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purchase. That's B-O-M-B-A-S dot com slash unexplainable and use code unexplainable at check out. Hi everyone from New York Magazine and the Vox Media Podcast Network. This is on with Cara Swisher and I'm Cara Swisher. We've had a slew of power women on on and today we're keeping up that streak. Comedian and actor Julie Louis Dreyfus. She's obviously a comedy
legend. I'm an enormous fan. She's won 11 MAs, a record of eight. She got for playing some of TV's most iconic female characters on three different sitcoms, Elaine Benes and Seinfeld, Christine Campbell in the new adventures of old Christine and of course Vice President Selena Meyer in VEEP. I don't know which one I like the most. I like all the characters. I suspect Selena is my favorite character because she's real. Actually I've
met people like her but my kids like Seinfeld. I love Seinfeld. It stays fresh even today and she's probably my favorite character on that show besides Jerry Stiller and her scene. If you haven't seen it, it's on YouTube of her and Jerry Stiller cracking each other up is one of the finest bits of comedy I've ever seen. She's been honored with the Mark Twain Prize for American humor and the National Medal of Arts. She is a national
treasure obviously. And now she's winning awards for her new podcast Wiser than Me where she gets life lessons from women over 70. Jane Fonda, Fran Lieberwitz, Gloria Steinem, Patty Smith and Lamont who I also recently spoke to. They've talked about what they've learned and how they've coped with the hard stuff including death and grief which is also the focus of Julia's latest film Tuesday. And so fittingly our question this week comes
from Psychotherapist and host of Where Should I Begin Podcasts Esther Peral. I'm excited to talk to her and I think you'll be excited to hear from her. Hi. Hi, Kara. How you doing? Thank you so much for doing this. I appreciate it. Oh my goodness. It's my pleasure. The movie was astonishing. I have to say you were fantastic in it. Oh, thank you very much. And I love anything about death. So I'm very excited about it. Yeah, I do too actually. But first I want
to talk about the podcast, your podcasting empire. Partly. Yeah. You're doing really well. You just wrapped up the second season of Wiser than Me which you interview women over 70. A lot of celebrities have podcasts these days obviously. A lot of them are different from yours. For example, I think smart list is basically a buddy comedy. Talk about how you decided to do this and the way you conceived of it. Well, it just it I watched the Jane Fonda
documentary. I don't know if you've seen it. Sure have. Yeah. Yeah. It's phenomenal in my view. And I was just riveted. And it's after watching that I really did think, oh God, where are all the old women? We're not hearing from these women. I mean, we are really not hearing from them. And I wish there was a place where we could just only hear from old women. And so that's where it sort of began. And I thought, well, maybe I'll do it. And you know,
and that's how it started. It was born out of curiosity. Not not any desire to do a podcast necessarily, but just to actually hear from older women. And then I sort of developed it with my with my college roommate. And it's been a real labor of love and passion. It's been very popular. It's very high up on the rankings. Were you surprised by that? You know, I was surprised by it because I wasn't really thinking about how it would do. I was just thinking about doing it
if that makes sense. I wasn't going after it with that ambition. That doesn't mean I'm not ambitious, of course, but it really means that I was just trying to think of people that would be interesting to talk to at great, at great length. How do you look at the podcast medium as a way to do that? You know, a lot of people get in and they get out of it pretty quickly because it's hard. It's a marathon. It's a real marathon. Yeah. And some make money, some don't. But they're, but they
can be very lucrative. I've had a really good run in that regard. But how do you look at it as a medium to communicate this? Because there's lots of ways you could have done this. You could have had a talk show, television, yeah. I know. Well, I mean, I guess because sort of like the conversation we're having now, which feels relaxed, if you and I were in front of an audience right now and having to talk and I was in hair and makeup and on their crap, it's a different, it's a,
it's an absolutely different content of conversation. And I actually enjoy talking to people on their podcasts when we sort of get into depth about things because I think it's, I just find it interesting to communicate that way. Right. Conversation. Yes. And so I thought that that this medium would be conducive to those kinds of intimate conversations where we maybe get a little bit more underneath, underneath, right? Here. Yeah. Also, we don't video the podcast at all. So there's
no pressure on these women who may have a feeling of self-consciousness because they're older. I'm not suggesting they should, of course, but in case just to make it as relaxed as possible. Right. So a conversation, this, you know, this sort of my dinner with Andre kind of vibe to it. How do you pick the subjects in the approach? Like, what does your goal say with Jane Fonda? You talked to her
about ambition. Well, it's really dictated by the women themselves. We do, I do, with my teams help, I do an enormous amount of research in prep and so that I can come to this conversation and not squander it. So it's really their lives and what strikes me is interesting to delve into. I mean, talking to somebody like Isabella Yende versus Bonnie Raider, Patty Smith or Beverly Johnson, these are, you know, they've had wildly varied lives from one another. So it's just, it's entirely
based on their experience. That said though, there are a particular set of questions that I love to hear them answer. I mean, I always open by asking how old they are and how old do they feel? And there are all these subjects that I'd like to delve into, like loss, for example, ambition. And then at the end, I might say things like, you know, what would you say to your 21-year-old self? You know, those things. What do you wish you'd said no or yes to that kind of thing? Yeah.
So we talked about being radicalized by these women or more radicalized by these women. I think that was the quote. Who have you been most influenced by? And what surprised you in the interviews? But you didn't expect. I don't know. Isabella Yende is a crack up. I don't know what? Well, Isabella Yende, oh my god, what a phenomenal human being. I was struck by her complete joy in life. I was overcome by it. And she talked about being in her 80s as being the best thing ever
and she meant it. I have a very good life. I'm very happy. Oh, God, that's so happy, Julia, really. I'm so happy to be alive. I'm happy to be here. I'm happy to be looking through my window right now. I live very close to Elagon and I see the ducks and the geese and it's fantastic. What do you think the best part about being your ages? That you don't have to please anybody. Oh, yeah. Only the people you love and the people you care for. But not the world, not everybody else.
You don't have to follow anybody's lead. You don't have to follow fashion or nothing. If I try to look good, it's because it pleases me, not because I'm trying to please anybody else. I don't care, really. And that was just like, oh my god, it was a completely different lens through which to consider aging. Gloria Steinem, who I spoke to for this season, obviously was just extraordinary. She actually talked about how as you age, and I'm going to butcher this,
she was talking about how as you age, your inner girl becomes more realized. Do you think that women become more radical as they get older? I suppose nothing is true all the time, but I do think it's possible that it's often true because we outlive the stereotypical expectations
of marriage and family and this subordinate role if that's still around. Or, you know, I mean, I think just as we are maybe more ourselves when we're before 10 or 11 years old and we're little girls who are climbing trees and saying, you know, I know what I want, I know what I think. And the feminine role hasn't descended upon us yet. We may also be more ourselves at the other end of the feminine role. And I always think it would be great if an army of great-haired women
could take over the earth. Well, then the earth would be a safe place in my view, you know. It would be better. It would be much better. It would be much better. There is a theme with all of these women, all of them, which is a shedding of what's expected of you, which as a woman, which is particularly fascinating to me and important to realize. I believe the technical term is no more fox left to give. Thank you. But it's not necessarily a negative thing, right? Yeah. No, it's fantastic.
It's like, I am, there's less bullshit. I say what I feel, I know what I know. I know more. And that's the whole consider the podcast. They know more. So come on, let's listen to this. Let's listen to them. Come on, woman. I will get to your movie. Come on, woman. That was the best best end line I'd say. One of the things that I think the reason it works, this is a lot about you and you how it changes your thinking, whether it's about the movie industry, women's rights,
becoming more political. Have these conversations changed you yourself, given you're looking for wisdom, you know, wiser than me, or is that wisdom being put to use in your own life? Well, I will say that my reflections afterwards, after I actually have these conversations, I think a lot about them. And I will often, or most often, write with my husband the story at the beginning of the podcast that sort of will be a thread into the conversation.
And so I would say certainly it's, I don't know if this is good or not, but it's, it's always been a very private person in a lot of ways. And I've made a bit of a shift in terms of sharing aspects of myself. I don't know if I'm ultimately going to regret that, but but I have done that in a way that I find surprising. You do not, you don't have that much time for a regret anymore, so it's okay. It's as if I let them out. But you also call your mom and
talk to her about them. Oh, yeah. How does that go? Yeah. Well, this occurred to me to do when we were developing the show because my mother is very intelligent, very curious. She's completely with it. She's 90 and she has been my, she's been my beloved mother. I don't know what else to say. And so I, and she's very intellectual. And so I thought, my God, of all the women, I must, I must include my mother in this in some way. So the idea of downloading with my mom feels right
because I download with my mom. And I enjoy her. I thought maybe people would enjoy, and she's getting a huge kick out of it. Yeah. Yeah. Would you bring her on? I don't believe you have, correct? I think that would be, I'm waiting for that one, honestly. You are, I, that's something I'm considering, I suppose. I think you have to. I've had my son and my brother on and stuff like, they've been, well, some of the most popular ones, which is interesting, especially my son.
He's very wise for a young person. But I would love to hear your mom and her thoughts on it. I think it would be really good because she's a character in your podcast. I mean, podcasts are about characters. In any case, we got a question this week from someone who's a fan of your podcast, psychotherapist, a stair perl, host to the podcast, where should I begin? I don't know if you listen to it. It's fantastic. And you'll hear her question for you. Oh, God. It's okay.
Hello, Julie. We drive foods. So much of your work on the podcast is about starting conversation that the world needs to listen in on. And that really resonates with me. How do you think about the role of community of the collective in working through some of the very issues that you are processing on the show? The importance of the collective in addressing aging or loss or love or grief, hope, desire. What is the relationship between the eye and the eye in the process,
in the processing of such complicated existential wonders? Thank you. She's a therapist. She's a well-known therapist. I know. I know. And she's a fantastic carrot. Carrot, you answer it. Are you not smart enough? Are you? I'm a dumbass. No, you are not. You said that. I couldn't, I couldn't understand. You heard not a dumbass. Stop. No, I'm making a joke. I know I'm not a dumbass. But, um, well, I mean, to be honest with you, I think she answered the question in her question.
She was talking about community and the collective, the we in terms of dealing with issues and addressing loss and love and so on and so forth. And the answer is, yes, the collective is the way out. I think actually her question speaks to something that's come out of these conversations, actually, particularly with my mother, which is the key is connect, connect, connect. I don't mean plug your computer in. I mean connect with human beings. There's everything to be said
for community and everything not to be said about isolation. Right. And we're in a land of isolation now, which is paralyzing and toxic. So I think there's nothing but value in finding ways to take action to connect with other people in every sense. I think people are desperate for it. Desperate for it. And agreement. One of the reasons I always say one of my podcasts pivot works is because where I'm connecting with a man who I disagree with in a way that's kind.
And we disagree a lot. And people are desperate for that. They're desperate. They're desperate for a kind conversation. You know, it's funny. I remember once, this is neither here nor there, but it was a while back and I was by myself. It was a weekend where I sort of didn't have plans and my husband wasn't there and I was sort of alone. And I remember that I went to the grocery store and I found myself having an in-depth conversation
with the checkout woman at the register. And I started asking her questions about her life. And I realized what afterwards what was happening, which was it was, it was, I was lonely. And I was became very, very interested in her life. Why wouldn't I be interested? Everybody has an interesting life. But I remember noting that. Like, oh, that's interesting. I really sought a human being out.
No, it's an important story. A year ago, you know what your your podcast reminds me of Spalding Grey did a show at the Kennedy Center many years ago where he brought people from the audience and just interviewed them just randomly. And it was brilliant because he said everyone's story is interesting if you just talked to them. And it was, you know, he had his own troubles as, you know, as life ended. But it was the most riveting conversations I've ever seen
because, and that's what you're talking about here. And that's what I'm talking about. And by the way, that's what something my mother does. And to sometimes great frustration to me and my sisters because she'll talk to anybody and ask them everything. And as a result, she's a vibrant human being. But it does mean it takes a while to get out of any situation. We'll be back in a minute. My dad works in B2B marketing. But I never really knew what that meant. Then one day, my dad came
by my school for career day and told everyone in my class he was a big, row-as man. Then he just kept saying things like, the bigger the row-as the better, over and over. My friends still laugh at me this day. I think it means calculating a return on ad spend? One thing's for sure. I'll be known as the row-as man's kid for the rest of my days. Why can you just be a fireman or a lawyer? Why?
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Support for this show comes from Babel. You're never too old to learn something new. In fact, studies show that learning a new language can help you develop a better memory, improve concentration, and even tap into deeper creativity. And if you're one in five Americans who has learned a new language on your bucket list, you might want to try Babel. Babel is a science-back language learning app with lessons created by real people for real conversations. Unlike other
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providing me with an ability to actually speak it. Here's a special limited time deal for our listeners. Right now, get up to 60% off your Babel subscription, but only for our listeners at babel.com-slash-swisher. Get up to 60% off at babel.com-swisher-spailed-ba-b-e-l.com-slash-swisher. Rules and restrictions may apply. So speaking of connection, let's talk about Tuesday, dealing with existentialism and grief. Just to let people know, this is not a comedy, but it is funny in many ways.
It's actually very funny. Giant Lulies Dryface is my favorite. You handle your tallness really well, but also and smallness. You didn't like smallness much, but the you going through the grass is a tiny thing. I felt the borrowers all over again. Anyway, but it's about death literally in the form of a talking maca, I believe. That's the bird. I have not seen a movie like this in, I think, for some reason, the John Malkovich movie
was the last one it reminded me of of the feelings I had during it. It's obviously a fantasy. It's surreal in many ways. It feels like Garcia Marquez book or something like that. Can you talk a little bit what attracted you and the reason for taking it on? So the script was sent to me by A24 and I, you know, it was crazy. Benav is this script, but the themes of the film, the parent child bond, grieve, loss, death, dying, acceptance,
denial. All of these themes are incredibly interesting to me as a human being. So then I met with Dina Opuchek, who is the writer, director, Croatian woman. This is her first feature film. And I met with her just to get a sense of course of who she was and what her intentions were and if I felt comfortable in her hands. And I came away feeling very trusting of her and signed up. God, you know, she, she's quite an artist. I'm sure I know you'll be hearing
more from her as a filmmaker. And the animation, of course, was, it was paramount that the animation within the film was expert of the bird. Yes. But I do want to say that within the film, as you say, there's this sort of monster like bird, macauffing that is representing death. And a lot of people think that was just CGI. In fact, it was not. It was played by an extraordinary actor, Arinze Kenne. He was a cast member with us. And then what the animators did was they used
his performance and animated over him. And so I always like to give a shout out to Arinze, because you're not actually necessarily seeing him, but you actually are very much seeing. Yeah, it's interesting. It's like in Lord of the Rings, because he was there. In that conversation, you had at the table, I was like, the actor is sitting there with you. That's what I thought. That's what I figured. Amazing, amazing performance, by the way. And disturbing at the same time,
but also very funny, but very funny bird. But in the movie, a mother and daughter basically having a conversation with death and about death together, you've been through a cancer treatment. You're a parent. I've had a stroke. My dad died. Talk about what you draw to understand about the depths of grief, because in this case, you're dealing with someone else's death or impending death. Well, I've also lost people close to me. I've lost my dad. I lost my sister. And so,
yeah, I'm certainly keenly aware of our mortal lives. So I brought all of that with me to this. But I think the first thing that really appealed to me about this was the ferocity of the parent child bond, which it's undeniable and it's enormous. And so I enjoyed that aspect of the script, the lengths that a mother would go to to keep death away. And it really explores that,
including, by the way, denial of a reality. Yes, not being there. Yes. Not being there. I mean, it's interesting when I heard the description that I almost didn't want to watch it, because I have kids and the idea of, I just, I know, you know what I mean? It's one of those things that I was thinking the other day right before I watch it. I'm like, total, I have so many kids. I've up my chances of being upset. You know what I mean? I don't know why I popped into my brain, but one of
the things, the grief of knowing you're going to lose someone. Now, we know that with older people, but it's harder. Your character, Zora, tries to avoid her daughter, selling off bits and pieces of their beautiful things. And then you go to the other extreme, which is barbecuing and trying
to eat death, literally, being forced by death and confronted. Can you talk a little bit about that, a little more about the parent child bond, because your character is at the center of that, and your child is kind of, the, Zora is really the child in the relationship in a weird way. Right. That's what is the dysfunction. Certainly, at the start of the film, Zora's daughter, whose name is Tuesday, is really parenting her mother. And the journey, well, there are many
journeys within the film, but one of the biggest journeys, I think, is the flip. So that by the end of the film, Zora comes to realize how she must parent her child in a functional way, which includes accepting the realities of her situation. One of the things that striking is not knowing the pain her daughter is in, not being aware of the pain until she can hear her, has having death. So she has this hearing. Well, she has a, I mean, it's very symbolic. It's very
metaphorical. It's because of the transformation that happens. I, we're talking about this in such a way. I hope it's clear to people listening, because what Zora does is she fights death in an effort to keep death away. And then ultimately sort of becomes death. She learns by doing death. She learns by doing. And, and then realizes that as death, she has to come to her daughter. Oh my God, I can't stand even saying it. I get, I still obsess me. I can't stand. It's like a death
doula in a weird way. Yes, which of course there is, which I think is remarkable. And God, I think about that a lot. When I talked with Isabel IND and we're talking about this thing called death. I was remarking, because I had the, actually the gift of being able to be with my dad when he passed away. And I was very much struck by how that waiting and being with him was not dissimilar from waiting for some child to be born for a birth. And the similarity in those transitions are
similar. And I'm not suggesting that one is as joyful as the other. But they are from a life living point of view. I was very, and she was talking about that as well. And she, well, what's interesting about it is she becomes joyful when she's doing death, right? That night of putting people at rest. The people screaming in the background and you don't get to see a lot of it, except for a couple of scenes, was very funny, even though it wasn't funny.
Bird bang bang bang. I was in hysterics with that. I was like, oh, that's what would happen if death went away. Death took a holiday, right? Speaking of which. But she gets joyful by doing death. Would you like to have that power? Would you ever fuck no? Are you kidding me? Really? I kind of would. You would? Caravilla. Yeah, because it's kind. It's a kindness. That macawe isn't cruel. That macawe is kind. That's too much for me to bear. Yeah. The pain. I can't handle it. I pass on
that job opportunity in real life. All right. Okay. All right. Well, you can do the life part. You can do the, it's the link together. So one of the things I just want to show at the movie, and then I want to talk a little bit about your longer career. But you finished this movie three years ago, as I said, looking back, does the idea of come on woman still resonate? Well, actually, it's a get up woman. Get up woman. Excuse me. Get up woman. Sorry. And yes, it's almost a mantra.
I think it works. It certainly applies to my life. What's the alternative? You've got to get up. You got to keep, I mean, we have a limited amount of time. Let's go. Let's get it done. We'll be back in a minute. Support for this show comes from fun rise. For decades, venture capital has been in one of the most prized investment strategies in the world. It was also borderline impossible for most people to
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to learn more. I want to talk a little bit about your career in comedy. You made a joke at the Mark Twain Award in 2018 about being a dramatic actress. That was part of the bit. Damu Peter Hall. What a mistake. But it would be hard not to finish up with the legacy as a comedic actress. We met at the awards show where you won the webby podcast of the year for Wiser than me. But in your long television career, you've won 11 Emmys. You're
one of the few actors who has played not one but three iconic television characters. Elaine Benes, Christine Campbell and Vice President Selina Meyer. How do you look at each character now? To me, this is just me and you could have a different take. I'm just an audience member. They have a common as a need to be in the Boys Club. Am I getting that wrong? All getting aside would have been easier to be Porsche. All of the characters, the thread between them all,
is profound frustration. Of course, aren't you frustrated? As a woman, isn't that? frustration is kind of for me a driver. It certainly is with all of these women. I would say, Selina Meyer in the most obvious and ultimate of ways. Yeah, but in that Mark Twain speech, and I was talking about being a dramatic actress,
and the truth is, is that I really do enjoy doing drama. It's actually why I took on this role because I wanted to exercise that muscle again and have an opportunity to show that this is in my wheelhouse. That joke about the quality of mercy is not strange. It was actually born out of a true place. Truth be told. I'm not going to wade you into the Seinfeld controversy because I think has nothing to do with you. But I'd love to know what you think is funny now. Everyone seems to
have a theory, obviously. But what do you think is funny right at this moment we're in? That question's funny. I think there's a lot of talk about how comics can't be funny now. I think that's not true. I think comics are funnier than that's bullshit. I think that's bullshit. Physical comedy and intellectual comedy and political comedy. I think it's never been more interesting because there's so much to do. It's a right time. Comedy is risky and it can be
offensive. But that's what makes it so enjoyable. Not that it's offensive, but that it's risky. It can be very truth-challenged. With risk, I personally don't buy the conceit that this is an impossible time to be funny. Maybe some people aren't laughing at your jokes, but that doesn't mean they shouldn't be made. One of the things Elaine is known, for example, with the physical moves, although the dry retorts or the shoves or the dance, but also the retorts. And Selena, to me,
is all feral facial expressions and wicked verbal cuts. Is it harder to do physical or intellectual comedy? There are equal strain. The physical comedy sometimes, in my experience, is stuff that I've often found in rehearsal. So it takes a little exploring to find it. But I wouldn't say that it's hard. I would say it's as much fun. There's nothing more exciting than having really good material and then elevating it. If you can, and if you do it physically, it's just delish. Absolutely.
I've just come more questions. Sign fell in particular, for example, which I think you'll probably be best known for, even though I prefer deep, I know what's on. I love Sign fell too. But it's having this renaissance on Netflix. A lot of young people are watching the show. My son was like, have you heard of Sign fell? I'm like, yeah. Why do you think it holds up? That younger generations are connecting. Well, I don't know why they're that it's having this research in. So I'm delighted
that it is. It holds up because it's the human condition. It's undeniably funny. It wasn't fad-ish. It speaks to really universal truths. And period, it's just like a great show. And it'll always be a great show. Is there a show if you had to introduce someone to it that you would show them first? There's obviously the famous ones. Not that there's anything wrong with that. Master of your own domain. Is there any show you would say, let's look at this one.
Well, I don't know. Probably something from seasons four or five when we started to really get our stride. It's interesting to watch the show because it's not that I do. I don't really watch the show. But when it first started, it was slow by comparison. And the pace started to pick up and it became more, it just became snappier as it went along. Maybe the soup Nazi. The soup Nazi was a good one. I think the bris was one of my favorites, the bris. Oh, really?
That's the double area. There's so many. The subway episode. But one of the things that's interesting is Netflix were really paid more than $500 million for the Sign felled rights for five years. The contract started in 2021. Did you see any of that money? Not one cent. Okay. How do you feel about that? Fantastic. I would love you to go on about that. Alana Glazer who was pretty critical about streaming
services. What's your take? You're going into AI next for free just so you know, but go ahead. Good because I know nothing about it. Look, here's my take on all of this. I'm worried about the corporatization of arts. And I'm, for example, this movie I made Tuesdays with A24. One of the very few, if not the last remaining independent studio making unusual films.
I'm worried about that because it's now a lot of executives calling and there've always been these executives, but they're have they haven't been on top of each other like a layer cake. I think and I'm very worried about what that represents for good art outside the box because you know, we're not making widgets here. Good ideas are often well, first of all they're hard to find. And they I can tell you one thing they're not found by a corporation. Good art
full ideas in my view. Yeah, even though you're a network note according to Jerry Fine Sign fell, that was very funny. Yeah, that was funny. It was fantastic. But in 2020, you signed an overall deal with Apple TV plus to develop new products as executive producer and actor. You've been producer on many of your shows. What does that mean exactly and how does the
deal differ from the ones you've cut over the past three decades? Well, first of all, I really like to, I didn't produce Tuesday, for example, but I do very much like to produce the work that I do because it just gives me more control over the product. And I've been doing this now long enough so that I think I have experience that's useful as a producer. And so that's important to me. I am no I no longer have this deal at Apple. It ran out. It was finished. And you know, to be
honest with me, they're all perfectly nice, but nothing came out of it. And that was too bad, but just didn't, which is often the case with the deals I guess indeed. So what do you do now? Do you go bring your projects, your production company? I don't even know. I don't want, I don't want the headache of that right now. I just don't. I'd rather do things on a case-by-case basis. I mean, I'm guessing, you know, probably yes, I could have a production company. I could have,
I could be developing material for myself or other people. That's not something ultimately that excites me. It's too much. I don't need a huge universe like that. I'm not Oprah. Yeah. You're not going to re-sweather spoon it first. I'm not going to. And this is not my way to disparage them in any, in any, in any way. I'm just saying that's not who I am. I approach projects very specifically. And that's how I'm going to, that's how I roll. That's how I may ask
what you're doing next. I don't know. Well, you've got to success. I just finished, I just finished a Marvel movie. Yeah. My son has to know why you're in the Marvel movies. You turn into a villain from what I understood, from what he tells. Well, I'm not allowed to say, Carabelle, he tells me. As you know, let me explain to you something. The Marvel universe, if you're in it, you have to sign an NDA every three and a half minutes. And so if I say anything to you right now, a Marvel
executive will come and shoot me in the head as I'm speaking to you. And possibly shoot you. He can try. He can try. Yeah, you'll take them on good. I'll take them on good. Are you kidding? But anyway, I did rap Thunderbolts. And so that is that I have coming out next year. But in terms of like, what am I shooting next? I'm not sure. I don't know. So let me ask just two more, three more questions very quick. Politics. You're a moderator at the 2020 Democratic Convention.
Just some very good jokes that some of it's apparently they cut. You can comment on that if you'd like. It was broadcast news to the 10th power doing that thing. I am here to tell you. It was Kuku bananas. It was COVID. The DNC talking to comedy writers talking to, I mean, it was nuts. Fun. I ultimately I was delighted to have done it. Although terrorists, what are you doing this this go around? There's a campaign. I don't know if you know that. There's campaign happening.
A president. Oh, really? And who's running? Kara? It's a rerun. It's. Oh, I see. No, not like this. Not like this. I am. No. It could be worse. It could be worse. I don't know. Could it be worse? Yes. I just interviewed Alexandria Ocasio-Cortez last week and she was like, I'll be arrested as if it was Tuesday speaking of Tuesday. Yeah. And she quite meant it. But are you do you want to get involved politics? I am involved. Yeah. I mean, at this point,
not specifically with convention, but I'm involved politically. I do a lot of work in down ballot races, in small races, and state legislatures and so on. And I'm continuing to do that really with evengeance. As we say, down ballot is the thing now. It is. It's a lifeline. I think to saving democracy. Absolutely. So I want to I have two more questions at the end. I want to go back to Tuesday and Wiser. In the end of the film, there's a question of whether heaven or God or the afterlife exists
or not. And the bird says something amazing. But there is an afterlife. The echo you live, the legacy, your memory, this is Tuesday's afterlife. How you live it is how she lives. What do you think of that? What's your echo besides an Oscar, obviously, and the Oscar goes to? I don't. My echo? Well, I'm going to say something very polyanna-ish. My echo is my two boys. And them being good human beings and good citizens. If they are, then my echo is good and pure.
That's my answer, period. This other crap doesn't matter. Yeah, I just gave that answer to someone they were surprised. I was like, that's the only thing. Why would you be surprised? It's so fundamental. I know. I was like, just them. That's it. That's just them, of course. None of this other stuff is meaningful in the same way. It's interesting, but not meaningful. You're right. The last question, you start every episode of your podcast with a story about your life. I think you should continue
to do that. I know your private, but it's I think it resonates with people. It resonates with me certainly. Are you writing a memoir? No, I'm not. If you did, what would the title be? The title would be, what should the title be? Question mark. That's the title. Okay. All right. I think you should. I just pulled that out of my ass. I like it. I like it. I like it. I like it. I like it. Anyway, thank you so much for doing this. I appreciate it. I do hope you do
when they ask her. Might be nice. Eras might be nice. Might be nice. I'm so happy to be on this to talk with you because I listen to your podcast frequently and so to actually have this conversation in-depth conversation with you has been really a delight for me. So thanks a lot. Appreciate it. Thank you so much. On with Cara Swisher is produced by Christian Castro-Roselle, Katari Yokem, Jolly Myers, and Megan Bernie. Special thanks to Kate Gallagher, Andrea Lopez
Crusado, and Kate Furby. Our engineers are Rick Juan and Fernando Aruda, and our theme music is by Tracademics. If you're already following the show, go ahead and do the Elaine Benes dance. If not, get up, woman and man. Go wherever you listen to podcast search for on with Cara Swisher and hit follow. Thanks for listening to On with Cara Swisher from New York Magazine, the Vox Media Podcast Network, and us. We'll be back on Thursday with more.