Jenna Fischer - Pt. 2

freaking Jay. Now, over the years, Jenna and John have been asked approximately eight billion questions about Jim and Pam's relationship. So I have to say I almost didn't even want to ask them about it, but but I did, and I was blown away by how interesting it was to talk about Jenna in particular, shared so many incredible insights into their relationship and and what made it unique on television, and why she and John are actually not a couple in real life, and trust me, they are not anyway.

That is just the beginning. This conversation was so fascinating, as every conversation with Jenna is. I cannot say enough good things about her. So go ahead and welcome to

your ear holes. Miss Jenna Fisher, Bubble and Squeak. I love it, Bubble and Squeaker, Bubble and Squeaker cooking at every More lived from the I was literally laying in bed last night thinking about this, Like if you think about the office as like a person or a body or something, Pam was the heart and your relationship with so many different people, well, with everybody, but really those three, you know, Jim and Dwight and Michael, obviously the relationship

with Jim. Why do you think that that relationship resonated so much with with audiences? Oh, I think it's the unrequited love. I think we've all been there. We've all been in love with someone who either didn't love us or couldn't love us, or because of circumstances or distance or whatever these things were, we're keeping us from being

able to fully express our feelings. The longing. And then I think additionally the clear chemistry between the characters that you could see that they were meant to be together and you just rooted for them absolutely. But I think that there was also something about your performance and John's performance. You showed such heart and vulnerability that I think people were really rooting for you, whether they had found what they wanted to or not. Well. I think both Pam

and Jim are very good people. They're polite. It's one of the reasons why it takes them so long. And uh, I think you always want the good guy to win, so I think you did want them to find one another and be together. It's hopeful, right. Um, Nothing throughout the entire his tree of the show brought production to a screeching halt, like a big Jim Pam moment. It's true, and I say that with love and also with utter frustration.

It Um, Yeah, we really really cared. I mean John and I would fight hard for what we believed and we were usually on the same page with Jim and Pam. We were had like a singular mind when it came to Jim and Pam. For the most part, there was often one Jim Pam moment per episode, and it was either where they're going to connect in some super special swoony way, or they're gonna misstep in some way where one of them gets their feelings hurt. And there was this very fine line that we had to walk all

the time. So, for example, shooting a scene over and over and over again where this time they can touch hands, but then we have to do one where they don't touch hands because it might be too much when their hand if their hands touch, that might be going to fall are Or do we end it with a hug? Or should he kiss her cheek? Before all of these little ways, how much were they allowed to literally touch one another, look at each other's eyes, swoon at each other?

I mean we would we would spend hours debating and shooting alternates of these Jim Pam scenes and ours is not an exaggeration. But what's amazing is this wasn't like mystical producers in another land talking about it. This was you and John who are in there in question? No, No, not at all. No. I mean, I think it speaks to the two of you as artists, but I think

that there's also the camera as a character. And what I recall is you and John, specifically with greg Or Ken or one of the other directors, you know, sort of two major questions, who is seeing this moment? Is the camera seeing this moment? And how does that change my behavior in this moment? And those were the things that I feel like well brought production to a screeching hold.

This was one of the most fun elements of working on our show was this camera as a character, because this idea that when you know the camera is filming you, it affects your behavior. It certainly affects Michael's behavior. When he knows the camera is on him, he performs for the camera. He does things like makes giant declarations and pledges of money to Oscar's nephews Walkathon in front of

the camera. But then when he doesn't know that the camera is shooting through the blinds, he tries to talk his way out of it. So that is so fun to play. And similarly with Jim and Pam, how do Jim and Pam behave when they know they're being watched and observed, and then how do they behave with one another when they can't see the camera when the camera is deep in the kitchen shooting through the blinds. I absolutely loved those nuances. Those were some of the most

fun things to play with on our show. Yes, well, and when I directed, and I'm not just saying well what I directed to get in the fact that I directed, But there was a moment later on season eight, Kathy Lindsay broad like Kathy and Jim goes away to Florida, and Cathy's clearly trying to get the moves on him. It's taking place in Jim's bedroom and we had to shoot.

The only way to shoot the room was through the windows, because if the cameras were in the room, we would not have gotten the interaction between Kathy and Jim that we ultimately wanted. But then there was a phone call with Pam. You with Pam that happened there and I remember sitting in You weren't Invalencia, You were probably home. Did I not come because I have a very vivid memory of being there when Jim was a smug bedbug?

Was that your episode smug Bedbugs? I have a memory of watching Rain and John crack up as John was a smug bedbug. I think that you came for the phone call. But we had a huge conversation about you were involved in what the interaction was between Kathy and Jim, because John wanted you involved and you wanted to be involved, and how that interaction, what that meant for your relationship with Jim. Anyway, I think it just speaks to everybody wanting to get it right. Yeah, we cared on this

show very deeply. Everybody cared very very much, And I think that started with Greg. Greg's heart was in this show, and you could tell, and he delighted. He delighted in getting it right, and and we would shoot something and we would all look over at the monitors at Greg and see if he was doing his little handclap with his little smile, and he puts his eyes up in the air, you know, because that's when we knew we nailed it. And he was such a great barometer for that.

When did you When did you start realizing or noticing that Jim and Pam's relationship was becoming so important to people outside and was it infringing on your real life? Well, realizing that my friend John and I couldn't go anywhere in public together as friends or else people would lose their minds. They didn't know how to deal with that. They didn't know how. And even today people don't know how John and I are not a couple in real life.

They don't understand it. And I don't know how to explain it because it's a little bit like telling kids there's no Santa. It's like I don't want to break anyone's heart. So it's hard. It's it's really hard. You should just explain that he's a real pain in the as in real life. Why would you not just say that? But that's weird. I have to. I feel like I have to justify why John and I, which are actually in love, And the bottom line is we were playing characters.

But I know that if people think of us as John and Jenna, then it's destroying some of the magic of Jim and Pam. But I'm not Pam in real life and he's not Jim in real life, and in real life we're mismatched. He is perfectly matched with Emily and I'm perfectly matched with Lee. And you know us all both, And in fact, I feel like if anyone wants to marry anyone, they want to marry Emily or Lee, they don't want to actually marry me or John. Is that a good description of why John and I are

not imagined real life because you know us both. Yes, I think that that's a great description. I also think, yeah, you both were playing characters, and I think that you um, and you've expressed today how different you are from Pam and John is different from Jim. People perceive you to be that even you know, if someone has a couple of minute interaction with me, they're they're not going to mistake me for Kevin. And I think that's so true

of like Angela as well. Angela is like a bubbly cheerleader. She's your best friend in two minutes. She's so not the bitchy Angela Martin that she plays on the show most of the time. Oh come on, but but I do see how John and I the Lion is a little more blurred, Like you can have an interaction with John and I and think maybe that we really are just like Pam or just like Yim. Yes, yeah, um, okay. Do you have a favorite moment or moments between the

two of you that you've got to play together? Yes. One of my first favorite moments is when we are up on the roof eating the grilled cheese sandwiches and you and Rain are doing at the fireworks out in the lawn. And that was super special because we had this skeleton crew. Everyone had gone home for the day and up until this point we had mostly only ever been shooting in a big group in the office with lots of people, and here it was just me and John on some lawn chairs. It was a summer evening,

like a warm breeze, candlelight. Greg is up on the roof, just a couple of crew members were up on the roof, and it was like so peaceful up there, the five of us and then watching you and Rain, who I believe we had no way of communicating with, yeah, just setting off fireworks. It just all felt really real and lovely. So that moment is one of my favorite moments. And what I'm gonna do is I'm gonna edit out you're talking about Greg and the other two crew members up there,

because then you're describing city there with John. That's why people think it's a warm summer breeze and we were sitting in lawn chairs on the roof. But some of it like it's true. It's like, you know, Matt Son is up on the roof and Greg is there, and we're all just none of us can believe we're on

the roof. And we had to take this. They had this old rickety rusted ladder that was on the side of the roof that everybody else climbed up, but since John and I were cast members, we weren't allowed, so they like fork lifted us up there on this wearing a weird harness. It was very funny. Um, were you worried when Pam and Jim got married that was gonna screw things up? I wasn't because we had been together

now for a couple of seasons. So I think the question was can they get together and be a stable couple and will we still care? And and I remember having a conversation with Greg where Greg was like, well, you know what's going to lose people is if we just keep manufacturing these affairs and these you know, weird ways that we keep them apart. That's exhausting and it's not realistic. And so what we're going to need to do is bring them together and then give them obstacles

to overcome as a couple. So, rather than obstacles that keep them from being a couple, give them obstacles to break through as a couple, like Pam wanting to go to art school or Jim wanting to start his own business, or having their first kid or whatever these things were that they were going to have to weather the storm together, that that would be more interesting and more realistic, and

people loved it. I think that's so smart, so smart because but he said, you know what's not going to be satisfying is if they get together at the end of season nine after multiple affairs, and like everyone's gonna be like, Yay, I guess you know. Congrats. I hope you enjoy your marriage with all your horrible baggage. Look totally right. That's not a happy ending. I've never heard that is so smart. Yeah, okay, so I talked again

about sort of that emotional core. Dwight. Talk to me a little bit about the relationship between the two of you and how that changed and evolved. I mean, you were with Jim adversaries and made you crazy forever, and then ultimately by the end, he says that you're his best friend. Dwight, doesw does you know? I think it's that first episode the Injury, when Pam has that line, Dwight is kind of my friend. But I think there's

other things. You know, Jim and Pam spends so much time teasing Dwight, and I think even go too far. A few times in my rewatching of the show, I think there's a few times when we're like, actually a little cruel to him that makes me cringe and I feel like, oh, that wasn't our best moment, but I appreciate because we allow our characters too. We don't all every day have perfect moments, right. But it's so hard for me to think about Pam's relationship with Dwight without

thinking about my relationship to Rain. Rain is a deeply soulful person. He's also like a curmudgeon ly old man. He's really cranky sometimes, and on set he would be hilarious. Do you remember the time do you remember the time he declared, Oh my god, it was so funny. We were getting ready to shoot and he said, hold on, wait, just hold on, everybody, hold on for a second. I have an announcement. Everyone on Monday's you do not need to ask me how my weekend was anymore? All right,

every single person asked me how my weekend was. Just assume it was fine. We were like, where is this coming from? Right? And I talked to him about this, and he goes, Jenna, that is not true. I said that on a Tuesday. I said, only asked me how my weekend was on Mondays. No more of this bleeding into Tuesday Mondays. And he went crazy because you and I know what he was talking about. Because it's five o'clock in the morning, and every single person that you

passed is like, hello, good morning. How was your weekend? And he what he was saying was like, you don't have to talk to me. We just saw each other on Friday night. We're good, We're good. Yes, it's so true. So he would be like that guy on this set. It was like so funny. But then at the same time, in moments of deep crisis, I have phoned him. I had a job offer that was going to take me out of town and would uproot my family for a period of time that I really wrestled with the decision.

I called him and he counseled me. He is he has that in him, a type of counselor, and I value him so deeply in my life. But then like like he'll call me up and he'll be like, do you want to go to lunch? And I'm like, yeah, I mean because you sound like you want to go so bad, Like is it a chore or do you want to go? Just like no, I want to lunch with you, Like all right, let's go to lunch. And then you go to lunch and I was just sort of like, are you liking our lunch. Are we having

a good lunch? How are you tell me about you? And all this so funny, but then like if I were to do you know what I mean? So it's like very much like the Pammed White where Pam will

like be like, oh, I love Dwight. I'm gonna go say something nice to him, and then he'll just be like, Pam, something about knives, something about snakes or bears, and she's like, yeah, okay, right, okay, But so I guess, um, I feel deeply loved by Rain, and I think Pam fell deeply loved by Dwight as well, Like they had a real bond, they really cared for

one another eventually eventually yeah. Um. Well, and it's similar to your relationship with Michael, right, I mean from where that relationship started and him fake firing you to him leaving and you you having sort of that final moment with him, Um, what did he say to you? Well, it wasn't so much what he said to me. Um. Paul Fie directed that episode Goodbye Michael, and Uh we were at the airport and Paul Fiq said, Jenna, I want you to just run up and just say goodbye.

To Steve. Your friend, Steve, this is your last scene with him, so say goodbye. We're not going to use the sound. We're just going to have a spy shot on you. So I thought, okay. So I ran up to Steve and I just told him all the ways I was going to miss him and how grateful I was for his friendship and the privilege of working with him. And I'm sobbing, and he's sobbing, and we're hugging and and I didn't want to let him go, and I

didn't want the scene to end. And then finally paulfy you know, says cut and he was like, Jenna, that was that was brilliant. Can you do it again? But just a little faster because it had been like five minutes. He was like, we just need to tighten it up a little because they wanted him to actually work ahead and they had one camera. There was only one shot that they couldn't edit. Is so great. I was like, just tighten it up a little, but sweetie, great job.

I guess he could tell. I was like sobbing. Yeah. In thinking back, honestly, when he Steve leaving to me was almost more emotional than the show ending. Well, the thing is is that it wasn't just the character of Michael that we were losing. We were losing the captain

of our ship, Steve Carrell. And I don't think that I can say enough how important him as our leader was, because just the kind of man he is, his work, ethic, his kindness, his generosity, there was no ego, and to be led with that, along with Greg's heart, it was very frightening to me that we were losing him. He was our compass that pointed us north and us all in line, and I really worried what's it gonna be

like on set without him. We just all agreed he was the most important person on set, and we always wanted the day to be easy for him. He had the most lines, he had the most work, he had to drive the show, and we all just collectively were there to support him. And he was so generous. I mean I remember, I remember directors would come in who were new and they wouldn't be able to find Steve, but he'd just be sitting on the couch. By reception,

We'll be like, oh, he's right there. Because he was so he wasn't like and I'm here, kind of guy. You know, he was just and I and I say this because after working on the Office, I've worked on many projects where this is not the case, and I see how that infects a group of people when there is someone who is leading the ship, who is insecure and needs a constant an ego boost, And it makes me even more grateful for how Steve was and how

he is still. I also remember Will Ferrell coming in and guesting with us, and then I've done movies with Will Ferrell and he's the same way. And I always thought, wow, they really have a competition for like greatest person to work for work with Steve and Will just like nicest man in Hollywood. But um so, my biggest fear was even just what is the onset vibe going to be like without Steve? Not to mention what stories are we

going to tell? Who are we without this leader? And I'll say it here and this is the only time I've ever really publicly said this, but it's always disappointed me that we didn't trust in our core office group enough to continue the show without bringing in what I think we thought we needed, which were these big guest actors to fill steve shoes. And I always felt like fear drove some decisions two that I does that make sense?

It does make sense. Yeah, I always wondered just what would that season have been like, like what we then got with season nine, where we said, no, we're enough, the bench is deep enough, the talent is there. We can keep the ship afloat with what we have. Right. I don't know how you feel about that season eight. No, I hear what you're saying. I think that there was fear and what would happen if we didn't have someone

else helming? Because being the boss changes the character. Yeah, so Dwight as the boss is not Dwight, that's right. Dwight is the character who wants to be the boss, who's always angling to be the boss, but who had does not actually have the authority. So if you make him the boss, then who is that guy? So it does make sense that they felt like they're needed to be and that was the question who should be the boss?

This was the conversation you should be the boss? I mean I remember being up in the writer's room and people ask me who I thought should be the boss, and I was like, guys, I don't know, I don't know. They were still trying to get like anybody's opinion, Like, does anyone have a perspective on this? Well? And I think as a character it was Jim. I mean I think Jim was the most I mean he was lazy, he was the most well suited technical level should be

promoted to that job. Correct, Yes, in terms of his interaction with people, his ability to lead and sort of inspire people. But I think then that messes up storylines in a way, that for sure. So I guess you know when you when when we get back to this, it is like, okay, well we need some other force of nature to come in and be the boss of

these people so that they can stay being them. Right, Yeah, I don't know that was that was tricky, but we made it through and we got some great episodes that season, and then we went into season nine where we sort of just didn't have a boss for a while. Remember Andy was our boss, but then he got lost on the boat and then we just sort of we were like, oh, here's an answer, it's an empty office. There's no regional

manager anymore. Um, what did you think about bringing the sound man breaking the fourth while and bringing Brian onto the show? Was there a conference. There was a major conference, many conferences. So for season nine, John and I were producers. We were given those titles because we were brought in to really discuss the Jim Pam arc of the final season, and so we spent a lot of time up in the writer's room talking about all the beats of that

story and what it would be. I did many on camera auditions with various brian's to be the boom operator, and then many discussions about who exactly it should be. There was this one actor who was just phenomenal, who just looked so much like John Krasinski that we had a whole discussion about whether or not he should look too much like John Krasinski, if that would feel like Pam, you know what I mean, and like all this stuff,

and so anyway, I liked that storyline. I thought it was really interesting because another part of season nine was that we were going to release the documentary that you were going to see what how it affects these people's lives for them to see themselves in a documentary, And I think that's really great closure for the show as well. Perfect I think it was an underrated ending of the show. I felt like Greg very clearly had a story that

he wanted to tell. Yeah, And I think that when you're live that you're anticipate and there's almost nothing that can meet your expectations. But I think if you go back and you watch it, you see just the brilliance of how he tied it all up truly. Um, when did you find out that Steve was coming back for the finale? Did you know early on? I feel like I almost always knew, because John and I had been up in the writer's room talking about the finale and

we were sworn secrecy. So I feel like I knew for a pretty long time, and I knew that there was a lot of trickery going on that he was not written into the final script. At the final table read, there was a scene between Dwight and Steve, but it was written between White and Creed, and Creed read the lines at the final table read. And that was because they did not want anyone at the network to know

that Steve was coming back. It was huge secret. They didn't want NBCPR to like, yeah, please it and and to ruin the surprise of Steve being in the finale. UM, what's your memory from that? Were do you more laughy or cry like in the table reads? Oh? I think I cried a little bit every single day. I was a crier at the table read. I was crying. That

was really emotional. That last table read. Chris Workman, our camera operator assistant, took a photo of that last table read that Angela has blown up in her house on her wall. That is fantastic of that last moment right after we said the last line. And then I remember that Pam has the last line of the show, and they had originally scheduled it so that that would be the very last thing we shoot. And I think it was John or some other people said, oh, man, well,

we don't all want to be wrapped. And then Jenna has this talking head and and Greg said something like, oh yeah, yeah, we got to have the last scene be with everybody. And after I finished my talking head, we shot the b roll of me taking the picture off the wall and all of us walking out the door.

And we did it, I don't know how many times, five or six, but we would take the thing off the wall and all walk out and then we would all stand off camera by the elevator, all of us, many of us crammed by this elevator, and there would be this moment where we would wait to see if they were going to say cut going again or cut

that's a wrap. And I'm getting choked up just thinking about that because those seconds of waiting and every time I just wanted them to say cut going again, because I knew when they said that's a wrap, that that was a wrap up. That was it. I'd never shoot the office again. And when they said that's a wrap, I just burst into tears and started hugging the closest people that I could find. And and it was it was really, it was just really really crazy and emotional. Yeah,

will you play that. I thought it was weird when you picked us to make a documentary, But all in all, I think an ordinary paper company like dunder Mifflin was a great subject for a documentary. There's a lot of beauty and ordinary things, Isn't that kind of the point to me? That's that's what Gregg thinks it was about that there's a lot of beauty and ordinary things. What do you think it was about, Oh, Greg Daniels, I

think that's what it was about. Yeah, I do. I also, um, I always thought selfishly because it was my job to view the show through my character. It's not lost on me that when Pam was ready to break free of dunder Mifflin, the show ended. So I always kind of thought it was the journey of a girl becoming a woman, finding herself going out into the world. When we meet her, she's trapped behind this desk, and she sort of slowly moves to sales and then finds the man she loves

and starts this family. And then when she's really ready, she really fights against leaving. And then when she's ready to go, it's all over because the documentary doesn't stop when Michael leaves, so it's not really a documentary about Michael Scott. You know, they decided to stop making the documentary when Pam leaves. That's so interesting. Do you think The Office could be made today? No, I don't think it could. Well, I don't know if it could be

made today. It's a good question. Well, first of all, something I want to point out our question I want to ask you is people always ask us if we're all really friends in real life, and I don't even think saying that we're friends in real life accurately communicates how deeply I feel for you and everybody. It's a like a love of family, Like I can't explain it. Do you think if we've made this show in the age of smartphones and whatnot, that we would be as

deeply connected? Like? Don't you think? Inc like the circumstances of us being trapped on that set for the first season with no working computers, no phones, no internet, nothing, just a troop of actors and artists trapped in a room for twelve hours a day playing. We never absorbed ourselves and our phones or emails or other work or anything. And I think that that lent itself to part of the magic. And I just wonder if if you try to put us all in a room today, I don't know,

when we just have our phones and our desks. I think that maybe I don't know, Maybe I think that we for sure. What I think is we were a collective group of people with differing backgrounds and experiences and training. It was like we were an old time theater troupe, yes stuck together. And we weren't all famous. No, we came from a place of just wanting to do good work. Well.

When Lee and I got married, I had invited a girlfriend of mine that I'd gone to high school with from St. Louis, and she was so excited to come to the wedding and she said, if they're going to be famous people there, you know? And I said, no, not really, We're not really friends with a lot of famous people, you know. And then she's like, well, are the cast members from the office going to be there?

I'm like, oh, yeah, yeah, there'll be there, and she was like, well they're famous, and I'm like, oh, yeah, that's right. I forgot. But even now today, I don't think of us that way. I still always think of us as the people in the room before anyone cared or anyone knew who we were, and so being on that journey together as well, I think really bonded us. But I don't know if we could make the show today. It's it's really hard to say. It was such a moment in time. Can you make a show today with

total unknown? I don't know, Silicon Valley kind of there's other shows. Well, let me ask why do you think the show is more popular now than it was when we was on. My answer is very simple. The show is excellent. It's excellent. It is absolutely brilliantly executed, and it holds up because it's just that good. Really, But you know it's funny. I started this podcast with Angela where we watch an episode of the Office. We started from the beginning. We break it down. This was not

my this is not a plug moment. We were about to go there in a minute, but anyway, go ahead. Now. What I was going to say is Angela and I are doing this podcast and we have to watch an episode of the Office and then we discuss it. So I've been watching the show from the very beginning. Had you watched the show since they aired, you had not. I had seen a few here and there. I had seen the dinner party I had. I had been in a trailer on a job and I had a teeny

tiny television mounted to the wall of my trailer. Was so small. She'm not joking right now. She just held up her fingers and showed three inches. I don't think the now, it's more like five inches. It was smaller than a laptop screen. It was very tiny, and it's so I was so that's what she said. I was so tickled by it that I took a picture and I sent it to Steve and John and Ed and Angela and all of us who had been in that scene where we were laughing so hard at Michael's tiny

flat screen TV. And then that made me want to watch that episode. So then I went and watched the dinner Party episode, and then a few examples of things like that where you're flipping through and you an episode comes on or something like that. But no, I have not seen most of these episodes since they aired, so it's been really cool for me. And I have to say,

I really get why people are so excited about the show. Like, as I watch it again, I'm really watching it almost as a fan, and it's weird that I'm on it in some ways. When I'm watching myself, I've always thought it was real. I is that a fact? I don't know.

But before I started doing that, I was on Greg to do a reunion special or revived the office in some way, selfishly because I just want to work with all you all again, and because I know Steve has a really good idea, and I thought, let's get Steve's idea going. Come on, Greg, come on, Greg, you gotta do it. Well, now that I've been rewatching the show, I wrote Greg and email recently and I said, Greg, Um, I don't think you should reopen the show. It's it

is so perfect just as it is. Like, I don't think we should now. I was such a champion for doing it for so long, and now I'm realizing maybe it's exactly perfect just as it is, and you don't want to have this weird extra seven years later episode that we made. Um, I don't know. Well, he do have. Here's the beauty is I have the ability to edit out whatever I say right now. I have no interest in it in doing it in a reunion episode. But have you heard Steve's idea. It's a great idea. It

has a good idea. But if we did it in Scranton, Brian, what if that's the thing that we come back for, is we shoot an episode finally in Scranton. Steve's idea? All right, Well, I'm tempting you. But at the same time, I think the show is just perfect as it is. Although we do have an unproduced episode pet Day. There's one episode of the office called pet Day. Well it wasn't shot that we never shot. That's right, I have the script. I have let you do. In fact, I

signed scripts, obviously to give away to charity. I have a gigantic box of scripts that because we would get multiple per week. It was not great for the environment, but we would get more, and they're in my garage and boxes. And I reached in and grabbed one and it was pet Day pet Day? And I thought, what if I had signed that? And I mean, thank goodness, I looked at what the title was, because that could have been true. I could have gotten in trouble for that. Well.

I said to Greg, what if we do a special where we just do a staged reading of pet Day and we all come together and we read pet Day. Wasn't there a reason we didn't do pet Day? Animal cruelty? I believe it was the reason we didn't do pet Day because there's some awful bird death in it or something I can't remember death and a porcupine in Dwight's desk we did, and Angela throws a cat and a cat and one gets frozen. And no, there's Greg must

not like animals. Um, is there anything else anything else that you want covered that you feel like we didn't? I mean, obviously there's so much I know, I know, I don't know you did. You were very good. I can't think of anything, really, I think something that's really interesting to talk about two, because you talk about how there were like the theater people and the comedians, and then there were the improv people, but there were also all of these ways that we were weirdly connected like that.

Phillis and I both grew up in St. Louis, as did Ken kuoppas he grew up in Belleville, Illinois, which is basically St. Louis. And then also our a d rusty mom mood grew up in St. Louis. So there were four of us St Louis's. Then there were a bunch of those Boston guys. You've got John and Steve and b J and Mike Scher. Then the fact that like b J and John went to the same high school and high school, you and Ed went to the

same high school. And Angela and Oscar were in an improv group together, and she walked on set and was like, oh my god, Oscar, you got cast in this. It was a complete shock to her. She'd done improv with Kate. So there were these ways where we'd all been kind of circling each other in this weird way, and then all finally came together. There were so many coincidences in how we were connected to Yes. I remember shooting a scene for webisodes and was in the annex camera on me.

I was shooting a talking head and suddenly I saw Ed Helms walking behind the I was like, Ed, what what are you? And he was there to meet with Greg and about joining the show. This is between season two and three. Yeah, it's crazy. Um, thank you so much. I love you, Brian. I appreciate you coming. I hope this has been some fun. I could talk for hours about our show. I love that you're doing this because I want to hear what everybody says. Yeah, well there

you go. I love you, I love you. Thank you. That is a rap on Jenna Fisher here at the office deep dive Jenna, thank you so much for sharing your time with us. I mean, look, I didn't want to say this to your face, but I think that we all know Kevin was the real emotional core of the office. I mean, you can keep thinking Pam, but I say it's keV Dog. But you were so great here. I'm gonna let you have it. I'll even forgive the

fact that you're a Cardinals fan. Go Dodgers listeners. Thank you so much for joining us, even all your Cardinals fans, and get ready because next week. Oh it's the big one, folks, It's the Big ConA, the big Cheese, the big guy upstairs, Steve Correl. Have a great week. The Office. Deep Dive is hosted and executive produced by me Brian Baumgartner, alongside our executive producer, Langlee. Our senior producer is Tessa Kramer, our associate producer is Emily Carr, and our assistant edit

is Diego Tapia. My main man in the booth is Alec Moore. Our theme song Bubble and Squeak, performed by my great friend Creed Bratton, and the episode was mixed by Seth Olandsky