Hello, and welcome to Open minds UFO Radio. Yes it is us. We still exist, and I know it's been a long time, but I'm your host, Alejandro Rojas. I'm still around and I am joined by Martin flying squirrel Willis. Well. Yes, I guess I probably should explain why you said that, although you didn't. Really, it's too bad you didn't exhibit, you know, properties of a flying squirrel or else you might not have gotten hurt, but you might have been I don't know what else.
Something that falls through the air more akin to a rock. Yeah, that's kind of what it felt like. So yeah, yeah, I fell off a ladder. Is that what I was on top? I was on the third floor of my house and I fell down to the first floor roof, so that's like two floors. Yeah, And I was I was basically shoveling snow. You know, we still have a lot of snow. It is melting. But I shoveled down to ice and I had a bucket of ice
melt in my hand when I slipped on the top roof. The bucket is what pulled me over the edge and down I went, and there was a horrible I'm really lucky to be alive. And I just started moving around, you know, in mid week ago. So yeah, it's been and quite a quite a fallen scary Yeah to hear that you you hurt yourself so badly, and I mean, you're doing better, that's why I'm being silly about it, but awfully frightening. Yeah, but you know what, I am
counting my blessings. I really am so lucky. I didn't land in a way to break a lot of bones or anything like that. I just or or die, you know. I mean, I just really was lucky, very lucky. And I'm not going to do it again. Good good, don't do it again. That's bad, right, thank you? And I want you getting hurt. I want you staying healthy. And you don't got to be getting on the roof for goodness sakes, hire somebody. I know, I'm in the middle of noise. I wouldn't get on the roof.
You didn't, what's that I wouldn't get on any roof. Yeah, Well, I'm sworn to never get I've I made a pact with myself to never do it again, and I just have to stick with that. But I really don't want to ever do it again. I never want to fall again, that's for sure. Well, I guess we should move on. Our guest today. I don't know why, I'm I feel like saying it, kind of like with a Lego Batman voice. Our guess is Nick Redford on three hundred and sixty five days of UFOs. Well done, well done.
Hey, I saw the Batman logo movie and it was really good. It's so funny. So that is my little I'm not this isn't a paid promotion, too bad, it isn't. But so I'm just inspired by funny Lego Batman. Yeah, oh, Lego Batman. I saw that advertised. Yeah, yeah, that book I read. I read through Nick's book. It's
really uh, it's really interesting how he has it laid out. Uh, you know, these are accounts of UFO sightings for every day of the year, on different years, of course, but really very very fascinating how we did that. Mm hmmm. Yeah. So this is a really fun book. Exciting a day, and we'll talk to him more about why he did this book, what gave him the idea, and some of the cool stuff
in it. So this is gonna be a lot of fun. Nick Redford's always fun to talk to and he's of course a favorite among people out there. So yeah, so this will be a lot of fun talking to him about this book. Really really cool, right right, So fun to have him back, and it's fun to be back because you know, for me, of course, it's it's been extremely busy. We had the conference and
everything h which went very well. The only major issue we had was you and You're you're not being able to be there because your flight was canceled. But you know, once we figured out that was gonna happen, because you let us know before the conference, we kind of did a group thing where I had to let the guys know. There was crying. The women, Oh my gosh, they were really devastated, but they kind of just you know, we all took a deep breath and we said, we can still
do this. You know, at least he's still alive. Little did we know that you you almost died, and we moved forward and were able to complete a successful conference. Yeah, you know, if I made it out there, somehow, I wouldn't have fallen off the roof. See how they worked well and actually getting into the news a little early. Uh, it's gone viral. We've got a gajillion stories out there right now about us having
given Tom DeLong the UFO Researcher of the Year Award. He was not able to be there, but he did send us a video response that we played and we posted this along with our video showing why we gave him the award on YouTube and that's gone super viral. So there's just a gajillion stories out there. Honestly, a lot of them are making fun of Tom DeLong. Luckily not us, but Tom DeLong, which is actually kind of sad because
very few of them. There's a really good c neet article that focuses on the details of why we gave him the award because and some people question this, I think, but well, there's no doubt you could see this online. But I think, you know, it's really important what he did that I asked people who are like, why did you give it to Tom DeLong just because he's a rock star? No, because of all the work that we were able to see that he did and how he has taken this topic.
He was able to have this discussion with these high level individuals. Nobody's gotten to have a discussion like he's had with these high level guys, these generals, executive vice president of Lucky Skunk Works. I mean, nobody's had a conversation at that level. So it's an event. It's a historical event really for this field in general, let alone quite an accomplishment by this one person who is now also going doing these non fiction projects that are going to
be coming forward. In fact, watch our social media because we're going to have some giveaways. Luckily times people they've been real happy with us, so they got ahold of us recently, and we'll probably be launching either today or tomorrow sometime this week. We're going to be giving some giveaways related to the book and everything, and we're going to have a discount code for his nonfiction UFO book that's coming up here I think just next week or at the end
of the week at releases. So check out our social media for a discount for the book and for some freebies regarding the book. But you know, I ask people who question it, who else has done something you know, at this level or better this year? What UFO researcher has done some great piece of UFO research this year? And I do feel that you know, Tom and most people agree when you put it in that perspective, which is exactly the perspective of the award, that the awards deserved. So I think
there's just a lot of people that get frustrated. So and that's okay. I guess, you know, there's always controversy, and you know, I don't think we've ever given out an award that didn't prove to be controversial at some level. So so that's okay, we can take the heat on this. I just you know, we genuinely believe it's deserved. It's not to buddy up with Tom DeLong, like we told him, we want to present him the award whether or not he can provide us a video or be at
the symposium to accept it. We just feel that it's deserved and we wanted to provide it to him, so at least it's coming from a genuine place when we do award it. Now, the the one person I can think of that has done you know, some work, some really good work last year and continues to do it is Paul Dean down in Australia. Yeah, that's a good point. I think Paul Dean has done a lot now. Arguably all he's done is shared previous researchers information, and that's that's so it's
not unique in that. However, he is finding research that wasn't widely dissemin before, and he's putting the pieces together and sharing those pieces he's finding, which I agree are highly highly significant. So and as can be demonstrated because we feature his work so much. I mean, I've had him on a couple times this year, and we've had him he's been an integral part to some of the research we've done. It we've shown on our Open Minds magazine
videos that we've put out there. So I agree he would be a close second. But putting it together, I did feel maybe a close second. And I also want to work towards I want to work towards doing some other things around that. I guess I'll put it that way without revealing too much, especially because who knows how successful I'll be putting some stuff together around that. But yeah, we've recognized him quite a bit and I want to continue to do so. But I would agree he would be the best argument for
an alternative. Ah yep, So am I going to get to do any news this week? Or is it you're just and do you have some I will not. I just wanted I had a story lined up, but you did, so you can you know you're going, You're going pretty well, you know, if you want to just continue, No, I just wanted to talk about the conference and the controversy and stuff like that. However, yes, Martin, we are definitely moving into the news because that's why you're
here. Well you're here for more than that, but because also it's so fun to talk to you about UFO news. So let's transition over to Martin Willis presents UFO News. Thank you very much. So this is uh, this is a low flying UFO spotted over Gettysburg. Now this is a you know Gettysburg, the famous Gettysburg where there was a major Civil War battle fought. Interesting historic town, Gettysburg address, blah blah blah. Well this happened
back and recently it was. It was February twenty six, just you know, a few days ago basically where this witness was out on his porch smoking a cigarette and he noticed a light coming like across the sky. He guessed the speed range of about eight hundred miles an hour and up now he thought the object was only about a thousand feet up and you know, I almost have to argue the point where if an object was only a thousand feet up, you would hardly be able to see it go by at eight hundred miles
an hour, just in my opinion. So again he was guessing it was about that far up, and he also thought it was about one hundred and no, I'm sorry, about eight hundred to one thousand feet long. Now, these are quite these are quite some incredible claims. Here he saw a bright line of lights and I believe he said it had kind of like a shape it dipped up towards the back or something like that. I know I read that somewhere in the article. And he watched it basically travel across the
sky. There is no pictures. He wasn't able to take a picture of this. He did hear a very low humming sound, which is also kind of curious as well. At first he thought it might have been a jet, but after a while they figured out, you know, there's just no way that it could have been that. And he said there was at least ten or twelve lights and they were all bright bright, as he exclaimed,
white, no red, blue, and none were blinking. And so that was that was basically I think it was close, like a unknown object or something like that. I don't really see any conclusion on this particular one. Yeah, I think maybe they're still investigating. Yeah, I don't think Roger really said. But I wonder if there's a bit of a mistype from the witness too, because they said the object was between eight to one thousand feet
long and it was also eight to one thousand feet up. I wonder if they meant it was eight to one thousand feet up not long, because yeah, that those numbers are pretty odd. And then ice hundred miles per hour, so and like you said, if it's if it's really low, it's gonna look like it's moving much faster if it's moving past you than if it is a larger object further away. So yeah, some of the numbers don't add up, but it's still interesting. I guess this guy was an army
veteran or is an army veteran. So yeah, very interesting, isn't it? It is? Do you have any other ones you want to talk to you about? Two? Well, I can if you'd like me to continue to go for it, do it, because it's been a while, it's been over a month for goodness sake. Last time we were talking, it was nearly it was just after the holidays. I guess I think you are right. Oh my goodness, you're right. Well, this is a I guess you'd call it a USO, not a UFO. This happened in Wisconsin.
It happened last year on November twenty eighth, and it was an incident involving a triangular shaped object object around Green Bay in Wisconsin. Swamico is the name of the little Suamico is the name of the town. And the witness says that he could hear a muffled jets sound and which is kind of interesting, and it was a very dark color and it had blue flashing lights, and I guess it came up out of the water and was at about five
hundred feet. He thought it was about one thousand feet away, and that the side of the triangle appeared to be about one and one hundred and fifty feet along. And now his thoughts were that he believed that it was operated by the Air Force. I don't know where he really came up with that idea. So this one was I think it it was closed as a UIVY unknown UAV category. Interesting, So what they even the investigator felt, I guess it was a man made object. And I think they've experimented with things
like that that can go in and out of the waterfly both ways. So interesting. Yeah, yeah, have there You really have heard that that they've
experimented with things that Yeah. Actually, And the reason I saw most of this is that they review that in a section of the investigation that the SEU that the group did in investigating the Puerto Rico video, they have a section where they talked about the different man made objects that could be And I've seen a story too, I remember, or maybe even a video of this Navy experiment. I think they even have them that could launch from a submarine and
stuff. But wow, I'm not so sure that they've actually built anything, at least that we know about. Of course, if they have built something and it was a top secret, then we wouldn't know about it. They would be testing it out there. So yeah, they test things. Do you think in the Great Lakes? I wouldn't think so, not the Great Lakes. Yeah, So I don't know the situation with the airbases out that way or anything like that. Yeah, I don't think they do that sort
of thing there, so hard to know. Really interesting case. What about And I want to ask you because I think you've looked at this. We have one titled North Carolina Witness Unsure UFO or drone. This is in wake Forest, North Carolina. It was captured April second, twenty sixteen, so almost a year ago. It was about four thirty pm, and so it's the light out and this person is near a lake and a river and they
see large birds a lot. But he saw this object that he started to thinking, Hey, that doesn't really look like a bird, but it doesn't look like a plane either. They said it was about two hundred to four hundred feet above the horizon and they weren't able to capture a couple video clips of this object. And it doesn't look like a plane, and it doesn't look like a bird. It's elongated, So I guess maybe a party balloon type of I guess it could be. But this one's just kind of weird
because it's not readily identifiable. Now, it doesn't move like it might be something alien, but I don't know what it is. Uh. There's at least one commentary who said, I I operate drones, and this is not a drone. So, yeah, what do you I remember we talked about this before and you looked at me. Do you remember it? I do? Yeah, what do you think? I don't know. You know, it's an it's an oddball. I mean, it could be a milar balloon, but it's so, you know, a very strange shape. Yeah,
I guess you could. You know, you could, you could make anything you want from my lar if you wanted to. Yeah, And yeah, I don't. It doesn't look it's sort of like a blob, you know. I don't know if it really could be a drone. It's an oddball one, that's for sure. Yeah, pretty weird. And then I have one more news story. Did you have anymore? Do you mind? I'm okay. So here's the other one I want to talk about before we get
to Nick Redfern, And I'm writing a story on it. I was going to try to write it for Friday, got busy so I had to leave. So I'll have this up later today with the whole transcript. But this is George Bush, who's been in the news a lot lately, right, But he was on Jimmy Kimmel Live the other day, and like Jimmy Kimmel does, which we love so much, he asked George Bush about UFOs.
So George Bush, now through the wiki leaks, the same ones that you know, revealed information that we were able to why we gave the award to Tom DeLong, and the same one I we were referencing Open Minds in a related story. So we saw that there was some conversation about Hillary Clinton coming on Jimmy Kimmel, and they were working on the script and what they were going to talk about in regards to UFOs and sharing information about what Bill Clinton
said and him and John Podesta, and they're interested in UFOs. That's why they linked to one of my stories. I'm so honored, That's why I keep repeating it. But anyway, so most likely there was some background here
where George Bush was aware he was going to be asked about UFOs. And in fact, Jimmy Kimmel started off like he usually does, you know, asking if he went through the UFO documents before he could even finish his sentence, Bush said maybe, and then he said, after the question was finished that it's kind of funny because his daughters asked about that all the time. So Jimmy says, well, do you tell that your daughters anything? And he says no, and he's like, well, he essentially asked, well
did you look at files? And he's like maybe. He's like, well, could you would you tell me what was in these files? No? It was really funny. He just kept saying no, no, and and he said, well, now that you're out of office, you can do anything you want, right. Bush said true, but I'm not telling you. I'm not telling you nothing interesting statements. Hih. He just kept saying
no, I'm not gonna tell you. Yeah, He's like and even with the question, well, if you did look at them, would you tell me or your daughters, He's like no, so but in regards to whether he looked, he said maybe. So that's really weird. I mean, he could be joking, but of course he's not like Obama, where you know he's joking. Even Obama does straight face. But Obama is arguably,
I think one of the funnier presidents we've had. He kind of acts like a comedian where he can he will laugh and smile afterwards and stuff like that. With George Bush, he's a little more poker face. So you can't tell for sure what if he's being serious or not. He does laugh here and there, so this one is a little bit harder to definitely say he's joking, whereas norma I think they typically are. So of course, someone tweeted me about this and said, hey, when's Ben going to look at
this? And or is Ben going to look at this? Ben Hanson who has analyzed these videos in the past. In fact, that's what he talked about at our UFO Congress. And I said, well, I think you just kind of asked him because you included him, taged him on his tweet, and then Ben responded and said, well, looks like I've got some
more work to do. So at some point Ben Hansen will will analyze this to see what he thinks, because he does, you know, he's got that law enforcement background and he does this kind of analysis of what we can tell there by what they say, so that'll be interesting. But it was a very interesting appearance. Were you aware of this, No, not at all. I'm going, Wow, Great, the video up on anywhere it is, so I'll have my story up probably up really soon, and I'll
send you the link and I'll embed the video in it. But it is on that Jimmy Kimmel YouTube site. Now, no, that's great. And you know, I almost wonder if Ben does not really have to do that much work on this one, because there is doesn't sound like there's any real denying going on. Yeah, true, so he probably you know. Yeah. Plus it's short luckily for Ben, because it takes him a long time to do this work because he looks at every single movement, the number of
breaths are taken, all of this sort of thing. So but definitely fun. This is really cool. It's a great development. So yeah, cool Ben. Ben said he had something like forty hours in one of those fun Oh yeah, I wouldn't doubt it. Yeah, amazing. Yeah, all right, that's it for the news. You got anything else, buddy, I am done. Well, I'm so happy that you survived your fall. Please don't try the flying squirrel impression and he longer and you keep you keep
yourself safe, buddy. And also to the people that I missed out in at the conference, I'm really sorry I couldn't get out there. I'm going to drive next year for sure. You can still fly, just you know, well, I like having my car and I think I'm going to take an extended time out that way. Oh okay, cool, yeah, so can some sun a little bit? Get out of the snow that I mean you guys, I cause I read about places that it's cool. It's already
summer here. Summer is already here. I mean this weekend with seventy five, which is great for us, too cool for some Arizonas because they're so thin blood but sunny skies. You know. It was a little cloudy actually, but not anymore. It's now sunny and in the upper seventies. So yeah, it's I'm feeling for you. Yeah, it's good stuff, all right, So we'll talk to you soon then, all right, thank you, Uh huh. Let's go ahead and talk to Nick Redfern. I am
happy to welcome back to the show. Nicholas Redfern. Hello, Hey, al Andre, how's it going fun? Good? Your email, says Nicholas, So I decided to use that. That's actually I forget why says that, but I think Nick wasn't available when that counts up years ago. I've had that. That's actually my second email, just not the primary one, but I've had it so long, but I didn't bother close me down. But I do remember it was something to do with the fact that and ic
K was taken. So I see, well, Nicholas is a nice theme. Yeah, I don't mind which it is. I be cold work, you know, Right, So, although you're generally well liked in the field, I don't know that I've heard one person say a bad thing about you. Oh, you've been looking in the wrong places. I get a lot of I get a lot of online Oh yeah, debates, shall we say?
Right, well, everybody's always talking crap about each other. But well, the thing is, you know, I mean, I don't mind a good online fight, you know, because I think, you know, it's one of these situations where debate, you know, is a good thing, right, you know, some people shy away from it because they don't want
confrontation. But the way I look at it is that if we're going to get answers, then we really need not just to share stuff, but you know, sort of point out problems with this person's theorial, that one, and and really, you know, because we're all looking at the end of
the day, we're all part of a community looking for answers. So I don't think it's a problem, really to you know, have a you know, a full on debate where you know, sometimes tempers get raised or whatever, that that doesn't matter if it helps us get a clear picture of what's going on. So true, true, But there are some people who just like to personal attacks, and I think they do it for fun, just to push people's buttons. Oh yeah, Well there are some people like that
in euthology, and I deal with them sometimes as well. The problem is it's not so much for me. It's a problem dealing with it. It's a problem when I find that, you know, I'm debating with these people and then I just realize, you know, I've just last two hours on the work, right, Yeah, I know. That's the other hard part about that. So the thing that not debating, it's just like it's like, you know, sorry, I got to go, you know, I've
got to earn a living. I've got to write exactly. That's why I try to stay after show social media as much as possible, just post stuff and leave. But I'm not very good at it because I end up it ends up beating up my time. Like you said, and I love debate. I agree with you. It's just some people with the personal attacks that's
where it gets hurt. And you know, let me ask you this question, because you're someone you know, when you put yourself out there in this field or probably anywhere where you have kind of a you're a public person where you know, like you being an author that a lot of people generates a lot of conversation. There can be a lot of negativity, especially in this field. How do you handle that? Some people really overtime it kind of make them a bit depressed, or some people, as you've probably seen,
have left the field. How do you how do you handle it well in terms of people are critical, you know, I just fire back and tell people as it is. You know, It's like if you don't want to hear something negative, you know, then don't say it's something negative about me.
You know. If somebody legitimately has an issue with something that I write or something I say, you know, I'm fine about debating it, you know, and I'll you know, I'll stand my own ground and and and forthrightly explain why I think this is the answer to this, or et cetera, et cetera. But when it's just people who complain about all this and that, well, you know, like I said, that doesn't get you anywhere. And so sometimes you know, if I feel like just having a
good online argument, I'll you know, I engage in. But other times, you know, if that's all they're doing, then really you know that there's just no point getting involved because it doesn't get you anywhere. But what I would say is that you're right some people have sort of walked away from euthology and disillusioned or you know, fed up with the scene. But I think, you know, I think a lot of this says he actually says
less about euthologists that he actually says more about human nature. You know, at the end of the day, euthologists are as human as everybody else. And I think if you were to look in any kind of community, you will get this kind of issue going on, you know, where you have people debating and somebody's like, well, I want to be known as the group secretary. No, you can be the vice president, or you know, it's kind of they want their titles and they want this and they want
that, and it becomes very much like an ego kind of thing. So I always tell people, you want to get into euthology, you know, it's do so because it's a fascinating subject, but you know, make sure you've got some thick skin as well, because you know, sometimes the people have to deal with And that's the way I look at it is that you know, I'm a pretty laid back guy, but not when it comes to
you know, sort of debate. I mean, I tell it as I see it, and if people like it, that's fine, and if it upsets people how it goes, you know, I'm not going to lose sleep over it. Mh. We've had scientists at our conference and at least a couple where I've said, you know, and they've gotten in debates with people and I've said, you know, I hope that went I ca for you,
and they're like, oh yeah, I love it. They're like, this is mild compared to our science conventions where we're really going at it on our different theories. So it's to your point, Yeah, that's exactly what I meant. You know, you can find this anyway, and particularly you know, the big issue of course that causes this is because we're dealing with like definitive unknowns. You know, it's kind of you know, I also write a lot about cryptozoology, the study of unknown animals, and you can
make the same sort of parallels to things like Bigfoot. We don't know what bigfoot is. We don't know what the LOCKMSS monster is, so you know, you have a dozen or more theories. In the same way, somebody would argue, you know, we don't really know what happens with alien abductions, or we don't know what's going on area fifty one. So inevitably this creates friction when somebody says, well, my sources said this is what's happening,
and somebody else says, no, that's wrong. You know, but that's what you just have to be prepared for, and people are prepared for it. That's probably better off, you know, watching the news, right doing something else, because you're right, I mean, you know, especially in this field, you can't do anything that is not controversial to some degree
because the whole field is controversial. That's right, yep. So speaking of controversial, I wanted to talk about Roswell because I think this is interesting and kind of fun and I've done this before what you're doing. But at Roswell it's the seventy eighth anniversary, so hopefully a lot of people are coming. I know, lots of people from Phoenix are coming, and I'll be speaking for the Daily Roswell Record again. Of course, there's a museum event where
there's lots of great speakers. There's Don Schmidt and Stanton Friedman, and I think of Vonn Smith and Travis Walton, a bunch of others over there, great people. But you're speaking. I think you're the only Eufologists I saw on the list. But you're speaking for a guy I'm alone, who's a great guy. I've met him. I've spoken for one of his events. But what's unique about his event is that they are it's kind of a religious
one where they have the feeling that aliens are demons. Yeah, that's right, And I mean, you know, I don't mind speaking for a group that has views different to mine, because again, you know, I think if you kind of sort of I mean ironical if we're talking about religion, now, if you've just preached to the converted so and speak, you know, that doesn't get us anywhere. And so you know, when guy said
to me, would you be interested in speaking for my conference? You know I didn't have any hesitation because I don't feel uncomfortable speaking for groups of people who have radically different views to mine. I'm totally fine with that. And I think, again, you know, the it's a conference again to try and figure out what happened at Roswell and you know, unravel all the new leads and pretend sources that may still be coming through which might finally provide us
with an answer, you know. And if at that conference, we you know, we get into a debate about the merits of whether you know, Roswell was a secret experiment, whether it was extraterrestrials, whether it was you know, something moral on the demonic angle. You know, I'm happy to debate those areas. And I think the audience like that kind of situation when you're sort of you know, getting to it, you know, back and
forth with each other. So again, you know, I think, wherever you come from on Roswell or any case, you know, tell it as you see it, and don't you know, don't worry about that because you know, if somebody else has got a deep, deeply held belief system, they're not apologizing for it, you know, so so why should you. So Yeah, I'm looking forward to the conference and you know, be interesting to see how it all goes down. Yeah, you know, I commend
you for that. I think that's great. I agree, And like you said, you know, there's a lot of this this whole everybody. You know, some people do want to preach to the choir others and it's funny that this is religious spas and we use these terms, but you know, others like me, I would rather talk to people who don't know anything about this field, who are curious, to give them a lot of information they don't have. So I think that's a great attitude that you have. And
you know, guy Malone, I really like him. There. One of the events he put together that I spoke at, some other UFO researchers spoke at, and we all were not totally clear on the nature of things, and it wasn't until the end that you know, this kind of the religious aspect came out and a lot of the speakers were really upset. But I kind of felt like, what the heck, you know, it's it's just
another topic. And to your point, you know, they're not going to get upset about or all and a half about what their beliefs are and how those are different than yours, So why should we. Yeah, and one of the things, this kind of issue comes up. I always tell people to remember that the term UFO that you, regardless of people think that you still stands unidentified. You know, we really don't know what the phenomenon is,
you know. I mean, although the overriding popular theory is the extraterrestrial one. I mean, if you look at the advances of being made today in things like quantum physics in relation to like multi dimensions and things like that, you know, we could actually be looking at something that actually isn't coming from some far away star system, but the kind of zips in and out of our reality. You know, then you have granted some of the more
controversial theories, like the demonic one at the time traveling one. So in other words, where we did dealing with definitive unknown. I think it's important to get the information out, but also to demonstrate to people, you know, this is my conclusions or your conclusion or whoever's conclusions based on the data. You know, and sometimes data changes, and you know, people's views
change. That's one of the things I always find a little bit odd about certain factions in eupology, where it's almost like you're not expected to change your views. You know, he's the abduction researcher who thinks of this. She's the you know, the conspiracy theoriest who thinks this is held at Area fifty one. He's the person who think it's aliens mutilating cattle. Somebody else is the one who thinks it's a government mutilating cattle. And it's like people almost
expected to carry that torch forever. But I mean, it's it's like, you know, you don't watch the same TV shows that say thirty as you do when you were ten, you know, you or clothing tastes change, you know, your music changes. And I think sometimes in upology you're expected to rigidly uphold something even in the face of new data, you know,
and people valiantly, valiantly hang on to some hoax documents. No, no, it's real, you know, And it doesn't matter, you know, if it's you know, if somebody investigates something and then further down the line it's shown to be something else. If you'd legitimately point out why you thought it was ABC and it turned out to be d ef there's again, there's nothing wrong with that, you know. It's that's what investigations are ford to get to the bottom of things, and sometimes it can take a long time.
And also until you reach that final correct answer, you can often find yourself in going all sorts of weird directions. Mm hm. You know, and and I And the thing that we do is write a lot. So the good thing about writing is that it causes you. It forces you to investigate what you're writing about. And of course you are a prolific writer in books and you know online articles, so you're just I'm amazed at how much you're able to get out there. But it's kind of cool that it does.
And I do appreciate that it forces us to delve into these things and to really investigate every thing that we're writing about. And I often find that when I follow things to the core, it's a deff situation instead of the ABC I might have been expecting. It's just funny how often that happens. Is that happened a lot to you too, that your expectations are kind of like blown out the window. Well, when I get you know, whether it's from a witness or it's a document or it's a room or whatever.
You know, I always just try and just follow the story and not try and you know, make leaps and jumps and put threads together that aren't there. I just follow where it goes, and if you take me somewhere, that's great. If it hits a brick wall, when you try and find a way around that brick wall. But you know, from my perspective, you know, when you talk about sort of writing and things like that,
I try and sort of be pretty structured. I like to sort of work nine to five Monday to Friday with the writing and whether it's the books or articles or whatever, and then I take evenings off. I don't work at evenings. Five o'clock on a Friday afternoon, the laptop goes into sleep mode and it doesn't come out of sloop mode till eight o'clock Monday morning. I just totally switch off to have a normal, you know, normal fund so
live, et cetera, et cetera. And for me, that works well because I don't get sort of burned out by the subject, you know, And I think I think that's an important thing. Is that as fascinating as an interesting and intriguing as the UFO subject is, I have seen on many occas and this isn't meant as a criticism. But on many occage I've seen people kind of get sucked into it so deeply that it goes from being an interest to a passion finally to like a full blown unhealthy obsession where everything in
their life is dominated by the subject. Now, if people like that, they want to be on UFO's full on twenty four to seven. I don't have an issue with that. It's just from my perspective, I couldn't do that. I'd get burned out. And I know of friends who've gone down that road and eventually they've just back to way because it was just impacting too much. You know, everything going on in their life was sort of seen
as being connected somehow, you know. And so I think, you know, there's a lot of things within euthology to think about that are I like that, you know? And I think, but again it's it just demonstrates part of you know, human character rather he does anything particularly about upologists, you know, Like I said, it's it's I'm sure people who collect stamps or something like that, you know, they argue over how did this person want get that one? And it's the last one in the collection I need,
you know, it's the same sort of thing really right exactly. So obsessions can be detrimental no matter what they are, So you have to be careful and have perspective in factors that guy here who baseball cards is his thing, and then he's gotten in trouble for doing too much baseball card stuff at work, so practically anything. Yeah, that's like a classic example. But again I think, you know, doing research, what I try and do.
I try and sort of take like an investigative research approach. You know, when I first left school, I worked on a music and fashion and entertainment magazine back in England called Zero, and you know that sort of really got me into journalism. They sort of taught me the how to sort of structure a story and construct it so you know, pulling the reader and things
like that, but also interviewing and investigating techniques. And I've always tried to apply that to sort of going with an open mind, not from the perspective of I'm going to prove this is extraterresterral, I'm going to prove this is a classified aircraft or whatever. I just go where it takes me. And I don't feel I'm someone who really flies the flag of any particular theory more
than any other. I just go where the evidence goes, you know, and that might mean that, you know, one day we find that, yes, extraterrestrials are really flying around, but they have nothing to do with cattle mutilations, you know what I mean. I don't feel I need to kind of place it all under one banner, which is you know, hell
high water, which is great. And you know what I really like about that that you're this way, you know, a great bishop and I had a conversation that was very similar recently on the show, but that you're like this, but you're still in demand as far as speaking goes, because a lot of times those people who do have kind of a hard set worldview, who preach to it and their goal is to kind of convince people of it, they're often the more popular, uh, you know, when it comes
to speaking engagements. But people love hearing your talks where even though you aren't like that, I feel like that, and I feel like sometimes get people get bummed. And I don't know if you've experienced this when they come to me and they ask me, so, what is this? What is that? And I'm like, I don't know, I can show you the information or what's out there, but I don't know necessarily what these might be. And they look at you like they're they're really bumped because they want that,
you know the answer. Does that happen to you? Well? Sometimes? But I mean when you talk about, you know, trying to convince the audience of this or that, I don't think trying to convince the audience of what my conclusions are is actually a responsible thing to do, because if like you're pushing the information down their throat and almost demanding they take your points of
view. What I try and do is demonstrate to the audience, you know, for a conference or like a you know, just a group lecture, is to demonstrate and show the audience what I've found, then explain to them the sort of the tentative conclusions i've or fall on conclusion that I've reached based upon my studies. And you know, it's like, for example, as you know, last year, I spoke at the conference on the Men in Black mystery, and I spoke about the different theories and the cases I'd investigated.
But what I would never do is say I know for sure that the men in Black are this, or that I can say I think there's certain evidence which pushes it down this particular pathway, and I think that's a responsible way to do it. And I think sometimes, you know, people don't actually like it when they're lectured at. You know, I don't think I lecture to people I share information I don't want to. I don't lecture at people, you know, demand that they accept this or that I share what
I've uncovered. And I think, you know, maybe that's why people enjoy having me speak of their events, because you know, I try and present, however, many sides of the argument that are you know, I'm fine about discussing them, but I'm not in the business of speaking at conferences just to say what the audience wants to hear, you know, or what I think is going to sell more books. Now, I'm just going to say
it as it is, and if people like it, that's fine. If they come away thinking, you know, whatever I mean, and that's fine too. I think, you know, that's that's what we should. We need to take a responsible approach to how we lecture, because you know, you go to some conferences and the egos are so high through the roof that the people who are you know, with those big egos giving their lectures will tell you that they know this for sure or this happened, you know,
when they don't. It's just their held opinion. Really, m amen, brother, another reference exactly. I guess before I leave that, before we get in your book, which I'm excited to talk about, I just guess I should ask if someone were to say, you know, let's say at the conference or Rino and Roswell, you know, do you believe that the aliens are demons? What would be your response? No, I don't believe aliens are actually demons, but where I do but agree with the people who
hold that view. He's on a couple of points. One, you know a lot of my views on the origins of the UFO phenomenon, you know, so it probably started to change where I was like my late twenties, early thirties something like that, and you know, I sort of came more around to like a John Keel's approach that we're dealing with something that kind of coexists and with us and flips in and out of our reality. Now, you know, people believe in the demonic angle would say that's what these entities
do as well. You know they have from their perspective, they would view it as Hell, I guess, but they would take the view that, you know, Hell is kind of like another place that kind of coexists with us, you know what I mean, that's probably approach they would take. And I actually share that approach that we are probably dealing with something that is
like multi dimensional. And I also agree with them in the sense that I think there are certain aspects of the UFO phenomenal which are clearly deceptive and manipulative, you know, where certain cases seem to be like almost staged for benefits, you know what I mean, It's almost like a bizarre kind of fear to play it out, like these cases over and over again of people driving
down the road and they see aliens taking soil samples. You know, there's so many cases like that that you know, it's like how many times do they need to take soil samples? Of why they always be seen doing it? You know, It's almost like it's been played out for our benefits, and and so I don't I would agree with the people who believe that demonic angle that it is kind of deceptive and it could be manipulative in a sinister
way. But where I differ is that just because I think they it could be manipulative and deceptive, and that it coexists with us in some bizarre realm of existence. That doesn't mean I believe in you know, horned figures with por with pitchforks, you know, and fiery pits and all that kind of stuff. You know, people believe that. That's fine. I don't have an issue with people who who believe that. My only issues with with you know, different is not what people believe. It's it's it's the impact it
has on other people if they don't want to get involved with it. You know, I have no problem with somebody who has any religious persuasion, but I don't want to knocking on the door at six o'clock at nineteen. If I wanted to find out about it, I would do it, you know. I wouldn't need somebody to, you know, to come knocking on the
door when I'm eating dinner or whatever. So, yeah, I guess some of my views are similar to theirs in terms of the kind of like the modus operandi of the phenomenon, but not you know, I don't think, you know, the Grays are sort of beaming out of hell or whatever. Although I did actually write extensively about this about seven eight years ago in a book called Final Events, which is a very weird book. I got onto the story thanks to a priest named Ray Bausha. Ray has a really interesting
background. Not only is he a priest, a Christian priest. In the nineteen eighties he ran the Nebraska chapter of mouf ON. He was the state director, and in the early nineties he met representatives from the Departments of Defense from a group that was actually pursuing that angle. They were like a little think tank type group. Weren't like an agency like the NSA or anything like that. It's a small think tank and they were looking into this angle of
is the UFO phenomenon sort of demonic and accult and supernatural based? And it was a fascint I wrote the book not because to endorse the demonic angle, because I thought it was fascinating that there was this small group in government being funded to actually investigate the stuff we've just been talking about. But I pointed, but I pointed out in there in the story that you know, this
is not my story. I pointed out, you know, I'm taking a step back and telling the story of not that I believe it, but how and why this group came to believe it and what their conclusions are. So again, you know, I think you know, there's no doubt that the the the monic angle has quite a significant following. Really, you know, there's people like like Tom Horn's books and things like that. You know,
they so incredibly well. So you know, in that sense, we are dealing with an aspect of euthology perhaps a lot of people don't think about, but which if you look into it, really you can find threads here and there, you know, in support of that theory. Mm hmm yep. Interesting well, and day Malone's events are always very well organized, and I don't know what the attendance is like, so it'll be interesting to find out
from you how that goes. So yeah, I actually spoken, He's two thousand and seven events and that was quite well attended really, And how'd you say, guy's always on time? It makes me laugh really because he's like, you know, if you're like thirty seconds ten seconds out, but it's like you know your times up almost imagine you know, you've got like the the shepherd's stick, you know, pulling your off by the neck off stage or whatever. I know how that is. Stage can be difficult. Yeah,
So let's get to your book. Your latest book just came out, what I was going to say, last month, but it's already March, so it came out in January. Three hundred and sixty five Days of UFOs, A Year of Alien Encounters, and this is really three hundred and sixty five stories, right, Yeah, that's exactly what it is. And basically, it's like whenever I write a book, you know, I don't just
sort of write a book from the perspective being a writer. You know, I'm also a reader of books as well, and so I always try and put myself in the position of not just the writer but the reader and think, you know, what would I like to write about. I haven't done yet. And you know, most of my books, it's not all of them, apart from this one, have been on specific subjects, whether Roswell or UFO contactees or the Men in Black. But with this one, the
theme is not you know, any particular or specific theme. The theme is a UFO case for every day. Now, you know, obviously I've got the famous ones like Roswell and Rendles, from Forrest and Betty and Barney Hill. But what I've also done is, for the most part, given the reader just previously unknown cases. Now, the reason why I've been able to do that is because, you know, when people are sort of generous enough to share their stories with me, and you know, they sort of kindly
let me use them in the books and so on. Very often a lot of those stories that don't get used because they don't necessarily fit into anything un particularly writing about, because you know, they're not relevant to, say, Roswell or the Men in Black. So as good as the stories are, very often you know, they just end up in a word document or whatever. But with this book, the theme is any subject. It's just you
know that the date issue is the theme. So that's allowed me to use a lot of cases that you know, I've never revealed before because I wouldn't have known what book to put them in. So the book covers everything from you know, sort of January the sixth might be a crop circle case, March the fourth, you know, might be a contact case. August the
tenth could be a crash ufo. And the years are at random, you know, so March the fifth might be nineteen fifty seven, March the sixth might be twenty twelve, you know, And so I've tried to keep it very varied. So you know, the first story might be you know, UFO landing, the next one's a crash. One after that somebody's seen a dead alien, you know, in a military base. Everyone sort of jumps from one angle to another. Really mm hmm, yeah, I think that
is a super interesting idea. It's such a it's a ton of fun. And I mean especially for people who are interested in a topic, or even if they're not, if they're just curious, or even just for fun, because then every day you can take the book and look at, well, what happened on this day. I think people like that because sometimes, I mean the book is quite a long one. It's about four hundred pages, so you know, it's roughly a better page or so on average per case.
And I think when you have a big book or fairly big book, you know, sometimes people don't want to wait up from page one to page four hundred. You know, it can take time and they have to go back, you know, and reread stuff to make sure they're following the story properly. But when you've got sort of three hundred and sixty five cases. You know, you can just pick it up from the beach, you know, or on the couch or whatever, and just dip into it in any
random order. You know. I think people do like that at times, and you know, they're like just being able to pick something up and oh, what's this story about? What's that one about? You know, without having to sort of go from page one to four hundred in you know one go mm hmm. Do you happen to have the book with you right there? Yeah? I do? Could you tell us about today's story? So let's do both. So today is actually the second, but this is going
to air on uh Monday, and let's see what's Monday. I don't even know. People are dying for an episode. I haven't had one forever because we just had the conference and I was so busy. So they're starting to get mad. They start to get mad at me. They're like, where's do you ever don with forever? So the sixth, So let's read what's on March second first, if that's okay, okay, Well, March the
second dates from the year for it. He is nineteen seventy seven and he deals with like a Roswell type case, but in the Jungles of Peru. And this actually deals with some sort of objects that came down in the Jungles of Peru in March nineteen seventy seven, which were described as looking like an
egg crossed with like a tear drop of that kind of shape. And a number of military people have come forward to talk about this particular crash, claimed to seeing the object and it had this sort of gigantic almost like a torn out piece of metal in the side of the craft, as if it had
been sort of violently, you know, affected in mid air. Now, apparently there weren't any bodies or crew members supposedly, but there were sort of three holes which were described as hatches, which sort of led to speculation that, you know, could it have been some sort of escape pod emergency escape pod type situation. But it's sort a very sort of fascinating and little known case, this nineteen seventy seven one from Peru that is interesting. Do you
remember where that came from? It's actually, i mean, most of the cases in the book come from my own records, but this one came from an old journal I've got uncrashed UFOs. I think it's like from nineteen eighty one or eighty two, something like that. That's a pretty weird one. So March sixth, right, so for the listeners that's today. Oh well, that's an interesting one because you know the excuse me, you know the
lon Is Amora case from Socorro in April sixty four. Well, this one is also from Socorro, but on March the sixth, nineteen eighty eight, now, and this one it was sort of very difference to the whole Scoro in the same town you know, years before. This one was actually one of the ones that's brought to me directly from a guy named Max Sparks, and he was actually driving through town and he said he saw this small sort
of circular shaped ufo. It was actually only about two feet in diameter, and it flew over his car as he was he actually pulled at the time he saw it. He pulled to the side of the rose. He got a flat tire, so he was changing the tire and this sort of two foot circular UFO flew over and he said it was like gray and collar and giving off this strange like a like a weird buzzing noise like and but quite a deep buzzing noise where it kind of made him feel a little bit sick
as it went over. Now, as I point out in the book, if we saw something like that today, we'd almost certainly saying, you know, that's a drone. But this was nineteen eighty eight, so we're talking next year, it'll be thirty years ago. So you know, I'm not I'm not convinced it was it was a drone. Whether it could have been some sort of prototype, you know, classified military thing that was being test
flown back then. Bear in mind, you know, we talked about New Mexico, where a lot of WIRZ stuff has been tested over the years. I don't think that's impossible, or you know, maybe it was a legitimate UFO, because I actually have in the book about nine or ten cases where people had seen UFOs that were only sort of like two or three feet in diameter, and some of them people describe like something along the lines of like a beach ball sized type object, sometimes with spike sticking out of them.
And I think there's three or four cases like that, So in other words, there's probably you know, more than a handful of cases in the book where these UFOs that people have seen are actually not just small, but like really small. Yeah, that is really interesting. I know. There are some photos that at least you know, my boss is really interested in too, and they are pretty weird. They come from Texas And this was a guy who was a guard at a and he took a video that I know
had gotten a lot of attention a few years ago. But yeah, he also took these pictures. We have a story of these real tiny little things that were flying around. Yeah, there's some really weird one in along hose line. Do you want me to do? You want me to find your birthday? Okay? Sure, July seventeenth, July seventeen. Okay, let's have a look what July seventeen is even I have to check when the stream and the sixty five of them. You know, it takes a well to
try. You can't remember all those all right, let's have a look. It's gonna be a weird alien one. Yeah, well that actually that was the day. I mean, you know the Surpo story, uh huh. You know, it's controversial story and these sort of allegedly leaked documents about this sort of trip to another world undertaken by the US military personnel, and then like a teav of aliens coming here, kind of like the last few minutes
of close encounters to the third kind. Well, July the seventeenth in nineteen sixty five was one of several dates that have been put forward over the years for when the human team, the astronaut team supposedly went to that other planet. So that's why I've got it down for that particular day. See, I think Doty made that stuff up, that guy Richard Doty, But he probably because he knows that I'm so interested in his whatd he write that?
Maybe he used my birthday on purpose to dig out? I'm just kidding. That's interesting though. Now you mentioned Sikoro, and the last one was near there, and that's near the White Sands, you know where there's a lot of testing. That's actually Sakurro's very near the Trinity site. I've heard of a lot of sightings. Do you think there's more sightings in that area than than than normal because it's not like densely populated, but you hear of a
lot of stories out there. Well, you know, it's hard to say. I mean there's no doubt that over the years, you know, New Mexico has had a huge number of UFO cases, and in the forties, you know, there are a ton of reports. Now, of course, the big question is when you're dealing It's kind of like with Area fifty one, when you're dealing with places where we know classified experiments and weird looking aircraft are being flown. You know, although there's a really genuinely real UFO phenomenon,
the big question is is knowledgy develops. It's all the issue is going to be trying to tell the difference between their UFOs and quote, how are UFOs, you know what I mean? And so I'm always careful when you're dealing with sort of profound UFO cases in areas very close to not just military
bases, you know that's not necessary an issue. But when it's sort of classified off limits places, you know, surrounded by mountains and desert and whatever, then I think we have to be careful what category put him in, or if we put him in any category. You know this one from Max Spark's the one in Sacoro in eighty eight. You know he's seeing it in eighty eight like a two to three foot circular thing making a buzzing noise and
flying overhead would probably amaze people today, really, wouldn't you know. You'd think, oh, yeah, somebody's flying, he's drone around or whatever. So I think, you know, we always have to keep those kind of things in mind when we realize, you know, we're talking about things close
to white sands or close to this base or whatever. But in saying that, you know that that cannot explain you know, some of the really good, credible cases that occurred in the like forties and which have are mentioned in you know, freedom information files. Some of those just those cases, a lot of them like Untouchable, because it's clear that we weren't flying things like
that back then. That's what's exciting about that, Max Sparks one because even if it is, you know, a drone that was seen early on before they were known to the public, that's kind of exciting because you know, these military devices like the drones, it's all of a sudden, you know they're in the news, but they're usually well developed and there's something that they're using. So there's obviously some history there that we're not aware of, and
so it's exciting. I think when people say they've caught glimpses of something that was secretive and was advanced, and now it's no longer because well, it lends to the possibility that we could spot something advanced that way, right, You're right, and I mean, you know it's we know that when for example, in the late eight is when the Stealth Bomber and the Stealth Fighter were sort of rolled out, you know, from the angers, and people
saw these large black you know, swept back, weird looking triangular showed things. You know, we know that they're on the drawing board, and in nineteen seventy five, and we in prototype form we're only reflying just a couple of years after that, and we didn't get to know them about them until like eighty eight. So in that sense, I'm pretty sure that there are
things on the drawing board now that we really don't know anything about. And I'm quite sure that if they're flying around and occasionally they get seen by mistake, you know that whoever's flying them, he's quite happy for people to think,
oh, it's little green men because it actually good cover. Now, that doesn't take away the fact that there are legitimate, really good, genuine UFO cases, but I think the phenomenon has been can be manipulated, you know, as a camouflage for classified aircraft flights and that kind of thing, and I wouldn't be surprised, you know, if that's happened quite a lot, really, And so you know, the big question is how we differentiate between hours and theirs, you know, and and as our technology develops,
will we be able to even you know, sort of figure out the differences or the similarities. M hm. Now, the motivation behind writing the book I can really identify with two is these cases that you really love that you know, you couldn't really put out there or didn't have a way to put out there, and this kind of lent a vehicle for you to do that.
Because I've got those favorite cases too that maybe I've written an article, but I'm always looking at an excuse to talk about them because they're really good cases, and I think people should know about what is maybe one of those cases in particular that is in your book that you were, you know,
really itching to get out to people that you're excited about. Well, actually, I wouldn't say basically just one, but there were some of the like really weird and creepy men in black cases that had never used before, you know, I mean, like I mentioned, you know when I spoke at your conference last year, there's this perception that the men in black, the real men in black, are like Will Smith and Tommy Lee Jones in the movies, you know, when the reality they're sort of much creepier and weird
looking, you know, like really pale and gaunts and these large eyes they hide behind these big black sunglasses. And what sort of fascinated me was the sort of sheer number of reports that were coming in from various parts of the
world. So I've got a number of never before seen men in black cases from the US, but also from places like Puerto Rico, South America, all over the place, and and so I wanted to put those into you know, to demonstrate people to people that this is like a worldwide phenomenon, and you know, they come across almost far less UFO stop based store isn't more like a almost like a Gothic horror story. That's so how weird and
creepy they actually are. It's funny you say that because when I think of men in back, because I'm more familiar with the stories and they're so odd it almost makes me think of American horror story. You know, it's just creepy and weird and just enigmatic and creepy. Yeah, that kind of like a cross between like a cross between nineteen fifties gangsters and you know, like like some sort of gothic vampire that they kind of you imagine a blend of
a too. That's sort of you know, the black for door and the black suits, but you know they look sickly. You know they're going to keel over kind of thing. Yeah, and I'll touch on this real quick because I know we're running out of time, But you also have a book called Women in Black. I mean, is it the same for these women in black that have been seen? Are they gaunt and creepy as well?
Yeah, they're sort of pretty much the same, really, And you know, they turn up in relation to UFO encounters and warn people not to talk about what they've seen, or they try and find a way to get information out of them. And again they don't look you know, completely normal. But just coincidentally, when you're on about you know, you're just talking about articles and so on and things like that just coincidentally, today I wrote an
article for Mysterious Universe which would be up in a couple of days. Were actually made a mention of you because she wrote about it was the Jackie Gleeson one. Yeah, the President Nixon, So which is see know, it's one of those sort of really bizarre, over the top stories, but it's one that still makes people think, well, is it so over the top that it could be true? So it's kind of like an interesting one, it is. And I think it was that the Nixon Library. I actually
went to and got some photographs that are in my story online. Feel free to use of if you want, because it's got Nixon and Jackie Lison playing golf together. Yeah. So I guess to wrap up, what is your next project? Because you're you. It's just like I said earlier, it's amazing how much you put out and how many books that you've got, and it looks like, you know, you've got three in just the last like
six months. What's your next book? Well, my other big interest is sort of like cryptozoology, unknown animals, and I've got one coming out the end of August. It's called Shape Shifters, and it's like a history of sort of in culture history, folklore, mythology of creatures that could change shape, you know. So I've got the obvious ones like were wolves in there, but also you know, like Native American legends of like the coyote and
things like that, the skin walkers. So it's like sort of almost like an A to Z, not an a to Z star, but it's kind of like an a to Z of stories of shape shifting creatures, if you like. And and where the you know, the stories came from and looking at the you know, the different theories that again that have been put forward for what these kind of things might be mm hmm. And what's the best place for people to find your books? Where would you prefer they go?
Produce them? Well, all the books are available on Amazon, and quite a few of them you can get off the shelves in Bonds and Noble, or they can order them in for you as well. And people I have a blog called World of Whatever. So people type in Nick Redfern World of Whatever you'll see the link to my blog and people can contact me there, and they can also reach me at Facebook. There are a few Nick redperones there, but scroll down and you'll find me, so thank you so much
for being on the show again. I think everybody needs to go out and get your book and I can't wait to read what the Daily what the UFO story is, So thank you very much. All Right, well, thanks a lot a learned, Joe, thank you, Thank you so much, Snick for coming on the show again. So really cool. This is a great book. He's got thirty three hundred and sixty five days of UFOs, a year of alien encounters. So check that out. You can see what
alien encounters might have happened on your birthday. Hopefully you don't open the book look at your birthday and then find out that you're the result of some sort of alien encounter. That would be kind of creepy, huh. But yeah. You'll be able to find his book on Amazon or at Nick Redfern fourteen dot blogspot dot com, and or you could google Nick Redfern's World of Whatever and you will find Nick Redferns blog page. So and he's got lots of
stories he puts up there on a regular basis. He's just a busy, busy, busy fella, always got something going on. So great guy, So thank you so much for being on the show Nick. Otherwise, all of the UFO news that we talked about earlier today you will find at Openminds dot Tv. Also, I'll be writing up a story on George Bush. In fact, I'm gonna finish that up, so by the time you hear this, the George Bush story will be up, so you'll be able to
go see what he said on Jimmy Kimmel Live. So and also, like I said, keep an eye on our social media. So probably starting tomorrow, we'll be doing some Tom DeLong giveaways and some discount codes. So when Tom Delong's book just does come out to nonfiction, you'll be able to get a discount on that. So I know many of you plan to purchase it, why not get it at a discount, So check out our social media
for that. Otherwise, the shows, so, uh, don't kill me, but I'm gonna be on vacation on Monday, So for next week, I will not be posting a show on Monday, but I will be doing an interview with Leslie Caine. So of course we have some interesting things to talk about with her, and we will, but we'll also be talking about her new book, so we'll have some ufone news at the beginning with Leslie, but we're gonna be talking a lot about her new book, which is
around senator on life after death. So I think it's really interesting. I think a lot of our listeners see that it's interesting. But she also wants to share why she decided to write this book and how it relates to UFOs, so I'm very curious about hearing that. So we'll have Leslie Kane will actually be posting it on Wednesday, so as soon as I get back from my vacation, I will work on getting that posted so I can have it as soon as possible. I knew you will probably would not tolerate me not
getting out another show next week, so we will have another show. It'll just be a little late. Other than that, you know, I'm gonna do my best to get back to getting some shows out on a weekly basis. So I apologize for this break. However, it was for a very important thing, the UFO Congress, which went so well. If you want to see the videos of the lectures, you can go to our Openminds dot tv store. So if you go to the page, you'll see the store
and you could get DVDs. Otherwise, you can get our streaming video service, and this is really what I think you should do. Go to open Minds dot tv and you'll see links for the streaming video service. You'll also see them at Ufocongress dot com And we've already got James Fox on there so you can watch his new lecture about the Phoenix Lights, which included never before
seen video of Fife Simington. So of course you've all seen some video of him talking about the Phoenix Lights and how he now feels he he, you know, saw the Phoenix Lights and they were an ET spacecraft. Now, James Fox is a guy who got him to come out about that. So in this video lecture from the UFO Congress, you'll be able to see James Fox talk about that. You'll also see him show some video when Fife Simington came clean, so you'll see that and you'll see what fIF Simington said because
he said a lot more. He talked about looking to the Pentagon, the Pentagon knowing but not sharing information that he felt like some of the official stuff that came out was bunk. I think that's the word he uses, bunk. So really interesting comments that James has not been able to show the public before that you'll see for the first time in this video, so go to the Open Mind's UFO video portal to be able to see that. There's a
very low monthly subscription. Definitely by far the best deal, because if you want to rent a video just a one off you can. However, it costs about just as much just to subscribe and then have access to everything. We've got hundreds of video hours of videos up there. I think we have at least one hundred videos, but we've got a ton almost one hundred, if not one hundred, because we have all the past UFO Congresses and we'll
be posting on a regular basis the twenty seventeen UFO Congress videos. James Fox is the first one, but you'll see more as time goes on, so check that out. I think that's it for today. I hope you all enjoyed the show. It's great to be back. Thank you all so much for listening, and thank you very much to the listeners who came up to say hi at the conference. It's always so nice to meet you guys and to see you. It's very inspiring. It really helps motivate me to keep
doing what I'm doing, and I hope you got that sense. I'm always so busy at the conference, and I always try to take the time to say hello and thank you, and I hope that I did a sufficient job of doing that and letting you know how much I appreciate you. So I do appreciate you all so very very much. That's it for today. Thank you so much to Caleb Hanks for the opening end closed music. Thank you to Martin Willis for joining us for the news at the beginning of the show,
and thank you all so much for listening. Name I will talk to you next week. Adios, moved chachos, your emotions sound Glas Garrio's hollering