Obsession

Syphilis.

Well they always say I think, like you're supposed to say sibilants, like is the Oh yeah, it's like that was like the always the thing back in the day. He'd say sibilants, but I always said syphilis because I thought it was funnier.

Yeah, you know what's funny is uh. I would I was in drama club in school and all like I was not good, Like I just was doing it because I liked the girls.

And well that's why we do anything, yeah, exactly.

And they all had like they're very pretentious, like Mama made me mash my in. They're they're all doing their things right, and so I'd just be staying there and i'd be like warming up nex to someone named Stacy. I'd be like, Stacy, Stacy, you're an asshole, Stacy.

I was.

Very funny at the time. I don't know how it tracks.

And there is an SNL sketch which I don't know if I've told you about, but the gist of it was this guy gets mugged and he's got to watch this police lineup, you know, and he's got to pick out the correct mugger. But the mugging happened right outside some repertory players theater where it's all these like struggling actors. So then these actors come into the police lineup and they read it like as an audition, like their audition.

It's so good.

And Kyle Moodey is one of them. He's like he does it and he's like, oh, that was so flat. And the guy's like, oh, come on, you know, just just shake it off. You get fire off a few verbal arrows. So then Kyle Moody is like fake firing off airs and goes, I mean, it was awesome, it was fantastic.

I freaking love that. Yeah, they're good. That's uh god, I wish I could be that creative all the time. But the smoke more weed, Yeah, clear, that's what it does, clearly. But all right, onto the new world of horror here, Bulky, And why do you call it the new world of horror? Because I have a feeling that Hollywood is going to learn all the wrong lessons from these those two recent horror releases surrounding how to hire directors and what goes

Okay, when you're talking about these two new horror movies, or by the way, are we recording, Yeah, okay, we're talking about Obsession and background.

Yeah, we're doing Obsession today.

So okay. Granted, yes, copycat, I understand it has a negative connotation, but those movies were good.

Oh absolutely absolutely. My point is go back to nineteen eighty and look at how many space movies came out because Star Wars hit it big in seventy nine, But in reality, it wasn't the fact that it was in space that made Star Wars cool. It was the characters and the lightsabers and the universe and the character building and all these different stories. And the Hollywood saw that was like these cretans like space, put more movies in space.

So you saw Argo, right, Yeah, So that was based on a real Hollywood script that just hadn't been made, I believe. So so Argo would have come out, I mean it was already written and came up like ready to go, and then Star Wars came.

Out right wait, what do you What does Argo have to Argo?

Was the fake film they used in Argo? Like whatever?

Oh?

Oh oh yeah, so that was a script that the movie just hadn't been yet.

Yees.

So then after Star Wars happened, I guess they couldn't capitalize it because they had it was a sealed document yeah, by Jimmy Carter that they couldn't like. Well, I guess we lost out on this one. We helped the government, so Argo could have been a lot bigger.

They could have, yeah, if it had fallen that way. But I have a feeling you're going to see a bunch of twenty somethings. And I'm not against any of this for the record, as long as they take it seriously and try and capitalize on the effort. But I have a feeling you're going to see a lot of people trying to emulate the parts. Oh they got they made eighty million dollars on a seven hundred and fifty thousand dollars budget. Let's do that again, and like it's just not going to be as red.

But that but that we were talking about this the other day, that's not new. I mean, people making a lot of money on low budget horn it is. I mean that that's that's something that has been you know, I don't know, you tell me twenty thirty years.

I actually saw a Twitter post that even said as much, and I wish I knew the name. I would I would give credit where credits due here, but I don't have it in front of me. And they because someone said this is unprecedented, and it shows the budgets for the two movies, and then the the take Home does far and then somebody retweets it and says, actually, this happens about once every ten years, and no one ever learns the right lessons when it happens.

And then, well, what's the right lesson to learn from a film like Obsession? Because obviously you want to give a pathway to a young and up and coming director, right yeah, that that that's the idea, Yeah, right, They that specific director, which I'm gonna look it up in a second here, executed a pretty good movie, pretty good film, and made a lot of money off of it, right yeah, So what's the correct lesson?

Then?

I mean, why why wouldn't you want to try to duplicate what has worked?

So if you if you asked me, what the lesson from that moment is it's not necessarily the director as much as it is indeed Navaret or however you say her name.

Hold on, she was the star. Yeah, so she also directed.

No no, no, no, no, I'm saying outside of the director. I think I might have have finished a thought that and he never ready. Yes, she I believe that her performance felt so unique because we've never seen her before, and she was well cast in some stuff. But I mean, like in the in the grand scheme of things, this is the first thing that I truly remember having seen her.

I mean, like, what what would you compare it to that you have seen The Monkeys Paw, which I never saw.

Yeah, wish Master from the late nineties.

Okay, And by the way, so we're talking about obsession, I should just tell everybody right now, the gist of this movie is this guy makes this wish okay with this supernatural toy that he buys to get his I think childhood friend. Weren't they friends? Since who he has a huge crush on. He's trying. He said he wishes for her to fall in love with him. And obviously, on the surface, that seems fine and innocent, and certainly

And just to be clear so that everyone listening understands this, this is my favorite kind of movie.

When you say favorite kind, you be careful what you wish for movies.

I grew up playing a twisted metal where like, once you would beat the game, you got to wish for something, and there's a guy named Calypso who would grant it, but he'd only screw with you, and you'd be like, I want to be the best, to be like, oh, you want to be the best? He turned into a beat or something, you know what I mean? Like, I love that. I love that. Wish Master is a West Craven movie.

From that time that's like Twilight Zone stuff.

Yeah, Like I love that. It's Tales from the Crypt it's Twilight Zone like that is if you want to. That's why this was, in my opinion, a lot more generic than I think a lot of people who don't normally watch horror realize. But I still thoroughly enjoyed it because it's very difficult to make them be careful what you wish for a movie where I was like, nah, like, not only do I like wish Master, I like wish Master.

For god, I didn't even realize wish Master, Yeah, the only.

The first one was a West Craven movie, but the rest of them drop off tremendously in quality. But nevertheless, these are very much in my wheelhouse for the kind of thing that I will like. But I made the comparison to my friend when Squid Games came out, I had already seen Battle Royale and the Belco Experiment and all these other things that were squid games.

What was Battle Royale?

It was a It was a Japanese movie, from the Squid Game was Korean, Yes, okay, And they all had a similar concept though at the end of the day executed differently, but a very similar premise. And so I got Covid when Squid Games happened, and so I watched it while I was quarantined for two weeks and like the throes of COVID, and I came out of my quarantine and I come out to a world where everybody has seen squid games and thinks it's the best thing they've ever seen. And I was like, first of all,

The squid game come out during the pandemic. Yeah, okay, well that's then there's your answer, right.

Because everybody was watching everything.

World would Tiger King reach popular?

That's a good point.

There's nobody talks to everybody talked about the Last Dance, the Chicago Bulls thing that that came out during the pandemic. When's last time you heard anybody talk about that. That's a good point, you know what I mean. It's just like, now we have our lives.

That's a good point.

So so I think, and and and by the way, not to like I mean, this is going to sound derogatory, but it's not. You watch a lot of weird stuff I do, so and and a lot of obscure stuff that most people like ninety five percent of people.

I sent Bulky a text yesterday, I said, have you ever seen this nineteen ninety nine Canadian indo film Cube.

It's great? Cube.

Yeah, it's just Cube. Okay, there's three of them. One to three are great.

See not only do you see the weird ones, you see the sequels to the weird ones.

But so, I mean I I thoroughly did enjoy this movie though, and like we're going to get into all the different elements here in just a second, but I will say this is one of those ones where I wonder if the if the Internet isn't helping this like foster the excitement along a little bit here, and that was good.

That's that's why or that's how the Quiet Place comparison comes out.

Yeah, Quiet Place. I was like, I've seen stuff like this. This is fun, it's not revolutionary, you're transcendent. It's good act and that one actually had recognizable faces in it, and you're like, yeah, this is good. There's exciting moments, but like yeah, like I'm like, I've seen this before, and like that was kind of how I felt with this, even though again that doesn't mean I'm not gonna like it, because yeah, plenty of stuff copies off of other stuff.

I did. I mean, I just I enjoyed it all the way through and I feel like, you know, there is obviously you have to have a twist at the end, and you make stuff like this, and there was a good twist, yeah, which was cool. So okay, in regards to this film, let's let's let's break this down. What specific element do you want to talk about first when it comes to this, Otherwise I have something in mind.

Do you take the lead?

I've been talking let's talk casting. Yeah, okay, so because I always like to talk about the cast and the actors and whatever. Now I was mentioning I told this to you on on the air, the casting of the protagonist in this film. His name was like Michael Johnston. Michael Johnston, Okay, he is a music store employee. By the way, did you recognize Andy Richter?

Yeah?

Okay, Yeah, lost a lot of weight. He's this music store employee who works with his friends, you know, at this location. What would you put his age at mid twenties?

Oh maybe I didn't even say early.

Well they were at bars, so you know with the trivia, so I would assume maybe I'm just getting old. It happens to all of us, and he's portrayed it in him. You remember how Jon Favreau was in Swingers. Where is this kind of this beta? And finally Heather Graham just has it with him, like you know, cause he's kind of like dancing around trying to ask her out without not asking her out and doesn't want to get shut down, you know, because you're rejection and it just creates there's

I hated him basically the whole the whole time. Yeah, are you online enough to be familiar with the term inceell? No, Yeah, so I've heard of that. I don't know that's what he is. It's one of those kind of dudes that like blames the women for not being into him while he's not shooting his shots or.

Okay, I can't get I don't find him as being an inceel then, because I don't, I don't feel like he you know, there's plenty of times where he was by himself. I don't feel like he felt personally wronged by females or whatever, you know, where he harbored this resentment to him. I just think that this guy was so much of a woos that he couldn't muster up one. And I know it's a difficult question, but but to choose the path that he did was not mind boggling,

Oh yeah, it was just.

So so great, so great.

That's what stuck out to me with both of them. Actually, I believe when you say both of them, h never Ready, never Ready. Yeah, I think I'll say this, and I don't know if he agree with me or not, but my opinion, the best physical actor of our lifetime is Jim Carrey. Like I thought, he was very face to do things. I think Indian Never Ready is not second, but one of the best physical performances I have ever

In a way that I have reviews for the performance, I.

Thoroughly enjoyed it, and I noticed Michael Johnston's face as well. The physical performances of both leads stuck out to me the entire movie in a very positive way. I think it did a really good job of a kind of conveying a lot of things that words could convey. They could have put it into words, but I think doing it that way is what probably the most unique part about this movie was that part. Especially you'll know it when you see it. If I just say the walking

And I don't remember this part? Is this is this when they're playing the game?

Yeah, I'm telling you, go on, if you get a chance out, watch it again. And uh, I like, once it's streamable and you'll be like, oh, I said, I didn't even notice this the.

First Well you know what I did notice about that, Yeah, was the camera shot that that was on Michael Johnson. And then who's the other was it Amber or I can't remember Sarah? Yeah, where it's it's set on them, and you know, with what's going on in that shot, there's something that you really want to see and then all of a sudden, slowly you're getting you know, kind of like that was.

It was a cool shot. I don't remember the walking backwards part. Oh yeah, because it wasn't necessarily subtle, but the way she was doing it, there were subtle nuances to it. I'm like, oh, this is creepy, and you could tell it was reminiscent. I found myself thinking of the sunken place a lot and get out, like, you know, this entity is in her, but she's still there. She just is controlling the wheel anymore.

And it's tough because I struggled with that concept in this movie. Yeah, because because I was like, Okay, she's there, but then something happens. They're like, wait, maybe she's not there. Yeah, but then she's there.

I didn't know. I'm not seeing it out I'm talking about obsession, but I'm saying they they conceptualized that in such a way when he like almost falls into the chair and all of a sudden, the camera you can see through the main dude's eyes and he's like almost and he's there, but he can't do anything. That's how I was envisioning it the whole movie, that that's the best thing I.

Can do, which is we didn't see that would have probably helped me understand obsession better. If I would have made that comparison, yeah, but I never did because I was like, what the hell is going on with her?

Yeah?

Sure, And I think we've talked about this. I know we talked about it with It's What's Inside. We've talked about this with one of the other movies that we just watched, and I can't remember which one it was, But how fun it is for us to watch actors and probably fun for the actors themselves essentially play two characters. Yeah, in the same movie, but it's still in the same sort of body, the same presentation, you know what I mean. Sure, and we saw that from Indian avaready in this movie.

Hold on? I just brought it down Nicky.

Nicky, Yeah, that's right. By the way, she's twenty five years old. We can weigh in on this, Okay, where is she on your attractive scale?

And he never well, see because so much of the movie she's in the Uncanny Valley by design. I'm not saying that's the way she is all the time. I think she's a very attractive woman traditionally. So we agree, Yeah, oh, get out of here. I was expecting you to tell me she's what's your name, al Ali Alison Williams.

That's not yeah, I mean, listen, I respect your opinion, but I'm near gonna be to say that she's an attractive woman, which is wild because you know what, if I had the chance, I would still date her, of course, and go out with her.

That's always the case.

And i'd probably tell her that too, like and maybe maybe that's like because everybody I think.

You're attractive, but if you're interested in dating, I would give you a shot.

Everybody else tells her she's attractive. I'm the one guy saying that, so, like, you know what, there's something to this bar.

Yeah, that's the guy. But uh yeah, And so I heard you're talking about them having fun, watching them do different performances. I heard Curry Barker, who is the director of this movie. I don't think we said his name yet. He was playing games with them, because there was such an uncomfortableness with the filming of these movies that they were playing like genuine like board games and having fun during the in between takes to kind of be like,

So Curry Barker as long as we're as long as they're talking about him, his background is YouTube. Yeah, so he came up with and I'm loading it right now. My phone was taking forever.

I'm sorry.

Curry Barker made the YouTube channel. That's a bad idea. That's the name of it, okay, and he co created it with Cooper Tomlinson. And you say, Balky, I have no idea who Cooper Tomlinson is. Well, I can tell you. After you've seen Obsession, you would know that Cooper Tomlinson played Ian, who was the best friend of Bear. Which you know that's the other thing too. How does a guy like that.

Well, here's a nickname. His name was Baron.

But it's so stupid. It's like or maybe it was ironic, Like it's like calling a huge guy tiny.

Well, you know, what it is. You got to get the subtext, balky, So you're not online enough. There's a whole there's a whole thing. It's been going on for years where women will ask one another would you rather be left alone in the woods with a bear or a man? And like something like overs seventy percent of women choose the bear over what the man would do, and so they named him bear. I'm telling you there's a lot of insight soul. Really, that's okay. I don't

I mean yeah, to a certain extent, although I wouldn't describe him as creepy. I just I think he's lonely, that's it. But so not to not to make which kind of turns him into a creep, I guess.

That's like and fundamentally, once you know that this woman is into you not of her own free will, there comes there comes an element of creepiness in it, even when they're doing like traditional relationship things, you know what I mean.

Yeah, that's a good point.

And so like, and he finds out fairlier in the movie this is not for free will.

It's synthetic.

Yes, And he's just like, well, this is life now, I may as well go along. That was the whole point of that hands On and Gretel scene that I told you. I just almost cringed right out of your body.

Yeah, so the Hansel and Gretel thing. And then were you telling me before we saw this about when when they were sitting at the restaurant and she had the smile come across her face. That's what you're doing.

That was what introduced me to the film. I was like, oh, this might be good.

Right No, no, no, no, no, yeah that was that was That was awesome.

That was awesome.

Curry Barker, by the way, was in this film as but just his voice.

He was on a phone.

Okay, I don't think that's spoiling anything, but you know who I'm talking about. Yeah, Okay. So he also Curry Barker directed, and maybe you've seen this. It came out a couple of years ago. It's a horror film called Milk and Cereal No Milk. He wrote it and directed and it stars him and Cooper Tomlinson played ian. And they're comedy. They do comedy on YouTube, but apparently when they're doing real big boy films, they're they're doing whore

You know What's interesting about that? Though? And like, just to take this into the world of business for a second, like, what's the do you know offhand the director's name of back Rooms, which will be doing next week?

Mean Parson, Yes, there it is.

He did not invent the back rooms like the person who made a YouTube short about it four years ago. Is someone entirely different. Yeah, that guy made a completely viral clip that is going to be seen by infinitely more people than the back rooms because Beckham's has a couple million people just based on the box office, but the original has quite literally over one hundred million views. One hundred million people are not going to go see this movie. Yeah. The movie, however, is grossing tens of

I think the ladder is much more likely the former. Yeah, like without question, although it'll probably be somewhere in the middle.

Yeah. I'm here though for more people going to theat for this kind of stuff. My lead was not full, but full enough, and I was like, it's doing well.

I mean, and this is did you see it an opening weekend or did you see moved? Okay, so I would assume an opening weekend. There's probably it's probably more filled. What did you make of? And this is I struggle with this after the film, and I kind of it kind of disappeared into the like the the the upside down of my mind, sure, where it didn't really matter. What did you make? And this isn't really a spoiler of this? Dude have an oxy in his medicine cabinet.

Oh yeah, that didn't really register with me.

It just struck me as that type of guy. He just it wasn't prescription. Yeah, like, so is this just what kids do nowadays or not kids but people in their twenties. Yeah, they just have oxy?

Is that the implication? I have no idea.

Honestly, I just thought it was really weird. He does not. I mean, I'm certain there's a certain type of person movie character, film character, fictional character that I would imagine would have prescription drugs using it for recreational purposes, right, But this sky did not fit that at all, which I thought was this kind of weird?

Yeah, is the director? I always like, sometimes you wonder and that's like one of the traps you can always fall in with this stuff, is trying to put more meaning somewhere where it isn't Is that the director saying this is a lot more prevalent than you realize, or is this just a stupid oversight like you needed this as a plot device for later in the film, whatever, whatever the situation. I always wonder that the original Hostel,

Sometimes I watch We Runs a King of Queen's and there's homophobic slurs in that show Real, which was from the early two thousands.

Yeah, yeah right, And it's just like, but that was just the way people talked back then, Like you can't you can't go back in time. You know, That's just the way it works. But so I see that happen, I'm like, because eli Roth, in my opinion, is a fantastic I love what he does. Ice cream man. I'm definitely gonna be there when that comes out.

When does that come up?

I think August something I saw a trailer for.

I'm seeing some really good trailers for stuff that comes out in September.

Yeah, it's like this, Uh.

I can't What was the one I sent you yesterday? Did I not send it I don't think you did know how to rob a bank?

Have you seen the trailer?

No, dude, that's another It's it's a YouTube channel, but I think it might be a fictional YouTube channel. That movie looks amazing.

Yeah, there's six YouTube people that have movies either done, being produced currently in instruction. Yeah yeah, and there was actually seven because one of them did it last year and it completely tanks. That's how I saw it, was like, someone needs to do a welfare check on this guy because the other six have such like, which like, how many of us get to make a movie? Shut up right? Like at the same time, apparently it's completely bombed.

But the the other aspect.

Of this or one of the other aspects.

And I feel bad because this is normally my unofficial duty for this show. I should have researched to see if what what's you're going to say? Because I research all the crap I wanted. I should have looked up to see if a one wish Willow was an actual thing. Oh sure, you know, or if that's something that was just made up for for this movie. The the cat thing.

Not real?

It's not real, Okay, the cat thing in here. There's there's two things that happened regarding this guy's cat or somewhat early. Definitely one early on and then kind of a little bit later on, and that scene the second one. Dude, I'm like, okay, yeah, if I had a seat belt, i'd be clipping it shut right now because this I don't know what's what's gonna happen. I don't know what's I don't know where this is gonna go from from here.

For that.

Yeah, but maybe that's just me being adult. I don't know.

No, I think it was subtle enough. I understood what they were going through. And again, maybe that's why you didn't really even pick up on the walking backwards part, because that was a physical version of the same thing that you're describing right there. I'm like, oh, man, because like, she looks like she wants to walk in a certain direction, but she's then walking the other way, and it's just like very subtle, And I was like, oh man, I absolutely I love when actors have a capacity to be

Do you think superate topic here but related to obsession. Do you think that the jump scare has become passe in neo horror movies?

H No, I think the the predictable jump scare is passe. I think I are argues, so I think everybody in the audience, including both of us here, can agree. The one true horror masterpiece is a cabin in the Woods and and in the Cabin in the Woods. It's like they know if you're watching that, that you know when

I don't think you were meant to. No, that's that's That's my point is there is a perfect opportunity for one when he wakes up in the middle of the night and you know, there's that camera shot that's I can't remember if it was a still shot or if it was panning a little bit in the bedroom, like from his point of view, there was a perfect opportunity

I agree. I was thinking of that when you said, because we've both seen back rooms already as well, but.

With Obsession this this movie too. I just feel like it's sort of like a better executed What was the film we watched? We both hated it?

It was Undertone? Yeah, dude, I thought the same thing. I thought the same thing.

This is just a much more well executed version of Undertone.

Yeah, it doesn't you it's so funny?

It does it does it doesn't give you the scare blue balls essentially, you know where you actually.

Want to see something cool. I was looking up while you were talking. This is the nineteen twenty two movie Hacks, And this is the first they didn't even have sound and movies okay yet this is the first jump scare that has ever happened in cinema. And can you what am I looking at here? Yeah? A guy?

Oh there you go? Okay, got it?

Could you imagine being at thirty year old in nineteen twenty two that might wouldn't be able to forget that for weeks.

Think about the first person who thought of that. Right, there is an SNL sketch. I can't I think it was Michael Keaton or Matthew Perry. Can't remember that was Matthew Perry. I think it might have been Michael ket It could have been I don't know. Yeah, but it was the invention of the first person to use sarcasm. Oh yeah, yeah, sure, it seems like such a stupid idea. Yeah, but but but when you executed it.

With Simon Pegg did the first guy to lie? And it was like a society.

Where was this?

It was a movie?

Oh it was.

It was a whole movie. I'll have to I'll google it. But it actually wasn't bad because he basically runs the world because everybody is running around telling the truth and he's just saying whatever he wants. Yeah, yeah, but but yeah, I do think the jump scares, I think are cheap. You know what's interesting, and we're kind of you mentioned this a bit with Okay, hold.

On, I just I want to get this out before you go on on this. Yes, they're cheap, but sometimes I think they are necessary to abruptly change the focus and the mood of the viewer. Right, It's an easy way to do it. And I think while they're not looked on as like these great cinematic segues. I think that they do play a vital role in horror movies.

Well see, and this is hard going to be hard for both of us to accept, and like, your kids kind of even opened my eyes to this a little bit with the story you told me about forty seven meters down.

Where they said rage fait, Yeah.

Jump scares. I think are getting filed into cliffhangers? Do I like cliffhangers on TV show? You bet your ass on the cliffhangers? I love them, like, oh, I can't wait till next season. I hate it in the moment, but then I like this, Yeah, you show a cliffhanger to a gen Z and they're like, what you couldn't figure out how to end the season. Why do you have to do this cheap thing to keep me coming back? Why can't you just tell a full story?

But it is kind of an immature way of looking at it, right that that's not how television is made. That's not how like we're trying to. We're trying to get people. If you're a showrunner, if you're a producer, you know, if you're a writer, you're trying to get people falling into your world, and that you don't want them to escape, right if you resolve something, and I know we're on the cliffhangers now.

We'll get back to them scars.

But if you resolve something, what's the impetus to come back to that? You know?

Other than season four of Dexter, every season is a self contained season, and realistically even season four is self contained. But there's just a major moment at the end of it that definitely changes the trajectory of the rest of the show gets you excited. Every season ends with Dexter catching the serial killer. There is no indication that another serial killer is out there. Yeah, for all you know, that was the end of the show and then the next season.

Sometimes sometimes I think they write right at that, like Euphouri, you just had their season.

Financial Yeah, I wanted to ask you. That's how I meant to start this show, to see how you felt about that. I know what happened because it's all over the internet.

Super powerful. Yeah, okay, and it's weird because I had a brother die of addiction. Yeah, st I had a brother die of addiction. I thought this episode was great. He hated it, you know, so it's kind of polarizing or whatever. I thought it was amazing. Anyway, it was the season finale. There's nobody. Nobody has said anything. HBO isn't commented if they're going to bring back for season four or whatever. I think if they do, it'd be kind of weird. Yeah, but they might. There's an zero

He knows he a younger guy.

It's weird. He's I think he's like my age. Okay, but he dated Ellen Barkin. I think not Ellen Barkin, who is the woman in al Pacino's right hand man in Ocean's thirteen.

That woman, Oh yeah, I know you're talking about it.

I think it is Ellen Barking. I think that's her name, and he's she's like twenty years old, and he was like dating.

Or when he was something. I was just interested.

He's a weird guy like he and obviously a lot of the stuff that he did on Euphoria, people are like, oh my god, I can't believe they're putting this on televisions. And he battled addiction to you know in his so he's he's an interesting cat anyway. But yeah, I think he's like he's like my age or whatever. But I think that's what you do if you are lucky enough to get your show on a streaming service or on

The greats Game of Thrones basically, most seasons would end with like not everything resolved, but like if you notice, go back and watch episode ten of every season and like the last fifteen minutes is all the different groups of people, Like it'll be like, say, I John Still will be like, well, I guess I'm gonna go Worth of the wall. He shows the door opening and he's walking out there, and then it's like that's the last time you see him for the season. It's not necessarily a cliffhanger.

It's like is that the last time we saw him forever?

No? Oh, okay, well, yes, but I meant like the first time when he finds the Wild Wings and he meets you know, nothing, Yeah, but.

Like you know they're together in real life. Yeah.

Yeah. But or even Breaking Bad, like in season two, it ends with the plane crash. It doesn't really leave much up to be desired, but you just know waltz actions led to the playing.

I think it's a little bit different for Breaking Bad and it like you don't like, it's like, okay, so I wonder how much more evil he's gonna get.

The only real cliffhanger in that show was the Gael cliffhanger. It's like, oh my god.

That was a cliffhanger. And then I would contend that because they split the last season.

Into two, Okay, that's fair.

The mid when they had the Yeah, that was actually more.

Of a cliffhanger than the Gael thing because it was definitely dead.

Well I mean think about like it was just intense. This is way before your time. But on Dallas in the eighties, which was the nighttime soap opera, they had the who Shot Jr? Right Now. Back then, there was no YouTube there's no streaming or whatever. You had broadcast tving. That was it. I mean, Ben, that's all anybody was talking about who shot Jr? And you had to wait several months, you know, to find out who it was.

Kristin Sheppard over here thinking, I don't I saw the who shot mister Burns special?

Well that was? That was But I mean that's just that's a parody.

So but yeah, So I mean, like the to bring it full circle, I mean, for the record jump, let's get back before we do. I do want to say, just because it feels like we're on opposite size, it's just to be clear, Bulky and I agree. I am pro Cliffhanger.

Yeah, I like say I like them too.

I'm saying young people, I'm saying it is it's because we are of a certain era and that era does not exist anymore.

Which I think is dumb. I mean, like, okay, give the people what they want. Of course, what do I always say the old adage if if you give the people what they want, they'll make it for free and they.

Won't see what you are producing.

Yeah, So I mean to me, rat, I mean think about walking debt when when they had the vegan thing.

See the only reason that show lasted as long as it freaking did. I think that's actually what made the discourse about cliffhangers a thing was oh, not.

Not paying that often that it could have been.

Start be sure because it was just like the first person view with the blood coming down at the end of the scene, you didn't know who it was.

Yeah, and people were trying to suppruder it, like with the angle that and then they totally flip it on its head when they come off.

That was great. But I think that but like even the zapruder thing, like, to me, that's fun. Yeah, I think that builds a community. I think people like it everyone.

But I'm telling you there there's I mean, think about all these idiots, not idiots because they're great, but all these people that don't have anything to do, like I think about and granted emergency awesome is I mean he gets paid to do that or his YouTube channel or whatever. But like all these Marvel people that I mean, they're breaking think about they just must if there's like.

You look at this license plate, they just must.

Live on Reddit and they anytime any hair brain conspiracy theory gets posted on there, they take it and run with it, and they have to look at every So to me, yes, you are probably right that this now current generation does not like the cliffhang or whatever. But there are still people out there who are megafans of whatever content it is, Yeah, that love falling into that world and coming up with stuff on their own.

Maybe this is gonna happen. Maybe this is gonna happen.

Whereas the people who don't really care about it are just like, ah, I could have that's that's not for me.

And I'm at the point where, like I got mad when ant Man didn't die at the end of ant Man three, like cause there was a stretch in the mid two thousands when like the Two Towers ended on a cliffhanger, Pirates of the Caribbean, dead Man's Chest ended on a cliffhanger. Like I was almost to the point where like when the movies.

Did dead Man's Chest, Oh that was the first one, that was the second one.

Yeah, and Barbosa comes back. Johnny Depps been eitten by the crack. It was awesome and uh, and it was like, why can't you finish the movie? I'm like, no, this is great. More movies should be doing this. This is fantastic, But more movies don't do it because you just never know. Of course, yeah you do with pirates, but yeah, exactly. But so I'm pro cliffhanger, and I'm pro jump scare, even though that might be a little bit outdated as

Well you okay, so at at at this point you're pro jump scare. But you can also say that they're cheap.

Yes, yes, as are cliffhangers. Cliffhangers are I don't keep me coming back. Just tell a good story and I'll be back. But that's part of the story. The cliffhanger is the story. I don't think cliffhangers are cheap. I think cliffhangers are necessary plot device you have. Oh my god, Ben, it's it's it's I mean, that's how you know you've got something. If people genuinely have a strong view on your cliffhanger, then you have created something awesome. Right.

If people don't care, your story sucks, go back to the draw on board.

You know what I mean.

The cliffhanger I think is what shows you what you've got. You know that that's kind of like, uh, it tells you how good of a storyteller you are, tells you how good you are of creating not only arcs, but beats that that go into this as well. So I think that that is see, I guess, And it's difficult. You can't really do it in film unless you unless.

Disney property right, Star Wars, whatever the situation is. But I mean, but like, so think about this all right. Now we're back on and again we promised will move on. But I do want to I do want to just highlight this because like it's technically not a to me. Maybe we're just saying the word differently. But like when Tyrian kills taiwin Lanbster at the end of season four and he gets on the boat and Varius is like, godspeed, my friend, we're gonna send you on the boat, and

I get it.

So I guess that's I guess my.

There's different versions of it, right, because you know, you know that he killed him, right or do we see him die?

You hear the bell toll? So I guess it's.

Pretty pretty obvious. But then you also you're like, Okay, what's next, you know, because you can't have something of this magnitude without repercussions, so that.

What next feeling is still there despite.

It's not necessarily a cliffhanger. It's like more of like a mountain view exactly exactly.

It's a bigger view what's to come exactly, And so I kind of feel like that's funnel in there, and I think it's no coincidence because both of these movies. Not going to say neither one of them had jump scares, because that'll be real. There was a moment in back

I was like, wait, yeah, that was that was pretty cool. Okay, I would save that for next week because I have so much to say about that. But in this one too, there's a scene with Sarah and Bear in a car in the middle of the night.

Mm hmm.

You knew what was coming once that scene started. I thought it was great pacing where you kind of lose yourself in the conversation. And even though I knew almost to exactly what did happen. Ben, Yeah, even though I knew what was coming, it's still totally caught me by surprise. It's great Marcus storytelling. Well, I don't know how you felt about that, but I totally because I was I had it in my mind. And that's like another device

I actually read a think piece about it afterward, and it's very interesting because they were claiming, and this was a younger writer who wrote it, and it said Obsession and by extension, Back Rooms are two movies that are finally, according to this person, ushering in a new style of filmmaking.

And that's kind of what I wanted to get into this.

They essentially said that the twentieth century style of filmmaking. And I don't necessarily agree with this, but again, I was, you know, a child in the twentieth century, so I love a lot of those movies. But they said that style of movie making has clung to existence twenty five years too long, and it's so nice seeing a new way of delivering story.

What was the style of movie making? Now? Is he talking about? I A should say he or she?

I don't know, Yeah, I don't remember.

Okay, But what are they talking about when they're talking about movie making? Horror movie making or.

I think it's movie making in general. Like I had a moment and I think John Wick kind of knocked me out of it where I was like, man, I don't know if I can do another stupid random action movie, like they all hit the same beats, and then John Wick kind of took it to this new artistic creative length and then kept upping the ante bought that genre

Now, I think this more applies to back rooms than than obsession, But I'll say it anyway, because both these guys had a YouTube background, isn't YouTube a great trial for for whether this is gonna play or not?

You know, And I'm hopeful people realize that. Try it out there, see what happens, Take it mainstream.

And then take it to a new level, right, take it to take it to the to the next step or whatever. So I think and and we'll we'll make this a two part conversation because I think we definitely want to explore.

This with backups as well.

The horror films I grew up on, you know, the Halloween and the Yeah, exactly, Yeah, that sort of like ushered in the Slashers.

Yeah.

What were the horror movies before that? Were they just the monster stuff like with Frankenstein and the Mummy and Dracula or whatever.

Yeah, I mean, Halloween one came out in seventy eight. Like it's hard to pinpoint, I know, Like The Hills Have Eyes were the early seventies.

Okay, Texas Chainsaw asking, that's our last.

House on the left was the early seventies. But so like they were starting this experiment a little bit. But once Mike Myers came out with a budget of like a thousand dollars or whatever it was, and made a hundred million, right. It was like, oh, so we're doing this forever now and bupah bub about a billion there. Okay, hell, alien was Halloween, but an alien terminator is Halloween, but a machine like so many other genres you don't even realize, are just slasher films done up a different way.

So it's interesting you say that, because what did we get after the slasher films? And I would say it was these weird kind of meta I.

Was gonna say it was the meta slasher films.

So you had like, you know, the screams obviously I think set the standard for that, and then you had urban legend. So it was kind of like we didn't we didn't go to the next step of horror films. We just kind of went meta and and you know explored, you know, like exploring these horror films from an audience's point of view, kind of if that makes sense, And so that and you have to look at that like, well, why why did we stop evolving?

Why are why are wait, Well, that's where the term elevated horror.

So that's what, yes, exactly, So then the elevated horror comes in, and that's and that's and I think back rooms like really exhibits it, but but there were definitely elements of it in obsession. It's cheap to do it.

It it it.

Plays with your expectations, with audience expectations, right, and it allows and I said this before, it allows filmmakers and directors to really drive home the point, at least to me, of what making me wonder what's going.

On all screen that I'm not seeing? Oh?

Sure, And I think sometimes you see that with backrooms with all the negative space, and you know, it's it's really creepy. It's super creepy.

It's creepy. But it also mixes it with the horror movies of the eighties, which I still maintain. I love the eighties is horror that I think it's fantastic. But that was like, oh, isn't this big thing chasing you scary? Whereas the back rooms like fundamentally and we'll get into that or like, let's even just use obsession as a standpoint as a viewpoint, since that's when we're discussing today. Is for anybody who might be subconsciously be like, oh my god, what if I'm going to die alone? And

I think social media and the way that we consume content on X, Facebook, Instagram, TikTok has changed the way that kids are growing up, the way that teenagers are involving, the way that adults are people who are adults now who kind of grew up in this. I think it plays off that a little bit because the things that

I yeah, no, absolutely absolutely, And I don't want to say what I thought was going to happen at the end of Obsession, because there's only so many ways these kind of movies can end, and I don't want to take now.

I don't know about that. I think you could take it a few different ways.

So do you think I can say because.

I was running, let me say this, let me say this. Ben Barker last month said he's considering a sequel to the to Obsession, okay, or an anthology television series where each episode explores a different character making a wish.

Oh wow.

If there was only one or a few ways that you can end it, they wouldn't be considering a television series. I think there's a lot of different ways think about Twilight Zone. I mean all the crazy stuff that that show brought us, you know, of like all the different things that what I always say, this is your Twilight Zone.

It just I watched a couple episodes. I was very disappointed. Yeah, which is a shame, all right. So you know what's funny though, we talked about learning the right lessons in Hollywood. I even made a joke to a friend of mine. I was like, what Hollywood should be learning is no cgi practical effects, pay new actors, good money to do good jobs. It said. What they'll actually learn is we need to make a cinematic universe out of this. Yeah, but I'm here for it. I'd watch it.

Yeah.

But okay, so I'm gonna say it. I'm gonna look at what time it is now, and if you think I've gone too far, I'll just take this part out of the puncast. What are we doing for time are? We're at fifty four minutes okay, based on the trailer. So just to make it clear, I'm not going to say anything that anybody listening me. Yes, he's talking to the guy on the phone about the rules. He's like, hey, can I that was in the trailer? Yep, he says,

I was like, I hate when they spoil movies in the trailer.

Yeah, and then I saw the movie, I'm like, oh, And like I think because I was so sure I figured out the movie before it even started, Like I wasn't even considering that it was going to go a different direction. And so I think I was very pleasantly blindsided by the way things ultimately ended up going. And so I'm telling you right now, if you out from the trailer, that's why the movie is gonna end, you're dumb.

And you're not dumb, but it's just it's just thought. Well, so yeah, that I was telling you about that how to Rob a Bank. When I watched that trailer on YouTube, the top comment was did I just watch the whole movie question, which I think, like, there's a reason that these trailers are structured that the way. I mean, think about how much time and effort Marvel has gone into

No, Yeah, you go ahead.

Well, no, should I rate it first? Because I you, I feel like you always do. Yeah, I'm gonna give this one a seven and a half. Really okay, then I'm gonna go eight. I'm gonna go eight because I feel like I like this better than you. I I never you know, Monkey's Paw? What was the other one that you mentioned? Wish Master? I never saw any those, Okay, So to me, for me, this was original. I can't remember seeing a film, a horror film with this, you know,

Ye, we'll see her again, and uh what what was it?

Yeah?

He was?

He was good too, He was very good. Could have used more Andy Rickter, otherwise I would have gave I'm just kidding no.

But for the.

Originality, the execution of this was was really good and and just like just the he b gbis, I had feeling that I was feeling after this film, I feel like that's that's what the desired effect was, like were you you are? And I remember when my boss or one of my bosses, I should say, saw the what's the ben Gone girl? Right? Is that what it was called? Ben Affleck? And what's her name? She's in the new.

I always forget her name. I feel so bad.

He's like, man, I'm glad.

I love my wife.

Man, I'm glad. Yeah, my wife and I have a good marriage. And I feel like that's that's the idea. And I got done watching that movie. I'm like, God, I'm so glad. I was not one of those characters in the in the in this film. So it really gave me the willies. I enjoyed it so yeah, solid it.

And like I said, it reminded me of a full length feature.

Vertical surprise giving it seven and a half given that you have seen, oh yeah, but like.

That's a testament to how well done it was in my opinion, because I think if it were worse acting, if it were more generic, like you know, if there were just been like too hot dumb actors through it, like not to say people are in tract in this movie, but you get the point, Like the type of movie I'm talking you guys know the kind of movie I'm talking about. And the eye candy carries it, yeah, exactly,

Of They've made all these movies. What are you gonna do new with it?

Yeah? I don't know. I'd have to think about it. I have to think about it perspective of my own life. The you know.

The other thing too with with this podcast, we always talk about the themes.

M hmm.

What's the theme in this one? The grass isn't always greener?

I think it's more so about not not your boy. Uh. Surf Fry might not like this this element of it, but I think it's more so from like a female independence standpoint and like learning how to like accept like put it out there except no for an answer, take your chances, and if it's not there, there's plenty of other fish in the sea.

But he never put it out there no, because he'd rather just.

Force it to happen. Because like, that's just it. It's that's when the movie's good.

Maybe it's like maybe it's the dangers of being an introvert. Ye.

See, this is why Avatar sucks is because like a six year old didn't look at Avatar.

See this sentence.

Yeah, well because because you okay, hear me out. You watch the Avatar, You're like, okay, fine, I get it. The military sucks, the environment's great, I understand the point. Like you could not beat me over the face with this more than you have for the last three bleeping hours.

I feel like I went two feet below the surface of this and you went twenty you know which you could be right, you know, Yeah, it makes sense.

That's what I took and I haven't read anything about it. That was just that's the beauty of arts, that's how That's what I took out of it here. And I've got some theories about back rooms as well, which is what we actually have like the next basically the whole freaking summers planned out for us.

At this point, it's insane with what we're going to be doing. The first this is this would be the first weekend of June, and the summer releases have not disappointed. There's there's a ton of stuff coming out. We're going to try to do as much as possible. Yeah, I'm sure there were we already we were making cuts before we went on today. We had Yeah, it's just there's so much good stuff, and we like July. When July hits, dude, that's gonna be huge. Yeah, for for blockbusters too, and

He spent in a bunch of stuff. Black mana black mana from Yeah, from Alkamenia. They're the same actor.

Yeah, wow, Yeah, he was in something else. Oh, he was wonder Man. Yeah, he's in this new movie that's based on a true story where Mark Wahlberg is like a mob Abdula McKean is this Abdomanteen, is this FBI agent. Wahlberg is this hitman for the mob, And they're trying to hit the hit man, sorry, hitman for the mob. And this is set in sol exactly and set in the late nineteen sixties, and there's all this civil unrest in the South, and there's all these murders of black

Stonewall that I advertised.

I just saw it today. I just saw to him. So they hire Mirk Wahlberg, who is a mob hitman to like be this guy's partner. He does all the stuff that the FBI agent can't do. It's you know, it looks heavy on action Wahlberg comedy or no, it's yeah, it's definitely a drama. Okay, but it looks awesome. So and that one comes out.

September as well. Okay, we are. We are, however, going to be doing Backrooms next week, which we have seen already obviously, as you can tell. But I I just succumbed to the hype and we'll have some interesting conversations about.

That and just to get everybody's appetite. I really enjoyed Obsession, as you did too. Yeah, so it's very difficult from the next movie I see to sort of like be really enjoyable. Yeah, and I like Backrooms better, which is not only a testament to how good the film was, but the fact that I saw it after I saw a movie I really liked, and I actually like Backrooms better. I think we're in for a treat for the listeners are in for a treat next week.

I would like to burn you on on the record, though, and I'd like to see since we already saw these movies and we basically have seven days to do whatever. Yeah, watch Cube, just the first one, Just the first one, all right? Uh? And and because I went ninety between ninety seven and ninety nine, I don't remember exactly, but it was the late nineties, I didn't see it till college. I've seen it one time since then. I'm going to

Okay, so I can't keep up. Yeah, I feel that I don't even know what an incel is.

But yeah, so it's going to be back rooms, very surreal film next week and looking forward to jumping into that. Thanks for listening, guys,