2024 TMSA Recap and a Look at 2025 with the HQ Team - podcast episode cover

2024 TMSA Recap and a Look at 2025 with the HQ Team

Dec 18, 202434 min
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Episode description

Join TMSA HQ team, Jennifer Karpus-Romain and Tiffany Yates as they wrap up a year filled with innovation, reflection, and celebration. We talk about TMSA's centennial anniversary, our highlights from the past year, and what we're looking forward to for 2025. Join us as we celebrate our achievements and look forward to the exciting possibilities in the coming year!

Check out these links referenced in the podcast!

Check out the Transportation Sales and Marketing Association (TMSA) website or engage with us on LinkedIn.

Transcript

TMSA 2024 Highlights and Memories

Jennifer Karpus-Romain

Hello everyone , welcome to the last On the Move of the year . This is a show where we share transportation , sales and marketing success stories and I'm really excited for this episode because we're sharing all of TMSA's success and maybe some things we're learning from here in 2024 and heading into 2025 .

I am Jennifer Karpus-Romain , the Executive Director here at TMSA , which is a trade nonprofit educating and connecting marketing and sales professionals in transportation and logistics , and I'm very excited to have on the show with me Tiffany Yates , who is the Executive Assistant and Administrator here at TMSA .

So while you guys all see my face weekly and out there on stage and doing all these crazy things , she is the woman behind the scenes making sure that I stay on task and show up to my meetings on time and that all things are running smoothly , and we appreciate her so much and we're so excited that we were able to get her to come on camera .

And so welcome to the show , tiffany . How are you today ?

Tiffany Yates

I'm good , it's fun to be on this side of things and I'm normally working the back end of things .

Jennifer Karpus-Romain

Absolutely, along with doing all the things I just listed . She is also the producer of On the Move , which has been really exciting for us .

We launched this program back in April and neither one of us I had appeared on podcasts before , but never did a podcast , and so when we talk about our favorite things about this year , the podcast in itself is one of our favorites . It was a labor of love for us . We really fought to get it .

We love being able to provide the information , the content , be able to highlight our members and all these things going on at TMSA , and it was really on an interesting learning curve for me to be able to do it weekly and execute it in a way that we were able to present the information that was really helpful but also be able to build it back and stuff .

What's your experience been like ?

Tiffany Yates

on the podcast . I mean , I agree it's been a fun learning experience . I've never done anything like this before and I feel like I just like drag in information . I'm just like a sponge . So I enjoy new experiences and this has definitely been new , a learning curve for sure , but it's been fun .

Jennifer Karpus-Romain

Yeah , I agree , and one thing I think that people may process , but maybe they don't know is that we really believe , for this show specifically , that we do want to highlight things and people that are going on inside of TMSA .

So everyone that appears on our show is either a TMSA member or a TMSA speaker , a sponsor , something , someone involved , a partner , something with that , and so if you are a TMSA member or somehow associated with us and you're interested in coming on the show in 2025 , then please do .

Here's a QR code where you can click to submit to be a guest , and we have our January lineup going on now , but we are scheduling out past that . So if you are wanting to be on the show , we would love to have you and to hear your stories and what you have going on in the new year . Hear your stories and what you have going on in the new year .

So the one of the biggest things at TMSA this year was that we did celebrate our 100 year anniversary and , as a two person team , that was a lot to execute on and we were so thankful for all of our volunteers and everyone that got involved with the 100 year celebration . We had a special task force that helped us coordinate things .

We were able to do so much at conference and one of my favorite things that we did was have people really tell their stories and say what about TMSA they really loved and why this association really resonates with them . So we are going to show you all a little bit of that . 100 years of fun . Ready , three , two , one .

Video

I joined TMSA for the community and that , working with people in the industry , it's just been really rewarding . To get insights from my peers and executive teams .

It's the sharing of information , without regard to the competition piece , that I like , because we are many of us are competitors , but we're all better if we can learn from each other and share information , best practices and latest technology . It's such a great group to keep that fire in you and really drive .

Jennifer Karpus-Romain

If you're interested in watching the rest of our 100 year video , you can do so . We'll put it in the show notes and you can also scan it here . We do also have a page on our website that talks all about all the like . It has a TMSA timeline . You can see the 100 years .

Tiffany Yates

The timeline is actually really cool .

Jennifer Karpus-Romain

Yeah, I love it .

Tiffany Yates

It's got a list of events and I thought it was really interesting .

Jennifer Karpus-Romain

Noelle Taylor of Taylor Logistics actually helped build that and so I love how the members really did come in , get engaged , get involved , have their own piece of it . So there's all kinds of stuff , that timeline where you can see , like Tiffany said , all the different pieces of our history .

We do have a separate testimonial video of people just sharing their testimonials . You can catch that there and on our YouTube page we have a virtual donor wall where everyone has their own brick and it shows how long they've been a part of TMSA and it shows how long they've been a part of TMSA .

It was just a big collaboration this year and really being able to celebrate how much this organization has given back to the community and people have given back to us , which has been really fun .

Tiffany Yates

And in that video one of our members wrote a special song just for TMSA . It's worth a listen .

Jennifer Karpus-Romain

Absolutely . I listened to that before we even made the video . I think I listened to it repeatedly as I got prepped for Elevate . This year . For me , when we were celebrating 100 years , I also wanted to think about how to celebrate the long-term members who've invested in the association .

So one of my top memories of this year was being able to give out our two Lifetime Achievement Awards this year to David Hoppins and Candy Sybator . That was really special . Here's a clip of a clip of that's Candy getting her award .

She neither Candy nor David knew that they were getting the award , which to me is one of the best kept secrets for the whole year . Both of them are highly involved in like every single email chain that we have about like all the important stuff going on .

So the fact that we were able to execute on that without either one of them knowing ahead of time was one of the most special parts about it and I loved that . And we did something new this year at Elevate too , where we did these 15 minute sessions on stage , which was something I was really excited about .

It kind of breaks up the longer form content a little bit differently , gives shorter stories , and both of them are featured differently . So Candy is best friends with Jodi Cape , who's another one of our longtime board members she's our secretary of the board and watching their professional and personal growth and journey together was really awesome to see .

I know I've made very good friends at TMSA that I talk to every day now and it really is this community . So really seeing how those friendships come together but then also hearing how they were able to grow professionally through that was really cool .

And then we had David on stage before award night as well , telling his journey and why he continues to give back to the organization , at what it means to be like a professional mentor and to keep you know your your brain sharp , even when you're at like the um , the higher end of your career , and what that looks like and helping the next generation and

learning the new things that are still coming . So that was really really cool to have both of them take the stage , still not know that they are getting their lifetime achievement awards and like a mwahaha moment , like I'm gonna get them up on stage and they won't even know they're being showcased . Yes , it was phenomenal .

I also in that moment brought back the previous management firm of TMSA . Brian Everett came on stage with me to present those awards because I really felt like if we're talking about their lifetime , of their support of TMSA I worked with them when I was a volunteer at TMSA but you know , in the leadership role I've only been here a couple of years .

So it was really cool to be able to kind of tell their whole story . And we gave Candy her award first and I remember David locking eyes with me . He knew he was in that moment when I said there were two and he was like I understand now why I had to go speak on stage today . I'm now putting all of this together and I know what's about to happen .

Tiffany Yates

I love that click moment .

Jennifer Karpus-Romain

Yes , that was one of my favorite moments at Elevate , because it was so funny , because he was like oh , oh , I did this now . It was really cool . What were some of your favorite memories from Elevate ?

Tiffany Yates

I would say , just like Elevate in general was nice for me this year . So whenever I originally started at TMSA , it was in April of 2023 . And then we had the Elevate conference in June of 2023 . So I had two months to get up to speed and get ready for the conference and it was really overwhelming .

I had never been to a conference ever , and so to be going to my first conference and then also working the conference as a very new employee was a lot . Luckily , everybody's so nice , especially like the board were coming up to me and facing themselves and chatting and like making me feel more comfortable . And then the whole membership is so nice .

So it was pretty easy . But this year I was more confident because I knew my job better , I knew what to expect , I knew the process , I knew more people , I got to know you know some of the members and the board and everybody better , and so it just it felt better , it was less anxiety inducing for me .

And then I also love that we got to go to New Orleans . I'd never been to New Orleans and I love that we get to pop around to different cities . Like we went to Savannah last year , we're going to Austin next year . So we go to these like hot spots , most of which I've never been to , so I thought that was nice .

Elevate 2024 Reflections and Innovations

Jennifer Karpus-Romain

I love hearing your journey and just watching your journey at TMSA . I mean , yes , to say it was trial by fire when you came in is very true In context .

You came in April 2023 , like literally the week I was going to the TIA conference and I literally gave him an assignment like we need to build a sponsorship chart , and you had no context , but you were able to execute on it and I just remember being like , okay , we're gonna be okay .

Like if she understood the very minimal information I gave her to put together this cause we were building , making sure we were like giving all of our deliverables to sponsors and things like that , and I had started it , but like we needed to start actually sending things out .

And so I just remember that and so it was a really good feeling heading into Elevate this year , being like , okay , we're making progress , we have better processes , like we know what's working , what's not .

And that to me like looking at like I hit my three year mark at TMSA last month and I'm like , okay , like you've been here now for 18 months , I've been here for three years .

We're in a place where we do understand more of our processes , what's working , what's not working , how to deliver things faster and better to our members , and that's something I'm really looking forward to for 2025 is being able to put some of that in process . There's been a lot of backend work in 2024 .

And I'm excited to see a lot of that stuff come out more on the front end in 2025 .

Tiffany Yates

Yeah , agreed , definitely more like settled in .

Jennifer Karpus-Romain

Yes , when we think back to Elevate this year , we did . We did try some new things , and that's something that we're always trying to do is finding new ways to engage , new ways to those 15 minute sessions , and that was , you know , something we put on the survey Did you like this , did you not like this ? And people did so

Tiffany Yates

We read every single one and we try to make improvements every single year ,

Jennifer Karpus-Romain

Absolutely

Tiffany Yates

.

Jennifer Karpus-Romain

We do , I , we , I start this year . I started that we shouldn't read them until at least a week after show Um , because we do put our blood , sweat and tears into conference and so . But we want people to critique us . It's just so hard to read it when you're coming right off of it . But we do .

We want to improve , we want to be better and we do take the pieces of feedback and put it in , and so people really liked the 15 minute sessions . They will be back in 2025 .

2025 , there won't be as many , because part of why we had so many in 2024 was to tell those TMSA stories but then also give different like we had , like someone talk about sustainability and have some other like quick hit information , and so we won't be doing the TMSA stories in the same way , because we're going into year 101 .

We're turning a new chapter and starting fresh . But on a personal level , one of my favorite things from Elevate was my own personal flair on the well , there's two things . So the first was in my free time . I really like to make art out of upcycled products .

So I actually don't know if this may be a fun fact for attendees , because I didn't tell many people , but all of the centerpieces that you saw at Elevate I actually made , and so here they are . You couldn't actually see them super well , um , but we will link a thing to actually hold on . I have it I have it right here .

Tiffany Yates

I think it's cool that we had this like personal touch yes , so we had .

Jennifer Karpus-Romain

It says tmsa 100 . I did keep one of them with me , and the other thing that I really liked was I took probably the scariest thing I could possibly do and I decided to you know , sing , and ironically , this is what sits on top of that in my house . On top of my TMSA 100 is my hat , and so I really wanted to tell a story .

Our keynote was the power of storytelling , and I wanted to be able to tell our story in our own way and do it in a unique way talk about the history of TMSA without just belaboring it .

The entire conference , and so I did encourage our a couple of our board members to come on and do pretend like they were the guys from 1924 , and they didn't even ask a lot of questions on it . Let's go for it , yeah . And they gave me the script and they're like can we wear matching outfits ? And like , of course , um .

And then I really , because I I just wanted to tell the story and do something different and also thinking about how we had the savannah bananas open in 2023 , and I was like I feel like that was a mistake , because what then are we going to do in year 100? .

But I just one day , because I've had a few people ask me like what on earth possessed you to want to perform ? It wasn't that I wanted to perform , I just thought about the unique way of telling a story . And is there a way to do that ? I don't sing . I sing karaoke . I've never in my life sang in front of business professionals or business colleagues .

I did do a play once as an adult but , like very early on , I was like a background character . But this was how I chose to open the Elevate show . We have a clip for you how I chose to open the Elevate show .

Video

If you want to view , paradise . Simply look around and view it . Some ideas hold on to it All . We really need nothing else to it . Thank you , Thank you so much .

Jennifer Karpus-Romain

Well , I was like , how do you end that Like ? So it was a spectacle . Very few people . I did get approval from the executive board to do it and , of course , people who participated . Some of the board members knew , and we had beach balls with the 100-year logo on it going off .

We had the part of what you guys just saw was the video slideshow that we had that had photos throughout the years , and to me it was a wonderful way to open the show and then to lead right into our keynote of the power of storytelling , and so that was one of the most unique experiences of my life .

Elevate 2025 Keynote Announcement

I get asked a lot how I will open your 101 , and I can tell you it is not that .

Tiffany Yates

You're like one and done .

Video

One and done for sure .

Tiffany Yates

No , I thought it was so much fun . I feel like as adults , we don't get unexpected things happening very often and I feel like whenever you go to a professional conference , like you just don't expect to have a Willy Wonka song and the executive director like coming out and singing .

So I just thought it was so much fun and just a moment to be like whoa , okay , this is fun , this is difference . And then I'm in the back , there's just beach balls flying everywhere , people are laughing and having a good time .

So I thought it was a really fun way and really unexpected way to open it up well , I appreciate that it was definitely something I've never seen or done and I it was .

Jennifer Karpus-Romain

Yeah , I thought it was a great idea up until about a week before you're like I'm rethinking my choices now and then I just like that morning was really tough .

um , because there's just I mean , in truth it there's a lot of pressure when you put on a conference , let alone a hundred years , and then to then add the singing element and just that , that opening .

I'm so happy with the response and that people really did love it and they , they got the heart of what it was about and they weren't like what , what just happened ? And where am I ?

Because you know if , if that would have went a different way or if I like just really fumbled it it , if that would have went a different way or if I like just really fumbled it it . You know it's the start of the show and so there's a lot of pressure , but it , it was everything I wanted it to be .

I don't want to ever do it again and but , as many people know , I will sing karaoke because that happened at the end of that day . So for many people . Jen opened and closed the day with singing , but yeah , that was very different .

So , yeah , for me , thinking back on this year , that was a really big like stepping out of your comfort zone moment and that was like uniquely special . But was what I wanted it to be . Figuring out a way to tell TMSA's story in a unique way , open the show with something that you wouldn't be expecting all of those things .

Tiffany Yates

Yeah , I think you nailed it .

Jennifer Karpus-Romain

Thank you . And then the other thing I just wanted to talk about for Elevate and something that's coming back for next year . So one thing that we launched this year at Elevate was our wellness room , which we got great feedback on .

Some people were like I don't understand the need for this , and I actually like that comment too , because that means this is really important for the people who need it and it's not important for the people who don't which is part of being inclusive but the people who need it and it's not important for the people who don't , which is part of being inclusive .

But the wellness room . It was the first year we ever did it . We are thinking of ways to improve it for next year . It will be coming back , but it is just a space in the chaos , like , yes , the chaos of conference . We were in New Orleans .

There are so many things going on all of the time and I'm just having a space to be able to just decompress for a minute . We had like coloring pages in there and we had stress balls and fidget spinners . My son goes to bed with that fidget spinner , but just a way to kind of unwind for a moment I really like to create .

I know that if I'm at a conference , the second that I go to my room , my shoes come off and I'm working like I'm typing , and so I want to , as event planners we said , think about how can we continue to create spaces where people that aren't going back to their room . So , can we create a space where people can just have that moment by themselves ?

Decompress ? Can we create a space , maybe , where they can have that moment by themselves ? Decompress ?

Can we create a space , maybe where they can answer some emails in peace , like in the past I've had that like in the back of a snack room and put like do not disturb signs for like two of the tables , you know just kind of things like that , and so that was something that was really , um , special and cool for me , especially because we did get such

positive feedback of like this was wonderful , I just needed . And cool for me , especially because we did get such positive feedback of like this was wonderful , I just needed one moment .

Tiffany Yates

Yeah , no , I get that . I used the wellness room a few times because I have social anxiety and so being around so many people and talking and smiling , for you know , full days on end , I'm just like , okay , I just I need a moment , I need five minutes to just go be with myself , just calm down . Room gave me that . So I think that was really nice .

And then what I found funny is I was walking to the wellness room to use it and you were already there coloring and like look up , I look at you , we make eye contact . We were both like , okay , yeah , we both need this right now .

Jennifer Karpus-Romain

Yeah , in silence , I was like I want to sit here .

Tiffany Yates

You sit over there , like we're just going to be in the same space , but separately .

Jennifer Karpus-Romain

It was . Yeah , that was one of my favorite moments of conference . Was you barreling in there when I was already in there and we just sat very at two different tables and colored together and it was lovely and I just that was something that was really special to me .

And to keep , you know , thinking through like that , I definitely feel like this year we spent a lot of time in the small details and that was really rewarding . When we got the survey back and just like , from what people talked about , is it like they really cared ? They saw and cared ?

Yeah , because I remember , like beforehand we were like , why , like we're doing so much , like , is this , is this even going to go noticed ? Are these things important ?

And so getting that feedback , knowing that it was , and then how can we , you know , maneuver that and take the best of those things and , you know , maybe get rid of some things or change some things for next year , but that was really cool .

Tiffany Yates

I agree .

Jennifer Karpus-Romain

It's definitely nice to know that all of the work and effort and thought that we put into these conferences is seen , is recognized , is appreciated Absolutely . And speaking of Elevate , so you mentioned we are going to Austin Texas next year , so that'll be June 8th through 10th 2025 in Austin Texas . We are very excited .

We do have our early bird pricing going on right now . You can find out more information about that at eventstmsatodayorg . What I'm really excited to share with you all is that we have locked in our keynote and she is awesome .

Her name is Kate DeLeo and she is talking about how to not just storytell but how to story sell having real conversations that convert from sales and marketing from a sales marketing perspective . And I loved this concept when we came across here , because last year we talked about the power of storytelling and how important that is .

But if you're not telling the right stories to the right people at the right time , then what does it mean ? So it's almost like we're elevating what we learned from last year and taking it to the next level .

So we're really , really excited to have her come keynote and we're even more excited in a way that we are also adding an opportunity for both attendees of the conference and , if they can't make it other people to come and do a virtual workshop with Kate a month after conference .

So take everything that you learned from Kate in that keynote , all of our other speakers , everything else that you have at Elevate , and sit in it for a month and really really think about how to be accountable and put that into practice , because that's something that we really care about at TMSA .

We don't want you to come to our conference , get inspired to do all these things and then get back to the office and check your email and forget all of it until next year . We want to encourage you to really do that . So she's doing this workshop for them people to really kind of build their brand trifecta and put it into place for them .

So that's an opportunity . As an additional add on to Elevate is to walk in that workshop . So you can pay for that workshop individually or you can add it to your Elevate conference registration .

You can register for Elevate at eventstmsatodayorg and if you are interested in learning more about Kate or hearing from her , she's actually our on-the-move opener in January . So this is our last show of the year .

We're taking a break over the holidays and we will be coming back with Kate Wednesday , january 15th , so definitely check her out here , what she's all about , and really excited to have her as the keynote .

Tiffany Yates

She seems great yeah .

Jennifer Karpus-Romain

OK , what are some other things that we're looking forward to in 2025 ? Do you have anything or do you want me to jump in ?

Tiffany Yates

I will say one of the things I'm excited about is the new conference app . So we've been using the same conference app for the past two years and it's been great . I love having a conference app .

You know , I'm the one in the back end , like pushing out the notifications and putting in the agenda , and I think it's cool to have a place for everybody to come together and have all of the conference information in one place .

New Conference App Features and Updates

But we're moving to a new conference app which is going to have a much requested by you new feature so you can schedule meetings directly through the app , which I think is really cool .

Jennifer Karpus-Romain

Mm , hmm , new feature so you can schedule meetings directly through the app , which I think is really cool . Yes , something that we get a lot both from attendees and sponsors and everyone that comes to our conferences is that they wish they had a way to easily schedule meetings with each other while they're at show .

So this new conference app will give that ability . We will open the app a month or so before we get going , so some beginning of May ish and you'll be able to get those calls set up , get those schedules set up .

And my favorite part about the feature is everybody can request the feature or request the meeting , but you can also then accept or decline , so it gives power to both sides of the conversation , and so then you know , okay , like both sides of these people really want to have this conversation .

So that is something that we have wanted to have in our conference app for a couple years , and we kind of found the way to do that . So , so excited about that we do . We are still looking for a sponsor of the conference app too . So if somebody is interested in getting in that or any type of sponsorship or engagement , reach out to me .

For sure , jennifer at tmsatodayorg , but we have all kinds of exciting things coming up for Elevate . Like I said , we locked in that keynote . We have the economy panel coming back . Our call for speakers is open now through December 31st .

So if you're listening to this before December 31st and you're interested in sharing your thought leadership or have a talk topic that you think would be great for elevate or executive summit or any of our webinars , you can reach out to the right place . You can check out this QR code for our call for speakers .

We are always looking for new and innovative speakers , new topics . We want to present the absolute best education that we can every year , but going into 2025 as well . Speaking of Executive Summit , we will be coming back with that next year in October in Chicago . Contract is in the works right now , so stay tuned .

We should have that locked and loaded for in the next couple of weeks for you guys to check that out and to get that up on your 2025 conference schedule . And yeah , so , coming back with both of those events , I'm like going through my list of all the things we need to talk about , because we have so many things happening at TMSA .

You know we're taking a little break over the holiday season the back half of December , but we come back strong in January for sure . One of the biggest things happening at the beginning of January is the launch of three of our award program categories for submissions . So we have our purpose awards , so our community basedbased and sustainability-based program .

So if you are interested in your company , does something really , really awesome to give back to your community or you have some type of sustainability program , we want to hear it and see it . That award program is a virtual award ceremony at the end of April , so we'll be giving out those awards in April .

It opens January 6th and then the other two categories that we have opening on January 6th are Trailblazers Awards and our Rising Stars . Both of those awards get presented at the Elevate Conference , so Austin next year . The Rising Star category is to recognize your younger rock stars who've been in the industry for five years or less . What are they doing ?

Why are they awesome ? We want to hear all about it . We love recognizing the younger generation this category is one that we keep seeing growth year to year of submissions . There's a lot of new people coming in and we love to recognize them . Trailblazers is going to be the best of sales , of marketing campaigns and initiatives .

So if you have a really really cool program , something really awesome that you did this year , you know , put it up for an award . See how great it is . We want to see it . If you want to know more about , like , the best ways to submit advice , we did last episode actually talked to Courtney Keenan , who is our TMSA recognition chair .

So check out that last episode of On the Move and she gives all kinds of best practices and we talked a lot about what we've learned over the past three years with award submissions and things like that . So check that out for more information . And all of those three categories go live January 6th .

If you're interested in our Mountain Mover category , those won't open until April and they get handed out at Executive Summit . Submissions are free for members . There is a charge for non-members but one of your member perks is to check that out and get those in . So mark your calendars January 6th for the start of our award program .

say , overall , my favorite thing about TMSA in 2024 was bringing you full time . I think that you are a tremendous help and support at what we do at TMSA .

There are so many back end processes and improvements that we've made to be able to best support our members and our conference attendees , and while people get to watch my face talk about how much I love TMSA at nauseam , they don't get to hear from you all the time .

So I'm very thankful that you came on the show today , but also for all of the work that you do for all of us here at TMSA . So thank you , thank you in here at TMC . So , thank you , thank you . The only thing left to say is because I realized I forgot one thing is we will be back with our webinars in January to .

Our first webinar is fueling growth data backed trends , transforming transportation and logistics in 2025 . And that will be January 21st at 1 pm Eastern , 12 pm Central time . If you're like , wow , jen , you've shouted so many different , all kinds of exciting things at me , keep it together . You can always just scan this QR code and go to the upcoming TMSA events .

That has everything listed . But with that we're in , close the show and , yeah , thank you everybody who has gone on this on the move journey with us .

Transportation, Marketing, Sales Show Recap

Like we said at the beginning of the show , this was a brand new , exciting thing for us . We got to launch this back in April and we've enjoyed bringing you news , information , content , success stories in transportation , marketing and sales for the past eight months or so , and excited to continue to do that in the new year .

If you do watch this on LinkedIn , youtube or Facebook and are not listening to it , you will see an exciting new intro and outro of the show when we come back in January , and that is my teaser for you . Any final words , tiffany , or are you like ? Yes , let's be done with the show .

Tiffany Yates

This has been fun , a lot better than I thought . Okay , you're cool , you're okay .

Jennifer Karpus-Romain

Yes , you are cool and you are okay and , yeah , I'm so thankful for you coming on the show . Thank you for everyone that watched us today and all year long , and we will be back with you in the new year . So I hope everybody has a wonderful holiday season and New Year's and we'll catch up with you in 2025 . Happy holidays .

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