The NFL Combine

a kick out of it. I love doing it so much, I say, hey, send me the dms. Don't go into m Rob's dms. We're gonna get your questions. It has been so crazy in terms of East West Shrine Bowl, which I had. You got Pro Bowl, you got Super Bowl, you got get ready for the Combine, which, by the way, our episode today is about the Combine. You got all these things going on. I looked, this is when you know it's bad. I looked at the dms the other day. Okay,

there was a ton of dms. This is God's honest ton of dms with questions praising you, by the way, nothing about me shows great and Rob's awesome, and I'm like, you're sending me the DM, which is part of it. But I will say this, I promise, because I always make it a point to say I get in touch with everyone. I promise at some point I'll get back to you. We're going to continue to roll on the NFL Screen podcast. I'm trying that. By the way. Also, congrats.

How about Kansas City. Yeah, man Chiefs the chiefs Man, big time game. That was a great place man, awesome game. And yes, the Patrick Mahomes followed my Buffalo Bills fans and my Josh Allen. Butsuka comments, Patrick Mahomes is the best play and he got me. Oh my goodness, that was so awesome. But Hurts, he's up there. He is definitely good. There's a reason why he finished second in the MVP voting. By the way, since we're talking about Mahomes and Jalen Hurts, we did do an episode pretty

recently on quarterbacks. The Goat's Mahomes's name did pop into this conversation, so highly encourage you to go back and take a listen to that one. All Right, I already sort of stole the thunder. I said, today's episode is about the Combine, and if you read the comments, you probably already knew that this episode was about the Combine. Your experience. I always say this about the NFL Combine. It is essentially a an underwear modeling competition, is how

I describe it. Is that a fair assessment. It's very fair. And I'm going to be completely honest with you right now. My wife is going to get upset with me because we have gotten into arguments about this. We don't have arguments. We heated fellowship and it started I think about three years ago. My wife was like plastered in front of the TV. I didn't know what was going on, and she was like, Babe, this new show you guys have

on NFL Network Combine or whatever. This thing is, Oh my goodness, And she did this little dance like this, and I'm like, oh, I got upset a little bit, you know what I mean. I had to check myself, my manhood a little bit because I knew where she was getting at some of the top genetic physical specimens in the college game, getting ready for the biggest interview of their lives and going to the National Football League.

But yeah, had to throw it out there. My wife's gonna get a quick little laugh at that, and she'll probably remind me of that when I get back home after she listens to this episode. So here's the true in the India, right like you, you made a living playing professional football as an athlete, you're still in great shape. Here,

I don't have that starting point. We were out the other day and we were watching the NBA All Star Break DK Metcalf coming down and I was like, crazy, yo, he is as like much of a freak zoids maybe there's ever been on the planet. I get the who is that? Oh, let me see? Go to Google images and it's all like and I'm like, what are we doing here? I set the dinner table. This is man, but I opened up the door for it. Your your combine experience didn't sound too positive. It wasn't Yeah, it

wasn't that great of an experience. And it had nothing really to do with the talent evaluators or the teams. To me, it was myself. It was the fact that I was listening to my agent at the time and I didn't work out. I didn't throw at the combat, I didn't run at the combine. I did everything at

my pro day. Just looking back again, hindsight is always twenty twenty looking back, when you see guys like Vince Young, Matt Line of guys like that that worked out and threw, you wish you would have been on the same field

with those guys thrown at the same time. This is not uncommon, though, So why do you have those regrets because I've covered you know, this year, we obviously at our combat coverage on NFL Network, We're going to be airing it all the dudes running their forties, the position groups, the whole thing. I've also covered a ton of pro days over the years. It is not foreign for a guy to not run this forty at the combine and then run on his own college campus. So why so

much of a regret for you? Well, the regret was, okay, we always we gotta put ourselves back what fifteen twenty years because the National Football League, just to me, in my opinion, wasn't ready for a Jalen Hurtzel, Lamar Jackson or Michael Robinson at the time. The scheme hadn't elevated to that yet, and so I was forced to kind of change my position and look at other positions, and so I decided not to throw, and again we had

other quarterbacks throwing. And people have to understand when you're at the combine, it's not just the physical things that

you're doing. I mean, this is a one of the biggest interviews of that these kids will ever go through, and it's really to see these guys and see how they respond and how they react amongst their contemporaries right at the common I remember being there in two thousand and six, finally seeing all the guys I saw on ESPN, all the college you know, Vinch Youngs, the Matt Liners, the Reggie Bushes, all the guys that you you know, you become fans of right and you get to see

him and be around him and operate around him, and just being in those rooms and being in those conversations. I just look back and wish, man, if I could have been, you know, throwing my footballs so that teams are looking at it in comparison to Vinch Young or in comparison to any of the other quarterbacks at the time, maybe I would have got a shot playing quarterback in person. Because it's not it's not just film. It's literally bang

bang bang, like quarterback Goos Quarterbackos. Yeah, it's right there, you know. And the talent evaluators they're all in the stands all around you, some of them all up on the field. And I remember because I did stay for a little bit part of the field workouts in the in the runs, they still call your name. I knew I wasn't gonna run. I told everybody I wasn't gonna run.

Michael Robinson, quarterback, number whatever, whatever. And you have to visually say no, And that does something to you because you gotta step up and say no. In the talent evataways are looking to send up. But I thought you would a beast of the East, Mike rob I thought you was the big ten player of the years. This is this how y'all get down? And yeah I was. I was a little pissed off about that, but I

had already had it. I had already made the decision and had a plan not to run, not to work out, and I didn't want to jump out as that. Keep in mind, there's gonna be three hundred and nineteen total prospects to combine this year. There are only eleven players from non FBS schools. As far as the big name schools. So you can imagine Alabama, Georgia they're sending the most

team and twelve players respectively, Florida, Michigan, LSU, TCU. Here we Gons they're sending nine em Is it about the tape? Is it more about what they do at the combine? Some of the guys might not even be working out, Like how do you separate yourself if you're in this year's class. Well, obviously game tape is gonna be everything, Right,

what did you do when the lights were on? You know, you had to play a game, your university, your team, everybody's rooting for you, everybody's depending on you to do your job. How did you respond and how did you play in those situations? I think that's vitally important, and that's the most important when you go to the combine to I think talent evaluators are just saying, Okay, let me confirm what I saw on tape. Let me I saw this on tape. I saw this kid had great

movement ability, or I saw that he had great football IQ. Okay, let me see in these standard drills, because these are all standard type drills, just a baseline, so that talent and valuators can have a baseline, a value you wait everybody off of. I think they're just coming to the combine to confirm and obviously get to know the prospects. And people don't realize, especially I work with some of these guys coming up at the end of the day. You can make a lot of hay off the field

with these talented value with us. How you speak, how professionally you are with them, looking guys in their eyes, and being truthful, being truthful. I remember I had gotten to a fight in high school or whatever. I had no idea they we're gonna bring it up. But I remember Bill Parcels at the time brought it up. Hey man, you were in this little you know, scadattle when you

were in high school. And I'm like what. And this was just after he asked me what my favorite offensive play was and I told him I liked the curls on the outside of the streets going down whatever. And it just I don't know what kind of threw me for a loop. But don't lie. They know pretty much everything. Okay, So what about the difference between how a guy executes at the combine where it's a little bit of I don't want to say an unsettled environment, but it's new

for these guys. When you're on your home campus for your pro days, it's I mean, it's comfort. You wake up in your bed, you're doing all the things that you're used to. You know, you're saying a lot of the cafeteria person that you usually have pregame meals. You're probably working with the wide receivers. It's your dudes that are out there. Like I would imagine, it is a much more beneficial experience to do well at the pro day compared to the combine. It is because, I mean,

that's your natural environment. You controlled all the controllables and all of those things. But when you're in Indy, when again that environment, they're not a talent Evaluators aren't expecting these athletes to be perfect. Sure, they just want to see you compete. They just want to see you step up to the challenge and go out there and go play. When you go to pro days, now it's on your terms, right, you can go out there and do the things and

set up things just the way you want to. I remember, if you remember just a few years ago to Johnny Menzel Pro Day, how everybody was hooping and hollering about all he had the music, he had to show it, so on he had to pass. He controlled the control bibles and elevated himself and he was taken in the first round. So the pro day is important, But I would say that, especially for people in my situation, that wasn't a surefire top ten type of a pick. You

got to go to the combine and make some noise. Okay. I was in Vegas a couple of weeks back for the East West Shrine Bowl, talk to a bunch of different scouts and this is it was something that I had already known, but it was reiterated again a couple of weeks back. And that's this idea of getting to know the player. I mentioned some of the questions that are going to be asked. What I think is fascinating

is these guys go to Indie. You decide to go out, Well, guess what, like you, M Rob like I might work for the Giants, right, like you might kind of know who I am. Maybe you don't. But then m Rob deceives me and goes, hey, that dude might work for the Giants. I shouldn't be here. I go to the next place. Well, guess what my boy who works for I wouldn't say the Jets, but let's just call he's at that other spot. I get the text message, you'll

m Rob's over here, maybe doing some stuff. I am fascinated by the personality aspect of also understanding now there was a high draft pick top ten guy from last year. I heard the same story twice now from two different people. Hey, this dude was in Indie getting after it at one place. We told him like, might not be the best. Look, went to another spot. Their boys sent to text passions said hey, I saw this guy maybe getting it after

a little bit too hard. I tell young people all the time that's going through this process because you know, a lot of former athletes work with guys. You know, whether our agent brings you in to talk to the group or whatever. And I just tell guys, look, man, this has been one of the longest interview processes of your life. Don't mess it up. You know almost at the bag, man, don't mess it up. Like, why would

you go to Indie and go out that Yams? That wasn't even in my thought process, Like I wasn't even thinking about going out like that. Wasn't even a thing

that was even possible. Let me tell you, I was upset because they told me I had a drug test at five in the morning one day, and I got up at four thirty in the morning unconsciously and use the bathroom, And so I had to drink so much water or whatever in the morning to go take the drug test right before I had to do my official way in, so my weight was inflated and it just totally pissed me off and messed up my day. But at the end of the day, But the point I'm

trying to make you go there for a reason. You're going there for a business trip. You don't go there to go out. I can't believe that guys are doing that. Just anyone who's listening to this podcast, I just want you to just take a moment and listen to what m Rob just said. Using the bathroom at four thirty in the morning messed up something in terms of how you were evaluate. Yeah, I believe so, because again I

wanted to be a certain way. Yeah, I had lost a certain amount of weight I had, you know, I was a certain shape and frame and broad drunks much water before I had to win because I had to. They would not allow you to go through with the rest of your schedule until that drug tests happened. So literally, I'm sitting up in there. There's a couple of other guys I can't remember the name after. I'm just sitting up in there, like, dude, you woke up and yeah, man, I forgot all of us we got I mean, it's

just something that happened. And then the schedule. Then you end up going being late behind everybody to explain to everyone. I pad at four thirty, Yeah I messed up. And they're sitting and and and in my head, I'm thinking, because it's all interview for me, I'm thinking, are they gonna think that I'm that dumb too? Oh? Like, come on, you know what, I'm all the layers around it. It's

all the layers. That's why I said, like, it's kind of fascinating you hear about this small, little innocuous moment that you don't even think about, and then how it kind of dramatically alters things moving forward. All right, Welcome back to the NFL Explained podcasts. Mike Yam and Rob with you and Rob mentioned some of these questions we've heard the crazy ones that are out there. Brandon Vinnie had sent you know some of the list care I

almost don't. I hadn't heard this one. I'm gonna go with it anyway, just because I wasn't aware of this one. How many ways could you use a paper clip? That allegedly was an actual question where you asked that that was a real question. That's what did you use a paper clip? Maybe that must be one of those am I t I Q questions? Right? Trying to normal function to like keep papers together? Yeah, unpick a lock, not that I don't know. I've seen it in movies. Trying

to answer this question right now? And then um, I don't know, like borderline dart, I don't know what else I am questions? Yeah, I mean it was something that was conscious with me when I was getting some of these questions about my grandparents and you know, uh, you know what male is around in the house and things like that. So that's something that really stood out to me. But I mean the big question that I kept on getting was bro Number one, are you married to the

quarterback position? Because we I saw that you led the team and receiving, we saw that you was behind Larry Johnson and rushing to football. One year, we saw that you would back up throwing. I mean, what position do you really want to play? That was a big one in number two. How did you answer that? I answered it. My goal was to be in the National Football League, not be a quarterback in the National Football League, but I would I owe it to myself to give myself

every opportunity to be a quarterback in this league. So all I ask, if you draft me, watch me take snaps, watch me throw the football, and if you deem I need to go to another position, cool, I'll do it. That's such a reasonable response. Did you work on that with your agent? I mean, I imagine like there's preparation, Like you know you're gonna be ask certain questions. When I had my interview at NFL Network, I had an idea of a few things that we're going to be asked.

You you kind of have some thoughts in your head. You knew that question was coming. I knew the question was coming, but something a little deeper. You gotta be real with yourself. And oftentimes I see young people they just real with themselves, like they everybody thinks they're the best and always the best in this that in the third I looked at my situation and I looked, I said, how many quarterbacks that look like me to play the game that I play is in the National Football League

having success? Right now? What minute? I mean? You had Michael Vick, You has some guy And so when you look at it from that situation, you just had to be real with yourself. And I just thought I owed it to myself five years of chasing this quarterback dream in college, that you just give me an opportunity to take a snap after that, if you don't like what you see, I'll do what I need to do to

make a living. Okay, So in the long run, that's probably the right approach, right because you're staying true to yourself and the team that's considering bringing you onto their roster knows what they're getting. Yeah, I'll flip it and say, maybe you're a little too forthcoming, maybe you're a little too honest. You know, I've talked to enough players where you go, is that how you really feel? Or is

that what you were trained to say? And that response right like, don't give them too much straddle defense a little bit. I don't know what general managers and team personnel are thinking like, is that a good thing? Is it a bad thing? If you're the face of my franchise, are you a little bit of a loose cannon where you're gonna be saying stuff that I don't want you to say, And maybe being borning is good. I used

to cover baseball back in the day. You go into the Yankees locker room, Derek Jeter was the worst postgame interview because Derek Jeter wasn't going to say a damn thing and go get you mine, not going to give you anything. One. I used to cover my team, the Mets. You go in there, PA would be friendly with you that you got the kids, you know, running around and

the music going different vibe. But I don't know what's better like, And I don't know how general managers and coaches would sit there and go, hey do I want this on my squad? Well, I think you know the situation. Obviously it has to give context everything, and I think just look at my specific situation. I think teams appreciated the honesty, appreciated that I was able to see myself for truly who I am. Sure you know what I mean.

And oftentimes we get kids who and people in their lives who just keep both of them up, keep pushing them up, keep pushing up. Which is all good. Is okay to have praise and things like that, but at some point you gotta be honest with yourself. And again, like I started by answering this question, By this, my goal was to play in the National Football League, not

being an NFL quarterback. And at the end of the day, those two principles stuck in my head and I wanted to make and guarantee the bag, not necessarily the bag at quarterback. Okay, So then there's the actual drills right right, Like the forty is the one that stands out. I mean, hell, I've done shows this year. I'm still referencing dudes forty times because when it's spectacular and then you see it in real time on the field. How many times have you and I have talked about this on Total Access?

Tarik Wolan goes out there and you're like, yo, he was fast at the combine, and damn that dude might be faster on the football field. Like it's crazy the context around some of this stuff. I don't know. You tell me the drills like forty to me. Sometimes feels completely irrelevant depending on the position. Sometimes it's totally relevant in the situation that I just made reference to Tyreek Wolan.

I think it's relevant in almost every position, honestly, and know people may be sampled, Mike rob I mean, if an offensive lineman has to sprint forty yards like that, your team's probably gonna lose, you know what I'm saying, Like, if you got to do it that much work. But when you look at the forty with the big guys, you're really were looking at the first ten yards, You're really looking at the get off, You're really looking at

different aspects of the forty. And people have to understand we have to have some type of uniform way to basically test guys for just basic athleticism. And I think that's what the forty does. That's what the change of direction drills do. And then when you get into the fieldwork, obviously it goes more into your position specific types of areas. But uh yeah, I think the command does a good job. But if at least showcasing the athleticism of the genetics

we have in our league. Okay, so basic athleticism depending on positioning group, I'm gonna throw a group of your way. You just tell me what the drill matters the most. Quarterback seems obvious to me. But it was obvious too, I would say throwing right, job, I was nervous, shut shuttle subtly, So are you kidding me? Let's go no throwing and obviously accuracy ball placement, um, how fluid the

ball comes out of your hands. But I will say this, what guys like Lamar Jackson, what guys like Jalen Hurts um. Some people can put justin fields in this category. I think the forty and the movement skills are gonna start to become more and more important for evaluating that position, because again, the more that position runs, the more of this game becomes eleven on eleven. All right, I love the forty. Can I have a little confession here? What's my favorite thing to watch when I go to any

of the pro days? Or the words? Really? Yeah, I don't know why because you know when I was a kid, and was I the only kid who did this? But you'd walk through a doorway and like you just try to hit the top of the doorway. But I don't call my wife all the time. Yes, like the problem is like a three sixty. So, like you know, I used to go when I lived on the East Coast and I was closer to family, you know, the Fisher Price.

I was a Fisher Price all Star man with my little cousins dunking on the Now one of them is like my height. I'm like son of a man once you get good. It's happen genetics, not on our side of the family, his dad's side anyway. Besides the point, but the vert's always cool to me because it just reminds me of my childhood. And I do think that there's some of the fact that I really can't jump

all that high and the knees aren't there anymore. But wide receiver, tight end, Like, I don't know how important the vertical is for some of those guys. Maybe it is, But are there some other drills that if you were evaluating, you'd say, hey, I need my wide receiver or tight

end to be really good in this drill. The vert and the broad to me, that correlates to the explosiveness that you'll see maybe in the start of their forties or maybe really yeah, maybe because just think about it, you're not running, you're just seeing how far you can jump from a stand still, and it just shows explosiveness. And this is not the exact science, but I feel like if you look back on some of the biggest, you know, broad jumps and verts, they're gonna have some

of your fastest times. I mean to me that that that's just if you're super explosive off a single leg or both legs, it's gonna make you move faster. Old line, old line. What I got for the old line ten yards splitting the forty very important, very very important. I will go again to the broad jump and obviously the old line change of direction drills, and again I go to broad jump, and this is just for me. I go to those drills because it shows the bend in

the hips. It shows the explosiveness from the biggest muscle in there in these kids bodies, the hips, and it oftentimes shows how powerful they can be at moving people off the ball, because again, if they can sink and get in their hips and be explosive from their hips, they can move people. Is it the same exact thing just on the flip side for the D line pretty much? I mean that's a big but two sumo wrestlers going

back and forth, just pushing weight back and forth. But for the d line, and I do like to see them kind of run the whole forty and just see what their delta time the last twenty yards would be, and just see how they finish. It really is spectacular when some of those dudes can Also You're like, how does it dude that big run that fact? It's amazing.

It is really amazing, yams to see six six, six seven, two ninety pounds run four to five and people don't realize, like a Kuombolt and one of the greatest receivers our league has ever seen, ran a four six four six is not slough, you know what I'm saying. It's actually fast. But we get so enamored with these fast times and things like that we don't necessarily realize it. dB. Similar

to what you would say for the wide receivers. Yeah, obviously for defensive backs being able to track the football while it's in the air. Like you look at dbs and wide receivers right, like they're the same, dude, one can catch one camp. Yeah, that's how we look at them and see the differentiation. And oftentimes the great defensive backs are the guys that can catch I e. Richard Sherman,

former wide receivers. So they have a great They do a great job at tracking the football, and you won't see them flip their hips and getting it out of breaks. To see how fluid they are in the hips. It's gonna let you know how fast they can break on out driving routes. Twenty years ago, if I asked you about linebackers, would your answer be the same as it is today. No, man, I think the lineback I think we're seeing a transformation of the linebacker position. It happened

right before eyes. Obviously, you have the outside guys who are basically pass rushers, right they rushed the passer, you know. Sometimes Von Miller's an outside linebacker in his defense. And then you got the stand up inside type of linebackers like the Roquan Smiths and guys like that. I do think it takes different skill sets for those guys. Now. Again, twenty years ago, they were more thumpers, more bangers, and I think now you have to see movement ability from

those guys. What about the dudes out of the backfield running backs? Oh my gosh, right, my guys. Right, I think the forty is important for running backs. I want to see whether this guy's gonna make defensive coordinator stay

up all night. And what I mean by this, there's a lot of running backs who can put the ball in the right place and get the number of yards the play was designed to be blocked for sure, right you know, seventy power going to the left, pulling the guard that plays usually going to get you between I don't know, four to six yards, you know what I mean. If your back has got something with him, he can get ten to twelve. If he's really special, he'll get through.

If you got a running back that's in that four four four three range, and when he gets to the second level he can pull away from defensive backs. That's what scares defensive coordinators. And so yeah, look at the forty drill obviously the running back change of direction, types of drills, and can he catch out of the backfield. If he can catch out of the backfield, I don't

have to sub him on third down. I was working with Lt. Ladamian Thominson the other day and someone asked him this question in one of our meetings, and I'm curious how you would respond to this. How do you measure a running back and pass pro. Is there a drill? Is there something that's specific at the combine because it's such a huge part and we always talk about the physical attributes of these guys and what you just characterize

running down field. Is there a burse where there's real separation, because that's going to create a nightmare for a defensive coordinator and for the dudeis try to track him down. But passpor is such an important part of the game, and these guys are asked to do it, it almost feels like you're not doing anything at the comboy to measure that you can't. Yeah, that's what you can't. You cannot do a drill to measure whether a guy can

be great at pass pro. And I think that's why you see some of the elite backs you'll come into our league struggle with pass pro at first, because oftentimes in college they're never asked, they not asked to do a lot of it. And be honest, witche jams. In the National Football League, the only time you go live passpro. You may get it, you know, two or three times during training camp, sure, and then you're in the game, and that's really the only time that you can do it.

But uh yeah, that's tough man. One of my favorite words for the draft is twitchy. Like if you played the game at home, anytime you heard the word twitchy, it'd be a whole lot of fun. It is a little bit of a cliche. But coming up next, we'll talk about some of the specific traits for players and why some of those twitchy type words are actually important. That's coming up next on NFL Explained. Back here on the NFL's Playing Podcast, Mike Am and my Super Bowl

champ Michael Robinson, we continue to discuss the combine. Quarterback height seems to be a little bit of question mark and in this year's draft, and we're gonna see him at the combine and Bryce Young from Alabama in the top three at his position. He's six feet tall. It just maybe a little on the shorter end. I see you kind of like, that's a little on the shorter end. But but Yams and I don't know, I'm following the comment, bro, But to me, it's not the height with Bryce Young,

it's about the heart. That's That's what I've been telling people for years. Well, honestly, it's it's the one hundred and ninety four taking a beating. That's what scares me. It's not necessarily height. We've seen Russell Wilson five eleven six feet in that six foot range still be able to operate in an Ask footballleague. Colin Murray, again, he's a shorter guy, but these guys are thicker lower body. These guys are a little bit more compact, and they

can kind of handle the riggers. Look, when you're a shorter guy, oftentimes in your protection, you gotta find the throwing lane. For instance, when you look at that Super Bowl Super Bow forty nine, Malcolm Butler intercepted that pass from Russell Wilson. Sure, if you look at the pass that was the passing lane, Russell really couldn't see or he wouldn't be able to throw over anybody that was the passing lane. That protection was designed so that the

lane was where the slant was. And so that's what you have to do with the shorter guys. In that same game, you saw Tom Brady throw over somebody to hit Julian Edelman for a touchdown. When you have height, you can throw over guys and it allows you to play quarterback a little bit better. Okay, so flip at them what's the advantage if you're a shorter guy, because look, the reality is we don't not every dude to six

to five and you know flamethrower out there. Well, the advantages you get lost man defensive guys, these big six six six five defensive guys trying to get after guys like a Russell Wilson, Coller Murray and guys like that too. A little bit shorter, they're actually able to get out of trouble a little bit better. But yes, oftentimes when they get a little bit of pressure, they have to retreat and move so that they can see. That's what

that's what happens if we have a smaller quarterback. But again it's the one hundred ninety four pounds because I don't mean to say this because he went to Alabama as well, but I look at two what six foot two hundred and seventeen pounds. I don't think he's two hundred seventeen pounds. I stood next to him when he when they played in that Buffalo game. I didn't think

he was that big. And again, his issue has been protecting himself from hitting the ground, something that I think they're gonna have to look at Okay, I want to throw another measurable your way at the quarterback spot. It was a huge conversation a season ago. You know exactly where I'm going with this, Kenny Pickett, we heard about hand side got little hands. Broka. I'm just saying, dog, all right, I'm gonna throw this your way. How about this,

statistically speaking, Russell Wilson notoriously large hands? Right? Okay, you would know you were teammates with him. I don't rush shook his hands. Russell can dap you b and his middle finger hits your elbow. Okay, So what you're saying is not small hands for Russo. But how about this now? Alex Smith? Also, Um, this was a conversation around Alex Smith back in the day when he was drafted by

the Niners. Wilson, who's got the large chance that you made reference to in a large you know, middle finger that would my elbow? Okay? A career fumble rate that's higher than Smith's. Are we getting off the rails here? Yes we are. He's taken a few or more sacks. But are we making too much of a bigger deal when it comes to a hand size for a quarterback? Um?

I'm gonna say yes and no. Yes, we are making a little bit of a bigger deal because it's not like every quarterback had the biggest hands in the world. You know, there's been successful quarterbacks that has smaller hands. Michael Vick has smaller hands. That's one of the knocks on me. They keble saying, man, your hands are like Michael Vings Man, you got runner hands. I'm like, whatever

the hell that means? Um when you when you look at these quarterbacks with the with the bigger with the bigger hands, that's when you get the weird at arm angles and the Patrick Mahomes and Josh Allen crazy throws, and you know, you see the Russell Wilson looked like

he's at short stop throwing the football. Sometimes, to me, when a guy has larger hands, whether doesn't affect him, height doesn't affect him as much getting the ball out and slinging the football, and having Aaron Rodgers another one, having being able to get the ball out of weird arm angles. They that just doesn't affect these guys. Okay, So lengths to me in certain spots makes all the

difference in the world than it becomes obvious. I was talking to a coach a couple weeks ago, college coach who was telling me about one of his guys who will see it the combine and his length and how important it was, and I watched him in up practices in Vegas. I'm like, damn, that coach wasn't lying like this. This dude is freaking long. From a lineman standpoint, offensive line,

I always talk about the reach of these guys. How important is that reach because in some instance we're talking about like an inch half an inch, Like, is it that meaningful? It's huge? No kidding, yeah, I mean think about it. If you a guy out six six sixty seven and you put your arms out and you're leaning a little bit and you're blocking somebody and you're fully extended, you're that much further away from the quarterback. It makes the guy run that much further. I'm talking about offensive

lineman having to get to the quarterback. And people don't realize, Yes, offensive line play and trench play it's a very physical affair. But when you talk to any offensive line coach or anybody that that's played in the trenches, it's all about hands, it's all about arms, it's all about that punch. The defensive guys are so much more athletic. You just want to get him like stopped for a second, and that punch it does just that. So yeah, I mean length

for all offensive linement vitally important. And I can even go for the pass rushers too, being able to have those long arms to be able to shed an offensive linement and disengage. That's what the length means for defensive players. Just real quick on the length of some of these players. When you look at a guy and you know that he's long, have you ever been fooled? Because sometimes I look at it, dude, and I go, he's really long, And then you see the measurables after and I go, what, Like,

he looks bigger than what he actually is. It doesn't make sense to me. Well, first of all, is a guy slouched over? And how's it with this posture? Looked like? Look, all of those things can affect what a guy looks like as opposed to his actual measurables. But I mean, this game is about genetics. This game is about being physically dominant, and if you're a guy that can move right and you have length, a coach is going to find a place for you. That's just what this game

is all about. And Rob, you know the point that I'm bringing up I'm being fooled is there's been multiple dbs where I see how long their arms are and I think to myself, oh my god, the length is kind of crazy here. And yet I see the wingspan when they get measured at their prote or their combine, and it's not always matching up. But the importance of that length for me just keeping guys wide receivers at bay coming off the line, extending out like there's some

obvious functionality. Absolutely, and look where a defensive back, if he lacks some footspeed, the length is vital. And I always go to my good friend Richard Sherman. Richard Sherman is not gonna go out here and beat Tyreek Hill and running. But the thing about Sherman is because he's so long, and guys like him a Brandon Browner at

some point Tyreek woolin now with the Seahawks. Because they're so long, they can actually wait a second longer when they're defending a guy, meaning they can wait until they actually see the ball about to come out because they have the length to catch up. Meaning again not necessarily the foot speed, but they have the length that if they were within a step or two, they can get to the football. And that's that's vier Lymport. I love that.

I've never heard this, but recovery length. Can I coin that? Go ahead? Oka is about recovery speed. I've never heard covery length. Yeah, I'm gonna start explaining. Yo, I gotta I'm doing draft coverage NFL dot Com this year again. I'm telling you, I'm I'm throwing that. I'm gonna say. It's gonna sound like like I'm I'm DJ recovery length. That's gonna be one of my teams at some point. I like that. I do want to get into some of the numbers in the science behind what we're discussing here.

One study from the University of Utah found that the first ten yards of a running backs forty yard dash time was predictive of their yards per carry in the NFL, which I don't know if that surprises you. Were not, But another study from sports scientists at the University of Rhode Island found that the broad jump was a decent indicator of successive running backs d ns and defensive tackles. You're throwing up your hands. You're like, yeah, man, I got through broad jump out there a few times. Man.

Because again, if you're explosive off your individual legs like that, man, it makes you, It makes your speedster. And then over at UCLA, how about this from a quarterback perspective, they determined that NFL success it only found one true correlation. Check this out, a quarterback's height and their future completion percentage. Really yeah, maybe it becomes some of those easier throws that you were talking about, not having to rely on

some of those throwing lands. I don't know, but the folks, the smart folks at u CELA said, that's that's what the deal makes sense. So a lot of analysis to unpack here. I'm gonna brass taxes or I'm gonna ask you to do that. Gmcap On, dudes got great tape combined in person when you're there it's okay or the dude just got okay tape and just wows you at the combine. Which how do you balance those things? Man, that's a good question. I mean, that's the rub of

why you're a general manager or a talent evaluator. I value game tape more because again, when you ask any football player, they don't want to miss games. They don't care about practice, right, Well, some of guys don't care about practice. They do not want to miss games. Guys want to show up and show out in the biggest situations.

And so for me, if I'm evaluating a guy, I gotta see what he looked like when he was all motivated and ready to go out there and do his job on his level, right, I just want to see him comfortable there. And that's why I value game tape. I really do, yams. You you can't just make your draft picks or your draft analysis solely based off the combine. There's just it's not real football being played, it's it's

drills being done so that you can evaluate. I've always thought that used the combine to enhance your thoughts on a player or take away like the personality thing to me is really important because I look in a day and age where character actually matters, or I think it does.

To me that face to face interaction, like I already seen what you can do on game film when when bullets are alive, I want to know how you are, how you're going to represent an organization, which is why a lot of these teams, as you mentioned earlier, know about all the stuff that you were doing before even got to your don't lie about any of that stuff. Many already know it. Bottom line here combine, we absolutely love it. We're going to have complete coverage Do not

Miss exclusively on NFL Network. Coverage Thursday, March second at three pm goes through Sunday, March fifth, which means if you're sending those dms with questions you can you can say some nice things about the show. I might be a little slow to respond to my apologies and Rob terrific job is always I'm my Kem. I always appreciated our crew help us out in an immense way. Thanks so much for listening.