¶ Intro / Opening
I'm Peanut Tillman and this is my uncle Roman Harper and this is the NFL Player Second Acts podcast. I know I look younger and I'm actually older. He's actually younger, but he looks older. We do this banter all the time. I just and he has never won any great Gray is Gray is in right now, Gray is in. And uh, it's just if you're older. You know what we should do.
We should just ask all of our listeners and viewers to make sure you tell a friend, to tell a friend, to tell a friend, to make sure you continue to check us out, give us a like, a review, and a follow. Anywhere you listen to your podcast, whether it's Apple podcasts or iHeartRadio podcasts, please look out for us. Give us a review, click like, Tell a friend, Yeah, listen to what Pino's saying except for the old part.
And speaking of friends, this this next guest. She's an amazing woman. She's actually the first female we've had on this podcast. She has tremendous value in the league. She's one of the senior vice presidents, one of the only women that hold that title. She's the godmother to all players that have played that are retired, that are Hall of Famers. She's the one who's responsible for this podcast. Y'all. Please check out our good friend Tracy Peerlman. So you
¶ Peanut and Roman give Tracy her flowers for being the "godmother" to NFL players
are the first ever female guest on the podcast.
I'm honored.
So how do you feel about that?
I'm honored. I'm so honored to be talking to the two of you. And you're not fighting.
No, we're not. We're not. You're like the godmother to all NFL players. I agree. Nobody knows that either. Yeah, nobody knows. Everyone knows you when you have a problem or when a player has a problem. When I'm frustrated with something, I just text you, like, what about these calls? What is the commissioner doing? What is Vince doing? Can you can you tell Troy uh To?
Does Troy Vincent remember he played defense? Is exactly?
Yeah?
What the text say her all the time?
He does.
But it's not just me though, It's like seven hundred other players will text you like how awesome does that feel for you to know that, like all these these grown men trust you and they they take your advice or they want to listen to you, or you're connected to them in some kind of way, like you have put shoe stamp on the NFL with players.
It's important to me that they know, and I don't care if anybody else knows. It's important to me that you know you can call me for anything. Nobody else needs to know that. And that's exactly why I'm here and the reason I moved to football. When Troy asked me, was I wanted to impact players' lives. I don't care about the rest of it because you didn't.
You didn't know that about Tracy, did you?
No?
I did so. I think he's just now starting to see it, like, damn, she know everybody. Everybody knowing Tracy.
I didn't know she was such a mover and a shaker either. You know, I keep received I'd received her email. I'd been told to email her multiple times throughout my career when this had popped up, or you know, post career, Okay, you need some help with this situation, text this person, and it was always Tracy Peerlman. I didn't know Tracy
Peerlman personally until I've moved on. In the last year and a half, I've got to know you a lot better, and it's been awesome to see It's been awesome to see you do your thing, and you really have impacted so many. I just thought you were on the other end of an email for so long. I didn't really understand your true job and the whole impact of the holistically part of everything that you do for the NFL and especially for the players.
I think it's dope in the sense of it's a male dominated industry. Yes, and you are, or maybe the proper term is you were I think one of the first executives yes, in that position. Yes, How how intimidating was that for you to be one of the only females. I don't think.
I don't think she was intimidated. I want a room
¶ Tracy talks about the call from Commissioner Roger Goodell that changed the path of her career
full of men. I would love to know. How did how did you initially try for the job and get the job?
Well, I started at the NFL the day after I graduated from college. So I had gone through the ranks and I had been in multiple departments and a job was open as an SVP. So I you named the level. I have been the level coordinator manager, senior manager, director, and I was a VP at the time, and it was kind of I was kind of stuck and I was doing all the entertainment stuff. I was working with players. We launched the Legends community and there was an SVP
job open that I did not interview for. And I'm in my office and I see on my phone Roger Goodell calling me. I'm like, this can't be good. And he said, come down to the office. I just want to talk to you for a little while. And he said, why didn't you interview for this job? And I said, it's not the job that I want. He said, well, what job do you want? I said, I want to be in charge for everything for players. There is no one who is handling everything that players need, talking to
them community. He said that doesn't exist. I said, I know, but you asked me, and that's what I want to do. And you know, we talked for a little while longer and I went back and I did the job that I was doing. And about a year later, Troy Minton called me and he said, I'm creating job that is all about the players, and I need somebody to run it and it's all player work. But I think it's your job and we're going to create it from the
ground up. And he told me I had to get rid of all the cool stuff I was doing, booking the halftime shows, booking Kickoff, doing the movies, and I went back. I thought about it. I talked to my team and I said to Troy, this is what I want and he said, it's yours because I know you care about it. Yeah, and he said, what do you want it to be? I said, I wanted to be a support and service to players, and we'll figure all the rest of it out.
So what year was this, Tracy?
It was six years ago, So that's exactly.
What I fairly knew.
That's exactly why I asked that question, because I've seen a change in the NFL's legends community since these six years that you've had this job. I've been retired now six years, so I've literally seen the efforts change from when I first got out to where now I received so many more emails, so many more opportunities, and all these other things that we're literally trying to change the
¶ Tracy talks about how she created a player-first culture within the NFL
outlook of former players, their outlook and expectations on what it's like to be retired and what the NFL can actually provide for them. And maybe you can speak to us a little bit about what you've tried to help implement or guide us into that third place.
It's so interesting we had to change the culture in the buildings. We want a player first. Culture. I want to walk into a room and when people say to me, I want a player, did you xyz? My response is always what's the value to the player? And now, sitting on that side of football with Troy, I can say that when you're on the marketing side, you have a transactional relationship with a player. Hides Tracy, I have money for you to do in appearance. Will you do it? Great? You show up.
There's really no investment.
No, And even though we kept trying to create that relationship, it was very difficult being on the business side because it's a business. When you're on the football side, it's about it's about you as a person. And we can take that and you've seen the shift in our building. Whenever somebody says to me, hey, we need a player, and here's what we're going to do for the player is now in the conversation, you know, we we were doing something and they said they had a list of
assets and the assets player was number one. And I got up and walked out of the meeting and said, when you guys understand that this is not the players are not your asset. The players are the reason we have this initiative. I'll come back and everyone has now shifted their view. And I think you've seen it a lot, oh ycause you've worked with everybody in the building where sponsorship says, well, how can we make this a better opportunity for players? Everybody is now talking that way, and
we really had to shift everybody's view. And we did the same thing at the club level. We were talking this morning about building up the PE departments because player engagement is a trusted resource for players. At the club, you need to have support there. You can have one person for ninety men. That's not fair. So we've just been trying to do one thing at a time, and I know it hasn't been that beast, but at the same time, I think it's been more impactful.
I think the thing that I appreciate most about you,
¶ Peanut lays out why he calls Tracy the "key to the city"
what a lot of people don't know, is you're like the conduit. You are a champion in your own regard, but the players value your opinion so much and they text you, they call you, and then you take those texts and opinions and you present them to Troy, to the commissioner. Because there are several things, but I'll just text you like, hey, you know, maybe we could do it like this, or it's just a fault that I was thinking in that moment. And then next thing, you know,
I was like, yeah, we got that done. Like I've done that to you probably maybe four or five times. Yeah, and the thing actually got changed, and I was just like, oh damn. Like there are people I call you, you said, movers and shakers.
Yes, that's why you can't use the word intimidated with Tracy.
I call you. I call you the key, the key to the city. There's there's a key to the city at every job that I've I've had, whether at every level, whether it's the team, whether it's uh like the league office or whatever. I think everyone thinks the commissioner does run it. I don't think so. I think there's a person like you and they're actually running it. You're the
key to the city. Like wives Heather, she run the house like it's we to face, But there's always a key to the city, someone behind the scenes, like running everything. I truly think that that person is you and your staff, everyone on your staff, Like I love hanging out with y'all, and I don't do nothing with anybody else. I just hang out with the staff like I feel like I'm a part of this is I was going to say, that's very true. Only hangs with you guys all the time.
That's why he knows all of you. I know everybody. What are we doing?
Like?
It's cool. So you've had such a huge impact even before this current role that you have right now? What would you say your message to all the players like
¶ Tracy's message to players
that you've helped today and the players that you have and helped moving forward? Like what do you want that message to be? What do you want to be known for as TP?
What?
Like? What do you want I don't know.
The person and behind the scenes who helped me get through it. I just want to be the person who helps you on your journey all the way through when you get in, when you're playing, and when you get out.
Who's kind of helped mentor you through year? How long
¶ Tracy talks about being mentored by Commissioner Goodell and Executive Vice President Troy Vincent
you've been in the NFL almost thirty one years, almost thirty one years, who's been like the one person that has helped you get to where you are right now?
I would say there are two. And the commissioner at the time that I started, he wasn't the commissioner, so he was somebody who I emulated. He was my mentor at one point and at that time, like I didn't know he was going to be the commissioner, and I just like that he makes people accountable. You know, when we launched the Legends community, everybody nobody wanted to go in the room to ask him for the money because
we needed money. And I went in and I pitched the whole thing and I asked him for it, and he said to me, you're accountable for this. It better work. And then he smiled and said, you should ask me for more money. But it made me feel like he was proud. He understood what I was asking for and he challenged me, and I said, you know what, I'm going to make it work, and when I come back in next year, I'm going to ask for double the money.
So I feel like he's always been a champion for what we do and players don't know he is a champion for players, And whenever we talk about it, if I have a player in the office, he's like, oh, Trace, spring him down. He wants to have that interpersonal relationship with the guys. And the other one is Troy if I didn't move over to Troy, I may not have stayed because I felt like I hit his ceiling and I feel like they both kind of pushed me along the way, and every day Troy's like, well, what else
are we going to do? So it's still challenging. You know, I've been with Troy for six years and we just keep moving forward, which I don't know a ton of people who are in a job for so long who say they have moved forward the whole time.
So, Tracy, two quick little compliments for you. Number One, Peanut always brags about how all you do is just get things done, and that's probably one of the greatest things that you've been able to do. And you, guys, relationship is that he can mention something or people say things to you and you just somehow another it just starts to happen. And you told me a story the other day when we actually got to go into the room. I don't even know what you guys call it. It's not a conference room.
It's way bigger than that.
General session like the general session room where all these owners meetings happen, which thousands of people inside this room. It's auditorium room. And I got to go in there, and I was just observing it all because this is my first trip here and just really witnessing it because
¶ Tracy talks about how former All-Pro WR Brandon Marshall was the catalyst for the NFL's "My Cause, My Cleats" initiative
players don't get to see all this no where. Every thing really starts ground level with all the rules, the expectations and everything. And so and you said, what was one of the best experiences you said bringing players here? Yes, you let off with players talking about Brandon Marshall coming up here and speaking to the players about the Mike Cause My Cleats, Yes, and how it all started here. Yes,
And I didn't know that. And could you maybe just share a little bit of that story with our listeners, because I think it's a great story and only that about Brandon Marshall, what everything he went through, who's a former guest on this show, But then also it will also kind of give us an insight of what your power and impact has been as well.
So My Cause My Cleats was actually created because of a fine that Brandon Marshall dot. So Brandon was wearing lime green cleats during games and he kept getting fined, and he came into the office to see us, and in a room full of people who are not used to being told anything like he literally said, I am sick of you telling me what I care about, and I want to be able to show people this is what I care about. Mental health is important to me.
Why can't we do something where players have the platform. And he wanted to do EyeBlack and Gloves, and we ended up with the Cleats. It took us eighteen months to get the Cleats thing done, and when we were going to host this meeting, my cause my Cleats had been the most successful program we ever launched with players.
Thirteen hundred players participated in the first year, and they were like, we got to get somebody in here to talk about it, and they wanted me to do it, and I was like, we need Brandon Marshall to talk about it. He started this, he needs to tell the story.
And he talked about number one, how he almost got thrown out of the game, how the commissioner essentially saved his life by threatening him because he was very difficult and he had gotten in a lot of trouble and he just shifted and everything changed and he captured this audience. It was unbelievable. He talked for about eight minutes and no one spoke, no one moved in their chair and for owners, head coaches and gms to hear a player perspective on something that could have gone in a very
bad direction. But I don't know what it was like to be in the locker room. I don't know what it was like when you hear you're being fines because you're wearing a uniform the wrong way. So whenever you call me, I take what you say to heart because I can do something for you and be your voice when you can't.
Yeah, I think that's dope.
It's another thing that Tracy said, that's beautiful because I talked to some of the Panthers or Carolina representatives for
¶ Roman talks about the importance of the NFL Legends community
the Legends community, and all they do is talk about how great you are, and they look, it's been some knockdown, drag out some meetings with a little bit of emotions. Hasn't always been sunshines and rainbows. But we were moving in the right direction. And one thing you said, Tracy that was beautiful that I had never thought about. It is like, look, we call it the NFL Legends community
because you are there legends. If you are even on a roster, it doesn't matter for how long you're a legend in some community because the odds of you making it are so small, and most of us don't think about that because we've been this process. We've been wrapped up where we got to be the best, and if we don't have this hall of fame, we don't have this type of career, or we always feel like we
fall short, and that's not true. And we need to be told sometimes from people that we don't know or people that care about us, that hey, you do matter. You are a legend. It doesn't matter what you think your NFL career was. You are a legend to somebody and especially to us. So thank you for that as well. So communication is it's big right in this business.
And what you kind of alluded to was when Brandon
¶ Tracy talks about players voices are shaping how the league operates
went in that room and he was talking to these executives or this room full of non players. Yes, they weren't used to being told what to do or they just won't be there. They weren't used to being spoken to in that manner. Let's just say that with the positions that they hold, do you think that communication has gotten better at that level of senior leadership at the league office.
Yes, And I say that because now they always say to me, Tracy can we get ten players on the phone. So for Pro Bowl we interviewed sixteen players when we changed the Pro Bowls and we had zooms where we said to players, what do you want this to be? Do you want to play a tackle game? No? Do you want to play a flag game?
Well?
What would it be? How can I play? And we got the feedback. You know, we dodgeball is a Pro Bowl skill because Joe Thomas told us he wanted to play dodgeball. So I think that now they see when we talk about social justice traits, I need ten players when we do rules changes, Troy says, I need four offensive alignement in this meeting, so when with the cat that catch no catch, there were a ton of wide.
Receivers, so confusing.
But imagine ten years ago, twenty years we would not have asked a player an opinion, and they'll like, we asked players for opinions on everything, and we got some. We got some feedback. Yeah, like some of the feedback is rough, but it's but we need it. We don't know, you know, we're in the middle of the prospect feedback for combine. You and I were talking about this yesterday, like we need to know the things that just are uncomfortable and are not.
Right right, And sometimes the NFL probably never thinks about this because when you play, or when you're in that position as a player, you do come away or walk away with a different understanding or feeling than most. We talked about the combine.
Seek to understand so you can be understood.
It's beautiful. Another beautiful quote by Charles Peny. Tell me he's always blessing.
Us with more. Yeah, reading his knowledge.
Baby, I love it so Tracy, I don't want to continue to hold you.
I know this was war in the moment.
This is beautiful and I'm PROMPTU.
I love this.
So what will be at the end of your dash when it's all said and done, when you leave the NFL.
In another thirty years?
¶ Tracy talks about what her NFL legacy will be
Yeah, what will be at the end of your dash?
I would love to know.
I don't know. Maybe I'll ask players to figure it out for me. I don't know. I really don't know, but I especially because if you asked me six years ago if this is what I would be doing, I never thought the NFL would let me do this. So I don't know. I'll leave it open.
Are you going to continue to push for more? You will continue to push for more.
Yes, continue to until there is not one story out there that says this NFL player is destitute. That like, until I can change the narrative where what they're talking about is how successful you guys are on the field, off the field post your career. That to me is the important part. Why do I have to see stories about the one negative versus the thirteen thousand positive? That's that's the goal.
What's been one of the most challenging situations you've dealt
¶ Tracy tells a harrowing life-saving story that started with a phone call
with that happened or it ended the right way, and you were like, this is why I do this job. This is why I care about these players.
Okay, so are you going to say it.
Without and you can say without naming I'm not chulding. I'm not going to name it.
But I've gotten a lot of training suicide prevention, mental health awareness to the point where like, if I see something on social media, I'll flag it. You know, we've created some interventions because of that. And I had a Hall of Fame running back. Stay to me, I'm going to have this guy call you. I want you to talk to him. And we started talking. He was angry.
I could see he was bitter. Something was going on, and it turned into a I don't know why I'm on this earth conversation, and I called in Yaka, who's the clinician. While I was on the phone with this player, and it was going in a direction that I was afraid that I couldn't handle, and in Yaka's texted me, find common ground, find common ground, find common ground. So he played for a team that I happened to know somebody very closely, and I said, hey, this player works
for me, that's my guy. But all of a sudden, the conversation started turning around, and you know, within thirty minutes, I got him from bitter to I shouldn't be here to can you connect me with him? To how can you help me get into a facility? And I literally for thirty five minutes. I walked out of the office and I was like, I don't even know what just happened. And this Hall of Fame running back called me. He's like, you just saved that man's life.
And it's gotta be a great feeling.
But at the same time, I was like, this is such a responsibility, and you know we are now the whole staff is getting trained, every club is getting trained because if I didn't know what to do, it could have ended really poorly. But that's why I do this.
That's a big responsibility. That is.
But we see it and then when we see when the players don't get that help, we see the end result and we're all so sad, and then we just you know, send a couple of tweets and we're like, oh, this, this, this, and we know it's that, and we make this excuse because it's not the first time we've seen it. And now I love that you're trying to get in front of it. We want to train more people to get help and get in front of We got to listen.
We've got to be willing to listen and be ready to be involved when we can.
I think one thing the league has done a really good job of is to push the narrative it's okay not to be okay, Like I've within the last couple of years, I've seen that narrative pushed out and it's been Yeah, it's been cool to see.
Yeah. And you know, the twenty four Legends who work in the Legends community get trained in mental health every single time we get together. And it blows my mind that so many players talk to John Randall because he was so damn scary on the field. I watched film
¶ Tracy talks about John Randle's impact in the Legends community
of him playing.
He talked all the time. It's dope. I love John.
And then he'll be like Trace, this guy is gonna call you, and all these guys confide in him, and he now has the training to be able to pass them on to the right people. So again the peer to peer, Like you guys are on the ground. You guys, hear it. We just want all of you to know. Just send people to us. We'll figure it out.
Yeah, okay, Well, TP, hey, appreciate you being first and only woman on the podcast, Like that's dope, that's no.
Thank you. There's nobody better to have on here to represent it whether they it is like you are, there's nobody else.
Thank you.
Appreciate Tracy and you guys didn't argue at all. It's awesome.
How can you not love this lady. She is awesome. I've had the privilege of working with Tracy and her team since like twenty twelve, and she is just you know, USDA certified. She's a great person, just just her character quality. She really does care about the players in this league.
I think she emphasized that big time it was about the players, and I'm glad that we actually get to use this platform to turn and shine that light back on her, because I know most people do not know who Tracey Pearlman is or what she means to so many people around the NFL and what she does for the league and its players. So I really appreciate that and the ability to be able to give her her flowers.
Now.
Yeah.
Yeah, she's great people, and we can't thank her enough for being on this podcast. One she's responsible for the podcast, so great person. Thank you guys for listening. It's been an honor, it's been awesome. I'm Peanut, this is my uncle Roman, and this is the NFL Player's Second Act podcast. Appreciate y'all.