How The West Will Be Won with Gass and Oshan

Hi, I'm Will Bruin, and I was just recognized as a Seattle Sounders legend. Now I get to do voice reads for the Sounder at Heart Podcast Network. There we go. Come on! Hey, O'Shann! Let's go! Seattle Sanders have done it! Winners, the soldiers rule the regions! Creatures great and small! Rothrop gonna collect it in just about runs into the advertising audience. Go to our left. More goes in! Oh what a cross! And what a goal! Where's my cup?

This episode of Nos Arietas is sponsored by Fulpole Wines, a Seattle-based wine retailer and proud sponsor of Nos Arietas since 2011. Full Pool was founded in 2009, is based in Seattle, and is owned and operated by longtime Sounders supporters. They offer the best boutique wines of the world to members of their mailing list, with special focus on their home, Pacific Northwest.

Welcome back to another episode of Nos Adiatis on the Sound Heart Podcast Network. I am joined once again by my good buddy, the host of Soccer Wise, David Goss. How's it going? Great. I'm ready to chop it up. I'm jealous of the jerseys in your background and I'm ready to talk. Oh yeah, we got uh we got some Patrick Ianni stuff here. That's an Obed Varg that's an assigned Obed Vargas jersey. Ah, I was gonna ask what the stripes were. I think that's who that is Yeah.

I guess and then I think this is a DeAndre Yedlin jersey from Tottenham. Nice. Nice. Man, weird that Yedlin's on RSL. It's just like a weird spin back around. Uh I made a strong take about it that I think he would be I think he's a defender of the year contender if he plays up to his level because of the way RSL plays, but it hasn't been a terrible take so far, but it hasn't been great.

You know, and it's it is funny'cause he was it was so I mean it was Two thousand fourteen his last season in Seattle. Wild. I would imagine some of our listeners, they don't even remember that. He was the shining light of Americans in Europe for like two, three years. I know again The only one consistently playing on his team around that 2018 dark days.

And you know what was else was funny is I really thought he was gonna get to a hundred caps for the U.S. national team. And I think he's gonna end up falling. just a little bit short because he you know, I guess this is what sort of happens with a lot of national teamers is they are regulars and then and it seems like they could just, you know, they're just gonna keep ticking off. eight to twelve caps a year forever. And then they just stop getting called in and they do zero.

But he's got eighty one caps, which is a ton and is an incredible national team career. Um, but he was as a young player definitely well on the way um to hitting that. I think He really got hurt by the fact his generation basically is the lost generation. That's not his fault. So he got hurt by the fact that after

They wanted Burr Halter to jump to the next generation because we hadn't qualified anyway and let's get there. And he w he was in a little bit, off and on, but then when he came back to MLS, he just completely fell off um the map. Yeah. Yeah. It was it's too bad. And, you know, I would like to think that he will someday have another uh, you know, like a farewell stint, but it's getting you know, we're getting to the point now where

the the v the the axes are not gonna quite maybe line up where he's the right price and the right need. And if he were to come back at this point, it would almost be purely as a sort of like a w a s a one year swan song kind of situation, which is So he's in a four way tie for twenty eighth all time on the appearances. Cause eighty one again is a lot. Tim Reims on eighty. So he will probably pass him. Weston McKinney's on sixty four. That's like the next.

Ballistic's already ahead of him. Um, but if he got one more, he would jump over Tab Ramos, Thomas Dooley, and Desmond Armstrong, who are three like legends, and he would go into a tie with Eddie Lewis, Eddie Pope, and Brad Friedel. So yeah. Yeah, it shows the level he was on. I mean he was starting at Newcastle and at a time when again people weren't playing. And then when he came back to MLS, it's interesting. It's just

MLS is so specific the way you have to structure a roster. And so guys like that just like are never gonna be probably paid the number they want. And now you get into a comfort versus challenge situation. And I think some of the national team coaches have

try to like overly sense that of like, oh well he's come back for his family to be comfortable. Like he's not pushing his competition anymore. And it's like they give up on those guys before actually getting them in the pool and being like, oh, he actually can't hang at this level anymore.

Yeah, it is interesting. Uh, you know, and while we're on this subject, and since we, you know, part of the fun of this show is that we're just kind of talking MLS here, but you know, one of the players who just came on the market. Darryl DK, uh a little bit of a flash in that you know, he is

uh a few people in our market have mentioned, hey, that might be an interesting player. I did not completely appreciate that it was four years ago that he left Orlando City and that he has, you know, he cause he went when he first went his first two stints. on loan and then his first real stint in England were both really good. But he has spent most of the last three years injured and now he got he just got released by West Brom.

Wh where do you put, you know, he's still only 26, I believe. Where do you put Daryl DK in terms of is he someone that MS team should be targeting to bring back? So I think Seattle probably sits in a unique place here in which If you could get him on a non-DP number, you wouldn't be reliant on him. And therefore, you could risk the injuries concerns for him, because that stuff's not going to go away. Like he's No, he's-

been sidelined most of the last two years. Yeah. Um, but he's he's a game changer when he's on the field. And he would be, when healthy, he would be a top five ten goal scorer in major league soccer. So that's like the risk you would have to take, where for Seattle with Musovsky and De R Di Rosario and whatever, you could take that risk if you wanted to. I'd be surprised if there were a lot of other MLS teams who could because I don't think they have the cap flexibility to do it.

And I'm trying to think of like a team. The only teams I could see give him a DP spot are like a Colorado, where they're like, this is our lane and we're not going to get other people. And we've fully established that. Ray. This is what we do. And so we'll be the ones right. The amount of money they gave Paxton Aronson, no one else in MLS is doing that. So I think that's like a type of team. That I could see maybe talk themselves into it and the other pieces with no transfer fee.

You could up if you don't need the D P spot'cause you're not going to use it on someone else, you could push'em into that number, which is like max TAM number between one point two and one point eight, whatever it is. And if you needed to, you could buy them down. If it's a three year deal, then let's say it doesn't work out. Once you're a year and a half in, you could look at a buyout or a termination or something. But I think in the list of teams that are like competitive in MLS.

I think most of them I wouldn't say are worth that risk. Yeah. And I I mean, I was uh did one thing I thought was interesting is that he wasn't quite making D P wages in England, but I don't know what his mindset is. Like he might, I don't know, maybe someone who feels like he would need to be a DP to come back to MLS.

But it's an interesting you know, this is gonna be a very interesting summer. And not just because it's a World Cup summer, but because there's this long pause between games. There's uh what, si almost sixty days between games, right? Yeah. And do you think that's gonna do you think that essentially that'll change the market as well, or is it more of just a

And I don't know. It's just it's just like an un I don't think we've ever had a a summer like this, have we, where we've had this long of a pause. No, absolutely not. I think twenty five Fourteen, there was a pa 2022 obviously didn't matter because it was a Winter World Cup. Right. Twenty fourteen, I remember like an extended pause where I don't think it was as long for twenty eighteen. No, I think it was like three weeks or something.

Yeah, and I think obviously part of that was the US not qualifying. And I also like the time zone stuff because twenty fourteen was like the games are during prime time and you didn't want to go up against it in MLS. intelligently at the time was trying to use the momentum of the World Cup rather than swim against the tide. Um, and I do remember the twenty fourteen World Cup final

was on ABC and it was a double header with a Portland Seattle game, and it was a brutal game. It was like one zero No, it was a Atlanta Seattle game. If I remember correctly. I thought it was 2018. No, no, no. 2014 is what I'm talking about. Twenty fourteen, okay. I was talking twenty eighteen, okay. Interesting. I didn't realize they did it in 2018 too. I didn't remember that. Um, but I remember that game. I mean it was a semifinal.

I just remember it being like, Oh, this is the best game MLS has to put on. Great. And it just was like, ah, you just got a bad one this time. And it's like the most MLS story. I tell this story all the time. We watched uh Orlando, NYCFC's first ever game. I was in the MLS league office at the time doing work for MLSacer.com and it was like caca, right? And they had sold out the orange bowl.

And it was just zero zero in like the seventieth minute. And Simon Borg goes, just never snows for us. And I was like, What do you mean? And he's like, NHL, they do the winter classic. It just snowed the first time. And like no one remembers the game even, but it's this magical thing that now has this huge moment and it was this surge of interest of like they're playing hockey in the snow and it was like

MLS finally got a sold out full stadium with big stars and big names and it was just a stinker of a zero zero game and uh that's always stuck with me. Um but yeah, I this layoff is different and I think we've already seen it, with Columbus letting Rydstrom gr go and with Austin even more importantly, I think.

Letting Nico Estevez and Rodolfo Borrell go, it shows the sign internally, which is this is a second shot at a preseason. And teams that don't like where they're at, I think are going to use this in a way we've never seen before. I think it shows some other signs about the league which we can talk about, but that's the big one is we legitimately have a chance to just start a new season coming out of this break if we want to. And every team is playing at least half their games after the break. Uh

More than half. I mean, the Sounders are gonna be playing twenty-one games after the break, which is wild. Or twenty one MLS games. I think most teams will have played fourteen going into the break. Um so coming out of it they will have yeah, they will have fifty twenty even. Yeah. So they'll have the twenty or so um left to play. Yeah. I mean that's that's it it is an interesting it it creates an interesting dynamic. You know, one of the other ones that uh obviously near and dear to our heart.

is the Portland Timbers, who a lot there's been a lot of chatter uh about how what's going on with uh with Phil Neville and he se you know, every week he seems to do jet you know, like he'll he'll get he'll get a result that's just good enough to sort of like, no, no, no. The gaffer's ready to go. What the no, what's his nickname? The uh

Yeah. Your British manager. Yeah. Portland on 14 points right now. So they're one ahead of St. Louis for 14th. Oh yeah, the Fizz are sorry. And fifteenth, obviously, sporting Kansas City. Uh technically they are five points out of a quote unquote playoff spot. I wouldn't exactly call it that, but that's what some people will. I think he's in a lot of trouble. I just I watched the team and we got some comments from our show on on Monday'cause

Uh, we were live during the time when the news came out about Esteves. So we had already planned to talk about Henrik Rydstrom, but in the rundown, we had already built like Tom kind of anticipated next week being that experience, which was hearing multiple coaches, core of sort of like that Red Monday, I think is what the NFL calls it, when the regular season ends, and that's where you get the news on a lot of it. And two of them happened.

Already. The other major ones that people are talking about is is Toronto, the struggles they've had. Obviously Philadelphia, which I would be surprised if Philadelphia made a move.

That seems like it would be tough, right? I mean, I know that this is exactly what happened or not exactly what happened to him. It's similar to what happened to Carnell in St. Louis, but it just seems like it would be really Harsh to like I realize going from Sporter Shield to wooden spoon contending is a bat is a is a pretty stark fall, but Winning wooden spoon contending at a rate that would be the worst points rep points per game per punt in MLS history.

Not just the worst team in the league. They'd be worse than twenty thirteen TC United if it continued, which I'd be surprised if it did, just because again, the core of a team is in there that's won so many games that my assumption is when they get hot, they'll win three. And even though I'm not saying they'll make the playoffs, I think they'll blow that number and What was that number? Yeah.

Have to be so bad all season to hit that. But that's again similar to the Phil Neville stuff like that shouldn't be a conversation, but the performances have been so bad that it pulls it in. My guess is with Ernstann coming back, quote unquote, whether he left or not. is up to uh debate or it seems like potentially opinion. Um, that that's just gives you a runway of like, well, it's all been chaotic. Let's reset from here. Let's start over.

Um, but Portland and then we were going to talk at the time about Austin. And in saying that it's like Okay, this is the feeling about Austin externally and clearly it was happening internally. So I think it gives legitimacy to the conversations we're all having about all these teams, where if it feels like there's external pressure, there probably is because an Austin felt it.

And they made the move and a Columbus, not only did they feel it, they had a little bit of a different situation because they have open cup quarterfinals this week where they like wanted the new coach bump for that game. I think that Portland's in the same boat. I I don't know how you will don't watch Portland. and feel that the pieces don't work together or are not working together.

And so some of the pushback I got from Timmer's fans, which I think is legitimate, is well, do the pieces fit? Because if that's not the case, then is it on Phil Neville? It's on Ned Grabavoy, it's on the front office. And I think that's a fair question to ask.

It's a very Russian. I think th this is what I would say, and I and I'm wondering what how you fall on this, is that in the similar to the Burrell uh Esteves situation where it's like Yeah, you're right. It's both. You know, and I cause it is there really any r someone was I don't remember who it was, maybe it was Doyle, but they were comparing Neville to well Uh, Chris Reifer was comparing Neville to John Spencer. And John Spencer is, you know

uh the first Timbers coach, everyone agreed was a disaster. He had you know, he was okay his first year, but he was like you know, he was famous for like rolling the balls out into the training pitch and say, Have at it, boys. Uh and anyway Everyone sort of agrees he was a disaster uh at Portland. And that's the compare that's the most apt comparison at this point to Phil Neville. And

Yeah, I mean I think there is something to be said that maybe the Timbers roster is not as well put together as some would have you believe. But like, does that excuse like is there really a world where Ned Grabovoy gets fired and Phil Neville doesn't? And and the way I just think people need to think about this stuff is for the most part, it's the sporting director's job to fire the coach. So there's not a lot of sporting directors that walk in the room and say,

Oh no, no, actually I'm the problem. Fire me. So you need ownership to shift into Exactly. Please just blame me and that's it. So that therefore you end up in a situation where you need ownership to step in unless there's a president who sits above both sides who would make this call, which Is hit or miss in MLS if there is, and for the most part, the ones that are are even worse because they think they know soccer when they don't. I think this is a bigger

Well, I was gonna say there's a huge complaint in St. Louis that I've heard a lot about. Um, and so The just the order of these things is well, can we salvage it? So the coach goes first. If that doesn't work, then the sporting director goes first. Where it's fascinating is Austin, where both went at the same time. I I don't remember anything like that happening before, do you? At least in the

Middle of the year. Like I'm sure there's been years where they just cleaned shop and they said, We got to get rid of everybody. I guess you could even say that in some ways that's what happened in Kansas City. Yeah, Wolvermeese was both. Um which makes it a little bit tougher. No, I'm trying to think Toronto had Bill Manning.

And I don't remember if Robin was coach at the time or who was coach. They've also had a bunch of interims because of John Herdman and stuff like that. So I don't remember that situation. But no, you're right. It is fairly rare to have them both happen at the same time like this, where it's not like

an off season or contracts were up and right both were let go. But you the like normal working assumption is the sporting director will hire the coaches. They'll hire the coaches for their system. And so if You now for Austin, you have to do one process. After you do that process, they have to start the next process. So like I'd be surprised if Austin hired a new coach this season who coached this year. I think best case scenario is you finally land on a name in the fall.

And maybe you announce them and they are going to take over after or they start coming around, which I always think is hilarious of like, okay, so you're coaching the team, you just sit in the stands, watch them lose and then and then you take over like

You're available. It's not like you strained a hamstring. You could coach. Right. And that would that would be my guess of what happened. And I I think because of that, Davey Arnold probably has a legitimate shot at keeping that job. But I I think we will see two or three others. I think Portland is more talented than Austin, the players they've brought in. And I think You have to convince yourself that you can make it work. Now, I'm not a hundred percent sure it will.

But you have to, if you're like the ownership group, look at it and s and like each guy is probably worth the value of what you paid for them. It was probably a mistake to pay that for all of them together. But you don't look at it and say this guy's playing underneath his monetary value that we put out is capable of it. Yeah. Dicosa's probably the biggest one just because

That's the one they probably most overpaid for for what he does. I think he's a good soccer player. I just think they put him in the Evander category themselves, which was a mistake. Right. Yeah. Yeah. Uh I guess and so who are the other teams that you think are, you know, flirting with coaching changes during this this long break? So I think the assumption is Portland's one of them. Austin we thought would be one of them. They clearly uh won't be. I think there is.

a lot of external pressure around the LA Galaxy, uh which uh Victor Just give it A give him a co a contract extension? They did just give him a contract extension. And I don't know exactly where that came from after the worst not after because they did it last year, but the worst season in MLS history. But Jim Curtin got a contract.

And he got let go. And so it wouldn't be the first time um that it's ever happened. So I think those Philadelphia's gonna get talked about. Toronto, I think, will also get mentioned and a reminder Montreal and Orlando are on tem are on interim coaches right now. Columbus is on an interim coach. So when you look here's just an example. Here's the non playoff teams in the E.

Orlando fired their coach. Toronto we think's in trouble. Montreal fired their coach. Columbus fired their coach. And Atlanta and Philadelphia. So, like, it's kind of everyone who's not a playoff team is in that territory in the Eastern Conference. In the West, I think it's a little bit less

Chaotic. Um, and I think because you have San Diego and Colorado, the two teams outside who they either have new coaches or Varus who did well, where there's a ton of internal belief and they're not gonna like panic into a coach move right now.

Yeah. Well, turning our focus a little bit more to the West, you know, the last time we talked, it felt like the West was sort of just you know, it was almost an embarrassment of riches at the top of the table where it felt like everyone had to win every game just to stay in the race. And in the interim, in the last two weeks especially, there's been a lot of

Uh uh that's that that has been tested a lot. You know, the Sounders only got four points in this a three game week where they were all at home. And weirdly the one they won was the the one I thought was their toughest matchup. Uh, but then, you know, LAFC suddenly is just absolutely falling apart. Uh Vancouver has started to show some chinks. San Jose has started to show some chinks.

I I don't know if they're, you know, all of a sudden RSL continues to climb. Uh Houston is the strangest team in the league right now for me. Like they they have no ties. They have no ties. Uh yeah. But d I mean, they're not at the top of the the conference, but just that it it's it's the it's gone MLS, I guess is what has happened. Is that It has Well, I would say so the the bait the original base of our convo when we had when we chatted last time was the West is stronger than the East. Yeah.

That has not changed. I think the my feeling is it's it's deeper than we even said. Like I think Dallas is a legitimate contender inside of that group that we talked about last time. I think LAFC will remain in that. There'll be questions about Mark Dos Santos. That's probably one of the ones I should have said as well. But that one I think is more external than internal, the pressure on him. But they went to a CONCAF semifinal, the games that that takes, the travel that takes, all of that.

It's not unheard of. And all and those are the teams that probably are best off with this long layoff. Because now rather than it be this full season thing where you never get your legs under you, like Seattle experienced in twenty one and all of that. There's this reset where now you can come out of it. They also have some flexibility because Ustakia was on loan. So maybe they changed their team around.

So, like what I would say is I think there are six teams legitimately in the Western Conference. And that's not even talking about San Diego, which I don't think they've done enough to deserve to. Where in the East, I would say there are two. So this experience over the last few weeks of like teams knocking each other off to me has only increased my feeling that Interesting. That the West is strong. But it does not increase my feeling that any specific one of these teams

the best sort of lane to get there. Sure. Um, like even San Jose, I think, is the easiest one of they played all their guys, they've had injuries. They are struggling. They they've struggled to get some of these guys on the field, but they've still put really good performances in against the other top teams. Like the loss in Seattle.

It's not one where you hang your head and say, Wow, we can't play with these guys. And that was without Nico Securis and without Werner and Preston Judd, you know, being rotated throughout the week. And then they did this. It was a totally rotated lineup. It's not rotated anymore because that's all they have left. Because then they went into the next game, but totally. And so Vancouver has missed Mueller this entire run and they remain at the top of the conference. So

I think it has increased my feeling that the West is back over the last three years. I think the West has been down in the East in terms of Cincinnati and NYCFC, Philly on top of Inter Miami and sort of the class at the top of it have have pushed things. Columbus, of course. Now it feels like that is transferred to the West. And I do think all I I wouldn't be surprised if any of the teams that we just talked about won the supporter shield or won MLS Go.

Yeah. The the one that's really surprised me recently is F C Dallas just seems to have suddenly gotten uh, you know, shown that they can they can really go toe to toe with some of the the big boys. And this win over San Jose was particularly impressive because they they sort of had to keep Like San Jose kept coming back and they just They just kept pushing it farther. And then the the goal I we gotta talk about the Sam Sarver Great. Isn't it great?

It's it's amazing. I I seriously wanna ask Paul Rothrock what he thinks of Sam Sarver because it's like It's i I feel like they have some kinship in their sort of the way they got here and nice sort of the way that they're carrying themselves. What? I am I was I that was just a um an amazing moment. And, you know, for a guy to kind of come out of MLS next pro, to be start scoring some goals like he did, and then to just like embrace the moment.

I love it. I just love that, you know, the the scuba dive celebration, you know, whatever. I don't know if that was the the best celebration, but to do it in front of the the away the home supporters and then to pick up a can that got through at you and to shotgun a beer. I mean, that was that was that was that was pure MLS. That was great. It's personality that we just don't see from a lot of players. And one of the things I love about MLS.

And I see this a lot because I cover NWSL is a lot of these players who are not these anointed athletes from childhood have personality. They have They are socialized in a way that most pro athletes aren't because pro athletes are just like raised on this track. And so you end up getting the Paul Rothrocks and the Andrew Thomases of the world and Kose Tefari at LAFC.

He wants to be an actor. He wants to be a fashion designer. He speaks multiple languages. Like you're not really getting that in MLB or NHL. Like that's just not the lifestyle most of these people live. There's an interview on, I don't know, on Sky Sports or something with Cole Palmer where they're talking about he i i it's like you talk about a guy who's just uh g has no real life. Yeah.

And he's fun because he has no filter because he doesn't really care and it's he's not really paying attention. But like i I won't I listen, I'm not the I'm not going to be the proponent only of college education, is the only way things work. But what what happens with most of these people is that they just become socialized.

'Cause they live they're they're older when they get to the pro ranks. They live a life where they're not this anointed god and they have to operate in normal society. They have to learn to function for themselves to an extent. And this is something I know.

Talking to people, for example, in the Sounders Academy, when they do those loans to what, the Austrian Mountains and Czech Republic or even to USL championship teams, it it one of the comments I always get when I ask is, well, they gotta learn how to cook dinner.

Like they have to grow up as human beings. It happens in soccer more than it happens in these other sports because it's not as high profile as sport here. And the money is not the same. So it's not this like lotto ticket that everyone is building their lives around. And Paul Rothrock and Sam Sarver, I think, are are two examples of that. And you see it on the other end of like they're quirky, they're fun, they're intelligent, they're thinking about stuff and open to talking about stuff.

Um, I've covered Sam Sarver since he was an academy kid. He was on Aidan Morris and Sebastian Burr Halter's crew academy teams. And The comment has always been like, This kid plays like a madman. And it was just like, Could you funnel him? in the right direction to use all of the madman tendencies and it wasn't right for him out of the academy. He went to Indiana, which is a great soccer program. He played high level soccer for three, four years there.

Then he goes to Next Pro, which I have a lot of bones about whether or not Next Pro is the right setup for everything in terms of what it is, but I think playing soccer. Is better than sitting on a bench and not having an opportunity to play soccer. I just would do it in the USL and have yourself going to Louisville and Charleston when you have those experiences, but no one asks me.

Um, and he sort of like bid his time and and found a space, but he's a super interesting guy. I think it's one of those, obviously, now that he's this. Darling people will learn about him more. Um, he's talked a lot about mental health in the past. He had um some tough times as a kid that I know the Crew Academy helped him through. Um, and like he now has emerged in this really opportune spot. But this is the system that I think exists. And as much as people wanna whine and complain like

Why do kids going to college? That's not the way it's done overseas, blah blah blah. You're always gonna miss players, or players are always going to be there are gonna be some players who are ready later on. And that's why I'm happy that at least the net is bigger now that a guy like that can then find his. Well and I think it's and it's not just you know, I think t m probably to your point, it's not just

going to college that's i important. It's that they live lives outside of the athlete bubble. And, you know, so many of these players in England, like they will like to use an example, right? They'll go on loan. They they'll They'll s come through an academy and then sure, maybe they go on loan to Wrexham or they go on loan to some, you know, random club and they and they're just but they're still they're they're still kind of tied to the big club. They still are raised in an environment.

that is about where soccer players are gods, where they don't have to interact with normal people, where like all their friends are you know, fellow academy players where they're, you know, there's someone doing their laundry and doing all this kind of stuff. And then the an American system is just set up in a way that for the most part, kids

are forced to go out and go to school and, you know, go to, you know, whether it's high school or whatever, but they have lives outside of their outside of their teams a lot of times. And especially once they get, you know, if they don't go pro right away.

you know, they're uh they're they're living normal they're like normal people. And I think that's what's so f refreshing about the American soccer player in for the most part is that these guys wanna, you know, they they wanna have conversations with you. Like, I don't know, every single time I Run into Paul Rothrock and he asks me, you know, how are you doing? And it's not like a empty gesture of like,

It and it's like, No, no, no, seriously, like how are your kids or whatever? And uh and it's like that's just not something you're used to athletes doing.

And I think the other thing that I like is I do think it creates an environment where guys that come to MLS. start to learn it here where you know you talk to foreign players who have always been in a different style and they come here and maybe they're uncomfortable at first. But like I chatted with Steven Morrera a preseason.

And he's like open to sitting down and talking about his life and his experience. And he's telling me about the fights he had with Wilfred Nance and the you know, the the the experiences he goes through there and what it's gonna be like when Darlington Nagby retires because he's his he the heart and soul. And, you know, as an a a player coming here, like Nagby adopted him and he's goes with his family. All these conversations that

To what I understand from a lot of these guys, they just wouldn't have in other places. And I think some of that tone is set by you come into a locker room where someone else is acting that way with media. And so it sort of builds a trust and a relationship and a style um that you wouldn't really have. And I think it's obviously been massively Influential on the women's game of the push for equal pay was from players who were high achievers, who had been through an experience of

playing at UNC and Princeton and Stanford, whatever, that the average athlete doesn't have. And it's not that those places are perfect, but they are forced to be intellectually challenged sometimes when they're in those places. They also rub shoulders with other people outside of their bubble. So then as you grow up

into your professional career, your friends are in other fields and you're learning about those fields and you're watching them succeed. Where a lot of players, if you are AAU basketball, you would never really get out of that. And, you know, if you play for Chelsea's Academy at U twelve,

probably most of the people you know are just soccer players and that's sort of the the niche you're in. So yeah, I I think it's really interesting. Um Sam Sarver's a great story. He's a like really cool personality. It's fun that he's just wearing it on his sleeve and

He's done for much as I think most people will say, oh wow, like there's just a kid who doesn't know better, he's actually done a lot behind the scenes to like make himself comfortable to be able to be this. And I think it's part of why he's playing real. Well and I think the g you know, like the the tell was a little bit the neck it wasn't like it was all just in the moment. The next day he went and did an Instagram post with a button. It was gold.

Yeah, it's so good. And Dallas is pretty good about like, you know, they're kind of like, Yeah, well let's take a shot. Let's see what happens. Where other teams might shut it down. And so to your point, on the soccer side, I've always been really high on this Dallas team. Petzar Musa, I I think he might start a game for Croatia at the World Cup, which is wild to say. And it's not

This is not Thomas Mueller coming here and working his way back into the team. Like this is a guy who is peeking into the national team because of his play in major league soccer. Um, I think he is the best complete forward in the league. And so that's a reference point that the rest of it all operates off of. And they found a little more possession this year, not as much as I'd like. I think they've struck out in trying to help him. Santi Moreno

is better than nothing, but is not the proper DP ten that they should bring in because of how good this team can be. But most of the other pieces fit in uh what I was talking about on on my show on Soccer Wise that When you watch the San Jose game, when they see a half opening, because they defend deep and they find their triggers and they go and they press. It's a full eleven guys like dogs, then in the other way. And so when they get

When they win the ball and they go in transition, it's not one or two, it's five to seven. And they overwhelm you and all of them are finishers and really good in those moments. And so I think that Commitment to that style, plus the individual talent in a lot of the pieces that are in there. Uruguide is one of the best center backs.

In the league. Uh, Calodi's been a bit of a step down this year for him. So goalkeeper's been a problem. Sierra got the start in the last game, who I think is a solid MLS keeper. And then up the spine, like that's something that. This is a team that will have a shot in any elimination game they play. And if they can either improve the quality on the roster or just turn the screws to perfect what they do, they also have a shot to stay in a shield race.

You know, and you had me thinking Peter Peter Musa has to be like this is a admittedly uh a a niche first, but he's gotta be one of the first, if not the first, MLS player who came to MLS before he was really in the national team. got into the national team and it's not just a r but like to be with Croatia, like that's a pretty high level you like we've seen players go from not being in the national team to being in a World Cup, but not Necessarily like a team of Croatia's Yeah.

stature. And I guess you could argue uh Almada was Almada, is that right? The Argentine, right? Yeah. Tiago Almado, like but he wasn't really like a important player for Argentina, whereas Peter Musa could end up being like a real player for Croatia. Yeah, I think Ahmad is obviously a huge one. Um I'm trying to think of other ones and I think

Well I can say names are countries, but like there's been players who have done it with Poland, a couple. There have been players who have done it with like a Cameroon, um a a Nigeria. So like probably that level of team. I mean it's hard for me To remember Croatia have been to back-to-back World Cup semifinals. I know and a final and one. So they are a blue blood team, but that's a bit of an outlier. Like they don't have the

player pool of a blue blood like uh France, whatever. Yeah. But yes, what you are saying is true, which is there are few, if any, examples of a player in his profile. I mean, Cuccio can't even get back into Columbia. And he went to La Liga. He qualified for Champions League. And now his club resume currently is better than all the other guys who they won't let him jump because when he was in MLS, they said it wasn't a good enough league.

So that's one example. And then on the other side, Musa might start alongside Luka Madrich in a World Cup game. And um yeah, he he's been incredible. I I mean the big question will be if he stays. If a guy like that goes and performs the way he's capable of performing, I don't know that Dallas can say no to the potential numbers that come in. They bought him for around ten million. So like it has to be a real offer. It can't just be a like, oh, we never heard of this guy. Yeah, we'll grab him.

But anything twenty five or up, which you're the starting forward for Croatia, if you score goals, like we are talking about Hoffenheim and Leverkusen and Gladbach and Roma and Fu and you know Adelante, like that's where that guy normally plays. Um, that will be the huge question for Dallas and I've normally been frustrated as a neutral with the decisions Dallas makes in those moments, which is, Oh yeah, we'll take the money.

Because they they they don't normally double down and say, No, no, no, we're gonna win now and then we promise. Like we'll like part of their ethos is selling great. There is a way to do it to say, all right, let's do five months here, four months, let's win a trophy, then you're gone in January and we totally respect it. Dallas normally just takes the money.

Yeah, I don't know that I can remember a time when they you know, especially for a team that has had so few Cup. uh finals. I think they have they won US Open Cup in like nineteen Sixteen or seventeen? Well they've won the supporter shield. Oh you're right. Did they win? With with And um it's a Mascop, I guess, is what I'm thinking of. Yeah. But they've been to one in twenty ten.

Right. Uh but anyone else that you really think is that w sh either is gonna be moving within MLS or out of MLS based on or maybe not based on, but like the summer window, like who are some players that you think could be sort of in the shop? The young guys are the old like obvious ones to start with. Like a gozo is an obvious one. Uh whether he goes to the World Cup or not, his numbers and his profile, like

for a guy that size with that speed and that touch, like he can play anywhere. So guys like that I think are going to There there's now a clear path to big clubs that want to come in and grab these players. And for them, buying between five and ten million is getting in before it gets hot, right? That's the like Gaga Slonina, Caleb Wiley's, like all of these guys. So my assumption is the number RSL has

They probably will get that offer this summer, even if he doesn't make the World Cup, because that's the profile that he sits in and that's where guys like that are viewed. Julian Hall will be one of those as well. Um, there's no question that offers will come in for him. Uh one of the fascinating teams to watch is Wilfred Zaha's on loan. His loan ends this summer. I'd be surprised if he comes back, but also Charlotte's gone big game hunting. And Charlotte feels like one of the teams that

If they go to their owner with a guy who was a flashy World Cup player, that there is like a selling point there. I think there's like five to ten MLS teams that will probably try and buy someone out of this World Cup. Whether that's purely for that reason or if it's, well, they came here, they liked it here, we got a chance to meet their agent, now we can can we convince them to stay, or now that the World Cup's over, that players' ambitions at the national team level are shifted.

Can we get a shot to bring them in? So I think there are some obviously obvious clubs. And then the other one is Chicago. We think Robert Lewandowski's in talks with them. He would have to take a huge pay um gap from Saudi Arabia, where he is getting offers to go there. It is the biggest Polish community outside of Poland and he is a legend.

Um, Hugo Kuypers is one of the four or five best center forwards in this league. So either they have to fit together, and in that scenario, maybe Jonathan Bamba's available or has to be moved. If not, Kuypers might be on the move. Uh, and I think there are some smart MLS teams that are gonna be hunting for these in the summer. I think they're looking at other teams DPs first before they're going overseas to say, can we get a little bit of a known quantity?

and get someone in the door and sort of be a dumping grounds. I wouldn't be surprised if a St. Louis is one of those. I wouldn't be surprised if a Colorado is one of those. I think there's a couple of these teams that can read the tea leaves well enough to say our best deal might be inside of us. Do you think a Dian Jovich could be on the move? I would just think'cause He wasn't signed by the current GM. He's a D P, but he's also got some value.

I he you talk to him, he just he is such a unique human being. He loves scoring goals. It's like the only thing that is on in his life is scoring goals. So if he gets the chance to do it no matter how bad the team is, I think for him, he doesn't care. I think he very much like connects to the idea that s Kansas City believed in him. And if you're a front office,

The guy does the thing he does well. Even if let's say five years from now, David Lee has a plan for the way he wants his team to play and Jovalich doesn't fit into that. Congratulations. You're five years away from that. And I don't think giving away a guy who will finish any chance that a team can barely create would be one that would move. So I you know, I think there's like logic in that thought process of like what are the struggling teams

What are the assets that they can get rid of to start to recoup? Um, Mirto Azuni's probably on the move just because I don't know how Austin fits it all together. And if I'm Austin, I'd stick with Torres and I'd stick with Brandon Vasquez. And I just don't see an MLS team thinking that that's worth their investment or their money. Well, it's gonna be a fascinating summer, that's for sure. Uh, you know, we got one more week before that, but uh, you know, it'll be

It's going to be a season unlike any other. And then, of course, we'll have another season like any other unlike any other next year when they play 17, what is it, 17 games that they're playing? Yeah, the sprint season. Oh that's gonna be that's gonna be We're all secretly hoping we just do sprint seasons forever after this and it's a Legia and there's a Apertura cluster. Does make sense, doesn't it? I'm voting fine.

Yeah. Uh I mean there's a lot of fun ways that you could structure it, I think, and it would be super interesting. But

I'm not no one's asking me for my opinions, I guess. Uh although maybe I'll share'em. Uh all right. Well This as people as I kind of alluded to, this has been part of a uh a partnership that Soundert Heart is getting into with soccer wise and kickback soccer. And I wanted to give you guys a little bit more of a chance to talk about what's going on at Soccer Wise, what's going back at uh you you guys have what, forty eight?

Previews or forty eight features on every team in the World Cup on on um on kickback? Is that right? No, on Yeah, we have our first touch speed. Who's touch? First thoughts. We were close. We're gonna get there uh eventually. I know. I know. Uh yeah, our first touch feed. So we have we have a bio episode about the history of the soccer in the country, some fun facts.

sort of stories about cult legends or w the way the game was built, there are some interviews in there, um, with people, whether it's journalists or current players or former players Um, or just fans and people from those countries. We kind of have a a good mix of all of it. So we did one for all forty eight countries. So

If you are just trying to find some stuff, you know, we've got music from each of those countries in the backgrounds. We've got some goal calls, all that type of stuff. Um, search first touch. which is our World Cup feed. Uh we are currently doing two shows a week that we are adding to those, which are uh more timely. One is a new show as we head into the World Cup. The other one is more of these like evergreen stories that we're exploring.

Uh, this week is a story about what it feels like to to be left off a World Cup roster and and that experience. But We've done a number of stories there. Last week we did a deep dive into James Rodriguez and what he means to Colombia and the history of the national team um and all of that. Some others have been more specific on topic.

Um, we dug into some weird history moments that I wasn't aware of before. So it's been really fun. And then we will be doing a daily World Cup show. Uh once the World Cup starts on June tenth. Uh and that will be available on that feed, SoccerWise, all of our others. And it will be live every day, nine thirty AM Eastern time, uh, on our YouTube pages as well as streaming and a bunch of other places. So uh we're gonna have

A lot of the coverage here. We were talking before this started of like, you know, for the World Cup, obviously for us, we're gonna cover it from a global stage and the big moments and the big games and all of that. It's not MLS specific, but one of the things that will be fun is there are these guys who pop up and for us they're known entities and for everyone else it's gonna be like no one had ever heard of this guy and

You know, I was just getting ready, doing some notes and putting like Eloy room for Curaçao in a depth chart as the starting keeper of like he's gonna have a game and everyone's gonna be like who Whoever knew, and it's like, oh, let me give you the five-year history under your light room. Or Derek Etienne probably will score a huge goal for Haiti at some point in this tournament. And because of the 48 teams, there's a lot of those. So I'm super excited for those.

uh as terrible as a lot of this world cup feels, I'm starting to get a little bit of excitement of like there's gonna be super important fun games that we all watch together. I think that's what that's what a World Cup is about. And I I think At some point that part will come and we'll continue to talk about all the other stuff as well. Um, but that's the part that I think we're most looking forward to and it it feels like we're we've finally gotten a little bit closer on some of that.

Yeah, no, I would totally agree. Like I I think there's a lot of valid complaints and criticisms of the World Cup and FIFA heading into this whole into this whole phase. But the reality is that once the games are coming. Once the games are here and we're talking about it, I think it's gonna be, you know, it's gonna be soccer. It's gonna be it's gonna be the most interesting, the most fun uh soccer event. Uh

sporting event in the world. And and at some point that will take over. That doesn't diminish all this other stuff that's going on, but it it does sort of It's a reality. And you know, I think I'm looking forward to the I am still looking forward to the World Cup being in Seattle. It's maybe not quite what I thought it was gonna be, but we'll have some fun here. Uh as people may know, we're we're hosting a watch party.

for the US Australia game with Scuffed, which is a a US national team podcast. So people will be able to come out to that. And uh and we'll be doing stuff in the uh at at our new recording studio a ton. So hopefully we get to Yeah, get to get to meet some of y'all and uh thank you for for doing this, David. And we'll continue I assume we're we're gonna keep doing this. Uh Yep. Yeah.

We're gonna keep talking. Um, if anyone's looking for some US MNT coverage, we have that. We've got Matt Doyle on uh with us every week. We'll be doing game previews, game reviews. And uh yeah, we'll keep talking MLS and NWSL'cause it's obviously the core of I think for a lot of us how we became fans and it's our connection point. So that stuff never goes away.

All right. Well, David, thank you so much for doing this. Uh once again, that's soccer wise and kickback soccer and first touch. Are those are all the those are the ones, right? All right. We got we got it. We got it. All right. Uh with all that said, I'm Jeremiah Shan. Let's get out of here. Uh you're listening to No Sadietis on the Sounder Heart Podcast Network, and we will catch you next time. Let's go.