Homeless Encampments: Should They Be Banned? Part 2

It's night time with Dan Ray.

I'm telling you easy Boston cit Radio.

All right, we're talking about a problem in Brockton, Massachusetts. It is not necessarily just Brockton, Massachusetts. As a matter of fact, it's any major city in America, and that is the homeless problem in Brockton. It evidences itself with

Go ahead, Scott, Well, sadly, it's a sign of the times and something that needs to be done in my opinion. If I remember, there are chapters of mass law that actually use the terms bums, tramps, and vagrants to describe persons who live on the streets without means.

And well, I'm sure that's probably politically correct at this point, but you're probably factually correct.

Yes, indeed, And you know many of your callers have made the point that it's a large problem, and you know there's there's nothing else to be done. Really, the the administration and law enforcement has to put their foot down, because there are people who who make a choice to be out there living on the streets, addicted to alcohol and other substances and living that lifestyle.

They do.

They make an intellectual choice or their lifestyle forces that choice upon them. Either way, it's it can't be tolerated. It has to be addressed. Uh, and we have cats problems in this country right now, and that this is one that needs to be addressed.

I mean, can't we get back to having obs houses or poor farms places in the state where all these people can be collected and say all right, here you go, this is this is your home. Now you're you're going to grow crops. If you're going to you're going to live here until you get your life back together.

I don't know that you're able to force people to work if they haven't committed a crime. If you've committed a crime and you're incarcerated, yeah, you can work in the light, producing license plates and all of that. These people are not probably committing crimes per se. And then the other question is you put them all on a farm if they're addicted. How's that going to solve the problem?

Well, they would have to just work through their addiction without So isn't vagrancy a crime or has that been eliminated from the books by.

Well, a lot of those crimes were eliminated because they were considered to be a vague, vague and capricious, capricious of the terms that are used. Okay, I think this is more specific, and I think it will pass muster under the decision the Court handed down Grant's Pass Oregon decision from last June, the end of last term, and that is that these people are engaging in activities which

I agree, local problems need local solutions.

I'm with you totally. Scott has always appreciate your call, appreciate your support of my program. Thank you very much.

Good night, Dan, good job, Thank you very much.

Appreciate it. All right, take quick break here it is about fourteen minutes after. Don't want to short change anyone six one seven thirty six one, seven, nine, three, ten thirty. This is a good conversation. If you disagree with me, feel free to bring it on. I just think that we have reached a point. We're almost at a point of no return because I'm I feel exasperated. I've been doing this show. Now, we're into our eighteenth year. We've

Now back to Dan Ray live from the Window World Night Sight Studios on WBZ News Radio.

Okay, I have callers who have waited a long time here, and we're gonna go in order. Victor's next, followed by Sherry, and then we got Coptic, Thomas and Quincy. We'll get them all in and we're gonna move the train a little bit more quickly, starting with Victor in Boston. Victor, I want to hear what you have to say. Go right ahead, Victor.

Hey, Dan, how you doing.

That's a good topic.

I'll start by saying, I, like some of the previous callers, I've been homeless twice, actually three times. It's not a good thing. I don't know not a drug user, but I do know that people who are and have been drug users. Unfortunately, most of them are not here now. They died by way of drugs or something, violence or whatever. Now, yeah, but it's not good.

But basically victory. It's not a great career path, is what you're telling.

Me, you know. And and another thing, I don't know why there are some people think that people who have been on drugs aren't educated or ignorant. I've known some very intelligent people who've gone that route. Okay, I think they had other issues. But the fact of the matter is that myself, I had to be proactive. I've had a job most of my life in some form. I just said I wasn't gonna keep on that path as

I think that if you're now living in a homeless encampment in Brockton, you have hit you've hit rock bottom, and well you've got to make a decision at that point. Not you, but I mean that person has to make a decision. Am I gonna take whatever help is being offered? Or am I going to just give up?

People will give up most people a drug addict, you know, if they're really far gone, it's gonna you know, take a miracle for them to change their life, because you know it's not I mean, drugs is it's a it's a it's a very very bad evil, as most people know grown ups. But the people who are doing the drugs don't care what happens. They don't care about going to jail and camping out. That's nothing to them. Only if they really really want to get help, that's the only way.

I don't think.

You know that the city can do what it can do, but it's not going to deter a whole lot. It's up to the person, period.

Absolutely, I understand that. But sometimes sometimes you need to get a wake up call. I don't know what your wake up call was, Victor. Maybe you had it internally in you.

I did since I was a teenager and I was used to that. Yeah, it's it's not an easy thing. I understand that. But like I said, I've known people on drugs. These people had been high intellects okay, smarter than I was in some ways, but the drugs.

It's the drugs, period.

So you know I mean, and that's what I'm I'm getting at it. It's the person you gotta if the person had to do it, Dan, Seriously, if the person doesn't want to do it, think of all the influences out there. Their friends ain't gonna leave them alone. They're gonna make up their mind to say that's it. I'm gonna get help. I'm gonna do this no matter what it takes. Period.

I'm with you. You've said it well and from your experience, you have a perspective that no one can argue with. Appreciate you call, Victor. Thank you so much for listening to the show, your your comments. Depending upon who heard you tonight, you may have turned someone's life around tonight by this phone call, whether you realize it or.

Not, I hope so that's as well.

Appreciate your call. Have a great night. Who's we gonna who we're gonna go next to? Oh? I know we're Gonna. Sherry is in Boston. Sherry, I appreciate your patience. You've been kind and held on. You are next on nightside, Sherry, go right ahead.

Thank you so much. So obviously I don't have the answers. I'm a registered nurse many years. I travel through Boston.

Thank you, thank you for what you do. By the way, Sherry, thank you.

Thank you so much. So I travel through uh Mass and casts. That's the methodon Mile Boston Medical Center. Mayo Wool was trying to shift people from the Produce Center to uh Mass and cass and Melanie Melanie Bulevarie. I believe it's.

Called Trina call.

Yeah. So every day I go through there and I think about, like, how is this going to get better? Like what can we do for these people. They're obviously addicted to opiates and they come there to get their methadone, but they're using and abusing of the drugs. They she breaks down the encampments, she takes away their kents and their livelihoods, but they go to the neighborhoods. They steal

Yeah, sure, yeah, I'm sure the problem is the same and the causes are the same, and the solutions that would be the same. I think somehow, some way there has to be in many cases, almost a miracle that occurs and someone realizes, hey, my life is worth more than what I'm doing to myself.

That's no no, because you know what, Unfortunately, they're so high, they're so stoned, they're so out of their minds that they can't think clear.

Okay, so what do you think that? What do you think the solution is? You know more about it probably than I do. What do you think is the solution if there is one?

So my opinion and my thoughts registered nurse, is that maybe we can create safe injection sites like Europe has in the mass and cast area. There's like prisons that are vacated, and maybe we can like put all the homble system in that area in those vacated prisons and keep them open, but have a curfew they can have

Me ask you a question, Sherry, what do you think it would cost the government to do that for each of the addicts? What how how much money do you think you'd have to spend all.

I really have no idea, that's all I know. All I know is when I drive through this area.

Oh no, you have a good heart. You have a good heart. Here's my question. Money does not grow on trees and the government to do that, it would call and first of all, I don't know if it would succeed number one, Okay, to be honest with you, but let's assume it did. You then are going to have to take money out of other government programs. Where do you take the money out? If you take it out of schools, do you take it out of programs for for elderly people? Where does the money come from? I mean,

Down.

Yeah, no, it's a problem. It's a problem, and we've spent a lot of money. They had a place down there was called the Round Hotel. Are you're familiar with the place down Yeah?

I am, And they started to let drug outs and it now pulls down. That was a really poor mistake, I.

Guess it was. But but a lot of the people who would be. It was what I think it was called. They called it a low threshold location, which meant people could go outside, shoot up outside, and then come back inside. And it was.

They had macuss up against the walls, they were having sex, and they were selling themselves. It's disgusting. It's the calls of drugs and it's just.

Let's see, let's see if if many people out there support your idea. It's a very generous idea that you.

Have, that you were safe injection sites. We need a place to put them up Long Island will the the bridge was blown up. They're trying to get Quincy to bring that bridge back.

You know.

It's but obviously there's a lot of opposition because they don't want the drug addicts either.

I can't of imagine why. I kind of imagine why the people I kind of imagine why the people in Quincy.

I conversation. I'm at me and throwing things in front of my car to.

Try to count.

I know, I don't I don't have the answer.

But yeah, right Sherry, I think You've made a lot of great points, but unfortunately I'm trying to have a conversation with you, and right now I'm a little frustrated, and I got the news coming at me. So let's see what people have to think to have to say they maybe there's more people out there who agree with you, and they'll call in and agree with you. Thank you, Sherry, appreciate your call. Have a great night. Here comes the news back on Nightside. Right after this.

Night Side with Dan Ray, I'm w BSY, Boston's news radio.

Here we go. Let's go next to gonna again to is coptic coptic? You were next to nights. I appreciate your patience. Go right head coptic.

Hey Dan, how are you doing?

Talk you?

Yeah, that's not my fault. Coptic at six one, seven, two, five thirty right a headpal.

Yeah, I really uh agree one hundred percent with the previous caller. That just some nurse. That's why I was gonna say my opinion about that. The uh and instead of the home homeless in Boston or Barkton or anywhere, it's gonna be with no control. We cannot control them because they are everywhere. I was suggest as like to have a fenced camp, Like there's a fence surrounding this camp and all of them is gonna stay there with all facilities like shower, like place like the medical support

You know, like is.

Gonna be like very very very bad idea.

So how are you gonna how are you gonna get control of them? And they live in a free society? Uh, in order to put them somewhere in a place where they're fenced in. You're gonna have to charge them or convict them of some crime. You can't deprive people of their liberty just because of their status as a drug addict.

That's what I'm saying.

You know, we're gonna keep them in a in a big place like affinsic camp or something like that, very much, But.

Can think you missed my question. What if they don't want to go into the big place in the camp, how do you force them in there?

I understand. But at the same time, if they refuse to pay whatever the fee which you said, like two hundred bucks of all of the stuff, and then you're gonna put them into jail, I believe this is not a good idea to you know, to keep them in the jail or to keep them in all of this stuff. Again, I understand your question very well. How are you gonna force them? Uh these people who has like no control

Got it, I got you, I got your point. I still think that in order to deprive them of their liberty, you're gonna have to convict them of a crime. And I think, again, this is this is a difficult thing. We live in a free society where people can become drunks if they want, and we've supported them in our society. But you know, we look at it. We look at it as a disease. We look at we don't look at as something that these folks had done to themselves. We look at it as a condition that they have

Legally, I have another thing, just less the thing that you want to mention. You know, we are dealing with this problem because it already exists. But we can work and something to stop doing to stop happening in the future. Like, for example, we have to teach our kids in the school that you guys, this is the results when you go in the way of the drugs and all of this stuff. You guys, you need to be smart.

We tried to do that. Remember all the programs in the schools just say no. That was an abysmal failure. They had all the police officers that come in and talk to the kids and remember the ads this is your drug that they'd take an egg and crack it and put it on the sidewalk and this is your your brain on drugs.

And sometimes when you like lit them, make a trip to the jails or the prisons. Tell them this is going to be your end. If you did something wrong.

They call that scared That program they've done, they called it scared straight. And there are a lot of people who are upset about that. You have great ideas, Coptic. Some of them are different, some of them are new. Let's see what people say if they if they like your ideas. Okay, thank you Coptic as always appreciate your call. Have a great one. Okay, let me go next to moving people a little bit more quickly. Johns and Braintreet John, you're next time, niceaga right hand?

Hey, Hey Dan, how are your captain handsite? How are you doing that?

Captain hindsight?

How are you fantastic? Time to report again? Hey, just a quick note, this is a real difficult thing all over the country. All that, and I wonder if there's a way we could start using the you know, everybody's looking for a space, looking for a space way to do it. I'm wondering if we could consider using the campgrounds that we have, like mile standards and any other parks that aren't you know, necessarily I don't know that they're obviously not being used during the winter anyway, but

Probably in most cases a combination of both, you know, right, I mean I would think, yeah, to be honest with.

You, but I know it's a free country. But do they have a right to do what they're doing in San Francisco to Brockton, to Boston to all these places?

And well, what happens is you have you have the groupsite the A c l U who say, look that the definition of a crime of being a vagrant, that's arbitrary and capricious, and it's it's vague, arbitrary and capricious, it's unconstitutional. I mean, that's what has happened.

Oh I didn't realize that.

Well, yeah, oh no, that's what they do to enforce that law. Now, I do think that you can. You can probably go in your direction, and I think that society will over time come to understand that something needs to be done. I mean, we just saw it in the election. You know, we had been going along in one direction for for many years, and the country just voted for substantial change. And I think if you look at Trump's cabinet appointments, we're going to get substantial change, for better or worse.

Yeah, but you know, it was an experiment that you know, and I jokingly say this, but who said democracy was going to be around forever? You know? I mean, who's arrogant enough to I mean, I love it. Don't get me wrong. I'm not taking aside yet, but I want to be the devil's advocate and say, you know, who says democracy is supposed to last forever? Okay? Maybe I hope.

I mean, we we have That's my but I'm trying to We have we have a we have a brilliant form of government. We have balance of power, we have you know, three branches, and there's checks and balances. And if if the new president or the president in the second term does something that that is challengeable, it'll get challenged. I hope that the Democrats give him a chance, and I and I also hope that they give the city

I don't know, but that's just rolling the kicking the can down. And you know, I want to make mention one or anything about somebody told me, I don't know this is true, but they had visited India and they said India doesn't have any security over there. If you're handicapped, if you're a drug you still got to work to pay your way to get your food.

You know.

And I'm like, wow, really, you know.

That is also that is also a country with an incredible population. Their population is only second in China. I don't think they're concerned about people dying in the streets over there, to be really exactly. I think that particularly now in the upper middle, they have a you know, INDI India comes out of a situation where they had a caste system where if you were born poor, you could never get out of that system. We have a system which is part of our democracy, where you can

I've admit we've been very fortunate. I've had enough of mental and physical health to be a little work like a dog on my life and get ahead.

You got it. You've got a Captain Hindsight always great. Good to see you, talk to you. Come back soon. Okay, thanks John, we'll take it. We'll take a quick break. Here. I got who's up next?

Out?

We got Linda, I got Gene, I got Tom, I got Mike. We got room for you at six one, seven, two thirty.

Now back to Dan Ray Mine from the window World night Side Studios on de Wite b Z News Radio.

All right, let's keep rolling here, going to go to Linda in Weymouth. Linda, you are in Weymouth, not far from Brock to go ahead, Linda.

Yes, are you saying brockdon b R Because I have a hearing thing and I'm hearing Rockland sometimes.

No, we're talking about brought.

The Home of Champions exactly.

Okay. I've been involved in years passed down at Puck's Pine straight in in Boston and also by the Bills, so I kind of get a feel for the clientele that you're speaking of. I understand fully. You know you're putting a fine on them and so forth. But along with that fine, the gentlemen to callers before had some good ideas, and I want a duct tail on some of them. Put them, you know, they talked them about

Okay, that's a thought. No one has mentioned that before. I like that idea.

I mean, where they're going to go though. But you know, like the people that i've that are down there at some of the facilities there, as you say, they have restrictions on drug usage, et cetera, and so you get a different clientele than the people that are on mass cast.

All right, well that's some good suggestions, Linda, thank you, thanks for calling.

That's basically what I'm going to saying. I don't need to expound on it.

So you did a good job.

Welcome night, good night.

Let me go next to Thomas and Quincy Thomas next on nightside, go right ahead.

Oh, mister Danry, how are you, sir?

I'm doing fine. Mister Thomas, how are you?

Oh, I'm fantastic. Okay, I'm gonna this is a conundrum that in my lifetime they probably will be thought upon, but not in the ways that will be acted upon. So many thoughtful callers coming in. Right, But here's my dream. We have these multi multi billionaires basils mosque in them.

Right, they have these massive.

Campuses, you know, Silicon Valley. What if they invest in the human species, right with a massive campus? Right, were taking everybody off the street, right, drug addicted or not, homeless or not.

They're come inside know said, well that could be a cult or this and you sign the wail.

Now we retrain you based on blah blah blah, this and that blah blah blah. This is feasible ultimately because you can't use they use feasible by town. Bring it, Dan Ray question, May I finish my point?

Yes, I had a question for you. If I had a question, yes for you my question absolutely, sir. On these campuses that you envision, can they still use their drugs?

Absolutely not, absolutely not.

That could be a problem. I agree with you, But that could be a problem when.

When when when you're intake, we go to an extensive detoxication process, which happens you know regularly in the state run facilities. But anyways, the conundrum is this, uh, fifty to sixty homeless in the city of Brockton. That that that is like, uh, you know who come over that number?

Double that?

Trible that and then and.

Then and then couldn't double that again and again it's over one thousand people that I know.

That conversation, don't you think? Absolutely explain that number to you. The fifty to sixty the number that was quoted to me. And I didn't do a survey. But the number that was quoted to me was these were the people who were chronically sleeping outdoors, setting up tens in public areas. There's more homeless people than fifty or sixty in a city like Brocklyn, because Brockden has one hundred thousand people.

That's absolutely unacceptable. And here's where I got vexed when they said there was a new.

Priest at the church. You have to print people that you know choose to evacuate themselves around the church, because a church has no twenty.

Four us to those people. You know something, there's a reason there by the church. Yes, you're not doing the right thing, but there's a reason they're by the church. Tell us why, Thomas, Actually, in my heart, for the purity of the call, there's a reason there by the church, maybe reason, maybe somewhere in their soul they're asking for forgiveness.

Yeah, okay, fair enough, interesting points. Thanks Thomas, you're gonna get one more in here. Thank you much for your question. Good night, bye, good night, mister Thomas, have a good one and cannumber. One of my favorite conundrum, one of my favorite words in the dictionary. Jeane and average Jean. We're gonna wrap the hour with you here, go right ahead.

Okay, thank you, Dan. This is a good subject. So anyway, this problem has been spread out into Boston onto three months, three Boilston three Boston God, and you know, no one can feel safe. They're shooting drugs up all over the place and people are afraid, can't even use the subway. So the mayor has to step into and get, you know, try to get some help.

She's building, she's building bike lanes. Come on, she's got a she's got her plate is full, building bike.

She's going to have to break, break that schedule and get some street workers out there to try to help these people. Winters coming, and it's going to get more dangerous. But you know, when workers can't walk back and forth to work and don't feel safe, it's not good.

No, it's it's absolutely not good. There's a lot of problems than in Boston right now. We got problems with school buses running on time. We got problems getting enough ballots to people to vote on job. We got bike We got a lot of bike lanes in Boston. So if you're a bike rider, you're a happy camper.

I give I give them an F for everything else though, flindliness that I have a right not to get hepatitis when I'm walking down the street.

Too, I totally agree with you. Look, I'm on your side. I'm giving them an F on bike lanes too. Gene, by the way.

I mean yeah, I mean it's just a world that they want the children to grow up into.

They don't care about the children. They care about getting re elected. Come on, you know that as well as I do.

Something has to change. Thank you, dam have a good night, you took.

I'm going to get one more in as it's out of Jean's kindness. Who's next here? Mike and Lynn? Mike, we're going to get you in. They got about three minutes for you.

Go ahead, Mike, mister Dan, how you doing good sir?

We're a little tight on time, but I get to get you and you want to wait through the news, go right ahead.

I know this is my second time calling you, and and I'll tell you one thing. You are a great person.

I don't know about that, but I appreciate the compliments. Sir, go right ahead. What's your thought on this subject?

My subject is like what I think about all the people they call you is they think this people the homeless, they're nobody. They do not deserve to be on a street. They deserve to be on jail. But there are good people. I tell you the reason. Want my experience. I get up every single morning, three three in the morning, tank shower. I'm with a definite donor.

I'm this guy.

He's homeless, So I buy him a coffee and I'm talking to him. I guess what, he's a brain.

Really become homeless?

Yeah, he become homeless because his wife and he's going to be the car accident as I die.

Oh no, I'm sorry to hear that. Yeah, that's circumstances in people's lives. Mike. Wow, that's that's an amazing story. That's an amazing story.

I become tread with him and I have a triple desho and I give him one of my in my house and he's given red tree. I want to give him taking chance in life.

Wow, you're a good person, Mike. You're a very good person. You are you were that guy's guardian angel. It's as simple as that. I hope that he appreciates it, and I hope you can get him back in the practice of medicine.

Miss. Then I'll tell you this. The last three callers they call, they all have heat about people homeless on the street, but they don't understand the fact is people on the street, Dad, they become homeless because they don't know how to climb the hill. Need somebody to have that.

All right, Mike, thank you for what you did, and thank you for this call. So an inspirational phone call and God love you. Thanks Mike. We'll talk soon. We'll look forward to your next call. Have a great one. Uh, if you'd like to continue on this issue, let's stick with it, Mark and Matt I got room at six one, seven, two, five, four, ten thirty and at six one seven ninety. Light them up and we can continue on this topic. It's been a really good topic for two hours. Let's keep it going.