On theme is a production of iHeartRadio and fair Weather Friends Media.
You are listening, What do we want black stories? How do we wanna in all sides of shapes and forms?
How long do we want to infinite?
Today we'll be talking about the stories that we like to see in twenty twenty four.
And we'll talk about some of the stories that we'd like to create, like our.
Own little manifesting session. I'm Katie and I'm Eves. In today's episode is New Year, New Stories.
Are you a new Year, New Me?
I am not a new year, New me person. Nothing against the people who are you?
Know?
Do you?
But I don't do that. I usually don't set resolutions either. But I like to think that I can be new at any point that I want to be. And sometimes the world, the universe be calling me to be new before the year changes.
So I gotta do. I gotta do. God say okay, okay, universe child, okay, what about you? Am I a new year New Me? I do look at the new year as like a time like, okay, here's a time that I can make some changes and then do I Normally that's the question. I like how you said you can be new at any time. But I also feel I like the camaraderie of everyone trying to be new at the same time. You've been in the gym with the
gym girlies. I do not be in the gym. I'd be walking outside though, and everybody and nay Mama be walking outside at the beginning of the year and then do a little. But I do like the the energy of like newness and like thinking ahead to the future and all that stuff. People be like be present, be president. I don't know how to do that. All I know how to do is ruminate and plan present. I don't know her, never met her, never been there. We'll work
on that together. But so thinking about like the new year and things we want to see in the future. I am thinking about like what stories I want to read, watch, listen to, and just like what I'm going to be on the lookout for. Okay, So I.
Feel like I'm in the opposite You say you don't know the present when you came to me with this topic, that's what I can think about.
It was like, all I know is the present. I don't know what I want.
I also feel like I'm inundated with so many stories and I have so many to choose from. I have so many that are on the backlist that I have to choose from. I have so many things that I have to enjoy that are in willhouses, that are in will houses that I've ever touched before. So I'm like, look at all of these things. I don't even know what to say I want. Yeah, this was shockingly hard to me to think about, because it's not truly not
something that I typically think about. I don't know what I want until I'm in that moment, Like we were just talking about what we're gonna read next, and I'm like looking through my bookshelf, like hmmm, what am I feeling? Knowing I have stuff checked out on Libby already and I'm just like.
But what am I feeling right now? What do I need in this moment? Yeah? Yeah, So I feel like we're very different in that regard. Yeah, And I think it doesn't have to be like a new thing. Like even you said you have like a backlog of things that you know that you've been wanting to read. Does anything like stand out to you that you're like, Okay, I would have like make sure that that gets off the back list in the new year.
So some of the things that I want to explore in the new year are stories that are centered around local and regional folklore. And that's because I do like fantasy, I like being in imagined worlds. I like world building in certain ways, but they that have really rich characters in them. And I feel like there's so much that I want to learn about the world and the people in the world, and so much that I don't know.
And I think that fiction centered around different cultures folklore would be something that would be really enjoyable for me to explore. And I also think too, it's like, yes, it's me learning more about black people, but also it'll be a really good turn around after this past year, which has been really really real for me. And I've also been focused on nonfiction a lot as well this year, and to go in the direction of folklore, it can
be things that will still teach me lessons. Maybe that'll still have me learning things, even if they're not lessons that are like moral text or anything like that. They'll still have me learning about different cultures and also allow me to be in fun and colorful worlds at the same time. And I think that would be a nice balance and nothing too heady, more hearty.
When you say folklore, are you kind of talking about like kid lit? Because that's what I think when I think folklore, I think it could be kid lit. So if it was, I would be cool with that.
Like if there were folk tales or kind of like fairy tales, or if they were about like around like folkloric creatures like mermaids, I would like that as well. But if it has folkloric themes and they're just set in worlds that are related to different folklores that may be more specific to a certain region or locale, then I could see those happening within adult fiction as well.
Okay, I got to because like folklore, when I think of that, I think of like the lessons that they impart. Is there a lesson that you've learned that could appear in folklore like that you could have gotten for folklore, but maybe you just like learned that.
That's a good question. Is there a lesson? Oh, I've learned so many is that I don't even know where to start. But the first one that I think of is learning to do things the easy way, And I feel like that is a consistent story over the course of my life where I consistently choose to do things the hard way. I'm going into the grocery store and not asking anybody where anything is.
I've learned a.
Lot of lessons about that over my life, but that doesn't mean that I still don't act in ways that
I know I should act in better. Because I was working with a lawyer earlier this year and he wasn't communicating with me the way I wanted him to communicate with me, so knowing that it would make my life harder to be like I don't want to work with him anymore because we just started, we had barely even started the process that we were going through, I was like, Nope, don't want to do it anymore, don't want to deal
with it. And I was like, I'm going to have to like continue the search or I'm going to have to do everything on my own. And afterwards I kind of felt like I had regrets for doing it that way. So I was like, I should have just dealt with it so I could take the easy route in this thing that I'm working on that's already very hard for me. Like the context of all I needed the lawyer was already something that was very difficult.
So not saying that what I did was wrong or it was right.
I'm just saying I think there are a lot of moments where I could have taken that advice in many ways, and other moments where I did take that lesson to heart, because there were also moments this year where I let people show up for me and support me in ways and like I was just cool with it, you know. So I took the easy route, and it's like I don't have to do everything myself. Other people care about me. They show that they care about me in different ways.
So I'm going to like allow myself to be open to that support. So I think I could really see going back to the folk tales. I could really see a story centered around folklore that would have some kind of lesson around not doing the hard thing, like the monkey climbing up the tree to get the bit this way instead of like shaking the tree for them to come down or whatever.
Yeah, I feel like that is reading as a kid. Yeah, Okay, is there any tales that stand out to you that you have already read or that you're looking forward to reading specific titles.
I have a book of folklore on my shelf right now that I've been wanting to read that I got when I was in South Africa. I can't remember the exact title of it. I'll see if I can find it to link it in the description.
Going back to your point of like doing things like the easy way and with the lawyer. One thing that I think about looking back on my life. I have so many regrets, Like I literally regret everything every day. But then I was thinking about one of my like a major regrets, and I was like, what if I did the thing that I said I should have done in this instance is like the school I should have
went to after high school. And I was thinking about it, and I'm just like the way that you live your life, Like sure there might be like infidite universes where I did go to that other stoo that I said I should have went to. I was like, hello, shit could
have went wrong then too. It's like when the choice you don't make looks so attractive because you just don't know what is on the other side of the choice, But you do know what happened when you went to the school or didn't drop the lawyer, or did drop the lawyer, or you know, broke up or stayed together, like you know what happened, So it's hard to make
the right decision. But then even like, no matter what decision you make, I do think it's just as right as anything else because like a bunch of other shits gonna happen behind every decision.
It's like always having a shiny object on the other side, gleaming and attracting you toward it.
It's just like mysterious. You're like, oh, like, well, if I want I went to the lad school, I would have been whatever the fuck. No, you wouldn't, girl, No you wouldn't. We'll be right back after this app break. One genre I hope to find something that I really like is like black written thrillers, because the black thrillers I've read, I've had super high hopes for them, but they weren't giving what they should have gave for me. And I do believe they're out there. I just haven't
encountered them yet. And it's funny too, because I feel like with black thrillers, like they feel like they have to like blacken it up, talk more about that, Like I feel like the writer has to be talking about hair, you know, there has to be some deeper complex meaning under yeah at all. Yeah, it has to be like racism or you know what I mean. So I haven't found a black thiller that I really like, but I feel like it's a genre that's, oh, y'all could be
eating down. So you said it isn't giving what it should give. What do you think it should give? It should get thrills, it should give pot twists, it should give Red Herring. Okay, m hm, it should give Oh. I could totally see this into being adapted into a movie and being a really great movie. It should give, you know, cultural references that aren't so overt. Another thing that I'm looking forward to, like really diving more deep into are like the foundational text of like black sociology.
So I told you I was reading Black Bourgeoisie, and I feel like there's a lot of text like that that I feel like I just like should have already read but just haven't. And there are referenced a lot in other books that I'm reading, So I'm like, oh, I should read what these other authors have read so I can like kind of get it, because I do
think like reading is you build upon the cannon. So I'm looking forward to reading those books that you know written in the twenties, the thirties, forties, fifties, sixties, and learn from that perspective because like, unfortunately a lot of these books are still very tiny. Yeah, save shit going on in the Year of Our Lord twenty twenty five.
Is it hard for you to have that understanding as you're reading these older books?
No, it isn't. Like you said, there's nothing new under the sun and the problems aren't new. And I do think that during those times we had more rigorous thinkers because one probably like there wasn't much else to do but read, where you don't go play a play, right, so there's less distraction. So like, these people are going to be reading and like thinking more deeply about things, and it shows that like a lot of the solutions that we have just ain't it, and they've been tried
and been disproven for a lot of things. So it doesn't make me feel bad. It makes me feel like in community with our fore mothers and fathers who've passed on but like kind of left these directions. So looking forward to that as well. Is there hoping it for you though? In reading those books? I think so, I mean I'm no like policy person. I'm you know, a nigga with a mic. So I'm gonna play my role.
I'm would tell people about the books, you know, like I think there is hope and just understanding, right, Like even if I'm reading these books and I understand that shit's fucked up, and I kind of intrinsically know that, but maybe I don't know all the nuances and how it is. And like sometimes I feel like, you know, it'd be the like Mama, I don't want to be woke no more, Like I'd rather not know about all
this stuff. But like being ignorant does look fun. There's just what wheels like, so like y'all are so dumb and looks so happy. It's like they do. But that's that's just not what I want from me, Like I want to know us up because like I feel like the people who do know us up but want to manipulate others for their own personal game, They're going to use the fact that you are choosing to be ignorant, like you're choosing just to like be blissful in your ignorance to advance themselves.
Are you saying that people who have more access to information are going to exploit people who don't.
Is that what you mean? So, for example, like you know how jay Z beyond his black capitalism gentrify your own hood. That Nigga knows that's fucking stupid. I believe he knows that stupid, And I think people go with it because like it sounds kind of good, like, oh yeah,
like we should own businesses, I guess. But then if you just like read like one book, you'd kind of realize that jay Z is in the business of advancing jay Z, Like the representation you get from a black billionaire really ain't doing nothing for you at the end of the day. But because you feel this kinship of seeing a black billionaire as opposed to a white one, you let a lot of shit slide that shouldn't slide.
I feel like thrillers versus reading some of the foundational texts of black sociology books are two very different pathways. Do you think they'll balance each other out in a way?
Yeah? I feel like that those are just for the fun of it all. You can read those so quickly by one day, two days, you know, get it in and out. I do think that the foundational text wills out sit with them more like I'm taking notes, you know, I'm trying to make connections. I'm like that meme of the guy with these papers like disconnectxist, you know. So, yeah, they're definitely different. But you know, I can say multitudes.
I'm a multitude. No group talk about it. So what are you looking to create in the new year?
So I mentioned in a past episode that I've been reading about black nature writers, and I think that in the new Year, I like to write for myself.
I would like to write more climate fiction. What is that or eco fiction or whatever you want to call it.
That is talks about how the people have been affected by climate and climate change, how people are affecting the environment, and all of the consequences of those changes, and how people respond to them, how the world changes. These things have been touched on by a lot of people in sci fi realms. So even if it's not specific to this world, it might be set in the future, or it might be set on a world that is not this current world.
So that shows up in a lot of ways.
And I'm not really a sci fi writer, but I think taking inspiration from climate fiction, even if it might not be genre, under that based on the powers that be that create these genres to sell books, but in general, climate fiction are more so being in the nature writing realm is something that I want to move into more.
I think typically I have a tendency sometimes toward more like historical fiction, okay, and I'm just now writing more fiction in general, so I think it'll be nice to merge those loves of mine.
So when I hear climate fiction is given dystopian, is that what you're thinking of?
I don't think I tend to go that catastrophic. Okay, So I don't know if I would say dystopian for what I would like to work on, but it could go in that direction. It could be like this is what this is what the world is like because we're all burning it down right now and we're not changing our behaviors in any large skill ways.
That's the only way I could see it going. You talking about the climate hit, what else could you say?
Yeah, I guess I'm thinking more smaller skill. And I'm also not a climate scientist, so like I couldn't even see myself like taking on something so as as like what would it look like if we went back to not using planes ever?
Again?
Like I think that's a little bit beyond my reach. Yeah, and it's more like the destruction of a forest in the specific.
Locale it's giving stop cop city. Hey, it definitely is what happens when you cut down a forest and let cops run the town. What happens? Some bullshit? And when you say you write, are starting to write more fiction? Like, what's the length of this fiction? Is it flash fiction? Like short story and novella novel?
I really love writing flash fiction, but I think in this case, I'm thinking more around like five thousand to ten thousand words for these stories. Okay, I think it would be more like a long short story on a ten thousand words.
In Okay, cool, more after the break. So, you know, I've been traveling all over the country talking to so many people about black bookstores and like getting this like oral history written down, and so the way my book is organized, it's like profiles of these different black bookstores from eighteen thirty four to present, which has been really fun to write for me because trying to make it not repetitive, right, because like everyone does have a really
unique story and kind of pulling that out because what I found is when I talk to different bookstore owners, especially the ones who are always talking to press. They have their stump speech, right, they have their I got it out the mud. I didn't know this was going to happen. I love the community, and I'm like, yeah, yeah, yeah, but what about you know what I mean, like trying to like pull something else out. So that's been really interesting to do. And it's been like, first time I
talk to you, this all you're gonna say. So I'm gonna call you up again, like, oh hey girl, what two up too? Oh yeah? I was just you know, and like trying to get them talk again. Then I'm gonna go out to your store. I'm a flat a la like, oh hey, what's up? Like show me around? And so I've liked this work, but it's also very intensive. I feel the pressure of having to get like it all right, you know, because these are people's stories. Like
I don't want to like misrepresent anyone. I don't want anyone to say like, oh I didn't say that, or you know, I ain't mean that. And also too, I don't consider myself a journalist, but what I have been doing is like reporting. But you know, there's like journalistic ethics, right, and so I'm also just a really nice girl. And so the girls be telling me all their business and I'm like, are you telling me just to put the book or are we just chatting right now?
Yeah.
So being in my nonfiction bag reporting but trying to make it interesting has been like a challenge that I found really fun. But going into the new year, I want to start writing fiction as well, which I've never really done, and I'm really apprehensive about it.
Although we do talk about from time to time when you tell me your stories, I'm like, oh.
God, that'd be a good short story. You gotta make it into one. That's what people always say. I don't know if y'all guessing me, but so crazy stuff to be happened to me, Like this sounds fake. They'll be like, this bitch has a lie, probably like I swear it happened.
So I do want to like start getting into like short stories, and I really like short story collections that feel like they're like cohesive, like definitely not like chapters of a novel, but like the characters are like orbiting each other and like it makes sense in a way
like that you want them to be in a shared universe. Yeah, Like I have an idea of writing just like which sounds a really depressing, a short story collection all about my grandpa's funeral, just from like different people's perspectives, but not in a sad way, like in a fun funeral way. I would love to see it.
I've been in some funerals and never been to a fun one. You never even know a fun I've never been to a fun funeral, have you.
I wouldn't say my grandpa's funeral was fun, but it was kind of fun listening to those stories about him because he's like such an old man and you know, like all black men are not going to be talking like that. Yeah, So like hearing his like cousin tell stories about him, like you know when he was a kid, Like who thinks about like what you were a kid?
How did that happen? So that was fun. So kind of like delving into that is something I've been like saying I'm going to do, but I've been like working on this book and it's like, Okay, well, like I'm on deadline for something else, Like I can't be like talking about my grandpa be and dad again, but I can see myself like working on that. But I'm apprehensive about it because I've never done any fiction. So it's like the world building that's like how do you build
a world? And it's not like even like how you're saying, like fantasy or folklore where it's more imaginative. But I still really it does not compute for me, like how people do.
Do you think once you start building your characters more that the world will show up around them?
Well, I say, the characters are like me and my family, but you still have to build them on the page though. Yeah, knowing them and the world isn't the same as them being on the page. See, I didn't know that. Have you interviewed your characters?
Have you tried doing that acting as your character and thinking of what they would say in an interview? Or I can do it with you acting as me. No, So whoever's your characters? So let's say one of your characters is your aunt? Okay, in this interview, you pretend to be your aunt and answer questions how she would
answer questions. Okay, And so you would have to be the interview in the interviewee, if you were doing it on your own, but if you had a partner to do it with you, I could ask you questions, and I could be like, did how you feel at the beginning of the funeral was it different than how you felt at the end of the funeral? And then you would answer how your aunt would answer for that story in your short story collection.
Yeah, I haven't done any of that.
You can do it however you want to. I'm not the one who creates ther balands. There are so many different rules for how different people write. You know, everybody will be like I'm an outliner, and I'm not an outliner. I do all this before I just go into it. I always have the MD planned out. Some people are like, I never have the M planted out. I'll let what happens happens.
That's crazy. Yeah. So we're consuming a lot of like TikTok and YouTube about like how to write fiction, and it is just like everyone has like an opinion and they all contradict each other. Yeah, so I think I'll just have to like start My thing is I'm too I feel like I'm too brief. I feel like when I speak, I'm pretty brief, and when i'm right, I'm really brief. Because I don't want to like take people's time for granted. So I'll be writing a short story and it'll be like five hundred.
Words, like Girl, that's still a short story.
I like the five hundred word range a lot. Actually, for sure. I like class fiction, but I wanted to be short story that flash. Yeah, I gotcha. I wrote one and I showed it to somebody there. Okay, So I had the idea of my grandpa's funeral short stories, and then I also want to do short story on scammers. I remember you telling me about this one, so the gamer one. I had tried to write it Girl. The first time I showed it too, was trying to be nice,
but I could tell it was really bad. It was just like like I knew what I wanted to say, and I just like rushed getting there.
That's just called more drafts. Don't be hard on yourself. That's definitely not a thing to do in this craft that you're working in. You already got to put a lot of I know, well, I'm sure you'll find join the process, and I hope that I do too. I like this, like that we're trying to go in different directions in the new year than what we're used to, like opening ourselves up, building on things that we've already been building on like with you and the sociology books
and going deeper into that. I think that it's important to be in the present and not to be too focused on, you know, everything being perfect in the new year. Is still really nice to have something to work toward and know that, like in any moment, if something calls to us more, then we can go that direction.
Oh for sure, for sure A little loose outline, if you will, h So you're outliner, loosely loosely? Are we ready for real credits? Yes?
Today, I want to give credit to early mornings when the air is still, the skies are dark, when the birds aren't churfing yet, and everything's quiet, that kind of sacred time where it's nice to just not try not something that it always happens for me, but try to not be bogged down about the day, about everything that I have to do. When I can take a moment to ease into the day and to settle into the day, I want to give credit to that precious part of the day.
Varies any of you. I'd like to give credit to inter generational friendships. It's funny because I always complain about not having any friends and I feel like I've made a lot of friends this year, but they're all like in their seventies, eighties, and nineties, people that used to own black bookstores that I've gotten to know over the last two years. So if you're listening, a high Miss Daphne Muse, Glenda Lynn Johnson, who makes sure I do not call her miss. She does not like that she's
a New yorka and does not play with me. These people aren't people I would typically like run into, you know, And I think it's there's so much to learn from intergenerational friendships. I think they learn something from me, and I definitely learn a lot from them and like being in their presence and company. They just lived a lot of life and it's fun that they share some of their stories with me. I love the I second that too.
I know I can't choose two world credits, but I'm just gonna say that's been in my life this week as well.
So I like that you brought that up. Oh cool, And that's all we have for this week. By all.
Peace on Theme is a production of iHeartRadio and Fairweather Friends Media. This episode was written by Eves, Jeffco and Katie Mitchell. It was edited and produced by Tari Harrison. Follow us on Instagram at on Themeshow. You can also send us an email at hello at on Theme dot Show. Head to on Theme dot Show to check out the show notes for episodes. For more podcasts from iHeartRadio, visit the iHeartRadio app, Apple podcast, or wherever you listen to your favorite shows