Welcome to the O'Brother Podcast with hosts Dan and Mike Smith , brothers from the same mother with different opinions on movies , tv , video games and more , plus celebrity interviews . Get ready , get set , it's time for the O'Brother Podcast . Welcome to the O'Brother Podcast .
I'm your host , dan Smith , alongside me , as always , my brother from the same mother , mike Smith . How's it going tonight , dan ? It's going good man , it's . What is it today ? July 13th 2024 , we're recording this episode , mike . A little walk down the memory lane , a little history lesson here , okay , first to start off with so Berlin Wall comes down .
George HW Bush is sworn in as president . Rain man wins Best Picture one of our favorite films . The Calgary Flames win the Stanley Cup cup , I think the first time maybe in franchise history and and wow .
Canada hasn't won a stanley cup in 30 years we're getting there .
Menendez brothers ring a bell we don't have to go into the details , but Google it , folks . The Dalai Lama wins the Nobel Peace Prize . Mike the Game Boy is released in April .
That's right 89 .
Right , yep , and , most important of all , I turned 17 . Do the math , folks ? Wow , but we're not here to talk about any of that . We are here to talk about it . Yeah , and you're older than me , so there you go . Huh .
So we're here to talk about something else , a pretty monumental event that took place in 1989 , june 23rd of 1989 , to be exact and that , of course , mike , was the release of the original Batman film starring Michael Keaton . I'm Batman , I'm .
Batman . This is probably my most purchased Between this and Back to the Future . I've bought it so many times , so many editions . Like if you look back here , all four deluxe editions Of just the 89 . Well , that's all four . That's all four , but the 89 in particular . But I also have bought the Nolan releases several times .
Right , it's a great trilogy . You know the one thing about this , now I was . There was a lot of hype , a lot of anticipation for this film in 1989 . Yes , and so much so that , like the merchandise was out , or like the t-shirts were all over the place , a place , were you in florida yet ?
no , okay , I was in line on a friday night in june to go see batman and and I went opening night as well in orlando I had just bought my house and the cable was 11.99 . Oh boy . For like you know unlimited channels .
You can't even buy a cable for $11 now .
And there was a TV station , which I think was still there when you moved , called Movie Time . Oh , that's right , and all they did was play movie trailers . You know , all day , 24 , 7 , that's all it was . I think it became wasn't that else .
It had this , this iterate , like it . It evolved into like talk soup and then something like that , like comedy central or there's some ah , that's remember that .
Yeah , Holy shit , yeah so but I loved it when it was movie time , and especially around 89 , because we've got Batman , which was an iconic , probably the most iconic trailer of its time .
Well , and here's the thing about that is , is you know if you look into any of the extras or the makings of the documentaries ? Yes , there was like , first of all , when they , when they announced that Keaton was going to be .
Oh man .
Now , this was filmed in Pinewoods which is in London and it's a Pinewood studio studio . Yeah , star Wars Hello .
Exactly with studio , studio , yeah , star wars hello , exactly , and so they were .
You know , cell phones weren't a thing , yet nobody . Internet wasn't a thing right .
So there was all this blowback when keaton because he had just done beetlejuice with tim burton- and he had just done clean and sober , which you and I have talked about doing a review on which I think we need to get to at some point , but anyways , so we were excited with the choice .
But man was there , blowback from the comic . People Correct His jaw wasn't right . He couldn't possibly portray Batman , the Dark Knight , the physicality and all that , and then the trailer comes out .
Right well , and this is why they get the trailer pushed out .
Yes , to settle down some of this fervor that's going on about it and you know , tim burton makes one of the best trailers of all time . Still to this day , I watch it . I get goosebumps . When michael keaton first grabs that guy and pulls him and says who are you ? Yeah , what are you ?
I'm a bad man yeah , so many , so many great lines , yeah so june 23rd 1989 , so we're celebrating the 35th anniversary . This was right . We decided to come on and do this and and it was a good excuse to see it again . I don't know when I last watched it from start to finish . Now I watched the 4K digital , which was good , not great .
It's not the best digital 4K I've seen .
Same with the 4k . It's not one of the best restorations , if it even is a restaurant . This might be one of those 35 millimeter scans which isn't true hdr .
Yeah , although I watched it the ending sequence , which is very , I mean the . The whole film is dark for the most part . Yes , you know from the cinematography . But the , uh , the , the ending sequence , in that belfry and all that , I mean that looks really nice , it looks until the joker falls .
Cgi wasn't a thing , well I just mean in terms of the 4k , the you know it's okay , it's been . Yes , you know even though there's a lot of shadows and it's dark , it's , it's . You can make it out . It's very crisp . But yeah , it's funny . You mentioned that the very first shot of batman that we get in this is this terrible .
It's not as bad as the joker . When you mentioned the correct and and I don't know was that . Have you seen that that was intentional in any of the documentaries ? Has there been any commentary about that ?
I listened to the commentary by burton while I watched it because I've seen it so many times . Did he comment on it ? Didn't comment on it because it's it's so animated . Commented on the joker at the end falling , but he didn't win not how it looks see it's like a , it's like somebody scribbling .
Well , it's a cartoon , it's animated right , it's literally in it and it's the top of access chemicals . But then we see this grand entrance with these giant wings and him descending in the smoke .
It's kind of like a noir , yeah shadows and like , yeah , the noir , uh , yeah but you know that I I forgave that opening shot because the next shot of him was so good well , the , the opening shot of batman isn't so bad because it's it's an overhead shot , it's very distant and he , you know , but you can tell it's it's animated .
But speaking of that , that , you know there are .
This is very heavily dependent on practical effects , like , yeah , the use of models back then , which you know , I mean I could spot that back in the day , like even with superman , you know that that was a very common practice at that time and you see that in this , like the ending sequence where the , the bat wing crashes into the steps , right , that's a
whole sequence done with models .
Exactly . But it looks cool , it's very I thought it looked good .
you know , considering that and you know what , there was a lot of stunt doubles and not once did I believe that wasn't michael keaton exactly , and there's some cool again , speaking of , like the , the , the practical sort of stunt work that's done in this film .
I didn't realize how much of it was kind of bordering on martial arts , like there's one sequence in the belfry where he literally kind of gets in this sort of right , you know , to defend himself , and it's pretty cool . Some of the kicks and all of that talk about um , because we mentioned keaton and the criticism there .
Burton wasn't some huge success at this point either .
No , beetle juice was a hit mild , hit , mild , hit , mild . But he thinks , according to him , that if beetlejuice had done it poorly he'd he'd have been pulled and he was pulled from three .
He was set to make batman three right well , and he got yanked because they thought batman returns was too dark and I think in some cases that's the better of the two films mike's favorite penguin , danny devito .
It's so nasty he was so nasty that it was so good , so hideous and that I mean that's what made that character so good but what I wanted you to talk about with Burton is the opening sequence , that very opening title sequence with the symbol oh right , which is the symbol , the Batman symbol , and he's getting into the dark recesses of it .
People couldn't tell what it was . Yeah , you don't know what it is , yeah , until it backs off . Right , right , he , he talked about that .
He said you know , I wanted to set a message from the start , with the titles that this was going to be the dark knight , the dark batman which is , which is , you know , of course , bob kane , uh , rest in peace , you know that's . That was his version of that . He was .
He was on the set for almost the whole shoot .
Well , and you've . And there was a I don't know if you know , there's a little nod to him in the film .
Uh , there's a sequence where , uh , robert wool , who we'll talk about , comes into the the newsroom and they're the guys are goofing on him because he's so obsessed with this story about a bat that's terrorizing , whatever , and they hand him this cartoon that somebody drew and if you look vampire , the signature is bob kane .
I didn't notice that I did not pick up .
Well all these years and I'm yeah , it's a good little tip of the hat .
Yeah to him . But yeah , you're right that that that opening sequence is so profound and you don't know what it is until it's revealed , but his directing throughout is spectacular .
What I was going to say when you mentioned Bob Kane is the campiness of the 60s TV show gets way away from that , of course , with Adam West , and know that version of batman again , which I love , which I love .
I'm right , and and he did too , burton was a big fan he's about my age , right , and he was a big fan of the tv show , but he wanted to make sure that he set the tone that this wasn't campy , this wasn't going to be . You know , and with michael keaton , at that time , a lot of people didn't see clean and sober . You and I were ahead of the curve .
Yeah , I think you had the laser disc of clean and sober . I did , and I and I bought it recently on dvd because there's no blu-ray or four , you did .
You didn't tell me , you picked it up .
That's I did . I bought it because we were talking about doing the episode .
We're going to do the episode on that for sure , but we knew he had these dramatic chops .
but people knew him from his comic stuff Right , and the most recent being Beetlejuice . But even before that he was kind of always a goofy kind of like tom hanks . I always confused the two of them early in their career because they had the similar roles yeah , that's a good well bosom buddies right bosom buddies .
Yeah , I've had great comedy , um . You know . The other thing I liked about it too was he kind of sets it in this time period that you don't really know when it is right it's the 50s at the 70s . Where is it ? Where are we ?
you know , you don't know which is great , it doesn't , it doesn't all done on purpose yeah , it doesn't doesn't tie it down any particular period , which is , which is great because it makes it timeless . You know , um the um , uh , we talked about bob kane , um , some of the audio .
I thought some of the the dubbing was kind of bad in spots I don't know if you pick up on that and this is definitely back when they were still using and I know they still do today , maybe not to the same degree , but Foley artists where they're , you know they've got a pair of shoes on their hands for like a clickety clack horse .
You know , there was clearly some of that going on , but I I just found there was something with the sound design that was a little odd to me yeah , well , did you pick up on that ?
I I didn't , to be honest , um , and I haven't in the past , so it's never been an issue . But you know , I do know michael keaton couldn't hear . It was like it was like communicating with somebody who was deaf because the mask and his whole costume was so uncomfortable and so heavy .
Yeah , so he didn't know what he sounded like until he saw the dailies , you know . So even he wasn't sure what batman actually he . But tim burton feels like the costume gave him the voice kind of came from when he got into it and there was all the issues where he couldn't .
There was no zipper , right , so he had to get totally undressed if he just had to pee , right . But , um , and you know , you got to talk about jack nicholson , the first one who signed on for the deal , and he knew he , he says he knew this was going to be big .
Yes , you know , everybody else seemed to be kind of running around scrambling .
We're making a film , you hope it's going to be great , but he knew this was going to be almost otherworldly , you know and he's out there he tells a funny story of being at like the Oscars or something , and he's in the restroom , you know , on a break , you know , and he's yucking it up with I think Jack Valenti is the person he mentions and he's just
saying how big this thing's going to be . You know , and didn't he cut a ?
deal Nicholson yes , to get paid . Every time a Batman movie was released , he gets paid . Oh , I believe that , yeah , yeah . I mean he cut a deal where you know he's still got a pretty good paycheck . I think Keaton got 5 million , so you got to think nicholson got more .
But the rights and the , the back end he got was like nobody had ever gotten before right , well , I mean david jack nicholson .
He was right , more than well established at that point . Which , and the perfect ? You couldn't think of a better actor at the time no uh , and it's interesting when you go back and watch these films , especially those in the 80s .
This is , of course , at the end of the decade , but you know , just to see the kind of uh uh , historical , you know um uh footprint of who was big at the time kim basinger , you know , as vicky right she came on after the filming started .
She was a very late arrival to this right , it was um .
Uh , who was the the um ? From no way out with kevin . Yeah , sean sean young , sean young , and she got in some like horse riding accident or something yes , and then she begged to come back as cat woman . Yes but they had already cast michelle pfeiffer right , didn't she show up at the , she showed up at place office , yeah office .
Yeah , and I remember her on a tv show coming out dressed as cat woman , you know , lobbying . All right , it's like it's done . There's a great .
She got obsessive about it michelle pfeiffer , of course , like just a kill , that own that role , that scene . If you look up on youtube you can see the video of her with the whip and all the heads one take , it's just she really hit the head .
Yeah , it's amazing , it wasn't amazing you know , I thought that was effects yeah , it's wild and she gets like this .
You know , standing ovation , round of applause , right crew people . You know , right the um , yeah , nicholson , that initial laugh of his .
You know , there's times where I feel like he's and maybe he said this or you , you heard this since the documentaries where I gotta believe there's spots where he's tipping the hat to caesar romero it wasn't mentioned , but you know it was so obvious and all those sounds like he would just make these sounds and burton was like I just went with it .
But it's jack nicholson , it's like trust me it's somehow it fit .
Yeah , it's like uh , is that you sugar bumps ? Right , you know ? Yeah , it's me sugar bumps . You know , that's the thing . There was humor in the film throughout , yeah , you know , but it never . It never got campy , as you mentioned earlier , like it didn't go there , but it was there was a lot of comedy .
This was the first big comic movie , you know , after Superman . Yeah , and even Superman was , you know , I don't know a little camp , at least in the latter two , the first two .
I really love . Oh , yeah , love the second one too , yeah . Me too , I almost like the second one more than the first one .
And if you're going to watch those , watch the Donner cut of two , right , it's much better .
Yeah , it's like this whole thing where Heath Jack , heath Jack .
And .
I would never even pick . They're very different interpretations of that character .
Right In a very different movies . Stylistically , if it was released today , he'd have been up for an oscar probably would have been the third winner as the joker .
The only thing they won , I think , was like set direction or some like that yeah , and I know danny elfman was .
You know he did um dick tracy . I always thought dick tracy came first no , that was the other way around . It came the next year yeah , warren baby with Warren Beatty . And about every star in Hollywood , including Al Pacino and James Caan , were unrecognizable in their roles .
That was a lot of fun shouting thing at the end of the table and dick tracy that scene that pacino has yeah you remember , I forget I'm thinking of gary oldman in the professional for some reason , when he says bring me everyone , everyone , right everyone .
You know that's confusing it .
Yeah , big , he played big boy . A big boy , that's right . Yeah , great , that's one of's one of his best , that's a great one . So , mike , we were recently talking about Fritz Lang . Funny enough , because you know , you know Fritz Lang , mike , he did Megalopolis .
Yeah , right , I bet that one screwed up Right , metropolis , of course , and FW Murnau with Nosferatu , which we just did a first look on that too a while back , um , but it was funny .
I don't know , in your study of film of you would come across this concept of the dutch angle , the , the canted angle , where in this film , throughout 85 of it probably , it's that you know where the camera is kind of tilted on its axis , correct , and it gives us this really sort of unbalanced , creates tension .
And you go back to the , to the TV show . They did it to an extreme Right that it made it sort of campy Right .
Yeah , it sort of got it . It was the heyday was like in the 20s , 30s .
The monster movies did it a lot .
Yeah , yeah day was like in the 20s , 30s . The german movies did it a lot . Yeah , yeah , and , like you said , it was tension like nosferatu , dracula , you know films like that but I was just didn't really sort of hit me as much as it did during this rewatch . I was like , wow , he's really leaning into that heavy throughout this film .
You know , it mentioned obviously burton , uh tim burton directing , and then it was uh screenplay co-written by warren's uh scarron and sam ham , who , sam ham kind of leaves the project at some point . I don't think he finishes it out . It wasn't like what , what ends up on film was not his full original concept , right ? Um ?
I know that , you know burton keeps talking about . You know the issues because this is like still in the studio days almost , where warner brothers is checking in looking over his shoulder .
You know giving him notes , you know all this concern from the comic community and blah blah , blah , which that leads to him getting a trailer out there very early in the production Right and think about how good that trailer is .
Trailer is great . I mentioned Warren Skerrin . He died in December 1990 , like shortly after the release of the film . He had also had writing writing credits for beetlejuice and beverly hills , cop 2 , which we've just been talking about . Beverly hills , cop 2 recently , um , the cinematography was a roger pratt who did some of the harry potter films .
Uh , he did mary shelley's frankenstein and that came out like the 90s 12 monkeys . This was interesting . So the editing and there was a , there was a few edits that when you've seen the film as many times as we have , correct , and I haven't entered his eye , I feel like like I'm a stickler for that sort of stuff . You pick up on these things .
Yes , um , the editor was ray lovejoy , who you must stop . Well , okay , the second stop . The second it's he doesn't . He's not even saying anything , right ?
so tell him what you're talking about yeah I'm talking . There's a scene where the the batmobile is driving itself and he has a little remote . He holds it up and he says stop , and the car stops within an inch of him .
But the problem is he holds it up and then he puts it down and then , when they go back to the shot of it stopping , he's got it up again .
So that was a bad edit well , and I don't know if you're talking about . There's what he does it again later at axis chemicals or something , and there's no sound , there's no him saying stop .
It's just yes , yes , it's so bizarre that's all in the same sequence right , okay , but ray lovejoy um was the editor on dr strange love , wow , 2001 , kubrick , two aliens , wow .
And the shining with jack nicholson three kubricks , wow , wow , it's amazing , so he was probably , uh , like nicholson , probably was one of the guys that got him hired I , I'm thinking there had to be some sort of absolutely deal there . Yeah , because nicholson definitely had a say and Jack Palance actually scared Burton .
Jack Palance is unbelievable .
But he said at one point , Palance comes out of the bathroom and he's upset about something and he says to Burton , how many films you made ? I've made over 100 . He's trying to intimidate him .
I was making films uh , with guys and bigger than you and my stool right . What is that saturday night live ? That was , uh , that's a great late . Uh , phil hartman , who was ?
doing . That's right , was he ?
thanks , yeah , yeah what does he say ? I've , uh , junaid o'connor . What's the line about chunks of guys like you , bigger than bigger ? Yeah , chunks of guys bigger than you in my stool . Yeah , that's classic .
Talk about danny elfman on this film , danny elfman . Again , he was with a band called oingo boingo . I don't know if people remember .
You and me two of the only people . But point out the fact that he's not some household movie soundtrack guy at this point no he's a legit filmmaker and really the bigger story is Prince .
Yes , because Prince gets hired and he's ticked off from the jump . He thinks he's doing the soundtrack right and it turns out like the way burton describes it he goes I didn't know what he was upset about , you know and then they started talking about a concept album , which they did , which they put out in fact I had ?
I had the cassette back when google it kids . I had the cassette of bat dance and I had all of that and there was a lot of the tracks yeah , they in fact , he used the tracks with the joker the opening the opening sequence of this batman it's prince .
Yeah , it's one of those songs , but all the , all the stuff , like when they're , when they're in , access chemicals and they open the safe . We've been ratted out here , boys , and then it goes . Watch it . It's almost like a choreographed dance to elfman's music . It's so good , um , but yeah , there was a big . That was a big issue .
That prince was ticked off because he thought he was doing the soundtrack and danny elfman's credited as the soundtrack guy well , you need a score .
I don't know that prince was going to do a score for the film well , I think the way he thinks of it , he was , yeah , okay , like it was going to be all his music yeah , and that's not the way from the jump that tim burton planned it I love the way it worked out and I and I and I don't dislike his tracks underneath in the film .
It doesn't .
I think it's good parade at the end with absolutely you know nicholson with the arms going just you know , and they're in london and it's in the winter and it's so it's believable , it's . It's cold and they look cold . Yes , they do . You see the breath coming out of nicholson , you know when he's up on the float .
Yeah , you know , what I was surprised to see was the although I don't know what's your take on these scores , so we bring this up often on the podcast , but for what it's worth , okay , take it with a grain of salt , if you will . The IMDb Metascore 69 . Wow For this movie shocking and and uh , rotten tomatoes 77 critics , 84 for the audience .
So that's more in line , although I would still expect the audience to be a little bit higher than that but you know it's it surprised me and you know it surprised me and you know , here it is 35 years later and we get Keaton back .
Yeah , that's shocking to me .
What's the ?
Metascore 69 .
Okay , it's only like 21 reviews or something .
Yeah , I remember Jay Boyar was the film critic for the Orlando Sentinel at the time film critic for the orlando sentinel at the time and I remember the day of the movie's opening , which is the day we both went it was a friday front page batman , five stars and he really got it . I mean it was one of the better reviews I've read , period you know well .
Well , let's see , I mean it . The budget was about 35 million , it opened at 40 million opening week and it's it's grossed over 400 million .
And I'm surprised it's not even higher Right . Yeah , me too , you know like this is one that would be . You know , they , they , they just missed it . They could have done a 35th anniversary release and some of this garbage that's in the theaters I know you know , take that out and put in some you know that .
Well , the theaters do that . Occasionally they do . They're playing like , uh , the lion king that's right .
That's right . The next disney you know is known for that talk about , if you can .
The um because this was a pretty significant effect in the film was when nicholson , as the joker , has the skin tone like yes and he wipes it off to reveal the white from when he is disfigured in the vat of chemicals that access chemicals . So talk about . Do you recall how they achieved that ?
Because it was pretty sophisticated it was and it took about four hours to accomplish it , because in the makeup guy figured a way to do the white in like an almost an acrylic , um , so the , the tan or or you know , because it was kind of tan , it was kind of like , yeah , you know , yeah , so when he wiped it , you , it didn't go to the skin , it went
to the white . But yeah , that was a lot of hours in the makeup chair that was that . That was an impressive effect and again leading to one of the bad , the big mistakes , when they reveal the Joker and he goes you know you can call me Joker and he moves into the light like a noir .
And there's a purple stain from his jacket on his neck and they missed it . They just missed it .
I forgot about it . I recall now that you say that , but I had forgotten about it . Um , yeah , you know it , there's still a comic aesthetic to the film , as I guess there should be . Right , that's where the character evolved .
But , um , you know , like , there's the shootout at access , chemicals , the , the , the costuming of the cops in that scene and the way that burton stages them , it's almost like the , the rule of thirds , you know , and everything is positioned in such a way and yeah , just the directing it was massive , it was amazing it's not .
It wasn't deeper into his catalog .
It was so good you know right and know when Nicholson and Keaton are face to face for the first time in their characters . Well , Nicholson not yet , he was still Jack Napier . So they come face to face and you know , Keaton's holding them up , Right , and I guess a couple of times they just burst out laughing because of the costumes .
Oh really , yeah , yeah , like yeah like you know , it was so silly to them .
Nice , and at the time , you know , nobody had ever seen anything like this nice outfit he says there's so many , there's so many great lines , the one , one of the ones we love . There's a sequence when , uh , there's a , there's a press conference being held on the steps of gotham city hall , or whatever , billy d williams .
Let's give a shout out to billy williams , who's still out there doing his thing , by the way . Much love to him yeah , love him .
Of course he would have . He would have been in the third one with burton as two-face and he's of course , right .
Well , that's exactly . I hate that we didn't get yeah , bill's , take on Two-Face . I would have loved it , because I'm not a huge fan of Aaron Eckhart's portrayal of it .
I just don't love it . And I like Aaron Eckhart . It's not him , I liked him as Harvey Dent .
I didn't like the Two-Face character . I don't know if that's his fault or if the makeup was too over the top or something . It his fault , or if I just the makeup was too over the top or something . I don't know , I didn't like it . It's funny that I mentioned that because it makes me think of in this film .
Hey , eckhart , you know , think of the future , you know the character in this one , that's eckhart yeah he's the corrupt .
You know , cop but um and and billy d williams tim burton talks about this would have been black and white , so what in his own skin color and what in and again .
The duality is all over this movie and how batman and the joker are really the same person , the same side of of a coin , and you know that was going to be part of the future right , it's like this whole thing where you know bruce wayne is commenting on the joker he's insane , he's you know this , and that's like well , you're kind of in the same vein , like
, yeah , someone could make a case about you . And and vicky vale is almost saying that , correct , yeah , she's almost kind of pointing that out and there's another .
you know they broke some rules that didn't go over well . Number one the Joker turns out to be the killer of his parents . That's not in the comics .
But I like it and in fact I'm glad you mentioned it because I want to make sure to mention it's a very brief sequence but I want to give love to this actor named Hugo Blick who plays the young Jack Napier Looks just like him , he looks just like him . It's a fantastic scene and it's just so .
The line is so well delivered because it's a callback at that point , correct , to Nicholson saying it Go back and watch that sequence , folks . It's just so riveting . It's one of my favorites and it's like a minute , it's very quick .
Yeah , but he was great and I didn't realize that jack napier like this is the first time that that name is introduced as his full character name .
It's not , yes , jack napier in the comics , which I guess it's a takeoff on um jack and apes the word jack and apes but also a tip of the hat , I guess , to alan napier who played alfred in the 60s tv show , which I didn't realize yeah , and , and nothing was said in the commentary , but I always wonder that when I see napier in the in the , you know ,
in the what's the connection ?
correct . Yeah , and the other , the other big rule that really ticked off the comic people which , like burton , says he could not go to conventions because he would get so much grief about these rules that he broke the one I just mentioned . Another one vicky vale walking into the bat cave , hello , okay you know , that's one of the things .
Sam ham is very like I . That wasn't me , right , right , like he's very adamant , that wasn't me , I had nothing to do with that . Right , I get it . I get it . But come on , folks .
And Burton says you know , people have gotten over it and it seems to fit today , but back then it was like a cardinal rule you don't break .
Right , if that's your religion , it's kind of like don't mess with it , you know .
Yeah .
There's another great shot where Jack , early on , when he's meeting Eckhart in an alleyway yes , and what's the actor's name ? He's in a ton of 80s movies , bob something , tracy Walter , who plays Bob the Goon ?
He's a henchman Right and again a friend of Nicholson's . They had worked together before .
Yeah , and there's a scene and Eckhart starts to pull a gun , but before he can , Bob the Goon pulls a gun out and it looks the way Burton shoots it . It looks like it's Jack's arm .
He's right over the shoulder . It great , what a great shot so nice , it's so , and the same with that call out that you already mentioned . You know , hey , eckhart , think about the future . I mean just great stuff you know it's it .
It's not a perfect movie , but no , it's not a perfect movie . No , it's not a perfect movie . There are some issues with it , not the least of which , and probably it gets a little more tolerable every time I see it but it's still difficult , are you thinking ? About an actor it's Robert Wold .
Yes , robert Wold , I just can't , doesn't fit , although I did .
He's not in the comics . I did like's a again . He was a big actor in the 80s , like he was , yeah , our list bull durham , you know right , he was in good morning vietnam with robin williams , like right , you know . There's things he's been in that I like . I just didn't like him .
If , if , if there's anything campy at all about this film , it's wool yeah yeah , just , uh , just and sorry , robert , you know I was not a fan of his going in so every time he's on screen . It's like a cringe moment for me . The only time was at the very end . You know , question , how do we call you know ? That's the only thing I tolerated .
Yeah , it's all right it's all right , it's okay . Yeah , it's , but the first half of the movie with him in it is not great .
It's not good kim basinger's , and it's a shame because basinger is so grounded and really , with all these guys running around and silly costumes , she keeps it in the real world she really does , you know , and she's such a significant character . I don't know what happened um with her not returning . I never read anything about that .
I don't know if you knew no , I don't , I was .
I was wondering if you might bring that up , but but it's funny . You mentioned that because one thought I had as this film was ending . I thought this film stands on its own . Oh yeah , you didn't need to make a sequel to this film and he wasn't thinking it .
He says that right out . In fact , the joker's dead , like for people who are like , well , is he dead ? Oh , he's dead . He kills .
Once it makes 40 million opening weekend , you knew it was going to be bad . You're getting a sequel , yeah , and then after the second one .
although I don't know about the money , I think the second one did better than the first , but that's probably just the scales of economy . But it was clearly they were going to make a third , because that one and I think the the mistake burton makes in part two is too many characters . He kept it to really three .
You know , the batman , the joker and and vicky vale . Those were the core characters , right , but then when you get into the second one , you've got the batman , you've got the penguin , you've got um , who's the actor that plays catwoman's boss ? You got michelle pfeiffer . Oh boy , oh , my god , I can't believe it .
I haven't seen that for so long . It's terrible .
I uh , let's see if I can pull it shrek max shrek is the character's name , and it's a totally famous actor , oh christopher walken , walken , good lord . So he's like a major character , right and you gotta take time from somebody to give him screen time because he was so good , sure , yeah .
And then you know , three and four are just so horrible , they're almost unwatchable .
And alfred is in all those first four correct god michael goff , no , michael golf yeah , is that alfred ?
yeah , exactly I'm thinking of commissioner gordon , whoever played pat hengel pat yeah , pat hengels and all he used to be in a west , you know western actor .
Yeah , he's good , he's really good , oh yeah he's really good in this and and and that guy . Every time I watch this the mayor I'm like is that ed koch ? I mean , it's like it's definitely a koch look alike . It's his doppelganger . It's unbelievable . But but billy d williams , again just to say I yeah , you hit it on the nose .
I'm like , damn , I wished we had gotten another harvey dent performance . Yeah , I think it would have been fantastic . But I agree it was enjoyable to go back and watch this . I remember , like it was yesterday , standing in line outside of showcase cinemas waiting for this to start .
There was a line outside down the block , um and it it delivered back then it was the range you know , so it was great and yeah like I'm surprised it didn't do more money .
But again , back then a ticket was four bucks , right well , anything else mike to say about 1989 , batman I just I look back on it very fondly . You know that time it just you know 35 years it goes in a blink .
Folks Comes and goes fast .
Don't let anybody tell you any different . Because I feel like I was sitting in the theater yesterday . Yeah , being annoyed by somebody you know , popping , crunching popcorn or something .
Some things never change folks .
Yeah .
Well , if you are not currently following us , mike , and said that in a long time , make sure that you do . You can go to our official website , ohb podcastcom OHB as in brother podcastcom . You can find us on Instagram , our handle's at OHBpodcast and our handle on YouTube is at O Brother Podcast .
Folks all spelled out Appreciate all of the engagement and interaction with folks out on YouTube . We get a lot of comments on the videos now and it's fun to go back and forth with people , especially when they're educating us about we have no idea .
Right and you know we welcome criticism .
Absolutely .
Some people you know they get offended or whatever .
But no , I think it's important to point out . We've always said this is just our opinion , right ? I mean , I don't agree with you half the time , so why would we think that people are always going to agree with us ? That's not the point .
We just like to come on here , shoot the right stuff that we enjoy , and that's kind of it , it's all about having fun .
It is , and so we know the killer is I get criticized more than you because I you know I'll tear a movie wanting to dislike it but , um , so , yeah , appreciate , uh , you know , make sure you come out and follow us , subscribe to the youtube channel .
Uh , we'd appreciate that . Just help grow the channel , get it out to more and more people . It really does do us a service if you hit the thumbs up button to like the videos , just to again get it . You know , twist it up into the algorithm , as they say , or whatever . Um , but again , appreciate all those who have subscribed .
Um , and yeah , drop us a comment and let us know what you think about the 1989 batman . Were you there , like mike and I ? Right , or have you recently seen this , or you know ? I would be curious to know that from some of the OGs .
Is Michael Keaton the best Batman ? My opinion he is . When he came back in the Flash movie , it was the best thing about the movie .
Now , mike , we're going to be celebrating our fifth year next year , yep , and our second episode I had mentioned to you was an episode where we broke down all the Jokers .
Yeah , so we might have to come back and break down all the Batmans at some point and then we'll do all the Supermans and all that sort of stuff , but for now that's going to do it for this review of Batman 1989 , the 35th year anniversary . Can't believe it . So it was fun talking about this one .
It goes in a blink .
Glad we have this one in the Old Brother podcast vaults . But that's going to do it for another episode of the Old Brother podcast . I'm your host , dan Smith , long time . He's always my brother from the same mother , mike Smith , and we will see you next time .
Bye everyone , Thank you .