This is, is off track. Hello and welcome to, uh, off Track with Hinch and Rossi. It is a Tuesday show that both of us showed up to a rare and amazing thing, and it's because last week we teased we were going to have Dale Coin on the show. Uh, couldn't get Dale. So we got the next best thing, which is the Soul
Dale's wife, driver for DCR so far, uh, for 2025 NTT IndyCar series. Mr. Jacob Babel is joining us today. Hello, Jacob. What's up guys? Thanks for having me on. I'm happy to, happy to be here. I'm a listener of the show. Um, and uh, yeah, just, uh, pleased to be here.
First guest that's been a listener .
Yeah, for sure. Without a doubt. So, uh, I'm just gonna ask the hard question first. Um, announced Dale Coin Driver in January. Like that's that's a pretty big deal,
Dude. It was tough. Um, to be honest, it was tough , but the, the biggest thing that was able to, to get that done is we had Media Day and we just used that as we need to get everything done by then. And Dale was, was saying it's like, you know, for whatever reason he just really wants to be done by this, this media day. I'm like, no. It's like I, I could honestly kind of care less about the media day, but if it wasn't the Media Day, then the next best deadline is St.
Pete. And I'd like to at least have, um, some sort of idea what's going on. 'cause I mean, you guys know how it is. It's very, very hard to prepare for something when it's not all set in stone. It's not all done. Um, you know, I couldn't be talking to the engineers and all of that, and it's like you're kind of training and doing everything without a purpose.
So to at least have it done with, with a month and a half, two months to spare is, is super comforting, but still something that's, you know, super late compared to everything that I've done the rest of my career.
I was gonna say, I love that that was like, that sounded like it was tough for, for Coin to be like, well, I gotta have this done by Media Day.
Right. we've talked about on the show, like how, how like legit this year's Media Day was so, I mean, it, it's a win-win for everyone. You know, you may have had a little bit of like, not ulterior motives, but you had your own deadline of like, okay, I wanna get it done by Media Day, but like, that's gonna be a good thing for everyone. We all saw what Fox did, we saw the production that went into that day. So the fact that you are there, right?
I mean, it's, it's gonna be very important versus whoever your teammate ends up being, they're gonna have to like Photoshop or, or do something, some sort of edit to include them in, in driver intros in the program of that sort. So it's, it's awesome that you were able to get it done and
If you, maybe if you know who your teammate's gonna be, you can make some here today, ,
I've, I've gotten that asked a a billion times, but
. Yeah. I, I can only imagine. I can only imagine. But dude, it's also like the, you know, like the, the bumper's going to break, right? Where you're like, you're in the cool backlit room and you do the arms crossed whatever. So when inevitably you're leading a race this year as we go to break, right, we can cut to the actual, not just like a static shot of you in a blank race suit going, you know, two thumbs up. Right? Exactly. Right. It's is key that you're there.
Uh, I wanna, I wanna take a step back real quick though. First of all, do you go by Jacob? Is it Jake? Do you care what people
Call you? Yeah, yeah. Jacob,
Jacob Jacob's Don't care. So this is the thing, this is, there's a lot of, there's a lot of Incar fans that might not follow any next too closely. So you're a new face to the, to the, to the viewers. So the listeners, we wanna give them a little bit of backstory. This is Jacob, don't call me Jake Abel , um, successful Road to Indie career.
So why don't you just kind of start from the beginning, what got you into racing and just kind of walk through your path a little bit that got you up to this point.
Okay. Yeah, for sure. Jim, there we go. No, but I, I a relatively late start to the game, which is always weird to say, and it's always weird when I'm telling people this. 'cause I started racing when I was like 12 years old instead of when I was, you know, five years old. Um, but it's always just kind of been a, a really fast tracked path ever since then. My first race was weirdly enough, uh, a dirt oval go-kart race in Clark County fairgrounds, Indiana .
Um, we're a long way from there, battle Battle place right now. Yeah, right.
man who hasn't spent just hours around that place.
Right, exactly. But no, it's, we, you know, quickly, quickly switched into, you know, the carting scene of the Zas and the U-S-P-K-S and WKI all the, you know, national carting races around the country. But my carting career was probably only two or three years long where I actually did carting and I did one, you know, I did that, that dirt oval race.
And then the next year we went out to New Castle and started doing some, some club races and stuff, but I think I did one club race, maybe two before I just got thrown into kind of the national scene. So that's sort of been the story of, of my whole entire career is my carding career was short, and then jumping into F four was a pretty quick step.
But that's kind of where the inception of, of Able Motorsports started is when I was in carting and, and trying to look into junior open wheel cars and, and going down that path, my dad sort of saw it as a way to, to start a business, um, instead of just, you know, writing a check and seeing it disappear in the wind and you get a, you get a seat for a year. Actually, I need to go back a little bit. My dad, he grew up a motocross racer his whole entire young career.
Okay. He did that as at a pretty high level, won some amateur national championships at, you know, the Daytona Supercross, some, some pretty big events. And he got, ended up getting hurt really bad later in life doing that. And so when I was growing up, he was racing vintage cars and that is very much a Oh cool, a do it yourself thing and you, you know, you always bring your own trailer and have your own people to, to run the show.
What was he racing? My dad raced footage at one point. What was he, what was he
Driving? So he was doing SVRA, he had a, oh man, a 1968 Alpha Romeo, little, little sports car. And he also had a Shelby Can-Am car, so it was kind of damn a spec series that they had like late in the nineties. Um, so he had one of those as well. And then he actually raced USF 2000 and like two races I think.
Yeah, he did Lu Soil and he did, he did indie, so obviously not vintage, but, but yeah, so once, once I kind of got out of carting, that was a bit more of the idea was to develop this Able Motor Sports. And it's kind of come a long way since our one car F four team in 2017. You know, we did the Indy 500 in, in 2023 and have been a successful race winning Indy X team, you know, for the past year or so now.
And it's, it's gonna stay like that even though I'm now gone, uh, which is, which is really a cool thing. But yeah, that was sort of it. It's just kind of moving up step by step. I'm a true product of the American Open wheel ladder of just kind of chipping away, doing my time, not necessarily over rushing things. You know, I spent time in the ladder with guys like Oliver Askew and Kyle Kirkwood who won it every single level right away immediately.
Um, but those guys were super proven go-kart racers who had been doing it since they were five years old and winning since they were six. So it's like those guys when they came in, they were super ready to go and fast tracked their way up. Whereas me, I was sort of moving my way up slowly and kind of paying my dues a little bit, um, to the point where last year was my third season then in Indie Next. And, you know, it was a really our first proper like championship run at it.
Um, you know, we had a, a good season. It started out a little bit better than it, than it was in the middle and ultimately ended, but it was a, a big step for the team and a a big step for me personally. And that's kind of led us to everything with Dale Coin and, and everything for next year or this year, I guess next, it
Just, it just goes to show that like motorsports is such a unique sport slash business in the sense that, you know, there's, there's no, there's no one way to get there, right? There's so many different avenues. There's so many different paths. There's not one set timeline. There's not, you know, if, if you're able to continually improve and develop and build relationships and, and kind of keep your face there, you're gonna get an opportunity, right?
Like it's, it's, it's hard to stay in the game that long just because we all know how expensive the sport is and, and all of the things that go into it away from driving the race car. But it sounds like what you and your family did is you took an approach that, you know, maximized everyone's strengths, whether it was your dad's history in, in the sport or whether it was your development through the ladder series and you're now one of 22, is it 24, 27? I don't know. There's a lot of,
How do you not know how many cars are on the grid,
Bro? Because it changes all the time. I don't know. So 27 Indy car drivers, which is, which is awesome, man. So a huge congrats. Uh, well
26, so they don't know who his teammate is yet, but
In theory T-B-D-T-B-D. Yeah. So, okay. So you're, you made it to IndyCar, you're here now. What, like what do you, what do you, what are you trying to accomplish? It's great question. Year one, have you driven, have you driven the car yet? Like what, what, what have you done so far?
Yeah, so that's, I just came off of a test about two weeks ago. Um, it was my first test, or I guess it was last week now. It was my first test as an indie car driver. I done couple of, was that the,
The first time you'd driven a car, the Indy car or no? Mm-hmm.
No. So at the end of 2023 I tested with Dale, uh, at Sebring and that went really well, you know, as, as tests go and, you know, we were out there with, with other cars with experience and it went well. But I think with that we always knew I was gonna come back and do Indy next for, for a third year because I felt like I, I did need to prove myself.
I did need to go out, win races, compete for the championship because I did want to be ready when I made that step and, and feel like I belonged when I was there. So that test was, was kind of just to, to dip my toe in the water a bit. We were off the heels of a pretty good sophomore season in India X with some podiums and poles and all that.
And then, um, we did the season and then my second test was at the end of 24 with GSI actually just through our relationship, you know, we developed throughout the past few years, they had a need for a driver, very specific India next driver who had oval experience and I was able to fill that need for them. And that was at Texas. And then my last test was then at Thermal. So yeah, I've had three days in the car kind of spread out over the course of like 14 months.
But, so it wasn't my first day in the indie car, but it was my first day as
An Indy car driver. So, but it was your first day in the hybrid?
Uh, the Texas test was the first day in the hybrid. Got it. Which was, that was a super cool test. Obviously we don't race there a lot anymore, um, at all anymore, but it was, I mean, a nuts track, very, very ballsy , sketchy. And we were on the indie tire, so it wasn't necessarily even flat and we were kind of sliding around everywhere, but yeah, it was, it was still a really cool experience.
What's That's cool man. What's it been like? What's it been like dealing with Dale? I mean, I feel like Dale is this kind of, uh, this kinda like mythical creature in the paddock , you know, like we, we hear from Roger Penske all the time, we hear from Chip Cani and Michael Andretti and, and whatever.
And Dale I feel like doesn't get as much coverage as he should and is sort of this like, he's not aloof like you can find him like if you need to talk to him, but it's, uh, we definitely don't get as much, much airtime with Dale as I think the, the series deserves. 'cause he is a, he's a heck of a character. And we've talked about on the show before.
I mean, I don't know Jacob, how much you know about the history of Dale coin racing and what an absolute stud Dale is that for, I mean, I, I don't know, 30 whatever years now, he's kept cars consistently on the grid. Such an impressive dude in so many ways. But we've heard some funny stories from guys that have raced for him that it can be, uh, an interesting experience kind of dealing with him, especially on like the business side of it and getting deals done.
It's, it's funny you say that because as our deal was kind of coming together, I literally did the most basic thing in YouTube, like, who is Dale Coin ? And then I found the most basic video of, of running through their history and, and all of that. And it is cool. I mean they've, it, it gave me a lot of confidence because they have won, you know, a handful of races in IndyCar and they've been on podiums like very, very recently.
And the amount of drivers that go through there is, we all know it is, is pretty crazy. I mean, you look just in recent history, David Lucas is probably his most recent product and now he is, you know, a, a Penske driver or, or is he, you know, none of us , none of us know, but he's
Jason. Nice.
Right, right. He is got his opportunities, which is, which is awesome. Super happy for him. He's a, he's a good kid, but I mean also Alex Below one of the greatest indie car drivers of, of all time I think already, and it's only however many years he's, he is been in here and Roman Rojan people like that. But yeah, on Dale personally, I don't have too many stories yet. He is a very, like you said, ominous person sort of, but he is also extremely opinionated. He's very connected with everything.
He's in all of the meetings, even though they might not be public, and he seems to have like very, very out there opinions. You know, it's, it's just, it's cool. I think he is a, he is a good guy to work with and he is, he is prides himself in fostering young drivers and young people too.
I think you look at some of the engineers who have gone through his program in the past five years, I think you look through the whole entire IndyCar paddock and so many people have been in that organization at some point in the other or the other. Um, and I think it's, it's cool, he kind of has a bit of a knack for finding those, those people, whether it's drivers or mechanics or engineers or whatever it may be.
Does, does he get frustrated? Have you, you don't,
I know him ask this question, you
Don't know, you haven't been around him that long yet, but like, has he expressed annoyance with the fact that like all of these, some, some of these really great engineers, mechanics drivers come through his doors and then exit through the same door not too many years after? Or does he kind of realize that's his, that's his space and he just looks for the next and best next thing?
Yeah, I, I don't, I don't really know, uh, um, I'd probably be pretty, pretty frustrated, right? If it was, if it were me. Um, but I think, think, I think he does get it and I think he takes a little bit of pride in seeing the guys like Alex Blow Leaf his organization and go win three championships. Like it's, it's crazy 'cause maybe he wasn't able to do that at Dale Coin racing, but Dale I think still feels like he's a part of that success when he sees Yeah. Stuff like that happen
As he should. Right. And the, the other side of Dale is he's, he's always been good at finding young talent, but the other thing is he's got a knack for is kinda giving established guys a second chance. You know, you think back to Christiano Dam in the early two thousands, you think the Sebastian Bordea, Justin Wilson, you know, who, who won him as first race as a team owner.
These were established guys that hit some rocky patch or, you know, the, the, the cruel unfair world that sometimes his motorsports fell up without a ride and, and Dale swooped in and, and gave these guys a shot to win races again, which both Seb and, and Justin did for 'em, which is pretty incredible. Um, you, you talked about your tests last week and that was at Thermal, right? Yep. So one of a handful of tracks, probably not too many tracks that you don't know going into your rookie season.
How'd the test go? Yeah, it
Went okay. I think, you know, you can look at the lap times and get super stressed out about that or, or whatever. I think for us personally, especially with the deal only coming together like a week and a half before, we didn't have a ton of time to prepare just as a whole entire group. You know, I went up there and spent as many days as I could in the shop before, but for us it was really trying to just build that dialogue together, go through, you know, all of all of the little things.
I think it was so different than the tests I've done in the past because it's like, okay, now you're an indie car driver, now we need to prepare for the season, right? It's not just go out and try a couple of these changes, give us a little bit of feedback. It was, we really need to start working on hitting the box in laps out, lapse, you know, tire management, all of that stuff. Fuel save and you throw it in. Yeah, exactly.
And it's, you throw all that in with a track, honestly, like you said, one of the only tracks that I don't know, it, it made it a little bit difficult, but I'm still, you know, fairly confident that we'll, we'll be able to get up to speed come the race weekend and, and all of that. And I think we accomplished a lot of our goals that, that we needed to accomplish.
When you come up from next, you know, most, most next teams are kind of structured in a way that on your car you have what, like two kind of dedicated mechanics mm-hmm . And then kind of one dedicated engineer. Maybe there's an assistant that helps out with all the cars or something like that. And then all of a sudden you're at an IndyCar team where you've got 3, 4, 5 engineers and you've got 8, 10, 12 mechanics.
I mean, from the driver's seat, you know, I, I remember what that was like the first time when you're looking around at all these people are like, <inaudible>, these people are all here for me. I better not screw that up. Like what, what, what, what's it like for you kind of making that transition and, and understanding the scope of what it takes to run an IndyCar compared to what you've been doing in next?
Yeah, it's intense. Um, you know, I had a little bit of an idea just through the, the past couple tests that I did.
You know, the Nessi test in particular, you know, obviously I'm a rookie and I don't have any experience with IndyCar teams or how they're supposed to work or how things are supposed to feel and all of that, but just that one day and the three weeks leading up to that to, to spend with that organization and having been there just for a little bit of time, but that test was very important to them so they, you know, went all in with it and preparing and everything.
And so just to, to get a little bit of that experience with that team almost makes me feel like more of an experienced IndyCar driver. It's like, okay, I know a little bit more of what it's supposed to look like, how things are supposed to flow and, and all of that. So it wasn't completely daunting. Um, I think the biggest thing for this team in particular and the number 51 car in particular, it's like we, you know, spoke to it before.
It's been a bit of a revolving door over at Delco racing in terms of new people all the time. And, and Mitch Davis is now there and he's kind of been able to put his touch on things and bring in a lot of the people that he wants to bring in and stuff. So a lot of that is just getting everyone together and, and sort of on the same page.
'cause it's not like, you know, these other teams where it's been people that have been working with each other for the past, you know, three or four years and then you just get delivered a new driver. It's sort of all of us, you know, learning each other together, which is, it's a cool experience.
It, it reminds me a lot of, of able motorsport and of my time there and kind of having to, to foster a little bit of, of that culture and, and bringing everyone together, sort of being that quarterback guy and, and you know, working with everyone and trying to make sure everyone's getting along and everything.
So I think that's something that I'll be able to, to pull from my whole entire year is, is that experience from Abel and sort of being with a smaller team in the past and, and helping them, you know, move up.
So one question I have, we, we've seen so many of the guys that come out to eat next right? Find immediate, not necessarily success, but are instantly quick pace. Yeah. You know, that that car seems to translate really well in terms of the driving style to the Indy car. Obviously you've been on Firestone Tires now, like do you, do you find that it's pretty easy to, to transition? Obviously it's a big organization, there's a lot more Yeah.
As you just explained things to think about and deal with, but just driving the car and getting the lap time out of it. Do you think it's a pretty simple step from one to the other?
Yeah, honestly I think it's, you know, it's full credit to Indie car and to Firestone for developing a very good junior open wheel car to, to prepare you. I think it's, it's a very good comparison. I think once you get out on the track and are trying to put together a good lap, that's the easy part to be honest.
And that's the part that's like very much comparable to the Indy next car, especially now with the Firestone and, and kind of how you, you know, blend the brake pedal in and all of that and everything is, is very similar with the Cooper Tire. The last one, it was a little bit more of a, a big step, but that was honestly 'cause that tire was just so hard and so hard to drive and it, it kind of kept the step, step pretty similar because it was just easier.
It was getting onto the Firestone has made everything easier and, and more happy. I think the biggest place it compared was probably Texas and the Oval. Um, for whatever reason it's just kind of how you feel about the right rear tire and, and everything like that was probably the biggest, biggest comparison. But yeah, honestly it's a, a relatively seamless transition and the Indy car just does everything better from from top to bottom.
I know, I know it's an old car now and you guys probably, probably think that's, that's weird to hear, but it, it feels really, really good coming from a guy like me who hasn't driven a, a top level open like that,
That's nice to hear because it feels like a piece of <inaudible> most of the
,
All the young kids have the advantage man because they didn't get to drive it when it was really cool. . Well, and
Honestly it's like not even having driven it without the hybrid 'cause everyone's like, oh my gosh, like the car's been so heavy and it's, it's changed everything. It's like, well to me it still feels pretty awesome because it's all relative horsepower than I've used to. Right. A lot more down force, all that.
So yeah, drivers will always find something to complain about Jacob, so Of course, yeah, you'll get down just give it, give it a couple weeks. Yeah, yeah. Give three races is gonna be like, this car's a piece <inaudible> man, I hate this series. Exactly right. . Alright man. So we'll just, we'll leave you with this. You're heading into your rookie season. Um, what, I mean, what's a, what's a realistic goal?
Like I I, you know, I know it's hard to set kind of numerical goals in this sport, but for you, you know, what is gonna be a, a result, and again, not numbers wise, but just what would you like to accomplish by, by the end of the season that by Nashville you're like, all right, 2025 was a good year and some something we can build from.
I think the biggest thing, especially, you know, coming into this team who didn't have the success they wanted last year, and you know, I'm obviously a rookie. I don't have a lot of expectations.
It's, it sounds cliche, but it's just kind of going out there and learning every weekend and trying to, to complete all the laps and not biting off more than we can chew and just, you know, focusing on, on progression instead of like outright results I think is gonna, is gonna be the biggest thing from, from St. Pete all the way to, to Nashville is that'll be the biggest goal.
You know, obviously I think as a driver it's like, okay, I'd love to make one fast 12 or, you know, be rookie of the year or something like that, but I don't want to get caught up trying to chase those goals and end up, you know, lacking lap time or, or crashing the car trying to get, you know, 12th instead of, of 14th or something like that.
I think it's just keeping everything relative and I think the goals are gonna progress so much throughout the season and they're, they're gonna be so dynamic. I mean, if we roll off and my teammate, whoever it is, is P five in the first race, I think that's gonna change my goals a lot throughout the year. I'm, I'm no longer gonna be happy with 15 or, or whatever it is.
So I think a lot of it's just being patient and, you know, adapting to whatever it is and trying to extract the most out of it, whatever weekend it is and, and whatever the car I'm delivered and whatever the package we have is, I think if we have a P 15 car finishing P 15, but, you know, God forbid we do have a, a really good car one weekend, it's like, okay, it's time to show up and, and get that result.
So yeah, I'd say that's the biggest thing is just trying to, to maximize whatever we have weekend and week out, whatever it is.
Very cool. All right, well thank you so much for coming on Buddy. Um, very excited for you. Congratulations. I know it's a, it's a cool thing, uh, it's a cool experience, uh, for everybody listening. You know, you wanna follow this kid? He is, he's a future star of the IndyCar series. Where can they find you? Like what's your, what's your give them everybody your socials and, and everything like that?
Yeah, it's just Jacob Abel, Jacob Abel racing on, on everything. I'm, I'm trying to be better at social media as we all are just posting as much as we can. It's worst. It's
So hard. It says on Jake Abel,
Not Jake Abel. Right. Jake Abel. Got
It. Yeah, right on.
All of my friends call me, call me Jab or Abel or so honestly, no one calls me Jacob, but if someone asks me it's, that's, that's what I say. Oh,
That's fair man. Cool. Thank you. I you, I like Jab Jabil's. Cool. . I like that.
It's, it's been such a funny nickname because
You would like it Hinge .
It's everybody in my whole entire life has come up with that on their own. It's like first racing people figured it out, but then I went to college and they all adapted that on their own and figured it out on their own. It's, everyone's just seemingly figured it out on that. That's funny. I don't go around saying, oh, everyone calls me Jab Ball, but
Yeah. Yeah. Well look, we we're gonna have you on kind of midseason to see, uh, do, do your, your Midseason report card and see how you're enjoying First Crack at the IndyCar IndyCar series. And,
And I'm going to name this episode. Everyone calls him
. Yes, absolutely. Absolutely . Alright buddy, thanks so much. Right on. We'll see you soon on, man. Thank you. This has been off track with Hinch and Rossi. Off Track is part of the Sirius XM Sports Podcast Network. If you enjoyed this episode and want to hear more, please give a five star rating and leave a review. Subscribe today, wherever you stream your podcasts. We are at Ask Off Track on Twitter and Instagram.
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