Punisher: One Last Kill

Uh, casting thing, not about this, just something I've found out today when I was looking up something else on the internet and I was and I was reading about an actor who's related to another actor, and I was like, oh my god, I'll random is that?

Okay, we'll get to it.

There's not really a good way to segue into it.

Yeah, no, I feel that, all right, Just remind me or I'll try to remind me.

I'll just probably just bring it up.

Yeah, yeah, in and off topic fashion exactly. Yeah. You ever watch these Marvel flicks?

You got good volume? Yeah, I'm good.

Yeah, okay, you ever watch these Marvel flicks, whether it's the TV shows, the movies whatever, or the special presentation special presentations. With this Punisher thing we're watching today, how much impact do you think we, as the viewers, the Cretans as I oftentimes describe us, have an impact on what ultimately ends up happening, Like when we want to see the X Men brought in, when we want this

Can't Mr? If I told you this, and I heard this from somebody, it was a producer or a director or somebody they're talking about. It might have been Actually, it might have been Figy. I don't think it was Figy, but it was somebody, somebody prolific in their field. And they said that if you start if the how did this go? If you make movies for the public, or if you give the people what they want see I'm

It or what's his name as mister Fantastic in The Doctor Strange Krazinski right, Like, I feel like there are moments where they just scour Channing Tatum as dambits. Like there's moments.

Although the Channing Tatum with Gambit thing that wasn't like a that was.

But it's fan appeasement, you know something. But it was going to happen.

That specific one. I don't think it was because I think he actually was going toe. That was for a while.

Then Fox twentieth Century Fox went belly up and that kind of was the end of that.

You know, I spent one night at the bar with my buddy who is also a huge superhero comics fan or whatever, and we went through and we tried to cast the X Men like you know, like the this is when the X Men came out, right, but obviously that didn't include all the X Men. Sure, yeah, And so we were like, okay, who's gonna play Juggernaut? Who's gonna you know, and we're doing like Magnetos and uh, and we got to Gambit and then you know who

He would, yeah at that point.

At that and not anymore. Obviously you're back to ever like, how is McConaughey not playing Gamut? So anyway, Yeah, I mean I think it goes and was the what did the Krasinski thing really affect the plot at all at all? Was that was more appeasement, like you're.

Now yeah, and then going the opposite direction, Ralph Bohner, who we all thought was going to be.

Uh, that was just quick silver. That was a troll job. That was rage bait, as my kids would say.

Yeah, I found out, and it was us, us waiting and waiting and waiting for Mephisto to show up, and then only for him to show up in like the least Watch the Marvel thing. Ever, was it really not? It's not very was No.

Did you at what I don't even know. We've talked about this. Did you at what point did you realize that was Mephisto?

Yeah, we did talk about it. It took a while because I wasn't expecting it at all, and so, like, I really didn't put two and two together. I can't remember specifically because to be frank h, iron Heart was very forgettable outside of the Mefisto stuff.

Yeah.

So, I mean that's a problem in and of itself. And it sounds like I'm gonna say I hate this. I thoroughly enjoyed the Punisher, the last kill. It wasn't what I was expecting in this. I think you had because you are of the two of us, you always come in much more thoroughly prepared than I do in terms.

Of Sometimes that's a detriment.

Though I agree, that's like it's an active choice. It's not like I'm being lazy. It's like, I don't want to know any extra details about this before I go and see it, because people are too good at predicting stuff and I don't want to come across that kind of stuff. So, like, I went into yesterday expecting a quasi feature length film focusing on this iteration of the Punisher played by I always say his last name wrong.

I think it was forty nine. Yeah, like with and I was waiting for the spoiler alert. No no, uh no credits.

No credits. But like I will say, and this will be quasi spoiler filled. As we said off the air, there's nothing to really spoil, but we're going to talk about the plot in its intimate details because there's basically two facets to this story. There's sad Frank Castle and then there's angry Frank Castle, and that that's basically.

What we're dealing with. You know, I think Angry Frank Castle had to come out because of the of the plot here. That okay, so let's let's get into it. Yeah, to just just before we do, I want to echo something you said. This The whole thing felt extraneous, Like I got done watching it, I'm like, why did they make this?

I think, I well, we'll get into why I think they made it, but it doesn't connect to the story at all.

No, I mean even like before you and I were talking, we didn't even know for sure at what point this in the chronology, we didn't know when it was. Yeah, and we think they know, but I feel like a real world they got now you think you know, but you have no idea or not real world? What was that? Uh? True true? What was it called? Was my diary? Yeah?

No, no, yeah, it wasn't my diary true life.

Or true true life.

I can't I know what you like, you unlocked the memory, but I don't remember what the name of it was.

But anyway, so it felt extraneous because this was basically the story of Frank Castle. Like what was great about it is you didn't need to see Dared Devil Born Again. You didn't need to see The Punisher the television series. Now, and you didn't even really need to know who the Punisher was, because in forty nine minutes they put this together where you understand this is a man who clearly

No?

Oh, my god, then we have to talk about this. So he he basically is fighting between what do I do with my life now that my family, my whole life is gone. Do I fight back against the people that did this or people like this, you know, do I fight back? Or do I just try to live my own life? He obviously still had PTSD. Then we enter into the second act, which was we were introduced to the antagonist of the story, and then the third

And this is a theme that.

Was I don't know where it was going with that, but I just wanted to say, like this to your whole I pulled out a single comic punisher. That's kind of what this was. It was just another chapter in this larger story. You know, yes, but but it wasn't like defining at all. There's nothing there was nothing that changed the story arc. There's nothing that changed.

Oh see, there was one thing that stuck. I love it very thoroughly.

I love it here.

And that's why I said I want to be able to talk spoilers because this is the last scene of the show that I'm about to describe. Not technically relevant to the plot in any way of the show, but the last scene. Nevertheless, he comes out decked out in his punisher gear. Yeah, and in my opinion, and correct me if I'm wrong, because I've seen the show. I loved the show. Haven't seen it in a while, it's been like seven years. Yeah, and I didn't rewatch it

And that's a valid point, but I still think you could, as the viewer, you could take it to the opposite and say, ultimately, what's the last thing we see is him wasting this guy. Yes, so you could be you could you could also take from that being that, Okay, maybe there's been some evolving here, but he's still who he is. Yes, because ultimately the last thing we see as the viewer, and that the that the that the screenwriter and the director wanted us to see, was him killing a guy.

But so that's that's having your cake and eating it too. Then right, we can.

Watch Spider Man, Well.

He didn't kill anyone there, and then the next time he kills him when it's like, ah, well, he's still so like he can go a full nine two hour movie and not be the real punisher and you don't feel like you broke character. And then the second you see him in Daredevil's season three and he is just waxing people again, and you're like, well, we we've we've crossed a rubicon here and you know, now people gotta get whacked.

I I really wish he would, and I hope it was a scheduling thing that he wasn't in season two, because season two of Born Again was more so than season one, was this fight, internal fight that Matt Murdoch had about how he doesn't want to take lives you know, even though he should when when Bullseye is begging him to and he doesn't, when Karen Page is is incredulous that he's not any old.

Buck and Daniels situation. That's across all those characters exactly. They're struggling.

And Frank Castle was just like, you know, black and white, no gray area. And we saw that a little bit in season one, right, and I thought season two would have been even better.

But whatever, Yeah, and he was for the record, this special in no way addresses why he wasn't in season two exactly. And can you remember so is the Nucci family was the scene? So that's like the main antagonist.

I was going to ask you, is it Nucci or Ganucci? Nucci? It is Nucci? Okay?

Were they the antagonists in either of the seasons, Like we're all those deaths of the show.

No, I think this is fresh now, it's I believe it's comic lore that Frank Castle hilled these I didn't realize he killed her husband. I thought he just killed the sons. Sure, so so that was new to me. So Maganucci do you know who played Maganucci special? Judith Light? Do you know who Judith Light? Is Judith Light played Angela opposite Tony Danza on Who's the Boss? Oh wow? Yeah, Now I would not have recognized her at all. Uh And then and I knew she was in this playing

And I barely watched that show, So I don't think I ever would have made like, there's no amount of I would.

I couldn't. I couldn't name one other thing that she's in. Yeah sure, yeah yeah.

And so like obviously though, and like full full uh full disclosure here, Like I love the Thomas Jane Punisher movie. I loved the uh what's that dude's name? The Punisher war Zone. I was surprised how much I ended up liking that movie. I actually took me a couple of times. But I'm not gonna claim to be the biggest expert

I would have met. Yeah, I don't know how they're gonna work because in the comics, again, I'm probably as well versed or not as well versed as you are, so both of us are kind of a blind a little bit when it comes to Punisher Cannon. But it's my understanding that she is a super villain from Marvel with her the main she's mainly been the enemy of the Punisher, sure, like that's who who she battles.

The more it strikes me out, like the Falcones are like always screwing around with Batman like in the background, and it's like, but realistically, Scarecrows the main threat, but like the Falcones are off jerking around somewhere and it's like, all right, I gotta be aware that they're doing stuff. But this is definitely tier six stuff compared to the obvious thing going on here. That's kind of what she strikes me as. But I feel like they really went

Bullshits?

It seems like we got plenty of kills coming out way here.

In the comic sma Nucci and I can't remember exactly how it happens. I don't know if it's a bomb or something, but somehow punisher her he either chops them off off or something happens and there's an explosion and she loses both her arms and legs, so she's basically a torso in the comic Spider. And then at the end when he finally kills her, there's like a flaming house or something, and she like crawls out of it, and all she can do is bite him on the leg.

Because that's what else she gonna do.

Sure, and he just stares down at her, and he just kicks her body into the fire and she burns alive. That's how that's how Mannucci reaches her end in the Punish Your comic.

Yeah, I hope they take it there. I don't think they have the guts to do that, but I'm here hoping that that's where this ultimately ends up here.

But I have to talk about the sound. Oh yeah, hit me with it. This is interesting. I was watching this in my basement on Disney Plus, and my my son sleeps through anything, but my daughter and my wife are both light sleepers. And I kept getting phone calls from my wife, can you turn that down? Can you turn that down? And I couldn't because there was something messed up with the sound on on I don't know

Yeah, and you didn't pick up on this, so I'll be honest with you now that you're mentioning it, I realized. So after it ended, I just threw something else on Disney Plus on to go to bed too, and it was one of the you know, I, oh, it was X Men Apocalypse.

Nice.

I threw X Men Apocalypse on, and I remember I threw it on and then I went to the bathroom to go and brush my teeth, and I had to actually walk out while I was brushing my teeth to turn it down because I was like, man, that is blowing out my ear drums. I was like, was I listening to it that loud?

Yeah?

And it didn't register with me the entire time, And maybe I didn't notice what the explosions made my neighbors fricking hate me.

I have no idea, but I.

Noticed it after I put literally anything else on. I'm like, man, I really had that volume cranking.

So I went on X like while this is going on, because I was getting really annoyed, and I'm like, when man Nucci's talking, it's like you can't and like describing, like what happened, you know why she's so mad. I couldn't. I couldn't. I couldn't understand everything. So I went on X and other people were complaining about the sound as well. Interesting, like this was not my TV, this was not my

Oh we we filmed that night Walker battle super Dark, so it felt like you were in the battle. Yeah, okay, great. I would have loved to be able to see what was happening, and this is kind of a similar.

I mean, I don't know, I know it wasn't just me, and if this was a decision by the director or whoever. Yeah, I think it was a bad one. Yeah, and I feel like I just I feel like it ruined some of the enjoyment for me, and.

I found the entire post traumatic stress like I mean, you know me, I like the psychological stuff. And when they were doing the stuff with like the apparitions, and it was like, wait, are you really here?

Of course I'm here.

No, it turns out they're not here, and like around and around and around, and I thought it was very well done, and I think they went out of their way. They touched on this in the finale to the first season of Daredevil Born Again. But there's a certain element of people that have latched onto the Punisher that aren't the best people, and they take all the worst parts out of the Punisher character. And I think a lot of Punisher lore much like the exactly what do you

I think it comes back to I don't you know Peter Parker's whole thing is with great power comes great responsibility, And I think there's a certain and that's why it's gonna be cool to see him and punish her in yeah, in Hulk, not in Hulk, but most of Punisher because Hulk is totally different. But what's the name of the movie, Brand New Day. It's gonna be interesting to see those guys because they have you know, with great power comes

He chooses life.

You know what I mean. And and so I think that there's a certain sense of, like, you know what, what has happened to him, nobody deserves. But at the same time, I think that he feels given in the same way Peter Parker, like how it happened at the end of No Way Home. He has nobody now, right, Yeah, Frank Castle has nobody.

And I didn't even put that together, but that's definitely gonna thematically try into the movie. You're absolutely right.

And I mean, I'm I'm sure they don't have each other. I don't think they look at each other like that. No, absolutely, I think they look at like look I've I've clearly somebody has put me into this place and given me this life, and I'm supposed to do something with it. I can't just sit because neither one of them is the type that would sit idly by and feel sorry for themselves. You know. It's either it's either I'm going to do as much good as I can, or I'm

Yeah, which is a theme they've revisited or visited in The Thomas Jane Punisher as well. That's what happens after he killed John Travolta. He's like, well, why else do why am I here? And then he just like in the show, he remembers Rebecca Rene Stamos and those two dweebs that are his neighbors, and like the fond memory. She's like, ah, you know what, And in this one he manages he can't save his own family, but he can save other families and that's kind of the growth

There's been and none are coming to my head right now, But there's been a lot of people superheroes that are like everything everybody I get close to or everybody I touch, bad stuff happens. Yeah, which is you know, a reason why you wear the mask, right, so to protect those people or whatever. But I mean, there is no character at least that I can think of. Maybe I'm wrong, Maybe you'll call me out on this. Yeah, there's no

Easy, absolutely not. And I think the reason it feels so fresh and unique because what you're describing is not unique to comics. But I'll tell you the other characters that go through exactly what you're describing. Thor goes through that, Dad dies, mom dies, had to kill his sister, brother dies, best friend dies, half the world gets snapped out of existence. Wolverine goes through that Jane Jane dies, Yes, exactly Wolverine goes through that had to kill Jean Gray.

By the way, just just real quick, Yeah, Loki died twice.

Technically three times technically Wolverine, Wolverine, though he has to kill Jean Gray, he watches Charles Xavier die. By the end of Logan, everybody's gone. Superman, you, you, all of these characters. The reason you have to do it this way is because the characters themselves can't feel pain. Wolverine always thors a demigod. Superman is basically a god on earth.

It's like the.

Realistically, it's a weird comparison to make. But he's like Jigsaw, not the villain Jigsaw from fucking Saw yea. Like when he got diagnosed with cancer, he drove his car off a cliff to kill himself, and he pulls himself out of the wreckage. He's got a giant piece of metal sticking out of his abdomen, and he found the desire to live. And in this special Yesterday, he goes from having the gun in his mouth to like, I'm gonna

What I love it? What do you think because I never really I mean, I know the moment where he starts fighting back, What do you think that was? What do you think ultimately drove him to be like I'm I'm gonna not only I'm gonna keep going, I'm going to unleash hell on these people.

I don't know if he's petty enough, but to me and the dialogue, what stuck out. Was the last thing ma Nucci says to him is when you breathe your last breath. No, it was the Nucciese that sent you there. And in my mind, I'm like, is he sitting there thinking like if I'm gonna die, it's gonna because yeah, and that was how I read that, And so right there he was like, well, no you won't. Good luck

They are normal people. I mean, they're they're they're from a crime family obviously, and I got the I got the feeling that they they were losing their power already when he started.

Yes, yes, I agree with you, and all these people just kind of felt like, like normally in these kind of movies, like even the Henchmen have like a general evilness vibe to them, whereas this it just felt like I normally drive a truck, but I also a'm affiliated with the mob, and now I have a knife and I'm gonna kill the punch of Like it didn't feel like a villain. It just felt like normal dudes living

I was too into it because all of a sudden, like as he's I think that final shot is a shot of I think we're looking up at him mm hmm. Yeah, and I was like, oh god, no, no, no, yeah, and then it ended. You know, I was like, I was really and it was I don't know, dude, it kind of I wish this would have been a feature length film.

I agree.

I think there is more story to tell. They they did what they could in forty nine minutes. It got the job done. Initially I was I was really ticked off. Yeah I was. I was super upset at what. I'm like, that's it. Really.

There was too much hype for it.

Maybe too, but I mean we always knew it was gonna be fifty minutes, like we always like, I didn't oh, I mean it was yeah, we talked about this. I said, yeah, you.

Said it's not a movie, but I'm like, oh, okay, so it'll be like an hour and ten minutes, Like it won't be because even like episodes of Daredevil are over an hour, like this is. This was such a like I'm like, man, you've been advertising this for a year and a half, creating all this buzz about it, and like it really doesn't answer anything like you highlighted. It's just like it exists, and it exists in a nice way. It was a good story.

Yeah, it was fine. It was a fine story.

Much like I know, I should have looked it up. I meant to look it up. It's just like the black and white thing that Marvel did, like I always.

Saw the weird thing. Yeah, this was the third one. The first one they did was that monster thing with I don't know, I can't remember that Gabriel Garcia. What's his name? I have no idea, Gabriel Gail Garcia or something. I can't remember what his name was. He was the star of that. Yeah, and who's who's the star? I didn't look up the cast. Oh well he was the main guy obviously. The you know, as all these monster hunters are convening in.

Gail Garcia Bernal.

Okay there, Jack Russell Bernal, I think yeah. So anyway, that was the first one, you know what. The second one was Guardians of the Galaxy Holiday Special. Oh. I didn't watch it. It came out four years ago.

I did watch it, and it actually had a lot more production value than I was expecting to be frank, And.

You know what was great about that. The big reveal I think that we got in it was that we found out that Mantis and star Lord our brother and sister.

Yeah, and they mentioned that there's an Offhan mentioned in Guardians three, right, that kind of like pays off on that a little bit, which is not which is if you watched it, you knew, right exactly. But yeah, and all of these are inoffensive. But you know what, I didn't rewatch either of those, and I'm probably not going to rewatch this either, just because it came, it went. It was entertaining, and maybe that says something about the connectivity of Marvel and what it does to our brains

Story for what it is. So is James Gun going to have a separate Batman though? Yeah, Wow, that won't be confusing.

At all, I'm saying, And like you and I are into this, Like I'm sitting there trying to explain it to my dad. I'm like, this is gonna be where you check out, isn't it? Like this is this is gonna be where we've hit a limit where it doesn't even matter.

I did see just real quick. Yeah, the Batman is now Batman Part two or the Batman two, whatever they're calling it. It's not gonna come out till next year. Makes it the longest between any Batman sequel. That's actually crazy when you think about it, because you think about how long we waited for Dark Knight Rises after Dark Knight. Yeah, that was a long time. This is going to be longer.

Yeah, it's not or I was even thinking from Mister Freeze Batman to Batman Begins feels like a long one.

Well, but that that was that was longer. But I'm saying like the connected like because because Batman Begins was not a sequel chair to but what was that called Batman and Robin. Yeah, I'm saying like in the same whatever you want to call it.

You know, there was supposed to be a fifth one, but Batman and Robin did so poorly they scrapped it, and scaret Crow is going to be the bad guy and he was going to make all the villains were gonna come back visions and like Jack Nicholson and Danny DeVito and all these guys, and Batman was going to be fighting all of his cast I don't think. I think Batman and Robin was such a dumpster fire. They were like, you know what, people hate this superhero stuff. Let's just move on.

So the first one, first two were.

Keaton, yeah, and more importantly Tim Burton, and then they got rid of Burton, went Schumacher and then and.

Then the third one was Val Kilmo yeah, which.

I have a soft spot for for Jim Carrey, and then you know, kind of goes off the I thought he did great. I stand bye. He's the best Riddler still. I mean, who else was there? I mean there was Paul Paul Dan Compared was like, oh he killed it. I'm like, honestly, I think Jim Carrey did. I like the Jim Carrey version.

Yeah, I do too. There is there is more of a I don't know. I don't think Ridler was his Riddler was so dark, and I mean everything was dark in that yeah, in that Batman movie. But like, I think Riddler from the comics was a little touched a lot touched in the head, and that's how Jim Carrey played it, you know, Yeah, and so I don't. I just thought that was true. It's more cartoony, but I think it's more true to Yeah, it.

Was comic bookie, And I mean Jill Schumacher very famously would go around set saying, remember, we're filming a live action cartoon. He kept saying that all the time because the first the studio was so mad after Batman returns there like, we cannot sell toys for any of this shit? What were you thinking making the penguin what he was? You're out of here? And like they went out of their way to really ham up the colorfulness of the third and fourth one, in my opinion, to its detriment.

I suppose? And then what happens like every everything after that becomes dirty and grimy in DC. Oh yeah, for all the stuff that came out out, yeah, well I should say everything, but most of it really funny.

Last aside, and then we can stop talking about Batman. Have you seen the picture of the Trivial Pursuit question card that went viral? Because it's asking which one of these actors did not play Batman? Okay, Adam West, Michael Keaton, Val Kilmer, George Clooney, Christian Bale or Ben Affleck all of them play. And you're sitting there and you're like, what kind of TYPEO is this? And it came out in twenty thirteen, the card dish.

Oh my god, how weird is that? That is wild? Yeah? Right, that's not ai. That's not something that a leit viral.

And I'm sitting there and I'm like what Because I didn't read the comments, I'm like, what's this bullshit? I'm like, all these people like, you're not You're not making me second guess myself. Then like all of a sudden, I'm reading comments are like they need to make a new one and have it say Robert Pattinson. I'm like, I still don't get it. He's also Batman. Yeah, and uh and now and now and then I've put it together there.

But I just thought that was very that is that is wild?

Ye?

What was I going to say now about? Oh? I think I think he was on Fallon or Conan. I can't remember when Affleck got officially cast and became public that he was going to be playing Batman, and the Affleck or whoever the host was a little late night just said to him, well, did they give you any advice after you know this, after everybody knows they're gonna

Not yet, not only will they have an issue like it is not only is it no one perfect, but every Batman casting has always been an issue. And outside of George and Val Kilmer, there's newspaper articles you can find them from the eighties and it's like, really, the guy that played mister Mom is going to be Batman? Yeah, and like yeah, not only he's gonna be Batman, he's gonna be fucking kill it. Yeah, we're kidding here, and just down the list all the way to oh are

Now. I don't think a whole lot of people ripped the Christian Bale one.

I think people were just starved for a new Batman at that point because the last one. I don't think anyone had any expectations. He kind of revitalized what I think people were expecting.

And you know, the other thing too, is like I don't I mean, yeah, he was Batman in that movie, but so much of that movie he wasn't really Batman. He was he was mostly Bruce Wayne, which is I think is a little bit different way to do it.

And hot take. I think he's the worst actual Batman right. That Batman voice was stupid. It's very iconic. Yeah, like we all mock it, and like I still randomly will just anytime someone says, what's the difference, I always will just immediately we're hockey pat. Yeah, that was like immediately, like that's just where I go to. But like it's it's dumb. And I think Ben Affleck, who takes the most crap for being Batman, was actually a very good one.

Okay, but but didn't you I mean, wasn't the case. I mean it's not like they canceled it. I mean there was already cracks in the Like Ray Fisher had a big issue with I came out, was it Snyder or whoever it was. He had a big issue with DC and so, and that was well before they had canceled it, Like there was something, there was something going on with the production company and him. I feel like Henry Cavell had an issue too.

All Right, We're going down this rabbit hole and I'm glad we're here.

So so I feel like the cracks were already, like if they were to continue this, I don't even know if those two actors were to come back. And oh and then Ezra Yeah yeah, Ezra Miller was an issue. Oh my god, you know, and they couldn't they couldn't bring him back.

Yeah, although they made that flash movie after the fact, like they already knew that everything, like, no, let's uh, let's keep this.

It wasn't it already a lot of it already filmed at that point. I don't know. I thought it was.

I feel like Covid aft with that quite a bit.

But but then the Lobo thing never came out until after it had Yeah, okay, so they still had Mama. I will totally what it's still done. Oh my god, where was she going?

Yeah, I will say I think the entire DCU was just snake bitten. I think it's ridiculous that they canceled it. I am not anti. There's a lot of people online that are very pro you can either be James Gunn or Zack Snyder, Like no, you can absolutely like both of their visions, And that is where I file myself into. I thought what Zack Snyder was doing. I'll be honest, and some of you listening might scoff at this. I think he was creating superhero movies for smart people in

That Civil War was more star.

Studded, exactly, and Zack Snyder presented it in a way that expected the audience to be smarter. Like, me, as a massive Batman fan, is like, why is Batman branding freaking villains that he's putting in jail, or like when the Flash kind of appears as as a time warp through a portal and he's like, you gotta stop.

Did they ever pay that off?

No, because we killed the freaking youth.

So do we know what it was supposed to be.

I'm pretty sure in a future Justice League movie they were gonna do some time travel stuff and then he was going to appear in that movie and all these plebeians would be like, Oh, I get it now.

But a lot of he's referring to though, where he's like, she's the key was that.

Lois laying and Superman was obviously off the rails again and they were gonna kind of do all this. He had the James Todd Joker storyline in there, with the hahaha jokes on you, like all of these things, And if you're looking at there, you don't know who Jason Todd is. You don't know that the Flash can time travel.

Over was leto the Joker in that. Yeah, okay, so what was the scene where they're running and hiding from Superman? It was like the dystopian.

Yeah, well in the in the extra long in the Snyder.

Cut Snyder of the Justice League.

Oh yes, and they were gonna put that in there, and they probably would have confused audiences more.

Yeah, that was a cool scene.

Like, that was such a cool scene. Batman's dropping f bombs. Like there's a lot to like in that there, And like, I I think we Americans just absolutely squashed the DCU. I think James Gunn will do fine. I think it could be even better than what Zack Snyder had out there. But it'll be brighter that I can tell you. Yeah, it'll be cheekier.

Yeah, we already see like this, this Superman cracks wise much more so than Henry Cable. Oh.

There were times where I felt like I was just watching Guardians of the Galaxy. Really not even the worst thing to feel.

You know. You know what I like too about gun is he's he's kind of he's not a master, but he's so good at bringing these like not minority characters that's not what I want to be. Lesser, no, lesser known. Yeah, and like I mean, who's who's the one guy in Superman.

Mister terrific, Mister terrific?

Never heard of him, you know, and he's and he's like this hugely powerful guy, which is great. Liner. We were talking about this the other day when when Guardians of the Galaxy was going to be coming out and and everybody's like, this is going to fail. You clearly have jumped the shark, Marvel. You have bitten off more than you can chew a tree, a woman talking raccoon, give me a break, and they made three of them.

Yeah, it's crazy, he does. I'm absolutely here for it. But I mean, we that was a bit of a DC tangent here. I'm just starving. I actually read so well, we will you know what. I'll bring that up at the end of the conversation because it ties into the next movie that we're going to see. But I am starved for superhero content, and that's why I was excited to break this down for you. And what's funny is we are two minutes away from eclipsing the runtime of

Oh yeah, that this could be the podcast could be longer than the actual art.

Yes, because I mean, I'll be real with you, man, what else have we not said about what happened? There's twenty minutes offc twenty minutes of raw violence.

I mean to encapsulate it. This is just like I said earlier, this is just simply another child. It's a longer chapter. But in the Punisher story, it hit. It plays all the hits. It plays all the hits, and you don't need to see it. I'm assuming you know, yeah, brand new day. I'm clearly I don't think anything happened in here that is going to catch Daredevil or Jessica Jones or any of those people off guard. And oh you mean Frank Castle went nuts and he killed sixty people. Yeah,

I'm assuming so, but we don't know that. I'm hopeful he's not a casualty of this big reset at the end of twenty seven, Like I could use four more seasons of John Burnenthal as the Punisher. Yeah, like a lot of these guys. Like I was thinking about it when I watched the finale of Daredevil, And as much as I love the series and I think Donofrio is a wonderful Kingpin, I'm like, I feel like we've gone

I don't know what they're going to do in season three. I think it's pretty clear Fisk is going to be the antagonisty.

Yeah, absolutely and absolutely.

We have seen him in Echo. Well, you know, did you watch Act I didn't watch e Go No, sorry, Yeah, we have seen him rise up in Echo. We have seen him rise up even further and see Wanta born again to where he's at the pinnacle in season two. Now he's falling. We have to you know, a guy a super he is a super villain, like a guy like that. You have to see him get back up and then rise to power again.

Ah but you see, I feel like if he comes back, it'll be like, uh, what's a what's a what's a good example of this? It'll be like in the Transformers movies, or like in the first one, they were like freaking, what's.

The main bad one? Megatron?

Like pretty threatening, huhh, and then they kill him, so like they're not gonna make you fight Megatron again. It's like we're gonna bring Megatron back, but also Megatron's actually scared of the fallen Yeah, and like that is who

Have we heard any casting info about Matt Murdoch being in Brand New Day? No? Okay, But as I've stated in that scene in the trailer, yeah, I know. So if he does appear there, right, maybe season three of Born Again takes off from where Brand New Day ended, and I don't know, I don't know where you go, like, you know, because he's in prison. Yeah, so obviously he'd have to get out of prison to be in Brand New Day, right, No, dude.

I would watch eight seasons of there. There's actually a Green Green Arrow storyline that's exactly that he gets put in prison, and it was an entire, entire comic arc because all the people he put in prison are in prison, and now he's also in prison, and they're like, Oh, I've got a bone to pick with you, Like if you told me the first four of eight episodes are Daredevil in jail, like keeping the Anti Vigilanti task Force

Yeah, I would check it out. But my point is Brand New Day comes out, Yeah, and he's in prison right now, So I Spider Man clearly doesn't have the power to break him out, or does he. No, he doesn't.

You know what, then maybe he won't be you know, you might have just logiced your way into me thinking he's not going to be in Brand New Day.

But the other aspect of that, you could still be right about that trailer where I mean Hult could be there, or you know, whoever could be there.

Oh yeah, someone's there, Frank Castle, Someone's there, whoever may be Hopefully there's other cameos that we don't know about.

But Spider Spider Pig John Malaney from Its Yeah Spider.

We'll have to check too, because like, obviously that movie will supersede anything else coming that week. But I have the worst kind of feeling that that and The New Evil Dead are coming out the same weekend, and oh is that going to piss me off?

That's going to piss me off? The the setup for this Brand New Day, I thought the Punisher would one last kill, would set the table for it, and it just seems we got a very serious, tormented dark Punisher, whereas the stuff we've seen in the trailer for Brand New Day, Yeah, is he's annoyed with this kid and very talkative and you know what I mean, Yeah, it's it seems like two different Punishers.

Yeah, I'm here for it.

Though.

I love those conflicts of style when they would kind of marry them together, So I'm I'm excited to see where it kind of goes from there because they've already kind of played with this relationship with Daredevil that Dar Devil's like the catholic that would never murder punishers, the guy that's like, actually I'll murder right now. Try me, Yeah, and like will he bring him over. I don't think

The other not that this is a pushback, but you know, we have to consider this sort of metamorphosis that he's undergoing in this and maybe it'll be a mental one as well as a physical.

Right and the Spider the Man Spider version of him might want to kill people more than the Spider Man version of him, which I'm sure will be part of it. Yeah, we're predicting these themes that are absolutely going to be the three threads like this is nice, this feels good.

This is it's going to be fun when that comes out, and we got to wait till July. Yeah. Yeah, so we're still like two months away. That's probably less than two months now, right.

Yeah, yeah, roughly almost exactly two months. I feel like it's like July twelfth, and we're currently at May thirteenth, so I feel like we're exactly two months away. And that brings me to let's review, because I do one. I'm at a seven, yeah, six and a half. Yeah, so I definitely enjoyed it. Yeah, it was fine.

I immediately after I was like, well, this is a three, and then I started thinking about it more. Yeah, and like, okay, why would I give it a three? And I'm like, you know, I can't because what it was.

I definitely didn't hate watching I was just pissed there wasn't more of it, which is typically a good sign for things, but and I think part of the problem is bulky. This kind of ties into it. This is the longest stretch since the MCU was created without an MCU movie.

Really is what we're dealing with right now.

Last Fantastic four till July.

Maybe Holy cows almost a full year.

Right, think about it, we've been doing we we reviewed Fantastic Four for this trailer, and we haven't done a comic book anything. This is the most recent comic book thing we've done since then.

So so, but I would say the difference is you're having all these television shows.

Yeah, sure, and that helps me a little. But I I the reason I bring that up is because do you know what's duking it out for number one in the box office? In an erics I saw a friend of mine post be like you know, in the longest stretch without MC without comic book movies, because realistically DC is not really pumped like I think the last thing we've seen is Superman, right, so Fantastic Force actually closer

Movies at the time. They should have called it the Devilwaar's Product too, colon Mortal Kombat.

Yeah, right, exactly. It's like what was the Barbenheimer? Like Barbheimer one of those kind of things going on right now with these two movies. I actually got a text from a friend of mine who hates big budget action and always talks shit on superhero movies to me. He's like, I get you love them, It's just not for me. He's like, I've watched plenty of them. I hate how into it everybody is, he texted me, and I want to pull this out because I really want to paint a picture.

He even asked me.

He was like, did you use to play the Mortal Kombat and what did you think of the first one? Is what he texted me because he was going to see with his wife. I said, Smash Brothers is the only fighting game I ever played consistently, and I thought the first one was fine, it was on par with the nineteen ninety seven Mortal Kombat movie in my opinion.

To which he was did they only make one back?

Then they made a second Annihilation? But that's so yeah, that's right, that's lation that's available on HBO.

Check it out.

But then he went on say, yeah, I never really played the games. I'd say that I just watched the best video game movie I've ever experienced, okay, coming out of Mortal Kombat two.

And this is the fourth Mortal Kombat movie, right.

Yes, okay, there's some off brand stuff. There was a TV show featuring sub Zero which I never saw, but it was very, very very low budget. Okay, so it wasn't something that I was interesting.

So how long was it between Annihilation and then the first you know, Mortal Kombats? Oh? God, twenty five years? Okay, so it was twenty five years later they came out with this. When did the first mort like the third movie come out? How long have we been waiting for this? Equal?

And now I'm lost? What third movie?

Okay? Oh that I have no idea. So the third movie which was which was Mortal Kombat? No, no, no, no, no, okay, no, we're not talking last you. Okay, there is Mortal Kombat that came out in the nineties.

Yeah, ok The second one came out like a year later.

Annihilation came out a year later. From Annihilation to the next Mortal Kombat movie, which was just called Mortal Kombat.

Yeah right, yeah, how long was That's what I was saying, was close to twenty twenty five years?

Yeah, okay, so then that movie comes out. Now we have Mortal Kombat too. See his last two movies. What was the gap between them? I think five years? Five years?

Oh yeah, I think it came out in twenty one during the law and I thought.

I thought that the third one got this to be so confusing. We'll talk about this next week. The third one was awesome. Yeah, I enjoy Oh god, it's so rewatchable.

It's I've watched it plenty of times. I thought, I wish and this is like a common critique of mine, I wish it got a little darker at times, like when sub Zero you think kills Jackson the first one and like almost like dismissively pushes him off the building and you watch him fallow in his face like four

Was kind of like the game, you know, Like I mean I didn't play the game a whole lot when I was growing up, but it was kind of like that where it was like finish him, you know where, like and we saw that in the movies too, where it was and you remember, I mean this is I mean, how old were you in ninety seven ten? So there is a big thing going around before this movie came out when the game was.

Oh trust me, I remember, like because I was the house people went to to play it, right, because.

Your mom let you do whatever you want. As long as he didn't have nightmares, you were fine. Yeah. But yeah, like that was a huge especially me in a in a Christian grade school, like oh my god, you couldn't even say Mortal Kombat. It felt like raising like oh my god.

And it's so funny because you go back and look at those Sega Genesis era graphics and like, what would happen? And then you watch Mortal Kombat eleven, which is the most contemporary version, and you watch what the fatalities are now, and then you go back to what was in the news in ninety one and you're just like, man, like, people really were just starved for anything. Right now, I'll tell you right now.

You know what's funny is what once nine to eleven hit? Yeah, everything changed. Not that I'm I want to make light of this, Okay, I'm not making light of it, but I will say this. You know when.

Something Batman grittier again was after.

Night I don't want to make I don't I don't want to make that point, but but I will say this, like, sometimes people just need something to talk about. And sometimes you know this from politics or whatever, the straw Man argument and everything, and and sometimes I think like, like, okay, I need to do something. I need we need to talk about something. I'm a politician, I'm a talk show producer,

Not lyrics in music video and other graphics. There was a lot of stuff to make it look like you were doing something to me. I think there was a kid in an arcade that got his ass whopped six times in a row. At Mortal Kombat went and told Autumn and like some strict mother was like what were you played? And it was like, oh my god, I need to call all the news companies and tell them that this is a thing. And then it becomes a

I love that.

I love him and anything he's in. So I'm excited to see you. You made the comment he's in his fifties. He's being Johnny Cage. That's an interesting, well decision. You know, we'll see what happened.

I just I just I think, like you know, I'm almost fifty now, and I remember when that used to be old to me. Yeah, and now I'm just I see people in their fifties. And I mean Idris elba is in the he Man movie coming out. Yeah, I mean, how old is that guy? O.

He's definitely up there.

Denzel Washington is not that far removed from doing Equalizer, and I think he's in his seventies.

Oh absolutely. But like Johnny Cage is always such like a smart ass, like you know, he's specially want to be like a little young, little too confident, Like I'm I'm pushing forty and I'm kind of hitting the point where I'm like, all right, dude, you're not that.

Maybe maybe they'll play into that in the movie too, like like he's sort of like this washed up actor, but he's still liking kick ass. I don't know.

You know what's funny is is at the end of the first the third one, first one, what however you want to call it Mortal Kombat twenty twenty one. Yeah, that's so let's refer to that Johnny Cage is like a young Asian dude because the cast is primarily Asian, and they're just gonna ignore that.

Well, no, because in the very end of twenty twenty one, yeah, he whatever his name was the main guy who got the you know, the suit and the armor doesn't narrow, it don't at all. I know, you know the UFC fighter. Yeah, he's going he's like, oh, I got a recruit and then.

It shows Johnny Cage but it's a it's a poster.

I didn't know that. Yeah, oh, at least I forgot about it.

Yeah, and so they're just gonna be like, no, no, mine.

They literally whitewashed it.

We need we need a more bank. Well, realistically, Johnny Cage is a white guy. So like this is what it should be.

Yees, but but they already painted it, as.

You know, and I think they're gonna make him the lead. We'll see what happens. We're already doing next week's thing. But like he shouldn't be the main character. And I have a feeling they're gonna make him because Carl. You don't bring Carl Urban in to make him be.

In the poster. Now, the poster features all the characters and it's Carl Urban's head like bigger than any I'm sure he doesn't.

Make any sense. It doesn't make anything.

The guy who is the main character in the last one is like so small compared to like in the poster or whatever.

Although I will say, uh, twenty years ago, if adult Ben would have been told, yeah, we're gonna make a live action X Men and it's gonna predominantly feature Wolverine, I'd be like, what you're gonna You're gonna take the meat head side character and you're gonna prominently feature him in an X Men movie, And like now, I can't imagine Wolverine not being like the most prominently featured guy. So who knows, maybe this hits, but like we'll see