Primate

Well that's.

All right.

So we're talking about Primate, yeah, which is a film about a rabbit chimpanzee. And I apologize I got some details wrong when I was on your show talking to Yeah, this was Hawaii, not Southeast Asia. Gets bit by a rabbit, mangoo starts attacking people in theory. Seems okay, Yeah, seems.

Oh no, waiter you telling me that it's less than okay?

Yes, I am oh no, you like this?

This is I loved this film.

No going to be I'm telling you, man, I just there. There was not.

I I just wanted it to be over. And this is like an hour and twenty three minutes. Dude, this is this is like a this is like a him Belushi. Yeah, length, you know, like this, there's nothing to this straight. This is this is a this is a season ten Walking Dead, This is a season five Stranger Things.

And like I still was like, oh.

Man, I just I cannot. I thought it was hokey. I thought it was I didn't. I didn't really care for the chimp how he was portrayed, like as far as like you know, the realistic yeah, special effects, I guess ye, make sure practical, Yeah exactly. I couldn't get into that. I thought it was predictable, and god forbid, I say anything is predictable to you, Yeah, because you are the King.

Yeah, nothing will catch you off guard in this movie.

Right, No, it it just was. It did nothing for me. This this movie did nothing for me. Troy Katzer, Uh, I think it's Katzer it looks like but yeah, uh an Academy Award winning Yeah actor. The fact that he was in this film was just I mean, it's a slap in the face to cinema that you're wasting this guy's talents in this. And then Rob Delaney, who I

No there was none.

No, there wasn't.

I just there was nothing. And maybe I just don't like this type of movie. There's nothing for me here.

I'm going to start here. I'm looking this up for the first time. Rotten Tomatoes has it, critics eighty, audiences seventy two. Yeah, I'm right, you're wrong. I think we can agree with you said.

I looked this up before I saw the film, yeah, and I was like, Okay, there should be some good parts in this Yeah, and I didn't like it. And then I had to go back and look. I was like, maybe I read Rotten Tomatoes wrong.

No, I didn't.

No more out of five people or three out of four, and audiences loved it. And I have to say, I think there's one thing that he's either going to make you love or hate this movie. So let me give you some perspective. I went into this movie thinking that it was gonna be essentially Moby Dick, like the whole not the whole premise, but a large premise of what Moby Dick is is that is that the fishermen are trying to catch this giant whale, and they almost make

Is a just get like like you said, say is a sadistic sort of approach to torturing people, yeah, and in some cases killing people.

And there was a there's a straight to Hulu movie called Slother House, which which describes exactly what it is right came out either last year or two years ago, and in it there's a killer sloth. And I'm sitting there thinking, Okay, the movie's gonna make you think the sloth is killing people, but in reality, it's gonna be the owner of the sloth who's messing around, and it's

I mean, like, I get like, we go to escape and and we go to suspend disbelief or whatever, but like the the whole rabies aspect of it, and and then this this, I mean, clearly this chimp, the chimp was really smart. We that was set up in the opening credits that this is a brilliant chimpanzee who worked with brilliant people to get him to communicate.

And and and he was very, very smart.

The wife slash mother, who was not in this movie, I assume she passed. I might have missed it in the story. She died of cancer, okay, perfect. She was a speech pathologist. So that's kind of the the rationale they give for why this monkey straight up. And what's funny is in the opening scene of the movie, or one of the opening scenes, he's pushing buttons on a thing like Lucy, Hello, Hello.

It's it's like a communication thing.

Yeah, like that you would give to certain people who are heavyly have you on the autism spectrum? Yeah, they can't vocalize, so they pressed the picture of what they're trying to communicate.

Yes, And in my inner monologue when they showed the monkey using it in one of the opening scenes, my owner monologue goes, if this is a good movie, he's gonna use that to talk shit later.

And sure enough I didn't pick up on that, but it makes sense I should have picked up on that. Well.

I didn't think it was actually gonna happen, because again, this movie both took its tell like it took itself seriously, but then it had funny moments. I don't know if you saw Coked, I.

Don't think it toks itself seriously at all.

Oh no, I don't, I don't, I don't at all. I think this was a farce. It was a monkey.

Now go watch Cocaine Bear and tell me the Cocaine Bear.

Like you thought that that movie took its at all.

I'm saying in that movie, someone would die and I'd be like, well, I didn't know a bear could climb a tree. Like, it's not like life is a Marvel movie. You're not gonna be quipping after you watch somebody die. It kind of undercuts. And I even said, when I walked out a Cocaine Bear and I realized how ridiculous it sounds, I said, I wish it took itself more seriously, because it's a cool premise to could have been fun if you would have made it a true horror. This

I joked on my show, I said, were there that many jump scares? Yeah, I'll tell you what.

I didn't jump, but there was there was unease, and I think some people just this was something for them that maybe they don't do a lot of horror, and they decided to kind of step outside a little bit, and it's.

Like, oh my god.

I didn't expect these kind of moments. There was one in particular that hit me pretty hard, but I can't remember what it was now offhand, all.

Right, So so nothing I did not. I can tell you unequivocally. I did not jump once in this movie, okay once. Some of the scares in this film. Do you remember remember what's the Patrick Wilson scary movie series Insidious?

Yes?

Okay, oh, the red faced guy. Not what you're saying. Yeah, it's one of the best jump scares ever.

Great jump scare, right, but but but part of that jump scare was not just the image, It was the slight movement that you saw.

On that on the movement of the of the Red Demon Earth yea.

And the randomness yeah, Now in this film, I don't I mean, maybe it was set up to do jump scares, but to me, anything that was that was scary. You kind of already knew what was going to happen, and it was very subtle where in the background the chimp would start moving, you know, like very subtly. The ending for like the big scene at the end, I mean, my god, how predictable was that? Yeah, you know, just and I'm just waiting and I'm waiting and I'll do this too to trash this movie more.

Uh huh.

The Packers Bears game playoff game that happened on Saturday night. I was getting so frustrated with the second half. I just I didn't know who was gonna win at that point. I just wanted it to be over. I'm like, this is not enjoyable for me. I don't like sweating like this. Yeah, I don't like sitting through you know, maybe if it was the Packers coming back rather than the Bears, I would have enjoyed it more.

I just hated it. I just I didn't want to watch the Bears final drive and didn't want to watch the Packers final drive. I just wanted it to be over with. From the point when the two boys showed up, I was just like, just can we can we just end this?

I mean, I just I'm done. I'm done with this whole premise. I'm done with it. I I just was ready to be for it to all be over.

You want to know what's funny?

And I said, Okay, maybe there'll be something that surprises me here and I'll be glad.

Sure I stuck around.

No, No, they were fodder, and like, but what's funny is because I knew what I was getting into at this. I saw those guys show up, and prior to them showing up, I was sitting there thinking, you know, this needed two or three more characters to kill because I don't think there's gonna be too many deaths left. And then they showed up. I was like, oh good, oh good, this is the case. And I will say and this was going through my mind while I was watching the movie.

Because to get you to get to care, to get you to care about at least some of the characters.

Compare that to Anaconda, not the same movie. They obviously were going for comedy, but we I complained about it last week. You knew which characters had plot armor and which ones were the were the the fodder, here is the gonna make it. I'm sitting there googling, like if you get bit by something with rabies, do you well.

Not only that, not only that, but like I was worried about the aftermath of it, like like, okay, well you know these people who got attacked, who got bit, who maybe had blood mixed with the chimps rabid blood, Like what's the long term Like is this something that you can pull out of?

I don't know. You said heroic for one of the characters heroic actions. Can you look at it also from a selfish lens for what she did?

Because well, yeah, because where that sort of like where things change, where the unexpected twist came in what she was doing.

We don't know what would have happened after that, No, we don't.

You know, yeah exactly because she gonna and you know what, she was kind of an s heel, Yeah, for what it's worth.

So I don't know what what her intentions were. We know that she did not get along with one of the main characters, so I don't know what would have happened there.

And I will say, with your endything, this is like an anti spoiler. It's what it's what doesn't happen that I think might have added to it a little bit. I wish it would have turned out it weren't rabies, Like I wish that's what the ending were. And you think the monkey's dead, and then whoever got bit or scratched by the monkey has something and it ends on like a cliffhanger.

Of like, oh, I don't I don't understand, like some other disease or or.

Like just take it into the supernatural. And it was like, you know, the rage virus from twenty eight days later whatever whatever, like not literally twenty eight days later, but make it something like.

No, literally twenty eight make it like yeah, like because who would see that coming? No, that would have been that would have been a totally read That's what I'm saying.

And I was a little disappointed that it kind of ends like there's no sequel bait. There's no uh oh did the monkey die? There's no here's the monkey's bait that's also born evil and with raised this is very much a one off and.

Uh, I don't know.

I mean, I love creature fleatures, and also I say it's a mixture between a creature feature and one of my favorite B rate movies of all time is called Frozen. It's about three people get stuck on a ski lift and the ski lift is closed from Oh I got to see this Sunday nights until Friday morning, and it's them trying to figure out how they're gonna get off this ski list. Wait a minute, did I see this? How old is this movie? Probably fifteen years old? I think I did see the dude from Animal ice Man

I can't he was. He was a Oh god, why can I not think of this guy's name? Yeah, I know you're talking. Yeah, he was in a Fox TV show following the following following Yeah, yeah, Oh did you say that following? No? I didn't, but I like that show. Yeah it is Kevin Bacon. Yeah, okay, yeah, yeah, that's that's I know what we're talking about. I can't remember.

Yeah, and he's in Frozen. But so like this movie has like you can't leave this area, and there's in Frozen, it was wolves that were underneath the ski lift.

I definitely see.

But in this it's a monkey that outside of the region that they find themselves locked in and like, as soon as you put me in that kind of scenario, because then my mind starts going, Okay, so what would I do in this scenario? And how am I getting out of here? And then like I'm like, oh, I would do this, And then you see them do that and you're like, son of a bitch, I would have died if I did that, And then like you get the next thing, and like that's when. That's what I

The one thing I did think that was good about this or I mean it's not wasn't all bad. But one of the things I liked was the the opening credit, not opening credits, but the opening title card explaining rabies.

Yeah, I have a funny story about that, but go on.

And how it creates a fear of water, yeah, which I didn't realize. Yeah, because that is a significant part of this movie, is how they are able to sort of bide their time but also be trapped at the same time and prolong their torture, prolong their lives with this infinity pool, which I mean, once I saw the shot of the Infinity Pool, like right on the cliff.

I'm like, this is you know, yeah, they're gonna have something. Which what kind of author? You know what I mean? You're not writing Harry Potter.

Well did you see the stuff on the wall? Like so he had all these posters throughout his house. By the way, Troy Katzer Katsuer plays a famous author in this in this film, and he has it seems like all of his his books have some sort of well they all have a theme. They all start with silent whatever. Yeah, like silent song, silent death. What you know, silent is death. Yeah, he's definitely, he's definite real life. So you might remember him if you saw the CODA move. Did you see

But CODA stands for child of Deaf Adults. Okay, and in this film, the sort of the star is dealing with their parents both being deaf. And I didn't see it.

I heard it was very good and I think that's what Katsuer won the I know if he if he won, that's what he wanted.

For anyway.

So he plays this deaf author and I'm assuming the plot of the books he writes has something to do with being deaf, like maybe the protagonist is deaf or whatever. But it's this series of books, which I totally believe if they're successful. You know, I think about who wrote the the you know, A is for this, B is for that, M is for murder. Yeah, that Patricia, but you might have been Patricia Cornwell, I can't remember. She's rich, yeah,

Had a wealthy I would assume a wealthy spouse, you know, doing the work that she did with chimps. And she was obviously a doctor, and then she passes away to cancer. I'm sure there is a healthy life insurance that comes with that. So I didn't. I thought that the whole thing was believable.

As far as where they lived, the type of place that they lived, I thought that was totally believable. And clearly the guy I mean, we see him working with his publicist on a zoom meeting and then actually in real life with other people. I don't know if that was an investor he was talking to. He took it very seriously.

Oh yeah, you know, you know so he I thought that that part was totally believable.

Okay, okay, you're convincing me of that. But if I can backtrack to the opening Rabi's discribe, Oh yeah.

So, so just to wrap up my point, if they would have not put that in, yeah, And I don't think I'm stupid.

I'm stupid about some things.

But if they wouldn't have put that in, I wouldn't have understood why the chimp could I mean, is it enough to say, oh, the chimp can't swim, so he's not going to go in?

Oh?

Sure, I mean I think the people would have bought that.

I I thought chimps could swim. I didn't realize yeah, could it.

No, I agree, And I was even sitting there thinking, like, you know, how I learned to swim. I was thrown in the deepend like I'm one of those babies, and I thrashed and I stayed afloat. So I'm very much of the opinion. And obviously people drowned, so I'm wrong. But like I'm of the opinion that if you just are thrown in the deep end and throw your limbs around you can at least stay above where you can still breathe, and then you just kind of go from there.

But I think it's just natural for human beings like to do that.

Yeah, I guess, you know, it's the same reason we die in quicksand, because we're fighting it, sure, right, And so if we fight the water, that's not quicksand, and we can you know what I was reading about.

I don't.

Oh, I was I got on a Quiet Place kick, So I was reading a bunch of stuff about Quiet Place and I didn't realize or at least maybe I forgot one of the kids almost dies in the grain.

Silo. Yeah, and.

There is a hyperlink from the story I was reading. And this is a big thing in the country. And and while deaths farming deaths have gone down over the course of the last you know, several decades. Yeah, that death has not gone down. Wow, But people being buried alive by grain apparently it's still happening.

That was a plot point in a Saw movie. I don't remember which one, I think the eighth one, but they started someone in grain.

Yeah.

It's apparently Hollywood's up on that right now, you know. I told my brother after I called him afterward to tell him how awesome the movie was and said, you got to catch this in theaters before it more it leaves. I said, you know, Balky compared Don't Breathe to a Quiet Place, and his immediate reaction he goes, and you're friends with this guy.

I'm not saying that they're carbon copies, but I am saying that, inarguably, there are certain elements that are shared by both films.

I would hold on, hold.

On, okay, I'm just saying that you wound up.

I unplugged myself. So here's the thing. I would not compare these two films like they're on the same plane with each other. Yeah, but undeniably bad. The fact that this guy in Don't Breathe can't see yeah, yeah, and the aliens in.

Quiet Place cannot see yeah, that is significant in both movies.

See and I but I am the kind of savant that I would tell you Don't Breathe Too isn't even like Don't Breathe on.

Is Stephen Lang? Yeah too? Yeah?

And they kind of terminated him. He's kind of like the good guy in that one. And it's a different director. It's not as tense. They have a three and two point two point out of him the whole deal. But in any event, I disagree that sentiment wholeheartedly. And I just I wanted to bring that full circle from us talking.

On you and I are we're not on the same page on this.

Yeah, No, probably not.

Like I don't know, I don't think I'm I'm explaining this properly. The fact that both of these antagonists could not see is crucial to the plot.

Yes, and both of these that is how I'm comparing. Okay, that's fair.

And so for you to say, like one of these is fantastic, yes, and one of these is schlock. To me, I don't think that they should be, at least for you. I'm surprised. I'm not saying that they should be. I'm surprised they are on opposite ends of the spectrum.

Yeah.

And also there's a PG thirteen R rated quotient in there as well that you have to get it.

But that's another that's another aspect of it.

But that made that made that contributes to the quality of the movie. Okay, but let me, I don't want to lose.

You don't go around telling people like, oh, I think that these are the same movies. They're not.

Okay, I'm just saying, and again I maintained everyone listening should see Don't Breathe one, do not watch Don't Breathe Too. Oh, Don't Breathe Too sucked. Yeah, I'm telling you it was a different director feed Alvarez. He just understands how to make a tot thriller, and that I think is what's missing from uh What the Quiet Place, as well as the sequel to Don't.

You're making a fourth one which is technically a third one because.

The other one's a prequel, which is the one I saw in Theaters Kill Me anyway.

Did you I'm realizing Joseph Quinn you know who played Johnny Storm?

Oh?

Sure, yeah, I didn't really know who he was. And now I'm seeing all this stuff that he's been.

At, Oh really like Stranger Things.

I feel like I've never seen him in anything either.

Straight he was he was Eddie and Stranger Things, Okay, and then he was the student.

Did you see The Quiet Place? He was the law yeah? Yeah, yeah, yeah yeah, But like, and now I'm seeing all this stuff like that. I didn't. I didn't realize that that he'd done all these anyway.

But so I really want to put a boat on the rabies thing, because you and I always talk about lowest common denominator stuff, and sometimes you got to do something that people aren't paying attention. So you're sitting here telling me, and for the record, not to uh, not to brag. But I was a neuroscience and biology major, so I took animal physiog.

Are you really yeah, you end up in radio.

Yeah, yeah, I know things. But so I knew that hydrophobia and rabies are kind of correlated to one another.

I did not know hydrophobia was a thing. Oh really, I'd like a fear of it's.

More so about it's about cells more so than it is a fear of water. It's because your cells are mostly water. So your cells are almost like almost disintegrating because it tries to give the non water parts are trying to get away from the water parts. It's like, wow, like, oh, that's not oil is hydrophobic. If you pour oil into water, you see it very clearly separate.

Okay, Yeah, then I did not understand the definition of hydrophobia, so that that.

Kind of lends itself to this. Then, so I'm sitting in a pack theater. Now, I lucked out because anyone who's been to the theater that I go to knows that most of the recliner seats are seated in pairs. I went by myself into a crowded theater, and it just so happens that if you sit along the wall, there's a one recliner seat that you can have to yourself. So a couple is sitting next to me, younger couple, not teenagers, like definitely in their adult life, but not

How old are there? You said?

Probably mid twenties, maybe late twenties, but like so not young enough.

For you to be this stupid, is my point.

So they sit there. The Rabies blurb comes up and it kind of describes what rabies is, and it goes into it in a way that any person who has seen a movie ever much like you highlight, you're like, oh, I'm glad they put that in there, because otherwise I would not have known a lot of what was going on. Balky, I'm not even lying. Thirty five forty minutes into the movie, the boyfriend, the husband whatever he is, leans over to the girl and hear them because I'm not whispering very quietly.

It was a very loud theater. It's fun.

Everyone was into it. And he goes, I don't know, but I think that monkey has rabies, and I was like, get out of here, are you kidding me? It's why do you think so?

So?

So Balky's shaking his head, looking at me and disbelief. Right now, the girlfriend leans over and goes, no, I don't think so.

Wow, uh what he Here's the good part about that. They clearly phone their souls. They're meant for each other.

Like he's trying to lean in to be like the brains of the operation, like hon if I don't know any better, but I think that the mongoose that bit that thing might have had rabies. And she's like, no, I just think it's a bad monkey. Like what how is it that people watch movies this light. I'm sitting there trying to internalize this because I'm just like ready to explode, like why are you here?

Yeah?

And they have the right to enjoy the movie just as much as ever.

Yeah, absolutely, But like.

When we do this podcast going forward, I'm going to be referencing that couple quite a bit because at times when we're like when I complain about the ending of the Dark Knight, and I'm like, why do we need the two minutes soliloquy to explain why he's the Dark Knight. We just watched him kill Harvey Dent. We understand why he's the Dark Knight. It's because of that freaking couple. They wouldn't have understand what they just saw otherwise. Close my mind.

One of the companies that work for we deal with a lot of customers, and we feel like we do a really good job of explaining something, and we do a really good job of giving everybody the tools and making sure everybody's informed on how things work, not once, not twice, multiple times, four or five, six times overkill, as I think most people would say it. And there is still a section of people that will ask you questions that were answered previously in multiple spots and multiple times.

Credit too much credit for the public.

Yeah, like we have to really hammer this home to the point where it is not to the point of almost annoying us.

It's got to be annoying the hell out of us. Yeah, to to sort of drive this home. And quite frankly, red like like like, what could they have done differently hammer it out through conversations with.

Uh, the doctors or something like that in it actually show the mongoose getting rabies and then showing the mongoose actually bite the chimp.

Yeah, I mean that's how else do you spell it out? I mean that that to me that and yeah.

We're not spoiling anything, by the way, I don't feel bad about saying anything.

Quite frankly, like I could have seen the mongoose bite the chimp. We didn't see it in the movie, you know, So I think there is a certain leap of of.

Of knowledge that. Yeah, I think it's pretty easy. It's a it's not a big leap, but you have to understand. Yeah, and I don't understand there's no rabies in Hawaii.

Yeah, that was true.

I guess because it's an island and it's isolated in a way that it travels. I am absolutely guessing in the fact that it is hydrophobic means you're not swimming through the freaking water to get to where you need to go, because.

I guess, I just I feel like you introduce one invasive species.

Yeah one time.

Listen, we've seen zombie apocalypse movies and TV shows. It only takes one right and then it spreads. And it's not like Hawaii is this brand new location. It's been around, yeah, for thousands of years, right, and so to say rabies doesn't exist, that's it's quite a bold assertation. Yeah, yeah, I I clearly it was a wrong ascertain Yeah.

Absolutely for the purposes of this movie. Yeah, like it was wild.

And I will say, to your mongoose point, I think the reason didn't show this. And I was intrigued by you saying you didn't like the way it looked because I don't know if you know this about me.

I don't know if we.

Talked about it, but I am a big big play under the apes fan, the original five, the ones that come out now. I refer as to the shitty. Tim Burton, Mark Wahlberg one is the tenth best Plan of the Apes movie because even though it's clearly the worst one, I still enjoyed it.

You know what's funny about Wahlberg is I like some of the stuff he's done. Shooter was was pretty good. I watched Four Brothers last night when I got Brothers is awesome. Yeah, I just watched that the other day too. It's on Netflix, that's yeah. And what was the other one?

I really like? Oh Italian Job.

That is my wife's favorite movie, which is a remake, which kind of defeats the point I'm about to make. He kind of wrecked Plan out of the Apes a little bit, sure, and he kind of wrecked Transformers a little bit. I mean, I I can't watch the Wallberg as much as I enjoy watching Wahlberg on the big screen.

Over Shilah Buff. There is something about Shila Buff in that movie being totally frantic and panicked running away from Decepticons that I just loved. Perfect for that, Yeah, he's perfect for that. And obviously Megan Fox too. Yeah. But the third one, I guess was not great, the one with Patrick Depk. Yeah, that one is very forgettable. I don't really remember. So it's weird that an actor like that can can sort of.

Oh yeah, conpolarized to that extent. And James Franco and John Lithgal saved the series for me though with their trilogy that they kind of kicked off. And now, but I bring up Planet of the Apes to say, and I don't want to Andy Serkis is a tremendous Caesar circuit.

Yeah, I was just gonna say, he's in Planet of the Apes.

Yeah, he's a tremendous Caesar. The CGI is very well done, especially even like some of these movies are well over a decade old, and they still look very good. This monkey looked better than any of that. And there's I refuse to believe they didn't have the bud They had the budget that the Planet of the Apes movies did. I I thought it looked much more real. It looks very clearly a CGI chimp, you know what I mean?

Like you know what? You know what? Ben? I like that.

No, here's the thing, and now now you can fry me all you want on this. I don't like I don't really like fruit, okay, okay, but I love fruit flavored things. Okay, you put a watermelon flavored jolly rancher in front of me and a piece of watermelon, nine times out of time, I'm going with that jolly.

I like mango flavoring more than mangoes exactly.

That's my point. That's my point. And while I know that that is is not believable. While while I know that this is not obviously real life, but this is not very realistic. I actually prefer that I like my sugary candy cutter apes that way. I don't like whatever this was. And perhaps you know the fact that most of this happens at night, In fact, pretty much.

All happens at night, right, oh thing, Yeah, one night.

Maybe that the shadows and the lighting contributed to me not caring for this this chimp that I was seeing. I thought it was a glorified muppet. I really did not. The only the only parts that really I thought, like like brought it for me was the close ups when when the chimp is about to go, not the hands, not the hands, but I'm talking with the with the face and the jaws and the teeth and the and the eyes like the rest of it.

I just I didn't. I did not care for so he heard in her hold on was Andy Cirkus in this? Was he the ape?

No?

He was, he was just a caesar in the plane of the He was the motion capture. Now did they had a motion capture? It was a blur.

It was a blend, I should say, of motion capture with practical effects. So you heard it here first. Bulky says Alien Covenant is better than Aliens from the nineteen eighties because it's practical effect.

I gotta forget who I'm doing this. You know I'm screwing.

I don't, but but but but I'm a practical effects sucker. I grew up on eighties whrror the thing Nightmare on Elm Street when he turns into a worm and he tries to eat her in Nightmare on Elm Street's three. I understand it's a puppet. I understand it looks stupid. CGI It twenty seventeen looks infinitely better than it from nineteen ninety, which one's scarier. For my money, it from nineteen ninety. And like I am a practical effects kind

I think I know what it is. You can look it up to confirm. What's your guess. I'm what it was. I think I think you are more than doubling what it was. I want to say it was like less than fifteen, like less than twelve.

You can look it up.

It's but but I was won to twenty four, right, roles you still wont all right, well, but you were much closer.

Yeah.

So, so in regards to this this Chimp, I did not the fact that the realistic aspect and the way that they portrayed the chimp in this, to me was not the most agreas Like I I was not upset with it.

In the moment while I'm watching it.

I mean maybe at times I was, but mostly it was like the decisions that the chimp was making and how they really really.

Villainified. Yeah. Yeah, it's not a word, but yeah, but I know what you meant. Yeah, that was a good word.

With just because he had raised so so rabies to me, it makes you more of like a mindless zombie type thing where you can't control what you're doing. Yeah, this was actually spiteful, resentful, hateful behavior. Yeah, you know, it's just and and to me, that was that covered up the whole. Like I was more ticked off about that than I was about the.

That's our biggest I think that's our biggest disconnect on that movie. When they took it that way, it was it. That was the plot I will I will say this, it was more original. Yeah, I wouldn't say that's a twist. That's not a plot twist. It's not a twist, but I guess it's a nice spin.

It's not. It was a spin twist.

It was a spin on what it normally is because again it's like Deep Blue Sea. We can all gree Deep Blue Sea's awesome. It might be the smartest animal in the world, but it's still just an animal. Like that's always what these movies come back to, as you're dealing with an animal that doesn't hate you. It's just an animal. This is the first time I've seen it where like it's like, oh no, this animal seems to hate these people. Did it loved twelve hours ago.

Even to the point where who's the main character, Lucy, Yes, even to the point where you're thinking they're having a moment towards the end of the movie.

This is the big redemption, like all that was so good.

This is like the whole walking Dead aspect of of like some of the people who believe that there's still a portion of that person still alive in that brain somewhere. Yeah, which ultimately they're not there never are, but but people believe that, and I start getting you know, start sucked in, like, Okay, here's the redeeming.

Question because I said, nothing surprised me in this movie. Yeah, and I I don't know. I watched that in the moment and I was like, huh, but I wasn't surprised, not at all. I expected it.

I expected it, honestly. By the way, one hundred and sixty million for Kingdom of the Planet of the Ape. So I'm saying, say that one hundred and sixty million for the most recent oh my god, wow, versus twenty one million for this and this is the monkey that they could. So I'm just saying it was it was a pretty impressive feat here. I I kind of liked that spin. I liked it. The monkey was named Ben that felt that felt like it.

What's the significance of that name? I was like, is that an homage to him? Like?

Not at all, not at all.

I thought it was interesting.

What's What's what?

I struggled with though, And you know, this is how I watch movies. I cannot for the life of me, and I did not look it up for the purposes of this podcast, and I kind of want to dive into it more in my free time later tonight. I could not figure out the subtext of this movie, Like when we watched Pogonia. It was such a strange movie with such a strange plot, and I understood what the director was saying about the theory of conspiracies and what people like I understood what the point was of the

No. I think that.

There are just some plots, there are some stories that seem very cool and we're gonna tell it. Yeah, But I think that there there are Ben, there are movies that exist without an agenda, like.

Now, not an agenda, not an agenda, but like so for sake of argument, I realized this statement might be a little polarizing, but I always viewed like you're watching Game of Thrones and I was like, oh, yeah, the White Walkers are a metaphor for climate change, and everyone

All right.

I was like, hold on, there's a there's a thing to They're like, everything means something. You don't just make art. To macau no, I think you are you are. I'm not even a climate change not like I am one of those people. I think.

I think you are inferring something that the artist did not. Hold on, hold on, hold on, what's it's infern what's the other one? Ben insinuate? Yeah, you are inferring something that was.

Not insinuated with that, Okay, I and I think to the point of Bogonia, you can tell yourself a story of everything meaning something, and in some cases you can tell yourself two different stories that something means, two different things that are on opposite end of the spectrum. Ah, what the hell is that supposed to mean? Like it's the same.

Like, Okay, here's an example, Dynasty Fantasy Football. A trade gets done, right, Yeah, somebody protests the trade because Team A is fleecing Team B. Sure, and then somebody else in the league is like, I can't believe Team B is getting all of this and Team you know what I mean. It's all a matter of perspective, right, Like if you choose to see something like that, if you choose to see the climate change aspect of the White Walkers a Game of Thrones, Yeah, it makes perfect sense.

Is that the intent? The intent? I don't know sure. And one of the things I've learned over the years is you never ever take what the creator says, what the artist says, what the auteur says. You never ever take them at their word of.

What they say, what they think is going on there, because you can't trust them. Like there's been so many directors and specifically, like I think you can make the case for abstract artists or sculptors that will tell you something and they say they believe this. You have no idea if they're telling the truth or not. And sometimes they'll even admit years later. Yeah, I was just making that up in the moment.

And so my whole point on this, Yeah, Ben, whatever media you consume, whatever art you consume, whatever you see, whatever you believe, it's there. But I'm saying it's not there for everybody. And in some cases the opposite would be there. You and I one hundred percent agree with that. What I'm saying is there was nothing to infer from this. That's where that's my point. I like this plug. Listen, listen.

A dinner, get together around a table, and everybody's high, but nobody knows everybody else is high.

Right, that's fun. Let's do that.

I have this idea a pet chimp, but it gets and it lives with the family, but it gets bit by a rabbit animal and becomes rabit and starts attacking people. There's no agenda, there's no like, there's no intent to

There's there's no there's no sequel.

Yeah, but there could be a spin off, right when when cocaine Barrel'll take that. For instance, some of the guys I listened to on a radio show that's not in existence anymore, they said, what's next in this series, right right, meth shark, you know, instead of cocaine meth shark or.

Oh yeah, sure, crack squirrel.

Or heroin squid, you know, stuff like that.

So there could be potential for this, right you know, primate to just like white lotus, totally different casts, totally different animal who knows. Okay, but I'm saying this is this is a time when if you find that little niche and it's cheap to make, would you.

Say twenty million, twenty five million? Yeah? Four?

And this conspawned is something. Let's take a shot and see what the American public wants. I don't think that there's you don't have to have some sort of intent and you can just make a cool movie because you're telling a cool story.

I'm not I'm not gonna hold you account to account for this because I'm pretty sure you haven't seen this movie, so I'm not I'm not gonna hold it over you. But there was a remake of the Anaconda movie that came out a little go a little bit ago, starring Paul Rudd and Jack Black. And in that movie, they start talking about.

Don't have to bend.

They start talking about making a movie with their friends, and they say, what does a movie need to be good? Themes? It needs motifs and they start generational tragedy achieving your dreams or lack thereof. And you understand that movie was a comedy too, right, But it was a meta narrative talking about making movies.

And it shows you what was poking fun at people and people making these movies right for making certain movies, Yes, certain movies have inten Other movies are remake as this intent, like if they're a movie, that's why wouldn't have that that's my point.

It doesn't.

It's just like, hey, let's reboot Anaconda because it's cool. We need a paycheck. The studios will make this and people enjoy it.

Polky. The whole point a Planet Condo was achieving your dreams, or at least pursuing your dreams, and what goes into trying to do that was the ultimately.

That that was the message at the end, and it shows.

Paul Rudd trying to achieve his dreams and being mad that he did it because of the personal elements. It showed Jack Black, who had the personal elements, who never made the plunge for the dream. That showed the woman who went to law school, who based on any accounts, that would be a dream for a ton of people listening, who was not happy with the trajectory she was on. Showing that dreams and achieving them are not exclusively linked

Then maybe the theme if you want to talk about it in that vein, I can talk about the importance of family, the importance of not having an absent father, the.

Importance there we go, there we go. But I'm saying, but I don't listen.

If this is because I'm scraping up for a theme like trying to find it, that's not what does.

It for me?

Like and quite frankly, this movie didn't do it for me. But what kept me entertained was not this reuniting, this potential reuniting of this family at the end of it coming, you know, without their mother. The obviously he lost, you know, the mother has lost to cancer. The father's busy with this work. We don't know why that.

This sister was distracted with college, you know, was pissed. He was like, I haven't seen you in forever, which was actually the plot to Final Destination six.

It was. It was a splintering of the family and then they sort of came care all right.

We found the theme, right, but.

Okay, we had to look for it like he did. It's not and you love this movie. I do.

And so my point is like, that's I think we're overrating that a little bit.

Yeah, oh no, I'm not saying that. I said it was just unique to me that I couldn't find, Like I even what was it a week or two ago? I was like, oh, yeah, con Air is h is right wing propaganda. But I love this movie, so who cares? But like, again, who says I'm right? I'm saying I can attribute it to it, But like that's the whole thing. Balky artists will put a line on a canvas and be like, what does that mean to you? And fifteen

I'm an active movie watcher in the sense of I'm trying to find out everything that is being shown and then what's not being shown. Yeah, So, like, for give you an example in this I was I was wondering for a good fifteen twenty minutes until I forgot about it. Why didn't we see the chimp get bitten by the mongoose? Yeah?

Why why was the choice made to not show that?

I figured it was hard to shoot if I had to guess on the budget that had I don't know. I don't I'm just I'm just shooting from the hip pier.

You talk about how good they did with the chimpanzee and they can't show a mongoose biting it.

Give me a break.

Yeah, maybe you're right, all right?

So that so I was questioning that. That's what I mean, not active you're talking like movie watching five.

Point zero or something. We're like, well, now, what's the commentary here on the race of the single man young man in this in this story?

Is what are we I don't don't do that? Yeah, man, you do. Yeah.

Now maybe that's because of your day job. And sure, maybe it's hard to unplug from that.

I don't.

I mean, but like people went, uh, and we don't have to dive into the actual politics of it, but we dealt with it. When we saw Superman, there was a huge pushback to that because there was a very obvious you know, I don't know if it's allegory or metaphor with the appropriate term to use is there, but regarding what's going what had been going on in the

But yeah, yeah, as far as as that goes, I think again, you you infer that. But it could just be part of the plot too. And I'm not saying that specific a y yeah, sure, sure, sure, but I'm saying stuff in general. You know, it could just be a device of telling a story, not necessarily a representation of something going on in the real world. Now, I think there are certain obvious ones. I mean, good Fortune Jesus, Yeah, I mean that was hit you in the face.

Yeah, there's a lot.

Of wealth inequality theming going on, and a lot of the stuff that we're watching Running Man Caught Stealing good Fortune. It's a pretty similar theme that pops up in all of these I think resonates and I will say I thought it when I was watching it yesterday there's a lot of movies out there right now. I don't know if it's because we're more transient than we've ever been. I mean, hell, I'm talking to you right now, five

Where have you been?

I haven't seen you in a year and a half. It's been so long since i've so clearly there's stuff going on, and I'm very disconnected from the social media world, so I oftentimes.

You're disconnected from the social I'm trying.

To get more connected, given what we do for a living, but I really don't like I'm only just starting. I've had my face. I looked at it. I've had my Facebook accounts since two thousand and six, and I haven't posted four hundred times since that's twenty years.

That is pretty crazy, twenty posts a year, I will say, as far as not that anybody cares about this.

I used to make a point because I manage a bunch of social media accounts for work and everything, and I tried to make a point of posting at least three.

Times a week on my personal stuff.

I mean, dude, unless I think the last Instagram post I had is when I met Rich Eisen at the NFL Draft O nice, Like, unless it's something like that, I just don't post.

This year that I had that I don't know that happen. That's pretty quol. Oh, yeah, I didn't tell you that. I was just walking back to my car and the whole NFL network crew is coming out. I mean, it's Green Bay.

You can't hide like walking down the street to their hotel or whatever is Yeah, Daniel, Jeremiah and the whole group. All right, anyway, and then I see these people like my my one of my friends calls it brag book instead of Facebook. The only time you're posting on Facebook

And so if I'm gonna do that, it's just like what's the point? Yeah?

And then and then like, if I'm gonna be honest, and be real. That requires way too much, you know, of like posting and stuff. And it's just like I don't there are certain parts of my life that I just ignore and I shouldn't, you know, because they're important.

I don't have time to pay attention to other people's lives. And that's and that's sort of how I believe, like, you know, like, yeah, when when I'm thinking about posting something, unless it's uproarously funny or like a very cool moment, it's like, what am I putting these people through? Yeah, there's no there's no point in you know.

I get annoyed when I see stuff like people like, oh my god, my wife, God bless her. She just went to see the Backstreet Boys in Las Vegas and she posted all these like photos and videos and it's.

Like, who the hell is watching this crap?

Oh, you know, and like I get it, and like it's her thing. I'm not going to tell people how to social media. You do you, but like I'm just like I'm out the game, son, Yeah, out the game.

One one of the only pictures I have of myself in my apartment is me at a concert and someone took a picture facing me and the rest of the crowd, and it's me surrounded by a bunch of people and it's like forty seven people holding their phone up filming and me with my hands in my pockets, just with a shitty ing grap See.

That's a great model. That's hilarious photo.

But I do appreciate that one very much. But the reason I even bring it up, and to tie it into what we were talking about, I think I even remember you might this might be your your line, but uh, it felt like watching Good Fortune. It was almost like a Z's when writing the script, just went on redd and saw what people's frustration, where frustrations were with the economy. This sounds like something you haul and then wrote a script. And I think that kind of lends it lends into it.

There were times where I felt like that, you know where, and there was there was some drama to it a little bit, and you know, having to you know, make sure you're super quiet and like to a quiet place.

Level, yeah, or don't breed or don't breath level of being quiet. I thought that was cool.

The whole glass shard, you know, oh that was and I knew that was gonna come back.

Yeah, that was kind of fun. That was cool.

Yes, But but and I even was watching that happen, I'm like, how did you not see that?

Then?

Mynor mom was like, Ben, you'd be looking for the monkey, like, don't tell yourself, you would be looking at the ground.

I'm like, you're right, yeah.

And that's the one thing that I always I think gets lost in this a little bit, the whole panic of like some critics said, there is there's a lot of screen.

Shouting in this movie where you're like, what are you doing, don't you know?

But again, you don't think rationally in these situations, especially when it.

Comes up on this so like like the whole phone thing, you know, you know where they revisit that several times, and.

Especially if you're not one of the family members. Like even if one of my best friends had a monkey, I'd only have so much interaction with that monkey, you know what I mean. I don't know what it acts like normally. I don't know where it hides, I don't know its habits, Like a lot of the people are not familiar with Ben the chimp, and I think we're by the way, using monk and chimp and gorilla like completely and loose, like I don't know which one it actually is.

Is that? Is that offensive?

Not offensive?

But I don't think it's right.

It's a check. It's yeah, all right, I didn't even know. But it's not like you weren't a friends guy. But it's not like Ross's chimp. It's I watched Frends.

Okay, so remember I don't rewatch Friends, sure, but I watched Friends. Yeah it's Marcel. Yeah, yeah, it's not like that. It's not friendly like that.

But uh, there were a lot of moments I actually I still have rotten tomatoes up just from a moment ago. And it even says I feel like this is you for the first stelf. It says viewers don't mind nondescript characters and questionable narrative logic. The film should be a fun utterly forgettable Nerve Shredder is the way that.

Except for nerve Shredder. Yeah, I agree, it's you know, totally accurate.

I think that this this movie, it was what Now here's the other thing, ben, as we look to our next project.

Yeah, this is two animal movies. You know that you loved one of them, did not like the other. I didn't, I did not care, and normally I love monster animal movies. There's a movie coming out, I believe it's this coming weekend, and I don't know if it's seeing a wide release, sure, called Killer Whale.

And it's about two people in an ocean that are being hunted and attacked by this killer whale. Again, on the surface, this seems awesome, right, I don't.

Know if I want to do it.

Three, let me let me put a bow on Oh yeah, yeah, yeah, no, for sure, And I just want to put a bow on the whole narrative thing for a second. Here Frozen. We just established we've both seen it, not the shitty Disney one, the one where they're in a in the ski the ski lift, right, Yeah, But I don't know how much you remember the plot. I've seen it two or three times, not in a very long time. But it features doesn't one of them jump breaking their legs,

I don't know if it is. I just know it comes out.

I mean it could be like you know, it could be one of these things where it's like not available to us here or what.

Oh for sure, for sure, let's let's do the thing where we rate and then we just discuss live on the show what we're going to do next. So I'm in like the I'm ahead of you. I'm sure I'm six and a half or seven on this one.

I don't know if I've bond this low before. Yeah, I thought you.

When I initially decided on four, I was like, yeah, Commons is probably gonna talk up and I'll get it up to a five.

I couldn't. Yeah, I just this is.

And now for anybody who's like, oh god, baal key, you can't four, give me a break. These are not my type type of movie, right, No, And so so I think that you have to understand, like if you're Ben. If you are if you like this type of movie, listen to Ben right like that, the his is much more of an accurate reflection of what how good this movie is.

That's such a good point. I think that's such a good thing to say. I always I think anime is one of the dumbest things on the planet. Like I do not enjoy watching anime. I very rarely see something and enjoy what I saw. Princess Manhunoke, which is an anime ten, is one of the most beautiful things I've really seen. If I say that, if you hear if you would have came in and said Primates an eight,

So if they did do like some sort of Primate two where it's like a gorilla, sure, or some sort of spider monkey or something, you're.

In, Yeah, for sure, I get like a like a brand new.

Cast to Yeah, Yeah, I think I would enjoy it, especially if it up the ante, but I would say it wouldn't be like like when Saw eleven comes out, I'm gonna go see it and I'm gonna expect it to be good, Like even though it's the eleventh installation of something, Well, I don't know that i'd have. I think this might have been lightning in a bottle, but I'd give it a shot based on what I enjoyed from the first one. Okay, but I don't know that

The other thing, too, I will say, is I had a very busy day yesterday. I mean all my days are busy, and this got pushed off and I saw it very late last night.

Yeah, and so I'm sure like I was not in the greatest frame of mind to serve as well.

And I conversely just found out Tomlin had stepped down and I was on cloud nine. Right, So.

You could have seen a movie with puppies being murdered in front of it. Yeah, that wasn't was that bad? I understood the intent of the director. I'm doing that.

I think I've opened myself up to those kind of jokes exactly which people will enjoy it. Yeah, next week, And here's the deal. Let me tell you, So, this is gonna be our last one for a while, because I'm going to tie Land for the next two weeks. So we need to pick something that, in all likelihood, whenever we choose not to see, is probably gonna be gone by the time.

We do this.

This is what I'll say, Because we've we've done this already, but the twenty eight days later Bone Collector.

That's what's advertised right in front of my face here on Rotten Tomatoes as I was looking at that. That feels since we saw the further or the technically the first one, given, this seems to start a new chronology.

This this these movies were shot back to.

Back, yes, and I do we know?

Is this? It is there? Like I didn't even know no second one, No kid, there could be another one. Yeah, I have no idea.

Okay, yeah, I'm down for that of releases on Thursday, so we can pitch it.

So I think we should do that. And this will be the first time, well I shouldn't say the first time. This will be the first time we've we've.

Worked on a movie review and then left it alone and come back to it several months later, right, because we did the John Wicks and Ballerina that was all right next to each other, right, you know, But now we've had time to let the twenty eight years later, yeah, Breathe, which is.

Available on Netflix, right, okay, yeah for anybody.

Yeah, so yeah, that's perfect.

Watch that one and then watch Bone Collector, which is what we're gonna do this weekend Temple.

Bone Collector was the Denzel Washington Bone.

Bone which was a great That was a great movie. Who was Monica Potter? Was she in that? Yeah? Okay, yeah, Monica Potter? Was she ended? Did she end up being a bad guy in that movie?

No?

The nurses a did Okay?

A ten year old Ben predicted that by the way.

Go on Along came of Spider.

Oh yeah, hecky, Morgan Freeman, did you predict her that one? I think that was too complex for me watching it because there were a lot of moving pieces. Bone Collectors basically in one room the entire time, my child brain, and there's only like five characters, And I was like.

Was Bone Collector he's like laid up in a bed.

He's he's a quadriplegic. He's injured during some kind of event as a police officer.

The heel turned for Monica Potter and along Cave of Spider. Yeah, chef y solid. That was good.

That was solid. But yeah, okay, Bone Temple, I think sounds good and I'm I'm a convert anti twenty eight days, Like I was not impressed by the first one. Yeah, and years later kind of converted me.

So did you not like Weeks? I thought that was atrocious, Like, like Weeks, why the hell did we watch years later? If you were out of it?

I even said in the episode that preceded it, I said, this might be the first time that I actively hate them. I said to you, I think, off the air, I want to do one of these where I crap on oh okay, And I think I even started the episode of it and I said, I came here wanting to hate this movie, and I actually really.

Got tough to do.

Like it's easy to like, Okay, i'm gonna like this movie, because I do that all the time.

Yeah, I'm gonna like this movie, and I do right.

Yeah, It's tough to go into a movie saying like, yeah, this is gonna suck and then it's like, wow, I was totally wrong about that.

That's rare.

Yeah, that's what I'm saying. So I have high hopes for this and I look forward to discussing it.

That's bulky. I'm Ben.

You can catch us every Thursday at noon breaking down the biggest movie releases. Talk to you then,