Chuck Zukowski, Fired for paranormal investigations

Radio. Welcome to Open Minds Radio with Alejandro Roja. Open Minds Radio is the UFO news authority, presenting evidence and the latest news regarding the UFO phenomenon. Here's your host, Alejandro Roja. Hello and welcome to Open Minds Radio. This is Alejandro Rojas. Just like the Gentleman has said, and you are listening to Open Minds Radio. And it's very exciting today because we have

mister Chuck Sukowski. Chuck. You might have seen a story that we wrote about Chuck recently, and in fact it was also kind of around Colorado media. So if you're from Colorado, you probably saw this on the news that Chuck, unfortunately was fired as a deputy sheriff because he was doing paranormal investigation. So that is not cool whatsoever. So we're gonna have Chuck on the

show to talk about that. And also one of the things he was getting so much media attention for lately was that he was doing cattle mutilation research and we'll talk about some of his latest findings there because there has been a lot of mutilations going on in the last couple of years in Colorado, so we will be talking about that. So that's going to be really exciting. Chuck's

always a lot of fun, so stay tuned. Also, subscribers have been asking about the magazine that's in Root if you haven't gotten your latest April May issue yet, and it's a pretty exciting one. It's got lots of cool stories in it. In fact, we had Robert Hastings who along with Robert Salis, put together a press conference in September where they had some military officers

come to talk about UFOs at nuclear facilities. And Robert Hastings wrote a book called UFO Nukes and he is the pro, the expert at that subject, so very cool. We've had him on the show before, We've had Solace on the show. We've also had Colonel Halt on the show who was also part of that. But that's what the article on the magazine is all about. So this is going to be a real fun one. We've got what UFOs in New York because there were some signings out there. Story on that

that we wrote. Jason has something on Chinese lanterns because that's been a big story and I think we told you all we went and launched them, and I believe because I haven't heard anything that in my little town, Americopa, that we didn't light anything on fire, that they were safe launches that came back to Earth unlit and safely. Hopefully nobody got hurt, No squirrel got caught in it. Oh, that'd be awful. So some cool stories that

we have in there. What else Gary McKinnon, I wrote about Gary McKinnon. What did Antonio do for this one? I can't remember. I should write down the stories. I can't tell everybody everything anyway, though, because they got to get the magazine and check it out themselves, because it's also

at the bookstore any minute now. Well. And also that magazine was put together a little while ago, and we're already another magazine into the process, so it's hard to remember everything that was in the True that issue because now we're working on our special Roswell edition and that's going to be coming out in June. So and this is really cool. Some of you are like, oh, man, I know all about Roswell. Well wait till you see

this magazine. Because we've got Don Schmidt writing about tons of witnesses talking about the actual creature creatures that we're seeing. I mean, the evidence which is quite substantial that there was a being that was captured there. We've got information about the best movie ever on Roswell by Paul Davids, who we've had on

the show and the guy who discovered the whole thing. You might not know that, Stanton Friedman, and he talks about how that all started and how he discovered it and the initial research and how all that happened and more so, lots of cool stuff on that coming soon. Coming even sooner is the news, because of course you notice on our website that we do news on a daily basis, the headlines from around the world on the UFO subject, and of course if you're part of our Facebook you'll see that as well.

Unfortunately, you can't be part of the Open Minds like Radio Facebook anymore because it's full. But that's okay because you can go to Open Minds Magazine. Just go to Facebook and if you're on the internet, do that right now. Go to Facebook and search for Open Minds Magazine and like it and then you'll get all of those updates and you can have all of your friends do this because we're not capped at five thousand for that like we are with our

other Facebook. So unfortunately, sorry, all you guys who are trying to friend us on Facebook and we can't do it five thousand limit for some reason. So go check that out and you'll see the headlines. And if you can't wait for that, well then let's just get Jason on the air here and have him tell us about the news. Jason, Hello, Hi Ela Andre, how are you today? Doing all right? Doing all right? Excellent? Before I get into the news, I want to ask you.

Did you happen to see the super moon? I did? Did you? Yeah? Were you blown away? Yeah? It reminded me of you know, if there's some other there's people who probably watched Dragon Ball Z and when Goku goes super saying he like lights up and before he does a kami hami ha, and that it was like that super and you're staring at you blankly. I wasn't that impressed. I gotta say, it's kind of cloudy out here, and I've seen the moon much larger. Well, I think we

got screwed here. Well, we've talked about that before, and I think this is one of those incredible things in astronomy that when the moon is lower on the horizon, how it looks really big. It's not closer right. In fact, the moon was at its closest point when at the supermon moment this weekend. But nobody knows why. Scientists can still not explain why the moon looks so big at the horizon but looks so small. There's a whole lot the scientists can't explain. That's true, and that is one of them.

Yep. But let's get into the news. Greetings everyone, this is your Open Minds newsbrief for Monday, March twenty first, twenty eleven. The Origins Project at Arizona State University is presenting a science and culture festival at which famed Simpson's care director Stephen Hawking, who's also an actual, real life astrophysicist, will be delivering a lecture. The Origins Project's website describes the festival as a celebration of the interface between science, the humanities, and the fine arts.

The festival will also feature the Dear Aliens Contest award ceremony. We talked about this Dear Aliens Contest a couple weeks ago. This is a contest that was launched by Hawkings's daughter, Lucy, and she asked students to submit answers to the following question, if you had to speak for humanity, what would you say? Submissions will be reviewed by a panel of alien experts made up of writers, scientists, and scholars, and the winner will be announced with

the award ceremony, which is open to the public. Contest winners will have their message broadcast into space. At the event, they're actually going to bounce it off the moon. Wow. The Origins Project Science and Culture Festival takes place at various locations on a Issues Tempe campus from April seventh through April eleventh, And from what I read at the Dear Aliens Contest Award ceremony, Issue

Professor Paul Davies will also be there. And we've talked about Paul Davies before on the show, and he's actually been a guest on the show too. It's a wonderful guys. I thought personally he was a great guest and he's he's a fascinating person to listen to, and he's got a couple of books out and he talks a lot about looking for extraterrestrial life here on Earth in

the form of bacteria and things like that. Yeah, in your nose, Yeah, he's the in the nose alien guy, right, really is what he's kind of gotten in the news for a lot, because he thinks there's these secondary biospheres, that alien life may be here right now, and that and the microbial type of way, and that there are these biospheres, are these tracts of alien life on the planet, just as these little bacteria and

stuff that, such as the bacteria that live in our nose. Why he had to bring up our nose in particular, I'm not quite sure, because I think a lot of people avoid the nose, that sort of uncharted territory. People want don't want to go looking in the nose. Yeah, I mean when you go to the doctor, he kind of explores that area. But well, and there was that movie with Martin Short where he was kind of cruising around and I'm uncomfortable talking about the nose. Let's not talk about

the nose anymore. People don't like the nose. I don't like the nose. I don't think doctors like the nose. I don't shove that thing up your nose. They're just pretending. They're just trying to get it over with. They're not actually looking, because who wants to look up a nose? Kind of gross. That's gross. Well on sort of a similar subject to

the essay contest that Ashu was holding another school we talk about that. It seems like almost every week now another school in the UK shows extraterrestrials as the subject of a student creative writing project. Teachers at Weak Primary School in Winchester, England created a scenario last week where an alien egg UFO crashed on school

grounds. Students investigated the staged crash site, complete with alien blood and flime, with the help of local police, student scientists from the University of Winchester and a ufologist from the University of Warwick. Following their investigations, students were encouraged to write news reports for newspapers and television news. This is fascinating again. I think all of these teachers must have gone to the same teaching seminar

or conference or something and all got the same idea. It's really weird. They're all using UFOs for their writings. And it helps now that you mentioned because it's in the UK that they've been doing this mostly, which is true and which is kind of strange. And it's the UK. But the movie Paul was made by British blokes right, who went through the UK schooling system

and they created this great I saw it yesterday. I thought it was great, very funny movie about an alien and just hanging out and being buddies with an alien. They're starting them young over there. Yeah, there's some conspiracy

there. There has to be something, but it is fascinating that. I mean, we talk about this every single week, another school doing the same thing or similar things, you know, staging a crash and some of the schools and even had theater students dress up as extraterrestrial beings and interact with the students and the students are required to interact and sort of show them around. And well, I could see how the kids would get energized and get into

it, and it would be imaginative. They would have a chance to be creative and have fun, you know at school when typically school's not fun. I didn't think so you, poor soul. I wanted to jump and laugh and dance and sing and I couldn't. I get in trouble was discouraged at your school. Yeah that's too bad. We had to sit there and be boring. All I did was jump and dance and sing. That's all I do here as well. You probably started off in public school. It's in

parochial school, public school. It's anything goes. That's exactly how it is. Yeah. A humanoid robot is the newest member of the International Space Station's crew. The Space Shuttle Discovery delivered Robonaut, also known as R two weeks ago, but astronauts have just unpacked the new crew member on Tuesday. R two is intended to be begin serving as a helper to the astronauts aboard the

space station in the coming decade. His initial testing begins in May, but for now he is simply attached to a pedestal waiting for his legs to arrive, which will be delivered to the International Space Station next year. Poor guy has no legs for a year. For a year, he's just got to kind of hang out and say, look at me. That. The topic

of robots and artificial life was also recently mentioned by CBS News. The article pointed out that some scientists believe that artificial life is most likely what would come off of spaceship if one landed on Earth. Professor of Computer science that UCLA recently said if an extraterrestrial spaceship ever lands on Earth. I bet you that it's ninety nine point nine nine nine percent likely that what exists, what exiss

the ship will be synthetic in nature. We talked about that last week from that article, but a lot of talk about robots in space, and a lot of the arguments you could say they make sense. You know, robots handle space better than we do, and with long distances to be traveled, robots can just be shut off and turned on when they need to when they actually get there a thousand years later. And do you know what's funny.

Here's the scenario I see. As we create I want to we send it into space, it takes us a thousand years to get to Alpha Centauri. By the time it gets there, we'll have created some spaceship that can go through a wormhole where then humans are going. And so we'll go to Alpha Centauri two hundred and fifty years after we launch your robots, and the robots won't get there till we've already collated the area and made friends with the aliens.

And it'll be a big joke. It'll thousand years later, the robots will show up and every look at the robots, we s right, It'll be pretty funny because they'll probably be programmed to get there and then report and send back a signal when they find something, so they'll get there and go human human and everybody else. But I think that the point being that,

I think it's only a small gap, small period of time. That is, civilization is not capable enough to have have spaceflight where they're actually taking beings as opposed to to robots. Don't. It's probably not like these guys think, you know, it mostly robots out there. Well, you could talk about it all day, but you know, I don't don't know if the problem is our capability of being in space. There seems to be something else going on. We could easily, it seems, build a base on the

moon and go from there, but we haven't done that yet. Yeah. True, there's something fishy going on. Yeah, so I don't know. But robots for now seem to be what they're pushing. And clearly these people have not watched Terminator. Well, if that makes them more open, and some of them are more open to the idea that UFOs are robots, So if that makes scientists feel more comfortable exploring the UFO arenas, then so be it. Whatever they need to do to convince themselves it's okay to look into

it. But you know what, I have bad news. You shouldn't worry about ever meeting an alien. Really, no extraterrestrials. You're not going to meet one. I know what The story you're talking about, Oh yeah, was a story recently published on Time Magazine's website. It took a very cynical

view towards the search for extraterrestrial life. The piece was called Relax, you don't need to worry about meeting et and the story was filled with statements like if exobiologists have learned anything, it's that you and your kids and their kids kids will probably never hear the slightest peep from an alien. It was a very negative piece and sort of jumped to a lot of conclusions and kind of

poo pooed the whole thought of extraterrestrial life. Well that and it's just so I think that to me, and I don't know if maybe I'm just being naive or unscientific. It seems very barbaric science to assume to make the types of assumptions they make in here, that even though the planet the one planet we first discovered and knew had any knowledge about, which was our very own is abundant with life, even though this planet has life that no others can

have that right sequence of mixture of stuff. They even admitted in this story that Mars probably had life at one point, right, So, I mean that's the next closest planet. And they were sort of arguing with themselves too, because they were bringing up the fact that even here on Earth we continue to discover our new life forms. We discovered life that is able to survive

in harsh environments like insight, volcanoes and things like that. Well, and then the concepts of that the distances other places are so far away, there's no way we'll ever be able to travel there and here again. You know, I'm sure that's what people thought. It is what people thought about crossing the ocean or even being able to fly right. Oh, it's absolutely impossible. Well, but just because it may be impossible to us right now doesn't

mean it will continue being that way. It doesn't mean it's that way for other life forms. It doesn't mean that other life forms might have not if they're not already here, doesn't mean other life forms didn't start their journey. Nine hundred and ninety nine years ago and will be coming here next year.

It would be an interesting psychological study to find out if I would think that people who believe that so strongly and impossible and that certain things are impossible, wouldn't make good theoretical scientists, because really, if you look at science, nothing's impossible. Everything has been able to be done that a lot people have sought to do, many, many, many things that many others have said it as impossible. Nothing. It seems unwise to think that anything is necessarily

impossible. We just haven't figured it out yet, right all. This a just an interesting story. It's not necessarily new news, but it's fascinating at least I think it's fascinating. But the UK's Daily Mail recently ran a story about some of Saturn's strange moons. These small moons have puzzled scientists because of their odd shape, making them look more like flying saucers than moons. The Cassini spacecraft has captured images of Atlas and Pan, two of these moons.

They were likely formed at the same time as Saturn's rings. Scientists think these oddly shaped moons were once spinning discs, and forces caused the edges of the structure to flatten out and a bulge to form towards the center. But the pictures of these things look really strange. They look just like flying saucers. Yeah, there are some weird looking moons. It's crazy how many, you know, when you think about these other planets, just how many moons they

have. Yeah, and then here Earth, we've got our lonely little moon. Compared to those moons, We've got a pretty good looking moon. I like our moon a lot. It's pretty cool now. And again, this is not new news. It's making headlines today if we're an update, But rockstar Sammy Hagar admits he has been contacted by extraterrestrials on multiple occasions. This

say isn't breaking news. It's these discussed alien encounters in the past. However, the subject is currently making headlines resulting from an interview with Hagar conducted by mtvhive dot com. The interview briefly explores the topic of UFOs after Hagar revealed that a passage about alien dreams in his new book read My Uncensored Life in Rock is based on a true encounter. While the mention of UFOs is brief

in his new book. Hagar revealed in the interview, my opinions about the UFO stuff well, I could write a whole book just devoted to that. I love it, man, I'm into it deep. Well, they asked I saw one angle of one of the stories was that they asked, you know, about his UFO dreams, and he was like, no, that weren't dreams. That was real, that really happened. I talked to Aliens. And it caught the interviewer off guards. Yeah, so what I was

just kidding? You're seriously And he's like, yeah, dude, I talked to Aliens. Man. And of course, yeah, we've talked about this on the show before because we wrote a story on it. But he's not afraid to just say, oh, yeah, I talked to Aliens, just like him and Ilium's enough they are in the news. Not ever afraid to say, yeah, I met Aliens and he wanted to talk a lot more about it than this this particular book. But the person who's writing the book

with didn't say, no, people will think you're crazy. He said, no, man, people don't care about that stuff. Yeah, but a lot of people do. And it's funny because he's getting a lot of press for his book off of this story, and the headlines haven't been talking about Jobe Hagar has a new book. It's saying Sammy Hagar believes in UFOs.

Well, that must be why that interview view is in Journalists might as supposed to pr because certainly people are interested in that staff, absolutely, and especially when it comes to a rock star, you know, and like he says, it's his inspiration comes from this, right, So yeah, I mean, people love Sammy Hagar and they want to know what inspired him if he says it's aliens, and you know, I'm sure his fans are cool with that. Mostly he's certainly cool with it, and that's pretty exciting. Yeah.

Back to our topic of space exploration, NASA recently tested a spacesuit that they hope will one day be used during missions to Mars. The NDX one spacesuit, designed by Argentine aerospace engineer Pablo de Leon, was tested for a week at an Argentine base in Antarctica. The location was chosen because the varying environmental elements and because Antarctica is one of the least contaminated places on Earth,

making it perfect for sample collection. The one hundred thousand dollars. Suit is made of more than three hundred and fifty materials, including honeycomb, kevlar, and carbon fibers. One hundred thousand dollars. One hundred thousand dollars. That's cheap for a NASSA. It's like an Harmoni suit. Usually everything cosh you know, million dollars. Yeah, one hundred thousand is is chump change for

them. It's kind of exciting too, because you know, again like we've been talking about how exciting even with a commercial spaceflight that we're getting to that age of now we need to build a Mars suit because we're starting to get ready to go to Mars. I mean they're talking about we'll be at possibly, you know, twenty twenty Mars. So that is pretty cool. And the suit is straight out of like nineteen fifties. It looks like comic books of sci fi. Oh yeah, red, with these tubes around it and

in a big like I don't know, like underwater helmets. I yeah, yeah, I mean they'll probably make it cool and get some Italian designers to come in and give some advice on where they nip and tuck and make it look a little snazzier, but I looked well, and I don't know. The guys who resigned the suit said that if you're slightly cluster phobic, you're not going to like this suit because it makes you feel really closed in and

you've got that helmet on. Yeah, it's very confining, and then you've got your intercom system all patched all over, so you feel kind of kind of closed in. Well, if this is version one, you know, they've got another five years or so they prepare make it a little friendlier for the astronauts. Well, hopefully they pick up the pace. I mean twenty twenty, that's that's not too far away, but yeah, they can do

a little faster. You know, this year, I've been thinking a lot about how I used to think, Wow, twenty twelve, how old am I going to be? And how far away that is? And it's almost twenty twelve now, so and the older you get. Supposedly, what I hear from the old guys is that time speeds up, so seven years might just pass like this. I was thinking that earlier this week because when I initially read this story, and I was thinking about twenty twenty, why are

they waiting so long? But that's not very far away. Yeah, and it may be maybe you know, they'll be like, well, we've discovered there's life on Mars. There's some creatures up there. Will you guys come with us, meaning you know me, you maybe they'll bring Maureen to to go, so you'll be the guys to communicate with the aliens because you guys know more about this stuff, and we'll get to have our own little poll experience where we'll get out there and get to hang out with the alien.

Didn' already ask you? No, I got my email? Oh man, no fair, Sorry, Bud, I guess that was secret. But these are exciting times. It's always exciting, Alejandro. Think of the kid, I mean, think of being a ten year old kid right now we're in. By the time you're twenty, we're going to Mars. I'm thinking about myself when I'm fifty. Screw the kids. Exciting. Yeah, I'll be a kid glued to my window and going out bouncing around in my space. Yeah. Oh yeah, I'm ready. Awesome. Well that is it for

the news, Alejandro. Be sure to check out these stories at more Openlindes dot tv, your source for UFO related news. I'm Jason McClelland you're a UFO correspondent and you've been briefed back to you, mister Alejandro. Thank you, Jason. Another job well done. And now you guys are all briefed on the news and you're up to speed on the latest and the greatest, so you can go to the watercooler tomorrow and be mister cool guy. Hey,

you guys, hear about the latest on the UFOs. Pretty cool stuff, and then everybody's gonna think you're the best, especially the uh Sammy Hagar fans, because there's a lot of them go to the water cooler and say, hey, you guys like rock You guys like some Sammy Hagar, Well, he was inspired by aliens. I don't know why you have to use this kind of weird accent I'm using, but it'll be a lot of fun to go to work and do that. I want to tell you about a

couple other stories that we have on the website. This is really cool and it makes me proud to work with the colleagues that I do. With the Wendell Stevens archives that we acquired, of course, Wendell Stevens being a pilot in the air Force who has been in the UFO business for decades since the beginning, even part he put in some blue book signings when he was in the Air Force, and so he's collected a lot of stuff. One of

the things that he's collected are the APRO bulletins. And this is an Aerial Phenomenal Research organization. It was created here in Arizona, and it was one of the largest organizations early on and made up of scientists for the most part

and devoted researchers. NICAP and some of these other more conservative organizations which were largely made up of military people really were into the nuts and bolts, and APRO was the first organization that actually opened up their purview to alien abduction or

Aarlien encounters or contactees and this sort of thing. And they were mostly you know, they did have some pretty impressive people as part of their organization, and they had some very impressive bulletins their journals that they would put out on a regular basis. Welluckily, Wendell Stevens had most of those in his collection

here. So what we've done is scan those and put those online. We have somewhere about from nineteen fifty five to nineteen seventy, not all of them, but most of them, and then we have some from nineteen seventy to nine, nineteen eighty that we're going to be putting up here soon too as we scan them. Jason actually has done most of scanning and created the page to make it look really nice, so he's done a good job there.

Antonio wrote the story so you can understand what the AFRO bulletins were in the background and the history behind that, and that is all up in our website. You can go to the resources tab and find UFO files and you'll be able to find those there. The Rockefeller document we've talked about is there also, and also the Colonel Corso document is there for people to look at.

So this is really exciting because these bulletins are pretty incredible. They've been invaluable for us for our research for the magazine and other stories that we write, because a lot of the original investigative work on some of the most important cases over the last few decades you can find in these documents, such as the Travis Walton case or some other famous crash cases or land cases, and it's very well researched and investigated, so it's very excited. I'm very excited that

we do have these up here. I know if I was just if I wasn't associated with Open Minds and you know, an independent investigator or with mof ON like I was before, I would be very excited that I'd be able to have access to these APRO bulletins. I was very excited when I found

they were hearing and it's great to go through them. So I implore you to go check those out because you're going to be fascinated by what you read there and very impressed by the diligent work done by these investigators in the past and these APRO bulletins. So it's very cool. We're going to get more up there soon. Also, we do have a UFO case files revealed that

is number twelve that's up. Michael Schratt of course has gone through different I witness UFO account and then what the person's saw, made a three D rendering and then put that in a background similar to where the person had seen it, so you can get a good idea and illustration on what that person might have seen. So we've got another one of those stories up too, so

check it out. Always check out our website because we're putting new stuff up there all the time, and it is a treasure trove for people who are looking for information. There's one guy out there too, looking for information, and he's he works so hard at it and he's gotten so much attention for it lately that he got fired over it. And that is my good buddy, Chuck Zukowski. Chuck, are you there? Oh? Angel am I here? It sounds like it all right? How are you doing? Good?

Good clothes? Everybody to populous regularly. So so you saw Paul yesterday too. I did see Paul yesterday. I did. That was a funny, funny movie. I would, uh not that I would get any musicuals from it, but yeah I would. I would recommend, uh, just for a righthearted movie, go and check it out. It was really interesting about this all handle was, uh, you know, they showed some of my little talking grounds, like you know a few years ago when I still

up in California, I hired a guide and met him. I met her at the Little Alien n at Rachel, Nevada, and we hiked the top

of the typic of the pe Corps. I could uh up the zoom you know, areas that you went off at a distance, and so you know, the movie kind of showed the way they man and showed the Rachel area and the extraterrestial highway and the blackmail boxes is not painted black, and it was kind of cool, you know, if you got a couple of supposedly geeks set of traveling looking all this stuff, I'm like, I'm kind of

hiding my eyes. Oh, I guess I'm one of those geeks. I'm rather afraid to be one of those geeks because really they didn't have a lot of UFO stuff in it, like you're talking about. They had that the Rachel and and stuff, but it's really kind of a sci fi geek fest, which I know you're a bit of a sci fi geek too, because I've been to sci fi conferences with you. Oh yeah, matter of fact that you know, the movie started off of Comic Con and San Diego.

When I lived in California, I used to volunteer working security at comic Con, so it was a lot of fun. Oh really, I didn't know that. Well, there they go. How cool? And that's a that thing has gotten so ridiculously popular that you know, all the movie releases are at Comic Con. I mean it's like one of the biggest conferences in the world. Now, Oh absolutely. I don't know if you ever saw the movie BOOKERU Bonds Eye, Yeah, old favorites right now, I have a

million head in my office. Hole, I have one of many heads and he's uh learning a team Bonds that I headband and I picked up. That's uh. That comic Con cool when they were introducing the movie Yarnevielle. Yeah, I still have artistac I should say artifacts though, I'll get the artects now because that don't all Yeah, they probably do have to be dested on. Yeah, along with along with some of the people that are up there

too. I did. Yeah, So I guess just to start, I had mentioned a lot about or I had mentioned something about how you've been getting a lot of attention in the media lately, and it seems like that's kind of what led up to the Sheriff's Department's decision here. But even though your website is UFO dot dot com and obviously you're you're a jovial person, the

media attention you've got has been pretty serious. It seems like most of the stories I've read where they've covered, you know, your counter mutilation investigations or some of the other investigations you've done. They've treated you pretty well and taken your work seriously. Oh absolutely, and that's really kind of cool about it.

And you know when someone they talked to me to go, well, you've got a wes I called the UFO nuts, and I have to explain to him that, you know, the whole basis of the main the UIFO nuts comes back in the day when you know, I first started doing this and people would, you know, they would contradict what I was doing and

calling me a nut. And so I decided instead of getting frustrated with you know that tag, I went ahead and uh, you know, put it all my life and played and then got Shirley thereafter, you know, built the website unful nut dot home and I kind of have I kind of have fun with it now. And basically also it's it's an acronym uful, not unconventional flying just non human and identified technologies, so and actually means something too. Imagine that did it start off as an acronym or did you make that

up later? I don't make anything up, you know that now, No, I'm creative. Uh. When I first yeah, what happened was the uphone that started to get so much at tension that uh just one not just looking at them, you know what that looks like it could mean this, And then I just kind of came up that and really, in reality it kind of does touched on on what uphone that really needs, you know,

non human identifile technologies. If you look at the UFO standpoint now, I asked for the animal retulations a matter of fact, and this is this is the first So this is a you know, this is the counts. There was open mind that do me five? No, I just I'm just kidding Renize. Yeah, I mean I don't let it said ala handle, but I bought that part out so I didn't want to get you in trouble. What happened is exactly what you said. You know. The last few years

I've been it's been a little serious. I've been getting a lot of serious coverage. The uh, the people visiting the website, very very very intelligent comments, very I mean, I'm so wow happy with the amount of people visiting the website and then emailing me and a shout out to not more than in true. The Bribons who who you know, who you know, helped me redesign the website to make it uh you know a little more whishl I say, uh, except yeah, it's okay, you can stay cooler.

O. The Prislla is listening high Prisilla yeah the other day. Okay, Hiera, I know her too. Yeah. But and Trina have done an incredible job with the website. I think it looks so cool, and they've made some really neat videos for you lately. Yeah. I heard that, you know, while they were all with you little Congress you were you were you're going to try and steal them from me and have them do something for you. But for that yeah, well you weren't there. You weren't there,

so that was my chance. No, yeah, yeah, unfortunately, I know I missed a phenomenal confidence and uh, you know, I'll tell you what all my ephold at work. I was kind of keeping up with the with the updates that people were posting on it, and then watching the Crystopher Brian videos that he was betting out on YouTube. So no, it's

not like being they're not even not even close. And that's really sad that I kind of missed that one, and I apologize to you for Yeah, you had other things to do, but I know to wash my hair that that weekend. Yeah, because you've got this long, lustrious hair. That's true. So, and what's kind of interesting is that we did have Chris O'Brien, who is a researcher back kind of from our neck of the woods back in Colorado, because he was one of the original researchers of the San

Luis Valley. But which is where or near in some cases where these mutilations were occurring that you have been investigating. Well, absolutely no, Saanllel's Valley is a very sacred area has been you know years before you know Europeans migrated to this part of North America, I should say, or even this part of the world. You know, the Native Americans have been going there for

hundreds of years. You know. I just talked to pursue this about it over the weekends and uh, just it's just amazing the history of that area and what's been going on and Hawaii, the Native Americans senture to that area. It's almost like it's almost a second to to Chocolate Canyon, although it doesn't have you know, the structures that Chocolate Canyon has. There are unique areas within the Sandlot's valleys that attracted the medics in the Four Corners region to

go there and to uh basically for spiritual gaping. M Panilla vel. I can't remember is she in New Mexico or is she in the valley? She's she's in New Mexico. Yeah, she's just she's just inside of evolve the Cooky. Okay, that's right, though I can't remember if she lived in

the valley or not for for a minute there. Well that that she's very you know, very knowledgeable that whole area, and uh, you know she's she's one of my uh uh you know gafs that uh uh you know that I r T contact when I have a question about uh you know, uh Native American president that area. And then also you know on my website I

reposted the Roswell Rock circle. Uh and uh you remember that when we went out to decide where where Robert Ridge is found of the rot I was more concerned about, you know, a Native American presidence in that area because of some of the artifacts were being founsands. The Priscilla wolffoft there to make sure that we uh, we were doing things that would be disrespectful for the Native

Americans. So, I mean there's there's certain things that are investigated. You have to think about when you know you're going into an area where artifacts are being taken out. First off, obviously you know bolm you know issues, you know whether or not it's uh, you know it's a property of the Mexico. And then the other issues basically give it the property of a Native American tribe that you know the reside h you know resided are resided in that

area, you know years and years ago. So it's you know, anyway, you have to you have to think about all the different areas that you need to cover. And then also you have to think about the areas soon that will help you make a sceptic proof and the bunk proof when you're doing retop of investigation. So anyhow, yep, now I want to We'll talk about the Roswell Rock Circle a little more in a minute, see if you

have some updates. But I wanted to get back onto the mutilations and get back to what there was a particular case that the Sheriff's Department referred to where they said you disagreed with their results. And that was a recent horse mutilation? Is that correct? Yeah? Absolutely, that was the Rush horse mutilation. That's true on August. Yeah, were actually the horses were found on August eleventh of last year. Yeah, so you can you fill us in

on this case, Oh sure, sure. Basically two horses were found mulated in August, and then there was actually two surviving animost one horse and one dog that was found with unknown marks on their body, not just random marks, the marks that you know, interesting enough, like you know, the markets done each one of the legs and in a very distinctive mark on the nose of the horse, I mean something that you could live they well,

you know that was a scar. I mean, these are something the marks, especially with the horse, that was so obvious that there was there that was very estivay type of thing. And then what is thing interesting about this was two days before one of the ranchers of the rants wife or her pushing sound almost like helicopter blades, uh through the daytime in the afternoon, and she looked up and you live out here in Colorado. If anybody else you

know who hadn't been out here in Colorado? One thing about Colorado is we don't have about three hundred and thirty days of clear skies. You know, we get about you know, we get a few days of thunder bending every everything kind of clears of knife and and you can pretty much guarantee you're gonna have at least three hundred days of nice not nice with the clear house out here, and so the sky work clear in the August Time train which she

was looking up and couldn't seen helicopters. Interesting thing about different types of relations we could touch up more but later is the rancher's perception of who run it, hacker Sex. But the bottom road on this particular case was, you know, where the mutilation occurred. It made the local media. I shot down there and h we'll be able to see the animal still while they were while they were there, and took uh, you know, my team out

there with the United Treina and the UH. And then they put together oh actually I should say they put together a really nice video on the website about it. But you know, it was picked up by the media and everywhere. I mean, I was getting emails from you know, England to make a recall where you know, Canada, I mean all over the place. And so Fox really was in Denver one of your story on it, and talked to the rancher's w Glenda, and said they want to come down to

interview her. And so she contacted me and she says, I've never done so fortunately, come down and meet with me and be there with me when it's you know, a Heidi reported for the Desert. Fox comes down and interviews me. I said, no, sure, of course, so that's the time off of work. And I went down there and she gets out of the interviewing too, and she basically said, you know, law enforcement

in general, you know there's issues. Well, I mean, how can these cases haven't been solved since I mentioned since the seven that are in Colorado? And my response with law enforcement in general basically, isn't prepared or is

this experience enough to these to these type of investigations. Now, I've been in law enforcement for eight years and I know that that there's certain deputies that take classes on, you know, on on cases where you know animals have been have been killed, so that she tells whether or not you know the animal was killed by uh uh by humans? Are naturalists? Right? The

animals? Is this training focus more on looking for foul play. I mean, they're not looking for unknown fact, they're looking exactly exactly, and I kind of know a little bit of the inside. I talked to the deputies who actually have taken these classes, and basically they're just afford me taught to human intervention that surrounds an you know, an unknown or surprised depth of an

animal, and then they do that. It's basically you know, cool to the ad to animals or something similar to that, which makes it a criminal act. And so I said, uh, this was a you know, this was not a from my experience and from what I've you know, researched and read in the past. The evidence that I saw, the evidence that I didn't see pretty much pointed towards an unknown predator or a or basically a

mutilation case. And uh, the reporter from Fox News, after she had US news, she went and talked to the PR person for the Sheriff's department, and PR person said that it was a predator or a not a known creditor, but it was just a predator and kind of a calm in occurrence. And I don't know that at a time, but when it aired, I basically contradictive charity department, although I made her contradicted him by name. I just said, well, of course, in general, I'm not that

stupid. I'm not gonna say, you know, Passtund charity department is absolutely wrong on what they said, because I didn't even know that she was gonna go over her interview. Mike just said, law enforcement in general, you know that you've been looking on some investigations. We don't. We basically don't accuse people individually or point fingers and anything like that, which I think it as general as we can, just because you know the title of the investigation

it is. Well, I think a good point you made was that the owner of the animals was not satisfied with that response, which is why she was still looking into other alternatives. Well, absolutely, that's why that's the

whole purpose behind uh investigators. I just going out on me thinks if you know you have law enforcements in and the law enforcements is basically telling the rancher who's been ranching all their lives that, oh, by the way, they don't know, they don't know what really what they're talking about when it comes

to the death of their animal. You know, and it's it's really kind of sad too, because, you know, a rancher like let's say, you know, and the offensive uh you know who lost four casts within you know, three athlete period and he's a sperienced generation cattle rancher. He still lives in the house. He was born in Okay, so his father man, his grandfather rancher. This guy knows the gas. And when you have ranchers like that that say, you know what, I don't know what killed

my animals. And then when they don't, you know, we're not satisfied with local law enforcement accession of or you know, uh, hypothesis of what kill the animal, then obviously they have to seek out and what they do to seek out people like us. And then we go in there and based on previous research and other you know, destinations that we've done, we kind of look for the proverbial evidence that I can't be found. And that's exactly

what we're looking for. Granted, you know, there's the crystal ryons and the limbo and how that they've done more than their share of of uh you know, mutilation restigations, and I applaud them for it, and they really you know uh catched, you know, installed a direction that we can all go into. And they had to make a good evidence, but they better attract the case. And the reason for that is there's that evidence, and there's that's going to directly related to uh, some things that we'll be able

to find. And so when when destinated, like me, when I go in there, I'm looking, you know, not only out of the box, and I'm looking. I hate to pay it off the planet not saying that it really owns it. I'm saying you've got to look really really far out. You really got to look for some thing that you don't know what you're looking for, what you'll know where to find it? Yeah, kind of in other words, keeping an open mind or looking at all the possibilities.

But like you said, you said, you know, no one's come up with the answer, which is what these ranchers are looking for. They I mean, when you talk to a rancher, a rancher's not I haven't found stubborn that. No, this has got to be alien to know. They want to know what it is so they could either kill it or get them in the cops to if it's a human, to get them to stop

doing it. I mean, if it's an animal, they want to know what animal and what kind of animal, because I'm going to keep this animal from killing my my animals, even if I got to kill it, or if it's a human, I want I'm throwing in jail, or I want to be compensated. Absolutely absolutely, And there's always a fear that know, of an unknown predator. Now for someone to come out and I'm not going to point finger that. You know, if the Sheriff's department or any other

law enforcement agency that you know with there a sessions on what happens. But basically it sold pulls out and said I just want to use the bake someone about it as well. A mountain line kill and then yet you know, people like you need We just don't interview the ranchers. We also interview the neighbors. We talked to people that out. Have you seen them out? I've never seen a mountain line in this area. You know, doesn't need

that one can't show up. Well, of course there's maybe signs of mountain line the predator and it's going to you could be a stockholder's going to be mark. There's going to be all kinds of evidence that a big predator. And then we also, you know, have taken on the animal. There's also the experine to the ranchers. I mean, can the Mountain Line take down a one thousand pound horse, you know, eleven hundred pound cow? I guess they could have they Have you ever seen that in the passes there?

Well, no, you never seen that. We know all the other ranchers in the area, you know, one animal is unique in the research that you've done in these mutilations recently, as you've gotten a lot of uh kind of expert help or you have outreach to uh other law enforcement in some cases and other agencies who have such as the Colorado the cattle guy all the cattle all right, right, but the Brand Inspector the right. But I

know there's other experts like the Brand Inspector and some other authorities. I think in some of those cases you even had police officers who were like, wow, I don't know either, let alone in abundance of many ranchers from the area saying wow, I don't know what that was. Well, and that's

and here's a disconnect. The disconnect is generally law enforcement at the site, and these guys are very intelligent and when they see something that they can't understand, they may or may not ride it in you know, ride it in their supplement, to ride it up the cation port or something. They kind

of keep it to themselves. And then very rarely when you'll ever see a law enforcement agency come out and say, we don't a little and we need some help with some UFOL guy you know, down the streets to help figure

this up. So they never want to drop their you know, the shorter hand basically, and that's because you know, I mean a lot of the law enforcements has to keep this you know, uh persona of of being able to be in control even though I mean, our air Force has been saying for the past since forty seven and they've got a complete control of the airside on the side that we we obviously all got differently. But yet they'll tell us every day that they're in complete control. I e. Same thing with

law enforcement. But when we start talking to police officers and I talked to you, I've talked to your huge obviously you know, operating plane pols and investigations including death to the soon told me their own personal stories of seeing things and having encounters that they would never tell anybody else just because of the ridicuel factor of the legal factor. But one an official spurrement comes out from from law enforcement, you doesn't really expect anything less than you know, they just

tag it. And the reason for that is there's really not they don't really

have the experience or the knowledge to venture outside. You know, the course that they that they've been taught, and law enforcement is very restrictive and the policy be continuing your follows and you will not you know, sway away from when you tautch you if you do, you're on your own basically, and that happens all the time where you know, if it's if someone violates a policy of law enforcement, you know, uh, the law enforcement will not

be up for them. They have to get their own you know, turning. I mean you see in the regions all the time, so get it into so basically, uh, if you have persons for law enforcement, were he's here too. Now we do know this that we're looking at this particular

chase. There was at a touchtown shirts department and there I can't tell you at this time, but if it just comes out of almost like a crunture getting themselves and I agree with them, but we're we're put of venturing into that right now, and we'll see whether or not depends out and in fact that is case the good. I'll come back on your show and service with

everybody. Yeah, that would be kind of cool if they come out and say we were wrong and you were right to be like a TV show, like a comic book TV show or something, and they give you the key to the city and a tick er tick parade because you figure no, no, And I don't think happen to get an ever beat something like that.

I don't think anybody. I don't think they would ever say if they were wrong and you know I was right, h what I would expect, you know, them to say, we either listen the shit or we didn't get everything out that right or blah blah blah blah blah. You know, there's the very rare way you ever get lawenforce to say, you know weld you know it gerally doesn't happen. But anyway, there's always the first time.

Yeah, I'm gonna write them a letter and say, hey, you guys need to make your wrong and have a trade check and here you go right down ahead, but you perfect hey there, you know, I mean we could uh put a date in history to do it, but not Roswalks. You know, I'll follow me down there out in Colorado at the time,

so so many to play. Just because of the disagreement with you know that came out with the Fox News, they started looking into they didn't you know, they claim that it violated longer policies, even though we haven't found a policy directed it's that not violated. And then also, like you're talking with the media, we can't on my website because you know, it's put together

so well and there's so much information in there now. And we even point over minds alphone that when media is coming in and they took me some stuff out of it, and when they write an article on something they see on my website, they go intough my bio and my bio for a couple of years has said that I was reserved deputy because I was proud of it, and so they would just blocked that into article, even though it also says, you know equ metals, I engineered in doing that for twenty five years

and and I have my education on the antology and all trust. They never pout of the BACKLAS put me reserve deputy step out of So that was another part of the termination letter was the fact that, uh, you know, media would refer to me as resilved even though they never referred to me as actually doing the investigation. Uh you know, uh, training, excectity or representing it. It's just that that was just part of my title or just

part of me, right, you know. And hell, you know, I think on there too said I was a hollywriter, but they never said fit that either. So that was pretty much the bottom line. Now, I will tell you this something that I hadn't told anybody before. But I'll tell you guys, a couple of years before, you know, back in two I guess a couple of years before. We be about two thousand and eight year or so, he's eleven. But we're just into a moment. So you know, I got called in to the uh you know, to

the officer. Had to go downtown, and the commander brought me in along with my lieutenant and said, we're not concerned about you doing uniphone investigations or not, and you're real concerned about you having that on your website, on your bio that your reserve tipity, I said, okay, and can the commanders said, well, I want to root it. And I said, do you want me to remove it? Or am I violating a policy? Or am I uh you know, or there the Sarance Department want me to

remove it? Tell me, I said, Now, if one person in this department has a problem with me being the unfol paranobal investigator, you know, to that, that's you know. But if it's a policy I'm violating, or if I get a letter from the department stating that I have to remove this from my website, they won't have to to. But I'm not gonna do it because I have one or two people out here that disagree with

what I'm doing, and we do have that issue. I mean, there's all kinds of uh uh, you know, people's background for how they are brought up, you know, religious. I'm not gonna I'm not gonna point fingers that if people of that, you know, the religious officers. But there are you know, there are people I haven't come across with, you know, the four thousand years uh you know Earth series, another of the you know, it's really hard to communicate with them. But I'm not saying

that with the case. But if there's an ory the visual trying to interimiate me to take it off my left But basically I was just saying, I'm kind of it, you know, it's part of me. But if if the Sheriff's department wants me to remove it, I will be more than have to relieve it. Just write it down paper, givest you know, I'll

remove it that night. And that was either that I've never heard about it before, you know, a since then right right after that, now there's some rumers going around, you know, you know, in the reserve area. Let's say, well, he was ordered to take it off. I wasn't ordered to take it off, you know, I was than't ordered to remove it from my style and person to disagree. Yeah, and even if that was the case that you were, I mean, it doesn't seem right

to order you to do that. That doesn't have anything to do with what they're doing. Like you said, you're not portraying yourself as these are official oh Passo County investigations, but it's part of who you are is at your reserve deputy officer. And the scary part of that is really it implies then that no or at least what their feeling is that nobody working for them should do paranormal investigations and that doesn't seem right that they should be able to dictate

that. And it's kind of scary because a lot of UFO investigators are police officers that are still police officers. Some of them are outward like ken Storch. We know ken Storch, you know, who's a Roora police officer, and he's not afraid to talk about being a police officer, and the UFO investigator and his cop buddies kind of tease him about it and stuff like that.

But still, you know, people who are law enforcement obviously have a set of skills and training they can bring to this investigation that's very helpful. And to try to say that at because we're afraid of the association, that these people shouldn't be doing that, I mean that's pretty bad. I think

that's pretty uh, infringing on people's rights. Well a matter of fact, during this conversation with said commander, I I didn't into you know uh and basically said, you know, there are you know officers out there, and that's basically said, you know, what if it's if it's wrong person's opinion. I'm not going to do that, but I say, if it's the

opinion of the department, I will absolutely I will take it off. And you know the arm all hands and you know me for a few years that you know I don't push too easy when filming comes to me and tries to, you know, intimidate me to say I pushed back. And that's one of my faults. I geas sometimes people call a post when people call it a ton, but I think that's where you you have to have to have a personality where you know, if you're not willing to push, you're not

You're not gonna get You got to be a little stubborn. You have to be a little stubborn, and you have to be uh, you know, a little straightforward sometimes too. I mean if you want, if you want to tackle certain types of investigations, you have to have that a type personality where you're not afraid to go into a dark alley to figure out what's going on. Uh. And that's what we are now. You've been on at leads two major investigations with me, and at any time was I ring of

badge? Did I have a shriff shirt on? Was I represent any planet? You know, you always have your ufon that T shirt time with my bad No, I never had my badge on it. But yeah, so I mean I was. I was telling of listen, you know you can They'll never find anywhere on any West Tide anywhere a picture of the Heath in uniform or badge ring, a badge or shirt that's a shared department doing an investigation, the Colonel Ltttle relationship, No letter because not out there. You

just can't find it. All I get there it's someone super closed on a photoshop or something. But you know there's not one out there of me because I've never done it. The issue is is, like you said, you know, there's certain people that for whatever purpose or for whatever reason, and

I'll tell you what. And as bad as that sounds, that's still not as bad as some of the comments I'm getting from people say well, and it's sad that that I get comments, because I really don't think it's that way that a lot of people think that way that you know, the conspiracy thing, which is another way of law enforcements, you know, keeping this

quiet and not getting it released. Because the bottom line and you read my terminations letters on the website basically said okay, you know, they don't even want me to investigate anything. You know, path of counting, which is twenty two of the square miles that they're investigating. And it's a little fine line with that, and you don't expect, okay, if they're doing this

investigation on cattle mutilation, that I can't touch it. When you call nine one one and an officer arrives on scene and if he if dispatch you know, gives him a case report and you add it down and the case report has been created on that ninety one one call, that'fter investigation, right,

So, which happens a lot with UFO research. I mean you well, that's just that every every officer at least definitely that I know, and I beginning of the years, you got a nine one call and if you have to look further into it, a case numbers, a time to it. As soon as the case number, that's just an investigation. So figure of all that couldn't touch which is ludicrous. And I think, yeah, there's no way whether there's very value crazy in a trade quare while ago that's just

that's just ludacris. Yeah, another part about this is it's not so bad for you, because funny thing is which makes it worse on their part is that this isn't your main job. You're an electrical engineer. You design microchips. That's where you make your money. So this is kind of, uh something you do as a volunteer to help out to help the police the sheriff's

department when they're busy. So because there's they're understaffed a lot of times, so you're helping them and then they they don't want to take your help anymore because of your UFO investigations. But at least you can be stubborn for the poor guy out there who makes his living being a deputy. That person can't just say, you know, no thanks. He's got to say, okay, I'm stopping investigating and I'm just gonna do what my bosses say. I

mean, unless they want to lose their job. Yeah, that's absolutely right. So there, you know, you can get talking. And I have been in those types of situations because I know, a matter of fact, I used to take my dast get paid this week, you know. And you're also right because there are people involved in law enforcement that that can't do that because not only will they not get you know, you know they're pay that we're losing a pension to them everything if I mean, there's a lot

right on it. So there's so what happened a lot of times is some law enforcement agencies, if they manage the intimidation, you'll see this involved in war in front of their department where they'll see a lot of definite coming in and now there are a lot of police officers city office coming in out,

and you can jolly you can jointly pick that. You know. All you have to do is look at a local lawforcement and the kind of feed into the yields of how many how many officers are, how many definities will getting out of that place or if they're not, then you know that Okay, management styles are little different. It's not any other company too, you know. M If a company wants to see their employees, obviously they're going to

manage them a little bit differently. In the company is a caroline, that's fine, you know, and do as I say, Or there's the door, those are the ones where the door is the revolving door, and how you see going out in your employees to live and anybody could pick their papist force and and all you have to do is just look at the artifics that you local law enforcement agency and see how many officers and devers have been leading

particular place in the past years and years. And if you're not seeing anything kind of know, oh, you know, not low person agency in my town, that's pretty cool. Obviously. You know they're not managing that, you know, management by intimidation. They're doing things a lither differently. It's just something that's elected. Look at now, I'm not saying that's the case that big die, but that could be the case. There are the fact that you know, they just have a problem with a beautiful nun. I'm

not the communic case too. Yeah. Yeah, I was just gonna say, if I was to share a bad We're proud have a UFO nut on my team, you know. I actually that's a sheriff's sound like that when I'm the sheriff in these parts and I'm proud to have a UFO that is a deputy. Tell you what, here's the whole ship there for you guys out there. There's only one person that can fire, the sheriff, and

the sheriff is the extra position. What person do you think to fire the sheriff, the city manager, the corner, the corner is the city manager. We had a sheriff fire, I think it, well, maybe I think it was a sheriff. That's weird. What are you talking about back in the old days. Back in the old days, the corner, the doctor Usley was the same guy just because he was the guy with all the education. And I'm not saying that sheriff and I don't have any cage.

So that back in the leftern days, you know, the one person in the town that had a fuller education was generally the doctor, who also was a corner. So the one guy in town who's smoking a pipe instead of chewing tobacco. So when they when they needed to get rid of the sheriff, they would go to the one person who had all the education, you know, and that would be the you know, that would be the doctor of the corner. And they gave him the uh, you know, the

cast and the ability to be able to remove the sheriff. And I think believe we're not going to call out of the case that your jokes the honest to goodness truth, huh to be honest, a little bit from beautiful that I learned something. You've gotten a bit of media coverage over this situation, and some of the local media has been very supportive of of you, right, and then very critical of the Sheriff's department decision, and and and one

of the reasons why and it's pretty simple. You know, NBC here, Andy Combe and I took h be calling out to uh the uh Francis relation. Uh, we were going. We were together the whole day, you know, because it's you know, yahouldn't call out face. You were San Louelis Valley San Luis, you know, a good three hours away, so you know, it's the whole day I think to do these investigations, you know, two and a half three hours down there and another two three hours

to an investigation. So you know, we're just not talking a lot in the park and you're down here to get back by you you know, we're talking a full day and you you rolled on one of these. So you know that just because we had a Denver on the other side of the Stay of Colorado to get up even earlier to get out and meet you in Manhattan, that's right. Hello, So yeah, you were kind of electric. Well, that happens to me right down, and there's sometimes you know,

I get suppressed. But I have an overwrite system that Met put in for me on the website, so I can overwrite all these uh these walking frequencies as the local doing is putting in. Matt's impressive. He's created a pretty impressive website. But I don't think he could do that. So so to the bottom line is where we're going with. You were talking about how the media has been helpfully that you spent the day with the NBC guy and yeah, So what happened was is, uh, you know I posted determination on

my website. I really didn't no other than a tog you about it. I really didn't, you know, putout the pressurely through and uh every down and I get I get hit with the local media and Andy you know,

saw it and called me on it. He said, you know what, I'll tell you what I never a news you've heard his deputy until the plane crash out here, Oh you know the laye from cor spreens and I worked at eleven out of detail there all the human kids and he was there in SA and when they're trying to load an investigation on a plane crash, and he wrote it later on to do the report on and tell the uniform and your top. Oh wow, so you had spant the day doing this uh

uh investigation with him or taking it out on investigation. And he never knew that whole day that you were a reserve deputy. Never knew. Never try to sell me in uniform. And so here was a person who explorence his bulls. Yeah, you know, I just I never knew you were. I actually saw in unifor and I was, you know, walked up to

me, so he knew me. From his point of view. He said, for God's sake, if you were telling you that you take telling media, if you keep someone that a take go through the whole day during the you know, a settle relations investigations. So he kind of thought this the whole thing, with all this thing he was, he decided to be based on it. He that, uh, you're going to story and uh and

he gotten me up to the you know, to the studio. I went to the agency studio here in tall ot screens and we got ahead into the interview. So it's interesting for for you listen, if you whatever, it doesn't matter what searches didn't like. But if you search defy fired u f FO all over the place, because it really is, and if you have my act made to it, then you can actually get rid of a better uh you know, finished the studio website that I've been talking about it,

and so far I've got a lot of takes a certain time. It's very very positive. You aren't going to get it some negative and that's okay. A matter of fact, we have a comment section on the website and we do allow negative comics to be posted. Uh, we'll don't allow us when people start, you know, slandering other people by name or other people.

Are the commonists sundering them or using sale anguage the guys that we just you know Rex but you know, intelligent comments and then also telogion negative comments.

You know, it's welcome down our website and we knew a bit most ninety all roll over ninety ninety six percent i've seen of all the really positive fucle negatives are and you've you've let these guys all handle you know, of course they turned age, you know, or you're looking for unfone you know they're built that sting, you know, or and it doesn't matter those guys,

you know, Cannand and it's not really our jobs. Can did convinced the guard God were just put the information out there and let people, you know, seek for themselves and make the you know, their own decisions made on

the information we put out. But some people are at the point where I had one guy that you got as far as four lines the five lines on on blogs and slammed me on that, and you were and you never finished reading the blog because what you're calling on all the other views read a little further and the contradicted exactly what he said, but he didn't didn't about it too. That's one of the things that happens a lot. Often there are

people who will make comments before they even read the story. They read the headline and then they make comments or yeah, maybe they'll read a couple of sentences and then they make comments and they sound silly because they haven't read the story, and unfortunately some journalists do. That reminds me of what Steve Obergh, he writes for MSNBC, and he wrote about Leslie Kane's recent book about UFOs, you know, pilots and generals go on the record, and he

didn't read the book. He started criticizing these cases that aren't even in the book. Well, I have a guy that that will criticize. And then you kind of read what they're saying, and you read important. That's how they read for about the book. You know, Oh my gosh, I can't believe that so Adored be killing me. But there's people out there, and that's okay. I don't you know, we deal with them, and

I know you dealt with them also, and that you can do. But it's just I guess if you put the information at just what you guys do on your website and you know, the radio shows and the Congress, you put the information out there and they allow the people you know who go to the Westside as the conference with the radio show, let them be of the decision. And then if they're interested in it, like I was years and

years ago, they didn't want to pursue it. You know, I was seeing in an audience going gosh, that would be cool to do that. I could do that. And that's that's how it all started. And and it was based on I can't remember who it was that I was listening to, but obviously that person was was energetic enough about what they were doing that they gave me the motivation to look at it. You know, go,

wow, that's cool. I'd love to do that. And that's what's exciting about this, especially when I get the emails coming in like Wow, how can I help? What can I do with you? I'm going I love of emails. Yeah, you know, because it's because there's some excitement in there. And when people talk about disclosure and it's going to happen, and I know that because that's not going to be responsible for the soldier. What's to be responsible for disclosure? You meet the people out there listening to this

show, reading your website, reading the magazine. They're the ones that are going to house the tsunami wave that's going to create disclosure. What's going to happen if thegether comes out and there's no say that they'll be disclosure. It's always because of what we're doing. It's going to push them to do it. So don't be sitting around waiting for somebody in Washington. They make a decision, okay, in sign for disclosure of I'll have a lot of police.

Well, you know, it's up to lot to push them to do it. Yeah, so we get the information out there if people make the decision on the road, you know. Yeah, Once I feel the same way. I mean, once it's a foregone conclusion to the general public, then it's silly. It makes it to a point where it's silly not to then accept it for the especially for politicians and people who are wanting the votes of those people who already have their eyes open to the whole idea. You

know, I was thinking too. One of the things that I like about you getting a lot of press in Colorado Springs and this NBC thing is that there's got to be a lot of people. Some people on the show might not know the Colorado Springs is the home of Air Force Space Command, and

there's a huge Air Force military present in Colorado Springs. There's Noorad and Cheyenne Mountain and the whole eastern side or the western side of town along the mountains a military for miles, and then you have a driver's secret Air Force base out there. So all of these people have to be seeing the UFO net in your UFO and paranormal exploits, And it's really funny sometimes, Uh, some people I talked to you or part of the air Force or part of

the army. And you're right, because of the military triangle here between teever, uh you know, Peterson, when you have air force tality and you have fort you know, I mean when you have for customs, right, so it's almost like a triangle space that's in the middle, and I do you know, I'll be talking to someone and find out that there you know, military matter of fact. You know, I was talking with a gentleman who picked up the information of being terminated and he's a uh Vietnam vet.

The that's uh, you know, that's has tightening to it. So we've been talking eighty one years old. It's to a week guy. And I talked to him a couple of times over the phone, and pretty cool, you know that. I've actually, you know, I had a couple of getting Augusta that have contacted me. Obviously it was probab of Korea and in

Vietnam being maybe one. But they have their stories and they'n't prayed to just talk to anybody about it, but they feel very very comfortable talking to me, and I'm sure they're very comfortable talking to you because we won't sit there and ridicule them like the other people have. You know, we we listen to them and I don't know word no, I'm just kidding. Well, we you know, we listen until we understand. We understand, you know,

what we're going through. We understand the experience that you know, they went through. And then if there's anything that you know we've read or researched or or actually tappened to us that it is similar to what happened to them and we could share that with them. Then you see that you hear that spark in their voice. It's over the phone, and you say, sparks in their eyes or that connection with me, and they're going, wow,

you know it's okay to talk about this. Uh, you know I had a real experience and now I can talk to you about it or right to talk and sometimes you can actually open them up whether we you know, they'll be more open to talk to other people about it. That was to realize, hey, you know what, it's something to mention this. You know, we have that literature, we have that giggle factors still going on, and then you know the ad coon with NBC start coming out there and going

to the investigations. You know, and and and if you have the opportunity to bringing someone, try to welcome me with you and you can experience something you're seeing something. You know, that's really a benefit for us because you know, when they write about it, they write about it a positive way, non negative way, where like you said, some of the reported they just kind of you know, they won't read the book. They will, you know, don't look forward, and then they base the whole investigation.

I'll just in the little parts. And those are the people that you know well only to me. Too much you can do about people like that, you know, generally, that's that's the culture writing that we're starving you more and more of when new culture coming out with you're really really interested in this,

Yeah, I think so about it. One of the cool things you did too on your story about the termination was you talked about what great people you had worked with in the Sheriff's department and how you're going to miss some of those people. I mean, in general, did you get along well

with all of the people you worked with? Well? Other than that the matter, Yeah, you know what pleasure you know, because I've been I've been on so many uh you know, patrols, you know we were bigger units and enough you were basically too too then the units and uh, I've worked on details where I've I've helped back up spotcast from actually you know, you know, paying the people that swat it in your life there in the data that you're right in the action and they're working with people now on my

website. I asked, really good thing. You know, you're in that all mindset that you know, they don't take a bullet for the person to find you know, I mean that's what they train you. You're in that mindset. And I know from the people that I worked with they would do the same for me. They don't work at you. That's a beautiful investigator that you would ask with a deputy And we have a deputy had Son. This is what we're doing. I've never worked with with the deputy that was

negative at all, at least negatives and what I was doing. And as a matter of fact, you know when we're out in the car and we pulled ten hour shifts and we're just bullshitting, they're the ones that asked me all these questions because we to them or it may not be to them, and they may have some questions as their own of some of their own experiences. And I've heard a lot. I mean, I've got a lot of things that unfortunately they can't really discuss, you know, other than to maybe

a person like me that I could look at you. No one's not giving you wedgies and and whipping you at their towels in the locker room or anything. Now, there's very very respectful and uh you know the guy that just just got yeah and went into uh any biggos all I'm with them, and it was it was just a part you're looking for eight years. So if I'm going to go back and look at anything positive, death, absolutely well one of the positive things. The other one, I mean, the whole

compans are doing. The new thing is to give back to the community. Someone told me that because well, even this not instant, still I'm still helping the community with doing you know, your phone to go through this division, tell me relations stuff like that. You know, really you're still kind of help in the community. I trying to understand what's going on. I've always start Coen tell you know, as you know, when I got younger kids to gabble in wrong forces because you know, I wanted to give back

the community that way by volunturing. You know, my time, I have a chief case, so I don't like to I don't like to have a lot of money volunteer time. Actually for me, it's always more important. But if you could take the time to do something, to volunteer for something in the community, it's a lot of atending someone five you take to that obviously if you don't have the time, and obviously locate against someone. Yeah,

well I used to. Yeah, I know you're going to have more time because you're busy, or a father, you're you're an engineer, you're a paranormal investigator. Of course, I used to get frustrated when I'd want to go do an investigation or or go to a lecture and you're like, oh, I gotta go volunteer. I gotta go work the prison or or what have you. So at least now you'll have more time because and hopefully maybe some more time for yourself to drive your Harley around the mountains. And

there you go. And yeah, that's one thing I won't miss I'll tell you right now, I will missed this searching. Okay. I am sill with that. I am full Hacke that and that's the one thing I will wherever we have I'll get those reformation. Yes, Saturday night, a couple of quick to sign about. Oh cool, are you going to miss the taser training because I know you you like to get tased except to throw the shock. Yeah you can. You can have your wife tase you at home.

Well no, Well, basically what I've done is, you know, certain things are just going to have to take the place of a livery thing. So for tasing, I think for the initial shock, are even go some destigations, Yeah, and they will they real quick. I know we only have a couple of minutes probably left. Yeah, something else. And this is absolutely the truth. And I don't know whether nothing can relate to this or not. Granted, you know, eight years I was in Regerve

and I've got some pretty you know with these things. With them, I've been in a lot of interesting situations to sort believe that. And I won't go into too much where you know, you have to drive them to all kind of if you thinks. But I'll be very honest to you and all the listeners out there, I have never been more scared in my life. When you're doing those investigations or cattle relations when you're out the middle of the Knights, you know, looking for something like that, or you know,

bigfood investigations. You know, when you're dealing with something that's completely unknown that you just can't take a text stuff out of the longforce of library and say this is how this person would react to We're out of time. We're like totally oh, I apologize, no good thing to end on. Thank you so much for being on the show. UFO Nut ufo nut dot com is we can find more information about Chuck and we are totally out of time, so join us next week. I don't even have time to tell you who

it is. Thanks for listening to Hoping Minds on TV. I to trip to trip