Hi everyone, I'm Katie Curic and this is next question. It's hard to remember now, but in the early days of the pandemic, back in March of before shelter and place orders were widespread, before putting on a mask to go outside was as habitual as slipping on your shoes. COVID nineteen was a virus that seemed to only affect older people or those with underlying health conditions. Even if the young and vibrant did get sick, it seemed as though it wasn't any worse than recovering from a bad flu.
But as we all now know, no one was truly safe from COVID nineteen, and one of the earliest to sound that alarm was Los Angeles fitness trainer Amanda Klutes. I know my husband with of nothing more than to go on a beautiful walk through Laurea Canyon. He would love them, so do it for these people. They can't do it right now because in mid March, Amanda's husband, then Nick Cordero, was feeling run down and taking frequent naps several hours a day. I'm sitting outside of Cedar
sign A hospital right now. And when his health quickly declined and he was forced to go to the hospital. Amanda started sharing updates on Instagram. I just finished my daily visit to go stand outside and play Nick song and sing and pray and talk to him from Afar. Within days of being admitted, Nick was on a ventil later and in a medically induced coma. So yes, my husband is in the I see you and Yes. By
mid April his leg was amputated. He has to pull through because all of this was his plan, l a moving, buying a first home. By July, he was gone, hug your loved ones, because I'm telling you, when I get to hug Nick again, it's going to be like the best in my life. Nick was just forty one years old. He was a Tony nominated Broadway star, an aspiring musician, and a new dad. That is the short version of
the story. The long and truly moving version of that pandemic tragedy is now a memoir called Live Your Life, My Story of Loving and Losing Nick Cordero. It was written by Amanda Clutes with the help of her sister Anna, and I was lucky enough to talk to Amanda about Nick, the writing process, the heartbreak, and the healing. Amanda I hate even asking you to relive this, but you know, and I followed you so closely as you told your story, really courageously and so openly, which I want to ask
you about in a moment. But can you just tell people what happened to because his diagnosis was so shocking and discombobulating and confusing, and it was in the early days of the pandemic. And of course I wonder now if you know, when with my husband's illness, I think, why didn't I recognize this? Why didn't I see this? Why didn't I appreciate that this was happening to his body? And and you all were I think, I mean it was a bit of magical thinking, but also just a
lack of understanding about this this virus. So tell me about Nick. When he first got sick, he was just really, really tired, sleeping all the time, and honestly, Katie, to a lack of knowledge about the hospital and care and what being in the i c U means and everything that they have to do in I see, I had no clue. I was so green about everything. Um, yes, Nick, Um, you know, we still don't know how he got COVID. We will never know this it's impossible to trace, you know.
We can think about we were in New York City, this was the beginning of March. Um, he was around a lot of people, around a lot of Broadway people, but he was also around me and my entire family and all of our friends. Um, the whole two weeks that we were in New York and no one got COVID, you know, so that's you know, so then you think, okay, then he got it on the flight back to l A. But then he was only two days after that flight that he started having symptoms. So that doesn't really even
correlate the math. So, um, we'll never know that piece. But yes, it just started with Nick being really tired, and I thought it was a couple of things. I thought, you know, maybe he's depressed. His show, um is closed because of COVID. We're in this how use um and we have nowhere to go. Um, he can't create, he can to do the things that he loved to do, his music. He was really working on his music. So I thought, you know, he's just depressed and jet lagged,
and so yes, go sleep. And I feel bad now because I was, you know, taking pictures of him and sending them to my sisters and being like next taking another nap. Don't worry, I'm just here, you know, with Elvis. You know, um, and I feel like you said, it's like, I feel so bad about that now. I didn't recognize that anything was wrong because he literally was just sleeping.
He didn't have a cough, he didn't have a fever, he didn't ache nothing, And those were all the signs that you were seeing on the news, and trust us, we were watching the news like every other person in
the world. Seven Um. It wasn't until he fainted one morning and was kind of really out of sorts that I took him to an emergency room and or sorry and urging care, and the urgent care did all these tests for flu, but not COVID because he didn't have any COVID symptoms and he wasn't around anyone that had COVID. And at that time, again super early in March, you couldn't get a COVID test unless you had the symptoms
or if you were around somebody that attested positive. Nick had neither, so they didn't do a COVID test on him. They took an X ray of his lungs, which now I know from being in the hospital days that his lungs looked terrible, like when it looks like charge of glass. So but you know, again didn't know. Nick and I looked at this X ray and they said, you know, he looks it looks like you have pneumonia, is what Urgin Care said. And they said, if you get better, um,
we're gonna give you some drugs. Hopefully we'll get better. If you don't get better, go to the emergency room on Monday, over the weekend. With all the drugs that they gave him, he was even worse and it got really bad. He couldn't breathe. He was having really a really hard time breathing and he was using um and
hailer that they had prescribed him. So that the Sunday night before I took him to the emergency room, we called our good friend who is a brain like one of the top brain surgeons at Cedar Sinai, and he said the breathing issues, that that sound good. You should take him right away. And I said, well as the morning. Okay, you know, we have this little boy and he's sleeping and I don't know how to you know, he said, Okay, but just the first thing in the morning. So we did.
We took him to the emergency room first thing in the morning, and I dropped nick off. I thought I'd pick him up in two hours. Um, you know, I I look back on that moment, I honestly don't remember what we said. I didn't kiss or hug him because we we didn't know what he had. And again, like in those early days, it was like, don't leave your house, you're gonna get COVID. You you know, if somebody's sick,
don't even go near him. And we had Elvis, and I was still breastfeeding Elvis and you know, taking care of him. So I didn't hug him, I didn't kiss him. I dropped him off at the corner our Cedar SINAI. Um, I don't even know if he said goodbye to Elvis. I mean, we really thought i'd pick him up in a couple of hours. I went for a walk, and of course, you know, those hours turned into they want
to keep me overnight. They did a COVID test. That turned into that morning, Um, they're taking me to the i c U. My my organs aren't getting enough oxygen. And then the next day they want to, you know, put me under and put me on the ventil lator. So upsetting to read that, Amanda, because obviously things just spiraled.
But when you write about Nick just basically waving to you on the curb and you saying goodbye, without any kind of idea that this was going to be the last time you saw him outside a hospital setting and the last time he was him, you know, because I saw him again, of course, but he couldn't he could bear even opened his eyes, you know, on a good day he could open his eyes. So and uh, yeah,
it's it's it's so hard. I I hate thinking about that moment, and it only makes me every time I say goodbye to Elvis, even if his nanny is just taking him to music class, I hug and kissed that little boy and let him know I love him, because you just never know. I mean, life is just That's one thing I learned this past year is how fragile life is. And now you just never know. And you
can't take it for granted. When you went to see him when he was going to be put on a ventil later, uh, he was quite out of it, as you said. His h you know, you describe him as sleeping with his eyes sort of half open, which was scary and disturbing, I know. But he did tell you that he was scared, didn't he. Well, that was Um, that was actually a beautiful moment. So I that was at four o'clock in the morning, he called me. They want and he said, they want, they want to put
me on a ventilator. Um. And uh and I said, oh, okay, again not really fully even understanding what it was. I really didn't. I don't even think Nick did. Um. And you know, in the I c you that's so formulaic that you know, it's it's nothing to them. And so um. When he called to tell me that I had elvis in my arms, it was four o'clock in the morning, I was like, okay, honey. Um. You know, they said they'll it'll be a couple of days at the most
seven days. Um. But this is just so that my body can rest and I can get better and and they can you know, get oxygen really into my body and my organs. And so we said, I love you. And that's the last time I heard, you know, I heard Nick speak. The beautiful moment was later on in the hospital. UM, towards the end. I was sitting there one day with Nick's mother and a nurse walked into the room and he said, are you Amanda And I said yes, and he said, oh my gosh, I've been
trying to find you. I heard that you had been visiting Nick. He said, I want to let you know. I'm the nurse that was with Nick when they put him on the ventilator, And of course, like I was already bawling, and he said he said, um, that Nick was really scared, and that um, that he was really scared that he would never see his wife A kidding in So, I mean, at the moment, it was actually a beautiful moment. It's kind of like, really sad to
think about. But when the nurse came in to tell me that, it was just like I was by nixt side, I was holding his hand, and I just like I
was so happy that I was there with him. What it's must be So, I mean, first of all, what you've been through is incredibly traumatizing on its own, but the circumstances not being able to see him then I know they did let you come in and see him ultimately, but I mean to feel so I think you feel powerless and helpless under the best of circumstances when someone you love is sick, and then when you cannot be there physically, it must have been maddening and just so
I don't even know if there's a word for it, Amanda, so frustrating and so um infuriating. I don't even know, as I said, how to describe that feeling you must have had not being able to be there to to support him and to comfort him and to help him. Yeah. No, and it was it was really hard too, because you know, again you you in retrospect, I have a slightly different you know, feeling in the moment as a wife, you know, and as a mother. Um, I was. I was maddening.
It was very frustrating. And you know, how can you not let me in this hospital right now? I don't go anywhere I'm safe, I've been tested, I don't have COVID. Um. I need to be by him. Nick needs his people, you know, his person, he needs support um. And of course, you know, I argued every day, and it was it was such a struggle with the hospital and at the
time very very hard to understand. Now looking back on it, I have of course, I mean I always had admiration and appreciation to those doctors and nurses, but now looking back on it, having you know, that experience, um, I'm of course, I'm so grateful to them for even letting me in during during this time and everything that was going on, and how on a daily basis, anybody that entered that hospital was a asked to the patients and
to the doctors and nurses. So it's so hard, Katie, because like, yes, at the time, I was filled like anger, battle every day with anyone I could just to try to walk through those doors. And you know, the security at Cedar Sine at the time was like the White House. It was like you aren't getting it. Um, So it was a it was a struggle, but um, you know, of course they needed it to be that way, and of course they needed to protect anyone and everyone that
was there risking their lives with this whole pandemic. So it was, yeah, it was a battle every day. You know, I'm thinking about Nick because he had no underlying conditions. He was a very healthy person. He uh you know, took good care of himself, right, he was in great shape. And you know, it's just such a mystery why what was it about his biology? And I'm asking this rhetorically that that created this situation where this virus was so
devastating to him. And it's it's still a mystery, isn't it. Yes, it certainly is because you know, like you said, he had no pre existing health conditions, and on top of that, he was even somebody that never really had to go to the doctor. He never got a cold, he you know, never had the flu. I mean it just you know, I'm I'm always at the doctor. I've always had things, you know, I've had a thyroid disorder since I was in sixth grade. I mean I'm always the one that
like has the issues. And and then you know, and then this happened to him. I mean, yes, super healthy, forty one years old and um, you know, had everything in life waiting for him. You know, I don't know, there's all the things. You know, of course that we all heard blood types, um, the fact that he was um Latino. You know, it hit the Hispanic community. I mean, we went through all of it, and I asked, you know, next doctors every single time, and their answer every single
time was, we don't know. We don't know why this virus sometimes really gets to somebody, and why sometimes you don't have any symptoms, and why one person in the household will get it but nobody else will, and then
that whole household, everybody will get it. Nobody knows. And they also said, that's what's making this so hard about helping people and and and and being here right now dealing with all these people's um, you know, issues at the moment, because they couldn't There was no recipe, do you know what I mean, Like, not one thing worked for everybody. It's so it was. It was the wild wild West at the time. We'll be taking a short break, but when we come back, grief in the age of Instagram.
That's right after this. I have had sort of a weird day, super emotional and tired, and I kind of just feel like the wind is knocked out of me. I just feel like if he hears his music, if he hears us playing his music, you know, that'll ground him. To wake him up, because the doctor said it's all about we got to wake him up. So you guys, he did get another great report from the doctor. Things
are just slightly looking better. I'm gonna tell you guys some more Nick stories because I have so many people praying for him. It's so sorry. Um, just like a beautiful story. My husband has been in the ICU for ninety one days. We don't know if he will make it. I hope and pray every single day in my life
that he does. You went through the whole process and this whole journey very publicly on Instagram, and I, like so many other people watched you and I'm curious why why you decided to do that and how you found the courage to do it, because I know it wasn't easy. I mean, we could see how difficult it was on many days, and you were asking people to pray for Nick and giving people updates and there it was profoundly personal. And did you just did you just feel like you
needed that outlet? How did that kind start? And when did you decide I'm going to just be really honest and real on social media about what I'm going through. Well it started because, um, you know, Katie, I have this fitness business that I run, and so I'm you know, before all of this happened, I had fifty thou followers on Instagram. But um, to those fifty thousand followers, I was always on Instagram, always promoting fitness in my life and showing Elvis and you know Nick, and you know
anything that happened with Nick and I are wedding. You know, Um, I was already very public, but to that small amount of people, and um, when Nick got sick and I took him to the hospital and then when he was in the ICU, I originally got on Instagram and and started talking about it because I thought, well, first of all, I can't be on Instagram, am being this fitness person, but have this other part of my life happening and not be honest about it. It It felt like I would
be living a lie. So I felt like I had
to at least address it. And then, but more importantly was the fact that I felt like to somebody who is sitting at home watching the news and hearing what was happening, and hearing the symptoms that were COVID symptoms, but then my husband's laying in the i c U and he didn't have any of these symptoms, I thought, you know, I have to I have to talk about this because if there's anyone else laying on their couch just tired, maybe they should, you know, listen and and
get checked and tested because this this might be a symptom too. Um. So you know, I thank God that that I did that, just because I feel like it helped a lot of people just be aware of the situation. And and then of course, like things just you know, snowballed. And in eighteen days, Nick was you know, had died, lost a leg, was on ecmo um and barely surviving
in eighteen days. So it kind of just really quickly snowballed again when I when I look back, because in the moment, I was just kind of um in fighter mode, you know, and and as I was sharing things that the response from people was so comforting. The kindness, the prayers, the support, the food on our doorstep, the you know, any anything. I mean, it was it was crazy how generous people were being, and it was so helpful. It
was really helping me. And then I realized in writing this book that when I look back at sharing my story and why I probably kept continuing doing it was because it was literally therapy for me. Every single day I was on I was talking it out. Something would happen and I would just talk it out. Number one role a therapist will do, just talk talk what happened, write it down or talk it out. So every day I was just being completely honest and open talking everything
that was happening. It was it was literally like I was giving myself therapy every day. I didn't realize I was doing that until my girlfriend, who was studying to be a therapist, said to me after we wrote after I wrote the book, she goes, you know you you you did like what a therapist would tell you to do if if if they were giving you advice to like, okay, just day one, what happened, And she was, you did
that every single day for yourself. So she said, you're kind of if if I were looking for a therapist for you, you kind of need to look for somebody who can work backwards because you've already done a lot of the work that a therapist would tell you to do first and foremost talk about it and then write it down. She goes, so you talked about it and now you've written it down. So she was like, I don't I don't know how to treat you. I don't
know what to tell you to do. Um, But I realized now it was therapy and and and asking people for help and asking people for prayers, the medical advice I got every day, the doctors from all over the world that we're reaching out to me. I mean, it was it was I could not have gotten through those days without that love and support. I really couldn't have. And I do believe I truly believe Nick felt it
in the hospital. I really do. You were asked, I know, about writing a book, Amanda, two weeks after Nick died, and I just I can't imagine being approached about that and being ready to kind of talk about what you had been through. But you wanted to and you were ready, or maybe you weren't, but you decided to try tell me about the process you went through when it came to writing this book, or actually deciding you would write
a book. Um. Well, Actually Harper's HarperCollins reached out to me end of June, so before Nick passed, and um, she, Lisa Sharky reached out to me and she said, I've been following this story and she said, um, it needs to be written down. It's a piece of history, I believe, and this story is just remarkable. And she said, I don't even care how it ends. Um, I just think it's important that you write it down and I was
leaving the hospital. I was like, you know, I couldn't during that time, like my mind was so just all over the place, of course, and I said, well, oh my, and I'm you know, I don't even I don't I'm not a writer. And she said, no, what we would get somebody to help you write it, and and I didn't have a lit agent, and so I said, well,
you know, let me think about this. I reached out to Gabrielle Bernstein, who had been following the story and had been kind of uh writing to me over Instagram, any kind of things that she can do to help. So I reached out to her. She got on the phone with me and she said, um, I'm gonna put you in touch with my lit agent, and I think you should do this. I think you should do this.
And I said okay. And I quickly thought of, you know, if I if I want somebody to write this with me, and I'm gonna need somebody to write this with me. I needed to be my little sister. Um. So I pitched Anna to HarperCollins, and after reading just a snippet of how she writes, she's an incredible writer. They were
like yes, of course, Oh my gosh. And I said, you know, Anna has been not only with me through this whole battle, she's been in the hospital with me, but she also was a huge part of um, my relationship with Nick. She was on our honeymoon, part of our honeymoon with us. I mean, she's he must have loved that. I did. No, Actually, we had a we had an epic honeymoon that I'm honestly like, thank god
we did that. And and the bit that Anna was on actually was a good amount of friends we were with and it was so great, it was so great. But um, she was such a part of our lives and so um, you know, was the perfect person to do this with. And um, you know Nick passed and they they And by no means we're pressuring me to start writing. But I went to Ohio with my parents just to kind of decompress and have like some time, and I put Elvis to bed one night and I
just started writing. Um. And again, I think it was that whole thing of be myself therapy. And I didn't even know I was doing it. Um, I'm so glad I did. I would write till one o'clock in the morning. Through tears. I mean there were sometimes I couldn't even see the keyboard or what I was typing because I
was crying so hard. And I would stay up till like one or two o'clock in the morning, and I would just kind of, you know, just right um, not really even knowing, you know, what I was writing necessarily, And I started sending things to Anna, and Anna started kind of putting it into something and and that's kind
of how we started writing this book together. And it was a really magical experience and and I think for both of us, really cathartic, because you know, Anna was such a part of this story, and I think it
really helped us both to process everything. And I'm really glad I started writing it when I did, because I'm sure you could understand, Katie, Like everything was so fresh in my mind, the numb verst, the medical terms, the dates, like I knew the dates, what the hospital looked like, everything sort of the layout of the hospital, almost, the smell of the hospital, the room numbers, the names of nurses, I mean, like everything, the medications, Like I mean, you
had I had it in my brain. It was so there. If you asked me to write this book. Now, I couldn't do it. I don't have that memory. Unless I had written things down, I would not have been able to member, like, remember the details in this book are so just there there because it was so fresh in my memory. And I'm so glad that I just put my pen to paper or my fingers to the keyboard because it needed to be written down, especially for Elvis.
I'm so glad this book exists for Elvis because it really like I think we'll give him a lot of piece one day too, I'm sure. And I think the process is so interesting, Amanda, because Anna was in Paris and you were in California and Ohio. I guess both, um and so you would write and and so you had a time difference, and and I guess when she'd
wake up, she'd kind of how did that work? It actually ironically worked out great when when I brought her on board for this project, she was just about to leave for Paris, and I thought to myself, Anna, I don't know how we're gonna do this, Like I think you should stay in Laurel Canyon with me and let's like write this book and then you go to Paris. And she, you know, was just adamant about getting back to Paris rightfully. So um, and I'm so glad she did.
But it actually worked out perfectly because as she was waking up, I was going to bed, so I was just finishing, you know, whatever I was finishing, and I would press send and literally I'd like pull the covers over me, and I'd get a text message from her going, I just woke up, sister, or I saw your email. I'm on it. And so then she would work all during the day and then by the time I would wake up, I would have her notes, and so that after I put Elvis down for bed, I could start
on her notes. It really flowed so well. And then we would get on the phone and FaceTime or you know, chat if we needed to kind of like go through details, or I would say to her a lot like, um, you know, actually, Anna, that's not right, or that's not what I was thinking, or you know, she knows me so well. I mean, we we used to call Nick and she would pick up the she would call him and pretend to be me and he wouldn't even know. I mean, that's how she. She sounds like me, talks
like me. I mean, we finished these other sentences. So a lot of times she would write something and and I would be like, oh my gosh, Anna, like I can't like it's like you were inside my brain. And then other time she would I would be like, that's actually not what I was thinking. He's like, oh okay, man, It's like, okay, tell me. And so we had a lot of beautiful moments, and then a lot of times where I would go to bed sobbing and she would text me and she would say, Sister, I know I
went to bed sobbing too. Um, I can't believe this happened. And I would write back, I can't believe this happened either. It doesn't seem real. And um, you know because you write this that you write it down, especially Katie, like when you read the book, all of the things that are so weird, all the coincidences, all the people that started coming into our lives, it just like it doesn't
seem real, you know. And so a lot of times we would be writing something and we would just say like, this doesn't seem real, and yet we know it was. We lift it, but it just doesn't seem real. Still, and the dedication you write for Nick, now you know your story for Elvis. Now you have his story. I'm curious because you're very honest about some of your struggles with Nick um and were you ever tempted Amanda with Anna to kind of um given almost sanitized version of
of Nick. Because this is going to be a real lesson and kind of an education for Elvis. And I'm curious how you weighed those two things about being you know, showing Nick as a complete human being flaws and all. Yeah, well, I mean we all have flaws. I mean one of my biggest flaws through you know, my relationship with Nick was and I you know, hate myself for it, Um, but I never really truly believed in his music like
it was you know. I hate to say that, but it wasn't until he was in the hospital and I I started singing Live your Life every day that I was like, this is an amazing song, and wow, like my husband so talented, but gosh, you know, and I think this is so relatable. Nick was forty, I was
thirty eight. We had a new baby, and he wanted to like go into music, and I was just like, you know, honey, like I don't know if this is the time to you know, go on tour with a band around the world, the country and in a bus two bars. You know what, how how how are we supposed to So, you know, I look back and I'm like, gosh, I really sucked as like being the supportive wife, you know. And we thought about moving to California for all year we thought about it. He wanted to come to California.
That's where he smelled opportunity, and that's where music was, and that's where he had to be. And I was like, well, my business is here in New York and and in the actor world for you knows you here, and and my parents have across the hall, and my sisters are up the street, like we're really leaving, We're gonna go across the country. And your mom is in Toronto, an hour flight from New York work. She comes down all the time, you know, Like and you just want to
pick us up and leave us. Yeah, but you know that's that's marriage. Like, give me a marriage that's perfect all the time, that two people are perfect all the time with no flaws. That doesn't exist. And and so to to tell this story and pretend like we were this perfect couple or that we never had problems, or that we never you know, got on each other's nerves or or almost broke up, you know, before we really kind of got it together. I just you know, that's
not the truth. And if I hope, if anything, after following me through all of this, you know I'm an honest person. I will always give you the honest report about things going down, because you know there's enough you know, making everything perfect for the world and social media especially, I think we're all kind of sick of that, right. What would you ideal like Elvis to say, when he's old enough to read this book, I'm so glad you
wrote this, Mom. I'm you know, I'm so glad that I know I have I'm so glad I have this. I'm so glad that my family will have this. Um. You know, I think, like I said, there's there's so if I didn't, if I hadn't written this down, it would have all been from memory. And I think we can all attest to the fact that as years pass on, you're like, yes, you were born June tenth, it was in the morning, six something, and you weighed seven pounds and I fourteen owns is I mean you know, I
mean unless it's written down. As time goes on, you just forget things, and I don't. I this was something I don't ever want to forget. I don't ever want to pass by this story and and who Nick was and how hard he fought, because he truly did. He fought so hard, and I know he did. I saw it. And you know, Elvis will never know because he was too little and by the time he came to the hospital,
it was too late. You know, Nick was was almost passing and and Elvis was you know, he wasn't old enough to fully understand where he was or who he was even seeing. So you know, I'm just glad that he has this now. Um and I'm and I'm you know, it was crazy. There was a day where Jennifer Love Hewitt, who has become a dear friend through all of this, she she called me. She's like, I have to talk to you, and I was like, okay, And you know, she's very spiritual, and she said, I had an amazing
dream about Nick. He visited me in my dreams, took me on a walk through laure O Canyon and was talking to me about your book. And he said he sat beside you every day when you wrote and he now knows his story and he has closure on his life. He knows what happened to him in the hospital. And I was like, oh my god. And so I had never thought of it that way. I never wrote this book so that Nick had closure. But it makes sense.
You mean, you'll see in the book. I I was positive Penny every day in that hospital overrem I never let anything negative enter his room, and if a doctor walked him, we always exited to talk. It was only positive things. I never really let him know the severity of his situation because I just wanted him to to focus on living and walking out of that hospital one day and having his code rocky. And so he never knew.
And um, I never thought of it that way until she said that, And then I was like, wow, that's so Nick needing closure on his life. Of course, we all, you know, a lot of us are closure people, and Nick was he he would have needed this closure. And so when I wrote the dedication, it was actually the day I started my audiobook recording of it, and and she said, sorry, the director Travis said, do you know
your dedication yet? I said I do now. I said, it's very simple and I wrote the dedication because now Nick knows his story, and now Elvis has the story. When we come back, Amanda share some funny Nick stories and a very touching letter that's right after this. Now, please welcome Tony nominee Nick Cordero and the Company of Bullets over Broadway. Yeah. In preparing for this interview, I went back and watched Nick's Tony performance and there you were. Yeah.
I was like, wait, that's Amanda, She's in there. You were handing him something right, yes, his his gun. And it was so exciting because you know, when you're in a Broadway show, you only get nominated if you're a New Broadway show, and so you only perform if you're a New Broadway show. So it's it's a huge, you know, a huge deal if you're asked to perform at the
Tony Awards and you're a performer. I mean there's a lot of times you do fourteen Broadway shows but never get to perform at the Tony Awards because it just doesn't work out. And so they you know, the number that they did was an all male number. Nick's big number because he was nominated for a Tony and Susan Stroman called me up one day. I'll never forget it, and she said, you know, we need um somebody to come on and carry give Nick his gun, and so I thought it would be perfect if it was you.
And I think she had a good inkling that Nick and I were, you know, kind of flirting from on stage and off stage, and so I know she kind of probably picked me for that reason too. But it was very kind of her to choose me to just walk out and walk walk out, walk on and off stage because it was so excited that I got to perform with the Tony Awards and and give Nick his gun.
And then no one really knows, but he really messed up his lines um singing, and as I was handing him his gun, I was smiling, going, oh god, you're really just messed up your lines. And he's looking at me like I just messed up my lines. And he killed himself the whole day. Oh, he was so sad that he messed up his lines. But nobody knew unless you knew. I was gonna say, I think you're the only two who noticed. But I saw him dancing and singing and thought, wow, you know he's he was so tall, right,
how tall was nixt six five katies? Oh my god. He was a fantastic dancer. And that's hard when you're that tall, isn't it to dance like that? Yeah? And you know, you know, Susan Struman is all about dancing into the ground, you know, really using your lower body, kind of staying underneath yourself when you dance that, you know, just you know. And it was an all male number and there you know, the you know, gangsters, and so it was very like down and dirty kind of number.
And uh, right from Bullets over Broadway obviously, and what was the song? I'm trying to remember the sunny business. It ain't nobody's business if I do, right, Yeah, get back to slack at leave for four another thing business if I do. And so it was great, you know, ned worked every day on that dance number. Even before
we started rehearsals. Susan Struman had him doing private tab lessons with James Gray, the associate choreographer, and uh, there there are many days in the rehearsal room before we started rehearsals that I was the I was the costume model, so I was doing the costume modeling and he was in the other room doing private tap lessons, and you know, we we didn't even like each other that I mean,
we were just friendly, like hi, Hi. But you know, it's just funny to look back on those memories and know that I was, you know, naked, wrapped in fur in one room and he's doing private tap lessons in another. And I believe you write about the fact that he caught a glimpse of you naked wrapped him for and that might have changed the dynamics ever so slightly. Amanda,
that was a funny moment. The dole evanted door opened, and I was like, oh Anna, and you obviously were closer than close before you started this book, and now I think probably you know, two heart speat is one in many ways. I don't know where I got that,
but it sounded good. And uh, she you and wlu did um a letter she wrote you on Mother's Day because you were a little a slightly miffed and disappointed that Nick didn't make a fuss when you were pregnant with Elvis, and then of course he couldn't for the next Mother's Day. But she wrote you a really moving letter, and I wondered if you could read a little bit of that for us. Oh wow, um yeah, sure, okay
Chapter twelve on Mother's Day. Okay, here we go. Dear Elvis, it's your mom's first Mother's Day, And to use the same words that your dad did in her birthday card, it is not the kind she wanted or deserves. But she woke up this morning as she always does, with a full heart and a smile. You're eleven months old today. You don't know or understand what is going on in the world right now, or what has happened to your family,
and for that I am so grateful. One day you will be able to look back and know what happened when you were just a little baby boy are petite. You will be able to read about how things change so quickly, how our world stopped, and how slowly our earth healed from it. You will understand why we always linger a second longer now when we hug, and why we never miss a birthday, party, a wedding, or a holiday. You will know why your mom and uncle Todd and
I are bonded in the most unbreakable way now. But there are some things she's not telling you in her letters. Things she won't come out and say herself. And so I'm writing you this one so that you will know, Elvis, you don't have a regular mom, you have a super mom. I can't get through this letter. Um. Right now, you're into everything. You destroy the perfectly clean house in a matter of seconds. You open every cabinet you shouldn't touch,
and play with everything but your toys. You trying to take down paintings, topple tables, and splash in the toilet. Everything you pick up, you trying to put in your mouth, from dirty shoes to rocks to lemons that fall from the tree in the backyard. She never yells, She never frustrated, She never ever shouts. She looks at you with eyes that outpour admiration and laughs as you get into mischief, Elvis,
she is a warrior. What has happened to your dad is sometimes impossible to believe so much so quickly, It feels to us like it can't be real. Your mom has dealt with more fear and pain and stress in the last six weeks than most people could ever endure in a lifetime. Keep going, No, that's good, Um, how did she close it? Um? She says that I have never seen someone gives someone else the kind of pure and selfless love that your mom gives you. You hit
the jackpot kid getting her for a mom. I know, because I hit the jackpot too when I got her first sister. That's so beautiful and so nice. And now you know, I think about you, Amanda because she find yourself a single mom, which is really hard, I know. And how are you handling just being that person that
you never imagined you'd be? I mean it's yeah, it's hard. Um. You know, you feel a lot of pressure to be like two people, you know, to give like as more than you possibly could give because he's missing half of what he should have. Um. There's pressure to provide and make sure that I can give him everything I possibly
can in life. UM. And then there's like days where you're just really frustrated because I'm trying to like do emails and text people back and even just have a sip of coffee or take a shower, and he won't let you. Um, and you're just you know, fresh straight in and that's really hard because you're like, gosh, I just wish there was like somebody else here that could you know, his dad, that could be like come on, Elvis, like we're gonna do this so mom could go shower.
That person isn't there, and you know, no one's you know, no one sees those times. You know, no one sees like those struggles where you're just like, uh, you know, but you like love your kids so much, it's never not about that. Um. But I have really great help. I have the best manny and nanny, and I have these friends that will literally do anything for me I have. I have really like the I'm so lucky to have these people in my life. And my brother lives in
San Francisco. He'll come down any time I asked him. He's in a car, um driving the six hour drive to get down here and be with me and Elvis. I mean, he thinks of Elvis as a son. So I'm very lucky in that respect. But yeah, I mean it's hard. It's really hard being a single parent. Um. I mean, my heart goes out to any single parent out there. It's hard alone to be a parent. You know.
Do you ever think about, like, dash, maybe I could open my heart to someone else or is that just something that you aren't allowing yourself to even think about. And I can't believe I'm asking you such a personal question. But I sort of feel like I can. Yeah, you can, Katie, I mean obviously you know I asked you this question when I when I talked to you when we first met. I think, um, because it's so crazy, Yes, I listen.
I firmly believe that if Nick could have spoke on his went on his days that he was lost here, he would have looked at me and said, you better fall in love again. You better find a amazing man and somebody that loves Elvis as much as as much as I possibly, you know, as much as possible. Um. I would have said the same thing to him. So I know he would have said the same thing to me if he could have. I know he doesn't want me to be alone. UM. So yeah, I I love
that idea. UM. I love having a companion. I love being married. I love having a husband. If that happens again in my life, I will be so grateful for it. UM. Not ready just yet. I you know, I'm sure like maybe i'll know. I don't know, Maybe I won't know. I don't think it necessarily is like a day you wake up and you're like, I'm ready to start dating. UM. I feel grateful that I I feel. I feel okay being alone, I feel okay being a single mother. I
feel okay not thing anyone right now. So um, I think I'll just take it day by day and and see. But I hope that there's somebody out there for me. I hope. So I think there is. I know there is. Not that I'm a witch or anything, but you know, I have to tell you that was a beautiful moment. It's in the book. But gosh, my mother in law, Nick's mom, who she's a she's a warrior. Oh my god. And she lost her husband, um three years ago. So she's lost her husband and then she lost her son.
And one of the really tough days in the hospital where we didn't know if Nick was going to make it, we were outside eating lunch and she said to me, because she was Amanda, I want you to find somebody again. I want you to. You need to. You're you're going to find somebody again. I want you to. Our whole family wants you to. Okay, Like, don't you think that, like we're gonna be mad at you or be sad
if you have a new life with somebody. You should have a new life with somebody, And I was like looking at her, and I was like, your son is in the hospital passing away, and you have enough strength and courage and love for me, um to sit here right now and tell me that. I mean, like, I don't know many mother in laws that would do that, to be honest, you know, I mean like, and I of course that day I was like, oh, Mom, you don't know and she was like, no, yes, you're gonna
find somebody again. You're gonna you. I want you to get married again. I want you to have a life with somebody again. And Nick would two, Um, she's amazing, amazing. Well, I I love talking to I'm so happy. I'm so happy that I've gotten a chance to get to know you, and I know that you've made a lot of new friends through this terrible ordeal and the this unspeakable tragedy.
Really and um, you know, I just want you to know how much I admire you, and how highly I think of you, and how much, uh you know, how much I too hope that you'll find happiness. But you've just been I think an exemplary role model for people, uh dealing with with this this kind of loss and this kind of grief. So I'm just really I feel it's a real privilege to know you well, Katie, I feel the same way about you. I feel like we're like long lost souls that were meant to be friends.
As my mom would say. That makes it official. We're members of the Mutual Admiration Society. Yeah, thank you again to Amanda Cludes who, as you can tell, I think she's pretty terrific. Her book, written with her sister Anna, is called Live Your Life, My Story of Loving and Losing Nick Cordero. It's out now on the next installment of my summer book series. I think that this is the backbone of America. It is the dream of America
embodied in my mother. She did it. Ursula Burns, the former Xerox CEO, on her extraordinary life, her trailblazing career, and her immigrant mother who inspired it all. That's next week on Next Question. Next Question with Katie Kurik is a production of My Heart Media and Katie Couric Media. The executive producers Army, Katie Curic and Courtney Litz. The supervising producer is Lauren Hansen. Associate producers Derek Clements, Adrianna Fasio, and to Emily Pinto. The show is edited and mixed
by Derrick Clements. For more information about today's episode, or to sign up for my morning newsletter, wake Up Call, go to Katie correct dot com. You can also find me at Katie Currect on Instagram and all my social media channels. For more podcasts from I Heart Radio, visit the I Heart Radio app, Apple podcast, or wherever you listen to your favorite shows,