybe birds, probably birds, but pretty weird. Video is pretty short. So here they'll come again. Here we go. Look at that. So they come together and shoot up in the air and boom they go away. That's pretty weird. Do you think that's birds kind of strange if it is, but I guess it could be. I like that video that's

kind of strange. This is from Philadelphia, Pennsylvania, on January eleventh. But then the more recent one is this one. I really like this. This is from Jones, Oklahoma, April eighth. But this person got like three or four videos and there are multiple objects like this, and you see this object come in fade away, and that's what this one is, come in fade away. And they put another post out with a couple more videos that are similar, but with

more objects doing this fading in and fading out. So he said over the night he saw several objects with doing this behavior. Now, if this was from an aircraft, I would say it was SpaceX because SpaceX looks like this pretty much exactly like that from an aircraft. You know, it's a racetrack phenomena. I interviewed Ben Hansen last year about these. He's a researcher who investigated these and in

their investigation they figured out these were starlink. But I don't know that they can manifest like that from the ground, so we'll have to get more people looking at that. But that's pretty weird. I think, don't know what that one is. So I'll put the links to these of course in the bottom, so you can check those out yourself. But what the heck could that be? I don't know. Here's another video where the same type of things going on. Yeah, I'm just not sure even to kind of speculate a

bunch of drones. You know Chinese lanterns, would they fade and float up in a while, But you see them lit and going. They're lit the whole time, not fading in and out. So I don't know what that one is. Pretty weird. Some good videos, so we will review. And again, you know, these are just unknown, there's no doubt. And just so you know, I expect when I post these videos, I expect that somebody somewhere is going to be able

to figure out what they are. I do not expect that you know all of these videos or aliens, or that you know these are proof of something anomalists going on. But I think that they're worth looking into because they could be. And I am not a scientist. I'm not a physicist, and so I from experience don't know which of these videos is really going to excite a scientist where they're going to look at that and say, you know what, I can analyze that and really figure something

out with that one. And that's what's exciting is to give them that sort of data to work with. And that's the whole point is crowdsourcing data and then getting that analyzed. So I'll bring to you in the future when some of these are resolved, just like that drone one that we looked at a little earlier that I think now is that the the law enforcement trone. So we'll check those out. That is it for this week's show. Thank you all so much for joining me. Stay tuned

for more. I hope that you enjoyed this. We'll have interviews going on, so it's just not me blabbing away in the future. Of course, these are posted on YouTube also if you want to see the videos that I had posted. But thank you all so much for joining me again on the podcast. I think that the time is right. You know, there's a lot of wild kind of stuff going on out there in this field, but I think the time is right to take a new,

sober examination of this. I think hopefully people did get snagged by some of the information that did not turn out to be accurate. But what's exciting That got a lot of people into taking another look at UFOs and then getting the Congress and NASA and DoD to say, yeah, UAPR are a real deal. We should take them seriously.

And that's what we're doing here on this show. We're taking all of this seriously, taking a hard, skeptical, grounded, sober look at all of this information, not lying to ourselves or sensationalizing, to really try to figure out what is there and to investigate and hopefully finally come to some resolution or make some novel interesting discoveries when it comes to the uap phenomena. Thank you all for joining. Until next time. Audio Smooth Chaco's