Welcome to the Open Adoption Project. We're the Nelsons. I'm Shaun. And I'm Lanette. And we are excited to be back with more episodes for our celebration of National Adoption Month. Yeah, we hope that the things that we share this month, typically about three episodes a week, will help you in your observation of and recognition of National Adoption Month. Yeah, we're really grateful for the opportunity to be sharing different perspectives and opinions and always
looking for that chance to learn. It's really one of our big themes here to listen and learn, especially listen and learn from adoptees but also from birth parents. There's always something new that we can learn to help us do better going forward. Yeah, so this month we're putting out several episodes a week. You'll hear episodes conducted by us or by Alicia Gallacher, who's our Director of Communications. And again, we just hope to kind of flood the podcast
sphere with adoption content for this month. Also, we're getting really close to a hundred episodes, which is super exciting. So this is helping with that too. A little side perk. Perfect. So we hope you enjoyed this episode and at the end we'll chat just a little bit about our newsletter. If you are not subscribed to our newsletter, I'll ask you right now to go ahead and look it up if you're
interested in getting more adoption related content in your inbox. So go on over to openadoptionproject.org and click on newsletter to sign up. All right, well we are back on the podcast with Liz Rivera. Thank you so much for being with us again today. And today we're going to be talking just briefly, a little bit shorter than our previous conversation, about some openness considerations specifically for caretakers in the foster care
situation. So, you know, when I ask you that, Liz, as a potential foster care parent, what should I be thinking about when it comes to openness, being connected with biological families? What should I be thinking about? So I was thinking about this just last week as we've been communicating back and forth. And I was actually listening to another podcast and they were talking about some of George Orwell's work, and particularly a phrase that he
would use called the power of facing. And they talked a lot about that and then I got online and read some more about it. But it was it was basically the concept is the power of facing the truth about our lives, the lives we're living. And I was thinking about that in relationship to our conversation today that so many times, you know, in foster care and adoption, we wish
things were different. And I think rightly so a lot of times, because sometimes the things that have happened are so hard and so sad, that we truly wish they were different. But then I was thinking of George Orwell and thinking about the power of facing the power of facing the reality we have the reality that is actually in front of us instead of the one we wish. And so instead of wasting my time and energy on wishing we're different, I simply
accept it and there's power in acceptance of the way things are. And part of accepting the way things are is that many of these children who come to care have deep and abiding connections to their first family. And that is we simply accept that that that's a reality. And then we think, okay, with what with that reality, what am I being called upon to do then that is in the
best interest of this child. And many times it is trying to find a way to maintain those connections, even when those connections are with people, that that foster family may not feel 100% comfortable around, would never go out necessarily and seek relationship with. And they start to just open themselves up and say, this is this child's family, they are important to this child,
therefore they are important to me. And I think sometimes when we only do something because it's good for the child, it's, I don't know, maybe it's a little bit patronizing or condescending, I'll be nice to you because it's good for my child. Instead of opening ourselves up to falling in love with the parents of this kid. And I can't tell you how many families I've talked to who have had that experience. And they said, I expected to fall in love with the kids,
I didn't expect to fall in love with their parents. And it's some of the most beautiful work I've ever seen happen. And regardless then of the outcome of a case, everyone is enriched, because that foster parent was willing to open themselves up to relationship with people that they may not have sought a relationship with otherwise. Oh, I love that. I mean, I've been on the I've been on the adoptive parents side of that four times over, and have come to really appreciate and love our
children's birth parents. And I'm curious, from your perspective, having seen this professionally for many years, what do you feel like some of the skills are or strategies that caretakers or adoptive parents employ to foster those connections?
I think one thing that's really hard is to be non judgmental. So this and this sort of echoes back a little bit to our previous conversation about the book, what happened to you is if they can look at the parents of these kids, and they can think, okay, this parent didn't just wake up one day and decide to, you know, become addicted to meth or opiates, or, you know, whatever they did, that
there's something deeper there. And I choose to look at them as somebody who has had difficulty in life, and instead of someone who's just done bad things, one of our families once they their daughter that they'd adopted from foster care was about 1516. And her older biological brother had aged out of foster care, and was back in contact with their their mom. And he so he called her one day and he said, Mom wants to see you. So she went to her parents and
said, My brother wants really wants me to go with him to see our mom. And they said, Well, we want to go with you to make sure it's safe. And so they went with her. And I talked to him after it happened. And I was talking to the dad. And he said, I said, How did it go? And he started crying. And he said, I wish we could have had her when she was in foster care. He said, We could have made
a difference for the mom. And it was and they were devastated by that. So I think this this approaching, you know, without judgment, with this is a human being whose life has gone terribly wrong, their children have been removed. That's a huge thing. And what's what happened to you? What? Where did you come from? This is this is where you've ended up and have that that openness, that grace, that compassion is that and once again, some people I think are born with it in
spades. And others of us have to develop that. And I've seen it happen both ways. I've seen people who just I know that's what's gonna happen because that's what they're like. And then I've seen the people that I never thought would do it actually do it. And it's pretty amazing to watch happen. Yeah, so that level of compassion, not being judgmental, really removes some of the barriers between, you know, creating this beautiful relationship. Any other
thoughts or ways that they can foster that connection with first parents? I love that recommendation. But what else comes to mind? Yeah, so I think now because we talked a little bit last time about how technology can be maybe not always our friend. But in this case, I think
technology can be our friend. I mean, we have we've had families set up, you know, password protected blogs, and they want to give the password to the parents or grandparents, you know, creating even though I think technically you're not supposed to do this, but creating Facebook accounts under pseudonyms, or Facebook or Instagram accounts that only the family has access to. So to be able to share pictures and information about the kids,
honoring the role of the parent. So saying to the parent, you know, this little guy's only been with me for two weeks, and we went to McDonald's, and I don't even know what he likes at McDonald's. What does he love at McDonald's? Or what's his favorite color? What, you know, recognizing these parents are experts in their kids, and deferring to them, recognizing that and foster parents will fight me on this one. I always tell them, they're in the
position, they're they're in the position of power and privilege. A lot of them don't believe it, because it doesn't always feel like it, because they're what they're hoping for doesn't isn't always prioritized. But they really are foster parents really are in the position of privilege. And so where can
they where can they share power with that with that parent? And sometimes that may need to be cleared with DCFS, because we don't want foster parents just going rogue and, you know, doing things that aren't necessarily according to the case plan. But talking to the caseworker and saying I want to involve this parent more in this child's life, I want this parent have more say
in their child's life. How can we share power with this parent? So they feel like they are still the parent and honoring that role of that parent. Yeah. And I think in this situation where a caretaking situation becomes an
adoption situation, the power does shift a little bit. And it's really, I think really important, especially for the child's sake, that we continue to honor the connections that we've that we've tried to create in the care, the care taking scenario, when an adoption is finalized, just because you become the legal parents of this child doesn't erase their past. That doesn't erase the
connections that they have with their biological parents or first family. Yeah, that's a really important consideration to make that that what we're doing has really long term effects and, and going into a situation, a care situation or adoption situation often means that we're gaining a lot more family than just this child who's coming into our home. Yeah, hopefully. Yeah. Yeah, ideally. Yeah, ideally. Yeah. Great. Any anything else? I know we're going to
keep this one quite short. But anything else when it comes to fostering connection or or openness in in the sphere of caretakers? I think you brought up a good point just wanted to really just quickly address is that when we talk about sharing power, when the child's still in foster care, the goal is reunification, that sharing power will look very different than if the case
plan changes to adoption and adoption occurs. But to reach out to professionals, so DCFS has, you know, people who can help with this, maybe sometimes, if the child is a therapist, they can help with this, but maybe having having those open conversations with the child's first family, like, okay, now it's going to be adoption, now it's going to be different now, because it will be it's just it just is. So what what's that going to look like? What do we manage
that? How do we navigate that and just be willing to talk about things really openly, and not think we have to figure everything out and then apply it, that we can actually make this a team effort and figure it out so that everybody feels like they have some say and the solutions we come up with together are oftentimes going to be better than the ones we might do just on our own.
Yeah, and in my experience, they are quite fluid. What works right now, or what considerations we have put in place for openness right now, are going to look different three months, six months, three years, six years down the road, because we change. Everybody changes, right. And ultimately, if we're doing everything that we can for the, you know, to, to put the child in the best circumstance, for their to help them feel whole, right. That's going to be something that's
fluid and endeavor changing. Absolutely. And that kind of just harkens back your comment just now to the beginning, right? Face the truth. And embrace the truth. What what actually happened, what actually is happening, and sit in the truth and be okay with the truth. Absolutely. Yeah, and we're going to have a much better response if we face what's happening instead of pretending like it's not or wishing it weren't. Wonderful. Well, Liz, thank you so much
for being with us again. I think these are really important considerations for either, you know, the caretaker or potential adoptive parent to be thinking about. So we really appreciate you. Any any last words that you'd share before you wrap up on this topic? No, just thank you. And just I really appreciate the
work that you and Lanette are doing with the Open Adoption podcast. And I really hope people are listening regularly because what this little bit we talked about today, you guys explore so much more deeply and so many of these amazing conversations that I hope people and then and then as we talked about before, you guys really privileged the voice of the adoptee. And I think that that's a
voice that has been missing for a very long time. And that especially during National Adoption Month, we want to privilege the voice of the person who's living this. Yep, they need to be heard and it has to be focused on them. So thank you again so much. We so appreciate you. Thank you. Thank you. Thank you so much for listening to this episode of the Open Adoption Project. Yeah, we're so grateful to be able to share a lot of content this month,
November 2023, for National Adoption Month. Yeah, so we just would love to remind you to subscribe to our newsletter if you have not done that yet. You can go to openadoptionproject.org and click on Newsletter and there's a subscription form right there that you can fill out. Also connect with us on social media. We're on Instagram and on Facebook
at Open Adoption Project. Yeah, thank you so much for being here and learning with us as we just keep talking and learning about all of these different nuances of adoption.