It's Nightside with Dan Ray on WBS Boston's news radio.
All right, welcome back everyone. It is April thirtieth, and we are about to leave a month in Boston that generally represents the beginning of the baseball season, and for twelve years now has represented the horrible, that horrible day back in twenty thirteen when the Boston Marathon was struck by the marathon bombers. And we've had a lot of conversation on Nightside this week about the concept of due
process and what it means. And it is a concept that is founded, you know, in the in the legal documents of this country, and certainly founded in the Constitution, but it is a process that sometimes defies definition depending
upon the circumstances. So, for example, we've been talking about a due process for the guy from Maryland who was flown out of the country with other members of MS thirteen and Toronte Duragua, and there's a big conversation about, well, how do we know he was a gang member and all of that, and you know, at some point, well, we can deal with that. But I thought that just by way of explaining how we in this country bend over backwards to provide due process for lots of people,
some of whom come here and become US citizens. And in this case, Boston bomber number two, who tonight hopefully sits in a jail cell by himself at the Supermax Federal Penitentiary in Colorado. And I I'd love it and have him a radio so he could listen to this show tonight. But I just the question that I have is, is here we have a Boston barmber number two, who I choose not to mention my name. I hope you can understand who I'm talking about, the younger of the
two bombers, the one that was not run over. Actually he was the run that ran over his brother the night of the shootout in Watertown. So these guys do their dastardly deed, their first dastardly deed. Maybe there were other dastardly deeds that we weren't able to prove, like the triple murder in Waltham, but we'll say that for
another night. The dastardly deed of April fifteenth, when they left two pressure cooker bombs about a block and a half or so apart on Boylston Street near the finished line of the Boston Marathon with the intention to kill and name as many people as possible. They killed in that moment three individuals, and of course we have come to know the name of Martin Richard and Crystal Cake Campbell and Lindsay lou who was only twenty three, Crystal
Campbell only twenty nine, and Martin Richard only eight. And then on Thursday night of that week they shot and killed MIT police officer, executed, let's be honest, MIT Police officer Sean Collier on the campus of MIT. And then in the shootout in Watertown, there was a Boston police officer who died about a year later. He was injured
in that shootout, Boston Police officer Dennis Simons. So in all, there were five deaths attributed to the Boston bombers who came here from Augistan, sought all the protections and the beneficence of this country, and then did what they did. There's no question they did what they did. We have the videotapes. We have them. We watched them walking away from the scene after they had planted and activated the bombs.
Boston bomber Number to played guilty. He didn't fight the evidence that was against him, the evidence was overwhelming, played guilty to what they had done. And of course they also maimed more than one hundred well injured, and some people named over one hundred and fifty people. Just as by way of mentioning, there's the Norton family. Liz Norton, who had two sons lost both their legs, both lost legs in the bombing. She was quoted on Wednesday in
the Boston Herald. It's mind bobble boggling. It's taken this long. My hope is I'm still alive to see it through. Okay, So what I did was I did a little bit of a timeline here and there is you're going to read about this tomorrow in the Boston Herald, a little bit of it's been in the Boston Globe. But I want to explain to you what do process can mean. It's a very elastic sized concept. Due process can be short and direct, or it can be just stretched out.
And oftentimes the more bizarre your crimes, the more lawyers and oftentimes pro bono lawyers are drawn to defend these these horrific people. So the bombing takes place on April fifteenth, twenty thirteen. That's now twelve years and two weeks ago. So you do the math on the number of days
that this guy has lived. But he has lived over If I'm doing some quick math, three hundred and sixty five days a year, twelve twelve years, we're talking about at least three thousand days, probably getting close to thirty five hundred. It's convicted, pleads guilty in twenty fifteen, so that's fairly quick, and he's sentenced to death. However, the First Circuit Court of Appeals, in their infinite wisdom some reason,
decided to overturn the death penalty. Now I haven't read the decision by the First Circle in a while, but they may have concluded any of a number of grounds cool and unusual punishment. Alough, it's really not that unusual. There was a period of time, even last late in the Biden administration, when that death penalty could have been lifted from his shoulders. But there were three bombers, three killers that Biden. Out of forty people on death row,
thirty seven got commutations from the death penalty. Three did not. Dylan Rufe, the racist kid that killed the nine older black parishioners in a South Carolina Church after having prayed with them, the anti Semite who attacked the synagogue Tree of Life Synagogue in Pittsburgh or outside of Pittsburgh, and the Boston bomber number two. So the Supreme Court two years later, now we're seven years out or we're actually nine years out from the bombing, they overruled it and
reinstated the death penalty. So then the lawyers, these are these lawyers who I guess we're paying for them. They're they're billing the government. These lawyers asked the First Circuit to re examine the wadir of the jurors, and specifically jurors number one, thirty eight, and eighty six. I mean, we're really drilling down here. And the First Circuit, who again had overturned the death penalty already, maybe they should
be recused from reviewing this. They ordered the trial judge, Georgie O'Toole, who's someone who I know a little bit. He's very competent trial judge. An amazing background on him. He had as his bachelor's degree from Boston College, went to Harvard Law School. He practiced for about ten years
from nineteen seventy two to nineteen eighty two. He became an associate justice in the Boston Municipal Court from eighty two to ninety and then in the Superior Court of Massachusetts from ninety to ninety five, and then in ninety five he was nominated by President Bill Clinton to the Federal Court, and he served in the Federal Court from nineteen ninety five until he assumed senior status in twenty eighteen. So this is a very competent, qualified, highly respected jurists.
By the way, I have no idea what his politics are or anything like that. He is a quintessentially a jurist. So the lawyers now for the bombers have gone one more step further. They have asked that Judge O'Toole be taken off the case because Judge o'tool needs to needs to recuse himself. Well, Judge O'Toole is not going to recuse himself from the case, nor should he. He will stay on this case, thankfully, because we do have an
adult in the house. When Judge O'Toole, and he has written recently, he's denied the Marathon bomber's allegation that another judge should re examine the judge o'tools procedure at sentencing Barmber number two to death, he wrote, He wrote this in that decision. He said, it is a parent that the Court of Appeals intended that this court investigate the potential bias of two jurors an issue. As I mentioned, those are jurors one thirty eight and two eighty six.
Everybody knew about the case. Okay. It was impossible, I think, to find jurors who didn't know about the case. I mean, I guess you could find twelve people out of an insane asylum who never heard about the case, maybe twelve people who lived under a bridge. But amongst people who would intellectually qualify to be able to sit in a jury, they all had known about this case. The instruction, according to Judge O'Toole, was plainly directed to this Dusk District judge,
meaning himself. Recusal would be at odds with the direction of the Court of Appeals. He also adds, quote, doubting my ability to follow my old to faithfully apply the law unquote is dead wrong. The reason I'm going through this tonight, and going through it at a pace that hopefully all of you can follow, is that this is all part kitten kaboodle, if you will, of what we
would call due process for Boston bomber number two. Now under the standard that I have recommended, when there is no scintilla of doubt about the guilt of an individual, and there is no scintilla of doubt in this case, as a matter of fact, this guy has pled guilty to the crime. And there's no suggestion that he was pleading guilty for because he was being pressured or anything
like that. He's guilty, he understands it. And are the aggravating circumstances, Yeah, A couple of pipe bombs, a pressure cook of bombs near a crowded marathon finished line the day of the Boston Marathon on Boylston Street, where there are hundreds or not thousands of people who could have been impacted by the explosions. Yeah, I think those are
aggravating circumstances. So the consequence is that as we fight and argue about the guy from Maryland, the Maryland dad who now is in El Salvador, I guess he's in a better prison than the sea caught prison. Good for him or someone else who is deported the Trump administration how much? How much due process. Do we need to give the Boston Marathon bomber. I think we need to give him one more bit of due process, and it should be applied in Terre Haute, Indiana, where he would
go to be executed. I want to open this line up because most of you out there understand in your in your gut, in your heart what should be done and how quickly it should be done. I certainly understand what should be done. And I know that there are people who were posted in aulterably opposed to death penalty. That's fine. Kind of argue with people who have a either a philosophical or religious opposition of that, that's fine.
But we have a death penalty in this country. It has been found by our Supreme Court to be to be constitutional. And it is now time for Boston bomber number two to get the Jews as far as I'm concerned, which he so richly deserves. We don't need to allow him to live a long and comfortable life in supermacs in my opinion. But the reason I mentioned this tonight is in the last few days, the whole concept of
due process is sort of an elastic process. What due process might mean for one person is a little bit different. There are some fundamentals of due process. Now, this guy actually was a citizen. He became a citizen. I think it was just about seven months before he did this dastardly act. He knew what he got himself into. Okay, we're told, well, he was the younger brother and he was influenced. All of that has been out there. We're done with this. Let's get it over with. I'd love
to hear from you. This is my little bit of a treatise, a due process. Okay. I believe in due process, I truly do. But due process is different for an American citizen who is charged with a crime for which that you enjoy the presumption of innocence than this guy who has surrendered his presumption of innocence. At this point, it is time to put to get the show on the road. Six one, seven, two, five, four to ten thirty six one seven, nine, three one ten thirty. Feel
free to join the conversation. I'll be right back.
It's Night Side with Dan Ray on w B Boston's news radio.
So my question essentially is how much due process does the Boston bomber deserve and has he has he has he exhausted his his his good, his good, his due process? Pretty simple question. I think it was exhausted a long time ago. Six one, seven, two, five, four to ten thirty six one seven, nine three one ten thirty. Gonna go to Larry in Boston. Larry, welcome your first this hour night side. Larry, go right ahead.
Thanks Dan, thanks for taking my call. I agree with you wholeheartedly. I think I think this this individual, let's give him the benefit of that at least, has has lived thirty five hundred days too too long. Given the rough math, I think, you know, the the you know, the abhorrent situation that he and his brother caused, and the and the you know, irreparable harm that he's done to the city of Boston, and the plague that he's
kind of placed upon us. One more bullet by the Watertown police would have solved that problem, right yeah, And and I and I think you know, he's he's lived too long, and he's not due any due process, so, you know, and I think due process is something that you know, we as citizens deserve if if there are situations and situations that require that due process to be invoked. However, not something you know, again, you come here illegally and
not here as a legal citizen. Due process unfortunately does not apply, right, And I know your question is specifically about this individual on I don't think he's deserved any and I think I agree with you. I think he's he's he's kind of taken up residents in a federal institution far longer than he deserves.
Yeah, that's you know, that's my feeling on it.
That's my point, and that that we as a society, Okay, we're very generous. And the more publicity that a case gets, Uh, there are plenty of you know, young poor Americans, young people, teenagers who do something stupid, rob a bank or whatever,
and they get moved through the process pretty quickly. But on the high profile cases, if you have enough money to purchase lawyers, or if you have enough money because of the the case, you can attract lawyers who will be willing to offer their services for the publicity that you get.
In the background, this guy could live another four or five years here, I mean, you know, he What will happen is that Georgia O'Toole is not going to refuse himself. They're going to probably appeal that back up to the first Circuit Court of Appeals. It's like a yo yo
going up and down. His due process is endless, endless. Uh. And you think about what what the people who lost loved ones, or the people whose loved ones were badly injured, or the individuals who were badly injured, what is their due process?
You know?
I mean, same way with this guy down in down down in Maryland. Whiz whiz, where's the due process?
Uh?
For him? He's they want to bring him back now. He apparently, you know, was told to leave the country, didn't leave the country. It's uh, it's almost the more bizarre your crime, the more due process that you're allowed. And I think President Trump said it yesterday talking with the guy from ABC for ABC Terry Terry what the heck was his last name? The reporter who I have, Terry Moran. He's basically saying to him, hey, uh, let's you know, let's you know, let's let's get this over with.
There's no question of this guy's guilt or innocence. We we know that they are aggravating circumstances because there was one or two yours who might have been a little less than forthcoming. I think it's it's a complete waste of time, and it it gives me something to talk about, but it also it shows how the system can be In my opinion, a great system of justice can be abused. I'm gonna let you go. I appreciate your calling and getting us going.
Okay, Thanks Dan, Thank you much.
I'd love to hear from you. Six one, six, one tenth. The whole concept of due process difficult to explain, but when you look at it in the context of what we're talking about, Boston bomber number two, how long does it go on? You've You've seen that there are killers. I'm not familiar with all of their cases, but some of these very bizarre killers are on death row for twenty years. And I know that there are good people out there who are posted the death betal. We may
hear from one in a few moments. I'd love to hear from you. Six one, seven, two, five, four ten thirty six one seven, nine, three, one ten thirty Coming right back after the news break here at the bottom of the hour on Nightside.
Night Side with Dan Ray. I'm WBZ Boston's news Radio.
All right, let's get right back to the phones. You're going to be talking with Harvey Silverglad in just a moment. But Jean's been waiting a little longer. So I want to get to Gene. Jeane. You are next up on Nightside Gene from Brookline.
Welcome, Hi, how are you?
I'm doing just great, Gene. We're talkingalking about due process.
It is, Uh, he had a not due process. He should have been executed within a year of getting found guilty. I give a year versus he's young. He could be on death row for sixty years, working in his twenties or something.
It's only thirty one right now. He's already been there for twelve for twelve years. Yeah, well he's been there. He's been there a long time.
He's Yeah, I think he should not be there any longer.
I mean, where was where.
Were the rights of people that just want to go watch a marathon not get killed or made you think about them? So how can we think about him?
I understand, I understand, but uh, it's it's a real it's a problem. It's a problem, and it is a problem. It's a it's it's it's a problem that people understand due process. But uh, it's it's it's sort of a it's a concept that is uh, it's it's it's a
concept that is somewhat flexible. It's it's not specifically laid out that due processes A, B, C, and D. There there are a number of ways in which due process has been incorporated on a on a case by case basis into the rights that all Americans and everyone in this country to some degree is provided. Absolutely well, Gene, I appreciate your your.
Supporting oh, because I believe what you're saying with the tail and that's the right way to pronounce it, doubt without with the world until Yeah.
Again, that's a standard that I have created, which is without a sintela means that there is no doubt. Okay, that's it means like the smallest possible pardon. Okay, you know. The whole The word due process comes from the fourteenth Amendment. It says no States shall make or enforce any law which shall abridge the privileges or immunities of citizens of the United States. So, nor shall state deprived of any person of life, liberty, or property without due process of law.
That's that's what we're what we're referring to. But it's not defined with any specificity. It's become defined over years, depending upon you know, various you know, various court decisions, nor deny any person within his jurisdiction the equal protection of the law fourteenth Amendment. Thank you so much, very much, Gene. I thank you for taking the time to call, and thank you for agreeing with me.
Okay, okay, always.
Probably going to disagree with me.
Thanks.
Yea.
This is my friend, Harvey Silverglade. Harvey is a pre eminent defense attorney. UH, one of the best, if not the best, that I've ever watched in court. Harvey, welcome to Night's side. You've heard me talk about due process. It has been applied and applied very very well. Uh to the benefit of Boston bomber number two.
Uh.
At what point do we say, Okay, this guy's had enough due process. He has had due process.
Let me the last time I dealt with this on your program, I pointed out that institutionally I was opposed to the death penalty because of the possibility that the line would be of what is certain would be moved and moved and moved, and eventually an innocent person would be executed, with which the innocent spasure has shown has happened, and my.
And my my audience respects and I respect your philosophical concern absolutely.
Now, now let me take another approach. You're an orthodox Catholic.
I'm a Colby that I'm a Catholic.
I'm you're you're you're believing Catholic.
Yeah, I'm a strugg like everyone else who's a Catholic, they will tell you they're they're an imperfect, struggling Catholic.
If you know what I'm saying, Hey, I I do. I do. I have the same problem with Well, okay, go ahead. My question is this, how do you square your support for the death penalty with the Ten Commandments?
Well, I I do see a little bit of separation, separation of church, church and state. Let me just finish, let me sorry, go ahead.
The Tank Commandment says say murder it is our start kill, which is different than murder you kill. Yeah, okay, now let's let's go just by your opposition.
Well, what I'm what I would be, what I would argue is that the state is not murdering him. He is, you know, he's living just as if in a state of war. If someone goes to war and happens to kill an enemy combatant, they haven't murdered them. They generally, you know, they get they get a medal for having taken out one of the enemy. I think that a society has a right to defend itself, and I do believe that the death penalty does have a deterrent effect
and it will make some people think about it. And I feel that, you know, it is up it is up to God Almighty whether and I think the same God runs Judaism, Catholicism, Islam and all of that. There's not multiple gods up there. There's one person. In my belief. I can't prove any of that, Howie that it's that it's up to him and I but I think that we as a society have a right to defend ourselves. Uh. And you know what do you do? I'm with with someone. Let us say who is on who kills? Uh? And
you don't give him or her the death penalty? And then they kill a corrections officer? You know how many how many people would they would they kill? I mean, I have no problem morally or or religiously with doing away with this guy based upon what he did. And I know that there, by the way, are members of the families of the victims who are opposed to the death penalty. I don't think that the Richard family is advocating for his death penalty. They're probably just better, better people than I am.
Well, I don't think it's got to do. It's better people, but I do think that well, I guess in the end, you and I just disagree, and there's no way of reconciling our precisions. But I well, let me ask you that, let me ask you us.
I know that you're If there ever was a case that my friend Harvey Silverglate, the great defense lawyer, could see them, could see as a possibility, this would be it. My feeling is that from a moral point of view, I have no doubt about his guilt or innocence. He's fled out, and he needed right, right, right, and and we certainly have the aggravating circumstances that no sentilla of doubt,
So it fits my my standard. I also believe that the amount of money that we're gonna utilize to feed and house him and give him a lot of the comforts that he will have for the balance of his life could be better used to help people in this country who have anyone.
I wouldn't call being in a supermax prison comfortable.
Well, you know, I mean, here's the thing, Harvey, You and I know that he can. He can meet religious whatever religious leaders he wants. He can be visited by family and friends. He can as time goes on, he will get some of the privileges of time. I'm sure that he gets to watch some level of television. They don't put him in a cell twenty four you know, three sixty five twenty four seven, because that would be
violation of the Eighth Amendment cruel and unusual punishment. And if he behaves himself, if he behaves himself over time, he will he will be treated better.
It will never get out though.
They would never get out, there's no question never get out. And the only the only UH person who faced the death penalty who told his lawyers to drop all appeals that I know of, and you probably know more than I do, was Timothy McVeigh. You know everyone has said to me, oh, the death penalty is the easy way out. I don't think it's the easy way out in the
minds of most killers. Harvey's from a you know, from a from an argumentative point of view, most people who are facing the death penalty fight it till the end legally, in everything that's available to them. None of them say, oh, you know, I want the easy way out. They say, no, I'm going to fight this to the end. And yet my friends will always tell me, oh, it's it's the
death penalty is the easy way out. I don't know too many mass killers, and in this case, this guy would be a mass killer who sees the death penalty as an easy way out. How let me ask you this. You know the system as well as anybody. He's been on death row now since twenty fifteen, convicted in twenty fifteen. How long How much longer do you think he will be able to come up with his lawyers will come
up with appellet ideas that will string it out. How many more years do you think he'll have before he will face that moment in time, assuming the death penalty is not eliminated in our country.
Well, I think I think this is the end of the road. But of course creative lawyer can usually flame something. But I think this is the end of the road.
Yeah, I mean O'Toole has refused to recuse himself. I have premendous respect for Georgie O'Toole. I think I know you well enough to know that you respect O'Toole as well. He's a good judge and uh and not you know, not that that most judges aren't good judges, but he is, in my opinion, a particularly experienced judge. I don't know how much, how much time you've been in how often you've been in front of him, but he's got a
great reputation. Uh. And I assume that they're going to take his his his refusal to accuse himself up and appeal that. So there's another set of appeals.
Right, They'll they'll lose that.
Yeah, but it will take Tod. It will take Tod, Harvey. I so respect your your intellect and your your moral compass. And I wish I could agree with you on this one, but I don't. And I really appreciate you. You challenge me on this every time, and it makes me think. And I really do appreciate your friendship and your challenge here. Thank you much, my friend. Right, Oh, by Howie Silverglate, there there there's no if I haven't had a serious criminal case, a criminal charge, Harvey would be my gut
to go do. I would advise any of you in similar fashion. We got to take a break. I got salin Ohio coming up. I got Mark and Cambridge. I got a little bit of room for you. Six months seven two four thirty, six months, seven nine thirty. Be right back here on night's side. And by the way, tomorrow night, the BSY car guys will be with us from ten until twelve. I know that's a favorite guest of many of you. It's time the spring driving season come on, and the Bzy Car guys are going to
be here tomorrow night from ten to twelve. And we will also have former state Representative Dave Nagel, who spent time in federal prison. He ran into a problem with gambling, gambling debts and then did some things which for which he admitted used money that he should not have used campaign money, not public money, but campaign money. And he spent seven months in prison. It was sentenced to a
year and a half. And we're going to talk to him tomorrow night about life and is it and what he regrets, uh, and now how he will be able and I think he will be able to build his life back up. So it's a uh, it's a story of reclamation tomorrow night, as as well as your crime and punishment as well. We'll be back right after this on Nightside.
You're on Night Side with Dan Ray on Boston's news radio.
Okay, back to the phones. We're going to get both the sale in market. Let's start off with Sal in Ohio. Sal. You were next on Nightside.
Welcome, Hi Dan, nice talking to you. Can you hear me?
Okay, I can hear you, find sir, go right ahead, okay, all right.
As far as due process, you know, I followed, I followed, I followed the bombing and such. But how does the families heal if if this keeps coming up, if there is anything about healing after you lose someone like at least someone does something tragic like that, But how do people get on with get on with their lives if to me? For me, I've tried to follow his sister Helen Praijan movement. I don't believe that. I think we should just have have a cut and dry your lifer.
You've been sound guilty, and don't tie up the legal system and all the everybody. You know, somebody's gonna some attorneys some days are going to make a book or something about what they how they defended somebody.
Again, Yeah, I just understand that.
By the way, I understand, I know, I know who Helen Prejean is. I understand that, and I respect her opinion. I don't agree with it. I just think that in my opinion, sal and it's only my opinion that there are certain levels of crime. And if someone you know.
Breaks into a store masterardly.
No, no, no, Yeah. What I'm saying is if someone breaks into a store and they've done it repeatedly, or they get caught stealing something out of a store, that's one level of crime. If someone goes in the street and they have a gun and they threaten someone, well that that raises the stakes a little bit. And but in terms of what these guys did, I think everyone and you use the word dastardly, I agree with you. I mean, there's just no way to defend it. I mean, it's as simple. It is as simple.
As I don't think that you know, you know, as as as if we want to be true Christians, we're supposed to forgive everything. We're supposed to not we're not supposed to keep punishing. Really, Jesus probably wouldn't have prisons.
Well, I don't know about that. Well, say, here's a different thing. If here, if you're my neighbor and all of a sudden you come over and you steal something out of my house, uh, and I see you stealing it and running away, and I will go over to you and I will say, look, you stole that. I want it back. And if you give it to me back, I might say, look, don't do that again. So, but society has an interest above and beyond my forgiving heart to prosecute you for doing something.
You know, I understand that, And I mean, look at the volumes and volumes of law that there is. But I understand that. But I think I really think that we need to look at other countries. I don't think great Great Britain has I don't think that they have death penalty.
I think you're right. I think you're right. And again we're a different country where the United States of America we're.
We have three hundred and fifty million people too.
But yeah, I mean again, look, here's the thing. If if you do, if you truly in your heart believe that this guy should not get the death penalty, I understand that Okay, I respect you. I don't agree with you, but I respect you.
I'm on the bench. I'm kind of on the fence because if some if something happened directly into my family, you know, with something I probably I might be inclined to change my opinion.
I don't know.
I don't know.
I don't know what I'm.
Saying is morally your opinion should be if you're based it on a true moral foundation, it should be the same whether it's your family or your neighbor's family. Well, anyway, hey, Sal, I got one more I got to get in here. Really interesting phone call. I don't know how often. I don't know if you've called before, but i'd invite you to continue to call my program Always welcome.
One other time, and we disagreed on Donald Trump a long time ago, It's like twenty fifteen.
But I listened to you, and people are listening to you. All right.
You have a good night.
Thanks Sale. Where about to Ohio you call it from? I love to know what.
How many people from Ohio?
Pittsburgh I've heard of?
Stupid Ville? Yeah, absolutely great, Sam, Thanks thanks much. Sal. Let me go next to Mark and Cambridge. Mark, you're gonna wrap the hour for us here nightside. What's your thought on due process for the Boston boment number two?
My call again, You're welcome. The Celtics one anyway.
The one last night, that one last night.
Yep, yeah, anyway, let's get so. Anyway, in my opinion, due process and justice should have been served that day when they call him on that boat and he was in that boat. Due profice and justice should i've been served that day.
No, I understand your opinion. I disagree with that because that's not what this society is about, and I think that's a yeah, we could disagree and that. So therefore, I assume you agree with me that it is time as long since passed for this guy to be breathing, you know, the fresh air that all of us are breathing or whatever there is being pumped into the Supermax in Colorado.
But to make it to the bop it up real quick. Due process, in my opinion again, should only be for naturally born American citizens. If you here on is here visiting, and you commit a crime, due process should not apply. Again, that's my opinion.
Yeah, well, the courts have held otherwise. The courts have held otherwise. However, However, the thing that to me is most interesting in my opinion, is that there is no clear definition of due process that says to get full due process, you've got to go through steps one through ten. So you can have a different level of due process for different circumstances. Okay, this guy is getting much more due process than he deserves because of the crime that
he committed. In terms off, you're a US citizen, you have full due process rights. If you're someone who here is here illegally and it was committed a crime while you while you're here, you get what I would call expedited due process. If you get my drift, okay, a different form. It's like you go to a restaurant. You can order the whole meal. You can order the everything from soup to nuts, or you get a sandwich. You still had a meal, it was just a little different. Hey, look,
I always appreciate you call Mark. You and I pretty much here on the same page. Thanks, buddy, You have a great night. We get back right after the not the ten o'clock news. Here on nightside. I want to
talk about the Trump administration's decision to arrest judges. We have a case here, which is one that you might be familiar with, but there's a case down in Wisconsin, in New Mexico where judges are facing some very serious federal charges, and I suspect we'll get some good different points of view on this in the next hour back on night Side right after this