Best Of - Pt. 1

to me. So for a special treat, I am compiling the best of the best from the Office Deep Dive into a two part episode release. I couldn't include everyone, of course, and I truly do love my entire office family, So go back and listen to any of the episodes you might have missed. But today we're gonna start where it all started, across the pond in jolly old England. In actually in the land that made the very dish that inspired our own Creed Bratton to write this podcast

theme song, Bubble and Squeak. That is, we are going to begin inside the beautiful mind of Ricky Gervais Bubble and Squeak. I love it. Bubble and Squeak on bubble and Squeaker cooking it every month, left over from the night before. Do you remember the first time you met Ben Silverman? Yes, I do. I was walking down the street in London. I think I was going to see my agent, and the phone rang um and he said, Hi, it's Ben Silverman. You don't know me. I wanna I

want to remake the Office for America. And I went, okay, all right. He said, can we meet up? He said, I'm in town. I went right. He said, where are you. I'll come to you. I've gone the cab. I went okay, and I looked up and I said right, I'm right outside Starbucks in ward Or Street and he went, wait there, I'll be down fifteen minutes, and he jumped in a cab. He got I've never met anyone like him. He came and found me because obviously he knew what he looked

like because he'd watched the office. And he talked to me and I said, well, listen, let me introduce you to my agent to get the ball rolling. And I took him in to see Duncan Hayes as my UK still is my UK agent, and that's and that was the beginning of it, and then I can't remember all the details or all the phone calls, but I think the next big step was we sort of auditions show runners and we saw some amazing ones from my favorite

programs of all time. We we chose Greg, and I think we chose Greg not just because of his body's work, which was as good as anyone's and he was a nice chat but I think I think it was because he was the only one that brought up that he thought it was a love story that was very important for me, that the love story. So you know, I didn't want to I never thought of it was, you know,

just the sitcom. You know, you traditionally sitcoms were, as I say, an ordinary guy getting into capers and ending num back at square one, and there wasn't there wasn't really romance. But you know, we stole that from America because you know, and movies, because you know, there was always a love interest in movies and a lot of Americans shows have had more romance and love interests than than ours. That was usually about a grumpy, middle aged man,

so we we like that. And then I can't remember what all of this this was in, but I think it was the Golden Globes where we won for the Office and I won Best Comedy Actor. I think that was the same week. So we went to Ben Silverman's office and I don't know it before and after, but then then and Gregg came to London and that I think that was nearer the time when we were very getting very close to actually start in production. And we

worked out the translation what was slow in America? You know, what was the equivalent of this, and what was the equivalent of that? And do we have this? And what almost did like a blueprint to you know, just americanizing stuff, and then we started. Then we started auditions and and that was it. I do remember at one point, I think before or auditions, or when we were thinking of looking for you know, that David Brent and I think Ben Silverman called me and said why don't you plane?

And I said, well, what were the point of that? I did my best? Now I want to rest. Now I want some I want some other Schmack to do a two D episodes. But mainly my really, apart from the fact that I was lazy and I was terrified of being working hard for seven years, I said no this should be this should be made by Americans for Americans, and I was flattered that they even let us being involved as we were. But you know, it really took

off when they started making their own show. Is the first episode was basically a remake, but then it just got further and further away, and you know, by the end, it yeah, it was it was his own show. And I remember that people were scared because The Office was such a media darling, you know, to a few Americans, even its peak. I remember the Office in America, the

our version. I remember it was the biggest show on BBC America and it had something like one point one million, right, and Ben Dield was saying, listen, there's a lot of people that haven't seen this that won't be prejudiced. But of course, I remember he was worried about the press saying this is a you know this, we love the original, um, and he came up with a really good thing. When they were saying, why would you do a remake for this that the original was perfect, he said, well, why

I wouldn't. I wouldn't make the film of a shitty novel. I'd make a film of the best novel I could find and I thought that was such a clever counter But of course we want to remake of something that's really good. At wine, we do a remake of something that looks terrible, and then soon you know, people forgot that there was original. Some people don't even know there's an original. To most Americans that they have no idea

that this is a remake, and they don't care. And you know, and I imagine most people who love the American Office, they prefer it to the British version. So and which is a great position to be in for me. I remember once it was after syndication and someone, someone on Twitter sent me a tweet that said, the American version of the Office is so much bigger and better than yours. How does that make you feel? And I sent back, fucking rich, Well, there are certainly worse things

to feel. So Ricky was in England more than happy to let the Office take off in a brand new direction. Meanwhile, back in the States, some of our cast was still keeping a close eye on Ricky's work. Rain Wilson in particular had his eye on the prize. Were you aware

of the British version of the Office? I was, I was so my friend Sam Catlin, he had heard about it and he had seen a couple episodes and somehow gotten some like British DVD or something like that, and had like even like an English DVD player or something somehow had advanced copies, and like, you've got to see it. Groundbreaking, amazing, And so we went over like on a special occasionally We've got to watch the Office, and we were blown away. So I was really truly one of the first people

to see it in the United States. It might have been one of the first couple of thousand people to see it in the United States, and just we loved it. And then he would get his hands on a couple more episodes and we'd go back and have dinner and watched like two or three more episodes. So I loved it. And what happened was I got cast in a pilot with Jeanine Garoffalo for ABC. Mark Marin was in it and Bob oden Kirk was in it. And this was this infamous pilot that we did the table read and

they pulled the plug after the table read. So they had sets built, we had locations, we had cast, we had plane tickets. We were flying out the next day, literally the next morning after the table read starts shooting, and uh did the table read? It went terribly, but I guess what, I still got paid. And that was the same pilot season as The Office, kind of the Office didn't really follow a pilot season when it was

first casting, right. So what happened was Vernon Sanders, who's one of the UM executives and NBC executives, right, And I ran into him in the parking lot on the way to this infamous table read, and he's like, hey, we got good news, and I was like, what's that is? Like, we got the rights to make the American version of the Office, and I was like, outside, I was like, oh great, and inside I was like, motherfucker, goddamn it. That's fucking sucks. Because I love the British Office so much.

I didn't have an idea of like even what the American Office would be, or what role I would play or anything like that. But I was just like inside, I was just kicking myself. And then the plug gets pulled on that, and then I called my people and I'm like, hey, I hear about this Office and they're like, yeah, Well. It was a few months to go on that. So fortunately that the space was opened and the door was opened.

The universe works in mysterious ways. Brian, That's right, it does, and so you eventually get a call to go in and meet correct. I was the first audition for the office. I have in my office us at home, framed the audition sheet of Alison Jones the first day of the auditions for the office. And I was number one on that list. So other people on the list, or Jenna Fisher, you can find. It's on my Instagram somewhere. It might even be in my book in the in the photos

included in my books, you guys can find it. But uh, I think Adam Scott audition. I think there were, um there was a lot of great talent that auditioned. My story about that I'll share with you really quick was when Steve left, Alison Jones came to me where he had a little party, a little reception. She came and she goes, I was looking for stuff for Steve that

I thought might be cool. She probably gave that to you, like when she was searching around and she hands me a sheet and it says Kevin, and it says Brian baum Gartner Eric stone Street and Jorge Garcia no kidding. So that was like the final three but oh fantastic. So you although Eric stone Street is way richer than you, he is now he sorry shoot sorry. So yeah. So on that first audition, I auditioned for both Michael and Dwight, and my Michael was just terrible. It was just simply

a Ricky Gervais impersonation. And I knew that I had more of an affinity for the Dwight role. Uh, And I knew that I could really deliver on that. I just felt it in my bones. I'm like, oh, this is me, this is that is exactly my kind of weird. Yeah, well that I mean, you're but you were so different also than Gareth in a British version. I mean he was much crook, yeah, weasily and and Dwight way more

authoritarian and trying to derive power, whereas Gareth seemed more backstabby. Yeah, we're different in a lot of ways and similar in a lot of ways. And it was this incredible luxury to go, Okay, here's Mackenzie Crook, brilliant actor, really strange looking dude, and he killed as Gareth and was so interesting and I get to steal all of his best stuff, and then there's maybe stuff that I can add that's more of my own, so it's win win all around.

So one of the things that Dwight is most known for is saying absolutely ludicrous, preposterous stuff with a total straight face and a dead pan, without any knowledge that what he's saying is ridiculous. And really, Mackenzie did that so beautifully and I really just frankly stole that from him. Another thing I stole from him was the haircut um.

I read an interview with him where he said he went to like just a local barber shop out in like Slough or some you know, suburb of London, and he kind of got the haircut that would be the least flattering for his head and the most ridiculous haircut. And I read that I was like, oh, I want to do that. So I spent time in the mirror figuring out what's the haircut that is going to make

me look the most ridiculous. I have a huge forehead, and I was like, I'm going to frame my forehead perfectly with these little draperies of hair that will highlight the enormity of my carapace. Is that a word? I think it is a word. They aren't even listening. Um, and then like really short on the sides, and then in intense, and then it evolved over time. Yes, the office did have some pretty bad haircuts. Glad to know that dwite style was on purpose. I wonder what Jim's

excuse was. Anyways, now reins on board the office crew. But what about the rest of the team. Ken Kapas, one of our amazing directors, told us about how another very important saleswoman came to be a part of the show. Tell me about what's true and what's what's lore or fairy tale? How did Phillis get cast in the show?

I well, I will tell you what happened. So, um, we were doing uh probably you know, kind of more traditional auditions, and in the room Greg, myself, Phyllis Allison, and the setup was is that I sat next to a video camera and on the other side of the video camera, Phillis was sitting and Phillis was reading off and Phillis was her casting associate. And I hadn't met Phyllis.

All I knew is I was sitting next to her and there was a camera between us and the actors who were auditioning were some of them were kind of playing it to the hilt and kind of working a little too hard. Phillis, meanwhile, was reading her lines in in this very kind of monotonal way, sometimes not even looking up at the actors, just looking down at the sheet of paper. And I just became fascinated with her

and started looking at her. And there was a couple of actors whose auditions I kind of missed because I kept throwing Phillis these glances. And I finally, during a break, I took Greg aside and I said, this woman really belongs in a paper company. And so we Greg thought about it and he said sure, And now there's a there is there is one additional detail that's so wonderful, and that is that after Greg said sure, let's ask her to be in the bullpen, and she agreed to

do it. That Greg and I had a discussion and Greg said, do you know if she can act? And I took Phyllis aside and I said, do you have a lot of acting experience? And she said not, not really, but she said that some years earlier that she had, you know, worked in burlesque in Branson, Missouri, and I

said stop it. And she then later that week brought in a photo of herself into like a very you know, wonderfully old fashioned burlescout was on her desk for ten years, nine seasons and the So that is the Phillis story and and I couldn't be happier that she became such a beloved member of the ensemble. So now the crew had come together and the office was starting to air, but we were still very uncertain about what our future would be. Every day I felt like we were on

borrowed time. And then lightning struck. Steve landed a massive role. Here's Angela Kenzie to tell us all about it. Forty year old virgin, right year old virgin. That was the game changer for Steve and Jenna. I have talked about this where we had this moment where we're like, oh my god, our friends Steve is gonna be like real famous, like real deal famous. I really felt like they were banking on Steve, and I was like, Okay, I will attach myself to the Steve wagon. I'm banking on him too.

I thought that that was a really good sign, but I still wasn't confident. I mean I still was like when we finished those first six because season one was just six, they printed our names on pieces of paper and then laminated them and put a piece of velcrow on the back and that's what stuck to your door of your trailer. And I went up to my ripped that, ripped it off and said, I'm gonna save that. That was fun because you were sure it was done. I just didn't know. I mean, they were putting so much

at the time. NBC had the show that was like our rival sort of show that was this couple, and they were on every bus everywhere. We weren't on any buses if we weren't anywhere, And I was like, wow, I've put a lot of money on those guys. Yes,

was not a whole lot of confidence. But Kevin Riley, I was about to say, I knew Kevin Riley was fighting for us, and I know that's why when we ultimately won an Emmy, all you guys lifted him in the air and that's the photo that made the l a times because we all knew as a cast, we stayed on the air because Kevin Riley put his neck on the line for us. Right when did you feel

like we actually had security? I know, distinctly. Ahead Well, I remember getting an email that our first Christmas episode had become the number one download on iTunes, and I was like what, and I said, oh, that's it. Mom was getting rid of for Chevy Blazer. And then I got a Honda. Um yeah, that that That was a huge moment. And it's funny. Before that aired, there was a moment that was very significant for you and I,

which was boost crews when we finally became series regulars. Yep, I found out I was going to be a series regular. And there's a photo that, um, I think Oscar took of Jenna and I when I found out. We're jumping up in the air holding hands. And I mean up until then, we were basically like week to week. Like I remember in Halloween episode when they were like, yeah, we're gonna actually fire one person, We're all like, okay, Hi, how's it going. I petitioned for it to be you.

I want you to know. I remember saying to my mom, I'm like, Mom, you know pretty much anyone can go really And she was like, well, every office needs a bitch, That's what she said to you. Yeah, She's like, every office needs the bitch. I'm like, your mom was confident that it wouldn't be you. My mom was you haven't you know Bertie Kinzie. She's like, don't speak it, don't speak it put out the positive. Oh man, So at this time, so this happens, Um, we shoot Booze cruise

in airs. After Christmas. Christmas episode happens on TV. It's our largest audience ever ever. Then iTunes streaming. We become number one in that and then Steve wins the Golden Globes. What do you remember about that night of us at the Golden Globes? Um? I remember I got a spray tan because I thought I was really white, like too white in my dress, and so people were like, get a spray tan. And then Rain made fun of me

so much. He was like how what what? So one day on the office, Angela Martin is like pale, and the next day you look like orange. He was like, Angela, I was like, I don't know me. And then um, we weren't allowed to sit in the main room. Only Steve got invited into the main room where the fancy people were. We were in the annex and we watched him win like on TV, and we were we we about like fell out of our chairs, literally we fell

out of the stuff. But we made such a scene that other fancy people were like those guys we were screaming, were so excited. And when the party lets out, it lets out into the room we were in, and we like we tackled Steve. We're so excited. We were all so excited. It's hard to put into words how special it was for our little show to finally start taking off and for Steve, our our show dad, to start

turning into such a massive star. You know, these days, with how popular the Office has become, it almost feels like it's always been that way, but it hasn't. And I think having our own special way of doing things really helped to make that happen. A big part of that was having so many of our writers double as our ensemble cast. So here's mos, Mike. Sure, when was the decision made for writers to start acting in the

show from the before the before the pilot? I mean Greg coming from SNL, Greg wanted SNL is very um. The membrane between writers and actors is very thin, and all the actors right stuff and a lot of the writers are in sketch is and stuff, and almost everyone there's a writer performer, even if he or she is only on staff as a writer or something. And he liked that, and he wanted to get rid of the false dichotomy of writers and actors. So he hired Mindy

specifically because she was a performer. She was in a play called Mattin Band that she had written in New York. He hired b J because BJ was a stand up and a writer. He and then like we made Paul against his will play Toby in the first season, like we forced it. He did not want to do it. He hated it, he hated acting, but we forced him to do it because it was so funny to have him be the guy that Michael Scott hates more than anybody.

But it was that was always the design. I think he wanted everybody to to write and perform, ideally except for me, because he made me a freak. Most famously and most annoyingly to me, played the character most shrewd. Oh my god. We never talked about most Oh my god. I I assumed it was gonna be your first question. I I know I have a whole section on it. But you were so great. Um, all right, well then just very quickly, sure you were cast as most I was,

and you're happy about that. Now. I hated it. I hated every second of it. Why did you hate it? Because I was wearing wool clothes and had a neck beard and it was always really hot and I didn't The joke was I didn't talk, and that's not a funny joke. And it was always like I had to get up at four thirty in the morning and drive to the middle of nowhere and wear wool clothes, and it was. And then the joke became with the writers

because they knew how much I hated it. They loved like what if your shirtless, what if you're on a see saw? What if you're on a trampoline, What if you're running as fast as you can alongside a car like a dog. I was at parks and wreck and they would call me and they like, we need most and I was like, I have a job, I have a life, I have young children, and they would just make me do it. They would compete with each other to see what was the most humiliating possible thing they

could have me do. But that that episode Paul. So Paul wrote that episode where they where Jim and Pam go to shoot farms, and he wrote in the in the script, it literally says, Mose appears out of nowhere and runs along the side of the car like a dog. That's what it says. That's I'm a human being. And so we did that scene. It was a hundred and

forty degrees. I was in woolf clothes and and old work boots that like didn't fit properly, and that sprint is probably a hundred and fifty yards down that dirt road from the time I come out to the time I had to run all the way up into Shrewt farms. It of course cuts off long before I ever get there, but they were like, you got it. Paul was directing,

was like, you gotta run all the way there. So I did over and over and over again, probably twelve or fourteen takes because Paul delighted in it so much. And then later in that episode, I'm in Jurassic Park pajamas that don't fit me properly. And then Greg pitched the thing where he was like, what if there's a loud noise and Pam goes to the window and looks at it, and Moses in the outhouse with his pants down and the doors flapping clothes. I mean it was

like it was aggressive. It was. They knew I never should have been. If I had said, like, I love doing this, they never would have put me in the show again. But because I hated it so much and was so vocal about hating it, Well, you have confirmed something. Moses a is a fan favorite. You hear about people loving most. Okay, let me tell you something. What I have always said is I think Moses a writer's room joke. Oh,

you have now confirmed without a doubt. Then it was literally a writer's room jo meant to torture, you meant specifically to make me miserable. Yes, yes, I was in a coffin. I was like hanging upside down somewhere like. There were a bunch of things that we did that were then just cut out of the show. I was riding a moped over like trying to jump a bunch of cars. They made me do that moped thing. I don't know how to drive a moped. I don't know how to drive a moped. No one taught me how

to drive. They were like just get on and just rev the thing, because the point was if I wipe out, it will be really funny now, and then run across the roofs of these cars again. If you slip and fall and break your pelvis, it'll be really funny. Like there was the subtext was always the worst this goes the fun year it will be when it happens. Well,

I this was after you left. I mean sort of from the beginning, but then more and more Kevin started having a lot of physical comedy type stuff, and there would be times where I would go to the writer's room and say, I don't remember if you were ever there, but I would say, you guys are writing for Homer Simpson right now and a cartoon you can force to do whatever you'd like him to do. He can do whatever, right, but I can't. My body doesn't work that way. No

one's does, right. Like the most painful, I feel like I still have pain from it. Is the most innocuous. You would never ever ever know. The office workers have to go to the warehouse and move boxes, so they decide are gonna put remember that episode yeah boiled down? So they could move boxes to get to the troll and everyone thought the big guy falling is really funny.

So I just kept falling slipping and which means on a concrete surface with oil kneecap on concrete over and it's like, guys, I can't keep You've gotta liked Yeah,

there has to be some other um. We had a we had a similar thing on Parson Wreck where Nick Offerman's character Ron Swanson was a sort of he was a little cartoonish in his abilities to do various things, and we wrote this joke where he wanted to get he was eating a he got lunch and he was eating his hamburger and and the joke was he wanted to get out of the lunch as quickly as possible. So in the script, he shoved the entire hamburger into

his mouth and ate it in one bite. So they Dean Holland was directing it, and he was like, okay action and Nick did his best, but then Dean was like, you you really need to eat the whole thing in one bite, and he was like, this is a like a half pound hamburger. Okay, Like I maybe the character can do this, but a human can. Yeah all right, yeah right, sorry, yeah, you're not your character, Right, Okay, I I almost wiped out super hard on that moped.

Like well, first of all, the joke was someone pulls up in the car. It was the Garden Party episode. Someone pulls up in the car and I'm the valve Mos the Valet, and I get in and they're like, just get in and tear off down this road, right, And the joke at the time is why is most driving so fast and so insistent? And so I did, and like, I tore off down the road and I'm

not a stunt driver. I don't know, like and suddenly I'm going sixty five on a dirt road and on a set and the back tires fish tail because it's a dirt road, and I like slow down and was like, oh right, I'm not This isn't a no one's gonna like save me. If I crashed this car, I'll die. Because I also got in and didn't put my seatbelt on because the joke was you get in and take off off, and I was like, oh my god, I just I forgot for a second that I'm not fictional.

I'm sure I'm not fictional. I'm a human could suffer consequences mine very similar to that was. I think it was when there's the storyline of Dwight telling Holly that that Kevin is slow, and there was a scene we did a number of different ways. This didn't end up in but where I'm driving and she's like you're driving. You have a car, and I'm like, yeah, I have

a car. And at one point they were like, okay, so do that, but then get out of the car, but leave it running, like leave it, leave it like, leave it, leave it in gear. So like as you step out, the car is gonna move forward and then we'll have somebody else who can jump in and stop it. Yeah, I did, like profound Meanwhile, it's vedas car, right, like her real car. I uh. That joke that they did with Kevin in the later years where he didn't know

the alphabet elemento. Paul pitched that in season two and we were like, Paul, that's insane, Like you can't say that he doesn't know that he's an accountant. He's a working accountant. Like he might not be the best accountant, he's an accountant. It made Paul laugh so hard, and the second that Paul took over the show, that joke aired and I was like well that's he got what he wanted six years later. Well, at least someone was

having fun. But look, we all have a part to play, am I right, even if our parts happened to be more dangerous than others like Oscar. I don't remember Oscar doing any crazy stunts or being turned into an indestructible office cartoon. Right, he had the honor of being the one who always got to keep his composure. You, and certainly over in accounting, you were really the straight man, like you had your idiosyncrasies, yes, I think so, but in the office you were you were the barometer of

reason very often Jim and myself. Yes, which is what they're talking about in the coalition of reason. Yeah, that's it. Are you you know, if you're if you're looking at sort of the history of comedy in a way, how does what is it? Oh? Come on, you can do it, Brian, I believe. And you ask you a question, the archetype of the straight man sort of in the history of comedy. Can you talk about that a little bit? Is that is that easier for you to do or is that harder? Oh?

They're both good. It's apples and oranges. It's lovely. It was a lovely character because he's he's a straight man, but he still has a little bit delusions of grandeur, which you need because that you need that, right right, that well, nobody's perfect or nobody totally straight exactly, Yeah, because Angela was a little off too. She was almost there, but then she was a little off. Everybody was a little off, right, Toby, every single even Jim. He was

too much of a prankster. He didn't take the job seriously. He was a little too right, juvenile. But you you know, I think so many of the scenes between you and Steve were so special because you know you had to be at Yeah, yeah, did you just sit there and stare at him, just stare at him? Well, and you would do that, well he said things. You would get the laugh because you did that. Yeah, that's all you had to do, stare at him. And people at home go,

what is he thinking? He can't say anything, it's his job, he's being good, and now he's excusing themself, thank you and just get up and leave, right because he's like Oscar, and it's the build up, the fucking Correll build up. Oscar, can I see you from moments? It down, Um, I ask you something, Um, I'm going to go in for a colonoscope, And I was, what can I do to

make it more comfortable for him or me? And he just trails it off and just leaves it like it's like it's a solid, like a reasonable question to ask me. And I'm supposed what am I supposed to tell him? I think, I think I just excuse myself. I'm like, okay, Mike, I just got up and left. So we're making the office right, and we're starting to get some fans, but then it turns out that some of our fans will actually be joining our Motley crew, like the wonderful Ellie Kemper.

Did you watch The Office, Brian? Did I watch The Office? I devoured The Office. I was an enormous Office fan. You don't know what this is like, because obviously you were on it from the start. But I loved The Office. I watched it every week. It's very strange to go from watching a television show that you happen to love and then being in the room with everybody. I actually the first day, of course, felt surreal for many reasons, but it's it's weird when you I think maybe anyone

has had this experience. If you watch someone on a screen and then you see them in person, it feels otherworldly. And particularly because I already loved everyone on it and admired them so much, it felt even stranger because yeah, I was a huge fan. It's very weird. I really tried to play it cool. Well, So, wait, literally, you watched it Thursday nights. Yes, yes, I did. I lived in New York at the time, and we always my

my whole family was a fan of the Office. Have I believe Mose Mike Sure reminded us of my older brother John college, like when John was in college, so we had like a big joke about that. But yeah, No, I lived in New York and I watched The Office every Thursday. And had you met Alison Jones before? No, So I met with Greg and Mike. Greg Daniels and Mike Sure. I think I was meeting with them for

Parks and Recreation. This was before Parks and Recreation was had aired, and I think that's what it was about. I really don't know. It was sort of just a general hello. And after that I met Alison when I actually read for Parks and Recreation, which it wasn't called Parks and Recreation. It was like untitled make Sure Project. And then I didn't get a part on Parks and Recreation. But then they called me back later for the office and your first day on set? Were you nervous? I

was so nervous. I first, Okay, I can't remember the actual very first person I met. I remember telling John Krasinski, who I had read was a turn at Conan and I had been an Internet Conan because my first scene, John is making a Jim Jim, excuse me, it's making a copy at the copy machine, and I'm like sitting there and I was like, like, in between takes, I was like, so, um, yeah, um, you'ven turned to Conan, right? Why did I feel the need to strike up conversation.

I am the new person. I think I should stay quiet until've spoken to But I was unusually bold and he said, oh, yeah, you know Conan, and I said I had turned there too. That was it. I don't know if somebody walked away, somebody saved me, because I wouldn't have. I wouldn't have kept that conversation going very well. And then and then the big news Brian I had to dye my hair that day. I have red hair, and as soon as I got there, they were like,

you have to dye your hair brown. And I remember, Mindy, I saw in the morning and I started in the afternoon, and I had brown hair in the afternoon, and she said, why did you let them do that? I would never let anyone dye my hair like us because in my first jobs ever, they can do whatever they want. Anyway, why did they dye your hair? Well, you know, I still don't know. I think the reason was they said it looked that this new character's hair looked too close

to Pam's color. But I PAMs never Jenna. But I mean the character Pam. Pam didn't have red hair, did she like? Was it chest study? Yeah, I guess I'm not real good at hair. I'll be honest with you, honestly.

Apparently neither of mind. But anyway, Yeah, first day memories are sort of blurry because I was so I don't know, I don't think you can relate to this feeling, because, like I said, you were there from the start, but it was just so it was first day of school, but to the millions of degree because it was like I already I'm like in awe of all these people, and I'm the new girl, don't mess anything up, And

of course she didn't. But there was another new girl, well woman, who came into the office family a little later on Amy Ryan and you our fans welcomed her with such open arms. I think maybe that was because she did the one thing no one thought could be done. She completed Michael. But come on, don't we all kind of wish she'd completed Kevin instead. You came in ultimately to be a love interest for Michael. But I have to tell you the storyline between you and I on

the show. Um gets talked about a lot, and I think in the history of table reads that we had on the show, it was never more laughed because of the how long that joke and maybe he used to set up. And you know when I get asked now about moments in the entire show where I could not stop laughing, was Hugh and the but it is literally if you with the change, this is the nickel, this

is this is a button. And there was something about the sweetness on your face and you just very genuinely explaining to Kevin that this was a button made me smile every single time, and I was like, I can't do it, and they're right there with the Cam'm like, I can't do it, and basically then just turned it into a grin to say I'm gonna I'm gonna bang you. But that Yeah, do you think that story could play now? I mean, there's so much of The Office that I

don't know if it could play now. Um, it's interesting. So I just happen to watch that episode because my ten year old daughter and all her friends at school are really into the Office. And my daughter is a little behind the rest of her friends because I think it's weird for her. But but anyway, so my husband Eric and I like we're just out of her eyeline.

But here comes your line like I'm totally going to bang her, and you know, I'm like, we look at each other, like and then you look over at her face as she registered that, you know, no, because somehow it's going right over their head, I think, or she maybe shouldn't you know. Um, I mean, I don't know. I think I hope a lot of it still plays because I think it's well intentioned. I don't think we were cruel statistic people on this show. I mean, but

the stuff that doesn't play. It's interesting to think about as we all think we're like well intentioned, liberal minded, caring people, and the stuff that we didn't pay attention to. And so you know, you're asking me, is it okay to make fun of a person who we think is mentally handicapped? Probably not, but it was really funny then so what do we do with it? Like, you know, I don't know where that lives. Um, I certainly don't

want to offend anybody. I mean, I think the joke is upon the person who made the mistake, you know what I mean, Like it's how could Holly be that thick head or or that well, you know white? Really, I mean that it's really that it's Dwight who But I'm I'm in the middle there of not using my own good judgment or maybe asking for a second opinion or you know, I mean, we all we're all judgmental.

We say we don't, but we judge everybody that walks down the block, you know, in our heads, in a little private tapes, in our Okay, she's right, of course, we judge people. We try not to, right, I mean, what we try to do is something very different. We try to find truth and beauty in every single part of our lives. And why well, that goes back to the captain of our ship, the man we put all

our faith in. Our showrunner and creator, Greg Daniels. A few people talked to me about one of your core ideas, which is the idea of truth and beauty. Yeah, that was my thing with Randall, the truth and beauty, Truth and beauty, yea. And what does that? What does that mean to you? Um? Well, you know to me, that was I think that's some romantic poet. I'm not sure where that came from, somebody like John Keats or something. I don't know, and I don't even know what he

meant by it. But the way I used to use it with Randall was that's what we're going for in the camera, right, Let the camera seek out truth. That's what it's trying to find. That's the point of a documentary. What's the truth? And also not like a cynical negative truth like also where's the beauty? It's like another principle of photography of like a good photograph is, you know, a little sprig of weed coming through the cracked concrete

or whatever, you know what I mean? It's like, where are you gonna do something that's a little bit inspiring but find it in a truthful way out in the real world. Right Well, Mike sure talked about it, and you told a story about um a parking lot, an endless parking lot with lines and parking spaces, and in one crack there's a little flower, a little dandelion. He said that it's funny. I just made the same. Yes,

I think that that, you know. I like the notion of aesthetic, like what do you searching for in art? And the Japanese have interesting aesthetics with a cracked pot? Did you mention that to use that a lot? So? I think it's called woo. I'm not sure, but it's

the notion of a perfect pot is okay? You know, and we in the West probably value a per pot, but a cracked pot where the crack suddenly makes you feel the history of the pot and the people who have used it in their family and have treasured it and kept it even with the crack in it, like it suddenly cracks through you know it, suddenly we'll we'll touch you. It's those little details often of imperfections, that's

like a it's just a cool sort of philosophy. Yes, yeah, I have this so far off topic, but a number of years ago, my parents were moving out of their house and I went for a week and I was like helping them and throwing out all of this trash. And we go into like the corner of the closet and a guest room that no one ever slept in, And in the closet there was a big piece of paper that was folded up and I I unfolded it and it was a Kennedy poster that my dad had

like handed out or seen or collected or whatever. And I remember saying to him, can I have this? And he's like, yeah, it's like all torn or whatever. And I took it and I framed it and I took it to this place and they were like, oh, we can you know, do this or that, and I was like no, no, no, the crack has to stay there and the wrinkle, the folded marks just as lightly as you can matt this on something and enclose it, because I want that history of it. I don't know that

idea well. Also, like I mean, you know, I don't get too psychological, but you know, when you think about your dad right, you're so the relationship that you have with your father, the fact how old that they are, and just the sense of like passage of time being important to that relationship and fragility of it and knowing that it may not be around forever, and that I can completely see why a tear in your dad's poster

adds to the emotion of it. Yeah, right, yeah, totally. Um, well, there's a lot about writing that isn't necessary really only about the office, but you know, like when you have a set of principles that you're trying to do for the show, right, if you're going to say, all right, I want to be realistic, I want to be relatable. Uh you know, I want to be observational. If you're going to follow those principles, you're gonna end up commenting on what's around you. And this to me goes back

a long way. It isn't unique to the show necessarily, but like when I was on The Simpsons, which is this is you know, complete cartoon, but the way that one Simpsons writer one respect from another Simpsons writer when I was there, was you did something super real. You had a line that just found like it just came out of a teenager and it was just perfectly you know, real to the situation and somehow, in contrast to the cartooning nois of it, that always seemed to be like

a cool thing. And then when I got to King of the Hell, we used to do a lot of research. We would go to Texas. I'd take the writers to Texas every season and we'd fan out with our reporters notebooks, and we you know, we'd try and dig up unique stories because I always felt like the shows that I really liked, the stories were original, like something had happened to one of the writers or you know, they weren't just going like, well what did what did Cheers do?

Let's do a version of that or something. You had to go out and do your own work and dig up your own stories. Well, Greg, I, for one, I am so grateful for the stories you dug up, and I know that I'm not alone. Thank you to everyone who was a part of this episode, and to all of you out there listening. Join us next week for another stroll down memory Lane with some more of our favorite episodes and guests. In the meantime, all of you

have a fantastic week. The Office Deep Dive is hosted and executive produced by me Brian Baumgartner alongside our executive producer Langley. Our senior producer is Tessa Kramer. Our producers are Liz Hayes and Diego Topi. My main man in the booth is Alec Moore. Our theme song Bubble and Squeak, performed by my great friend Creed Bratton, and the episode was mixed by Seth Olandsky