It's night side when Dan Ray on WBS cast Radio.
Thank you Nicole. Yes, I am back, and I first of all want to just explain what went on yesterday. I want to thank Morgan White who pinched hit for me yesterday. Morgan is always there to back me up, and I really appreciate what he did yesterday. I got hit with something like Monday into Tuesday, and I wasn't quite sure what it was. I tested myself for COVID, came back negative. Actually dealt with my doctor and I explained that lots of felt like fluids and my lungs,
did a chest X ray, wasn't sure, wasn't sure. I think we've kind of settled on it was a bad case of bronchitis. You'll hear it in my voice. I apologized to everyone. I tried to do a nightside post game on Tuesday night Wednesday morning, and I had taken a niquill medication, just over the counter medication, and I literally was falling asleep as I was doing them. I just realized that I was exhausted. I slept sixteen hours
yesterday and I'm still not one hundred percent. Hopefully you won't hear me cough as much as I've been coughing. But again it's a cautionary tale for all of us, me included, to take better care of ourselves. I think this was the first sick day I've had in several years. I think of the last time I actually had a
sick day. So I've been blessed with good health, blessed to have Morgan as someone who they get on moment's notice, and I just wanted to say thanks to him, and thanks to all of you, And let me tell you, Tuesday night, I was struggling and at some point I thought, well try this night quill stuff. I'm not a big niquill guy, to be really honest with you, it hit me like a ton of breaks about quarter midnight. So apologies to all, apologies around, and again great appreciation of Morgan.
So we will be talking later on tonight with the WBC Car guys. From ten to midnight, Larry and Scott Reubenstein will join us answering all of your automotive questions. At nine o'clock to night, we'll talk with Joey Noon, also known as Joey Voices. Had him on the show before. He's a great entertainer, and I think we'll have some fun with him. But the first hour tonight, I'm delighted to welcome two people who I know very well, the Mayor of Everett, Carlo Demiria de Maria, and his attorney,
Jeff Robins. And some of you may have read in the newspaper that Mayor d Maria won a settlement in a really vicious set of circumstances. He won one point one million dollars in a settlement against a local newspaper in Everett, the Everett Leader Herald newspaper, which not only agreed to pay the one point one million dollars in a settlement, but they also agreed to cease publication after one hundred and thirty nine years as part of the
deal with us. There is also Jeff Robbins, As I said, Mayor de Maria's attorney on this, let me start with you, Jeff very quickly, that I want to have the mayor tell the story. This is an extraordinary outcome. For those in the audience who are not familiar with the case law in this area, there's a case out of New York in the nineteen sixties called New York Times versus suttlement, which makes it very difficult for a public figure, of which the mayor is a public figure, to win anything
in a case like this. Can you explain that in terms that my audience will understand. I think it was a bad decision in nineteen sixty I think it was nineteen sixty two. Although it protected people like me in the media, I think it ovally protects us well. Dan.
First of all, thanks for having me, having both of us on, and it's great to have you back. You are the cal Ripken, the Luke Garrick of broadcast journalism.
So I like to think of yourself as the Wall. I like to think of myself as the Wally Pip. I'm always gonna so.
Well.
Whenever you're not on on a weeknight, a tremor goes through the broadcast journalism community. So welcome back. It is an unusual case. You're right. There was a Supreme Court case called New York Times versus Sullivan, actually out of Alabama. It arose in Alabama, and it's a case which ended
up holding. Though you're right that it was kind of a twisted and tortured case in certain respects that in order for a public figure to win a defamation case, that public figure had to show not only the usual elements of a defamation claim that there was a falsehood and that it defamed somebody and did that person damage, but that it was uttered with what's called actual malice, which is, in brief, either the person publishing it knows
that what's being published as false or publishes in reckless disregard of whether or not it's true or false, And so is commonly said, the public figures have a difficult time winning defamation cases because of that elevated standard.
By the way the.
Case the case set up, this is a sheriff from Alabama who is not the nicest guy in the world, and he's suing the New York Times, and the New York Times was able to win that case against someone who.
Was not a nice person from what I have read about Sheriff Sullivan.
Well, that's you're right. So much as aught about that case, it does arise, and we'll get back to the mayor's situation. The case arose from an advertisement to paid advertisement published in the New York Times, which had all sorts of falsehoods in it, and the Times did nothing to fact check the advertisement, even though they're being paid money to
publish it. And so, as you say, the case held that a plaintiff such as the person suing, had to show by clear and convincing evidence, if that person were a public figure, that what was published was not only false intofamatory, but was published essentially knowingly. And so it's a high standard, and therefore it's uncommon for plaintiffs who are public figures to win these cases.
So the plaintiff who you represented, Mayor Dean Maria, went through years, years of unfair allegations. It became almost a uh a personal war against him. Mayor Gean Maria, tell us what it was like. You're the mayor. You've been elected and re elected in in effort for many years.
But there was a couple of elections that there was an effort apparently by these uh the owner of this newspaper and it's publisher and editor uh to take you out whatever, whatever whatever the cost, right right, Uh, Hi dam and Jeff, how I how you guys doing tonight?
Than? Uh, thank you again for having us on. Yeah, like yourself, I'm a little onto the weather myself with that same type of uh food conditions. So if I found a little off myself. It's uh, I think I'm think I think something's going around, uh Dan, Yeah, but uh yeah, you know, for about so prior. I mean basically they bought the newspaper and I believe was twenty seventeen,
twenty eighteen. For four years, they just you know, week after week they began with satire and then they ended with you know, we have the facts, this is all true. This is uh you know, we have witnesses, we have sources, and they just I mean from you name it, they said it. It was. It was awful. I mean they they you know, we get to after we began the lawsuit we set up. You know, it takes me away from important things, but I just want to kill this guy or take him out. You know. It was it
was truly awful. I mean, Jeff can definitely do a better job. But you know what I went through, My family went through, my children went through you know some of the some of some of this stuff. Actually josh Resnik was in working with Andrew Esties from the Boston Globe and she was using him as her sources for some of her stories. You know, it was, it was, it was, It was terrible. Just when I went through, my family went through.
I mean, yeah, I think one of the stories that I heard was that at one point your dad came to you and he made a comment, which had to be a frightening comment that if any of this was true, well he said something like, then you're not my son, or something like that. I mean, it was.
Devastating, Yeah, it was. It was devastating. You know. My dad was, you know, former carabinarian Italy, came to America in the late sixties to follow his sweetheart to America. You know, he had a great life in Italy, but came to America. My mother came to America first. Uh so he you know, I mean his English isn't the greatest, but he did read. You know, back when we were growing up, Lead the Herald was you know, run by the Canine family, who did a great job running the newspaper.
You know, it was a legitimate newspaper. You know, everybody relied on the newspapers, one of the only papers in the city. And as you know, it was one hundred year of paper.
Year old paper, one hundred thirty nine year old paper.
Wow, yeah, it was. It was actually a really I mean it was it's unfortunate that this family purchased his paper for the mere reason just destroy my reputation. And that's what they did. They bought this paper. They actually, to the tune of about one hundred and fifty thousand tred thousand a year used uh subplanted, I guess, so used outside fund to keep it operational, just to uh
ruin my reputation. But so my dad, you know, he, like you said, it came came to America, came to Edward in nineteen sixty nine or sixty seven and read this paper weekly. You know, that's just his This is what he That's pretty much the only paper he read. So he, you know, thought it was you know, and everybody, even all the old timers and the say, a lot of people turned against me thinking was being written in this paper was true because everyone thinks, if it's just
a paper, it has to be true, right. The press doesn't lie the press, The press just reports. Well, we know that's not the case. So you know, one day, you know what I mean, after you know, as a continuously writing these articles and you know, and it stops stopping. You know, my dad says to me, you know, this is this is true? You know, you're not my son, you know, and I said that, you know, yeah, this is not true. You know, this is all false, It's all made up. And well, how can they keep writing
this stuff? How come no one's you know, he's thinking the government will come in and step in and shut it down. Realize that I have to I have to, I have to take a suit, you know, and that's when you know in Matthew, it was October of twenty one. You know, I brought Jeff Robins on Saul E Ring, who did a remarkable job. I mean, you know, it's kind of sad in the way that we didn't go to trial. I was really anticipating watching Jeff's and Joe and Page do their thing. I mean, you might other
information we had. Uh it was just incredible. I mean, you know, it's it's just just uh, it would have been it would have been great to see them uh put this on.
But uh, you know, the settlement speaks, speaks volumes. Mayor let me take a pause here because we've got to take up a commercial commercial break. We can back, Jeff. I'd like to get into how you were able to get all of these notes and information in which they basically in depositions, they admitted everything that you needed. It seems to me. We'll take a break back with Everett Mayor Carlo d Maria UH and his attorney Jeff Robbins is with now a very significant firm in town Saul Ewing,
and Jeff is the first Amendment lawyer. You know him from this program from many other issues. He and I feel very strongly on the issue with Israel UH and the need for that country to to be able to defend itself and for us to back that country. But this is a different issue. With Jeff Robbins and Mayor Carlo Di Maria tonight on Nightside, We'll be right back if you'd like to join the conversation or like to actually congratulate either of both of these men, because what
they did this is a long odds to win. With a backdrop of New York Times versus Sullibon and give us a call six one seven two five four ten thirty or six one seven ninety three one ten thirty back on Nightside right after the break.
Now back to Dan ray Line from the Window World Nightside Studios on WBZ News Radio.
We're talking with Everett Mayor Carlo de Maria uh also with his attorney Jeff Robbins, they have just settled a defamation suit against the Everett Leader Herald newspaper for one point one million dollars.
Jeff, Yes, that's fine, We're good now. Jeff, tell me, how were you able to basically, through depositions, get all of the information that you need to bring this defendant in affected their knees and to a point where they're willing to pay one point one million dollars and shut down a thirty nine year old.
Well, well, you know, I always think about this famous line, this supposed the story about the kid that asked John Kennedy how he became a war hero, and supposedly he replied, it was easy. They sank my boat. Well you know this, this, this wasn't easy because, as you know, Dan is a lawyer.
This process is very arduous, full of fights over who has to turn over what material, endless battles with a court to get a judge to require to compel people to turn over documents, emails, texts, and other records that they don't want to turn over. It's a very expensive process. It's a very time consuming process. It's a very dispiriting process. It's built, as you know, and now, as the Mayor also knows, built into our legal system, for better or
for worse. It requires a lot of effort. In those who can't find somebody to do it'll never have the chance to vindicate their rights. A long way of saying that this process required the Leader Herald and its owner and its editor publisher to turn over literally hundreds of thousands of pages of emails and texts. And the hard work was done by colleagues of mine, Joe lipshitson Page Strader, who spent a lot of time we all did going through these things and found documents that were simply amazing.
They were This is all a matter of public records, so I'm not saying anything which isn't emails. As the mayor said that said, you know, we're going to carry this guy. We're going to crush this guy. We're devastating this guy. We're administering a holocaust to this guy. He can never survive this. We're going to issue an atomic attack. And there were literally hundreds of emails and texts like that.
In addition, how are you, yeah, how are you able to prove that? They also knew that they just weren't simply mistaken that they knew that what they would do. They must have had some admissions in there that they're making this stuff up.
Well, you're right. The deposition again all matter public record. The deposition of each of these in the two individuals lasted for many days, and over the course of the deposition, in particular of mister Resnik, the editor and publisher, he came to admit that he had no basis for making the allegations that he made, that he could identify any
basis that he had fabricated them. And moreover, with respect to one series of particularly damning stories, he ended up admitting, having first testified falsely that he'd conducted interviews and he'd kept notes, he ended up admitting that actually there were no notes. There were no interviews, and there were no notes, and that what he did was after the lawsuit was filed against him, and after he'd been suboena to turnover notes,
he made copies. He went into a notebook and wrote down stuff after the fact to make it look as though there were notes when they weren't. He admitted that he had concocted quotes which he had falsely attributed to somebody who swears that he never said them, and on and on it went. Every time he turned around, there
was more of that. There were emails that he'd sent about collecting cash, thousands of dollars of cash from opponents of the mayor for the purpose of funding what he himself said was an effort to drive the mayor out of office by sort of adding thousands and thousands of copies, printing thousands and thousands of extra copies and delivering them door to door for the purpose of What he said clearly was, you know, driving the mayor out of office. So the whole purpose of the paper, Yeah, this.
Was a journalistic hit job. What was the motive it was? Was the motive to increase the circulation or was it more of a personal motive that they said, we got a guy here, let's let's you know, he's a target rich environment, let's make him a target rich environment. Why, Well, it sounds to me like how do you keep those lies straight?
Well, you've asked several good questions there. The first one is one which a lot of people ask. And again I'm not speculating here, I'm simply telling you about what some of the evidences that's on the public record in court.
There was testing moaning from the editor publisher that the family that owned the paper, mister Philpin, who had an insurance business, that had had prior contracts with the City of Boston which the mayor didn't continue, who had rooming houses and other real estate projects with the city of Everort. Sorry did I say anything else? City ever and he City of Everett, and he felt that the mayor was not sufficiently favorable to the business interests of the family.
There's a text in which that that is what this individual said, that he understood very clearly that his boss wanted the mayor defeated, and that was the purpose of the publication of the newspaper with what the evidence was.
Thank god that Mayor de Maria was able to withstand this. I know that there was one election that turned out to be substantially closer than anyone would have expected. We'll talk about that, and we'll continue to talk with Everett Mayor Carlo di Maria and his very competent attorney, his
defamation lawyer, Jeff Robbins of saul Ewing LLP. This is this is a good day for journalism because there is within the journalistic community still people like this, people like the Alex Joneses of the world, who will do anything. He's the guy that said that the massacre in Newtown, Connecticut at that school was made up. There. I just think that, Look, I'm the journalist, but a journalist for
a long time, but this is well deserved. If you'd like to join the conversation, ask a question if you're from Everett, Field free six one's seven, two five, four ten thirty six one seven, nine three one ten thirty. We'll continue with our conversation learning a little bit about defamation law and then in the context of this case against the backdrop of a very famous federal case New York Times Sullivan, We'll be back on night Side right after this.
You're on Night Side with Dan Ray on Boston's News Radio.
We're talking about an interesting case which Everett Mayor Carlo di Maria was defamed by a local newspaper and by the editor and publisher of that newspaper over a long period of time. And uh and it was some very brutal, brutal comments that were made and Mayor Dean Maria, this had to take a toll on you. And on your family. There was one race I forget what, I forget what year it was, which you almost lost in large part because of the lives that this newspaper was spreading.
Oh yeah, yeah. They they actually at one time they put on a ten week campaign from about a month prior to the primary and after the primary up to the election. It was week after week, every Wednesday, delivered to every home in the city, and they just, uh the lies were you know, extortion, uh, kickbacks, demily, a crime family, uh, quid pro quo, uh, settling, all kinds of harassment, lawsuits with females, put a knife to a girl. Stroke.
It was it was. It was awful. I mean it was like week after week after week lies and uh you know, so you know, it was it was just it was just a U yeah, it was. It was awful. I mean it was completely awful. Yeah. Someone just actually interrupted me and I was talking here.
Yeah.
It none of this had any you know, look, if if you had had a let's say something like a car accident, okay, and let's assume that there was some little in situation where you yelled at the other guy, hey, why'd you do? And if they had something to work on that was genuine, but just make stuff up out of whole cloth and then try to basically drive you out of office.
Yeah, that's right. I mean you were saying it was close. Yeah, I mean, you think about it, Daan, if a hundred people changed am I on that election, I would have been out of office, disgraced. People would have believed this newspaper. They would have continuously still writing all this awful, terrible stuff. I wouldn't have the ability to have, you know, filed this lawsuit against them. Yeah. I mean, you know we were pulling prior to you know, they they really ramped
it up in twenty twenty one. I mean that last year prior to my election, they rarely ramped it up. I mean, the the lies were awful, so bad that I mean I was in a bad place mentally, truly was because you know, people were believing it. People were sharing the articles with friends, you know, family members, people, you know. I would see my neighbors were asking me, you know, we're questioning everything I was doing. I mean
it was terrible. I mean I talked about how my father asked me that question, you know, I mean he wrote it so that you know that you know it was as a matter of fact, you know these there was a matter of fact. We have sources, we have people interviewing with us. You know, it was it was, Yeah, it was something godly awful.
And I mean the media and Jeff can get it in this as well. The media has tremendous powers in this country, Okay, to influence elections. Different case, different story, But obviously had the Alex Jones case, the nut job down in Texas who was basically saying the horror that he visited upon the families of those kids and parents of the six school teachers and the twenties children who
were massacred on that horrific decevery day. He did it to basically make him a bigger and bolder a political figure.
George Stephanopolis has been suited. Apparently ABC has agreed and
helped me out here, Jeff on this one. I believe that ABC, in a similar fashion, has agreed to a settlement to pay fifteen million dollars to the Donald Trump Library because Stephanopolos is apparently saying something about Donald Trump which was factually incorrect, continued to say it even after his producers cautioned him not to say that that Trump had been convicted of rape when I mean, the power of the media is incredible, but it cannot it cannot be used in a way in which it can be
it can be used to destroy people's lives.
Well, yeah, you're absolutely right. The ABC settlement was fifteen million dollars. And you can see the interview in which George Stefanopolis, in the process of interviewing Congress Will and Mace, says I think at least four times that Donald Trump was found libel for rape, which actually is not true. The jury slip specifically said that they did not find him liable for rape. And your point, though the larger one,
is a very good one. There is, on one hand, this absolutely crucial need, crucial need for the First Amendment to be robust and to protect a free press, especially visa the government. But on the other hand, as you also say, there is a potential for terrible abusive power, just like there's a terrible potential for abuseive power in
every other entity enterprise in American life. There's that capacity for massive abuse of power, given how much power the press has, if people are cocky or or dishonest, or are too interested in clicks and shares to be focused on printing the truth.
I think that the social media, the arrival of social media, and it inundates our lives these days. Jeff, and I'm just curious if you think that has contributed to the sort of wild west attitude that maybe this small newspaper it ever had towards mayor de Marine.
Absolutely, and wild west is absolutely the perfect phrase for it. That is what the media landscape is. More and more and more, it's pretty much, you know, everybody is a media entity, unto himself or herself. There's an enormous pressure to get clicks and shares and attention. It's also part of American culture, and it also drives every media enterprise large, small, medium sized to get out there and grab attention. And if that means being reckless or clever or pandering to
a particular segment, well then that's what they do. There are some people who feel as though that that's their financial model, you know, So you're right.
I just think it's there has to be a clear demarcation between I will read op ed columns, you're writing an op ed column. There are people going to disagree with your op ed piece, your conclusion. I don't, but but others will.
Uh.
And that's what the op ed page is all about. But when you start putting out something as factual and putting out in the concept this is a news I'm reporting this as a newsperson as opposed to this is my opinion.
Uh. That's that's where where the line becomes very, very shaky. And that's where I think this guy Resnick went way over that line. And obviously the newspaper's out of business. What what's the what is the papers plan? Are they going to come back in some other entity at this point? Or does does Everett going to have another newspaper mayor what's is there any idea what you know? Obviously, Everett is a big city that is a lot smaller than Boston, and you got the Globe in the Herald, But it's
also good to have a local newspaper for as well. Correct.
We have two other local newspapers that do it good, decent enough job to report what's going on in the city.
Uh.
You know, we put what's currency, not create Uh you know what's going on in the city, right. Uh. And that's the problem with the press I think today is that every time you listen to a different news station and you read a different article, it's it's uh, it's their opinions. You know, no one's reporting anymore. That's how I see it. I mean, it's just between the social media and and you know that that's why you see so many people that are depressed, children that are pressed families.
I mean, it's just bad. I mean it's it's it's a bad time and it's unfortunate.
But the best example, I think right now, and maybe Jeff to come up with a better one, is this guy, Alex Jones has a tremendous that's awful. A lot of people are can He doesn't say it's his opinion. He basically blusters and said, no, this was set up, this was this was a this was a false flag. Uh, these children weren't, weren't massacred. This He basically made it sound like a Hollywood movie. And he wasn't saying it's
his opinion. He's saying it's fact. And and he was sued Jeff, thankfully, and I think that eventually his whole media empire will collapse and and he and he deserves it. I mean, this guy made no this just as somebody who takes journalism kind of seriously. I look at this guy and I think, what an impostor he's He pretends he's a journalist, but he's anything but a journalist.
And obviously there's a lot of people like that.
Yeah. No, no one worse than him though, in terms of in terms of ye in size and and and the damage that he that he did. Let's take a quick break, gentlemen. I want to one more with you, and again, if folks want to call in, I'd love to hear from you. Six thirty Jeff. As you know, whenever we talk legal issuers, a lot of people are intimidated and they want to listen to what you and the mayor has to say. But folks can certainly call in if they'd like. Six one, seven, nine, three thirty.
Coming right back on the Nightside.
Now back to Dan Ray live from the Window World Nightside Studios.
I'm WBZ News Radio. It's got a couple of phone calls in here. Let me go to Joe in Everett. Joe, welcome to Nightside. Appreciate you calling in your first this hour Nightside. Joe.
Hey, Dan, I'm an Everett resident. I just want the meet and know that the people have ever support him, whether it's getting new sidewalks. I live on Woodward Street. You know enough, that's enough with these people, these crazy people. You know, you had a tough time in the school department with the crazies in the school department and now this thing. So the people have evert support him, and I hope he run for reelection again.
Well, thank you right there, go ahead, Mayor.
Thanks Joe. I appreciate that. It means a lot. I appreciate that.
So when you rather, Mayor, what do you what's realize is a two year term? You have a four year trim.
Uh no, the four year term and uh reelection would be next year, would.
Be twenty twenty five. What are you thinking?
Let's make some news, you know what you know, leaning towards running for reelection right now? You know this is definitely putting this behind us and shut down the leader Harold uh for good. Uh is a great start, and you definitely didn't want to go through that again. Having that, you know that news shaper and business and writing and stuff. That's it's writing, you know, you know, we feel very optimistic about running it again, and you know, papers to
come out in the springtime. So right now, I'm just trying to you know, it's it's been a long road. Uh, just kind of really just you know, realizing that.
You have a right to take it. You have a right to take a big deep breath, uh and realize that that at the end of this things worked out really well. And I suspect that if you did decide to run for reelection in view of what has happened, uh, that that you'd be that you be returned pretty easily.
What you definitely have a lot of projects to get done. There's a lot of a lot of things that we want to get done right Uh. You know that that pedestrian footbridge from Assemble Row over to the Encore Casino. We're trying to get phase two off the ground, the stadium. I have a new high school we're trying to get built, trying to work with the governor, now the te they get a couple of commuterial stops in the area. But
there is a lot of work to get done. And that's one of the things that is driving me to uh to look to run it in To be honest with you, thank you, you care about you care about the working class people. I just have to say that, you really do. So I wanted to thank you. Merry Christmas. Merry Christmas, Joe, thank you my friend.
All right, thanks Joe. Iks appreciate you calling it. So you have served how many terms? This is finishing your second term mayor? Is that correct? Or more?
No? I uh, I've completed three two year terms and this will be my third four year term.
Oh so they changed it to the four year term. Okay, so you've been mayor there for If I'm eighteen years, this year will be your eighteen year. If I did my.
Math, ye, this year coming up will be eighteen years correct.
Okay, Well again, keep us posted on that. I want to just swing back to Jeff for a second. Jeff, there's more than than just a case here.
Uh.
This has generated a lot of attention in newspapers, not only across the America but around the world. What's the lesson here? What? What? What? This has to stand for? Something more than just one rogue newspaper in one city outside of Boston. Yeah.
And I say this as somebody who is involved in journalism, who loves journalism and journalists, who represents newspapers and media organizations. But there is I think, as we all know, a fair amount of mistrust more than fair, a very severe amount of mistrust of the media in this country, clearly, and this is the kind of case which I think proves the point for a lot of people who think that there are folks who have this power and don't wield it in an honest way. And unfortunately there are
instances where that occurs, plenty of them. This was an egregious example of it, and I think that's why it's captured so much attention.
Their final comment from you, You've gone through this, It was not fun to go through. You've emerged on the other side with your reputation intact, and the possibility of serving four more years in the city that you have served so well for eighteen years. I don't want to ask you was it worth it? But what's the lesson that you took from this, this whole experience.
The lesson that I took from this whole experience? Yeah, uh, when you when you when you need when you need help, call Jeff Robinson. Yeah you know, Uh, I don't know the lesson I learned from this. It definitely, uh definitely made me a stronger person, more resilient, person, you know, you know, maybe I guess journalists out there too, you know,
have some integrity. When you're writing a story and you know someone calls you and tells you something, and you write a story allegations about somebody, Maybe do some more research, you know, not don't just print something and say, oh this, you know, allegedly this person did this or that. Do the real work, you know, do the real work and make sure you're not ruining someone's life, you know.
So that's a lesson that all journalists should have. Let me get one more in here, real quickly before we gotta before we got to break here. Let me one last caller. Ken is checking in here. Ken, you were next to night side your call on late. I give you about a thirty seconds or a minute, go ahead, Ken.
Yes. I read two books by this gentleman, Josh Wesnick, and they're in the public library in Chelsea, and they discussed the Chelsea fire. I think maybe the penalty was a little harsh one the gentleman.
Well, he might have written written good books about the Chelsea fire. Ken, But like anything else, if if you have a great surgeon, and he's been a great surgeon, but he does surgery on you and he screws you up for life.
That's that's a problem. And what he tried to do to Carlo, to the mayor of Everett, has been proven. What and and I think that there's a lesson for all journalists who feel that they can basically go out and hunt public officials as you would hunt, you know, an animal in the woods during hunting season.
That's not what journalists are supposed to do this.
They're supposed to consider the the information they have, consider their sources, check it in double checking.
Appreciate you call again nonetheless. All right, thanks very much, Jeff Robbins, Thank you so much. Mayor Dee Maria. I wish you a merry Christmas. I know it's going to be a merry Christmas for you and Jeff. I wish you and your as a happy honker, and I know it's going to be a happy honker for your family as well. Every once in a while, the good guys do win, and I think of this one, the good guys won. Thanks guys. I appreciate it so much.
Damn, thank you so very much.
All Right, guys, talk to you soon. When we get back. We're going to talk with Joey voices, a great entertainer who is gonna have a little bit of fun right after the nine o'clock news. Here are nights i'd stay with us and we're gonna be doing talking with the car guys from ten to twelve. There was someone today who had a question about a car. I had no idea. Uh, all I gotta do is call the car guys. They will answer all your questions. Coming back on the night, said right after this