“Cherish America.”

I recall correctly, Robert a native of the state of Maine. Correct, How are you tonight?

You know. I grew up in a family where with sisters and brother and my mother was a school teacher and she would put us to bed promptly at somewhere around eight or nine, and I would pay no attention to that and have a transistor radio listening to the Red Sox play under my pillow, and it was I don't know, there was something a little bit Norman rockwellish about that ears.

Camden Yards in Baltimore or where else. And you, nonetheless were transported. And that's what we do here on night side every night we try to do. But your life took you, and I think it's important to set out the world experience that you had. How did you find

your way into government service? And obviously as a former assistant Secretary of State, that's pretty rarefied Aaron to function and tell us, tell us a little bit about how you got from a small town in Maine to the cards a power in Washington, DC.

want to do, that the clouds would occasionally part. And what I learned, I mean, my father never finished college and my mother was an elementary school teacher, started at twelve thousand dollars a year and more or less raised four kids on her own, and we ended up in a situation where she prioritized education and she said, you know, if you want to do anything other than stay here in this town or nearby. You need to get an education.

And so sometime around the middle of my high school years, I decided it was probably important to get a little more serious. I was a runner and some other stuff, but I I started to work hard. And you know, I'm going to just tell you this as an inspiration for anybody listening with kids, grandkids or themselves. You have to first envision something that you would like to do. It doesn't matter whether you're going to be an astronaut or you're going to be a pole vaulter in the

Olympics something. And then you have to have in your brain and in your heart the belief, the true belief that no matter what anybody else says, you could actually do that. And then you have to work your tail off. And so, you know, sometimes luck comes, or you know, the blessings happen when you work hard. So what happened

with me was I'd never had it. My father didn't finish college, had no links to Dartmouth College at all, but I had seen it once and I was just intrigued by this college in New Hampshire and beautiful place. And you know, I do remember there were people who even sort of laughed that I would try to apply to this, but I decided, what the heck, I'll just try, and so I applied and I got in by some strike of lightning. But ironically, and again this is this

whole idea of don't give up. They didn't give me any money. I had no money, and they let me in, but I had no money, and in that era, that was the deal. So my mother, God bless her, and we just lost her last timer, but she said, look, take the family car and go over, and you're not a bad debater. Explain to them that you're a good investment. And so that's what I did. And they came through with loans, which I paid back every penny and wouldn't have done it any other way, and they came with

those scholarships. And so then what happens is once you begin to realize you can turn the dial, you know, like cranking on some bolt that has been rusted shut. But then you get it to turn. Now you start really trying to turn it. And so I applied for a scholarship to Oxford and got it, and then to Columbia Law School and got it, and then I wanted to now for some people this will sound sort of hokey,

but there's things called clerkships. And I wanted to clerk for a federal judge, a conservative because I am conservative was back then, and I you know, I didn't know I was until I realized everything I believed was what people call conservative.

so it was an amazing experience. And then I come back and ended up with time again just knocking on doors the way you would if you were a local candidate for something, and I ended up working in the Reagan White House and then staying close to the Reagans until the end of both their lives, and worked in the Bush forty one White House and ended up running the largest part of the oversight committee for New Gingrich, bouncing back and forth between being a private sector litigator,

which I hated. I basically was not motivated by money, so it really didn't light my fire. And then eventually I got a call one day from Colon Poland and I actually, I actually said, are you sure you have the right number? I mean, I had no link to cold and Powell, but it you know Helen. Anyway, I ended up talking with him and he said, no, You've written a lot. You are the guy that I'd like

in this job. And so I ended up basically training all the Iraqi police, Afghan police, spent a lot of time I had spent time with law enforcement, and just basically got to apply abroad in seventy countries. All this learning that I had, and then as time passed, I rolled out of that into starting a little company that worked for five of the combatant commands and did some things for the military and also for nonprofits. I was really big on counter narcotics. I really believe kids. We

got to work with the kids. We were given incredible benefits by the World War II and Korean War vets, many of whom were in this book. But we owe it to pass that baton forward. So I work with nonprofits and everything was going around along pretty well. I had joined the Navy as a reservist in intelligence because I had some background in intelligence, and nine to eleven happened.

And the irony is that again, God puts you where he wants you on any given day, and if I wasn't sure of it before that day, I was sure of it on that day. Because I was meant to be in the Pentagon where the CNOIP wedge is, or fifteen of us that looked after bad guys and four hundred in the command center. That wedge was hit that day and I wasn't there. Instead, I boarded a plane forty five minutes before the plane that hit that Pentagon and in DC and spent all of nine to eleven

in the air. So when I was done and realized I'd lost a lot of my shipmates, I just volunteered for active duty immediately, and then that gave me other kinds of understanding, and eventually I ended up in the position with Paul, and you know, life is a you have to accept what comes to your door. And some of it's bad and some of it's good. But the thing you have to keep doing. In my opinion, and I many of the people in this book, in fact, all the people in this book said yes to responsibility.

And if we can just teach the lesson that when something comes to you and you can either stand up, take responsibility and do it, or you can look the other way. Take the chance, take take the dare, take the move, make it good, do something good with yourself, and then something will follow, and something will follow, and something will follow. So my journey out of the little town and I came back and I lived in that little town now. But that little journey was a lot

like Jimmy Stewart's journey. You know, I've been a very blessed guy.

early twenties. How did how did that work come along? How did that break come along?

stays at home. But my break came because again I'm not the irony is I was at Dartmouth and I, first of all, I was sure I was going to fail out, but my mother had reassured me, don't worry, you can always come home if you do. But then I worked hard and didn't and a moment came towards the very end where I could apply to work not in a white house that wasn't available, but it was. You know, everything is a step, step to step to step.

I was allowed. I Dartmouth had a program where you could write your own program up, take some initiative, and if they liked it, they had some corporate funders that would fund it, so sort of anonymously. And so I wanted to work in a piece of the US House that was kind of a caucus or a committee that was working on legal issues, because I thought in that

moment that I was going to become a lawyer. So I just ended up with an internship, an unpaid everyday internship, and I worked my butt off in that internship and published a paper which then led somebody who knew that group. When Reagan won in nineteen eighty, he got there just like you're going to see all these offices populated by people. They're populated by the president's choice, but the number two, number three, number five in that line are not there.

And so what I did is I was given a chance by a guy who Roger Porter, who later taught at the Kennedy School. I never knew anything about Harvard, never knew anything about this stuff, but he said, how would you like to come? I don't have a deputy. How would you just like to come and work. I saw the work you did for this little caucus, so I said, yeah, of course I'll come and work. Of course. And I dropped everything and came and work.

some of you might want to. No one probably has had an opportunity to read the book yet. I don't expect you to do a book report. However, maybe some of you, once we get going here, might be able to recommend some other Americans that if Robert were to do a sequel book that he might include. So we'll have some fun with this, I promise. If you'd like to talk with Robert Charles six one seven, two, four, six, one, seven, nine, ten thirty. Those are the two best numbers to reach

us at. My name is Dan Ray. This is night Side, and we're talking to a person who has been blessed uh in his life. Uh, and he is now blessing others uh. And a book is entitled Cherish America. And if anyone tonight who live here a dozen Cherish America, well your head is not screwed on straight, particularly after what transpired on Bourbon Street in New Orleans just about twenty eight hours ago. Now we're coming back on night Side. We'll be back right after this.

just don't know it. But there's a Forrest Gump element to my life story, which is that I have crossed paths with people who did truly extraordinary things, and they were pieces of my life. And I didn't know that they had done some of these things until later on,

and I began to pull on threads. So the book actually is divided into four sections, and the first one has about twenty two stories, including everybody, and this section is called Courageous Souls, and it is gripping sort of Agatha Christie's style, stories about and they're all true about law enforcement officers who did something extraordinary, pilots, military pilots who did something extraordinary, teachers or nurses, infantry officers, and

those that you wouldn't expect, people who have disabilities, and other things that just make your jaw drop when you see what they've done with who they are just at the lead in. So then the second section is places in Time. The cast of characters in that first section, I'll tell you some of the stories and you know in short and they'll stop you in their tracks because

they did me. And then places in time, including places like Arlington, where I have a lot of relatives buried, and an extraordinary day there that ended with a shaft of light on a stone which just blew me away, and I've got photographs in the book. And then getting out of communists Poland when I got myself in trouble there walking alone on the beaches of Normandy, and the sort of granular feeling the living of the moment of being there. I think people come away feeling it a

lot more strongly when they read that story. And then some other tougher ones I privately in my twenties walked through Auschwitz and had notes about all of that. And then gradually the third piece is Glimpses of History, which are private stories that have never been told, but include very personal stories having worked a couple of years with Colin Powell about what kind of a leader he really was, what kind of a person inside out, and they're they're

pretty compelling stories. People have never heard them, and there I think you come away with a much higher level of understanding and respect for who he was, even if you went in with a high understanding. And then Ronald Reagan, who I had the privilege of staying up with after the White House and tell some stories about both he and his wife, who I Nancy Reagan, who came and helped me in Washington on counter narcotics shoes with some testimony. And then the Bushes and a couple of sort of

serendipitous events. One is that Roger Porter actually and I were at an event with Gorbachev at one point and it was a multi day event, and at one point in that event, I asked Gorbachev whether he believed in God, and his answer was fascinating. And then my other part

of my life which is an odd ball. But turn of again serendipity is I did oversight of NASA for a number of years when I was with Congress, and in that process, over time back in the nineties, got to know very well Walt Cunningham who was Apollo seven, Gene Cernon who was seventeen, and Buzz Aldrin, who I have ended up working three or four times a week

with for the last twenty five years. And so there are stories, you know, the Buzz stories are ones which will just grab you because maybe six years ago, five years ago, I said, Buzz, we talk all the time, and you're telling me things. I've read all your books, and I've seen the clips, and I've read the transcripts, and you're telling me things that are not in any of those books. And I think you ought to write another book. And he said, I don't, you know, I'm

in my nineties. I'm not interested in writing another book. And so I said, well, here's what we're going to do. Then, I'm going to turn on the tape recorder and eventually we're going to pull some of these stories together. How they got off the moon is absolutely gripping, and most people have no idea that they almost did not get off the moon. They had other near death experiences in things like Gemini twelve and some of the other Gemini missions.

So his stories are just absolutely riveting. And eventually I didn't originally think of it, but when it was all said and done and he'd read the manuscript, he offered to write the forward for this book. So his forward in this book again words You're not going to see anywhere else. He has a very clear understanding of what

makes America great, and he really portrayed it. And then the last section includes deep dives into it's called where They Stood, some deep dives after reading hundreds of letters of Thomas Jefferson and John Adams and Ben Franklin and some other more modern heroes like Jimmy Stewart. Deep dives into some things that you don't know about people that

you think you know. So I will tell you that the bulk of the story of the book is these gripping stories about people who in a moment, and literally it's fifty six stories, but in a moment needed to show courage, very often real courage, and didn't know if they had the power to do it, but leaned in and did it. And some of these are things that lasted a lifetime. Some of them happened in a thirty

second block. I mean, the first story in the book is a guy, a law enforcement officer who later worked for me, who he worked the night shift when he was young and in the Charlotte area, and he was coming home one morning early and saw smoke curling out of trailer. And the bottom line on that story is he just did some extraordinary things and ended up saving two little children's lives. And so unique was his selflessness.

And I think of it that way that everybody else in this book, from you know, from the law enforcement officers to the military personnel, to Scott Hamilton, who was the Olympic skater that I've known, and what motivated them. Their names are in this book, the last names. Rick didn't want his last name in the book. His story is so gripping. And then several teachers, I mean, just one, two and three. One is a story about my history

teacher in high school. And again it seems odd that one life could touch so many, but all of our lives are touched by and touch so many. This guy was an infantry officer one hundred and first airborne in Vietnam. His stories there are gripping. But when he came back, there was no Internet, and he realized that all these guys, thousands of them, had no way to compare. Their story is to relate to each other, to get together, and

so he started kind of a newsletter. And you know, I asked him at one point, tell me some of the things that happened as a result of that. And again, I've known him for decades. So he started to roll him out and showed me documents, and you know, one of the most moving stories is one day he got a call from a guy who said, I'm looking for a guy named Jack. And my teacher, David Cook, said Jack who, he said, I don't know, just Jack. But

here's the story. In the middle of a firefight, a guy is wandering across the open running actually across an open plane under fire, and stumbles on a medic who's working on four guys. He's actually working on three. The fourth one he's let go. And so this guy recognized the fourth one and said, why aren't you working on this guy? He said, he's white, he's bled out, there's

nothing left. He said, well, and he recognized him. They've been drinking beers a couple of weeks earlier in a local place, which is described in the book, and he said, well, what if I could He said, you won't find any veins? He said, what if I could find a vein? He said, you find a vein, I'll put plasma in there. Well, this guy hunts and finally finds a vein in the ankle, brings the guy. They bring him around forty years later.

The guy who called looking for Jack is the guy who was saved, who was looking for the guy who saved him, and my teacher Dave put the two of them together, so really powerful stuff. Another my eighth grade math teacher was lit guy.

a book called Cherish America. I would say Cherish America also cherish Americans, because we're very lucky to have been placed here, very lucky to have found this place if we hadn't been placed here. And it is amazing how many people do not appreciate the fact that they live in the most powerful country in the world, but also I think the most compassionate. That's part of the theme I want to hit on the other side of the news break, my guess, Robert Charles, feel free to join

the conversation if you'd like. Six one, seven, two, five, four, ten thirty six one seven, nine, three, one ten thirty Back on night Side right after.

and the my first half is unsung heroes. So on Gorbachev, it was actually a remarkable moment because I don't even really know why I asked him, other than I had always wondered if Reagan and I do have private stories about Reagan in the book, if Reagan had in some ways felt or sensed something about Gorbachev that allowed him to kind of open a shaft of light into the man. And eventually, I mean Gorbachev's stays very standoffish in the first years and eventually becomes almost an adoring I mean,

he almost adores Reagan. And so the answer to the question really has two bullet points. The first is that, when asked directly, he sort of circularly but nevertheless, very revealingly said that he grew up in a home in which his grandmother and his grandfather were really decisive influences, and that his grand father was as a Communist and his grandmother was a devout Orthodox Christian, and these were

the two big influences on his life. In fact, so powerful were they that his grandfather kept a picture of Lenin on the mantlepiece, and on the mantlepiece beside that was an icon of Christ. And so I plumbed it a little further, and I will just tell you again, sometimes you get an exclamation point when you were only looking for a period. The exact things he said are very revealing and suggests to me that this man there was more to him than most people understood, but Reagan

understood it. But the two things that really come the data points that I want to mention, are that he actually referred, if you go back to transcripts privately, a couple of times about the intercession of God in the

peace process that eventually brought the Soviet Union down. And the other thing is years afterwards, when Reagan died, I had worked for or Gingrich and I was invited to come kind of go down a little staircase when they first had Reagan lying in state and come down and they stop me at the bottom of the little marble staircase.

It comes from the Speaker's office down to where a body would lie in state in the Capitol, and they stopped me, and the capitol police just stopped me, and I was just by myself, and this little man came in and walked over and bowed his head at the casket for I don't know a minute, two minutes maybe three, and then retreated privately, no press, nothing, And that little man was Gorbachev. So it's fascinating. That is one story,

and that's the course on the more. You know, I could tell you private stories about Colin Powell and his personal attention to people, Reagan's personal attention to people. But I actually think the more many of the more compelling stories are on the front end with I was going to mention my eighth grade math teacher was the first guy to ever give an orger and to someone, and he gave it to his brother. Never happened before. The two boys were both Korean War vets. They only had

each other. Parents were gone, and Ron decided to give his see if they'd never done it before. They said it couldn't be done. And then they called him back and said, actually, your brother's an identical twin. Maybe if it would ever work, it would work then. And that story is just gripping. And then another friend of mine is one of the F sixteen pilots. There were only two armed F sixteens on nine to eleven, and Jeff Cashman was one of the two. He and his wingman.

All the pictures you see of New York are taken by Jeff and his wingman. The two burning towers, And I asked Jeff, you know, i'd known him for decades. Twenty years later, after nine to eleven, I asked him, how do you feel about all this? How do you feel about what happened and what he didn't get there in time? But you know, his answers are gripping, They're really something you'd be amazed at. And then there are several genuine rescues, military rescues.

that's not going to be a mistake. And so he got two F sixteen's fully armed, so that when National Command authorities actually called him and said can you get two planes in the air, how long will it take you? He said thirty seconds, actually said ninety seconds. They said no, no, fully armed missiles everything he said, I were fully armed, and so they got up and gave chase. And it's a fascinating story. A couple of these are gripping in the sense that Coastguard is involved, a one hundred first

Airborne are involved. A good friend of mine is a black Hawk pilot who had forty one saves to his unit's name, and one of those missions and just absolutely will make you cry. It's unbelievable the risks they took to get in and save this special operator, and they saved them, but they you know, they almost they almost went down together with a revealing tanker. Anyway, just amazing stories, and that's why I think this book. Honestly, from the age of twelve to one hundred and twelve, these are

the kinds of stories you want to read. They remind you that not only are their heroes at your elbow when you're grocery shopping or on the street, and they don't talk about it, but there is a hero in you. And when you read these stories, one of the things that happens with me. And I've gone back through the interviews and I read them again and tear up and think to myself, Okay, I just want to fortify myself if I was ever in a situation like this, would I do what they did? You know? Would I rush

in and save those two kids? Would I? You know, I would I put pedal to the metal with odds of you know, one hundred to one that I'm not going to get there and some of these and would I do it? And that's that's one of the beauties of this book is it highlights this can do American spirit. F fifteen pilots, guys that were in Vietnam, guys that were more recently in combat, and then people who are

doing things in the civilian world. A twenty two year old nurse and how she managed an unbelievable pile of responsibility during COVID and what did she do and how did she do it and how did she feel afterwards? Really gripping stuff.

my life. When we get back, I want to tell you about an American hero that I think you know about, but the most courageous individual that I've ever met. And I'd love to get your reaction to who I think is in that category. We as we've met many of the same people believe it or yeah, and I can identify with you. But I invite our callers to join the conversation if they want to ask a question of Robert Charles, or if they want to talk about someone

who they consider to be an American hero. Again, the book is Cherish America, and I just think that at this time, all of us in this country who are blessed enough to be here, need to understand that we need to cherish this country, because if we do not cherish this country, there are forces about not only around the world but in our own country who would like to bring this country down. And that's why I think

this interview was particularly well timed. It was timed in advance of what happened in New Orleans on January the morning of January first. My name is Dan Ray. This is Nightside. If you'd like to join the conversation, feel free, don't be intimidated. Six one seven thirty six one seven nine three one ten thirty Coming back after this one Nightside.

held at peter Pang, North Korea. He had a crew of eighty three men which they were basically pulled off the high seas off the coast of Korea, North Korea, and they suffered eleven months of horrific captivity from January twenty third, nineteen sixty eight to December twenty third, nineteen sixty eight. And Booker brought all of his crew through that and the night that he was forced to write a quote unquote confession, you know, in against the terms of the uniform.

unless you went to Annapolis. He did not go to Annapolis. So he was small enough to know that the North Koreans in nineteen sixty eight, this is now, you know, many many years ago, over fifty years ago, were blind to the outside world. And he remembered the word peon, which is an ode of praise p A e a n. And he wrote a confession essentially in which he said it would be his greatest honor to Peon. Kimmel's sung basically turned the noun into a verb, and yeah, it

was just amazing. And of course the North Koreans released that they looked at their Korean American dictionary and thought that they didn't understand that that it was a noun and not a verb. He used it as a verb. Anyway, I got to know him, one of the most courageous people I've ever known in my life. They attempted a court martial and when he came back and John Chaffey, who was the detective of navy, said no, that's not going to happen. And he actually led the d mining

of Hyphong Harbor in nineteen seventy five. And I remember talking with the time and I said, I hope you're going to leave a few live ones there. Pete's named Pete Poker, and he said, you can count on that, you know.

of people that sacrifice for us and that they admire. And yes, there are World War Two vets in this store, in this book, and there's some really remarkable people. But I will tell you that more often than not, people read these stories and then come back to me with members of their own families, and many of them have done absolutely spectacular things that were for America, and they

are not written down anywhere. And you know, you know, that's one of the reasons you've got to get a book like Cherish America to remind you that these people exist.

of this comes to mind with them. There was a book my kids read growing up in high school, I think called What Is History? The only thing I remember reading it along with them was that if you took all the books in all the libraries in all the world and you put them all together in one pile, they represent less than one half of a percent of what actually happened. And so in the end, if you don't write it down, if we don't remember that these heroes exist in our past, we'll forget them.