¶ Show intro
Welcome to the Obrother podcast with hosts Dan and Mike Smith , brothers from the same mother with different opinions on movies , tv , video games and more plus celebrity interviews . Get ready , it's set . It's time for the Obrother podcast . Welcome to the Obrother podcast . Me host , dan Smith , long time is always my brother from the same mother .
Mike Smith , strike strike strike , strike , strike .
What is that Obrother ?
sweatshop .
I love that .
I absolutely love that it might be the best bit you've ever come up with . I gotta say , folks , I didn't know he was gonna pull this out . I asked him to pull this out . I didn't know he was gonna pull this out . I absolutely love it . I'm dying inside because that is just too funny . It is , uh , july 27 .
You know there's nobody to do my makeup .
Yeah , july 27 , 2023 , when you get in this . Well , when we're recording this episode of the Obrother podcast , right , mike , we are going to be talking about uh , if it wasn't evident by your prop there , we're going to be talking about the uh , you know , because everybody else has been talking about this . We're like we ought to be talking about this .
We'd certainly been talking about this offline , correct , and I think when , uh , one of our other favorite topics began to intersect with this topic , I said we got to talk about this . So , yeah , you know , one of the one of the things we like to talk about most on the podcast is , of course , disney .
Really , so , yeah , so uh , believe it or not , folks , the uh , the uh , writers and the actors strike does have , uh , something in common with that other topic of disney . So , Mike , you want to set this up .
What we're gonna , you know , talk about or
¶ Two Strikes
yeah , basically , the writer's guild went on strike . What over a month ago , may 2nd 2023 ? And now the actors , as of last week , went on strike . Well so that means July 14th . Was it july 14th ?
Yeah , it's about two weeks , a couple weeks , yeah , and so basically all production Film tv is virtually shut down right now because you know nobody's crossing the lines . Probably people have seen on the news mark ruffalo and bob odin kirk walking the lines like they're little people like us , brian cranstin and so brian cranstin , fran direction .
I can already see you're taking a very sort of pessimistic .
No , not really I did view , because you're you're , you're throwing out some Comments that you're probably gonna get you some comments after we uh maybe , but if people hang in with me , I'm really neutral on this because it affects all of us and and people might be watching this , but I don't think .
Yeah , I don't think it's gonna affect you at home . I'll be interesting . It'd be interesting if you can convince me to be neutral , because I don't think I'm neutral .
Oh , if you want .
Well , we'll talk through it , but , um , but , okay . So , as you said , the , the , the writers , the writers on strike against the amp tp . So this first time that they have both gone on strike together in 60 years , right .
It's not . They're separate . Now . That's the other thing . This isn't like the actors joined the writers and this is a One strike . The actors are on strike and the writers are on strike and they have different goals .
Right , but for all intents and purposes they're in solidarity and strike against the corporate monsters right , but every time because you you just said the key thing that this is the first time in 60 years where both are on strike , right , normally , but they have been on strike before 2007 .
2008 was the last time and Normally when they go on strike like this both of them , you know , the writers come to an agreement and then a month later , the actors come to an agreement , so don't think it's going to end all at once likely not right right .
One side might Reach a resolution and the other exactly it might drag on and nobody knows how long this is going to go on for right . It seems like it could be quite a while , though . Now . How long did the the the last one go for ? Do you remember ?
um it , it went for . At least it was over 90 days . I know that , okay , and this was I think it was up to six months .
It's a really bad one , yeah so
¶ Breaking Down The Issues
now can you break down the you know sort of what , what the the points are of each side Between the writers versus what the actors are really kind of striking against .
Yeah Well , if you're a writer today , you're , you get a hit tv show . You get to write eight episodes , right ?
we watched some of your favorite shows well that I think what you're really commenting on there more is the streaming model now that we have it wasn't that way with the network product , because it was , which is part of why this argument has come to surface , right streaming is the big key here . Right , you know that's the streaming and ai streaming .
Yeah , those are the two big issues . Streaming is Not paying residuals , which that was the one of the last strikes in the old model . When you're on network tv , you have to do five years . That's why you see a lot of shows . This is the end of our you know , conclusion of our series . They stop it at four years so they don't have to pay residuals .
But now , with streaming , there is no deal . In fact , netflix Specifically puts in their contract you won't be getting anything else .
This is it here ? Well , did a , did a show have to go five years to be syndicated ? Was ? Was that ?
yes , okay so the rule , maybe a change but until it gets in syndication there .
That is what . That's what kicks in the reruns . Correct , so you ?
okay , so what is it ?
So you're saying , but you're saying season one to four , nothing , they're never being . They're being re shown , replayed , re aired , but they're not paying out at that point .
Correct , like , if it's it repeat yeah , good luck . Yeah , but if you hit five years then that residual thing kicks in and for some people they live off that . Yeah you know , like I brought up , gilligan's island was .
I don't know why , but you know back then when they were think of those shows they shot every week for like 50 weeks out of the year and it's been in reruns how many times . I mean you can watch Gilligan's Island probably any time of the day in any place in the country , but they don't get paid . Now I think in the last strike they got a .
You know they threw them a bone but like arrested development , there's a more recent one that went to four seasons , didn't get to the fifth . Now the quality had dropped off because Fox wasn't really backing it .
Yeah , now , you had mentioned that . You know with the streamers , they're not getting residuals . That's not really true . It's just how that residual amount is determined , which is you know , you've got the studio right that is selling the content to the streamer , right ?
So there's a licensing deal going on , and so the streamer then says , okay , we're gonna pay out a percentage of that licensing deal . That's what trickles down to the content creators and the performers which , as we've seen in the news just in the last few days , these residual checks are like a penny 26 cents .
Some of those , they weren't one . You sent me a picture of Eric Bogozian who had a bunch of one cent . That was probably talk radio back in the day .
No , no , because there's a woman who was one of the regulars on . Orange is the New Black .
I was gonna bring that up .
It was like 20 bucks or something like that . You know this was a hit show . It's like Netflix top show .
But that was the first show to see anything . That was the first hit show in streaming and it's already gone right and they're getting , like you said , nothing for it . Netflix makes a profit , but they won't tell how much . They won't tell how many streamers they get . They hold that information like it's gold .
All the other streamers are basically losing money because they all came out with cheap Odeals for , like like I got Disney Plus for 3.99 for three years . Now when that comes due , it'll at least double , probably triple , because of the price . I mean because of the strike .
Yeah , so it's a real conundrum because the companies like say you work , amazon has Amazon Prime , right , I pay $120 a year . Used to be 60 , but now it's 120 . But it's still worth it for free shipping and all that . I can buy something for 50 cents and it ships free , right . But you know how does Amazon say they take your $120, .
How do they carve that up ? How do they know how much is going to streaming ? Likely they do , dan , but they're not telling us . Well you gotta believe they do , I gotta believe they know the stats and they're not being transparent . They're all saying , well , we don't know . Like Disney Plus , right , remember Warner Brothers during the ?
This streaming grew massively during the epidemic Fantastic , yeah , and what happened was , as they got bigger , shows moved from network to , you know , over to streaming . It was they were getting better deals up front , right , but somebody and I blame some lawyers for this , because somebody wasn't paying attention Somebody wasn't forward thinking enough .
You know we talk about a visionary , which Disney is lacking right now . Did that come out ? Yeah , we're getting that so like Disney , is losing big money on their streaming People think oh , it's Disney , you know ?
Yeah , I mean their stock continues to plummet .
Yeah , the only thing profitable with them right now is the parks , the thing that they have abused the most , especially under the Cheypeck era .
You know , the fair wages is also kind of sort of on the agenda here of things that they're fighting for .
You know , Correct and I didn't know the details , but it you know if you're in the , if you're in the guild , the writer's guild in particular I don't know if it's the same for the actors but 26,000 a year to get insurance , that's the threshold that you need to meet and most of them are not making that . Correct , and that is part of the thing .
Right Is that it is a weird kind of thing . As you said earlier . It's like , you see , like Brian Cranston and all the top stars that are out there , and it does seem to present a little bit of a not I wouldn't say a contradiction , but it's a little weird Because , like , pay us more money and yet there the top paid .
But you know what are they gonna do ? Not stand in solidarity with Correct .
Their guild brothers and sisters , you know there's a worry that there's gonna be a wedge eventually . If this keeps going which is predicted to go If by now already the fall lineup is done , it's gone . Even if they , even if tonight they say the strike's over fall , tv is gonna be game shows .
I read a great . There was a great article in the Hollywood Reporter just yesterday , I think it came out called Strike , Fall Out , and there was a lot of other like smaller stories in there about the topic . But you know , in this whole conversation now about that , streamers are having you know in their boardrooms about , like , are we gonna hold this content ?
Are we gonna release it ? What are we gonna do ? Because part of the deal is their stars can't go out and promote it . Right , Right , there's no talk shows . There's no way to promote these things Same things going on with the movies . So what do you do ? What do you do ? Do you hold it back ?
And then , all of a sudden , your audience dries up even more . You know , and you and we've made this point , that this is coming at such a critical moment , especially for the box office , especially for theaters . We've done numerous episodes on that
¶ The Disney Dilemma
and Iger himself said this in his now infamous speech in Sun Valley for CNBC , where he stuck his foot deep in his building , in our mouth , and Iger is . Iger is who no does anybody not know who Bob Iger is , they might not , he's the most powerful man in the media . I get it .
I'm an auditionh and I'm an DSI and he's like Jam off customer service , facing it Like we're still watching this show and I'm sure one of our already into ray the Soviet Union . Yet we're watching the" says I'll give you two years . He really said he didn't want to come back , but he'll come back to smooth things out .
And now he's back , and now he's back longer than anticipated . Yeah , Right , and the word on the street is that he's turning grayer and grayer . And he didn't even anticipate the kind of shithole that he was stepping into . The shithole Right , but , but , but .
Jpeg drove Disney Plus so underwater he had mentioned I circled around before you got me off the rails was in that interview . He talks about the fact . You know what I was the point I was about to make , which is that you know , we cannot , like the industry can't , go through another pandemic like a pandemic , like period .
No , I don't think the theaters would survive it . I don't think so . I mean , I don't know about TV and the streamers and you know , but the theater , I don't know how they would survive it .
And and right now less than 50% of people have cable . So people are streaming . That's how they're getting their major content Right , and we saw all summer one , one bomb after another , until we hit Barbie and Oppenheimer . So , right , when you're at the Apex , you're going to walk out the timing sucks .
It is interesting with the Barbenheimer thing that you know now the backdrop , you've got this going on . I mean you couldn't have predicted this would happen , but you know I was wondering you know was good .
I was going to say that was like . You know , one time Warner Brothers probably wanted those movies to do less . Yeah so they could say , hey , we're not making enough money to pay you , but Barbie did 150 million and 170 million in the opening weekend .
Come on , I can't imagine money to go around . There was no studio exec . Roll on the dice on the films not making money .
Come on , what , what it ? What did Disney play Bob Iger to come back something like 27 million a year ?
Right , yeah , not to mention the performance based pay that he gets , which is about the same amount you know that's what got Eisner in trouble .
Yeah , he's making did a stock deal Right and that's why the optics of this interview that he did with CNBC Was ours are so bad you know , there's even people that you know anonymously have come out and said that wasn't a good look , you know he's out there at this bill . What do they call it ? They call it the billionaires camp .
Yeah , they were all out there in Sun Valley having this powwow and he came out and he said he . He basically said this was a disruption . What they're doing is a disruption , and he went on to say that what they're expecting is unrealistic . Right .
He managed , as an industry , to negotiate a very good deal with the director's guild . That reflects the value that the directors contribute to this great business . We wanted to do the same thing with the writers , and we'd like to do the same thing with the actors .
There's a level of expectation that they have that is just not realistic , and they are adding to a set of challenges that this business is already facing that is , quite frankly , very disruptive . So they're not being realistic .
I know they're not and then you , you probably then , if you haven't go out and see it online the nanny who , of course , friend rusher , is the president of SAG aftra .
She came out and had some choice words for Iger in response to those comments like just how tone deaf Someone at his level could be right , you know and Especially a guy who replaced a guy who was incompetent and he knew .
He told them Don't put this guy in charge and he sunk the ship for for Disney .
It's interesting because if you go and what , I don't know if you've seen the interview with them , but with David Faber or Faber on CNBC , but it's fairly short . I mean , they talk about a lot of other things . They talk about just the state of Disney in general , the Supposedly low reported attendance at the parks , which really wasn't factually correct .
You know , yeah , but anyways , and you know that the battles with the government here and all of that and so , but it most of what he says there I agree with in the interview , except for this statement about their . What they're asking for is unrealistic . It's this expectation that they have . You know this , this sec people cough on podcasts all the time .
We don't need to delete it . You're right . You dying on me .
Yeah , no .
Is this the end ? I think it's the end of a brother . No , you know , you want to come out with schedule scope . You want to come out and say some nasty shit at the top of the episode that karma's gonna get you in the ass . But , you know it made me it , so I was just saying that you know .
So what were the issues he brought up that you well ? He never he didn't .
He didn't peel , you know , peel the layers back enough to say this is what they're being unrealistic about , or whatever .
Right , and the guy didn't really grill him to go down into the details and to stay on the media thing is
¶ Ron Perlman Weighs In
I Forget it might have been the hollow Hollywood reporter also came out with a story About a week and a half ago . That said and it was supposedly an anonymous source that was an executive who said we're gonna , we're gonna shut this thing down until the writers start losing their houses .
Yeah , and then ?
then long comes Ron Pearl man . Go to TMZ and watch the Ron Pearl man .
Right , you'll see your . Ron had a few choice words .
Oh , man too . The mother who said we're gonna keep this thing going until people start losing their houses in their apartments . Listen to me , mother . There's a lot of ways to lose your house . Some of it is financial , some of it is karma and Some of it is just figuring out who the said that , and we know who said that and where he lives .
There's a lot of ways to lose your house . You wish that on people . You wish that family starve While you're making 27 million dollars a year for creating nothing . Be careful , mother . Be really careful .
So you know , it made me think about , like , what about the advance of things like CGI , right and right , like with the Mandalorian in the Introduction of the volume , how they record on the volume , right , that big sort of 360 stage where they can kind of project these Landscapes and whatever they want up there , right ?
It's unbelievable technology , with Favreau and all of them that are doing that . You know what about that in terms of how that impacts ? You know , set builders and people in those unions and things like . Has there been an issue there ? Where's the case ? I don't know . I just wonder how many other layers there are to this .
Well , there's a ton . I mean that we're we're not a monetized site , we're not big enough , but there is websites yet folks yet , yet . But that's OHB is and brother podcast Dot com well , put it on your LinkedIn and we'll be , you know , monetized .
I .
Thought you're .
I thought you're on LinkedIn but on LinkedIn , yeah , oh , my LinkedIn yeah right the fallout .
You know we have a niece that that was working in Production and you know , kind of like a grunt job like you know , you do this , you do this or she would have to cat .
What if she thinks it's the most glamorous job in the world ? Well , no , it's a job she likes she , she's home right now going . No , I was happy with my life ten minutes ago right ?
No , no .
And then my uncle good on the money , he's not working right now because of this strike .
Have you been talking to her ? Yes , yeah , and you know it's upsetting because and again she'd be the first one to admit you know she's not , you know she can't get the insurance , she's not making that much right . And those issues are just . It's a trickle down , if and it's gonna affect , so where is you online ?
Where does your neutrality come in that you were talking about at the beginning ? Well , you know , I see how could you possibly be on the other side of this ?
No , I , you know , I think what it is is you .
I think it's more . I think maybe more what you were getting at was as a consumer , correct ? And not getting the next series of this or that ?
No , no , no , no , not that , but let's go to the endgame like okay to .
¶ Film Industry Fallout - Winners and Losers
Right , let's go to the endgame , because this is gonna end . Maybe , maybe destroy the industry itself and redo it . I don't know , but it's gonna end right . When it ends , what's gonna happen ? You tell me when anyone who's streaming you're going to pay double . Okay , amazon Prime is going to go to 180 .
Right To make up all those costs .
Disney Plus is going to go to 20 bucks a month .
Yeah .
So we get screwed . Okay , the writers and the actors get screwed and the owners are like , hey , we put up the dough to make this film , to make this show .
Have you seen any details as to what the offer was ? Because it was a statement in the headlines from AMPTP about well , you know , sag after they we made them a great offer . They walked away . It's a shame they were going to negotiate with us , but that was a political stunt . What were the terms , of course ? So what were the terms of that deal ?
I don't know . Do you Do , you know it no but I'm sure it didn't get them any closer to where they wanted to be . But you're right , it was just a political stunt . Yeah , now , interestingly , I think there could be some irony here that we might indirectly get our wish that there could be an impact or a change to the award shows , right ?
You know what's going to happen with the Emmys . The Emmys are already gone . Well , no , they're not gone .
They're not gone , they just they . It's in a holding pattern .
Yeah , it'll go it's supposed to be in September , right , and they're already saying it's going to be next year .
Yeah .
But you know these things they end , but they don't end good .
Yeah , just make it never . Right , we don't need them . Yeah , you've already got your .
you know that's see , that's what makes the stars , the big stars , look kind of petty , you know , do you think somebody like you know , Pacino or De Niro are they worried about this strike ? You're going to see them on the picket lines .
No , I mean they might be worried for those that are most impacted by it , and I think that is the message that people like that you've seen be very vocal , like Brian Cranston and others , right , and look , the Rockwood is his money where his mouth is , or whatever . He gave a seven-figure donation to the cause . So I mean that's not nothing , right ?
But yeah , it is a weird kind of juxtaposition , right .
Yeah .
It's . You know how there's . Why does this one get ?
I mean , it gets very sociological and you know and the worst part is , like I said , in the end we all lose . Right now , like every night , I watch an episode of Perry Mason .
And then I thought I heard taps playing very softly in the distance , like what , like a Christmas story ? Just you , just we're bringing it down to a real downer , yeah .
Okay . So I'm watching on streaming a site called Freevy , which is what it says Everybody has Freevy Right , Freevy 2B , Freevy 2B Right Right . Their prime content is going to get sucked away by the streamers , because the streamers they're not making money . They're not . Netflix is making money , but the other ones .
So there's where I kind of get into the neutrality issue .
But you said yourself we don't really know .
We don't know .
What they're making or what they're not making .
But I do know for a fact that Disney Plus was totally underwater when Bob Iger came back . Right , His first thing . What did he do ? He fired people from Pixar , their best studio release segment . He fires people . He fired the woman . You said her name , Christine McCarthy McCarthy .
Christine McCarthy is one of the ones that went behind Chaypex back to Iger Get him out and said will you get ? You know , come back .
I got to get this guy out , yeah .
He blew her out . Yeah Well , she's home . She's on the picket lines .
Iger certainly isn't worried and he's not worried about the future of Disney . He said as much you know . And he even said look , this company's 100 years old . You see it in the interview and he talks about . You know even Eisner , you know even Walt .
I mean there was peaks and valleys and every valley always had a peak you know , so , I don't know it seems like this is going to drag on for quite some time In what showed us if Barbie and Oppenheimer tanked .
I was ready to do an episode just about that . I talked to you about it off off air and I said you know we got to cover this because something's really wrong . When mission impossible and Indiana Jones 5 and , and well , we weren't that surprised by flash which started the tanking .
Although you said it wasn't as horrible as it was it wasn't as horrible .
Honestly , be fair when you see it . Yeah , I think you know as remilers taking all the blame .
So so what happens ?
What's gonna be ?
what's gonna become of what was supposed to be a pretty strong fall , where a lot of films we've already either done a first look on and we've done a different episode on . We just did an episode on what looks to be . I think , well , probably could be , could have been whatever we need to say now .
Maybe up for best picture , certainly , which is Killers of the Flower Moon , the Scorsese film , you've got Dune part 2 , you got the marvels which we've talked about here . Napoleon and Wonka , right , you know , are they , they even gonna come out . I think I'm gonna push him because it's a real . That's a . That's a .
I wouldn't want to be in the seat to make that decision you know , because the executives are gonna say you know , we put it out , we're gonna get nothing now One like Killers of the Flower Moon .
It was only already gonna have a very small theatrical release , so I don't know why you would hold right from releasing that on Apple TV right Just now with that correct but the other , like Warner Brothers , you know part two , brothers , right , you know , if you can't have Timothy Chalamet out there doing , because they they're not even allowed .
They're prevented from even , you know , promoting it on social media or anything , right , right .
And so what do you do ? Like I said , it even affects us now , because Dan's been working behind the scenes to set up some interviews that now we're likely not gonna get right and you know that's that's the trickle down of this and again , in the end , everybody's gonna go back to work , everybody , you know people are gonna lose their homes .
Yeah , everybody's gonna be pissed off and we're in a time that , like you said earlier , it couldn't have been a worse time For a strike . No , no , you could , you couldn't have made it up you know , I mean somebody again , the lawyers who did all of you know legal stuff back when streaming was in its infancy .
Yeah , I look at them and say they weren't bright lawyers . You know they weren't forward-thinking . You have to think ahead , ai . There were people who were thinking ahead . Yeah , I haven't talked about that much yeah and you know , and now it's coming to fruition .
So all of a sudden , the guy that they were saying was a nutball a year and a half ago he's on . You know every talk show talking about AI , yeah , so you know what happens with that .
I mean I , I'm Certainly in the camp with , with the , the strikers at this point .
I'm definitely more on that side , yeah , as much as it might impact .
I mean , you don't have to look too far . But beyond Mike here in his physical media collection , he's gonna be just fine folks . He's gonna be just fine , yeah and my all right . So we got a we probably want fair wages . We should wrap this up so Mike can get back on the picket line . So anything else to say about this topic . What's your prediction ?
My prediction is this doesn't get settled till next year , it's gonna be dark .
Yeah , gonna be cold and it's gonna last for the rest of your life .
That's Chevy chase correct .
Jesus , folks , did I miss it ? Jesus , you know what ? You should just leave and go on the picket line . It's Groundhog day , for God's sake , all right . Bill Murray , harold Ramis , bill Murray , andy McDowell , the great in McDowell . Right , there's another lease who is
¶ The Nelms Brothers and Final Thoughts
right . This cannot impact our Nelms brothers . Next release red right hand . I won't have it . I won't have it . I won't stand for it , folks .
Andy McDowell playing a heavy . I got to see that I won't see it right now .
Yeah , let's .
Let's get send some love out to a friend of the show , johnny Durango to , who Just posted on his Instagram follow him out on Instagram about this film he just wrapped with Director you might have heard of in the past by the name of Mel Gibson , and and six directorial , and which is a hard to believe , hard to believe and Starring , of course , one of our
good time friends , mack Walberg , you know right , mack you know from their local hero up there . So but it's called flight risk and it's in post-production , but super excited to see and again will we ?
will we get to see it in the theater ? Yeah like you know , thank you , think we love the Nelms brothers . You know the Nelms you . We love everybody within the right universe and anybody related to it , and Elms cinematic universe . We call they got screwed . When fat man came out Because of the pandemic , it went right to DVD .
It's a theatrical release , that's true , and it's been , it's been , it's been some episodes since we've crowbarred that in . But right , I haven't seen if you haven't seen fat man folks , you have to see it and you have to own it because it is . It is a masterful film .
It's because you watch the film and then to listen to people like Johnny Durango , ian Eschum , michelle , to listen to them talk about it . It's just a great , a great film . But the following year or last year , then there was all these like Santa's crazed killer you know they were trying to copy .
Oh , definitely , but got nowhere . Close , violent night and all right . Right , let's just hope that this doesn't have a long-lasting impact on on those films at least .
but yeah , I think we're in for a long strike . I mean , that's what most of the experts think and that's just not good for anybody . I mean I want the thing to get settled tomorrow . I wish I could go in and mediate .
Well , anything can happen , but it seems like they're very far away from yeah , they're done coming to an agreement at this point . So all right , well , listen , that's gonna do it for another episode of the O Brother podcast . I've been your host , dan Smith , long time .
He is always my brother from the same mother , mike Smith , and we will see you next time .
Maybe I'll see you next time . I might be on the picket line .
Boo , scab Boo .