Angela Gibbs

At school, I was shy, but when it came to performing, there was this other person that would just come out of me. And I remember we were doing a play Scrooge and the little boy that was supposed to play Scrooge couldn't get it right, and I was so upset and I just stood up and passed and said I should be Scrooge. And they said, but you're a girl, so it doesn't matter.

It doesn't matter.

And then I started trying to direct him and they were like, Angela, sit down, and I was like, this isn't fair. So I guess that was the beginning of me having my voice.

Hi. This is Angela Gibbs. I'm so excited at being on this show.

I am an actor and an acting coach and I'm recently on a new show called Not Dead.

Yet on ABC. I'm excited to be here.

Hi, everybody, and welcome back to this week's episode of Off the Beat. This is Brian Baumgartner and this is me very very excited, as you just heard. My guest today is Angela Gibbs. Now let me tell you something. I did not know Angela personally before speaking with her earlier today. But let me say this She is why I do this podcast. Having conversations with her specifically, and people like her, It's why I do this. I had so much fun today. I hope you hear that in

From the night before.

Hi, Angela, Hey Brian, how are you?

I'm good?

I love that morning smiler. Is it an afternoon smile? Where are you in New York?

No, I'm in I'm in California.

All right, you're with me.

I'm with you. I am such a big fan of yours. Angela, thank you so much. Thank you, Yes, thank you so much for coming on. We're going to talk about as much as we can fatally, but I do want to start back. Your career is so fascinating and when I was going through this research, I'm like, wait, she did what she wait with how when did this?

What?

Bird band? What are we talking about talking about? So I can't wait to get into it. You grew up in Detroit, Yes, am I right?

That's right during the time of Motown and the Motor city was flourishing, and it was a great It was a great time to come up in Detroit. People talking about my city and I don't know what they give us such a bad rep but it was such an It was the neighborhood, Brian. You know, I could sit on my porch and name everybody up and down the street.

It was.

I did get a chance to fill that small town even though it was Detroit kind of neighborhood community, if you will, growing up and uh, you know, if I was bad, parent down the street spanked me, you know, back days they could do that. And then when I got home, I did another one.

You know.

We were pig cherries off of people's trees. You know, it run high, you know. But anyway, it was a great childhood. It really was a great time to come up.

I'll tell you about my story about the Montelettes and wanting to be a supreme that's another story.

Well, but so music was a very big deal, absolutely in Detroit at that time. It was for you as well.

Absolutely, we all wanted to be Well, let me say this. I grew up next door to the mother of Levi Stubbs.

Now Levi Stubbs was the leader of the Four Tops.

I didn't know this, but his brother was the leader of the Contours, Joe Stubbs and recent and so I grew up. So since that was the mother, I e grandmother of his kids. His kids were over there all the time. So I grew up with Levi's kids.

Right, and we had a ball We always wanted to sing. You know, there was there what do you call it, the mot So we started this group cause the Montellettes.

And my mother, you know, wasn't on TV any of that. She worked for the airlines. She was our manager. Now she got it a little twisted. We wanted to be arm and B singers. She had us singing tall and tan and yeah, she had us sing and all the stuff she wanted us to see, right Sinatra, Oh my god. Anyway, we were shortening, but we did go to We did a couple.

Of what was it back then, the y w c A. And we never made it to the motome.

Let's just say that, okay.

But they had street parties, you know how they block off the street and all the neighbors would cook and we'd have music and I would sing there.

That is awesome. I love that. And so was that? That was your earliest performing, Yes, early.

Performing, that's right. And then I went to Catholic school. I went to Saint Gregory's.

It's gone now, but in Saint Gregory's they had drama and Brian. You know, I had no idea because basically believing or not, even though I was a tomboy and you know, the oldest of two brothers and so kind of the leader that at school, I was shy, but when it came to performing, there was this other person

And they said, but you're a girl.

It doesn't matter, it doesn't matter.

And then I started trying to direct him and they were like, Angela, sit down, and I was like, this isn't fair. So I guess that was the beginning of me having my voice. I didn't get to play screw all right, but that's okay. Later down the line, I began acting. But I started acting then and I was in like, I want.

To say, fifth grade, you know. So they'd have little recidos.

I would play music, nothing, no big deals really, you know, but that was kind of like the beginning.

Your mom was an actress, Yes, yes, your mom was Marla Gibbs.

Spoiler is Marla Gibbs.

Is Marla Gibbs.

He's still around honey.

Your mom is Marla Gibbs. Yes, I know she still is. I just went back into her bio as well talking to you. I mean, we're not going to make this about your mom, by the way. Okay, that's okay, though I'm not going to do that. But let me just say this. When I think about my childhood, I think about those shows that work because I was still young when The Jeffersons was on, and no joke, I believe that your mom was the first person for me looking back where I went, Oh, she is funny, Yeah she is.

Do you think it was? You know?

One of the things that we kind of picked up early on was my mother was the domestic who inhabited everyone's aunt or grandma, Like there was somebody in the family.

That, as the kids say, now clap back, you know.

And there was something about her clapping back at her boss that made her kind of like everyone's person, you know. And I only asked that because even though she wasn't.

A real maid.

There was a group of people nationally called National something of household technicians, and these were maids and butlers, et cetera, and they honored her right, So there was something about her humanity and the way she dealt with that boss of hers who was hysterical and obnoxious. On all of that, I wonder if that's what it was, that she just kind of spoke her mind and she bumped up against the establishment, if you will, I just wondering.

Yeah, No, I think I think that that is absolutely true. But I also think her there was something about her. I mean, there was Isabelle Saffort and all of they were all so great, yes, but all playing this very traditional sitcom style, and yet she took her time. She took her time. She would take those pauses, yes, and she would deliver things in an unexpected way, not this traditional way. And for me, I think just in terms of comedy, yeah, like I appreciated that as a performer.

Listen, I've been Mather's daughter sometimes painfully all my you know, like you know the way we want your mom or Marla Junior or they will introduced everyone by name.

When they get to me, they're like, oh, that's Marther's daughter.

So so there's been that, but there's also this other side that I'm very, very proud of and proud of being her daughter, and so I want to just share this when you talk about her style was different when she was doing that role, Brian, she was brand new, right, she'd been enacting only a few years, but she was in her forties.

Also raised three kids.

We had a great escape from my stepfather who was at that time, you know, it was a crazy marriage, and she gathered us up and when he went to work, we took off and came to La, right. So she was bold and brave in that way, and she took that kind of fierceness.

And being a grown woman because she's like forty four, she just looked young for her age.

When she went into that. She still worked at Unana Airlines, so she had a backup, she had a job. She was bold, and they loved her. You know, she had that line. How come we overcame and nobody told me? And that was the line and everyone I was there for that delivery and the audience they had a hole for like five minutes, and the word is the producer said, who is that? Because they had already contracted a maid. There was already someone who was supposed to play that role.

Right.

But they loved my mother so much. So now she's getting a couple of shows. I think she maybe had six or seven. And the first one, she sits at the table. They do the table read and then all the actors are supposed to get up, and she sits there, and Norman and the producers.

They're like, this is the black woman sitting at the table. They don't want to hurt their feelings and tell them to get up.

They're figuring she'll get the hint, so they start talking to each other.

They're not looking at.

Her, and the actors are like, you know, come on, come on, like get up, right, we don't tell them, they tell us we get up.

And she's like, yeah, but I don't know what they're saying. I don't know what they're talking about.

I don't want to know what they're talking about, right, So she says and then she starts interrupting.

She's like, wait, excuse me, Can I say something?

And they're like, okay, you know we're gonna pacify this woman. And she said, glad, people don't talk like that. And they said, oh, okay, well what would you say right?

And she said, we have our own rhythm.

Every culture Hispanics have their rhythm, Jewish culture has their rhythm.

We have our rhythm.

We throw stuff away, you know. And they said, well, how would you say it? And Brian, and then I'll you know, leave it on the table.

Brian.

They listened to her. They were smart enough to listen, and they started moving those lines around so they fit in her mouth, and she started a culture because after that they let all the actors sit at the table after the table and discuss their lines. So even back then, Trailblazer, you know, so all right, enough about mama.

No, that's awesome, but that that has to help make up who.

You are, oh, without a doubt, and.

Your entree if you will, you know, into the business. So yes, yes, she's working. And it sounds like not too far after you start working.

Well, here's the funny story that people are just starting to realize. I actually started acting first first okay, yeah.

Yeah, well we came out here.

I got into drama in high school, Miss Asimov, I'll never forget her at LA High and Miss Asthma was my girl, right, and and you know, I falled in that class. Me and this other student became the people that they would say, I need an example answer, get up and show them what I'm talking about.

So I had some confidence there.

And my mother found a workshop called past LA and it stood for Performing Art Society of Los Angeles.

On Vermont in Manchester.

And there and Roger Moseley was there at the time, and so we and he was getting started. So yeah, he was a little beyond us in terms of summer credits. But anyway, it didn't cost anything.

You know, they were they were funneling a lot of money into Watts because of the riots, and they were trying to do some enhancement and artistic kind of endeavors to make sure that that community had something. And so we benefited from that.

And then from so I was in school acting, but I'm in this workshop, and then I go to Fairfax High. I get in their drama department, and then I get an agent. Right, Roger Moseley sent Max Julian, who recently passed.

I don't know if you remember Max Julan.

He was the mac back in the day film called Cleopatrick Jones, and he wanted his woman at the time, Bananda McGee to play it, but the studios wanted the tall tamra Adobson. But they gave him some perps and one of them was he could cast a couple of smaller roles. So Roger told him come out and see this young girl. She's in this play. We made up the play and it was me and I was playing Angela Davis and he just fell in love and I reminded him of a younger version of Banetta mcgeek and

Know, And she's like, no, I'm serious, I'm serious.

Call this number. And I called and they asked me to come out. They told me you've already got the role. We just want to meet you. Max Julian wants you. I got in the union. Roger Mosey gave me his agent. It was yes, it was, you know, one of those kind of like yeah, and it was seventy or seventy one, and that's when I got my sad car. My mother starts teasing me because she's like her and her friends. They were still like trying to get on the lot, knocking on doors.

And I had a dressing room. I'm like, oh, come by and visit me in my dressing room. Right.

Oh.

I was very political. I was a hippie slash revolutionary. Remember my name is Angela. They were looking for Ashla Davis. You know, I thought it was it was on me to carry on, you know, And so I went to Africa changed my name Totamu. Don't tease me, and you know it was Tamu.

Yes, and why why wait, I'm not just let it go?

Oh come on now?

Why?

Well you know what back then? Yeah, yeah, well here's okay. This is where it gets worse. The story starts to go downhill because my name was U Tamu, and that was, you know, taking on my African culture and heritage. And I wanted a new name to kind of, you know, express my connection to Africa.

The problem was the friend who gave me the name. The problem was this.

People would say, oh, TMU, what does that mean? And I said, sweetness, can you imagine I'm a young woman, not bad looking.

The guys are like, yeah, I think you are. I'm this has nothing to do with revolution. I want a new name.

So my son teases me, I got a name changed to Aoka, and then they call me a Yoka for a while that meant light. She comes with light. Turns out my middle name, Elaine, means the same thing. So I eventually just trapped it all. You know, my mother knew what she was doing because I came from Africa and I said my name was Utamo and she said I named I said, well, I'm not answering anything but utamol and I'm a vegetarian. My mother says she has

I used to regret it.

I used to think it was a mistake because when I came back my mother was Florence.

But I like, maybe I made a mistake, maybe I should have stayed in La.

But I'm glad because I wanted to have a purpose even as a young woman.

I wanted my life to matter. I wanted to be involved in things that made a difference in the community and ended.

Up coming back and opening up a theater. So it was meant to be, Not Bryan, I didn't know it was gonna take me this long.

I mean, man, didn't take a long time.

You wanted to break and a little bit locker.

That's right, That's right.

So you know Suirlee Ralph, she's singing my song when she said don't give up. You know, my saying is if you stay in line, your turn will come. So when I came back, I realized I loved this so much that, hey, brother, I make it or not, and you know, make it meaning that I make a living at it or not.

I got to keep back it.

And I think when I finally got there, things started to change.

You know. That's my story, and I'm sticking to it.

You founded a theater when you returned, I did because you had fallen in love with the theater.

I did. I loved theater. You know. I started with theater.

Me too, by the way, Yeah, theater.

Is it is.

It's the best, and it's a great training ground because it's intimate, it's.

Right in the moment.

If you make a mistake, you've got to figure it out, you know, it's And I want to do theater now, Brian, I'm just trying to figure it out because now with TV and all of that, and you know, it's such an l a thing.

But I know you make good money. What are you doing TV?

Wait and wait what? You make more money doing television than you do theater.

I'm sorry to say, but holy holy moly.

Yes indeed.

And so you know, it's like it's hard because when you do a play, you want to commit and you want to commit to your cast members and you don't want to just pull out, and you know it's it's hard. But I am going to figure out a way. I'm in a class right now. That's one of the things I do if I stay in the class. Even though I coach actors too. It just keeps me out of my own bubble and keeps me on the edge of

What are you going to do?

What are you going to bring, you know, back to your community, How are you going to make a difference? And my thought was what I do is theater and acts, so maybe I can take that back. Ironically, my mother had a building by this time, she's on TV. She had a building that was a print shop right down the street, literally two blocks from where we started on Vermont in Manchester. So I turned that building into a theater little by little, you know, and it.

Was called Crossroads.

Interesting enough, I would find out later as I started learning how to write grants and things like that, that there was some kind of collective consciousness and a movement going on because right at that same time, there was a theater that was being founded in New Jersey called Crossroads in Black Theater. There was a theater in Saint Louis called Saint Louis Blackbreath and it was a theater in Atlanta called Jimondi.

So we when we all met, we realized.

We were all picking up that signal from that consciousness of its time to have a theater in the community, right, and we all kind of became friends.

I remember, Timandi, I'm from Atlanta. I remember, yeah, So I remember that. Let me ask you this, do you do you feel like historic Black collegists that there is more of an emphasis there preparing you for when you leave to do something in and for your community.

Absolutely absolutely, I still am. Listen.

I went to n YU to their boot camp for film AFI American from institute, you know, studied some at UCLA as well. I didn't finish college, so I had a B A b y he's forty five now EXEID but BA. So I went back and finished later at Antioch. And I named these other universities because what I absolutely did learn and see is that there's more resources than

Eleanor Roosevelt. You know, I love that saying.

And then you can you know, there's more resources available and things like that, but yes, you know, and I literally was asked by professors, you know, what are you going to do?

You know that?

And I think it comes from just that whole idea of segregation and not being able to go to the white schools and you know, us becoming teachers and knowing that the only way we were going to survive as a race was to make sure that we were educated and that we had community organizations, that we had you know, ways for our youth to express themselves where they saw their value and so yeah, I absolutely agree with that.

Yes, I think we're prepared well to make a difference.

So you found this theater or you become the founder of this theater? A crossroads and when do you start doing coaching?

Coaching came way after, you know, coaching was something I didn't want to do. I was because you know, and let me say this, I founded it with my mother.

She was a co founder.

She was on TV and she was opening a jazz supper club and she said, I don't want to open the theater right now, and I'm like, I do and I need your money.

I don't want to do that right now.

And so she calls me the great manipulator because I said, well, just give.

Me a little money for a dance floor. We'll just give me a little money for some theater seats.

I just get, you know, And I would put her name on the press release and she's like, why is my name on the press release. I'm like, I have no idea, Manna gives the fice he made floorings of the Jeffersons is opening the school.

She's like, stop that.

But you know she did say, you know, you keep that up. And people are not going to know what you're doing. They're going to give me all the credit, which is what happened. And it's okay because those that know no the Regina Kings, for instance, Regina was in the.

Play two two seven. It was a play.

First, and I yeah, and I talked my mother into doing it, and she was so busy she did not want to do it. And I get it because she was doing the Jeffersons. She was opening the nightclub, which was very popular for a time. And once again, mama, you just got a being there for.

A couple of weeks, you know, and it became a hit.

Norman never heard about it. Brandon Tartakoff was alive. He heard about it, and you know, the story goes on. They came, bought it. My mother became ep and you know, but I ran into Regina years later and she said, you were twenty five years old with a baby on your hip. I had a little boy and I was a single mom, and you know, he grew up in the theater.

Right. But it was a play first.

Nea Long was also understudy, and she alternated, i should say, with Regina, and then we started some careers from that play, right.

But yeah, yes, two two seven, groundbreaking television show for which you are the recipient of an NAACP Image Award.

That's right, that's right.

That's for producing that. That's that's amazing. I did not know that. I did not know. That started as a play.

It started as a play, and it was It was really funny because originally it was written by Christy Houston of Chicago, and it takes place on stoop and it's two people, my mother and it really originally it was a layer. But you know, in the in the cast there was another woman and they sit on the stoop and play numbers. They played the numbers, and my mother talks about everybody in the building. I mean, she had

I mean, he was mean.

She was bad, right, and uh, it was funny, but when it got to television, she wanted to clean it up a bit, right. And I brought that up to say, I worked with so many actors as a young producer. Remember I'm twenty five. I've got these grown ass actors excuse my language, and they just they're running me.

You know what I mean. I need this.

My cactter needs Chanelle and I need And I was to sit sometimes upstair with my partner, Shae Wafer. I had a girlfriend I went to Howard with, and she went on to go to Yell and get a master's in theater management. So she's she's actually running Waco, which is Beyonce's mom, Tina Knowles and Richard Lawson's theater. But so she ran a lot of theaters over the years. But we started together. Anyway, we would sit upstairs. You know,

We took a couple of those, Brian and we would sit upstairs and cry. Nobody listens to us. We were good, we were young, we were good, but we just, you know, we were worn out. So I knew I did not want to deal with actors. I didn't think I had the I was.

I felt like I was too much of a people pleaser and I would not, you know, be a good coach. But it turned out it was actually my lane.

Well, how long did cross Roads last?

About almost ten years.

Ten years.

Yeah, yeah, my mother bought a theater in le Merray Park called Park, called the Vision Theater, and she was we housed Crossroads in there, but there was so much, There was so much in terms of keeping that huge building and facility afloat that Crossroads kind of got lost. And I after ten years, and you know, a lot of that's a lot of time and being a mom, I started having other interests and one of them was filmed and I got invited to go to I de scided I would just give it a shot. And actually

I guess it just wasn't the time. You know.

Now there's a lot of people over in the murder Park trying to resurrect her vision.

They get it now, you know, right.

But yeah, so you know, being there kind of I pivoted in a way where I had more confidence.

Uh.

And I told my agent, you know, I want to maybe be a line reader. Well, I just run lines with actors. And they said, what about coaching? And I'm like, nah, I just run lines. And I took a class with the woman named Judith Weston. She's amazing. She's got great books out.

She's you know, coaches The Life of Laura Dern and Matthew McConaughey, and she worked with all she coaches directors, and she worked with Alexandro on Babbo and twenty one Grams. And it just so happened out of all the students she's had. She calls me one day and I wasn't even in her class anymore, and she said, I look, do you know who Alejandro in that E two is? Now? Of course I did, because at AFI you study everyone and I've loved his film, So it could have been

Universe, right, and she said, he's doing a new movie.

It's going to be revolutionary and blah blah blah, you know, no cuts, and he's working with Michael Keaton and he needs somebody to help him. And at this point I have my phone, you know, and I'm like, you know.

Like who is this.

Who's like quick plan, you know, And I'm like, are you serious? She said yeah, She said yeah. She said, I'm not just doing you a favor, I'm doing them one as well. She said, you're talented and you need to be doing this.

So that afternoon, well then right after that, I'm on the phone with Alejandro. Can't believe it, and I just love his passion. And he had this movie called bird Man. He's explaining it.

To me, and he wants me to meet Michael, you know, to meet Michael, you know. And I go out there and Michael can I say.

I ran into him recently at grandparents Stay at my grandson's school.

He's got a grandson there as well. We just hugged.

Michael Keaton has got to be one of the most generous human beings I've met. Beyond the fact that he's so freaking talented, right, And when I met him, I just remember I called a girlfriend on the way to his house, like, what is happening right now?

You know?

And I'm looking at the ocean and the ocean because you know, I'm out towards Santa Monica and I'm looking at the ocean, which always gives me peace. It's kind of just like that's the space, you know, where God is if you will.

And she said, honey, you wouldn't be in that car if God didn't want you in that car. You're right where you're supposed to be. And I said, okay.

And I decided to go and not pretend to be anything other than who.

I was and where I was right and I meet him.

Love that, yeah, man.

You know it's like it's like knowing you're enough, just knowing you're enough, right, And if it's yours, it's yours.

If it's not, it's not. I don't need to pretend. And when I met Michael, I was like, hey, you know, let me just say I love your work, which I did.

And when I told my mother I was going out there, did you tell him he's your favorite batman? I'm like, Mom, I'm not going to have that conversation, but he was my favorite. But she I just loved his work, and so I just said, your credits wrap around mind about a.

Hundred times, you know.

So I'm not going to tell you anything you don't know, but I love to ask questions. I love to dig the work I do with Judith Judith Western has you know, I think it has a lot of value.

And he said, hey, I love that. So we ended up just chatting and then we're about the same age.

And when I leave him, Alejandro calls.

Within five minutes. I wondered, was there like a camera in there? Like how did he know? You know? And I just he says, oh, what does he say? You know? And I'm like, you'll have to call him.

The next phone call I get is we want to book a ticket for you to come to New York. Now Michael could have said, hey, there's a coach I worked with already, you know anything.

He said, bring her to LA. I'm into New York. I like her, right, So I don't say so much, even though I have credit for coaching. And he told me the other days, I steal use some of the things.

You you know, we talked about and you showed me, which amazing. But I walked the walk with him because there was so much that Alejandro had going on, and there was this kind of non stop camera movement, you know that if the camera was here on one scene, by the time it got to Michael, he had to be ready, and then it would go after him, say to zad Gallipanakis, and then it would go right back to him. And so it was just running lines, running lines, walking and running them.

Talking about it, talking about subtexts, what was really happening underneath the scene.

And then Michael taught me some things, of course, you know, it was just a beautiful exchange. And then of course from there all bets were off. Suddenly my coach and I had started coaching. Prior to that, my agent would send me people, so I was coaching people, and then managers would hear and they would send me people.

The actors would tell their friends. So I was already doing it, but this made me made my status just rise. And after that they were like, you know, she coached, you know, you know, so I'm getting So then I became and then he asked me to coach.

Alejandra came back and asked me to coach on the revenue and sent me around the country and to Canada to meet Native Americans that he'd seen their tape and he trusted me.

It just blew my mind.

He said, I want you to tell me what you think, telling me if you think they can do this role. And there is nothing like looking at Alejandro and him saying can they do it?

And I'm going, h yeah.

And I'm paying hands hands collapsed together in prayer. Yes, yes they can do it. But you know it's I'll say this, Brian, I feel like I feel like the gift I hear.

I have people tell me all the time you got this gift.

Because it took me so long to kind of resurrect my career, and because my mother was a star and people would kind of push me aside. I had a real struggle with confidence, and a lot of times this game is about confidence and knowing you are enough.

I mean, it's.

About that's life's game, to be honest with you, you know, and in acting it's you.

I should have studied a little more or you know, if I had more.

Roles, I would be you know, there's always some reason why we're not ready.

But if the role comes to you, perhaps and you get the role, perhaps you are ready. You just thought, it's like that car rides to meet Michael.

With Michael, he hadn't done stuff in a little bit, and it was just really about running it and just remembering how good he was, right and uh oh, you know, the first rehearsal, he killed it, killed it just in rehearsal, you know. Alejandra was so happy. The same thing with the Revenant. I worked with people who had never acted before, and it was but they had lived a life and that life informed the character. And I learned that also from my mother. She hadn't been acting that long, but

You know what I mean. She knew who that was.

And so it was about trusting yourself enough to allow that expression.

And part of your humanity is there too to come through and.

Not editing, you know, so you know, you can't be on the outside of yourself looking and wondering are you good while you're in it.

You got to be in it, you know.

So Revenant then I got the reputation of coaching newcomers. So then I coached the young man who played Tupac and man, I mean they came for us, like.

Who's playing Tupac? He bet not mess so we loved to and they just say mess up. They said that other word. Yeah right, we left you, but don't you f up? And I'm like, oh, Lord, right, Jesus.

It occurs to me. You know, we just had the Oscars a few nights ago, Brendan Frasier winning after you know, a period of time not working with a beautiful performance, and not that Michael was exactly the same way, but he had he had had some time and was duly celebrated for his unbelievable performance in Birdman. Yes, what is that feeling like for you when you see him being recognized for that work?

It is, oh, you know, I think, to be honest with you, it's what gave me the confidence to stay with it. It warmed, It warms my heart to the point of tears. When I saw him, I teared up, without question. It was it was my win as well, you know. And and he let me know that, Michael so generous and sweet. He'd let me know, he said, this is you.

You know you.

I couldn't have done this without you, you know, Alejandro.

He reached out and said, you put the heart in this film.

So to get that kind of feedback as a confirmation, it's wonderful. However, just within my own heart, it was my celebration as well. I love seeing people win and I love seeing actors win.

And it's kind of like my story. If you will, you know.

You're an artistic director, you're a director, you're an acting coach, an actor. I mean, you go truly everywhere. You've been in some amazing projects. But because I'm taking up your entire day, unfortunately I can't go into them as much as I had anticipated. But Black Jesus really really really fun, uh, straight out of Compton as well, So it's not just comedies here in the GIFs family, real real serious and important work as well. You're a coach, so I'll ask

So Rian, you have just whoa let me. I'll give you, give me a day. I'm gonna come back such a great question.

Well, and you know, I'm on a comedy now not dead yet, and the creators of that show come from the This is Us world, and I did do a role on this as Us well still and Kate Brown's mother.

I who I gravitate towards drama.

As a performer or as a viewer or what do you mean as a performer?

Okay, I gravitate more towards drama. I love. I think that's why Alejandro and I got along so well. I'm not afraid of the dark.

I love the resilience that we find in the dark. I love the light that's always there somewhere in the dark. And I love it when I see someone find it, you know, and resurrect if you will, themselves comedy. And I'm lucky that I have a role that and I bring up, bring up you know David Windsor and Casey Johnson because you know they're they're This is Us. You know they come from that family, because they have found

Just too corny and too forced.

I love the comedy that comes out of drama or the comedy that comes out of something off into in the reel, and it's organic, right, that is that's the laugh out.

Like, you know, I'll give you a moment.

You know what was that movie Still Magnolia's And Sally Field is having this moment where she's just crying and crying because her daughter has been buried. And in the middle of Oh, I just want to hit somebody, you know, Uh, she's given Shirley McClay him hit her. And I have never laughed so hard in my life, you know. But so I love those kind of twists and turns. However, when you say, is there a difference in approach as.

An actor, I don't think so. I don't either.

I don't think so. I don't.

I don't either. It's about approaching and creating the character as written, regardless of what genre or style is. Now. Style plays into it, genre plays into it. The choices that you make are maybe a little bigger or smaller, or you know what, at the times are faster or slower. The timing becomes different depending on what that is. Right, But yeah, no, I agree, it's about it's about ultimately, it's about the material and the choices that you make.

That's right, that's right. I still got to do a bio and research on my character. I still need to know what the subtext is, what I want, what the scene is about. And then if it's honest. I think the thing that was so funny about my mother was she was honest. Yes, you know, and you could see it actually happening, you know, Otherwise you start playing for laughs, and then those are the ones that are not that's funny.

Yeah, I know, yes, I know. I've read. I've read quite a few.

And I'll say this real quick. People tell me I mean to cut you off, but just really. People tell me I'm funny all the time, and I don't see it.

Well you are.

I don't want to mess with it. I don't, but I don't want to mess with it.

Well, don't mess it. Don't you don't mess with it. You're you're making my transition even better here. You gravitate toward the dark. You don't think you're funny. Let me tell you, hacks the show. You play Marcus's mom and Hacks with.

That nut Blunell.

By the way, yes, let me tell you, I really enjoyed that show. I mean, I really enjoy that show. Your performance. How did that show come about?

It's funny because Lunella and I were together and think like a man one and two. That's how we met. And then we did Black Jesus together. I get to jump on her.

And Jesus yeah, And she's like, I don't know how my fans are gonna feel about getting hit. Then she said, well, I'm getting hit by miss Touty, So I guess it's okay.

I love this Tuti. And then I used to tell you are they gonna like me? They're like, oh, they're gonna love you.

And so Harry Care comes Hacks and we're together again. Okay, so there's something about the universe. He keeps putting us together. But you know, I just auditioned for it, and then it was quiet. I didn't know I had it. And then I get a call from my agent. Remember that audition you did, you know? And here comes to show and they want you, and I was overjoyed.

And of course Jeane Smart is a freaking master class that woman right there. And but I didn't know how big this show was going to be, you know. And then you know Marcus carl Is, he's an amazing talent.

You know, he was in Hamilton and he's done so much. But playing his mother, the immediate connection between myself, Marcus and Lounell, Luna and I already kind of we've become friends. It was just golden, just golden, and we fed off of each other. And Paul and Lucia and Jen they loved us, and Lucilla and they loved us, and they're like, we're bringing you back.

So I'm doing the third season now.

Oh, congratulations, thank you.

That is amazing, all these nominations, I mean nominations and wins.

I'm so proud.

Yes, you know, I'm struck by your character there that is very clearly a comedic character and is very funny. Yet there was a moment there in the second season where Marcus is going through something very real, very difficult, and you see it. Yeah, and you drop into that place and have a really beautiful scene between the two of you.

That's where I kiss him on the head. Yeah, where there's.

That kiss just came well, I didn't know he was going to put his head on my shoulder, but I just like my big baby.

What do you think the show says about women specifically in the industry who are at I guess either end, the end and the beginning.

You know, I I this monk Brian. What I love is that, you know, women, we've been pushing for our voices to be heard for a while. Now.

You know, we've got agism, you know, and general identity and and you know, of course, you know, black lives matter and these kinds of things. And in the midst of this is also the idea of women's agency, right and that and agism is real. You know, they're ready to put us away after a certain age, but we're still.

Vital and valuable. And even in our families where matriarchs people come to us. In my own life, I have a lot of young people, male and female, because even with my coaching clients who become you know, like can I just talk to you?

My son his friends call me mom. So to not show that, to not honor that on screen, there's a huge piece of our story missing. So what I love is that in Hacks, we're dealing with multi generational relationships. You've got Jane's character who is supposed to be washed up and it's time for her to go out to pastor. And then you have this young writer who's messed up and needs help, you know, and they inform each other. Their exchange is beautiful and it's real and there's nothing

They're funny because they're both can be at each other's throats, you know. And you know, younger people, when we're young, we think we know it all we do.

You know, and you can't tell me anything, and then we mess up and then that older person is there and say, well, in Jean's case, I told you, but that she's also there for the hug. And so I'm really happy to see more of this. And I think all of it also is happening, Brian, because more women writers and older women writers are being invited to the table, you know, like this one show that I love, you know,

We're seeing more of that now.

You know.

It's kind of like the Golden Girls back in the day, it was key. We need more of that now and I'm starting to see it. So I think it's important, and I think what it says about women is that.

We're here and we're here to stay, and our stories are valuable and funny, and there's an audience, definitely an audience.

Oh absolutely, not dead yet came out. I read that it is ABC's most watched comedy debut in over four years.

There you go.

I heard network television was dead, but no it is not. It is a lot thriving. It is not dead yet. God, you made the pun better than I did. Did you think it was going to be a big hit?

I was hoping.

First of all, Gina Rodriguez. You know, she's coming from Jane the Version and so many other things. She's a boss and she's just a spitfire. She really is so talented. And then you know we've got Lauren ash and you know from ESU Hysterical, from Superstore and Hannah, you know, just everyone on that.

Show has a history.

And then of course I think with Casey and with David and Dean Holland team good team. You know, Mary Biola's also and Corey Marsh they bought for the show. So when I looked at the team and looked at their background, I'm like, they all got a great history.

So I was praying.

I can't say that I knew it for sure, but I thought it had a great chance to be a big kid. So it's exciting and this is my first network series, so it's a dream come true.

How did you become a part of it? Did you just audition?

I auditioned and they probably knew my work from This is Us. I've auditioned and they loved it, and I got to tell you, they made an they you know, David and Casey were talking about this. They said that I was the first one hired, and I guess because at that time some players were moving around. But little did I know they had already auditioned me, and so they kind of had me on the hold. And I didn't know if I had it or not. But they said, you were the first one hired, and when.

We saw you, there was never a question that there was we were to even see anyone else. I was like, oh my, that's a great story.

So I auditioned and then it was quiet, and then they asked to see me again, but this time they wanted me to read with Gina. We did a chemistry read. Gina and I connected immediately. It was over zoomed. And then the next thing I know, I had to offer you know, and it's it's I'll say this. Out of all the you know shows I've done and all the you know shows I've lost, this was probably one of the smoothest transitions into a show effort. So when it's your time, honey, it is your time.

You know.

They love that. Well, you're working with one of my old pals, Dean Holland worked with me on the office for so many years.

And I love you and I get to say it now. Can I just tell you how much I love you much? I love you?

Oh stop keep going stop. Yeah, I love him. I'm so happy for his and now your success. So playing cricket free spirited, talk to me about your process as is your coaching yourself getting ready to play her. How do you go about approaching getting prepared on a week by week basis for her?

So I did it.

I did it, and I got coached because I as a coach, I like to just step outside of my bubble as I said, and here's somebody else's opinion.

So I did, even as a coach, you have a coach oh.

Heck, yeah, yeah, because there's there's the coach muscle, but then there's the acting muscle. And it's a little different because when you're coaching, you're outside of it, watching when you're and so there's of course I got to do what I tell my clients to do.

So that helps, without a doubt, tremendously.

But there's something about having someone else watch me and dig and poke around, you know. And so I work with a guy named Guy Camilary and he's great, pushed me around a little bit, you know. And so so what I my process is this I I did. I did a bio, you know, a lot of research on cricket, and I talked to a couple of my girlfriends who were married to men, white men.

I just kind of talked about what that was like for.

Both of them, and you know, out in the world and how people judge them or not accept them, et cetera.

Looked at looked up Monty. I was so, you know, tickled to be with Martin mull and you know all that he's accomplished, he's iconic and I, you know, and so I allow myself to continue to let that bio evolve based on what I learned about the story. And by the way, they're so great, Dean and them.

They let me meet with the writers and we got to talk, and from my personality and that exchange, they came up with some things that I had shared. So week two week, it's, you know, I kind of always go back and read that bio and try to stay on tasks of who Cricket is. And then I did with it the same way I would with anything else.

What am I really saying? What do I need? How do I feel about Gina? You know? And I sometimes make personal connections, but now I don't have to anymore because she and I have our real connection. So it's, you know, it's it's always what is the story? What is the story I'm telling? Yeah, and what's my part in it? You know? What? Boys do I have in this? In this kind of like.

Tapestry if you will, of this episode, because it's about being a team player.

It's not about trying to outdo outshine, you know, show them I'm good, and you know, it's it's just stick with the story.

The role has been written, it's been written well, and just what is the piece? What's the piece that they need from you?

Yeah, you know it occurs to me based on our earlier conversation. You know, the show deals with the dark, right, death and break up obituary, but you know it does it with with a lighter tone. Yes, do you think that that enables us to address some difficult topics a little easier or a little deeper even than maybe dramas can.

I'm so glad you said that.

I think the comedy, that this blend of comedy and then, like we said, the dark is the perfect medium or or genre, if you yeah, in addressing some of those things that it is hard to address in real life.

And you know, my son is funny.

He's like my buddy, and he's you know, watched me since he's was born, you know, and he talks about he talks about how there are other ghost movies on and there's dark movies, and there's the vampires, and not putting any of that down.

There's a place for everything, right, But he said, you know, Mom, while there's there's so much going.

On in this world and so much darkness, it's nice to be on the show. He's so happy that I'm on the show that takes darkness and brings it to the light, you know, And oh, we find a light in the darkness, absolutely, you know. And I come from a family my grandmother, my mother's mother was Claire Boyant, and she was a preacher.

She kind of believed in spirits and things like that, and you know, we're like, wait a minute, who's in the room? You know? You know, you see who, you feel what you know. But I've always been kind of a believer that, you know, we move on and there's this other realm of this, this other existence.

Like not to be so arrogant to think that maybe this is just it, that there might be other energies and life beyond us. And this explores it in such a funny way, in such a sweet way.

And who better to get life advice from but from those who've already lived it and have no more choices.

We still have, and I think the meaning, you know, there's different messages each week, but at the end, at the base of those messages is the idea that we still have choice, we can still make a difference, right, And I think that is hopeful and it's uplifting and it's necessary. So I'm so proud. I actually wrote an affirmation out. I don't know if you've ever done this, Like when I was broken, I was.

Like, I don't no mammy ever gonna act again. I quit, I'm done.

And then my age is like you got an all this, and I'm like okay, And so someone said, well, write down what you want, and when I tell you, I wrote down two things out share I know, one out of time. One was I thank the universe as if it's already happened, thank you for a role on the show that matters, like this is Us. And then I

And I was like, wow, you know that's cool. That's cool. Yeah. So I hope that answered your question. But I think it's the perfect avenue to explore.

Some of those those feelings, those hurts and maybe come to some place of hope.

It was a perfect answer. Let me just let me tell you this, this is true. I was recently asked why I enjoy doing this podcast, and my answer is because of the conversation we just had. Oh, getting to meet you and talk to you, and your incredible career and the diversity of your career what you've been able to accomplish from where you started, and it's just so like, my day is better, My day is better for having

Again, I'm a huge fan of yours. So when I had this, I thought this opportunity come through. I was so tickled and you have made my day. Thank you so much for having me, great questions about it.

A couple of times I'm made me think, thank you.

See you have a beautiful week, and thank you so much for having me. Hope you get to meet a real person.

Me too, very very soon. Yes, indeed, Angela, thank you so much for joining me today. This is the beginning, It is not the end. I had so much fun. I can't wait now to tune in too. Not dead yet, and listeners, you should do the same and I will catch you all next week for another exciting episode of Off the Beat. We're gonna have more stories, We're gonna have more laughs, more everything. You just call me mister Moore. Well,