Hello friends. Welcome to a very special edition of Open Line with Doctor Michael Dolnick. This is Moody Radio's Bible Study Across America. But we're not going to be taking your questions. It's pre-recorded. It's special. You'll hear about why in just a moment. My name is Michael Dolnick. I'm the academic dean and also a professor of Jewish Studies and Bible at Moody Bible Institute. I am so glad to be with you today. I have a very special
guest this first hour and then some other guests second hour. Uh, but it's a special weekend because today, while you're listening to this, this is the time that we're having the summit opposing anti-Semitism right here on the campus of Moody Bible Institute. You probably have heard about all the explosions of anti-Semitism since October 7th, 2023. anti-Semitism was on the rise even before then, but now it has just erupted.
And as a result, Moody Bible Institute and Chosen People Ministries are having the summit opposing anti-Semitism right here on the campus of Moody Bible Institute. So don't give us a call today. Save your question for next week. You can go online if you like, Open Line radio.org, and you can post a question. And Trish will put it in the mailbag for next week. But for today, I'd like you to listen about what we're doing. And I have one of our very special speakers who is going
to be speaking at the summit, too. I'm saying tomorrow, but it's actually today while you're listening to this. Uh, his name is doctor Don Sweeting, and you may recognize that name, Sweeting, maybe because he went to Colorado Christian University, where he was the president. Now he's the chancellor. And also, you may recognize the name Sweeting because Doctor George Sweeting, his dad, was the president of Moody Bible Institute, and Don and I went to Moody back in the 70s. Right.
That's right. That's right. I think you graduated one year ahead of me.
Not so long ago.
Yeah, not so long ago. I'm so. Yeah, it just seems like yesterday. I'm so glad that you're here with me. Donna. And I really appreciate your willingness to come to Chicago to speak at this summit. It means so much to me.
Well, it's great to be back at Moody, and I'm so grateful to Moody for stepping out, unlike so many schools and not just being neutral, but being positively, um, standing with Israel and with the Jewish people at this time.
Yeah, it's so it's something that makes me feel really grateful. I've been at Moody now. Uh, I started as a student 50 years ago. Uh, wow. Then I was an alum, and I came to teach here 31 years ago. And I'm really grateful to be here. And, you know, there I was, this Jewish kid from Brooklyn. I really did not feel culturally that I fit in here very well. I had only come to know the Lord two years earlier. I was in a I came from an observant Jewish home.
My first language wasn't even English. I spoke Yiddish in my home, the Eastern European Jewish language that Jewish people spoke in the in the small villages of Eastern Europe, where my dad was from. He was from Poland. And so I came here and I felt out of touch. But what I recognized even then, 50 years ago, was this was a place where Jewish people were cared for, where they were loved. It's the only school 102 years now. We've had a Jewish Studies major at Moody Bible Institute.
It's extraordinary.
Yeah. And it's it's always been a small major. So that means there's been an investment to have this program at Moody Bible Institute. So I'm extremely grateful to be here. But I'm also really grateful that you're here. Your dad is one of the people that made me feel welcomed and loved when I came to Moody right away. Uh, as a as a Jewish person, he wanted to know all about my background. He asked me all sorts of stuff, and he was really gracious. He grew.
He grew up outside of New York City, real close. And he had lots of Jewish friends growing up. So, you know, this was home turf.
But I think, you know, as I knew your dad, he always was pointing to the Bible and and you and I have talked about that. We were on, on Chris Fabry, uh, yesterday on Friday. And you talked about that, how important the Bible is to have an understanding and appreciation for Jewish people, particularly the Old Testament.
Well, it's it's huge. And I had this fascinating conversation in the spring with an Orthodox Jewish friend in Israel, a guy named Yoram Hazony. Oh, do you know him?
Sure. I don't know him personally.
The institute head of the Edmund Burke Society. And he said, we're talking about what happened to our universities, and one of the things that happened is they have no students. Gen Z have no understanding of what Israel is, let alone which river, which sea. So he said, there.
Are a lot of videos of which river? Which sea? Well, I think the Mississippi or something.
It's worse than that. They don't know the story of Israel. They don't know the Hebrew Bible. So Yoram said, what if we were to do a little bit of a Bible study together? You bring some evangelical scholars and I'll bring some Orthodox Jewish scholars study, study Genesis through Kings to talk about the political wisdom that's in the Bible. Wow. We spent two weeks in August in Jerusalem doing this. How fantastic. But but, you know, it's just God's doing
some really extraordinary things right now. Yeah. Where there are bridges being built and conversations being had because we're we're sort of in the same boat right now as culture has turned against Jewish people. Yeah. Jewish people. Israel.
The canary in the coal mine.
The United States, the Constitution. Western civilization, Christianity. These are all enemies of of of the the whole neo-Marxist narrative. So we find ourselves in the same boat together. And as I had one, there was a Jewish legislator, legislator in Denver. And he said to me, you know, Don, after they come after us, they're coming after you.
That's it. The canary in the coal mine. Uh, you know that old illustration they would bring the canary in and when the gas would come, they knew when the canary died that to get out of there. Right. And the Jewish people, when when secular society turns on the Jewish people, which is what we're seeing right now. Right. The next step is to turn on on followers of Jesus, turn on evangelical Christianity. That's right. And that's what, you
know in Nazi Germany. Yes, of course, they turned against Jewish people first, but they were going to go after the evangelical pastors next.
That's right. Yeah. The famous Niemoller quote comes to mind. Right? But my my secular Jewish friends, they were just in shock at at how things have changed. And I would have conversations with them and they'd say, we don't understand what happened to our kids. They'd go to these universities and we thought they'd get a good education. But they come out hating Israel and the Jewish kids. Everything we stand for. Yeah. And they're saying, are all schools like this?
And I raised my hand at the table. I go, no, not all of them. You know, Colorado Christian isn't and, you know, Moody.
Bible Institute obviously isn't.
It just jogs their mind. They don't they have a hard time processing that. Yeah.
But now now here's the thing. I know you've always been reading the Bible, you know, raised in the home that you were in and you studied, obviously not just in your home. You went to Moody Bible Institute. You I know you went to Trinity. I don't know all the schools that you went to, but I know those are some of them, too many at Lawrence University, I knew that. Uh, but you studied the scriptures. Is is that what gave you the perspective that you do about the Jewish people?
Yes and no. So when I was a student at Moody, I kind of got burned out on eschatology because there were sometimes things said in chapel, like, you know, that that just didn't make sense to me when I just remember when somebody said, if you count up the number of numerical value of Henry Kissinger's name, you'll find out he's the Antichrist. Oh, no, no, no. And I just, I just, you know, and I just said, I don't need that. I want to focus on the basics. And
so I came away from Moody just just thinking. They can't figure it out. I can't figure it out. Let me focus on the the central things in the Christian faith.
I just want to say that wasn't a faculty member here. No, it wasn't.
And that wasn't typical of the chapels either. But but I burned out on it, honestly. And then my I was a young pastor. My dad said, do you want to lead a tour with me in Israel? We led four tours to co led four tours together. And so I and I met, we had Orthodox Jewish tour guides, and I was stunned when I learned that they believe more of the Old Testament than I did. That was sort of it was a rebuking moment. At the same time, I had been reading Paul Johnson's History of the Jews.
He was a secular historian, a brilliant historian from Britain. And and as you read this thick volume, you realize there had been more persecuted than any other people in history. They have lasted and kept their identity more than any other people in history. They're more gifted than any other. And I finished that going. Something's going on. I mean, what is going on? God's. God's evidently been at work. Regathering.
They're coming back into the land. Um, and so I went back to the Bible at that point and started reading the Old Testament and the New Testament together and trying to fit the pieces together. And it was out of that Bible reading that I came to a conviction that God is not done with the Jewish people or Israel. He has he he's made promises that he has to keep. The gift and the call are irrevocable. Yeah.
Romans 1129. Exactly. That's so great. You know Paul Johnson's history. I've read many surveys of Jewish history like that one. And he's a brilliant writer. I think he passed away. He did. You know, he was a a kind of neo orthodox Christian. And it's one of the few Jewish history books. And he's not Jewish. And he wrote this book. It's one of the few books that sees he kind of hints at it. He says, is is this just an unusual, quirky history, or is it the hand of God? Yes.
And he would raise that as a question. And obviously, he seemed to think that there was something to do with the Lord in his providence.
And it was very plain. It was the hand of God. Yeah. Yeah. So so then I started doing tours over there, and then this about two years ago, a year and a half ago, I got invited by a Jewish businessman in Denver to the 75th anniversary of the State of Israel. And in the course of the the activities, they took us up to the Lebanese border, and we got briefings by IDF, and we went through some of the tunnels that Hezbollah had dug. And we and we saw things
that the normal tourist doesn't see. And it was just a huge eye opener being in the land and seeing it, you know, from the sky. And that how they're surrounded by a lot of non friendly people. Um, and it deepened my love.
Wow, wow. I'm so glad we're going to talk more about that in just a moment. Uh coming up against a break here. But when we come back my guest is Don Sweeting. This hour, doctor Don Sweeting is the wonderful chancellor of Colorado Christian University, an old friend of mine, but not old in his heart or in his body yet, but a long time friend, I should say. My name is Michael Melnick. You're listening to Open Line. We're going to come right back with more of our discussion about
the Jewish people, Israel, and opposing anti-Semitism. Stay with us. Are you looking to deepen your grasp of Paul's powerful epistles, the Moody Bible commentary on Galatians, Ephesians, Philippians, and Colossians is your key to unlocking these treasured books with clear explanations and practical insights. This resource illuminates Paul's teachings on grace, unity, joy, and the supremacy of the Lord Jesus. Request your copy of this Moody Bible Commentary excerpt. When you give to
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week with tips and encouragement. Become a kitchen table partner today by calling (888) 644-7122 or go to Open Line radio.org. Welcome back to this special edition of Open Line. My name is Michael Riedel, and you probably think I'm going to be answering your Bible questions today. But no, today is the summit opposing anti-Semitism. So we've pre-recorded this, uh, special edition of Open Line. I'm joined by my guest this hour, doctor Don Sweeting, chancellor of Colorado Christian University.
His dad was the president of Moody Bible Institute when we were both students here. How hard was that for you?
It was hard. Yeah.
I can imagine. My son was a student at Moody when I was a professor, and he just made a lot of jokes about it, but it was tough on him, I think.
Yeah, it was easy to get a little rebellious at the time.
So yeah, I met Matt Stoll, the son of Joe Stoll. He said similar. Well, because.
Everybody had high, super high expectations and would put you into a box.
Like being a preacher's kid, right?
Honestly, looking back, they were great years. I learned the English Bible at Moody and more than any other school I've gone to. It was, it was. And my character changed.
Yeah, I felt the same way that, uh, you know, I went to other schools afterwards, as you did. But for me and anyone listening, I think Moody's a great foundation for life. We have a mutual friend, Steve, who became an attorney. And people say, well, why would he go to Moody? Uh, well, it's that foundation for life.
Get a Bible base.
Yeah, it changes your worldview. And so it doesn't matter if you're going to full time ministry. We're all going into ministry. I think that's why Moody is such a great foundation. Whether you're going to get your paycheck in a vocational ministry or if you're going to be working in society penetrating.
That's right. Look, if the Bible is the most important book in the world, and if it's God's Word, then you got to take it seriously and you better get to know it. Yeah.
Yeah. So anyway, let's let's do this. I think it's important to understand what's going on on our university campuses. It's quieted down a little bit now, although. Yeah. Just. But just yesterday or two days ago in Chicago at DePaul University, two Jewish students were assaulted. Right. Uh, what in the world was going on? Why are these universities. So now people say it's just anti-Israel. But they seemed. I saw swastikas, pictures of swastikas and all sorts of
anti-Semitic imagery. Not just anti-Israel, but anti-Semitic imagery on these university encampments and campus, uh, protests. What's going on on our campuses. You're the expert.
Mega mega shifts. So, you know, when I. When we went to college, we lived in what I call the liberal era. They had not they weren't Bible. The secular schools were all secular, but they still believed in the liberal arts and history and all that. But there's been a shift. And this shift is an ideological shift where we're in a post liberal world and the there's a
whole neo-Marxist framework. Cultural Marxism is sometimes called has set in and there's been an ideological captivity of so many universities so that students come away with an ideological framework that is very anti-Israel, anti-Jewish, anti-Christian, anti-American, anti-Western, anti binary, you know, men and women. I mean, it goes in so many different directions, and it's based on a critical theory where they want to deconstruct things and turn everything upside down. Yeah.
So it's bizarre that.
Shaped a generation. And it's not just in the universities. It's been in the K through 12 schools. And so we're seeing a radicalized Gen Z and people are wondering, you know, what's happened to their kids. A lot of people are giving up on the university because they don't. They've lost confidence. And they say, why am I going to spend $40,000 if it's going to do that to my kid? And that's a really good question.
Yeah, I agree. And, you know, I've been noticing that many of the New York high schools, you know, my sister went to a particular high school. It's it's turned radically anti-Jewish. When, when I was living there in, in the Holy Land, Brooklyn, you know, that that high school was, uh, was mostly Jewish. I'd say 75% of those students in
that high school were Jewish. Uh, just a few months ago, there was a teacher in that high school, who was chased into a room and had to lock the door behind her as as crowds of students were shouting all sorts of anti-Jewish slogans and pursuing her and threatening a teacher. Yeah.
Well, you think about the presidents of the three schools that testified before Congress last December, and they couldn't condemn genocide, and yet they condemn all kinds of little picayune microaggressions. You use the wrong pronoun. You know, you're grounded and and and and so it was very evident that there was an antisemite, a deep anti-Semitism at work, at places like Harvard. And then when they tried to fix it, they appointed somebody over who who was even, you know,
more anti-progressive. Yeah. So it's not going to go away. Yeah. I think we're going to get a reprieve in terms of the public pressure because of the new administration.
But I think for young people today who are going to college, I think schools like Colorado Christian and schools like Moody Bible Institute, depending on what people want to do. Now we both have both. Our schools have grad programs, but I think it's so important to get that foundation of understanding, you know. That's right. That that's so important. Now, now, Colorado Christian's a Christian liberal arts school. Yeah. Moody is
more of a ministry training school. Right. But, you know, the foundation is there.
You get a Bible foundation. I know you do at Moody because I was at Moody. But we require students to get a strong foundation in the New Testament and in the Old Testament. And we of course, we promote debate and we push the liberal arts, and we require that you learn history and you learn about the Holocaust, and you learn history.
As as reality. Fact.
That's right.
Not not your narrative. My my lived experience versus your lived experience. Right.
Yeah. And so much of this has been lost. So you have those basic realities. But then I think both of our schools have gone an extra step. So right after October 7th, we started speaking out very, very vocally. And then the day the three presidents got up to testify before Congress, we had a fundraiser for Israel. We invited all Jewish leaders in our state, and we raised over $1 million, and we gave it all to United Hatzalah, which was the big relief agency.
It's a really important agency because they're the ones that when there's a murder, like like what we saw on ten, seven, 23 or like a bombing. Right?
They're the first responders, first responders to anybody.
Yes. And they gather it doesn't matter. And they gather they actually gather up all the body parts and they they treat them with great dignity and respect because of how they believe that that man is made in the image of God. Humanity is made in the image of God.
That's right. So so we were doing things like that. And you're doing a conference like this, and I'm just saying to our audience. You're not going to find this at many, many schools. No, there are so many schools have either let this stuff go wild or they're silent because they treat it like, oh, it's a morally neutral thing. You know, Israel's as bad as Hamas and it's just terrible.
So, you know, the big transition that, uh, that I've seen is that after 1967, with the Six-Day War in 1968, all of a sudden the Jewish people went from being oppressed. And that's why Israel existed. So they could defend themselves to oppress her. Right. It was that was the big change. And I think that that has to do with the the new left that erupted. Yeah, that came out of the woodwork there. You know, we had the 1968 convention here in Chicago. It's the.
Post-liberal left. So it's not even liberal, you know. In fact, the liberals are very are looking at this going, what's happened to America? This used to be a safe haven, but it's a post liberal progressive again culturally Marxist. It uses Marxist categorized categories to to look at things.
And so it seems to me like the old Marxist category was economic, you know. That's right. It was the haves versus the have nots. Yeah.
And this is cultural.
It's cultural and it's almost it's, you know, it's it's the white people's oppressing the dark peoples. And there's no question that there was a history of racism in the past and all that. However, when you look at the situation, for example, in Israel, it was somehow chosen that the Jewish people of Israel were the white people, the white oppressors, and the Palestinians were the oppressed. And you've been to Israel. Can you tell the difference? Yeah, right. We look the same.
So it's quite arbitrary when you think about it. So that's shocking. But it now I care deeply for Palestinians. I know you do too. I'd love to see Palestinians come to know the Lord, just as I want Jewish people to come to know the Lord. Uh, but. And there's there's no but about wanting them to come to the Lord. But there are situations, like with groups like Hamas that are murderous, genocidal groups, that it's that's why the Bible says there's a time for war and a
time for peace. Right? There are times that that it's it's justifiable to go to war, right?
Israel has to defend its people, as any nation should. And what Hamas has done to the Palestinian people is, is, is terrible.
I think what they've done. Yeah. Is oppressing their own people.
And it's and it's not just in Gaza. It's it's in Lebanon now where they found all these missile factories underneath, you know, homes and hospitals and everything else. This is this goes against what, you know, UN regulations of what you're supposed to do. And it really makes you a war zone. You're not a school or a hospital is not to be a war zone.
So I have this very dear Palestinian neighbor who's very kind to me, always good neighbor here in Chicago. And he said a very interesting thing to me because he was he was talking about how oppressed his family felt, not by even Hamas, but by the Palestinian Authority. Yes. And and so I was kind of tell me more, tell me more. And I said, well, let me ask
you this. Every year I see reports at Christmas time about how Israel is oppressing the Palestinians and the Palestinian Christians and and your Palestinian Christian family, who why don't you speak out? He said, and he puts his hand on my hand and he says, oh, my brother, don't you know, if I spoke out, they would go find my family and kill them. And so he.
Was talking about the Palestinian Authority. Yeah. That would do that. Yeah. Yeah. That's right. Yeah. I hear the same stories.
Yeah, that's. That's shocking and terrible. And so one of the speakers at this seminar, a seminar summit tomorrow, is a pastor from a congregation in Nazareth. He's a Palestinian Christian who says he feels so much safer living as a citizen of Israel. Right, because.
He's heard the same stories? Yeah. So when I was there in August, we had a Palestinian Christian meet with us and and he said, you know, all the schools in the Palestinian territories in Jerusalem and in, in, uh, uh, certainly in Gaza, they're they're using the Islamic narrative to teach the history. So he said, we naturally grow up just hating, hating Israel. And he said, so that's the way I was raised. And then my cousin, um, received a request to, to marry this Islamic man. And she
said no. And they, they they forced her. They abducted her. Wow. And when we tried to intervene, they threatened our lives. And he said it was at that point that I had to question everything. He moved to Tel Aviv, and he realized that he had been sold a false bill of goods. Yeah. Wow.
Well, that's that's an amazing story. We'll talk more about things like that when we come back. That's don sweet. I'm Michael Ray Dolnick. Stay with us. There's more to come right here on Open Line. We're so glad that Febc partners with Open Line with Doctor Michael Ray Dolnick bringing the Febc mailbag every week. Learn how far East Broadcasting Company is taking Christ to the world at febc.
Org on their weekly podcast. Until all have heard with Ed Cannon, you'll hear stories of lives changed by Messiah all across the globe. Again, you can hear the podcast when you visit febc. Korg. That's FBC Korg. Welcome back friends. My name is Michael Ray Zelnick and normally you would be calling with your questions about the Bible, God or the spiritual life. We sit around the radio kitchen table,
talk about the scriptures. It's the Bible study all across America. However, today is a special pre-recorded program, so there's no need to call. You can call next week or you can send your question. All you have to do is go to Openline radio.org. Click on the link that says Ask Michael a question and it'll get posted. And then Tricia will put it in the mailbag, the Febc mailbag for next week. But joining me today is he he has
no idea. He's he's well beloved by me. We've been friends or at least acquaintances for many years because we went to college together. This is doctor Don Sweeting. But, you know, his dad is really my all time hero in life. I've always said when I grow up, I want to be like George Sweeting. And so, truthfully, I would pray for you all the time. When you were pastoring the church up in the northwest suburbs, uh, I
would think about you when you went to. You were president of a seminary and then you were president of Colorado Christian Talk. I would talk with your dad about you all the time. Pray for you. Thank you. So you had no idea that you I knew you, but. And in fact, he said, yeah. Yeah. Uh, Don's doing great. He would always give me really great reports. That was always wonderful. So anyway, I'm grateful to God that he had a small impact on my life because I didn't
get to grow up with him. But, uh, great impact in your life. You could see it, uh, in, in your, your very face, your character, your being and your mom too, by the way, who and so let's just say it right here on the radio. You've lost both your parents in the last few weeks. Yeah. How tough?
It's tough when you lose them both together. They were in their high 90s, but they were still living at home. In fact, dad was driving until May when he fell and broke his hip.
Wow.
So they were in pretty good shape for their age. But then things started getting complicated real fast, and. And they're gone.
Yeah. I'm so sorry. What a tough time. But, you know, God has blessed you for so long to have them. Yeah.
We're we're grateful. I'm going to.
Tell you my my favorite story about your mom. When I went up to visit them just before the pandemic. And she. She was embarrassed because she didn't make the strudel that she. That she served me. Yeah. Because she was a great baker. And she always would make the strudel or whatever.
His daughter. Yeah. Right.
So I had. This is a good German bakery, though. She said you'll like it. It was good.
You know, Proverbs says, blessed is the memory of the righteous, but I think it's revelation. It says, blessed are those who die in the Lord. So there's a double blessing. The memories are incredible. But to know that they died in the Lord there with him. And that's. That's good news.
Yeah, yeah, well, I know it's tough for the whole family, but I'm grateful to God for their lives. And I know we don't grieve as those without hope. Right. That's right. So. That's right. Yeah. Well, okay. You were telling me something about, uh. What was that? When you went to Israel? You were taken to the place where Hamas assaulted the southern.
So. So this about that this past trip, we were there in August, and it was really at the height of the Iranian threat. So you check into your hotel and they go here, here's your key, and here's where the shelter is. Oh, wow. And every night, you know, we were expecting attacks. So it's hard, hard to sleep. But our group took us down to the Gaza border. We had an IDF briefing, two IDF briefings of what
was going on there. And they took us to the Nova site, the festival site, and we talked with survivors and some of the sites where the attacks took place and saw all the cars, you know, thousands of cars that were burned and bulleted. And it was so sobering. Michael and all around, too are signs like, if you if you're not near a shelter and you hear the sirens go off, you have, you know, like 10s to find a place to hide or lay on the ground
and cover your head. So these people live with the everyday reality of missiles coming over, and they have for a long time. And Americans just can't seem to grasp this.
Yeah, yeah. And yeah, that's why they think. And I'm amazed we'll be talking to an IDF soldier next hour. Uh, he's a moody student, and he left Moody and served in Gaza. Wow. During the war. At the beginning of it. And what what people are not aware of is Israel does so much to try and protect The civilians, Palestinian civilians and Hamas does everything they can to to use them as human shields and put them in harm's way. Yeah, it's it's heartbreaking.
And that doesn't get in the mainstream media ever, because there's a bias against Israel in the mainstream media.
Yeah. Yeah. My, my son served as an infantry soldier in the Israel Defense Forces after he graduated from Moody. You know, he went moved to Israel, became a citizen, got drafted. They said, well, you're older. He was 24. We'll put you in a desk job or something, maybe kitchen do something for six months so you can say you served. And he said, no, I didn't move to Israel to do that. And and he served as a machine gunner. Wow. And it was in a special anti-terrorist unit.
And it was it was sobering for me. I didn't sleep for two years while he was doing that. But what what he told me most because they were specializing in close quarter urban combat, was all that they did to put themselves in harm's way to they had to learn to protect innocent Palestinian civilians. That was part of their training. Every day was to make sure that they protected the innocent as best they could, even if it put themselves in in harm's way. And so, uh, it is it is.
I've heard stories that no army has ever gone to that length to protect the other civilians on the other side as the IDF.
And then, of course, you're going to find, as in any army, there's going to be some soldier that does things wrong, you know, and.
And mistakes made. Yeah.
And that's what's going to hit the media, right. You know, that's the only thing not all the soldiers that may even die themselves to, to protect the innocent. Uh, anyway, so now you were mentioning what's going on in the south and the north. You've got Hezbollah, and I have relatives that live on the Lebanese border, and a lot
of the people from that area have been evacuated. Jewish people, almost between 60 and 100,000 Jewish people from the border of Israel, uh, have been evacuated to keep them safe. So I keep checking with my cousins and saying, are you leaving? And they said, no, because we don't want Hezbollah to determine the borders of Israel. If we leave,
then they're determining our borders. Yeah. And so, uh, when the when Hezbollah just recently started firing, well, they started firing rockets on October 8th, but recently they've been firing at Nahariya. Um, and one landed on a house about three houses down from my cousin and her husband. And it it destroyed that house. Yeah. Uh, and the other cousin, my this couple's daughter, his adult daughter, uh, when the
Iranian missiles came over. Ballistic missiles. Some shrapnel of the missiles that were shot out of the sky landed on her home. Set it on fire. Yeah. And so?
Well, I have them when I'm over there. I got an app on my phone called Red alert, and it tells you when missiles are coming in. And it was just because I wanted to know, you know, what was going on. And I kept it on my phone. And it's constant. They're constant little things. Missile fired, drone fired. And I can't remember the exact number, but it's way over 20,000 since October 7th, 20,000. You know, if that happened on our border, you know what we would do?
Yeah, well, they wouldn't we wouldn't listen to Israel telling us to restrain ourselves.
No. Yeah. Yeah, right. We would not accept Canada telling us to restrain herself like the current administration has been telling Israel. Nor would we reveal the plans of of the Israeli IDF to the world.
It is it is heartbreaking. And I know that there have been civilians who have have suffered greatly in Gaza. My heart is broken for them. But I don't know what the options are. You know, in Romans 13 it says the government has been given a sword, right? Yeah, it's it's responsibility. It's a servant of God to protect the innocent and punish the wicked. Right. And the sword was the Roman assault weapon, right? You know, that was their M-16. Yeah. Uh, and so what that is saying
is that even a civil government. Not necessarily, you know, theocracy, but a civil government has a responsibility to protect their people, even with with force like that. I don't know what other option there is. Well, no, they.
Have to and we would want our government to do the same. But I think it's important to say, you know, we want a just peace in the Middle East, a peace where every party recognizes the right to exist of the other party. And this is the problem, because once Islam conquers a territory, they believe that it's theirs forever and that if somebody else is occupying it, they need to do jihad and and take, take them out. So they're until they recognize Israel's right to exist.
Really recognize.
It. The government of Israel has to defend itself. Yeah.
Has to be that way. And I know the Israelis really want a peace, too. They don't know how it's going to happen, but they really long for it. Right. We're going to come back and talk a little bit more. That's Don Sweeting and Michael Ray Dolnick, and we'll be right back. You're listening to Open Line on Moody Radio. Some claim Paul is the key person who took the message of the Jewish Messiah. Jesus made it into something Gentile. But Paul is also the one who wrote. Brethren, my
heart's desire for Israel is for their salvation. Romans ten one chosen people ministries. One of our underwriters wants us all to learn what drove Paul's passion for his own people. They're offering the book The Heart of the Apostle by Rich Freeman, free to all open line listeners. To get this exposition of Romans nine through 11, just go to our website, openline. radio.org. Scroll down to the link that
says A free gift from Chosen People Ministries. Click on that and you'll be taken to a page where you can sign up for your very own free copy of The Heart of the Apostle. Paul, welcome back to Open Line. I'm Michael Radonich. Joining me today for this special pre-recorded edition of Open Line is doctor Don Sweeting, chancellor of Colorado Christian University. Before anything else, I just want to say thank you so much for coming to the summit
opposing anti-Semitism. Thank you so much for being here in the studio with me means so much to me. It really does.
I'm delighted to be here and I admire you for putting this together and being a standout school in our country at this moment in history.
Well, you know, I'm grateful that Mark job, we mentioned, he and I were talking yesterday about some of the anti-Semitic incidents, uh, in the Chicago area in just the last few days. And when he called me to talk about that, I thought, oh, no, he's going to be nervous about the summit coming up. And he said, uh, isn't this the perfect time for us to hold this summit to make a stand? And I thought, I love having Mark Jobe as our president. You know, he had
had big shoes to fill. You know, George Sweeting held those, but he's doing a great job. And I appreciate that courage that he has. Well, and you.
May catch flack for it. You may you may get who knows, you may get picketed. That's just part of the territory. Yeah.
Yeah. And it's okay. You know, uh, you know, we've been picketed before for other reasons, so that's not a problem. Uh, but here's the thing. Uh, I appreciate so much that you are building bridges with Jewish scholars and Jewish people. Like you mentioned, studying the Bible with Jewish scholars. You mentioned that earlier. Mhm. Uh, one of the things that people think is that somehow because we're talking about God
has a plan for Israel, right? Uh, that's one misconception, they think, is that somehow we're saying that Jewish people don't need to, to believe in Jesus. Yeah. God has a special choice to the Jewish people. He's got a plan for the Jewish people nationally. There's a special, uh, I think, hand of God on the Jewish people. But Jewish people like everyone. We need to trust in Jesus, don't you think? Right. Yeah.
Of course. Yeah. I had a fascinating conversation with a rabbi friend in Israel about a year and a half ago, and he was involved in discussions with evangelical leaders, and, and he and and I said, well, you know, evangelicals, we talk about Jesus. We believe he's the same. He said, well, you can't do that in these conversations. I said, well, I mean, that's who we are now. He had a he hears his point. He did have a good point.
He said, so many Christians, they they, they don't realize what the past Christian anti-Semitism and the pain and the, the horrible things that have been done in the name of Christ. And he said they want to rush into things and they don't build relationships of trust and, and accept people for, for who they are. And I think it's a very valid point. It's it's you build bridges into people's lives. You love them because that's the right thing to do.
And that's that bridge is the bridge for the gospel. You know, it is Jo Jo Aldrich. You say you love people until they ask you why. Yeah. That's right. And that's it. You know, the.
Treasure is Jesus. Yeah. And and there's a lot of my Jewish friends say we don't think he's the Messiah. I said, where are you going to be really surprised when he comes and and you recognize that he is. But, you know, until that time we will love you. We will stand with you. And you know, we want you to know that Christ is our life. And and you need you need him.
Yeah. Well, you know, I so appreciate you saying that about Jewish history because you're a church historian. Most people. That was your academic area, right? Right. Yeah. And, you know, most church historians aren't even hardly aware of that history. And yet Jewish people, we're so aware of it because it's so much of our history. You know, what the
what the church and Christianity is, unfortunately. And today, though, there's a shift in the new anti-Semitism, which is it's less it's not so much Christian today, it's more Islamic or secular. Right, which is a big change. Uh, really kind of remarkable.
If you think about this, the 20th century. So with the the Nazis, I mean, Hitler went after the Jews, but he started going after the Christians, too, as Niemöller points out. And then in the Soviet Union, the same thing happened. They went after the Jews, but then they also went after the Christians. Now here we are in 2024 and we're seeing this, this leftist ideology which which hates the Jews, but it also hates the Christians. You know, so we we're finding ourselves in the same boat and
being in the same boat. We're looking at each other and we're getting to know each other and talking and having conversations that we have not had.
And, you know, that's in my I live in a very Orthodox neighborhood, and they know Moody Bible Institute. I have a rabbi friend. In fact, uh, I knew his grandfather, who was also a rabbi, back in the day when I was a kid. And here here I am in Chicago and we met. We've become friends. And he recognizes that the true friends, the people that will care the most for the Jewish community at this time of just
enlarged and growing and, uh, just exploding anti-Semitism. The people that will stand with the Jewish people are there are the followers of Jesus. They're speaking up. They're they're taking a stand. Uh, pastor in New York recently said at a at a rally for the Jewish people and opposing anti-Semitism when they come after the Jewish people. He wants the Jewish community to know that they'll have to come through our church. Amen. Yeah. We're going to be we're
going to be there with you. And I think that that is a tremendous testimony.
I'm glad to hear him say it, but I hope other churches will say it and they will believe it, as opposed to just sitting on the sidelines and pretending like this doesn't really concern me. It's not important. It is biblically important. Read the book of Esther. You know, start with the book of Esther, then read Psalm 83. Yeah.
Right. Right.
Then go to Romans 11. Yeah. And then put some Jeremiah in there, too, and tell me what you come up with. Yeah.
Jeremiah 3135 through 37. If you can measure the heavens, search out the foundations of the deep. If you can make the sun, moon and stars stop shining, only then can the people, the Jewish people, be destroyed. God will protect the Jewish people and I, I believe that, but what? Who does he want to use to protect them? You and me. Schools like Moody and Colorado Christian University. I think that that is is truly what it's about. And
by the way, I want to commend you. I you wrote to me and you said that Colorado Christian University has established a course in history of anti-Semitism. That's what a great school. I'm so great. And I think that was a kind of promoted. And of course, we've been teaching Jewish studies at Moody for 102 years. But I am so grateful that Colorado Christian, a student there, can take a course in history and its history as fact. Yeah. Uh, not not narratives, you know.
Right. And there are actually a lot of courses, you know, they have to study the Old Testament, the Hebrew Scriptures, um, they will have opportunities to study. I mean, they have to study the Holocaust. They just have to. Oh, yeah.
You know, the most important theological issue of the 20th century, I believe, is the Holocaust. And, you know, one of the things I've been doing now for 30 years at Moody is teaching a course called Holocaust. The Holocaust History and the Crisis of Evil.
And I want to take that course.
Well, you know, I'll give you the zoom link. I'm teaching it this semester. And, you know, it's such an important course. And what I'm amazed about and so grateful to moody students. It's always full. Yeah. You know, students not in Jewish studies are taking it as their theology elective or just squeezing it in as best they could.
So I think there's going to be a an awakening in the future of the church to the importance of Israel and the Jewish people. It hasn't happened yet, but I think it's coming.
Yeah, I agree with you. And I see it even now with the summit now, because people registered for this in really larger numbers than anyone thought. We expected this many people, some people who were talking to us said, no, I don't think you're going to get that many. But we did.
Good news.
Yeah. Thank you. Hey, thank you for being with me today, Don. I really appreciate it. And that was Don Sweeting, the chancellor of Colorado Christian University. I'm Michael Radonich. I'm so glad that you were here. And I want to say thanks to Chris Siegert for doing a great job as our engineer this hour. Stick around, because there's really an interesting program. We're going to talk about some people about the summit and why they're here. And I think you're
going to enjoy it. That's the first hour of Open Line is done, but there's a second hour coming up, so don't miss it. Keep reading, keep reading, keep listening. We're going to talk about Israel and the Jewish people. Open line with Doctor Michael Radonich is a production of Moody Radio, a ministry of Moody Bible Institute.