Katie’s book tour extravaganza episode!

let's get ready. In three two, we're going there live. Thank you. You guys are so nice to be here, to pay good money to come see me. Thank you so so much. Hi. Today, I'm sharing some moments from my nine city Whirlwind tour after going there, came out and laid October. I went there to talk about my book in person. Here's a little taste. Let's rewind, shall we,

to a time long ago and far away. My big break came at w r C at local station in d C, located right upstairs from the Washington Bureau of I was proud as a peacock to be part of the NBC family. I had woken up that morning with a healthy husband, our lives stretching out before us. I went to sleep with a husband who had stage four calling cancer and a colostomy back. As Peter Parker in Spider Man reminds us, with great power comes great responsibility,

and Matt unfortunately seriously abused his. After my first broadcast on the CBS Evening News, it was open season on me, my makeup, my hair, the fact that I wore a white jacket after Labor Day. What has been a raging success though, is my merger with Muelner. Yeah. So for all of you who may not believe in second chances, I'm here to tell you it is possible. But I also got to share the stage with some of my very favorite people like Eina Garten and Jenn Garner, Chance

the Rapper, and Kim and Brad Paisley. You know what he's He's going there, Katie, he is now. In addition to those celebrity interviews and more on those in some bonus episodes to come, yeha, I also about to sit down with people you may not know but should. Many of them who I met along the way. They were at the center of some of the biggest stories of my career, ordinary people who responded to extraordinary, often traumatic

events in inspiring and life changing ways. On this episode of Next Question, I'm sharing the best moments from those conversations. We'll begin where the tour did in Boston. I want to give you all a warning. This is our first night of doing this, so so so seriously, please please be gentle because who knows what's going to happen. But I'm so happy you're hearing. My guest was Celesque Corkrant.

Celeste was watching her sister Carmen run the Boston Marathon on April two and was at the proverbial wrong place at the wrong time. When one of those bombs exploded. Celesque would lose both her legs. How do you put your life together? How do you not let anger win? How do you find purpose through the pain? How do you go on? Well, I'll tell you because she is, and she's here tonight, so please welcome Celesque, poor friend

and her sister, Carmen Icabo. Celesque came on my talk show back in just a few months after the bombing. Back then, she walked carefully on ill fitting prosthetics, but in Boston this past October. She walked across the stage confidently and securely, accompanied by her sister Carmen. Here's a portion of our conversation. You've come such a long way, I think since that day when you were on my show.

And I think we should also mention that their daughter, Sydney, who was seventeen at the time, suffered critical injuries that day as well, had to go through numerous surgeries. And I can't imagine as a mom, you are dealing with your own injuries, and yet Sydney had her injuries too, and you all ended up being sharing a hospital brand didn't. Yeah, that was just luck that we ended up at the

same hospital and everything. And then they put us when they realized that we were mother and daughter, they put us in the same room. But yeah, to be there my mother everybody, like I've always been like that, and to not be able to to be in a hospital bed, to have my legs in these casts, and then and to know that Sydney was so hurting, you know, I would see her crying um and he couldn't get up and go to her, and I was I was always that's my baby. Of course I'm going to be there.

It was. It was overwhelming because it was the two of them, and celest really wanted to be her mom and she really couldn't. Um. I mean she could and she was. But I think the hardest part about it it was like, you know, we thought our life everything was going to be so horrible because Cels lost her legs. But Sydney was so so sick, and so that was what was so hard. Like her, her injuries were much

worse than selesces. If you can even imagine that, you had to obviously deal with this sort of huge life change. And I don't think we should underestimate how challenging it was, because not only physically for you, uh, Celeste, but also just mentally and emotionally. It was really really tough. There were days where you just wouldn't get out of bed. Understood days like that. Really, Yeah, I had, I've been out of my legs. I'm just kind of I started

almost all over again. I had surgery from my nerve pain um three years ago maybe it was it was about three years ago over for COVID, and that was a long recovery and I was out of my legs um for a long time. I was just in the wheel chair. So for the last like I don't know, three years more in my chair than in my legs. But um, but I felt like I needed that two like ground myself or something. You know. Here I am up on these stilts. And before I lost my legs,

I used to walk barefoot all the time. I love to walk barefoot. And I felt like there was some gonna sound goofy, but I felt like there was some kind of connection that was lost. You know, I needed to be like down on the ground. You I know, were introduced to other people who were amputees who had lost their legs, and it was sort of helpful, but not that helpful at first. Why was that? Um, some marines came to see me, and um, a lot of

military people. So it was a lot of men and a lot of um single leg amputees that I met with or that you know, came to encourage me. And that was fantastic. I needed that, but I was sort of like missing, I don't even know how to say it, like a female connection really right, that's exactly how to

say it. And so and so um and and luckily you got connected with this incredible woman in California who have lost her her legs because of frost bite when she was nineteen years old, and you all became best friends. And I feel like that relationship really turned things around,

didn't it. It really did. We I met her in New York and she was going to an event and she said that we had had numerous conversations on the phone, and then she was like, I want to meet So she was gonna go to the function in New York, but she had my number, let me tell you, because she was like, Celeste, if I fly across the country and show up there, you can't back out. And I so would have. There was on a good day, you know. I was just like, New York, I'm not gonna be

able to like what you know. And I was just freaking out. And then this one was like don't you go? And and so that I gave you, um, you know, it gave you back your fighting spirit in a way, didn't it. It did? Because that's how Jamie is. She's very um. She's just a go get her and she's just if I would cry, like say I had to crawl to get into the car or something like, you know, get out of my wheelchair, get in the back of the car, fold my wheelchair, put it in the car.

I would call her and just be like, oh my god, this is you know what I have to do. And she was like, yeah, but you can do it. And it's so true. And and now I went from crying because I had to do something a certain way to yeah, I've got this, Okay, I got it. I know that you have started to do a lot of ad because he worked with an organization called fifty Legs, which which helps peep who who need help getting post prosthesis a prosthetic.

I always have a hard time saying that, yeah, we help people get yeah, and um that has that has

that helped you to by helping other people? Absolutely? Um, she has really been helped to so many people, Like there are people in the hospital or whatever, and just throw out all of our work with fifty Legs and what has happened to thee last Like you know, we've always said from the beginning, with bad comes good, and I think that's the over you know, the overwhelming theme in our life, as we always have to say, with bad comes good, and she has She's helped in so

many people. And in my situation, I feel strongly about this in my situation, I had so many people. I mean, the whole city of Boston was behind all of us. Right, talked about Bostons and people that I've met over the years have car accidents, diabetes whatever, and lose limbs and don't have any of that support that I had. So I felt very strongly because I had so much help and it helped me so much, and I don't know

what I would have done without that much help. So every time when I can help somebody, I feel like I'm just paying it forward, you know, And I hope that and I tell them that if they need somebody else they had some too. Wow, you're you're really a remarkable person, and not you are. I just don't. I just dealt with a situation that came to me as best as I could. You know, I didn't choose this, but I'm not done living, so of course has gone.

That was Celesque Corkran and her sister Carmen Icabo in Boston. In New York, I got to talk with Lauren Manning in two thousand one. Lauren was a Wall Street executive at Candor Fitzgerald, which was located it in the Twin Towers on September eleven, Lauren was just entering the lobby of the North Tower when the first plane hit and a fireball from the elevator shaft enveloped her, burning more than two of her body. Lauren, who is also a wife and mother of two sons, Tyler and Jagger, had

a slim chance of survival. And yet you will not believe how far she has come since I met her two decades ago. She is a real force of nature. Please welcome the extraordinary Lauren. Manny. You know I wanted. I was so thrilled, Lauren, first of all, that you were willing to come back and and sort of reconnect with me, because you're such an amazing person. It's such a inspiration to me still to this day. And I wanted to ask you just about this whole healing process,

because obviously we just passed the twentieth anniversary of nine eleven. Um, do you do you have any residual effects from the injuries that you sustained that day? Completely so, my life on a daily basis is lived through a different prism of what happened to me, and every aspect of it is compromised from the way any limb works to the

way my voice works. Learning how to walk again and speak again, and to really live again is all a study in an ongoing series of pain UM, only punctuated by sometimes, uh, the blessings that I have in life of a husband and children who are even more painful in certain moments. You know, Lauren, you were you were a badass before this happened, and I'm curious if you're

kind of tough. You're such a determined woman. I mean, when I met you at that rehab center, you I just couldn't believe how focused you were on getting better. Do you think your personality type really contributed to your healing? And You're you're a singular focus on that, I think so certainly. You know, we all come from a different

place in a sense. But my family and my my upbringing, and UH also being in a business that was dominated by men who are all wonderful in so many ways, but highly misogynistic and many others, really difficult to make

the grade and to get paid what you should. And it created within me a thesis, along with my family's service through the years, UH in the armed services, back to the Revolutionary Revolutionary War, that I UM was there in ninety three when the first Trade Center terrorists detect occurred, and I knew in a sense and believed, as many

of us did, they would come back. And when I looked up and knew that most of my friends and colleagues were certainly gone, I had this chance, and uh, I was not going to squander one minute of it. And and so many people from Canada. Fitzgerald died that day. Was over six hundred, right, six hundred and fifty eight. That's just so hard to believe. Meanwhile, you and you and Greg, and your husband is such a sweetheart. Please give him my best. You had another son after this,

You have a son named Jagger. So Tyler is now twenty one, and Jagger is now eleven. Is that right? But we just turned twelve. Tyler just turned twenty one, and he's at Jay's alma matera the wonderful Trinity College, and Jon Mohlner's alm alma mater, Trinity College and Hertford. Yeah, and uh, Jagger turned twelve. And I don't know how many of you have children, but twelve is like fifteen. And I've never been so wrong in my life. Uh, this was a reprieve to be here. To this evening,

so like happy to say goodbye to my young boss. Um, I am just so happy to see you. How so life today. You have the challenges of having an adolescent son, but and you're you're You're also still this tough businesswoman. I'm so proud of you. You've got to start up, You're working, you know, really hard on that. So things are, things are good. How would you describe your life today? I mean, they are what they are. I think for

most of us, they're wonderful days and challenging days. But the blessing of having the moment to prevail over the fears of failure, which were very easy to let go after nine eleven, has um really given me an opportunity to be in a space of doing what I need to do in terms of supporting things like sanctuary for families and I pads for soldiers and helping wounded and injured soldiers and starting a startup based on social commerce and the nexus of privacy for consumers and allowing us

all to get paid for it. So that's a long winded answer, but well, it sounds like your life is very full and rich and purposeful. It is purposeful, yes, if not always divinely well choreographed. I'm trying to get from here to there, and you have been certainly someone I've always looked to as a woman that has led the way for so many of us. I feel so blessed and privileged that I got to meet you, Lauren, and I'm so proud of everything you've accomplished and all

that you've become despite everything that you face. So thank you for coming back and and being here with us tonight. Thank you, Thank you Laura and Manning. Everyone. We'll be back with more highlights from my book tour right after this. At each city I traveled to for my book tour, I reconnected with some of the people I've met during my career who have left a lasting impression, people like Tom and Pam Bosley, who I got to know through

a documentary I produced in called Under the Gun. The Bosley's have worked tirelessly to reduce the amount of gun violence, not only here in Chicago, but all across the country. They've joined forces with other families and are a real example to me of turning their tragedy into action. I just love them so much, so please welcome Tom and Pam Bosley. Tom and Pam lost their oldest son, Terrell, to gun violence in two thousand and six. He was just a nineteen year old kid on his way to

band practice at his local church. His murder remains unsolved to this day. You know, it's been fifteen years since you lost Terrell and he would be thirty three years old today, which is so hard to believe. And you all did everything right. You kept him busy, you kept him involved in sports and extracurricular activities. It just broke my heart to see him on those videos. I'm sure it's just crushing for you all. But um, what you know when you think about Terrell today, what do you

think about Tom? What? Well, probably by now we would be grandparents hopefully, and uh, you know, we just miss everything about him, the music, the personality. And you know a lot of his friends have are now they're grown and they're married wickid, so you know when we see them, we flashed back a little bit. You have two other sons, Trey and Terrest. I know, tell us how they're doing. Actually, trade, I'm gonna start with the rest. So this is my

mildest son. So that's the one nobody never sees. But he's my one that keeps me a courage. Um. He was actually closer to Terrel. So he the one to be like, mom, you've got this, um and he's always in the background. But Tray is my uh my rock my, he's my baby. But he's an activist. He's outspoken. Uh, he's the one that more like me, you know as far as coming out talking about tell story. So his goal is he's an activist and his goal is to

um reduce gun violence. And I know that when you lost Terrell, you felt so alone and and and there was nobody to really talk to about what you all were going through. And that was the impetus for you to start this incredible organization called Purpose over Pain. Tell us about that we did that first year when um, my life went throughout our life was destroyed because through our life was taken. I try to take my life twice, UM,

so I didn't have nobody to turn to. And what I myself, um A Nettop She's Blare the MoMA Blair Hope who was killed on the bus and some more of us. We came together and we started Purpose over Pain because we knew God had a purpose for our life. So what we started doing was supporting other parents like us, uh, because we didn't you know. Actually, throughout the years we've been meeting people who who didn't make it, you know,

because of this. So we support parents by doing events like uh, this Christmas coming up, it's a hard time for us. So we actually put together sneakers ball Um. We do different things to support them, and we advocate for comments since gun maagers, we mentor young people. So we just try to stay busy helping each other and try to get our cases stived because in the city of Chicago, over the cases we may unstave. So we walked the streets and we try to solve our cases.

So we united together to help each other and just to support each other. And you won't get phone calls, I mean at all hours of the night from grieving parents, which must be so difficult. Tom, It's tough because it never stops. Um. You know, you hear about some cases in the news, but then we get the ones you don't hear about in the news, and and every time you get that call, it takes you back to the day that you got that call, you know, so you're

constantly reliving it. So at times it's difficult. But the joy you get, if there's a joy, is that you're helping a parent get through this process as best you possibly can so that you know, um, they can keep the memory of their kids alive and we can bind together and hopefully make a difference. Just have support, right exactly because it's it's we get like forty five phone calls a week. Actually have the number in my pocket. I've brought it with me, um, because we really need

to always say these numbers. UM. Year to date here in Chicago, we had three thousand, nine hundred and seventy eight people shot and six dred and eighty eight people did and nobody really talked about it. And and November just you know, we just started November, we had fifty two people shot and we have twelve dead. And these are the phone calls we get every single day. We're getting forty five calls a week trying to help buried children.

And that's what purpose of the paying do we make donations to burying our children Because some people don't have insurance, they don't have anything, so they you know, want to cremate their children because they don't have money to bury them. So UM, we we there for them, We support them all kinds of ways. Why why hasn't it gotten better? Um? You know the statistics in Chicago or worse than ever.

And I know that the governor has been very supportive and is channeling a lot of money million dollars to to to address some of the systemic issues that are creating these problems. But you know, how do you how do you explain that it's it's worse than effort? You know, I was, I was speaking earlier. It's a will issue in my opinion, Um, just like the pandemic. You know, if you can bring resources together to come up with a cure, uh for a vaccine, you can do the

same thing for the pandemic of gun violence. But there is a will, there's a lack of a will to h to do that. Well, I know one thing that gives you hope is your son Trey has become an activist as well, and he gave a speech um at the the two thousand eighteen March for Our Lives event. I was actually there in Washington, d C. Let's show tray in action. It's time to care about all communities eating. It's time to stop judging some communities it's worth as

some community word. It's time to stop judging you that look like me or my brother, that come from a privates communities any different than anyone else. It's time for America to notice that everyday shootings are everyday problems. I'll close with this Pope by Marlotha King was said, we

must accept finite disappointment, but never lose infinite hope. I said this to say, no matter the hurdles we may face along this journey, we must remain hopeful, and we must continue to stand together and fight for the lines that we deserve. Thank that's awesome. I know you're very proud of him, aren't you. Yes, we are. Well. I'm so grateful that you both came to to actually see me and to share your story with everybody in the audience.

Thank you for everything you're doing. And let's not let four years past before I get to visit with you all again. Thank you, Sam and Tom Boss everyone. Meanwhile, in Atlanta, I met up with Amy Copeland in a zip lining accident resulted in a gash in Amy's leg that required twenty two staples. The wound was infected by a flesh eating bacteria that's incredibly rare, but also incredibly deadly. It cut off her blood flow and five of Amy's organs shut down completely. She was on life support for

several days. To save her, doctors had to amputate both of her hands, her left leg, and most of her right. She was twenty four years old. The last time I got to talk to Amy was back in just a few months after her injury. So much has changed since then. Well, let's talk about sort of what's been going on with you physically, because I know you still do occupational therapy.

What twice a week? Still tell us a little bit about the healing because you continue to work and to make sure that you're as as independent as you possibly can. Tell us what that involves. Ye, So physically, I'm a swimmer, so I swim. I woke up and swam a mile this morning. Wow. And I'm also a registered yoga teacher, so I also practice yoga on a daily basis, and I work out with weights because having a disability, one of the most important things is that I'm fit. And look,

I know you you are a beast in the gym. Amy, That's awesome. Do you work out every single day about five or six days a week. I try to give myself, you know, even God rested for a day. And how important that must be incredibly important for you to make sure that you're as strong as you possibly can be, right, especially shoulders strength to prevent injuries. I use my shoulders and compensate with my shoulders for a lot of movements, So being able to keep that strength is really important

to protect my body. So let's talk about what you're doing. First of all, tell everyone what you got your two master's degrees in show off um and what you're doing with those degrees because it's so interesting. Yeah. So, first master's degree in psychology, second in social work. I'm now a licensed clinical social worker in Georgia and in Arizona,

and I run my own counseling group. So I have about eight therapists who I direct and consult with, and we create affordable mental health opportunities for people in Atlanta who may not have health insurance coverage, so with fees as low as thirty five dollars. And then I also

run a nonprofit organization which is so Amy Copeland Foundation. Yeah, so tell everyone what the Amy Copeland Foundation does, because I think it's so awesome what you're trying to do, and we also want to sell these nice people that you're still fundraising for it, so explain what it is. So our mission at Amy Copeland Foundation is to bridge the gap between nature and accessibility, particular for people who

are in wheelchairs. One thing I realized waking up with the disability is I didn't have the same freedom I used to to be in nature, and that was what I studied. After a while, I realized people in wheelchairs really needed that most. So we're doing that in two ways. One is by creating accessible workshop retreats, so we go to beautiful places in nature and people can come out and learn pain management and self regulation techniques for improving mental, physical,

and spiritual well being. In addition to that, we just started our All Terrained Georgia program, which actually allows people in wheelchairs to visit their own community parks any time they want with their family and friends, which is so great. And I know that these wheelchairs are expensive, and so you want to make sure that you get them and make them accessible for people who need them all across

the state of Georgia and all all state parks. Right that's right, and right now we actually are doing our been cutting next Monday for the first ten shares, which will be housed at ten state parks within about an hour or two of Metro Atlanta, and those will be available for free rental by people with disabilities starting in April. This is the first program of its kind in the United States, but I've already gotten interest from North Carolina, Florida, Alabama, Tennessee,

South Carolina. That's where all want to start programs there. So we're out. He's so great. I was gonna ask you, and we wanted to replicate it in other states across the country. And you know, I know that you that you do ecotherapy, So is that mean sort of the idea of healing out in nature, and that's why you have these workshops where you bring folks who kind of you believe in in that kind of healing and the power of nature to help people, right, that's right. Yeah.

I studied ecopsychology, and what we learned there is that we're from the earth, We're related to the earth, we are a part of the earth, and so being pulled out of nature and being really sedentarian indoors can create a lot of secondary issues for people who already have physical disabilities, so the idea that it is only natural for us to be in nature, and there's all sorts of impacts that has on the human psyche. I know

that you are. You struck me even I mean even when I met you all those years ago, four months after you were dealing with everything. You are an incredibly positive person, but you also deal with some challenges and there have been dark days for you to amy and and how have you gotten through that. I know that you're a big believer in kind of seizing on those those tough emotions and letting that happen. And you have an interesting story about falling down and just kind of

literally mentally and physically collapsing. Yeah. Yeah, yeah, it was right after Actually I got the van on your TV show. I got donated my wheelchair accessible van and I would drive down to Valdosta. And the very first time I ever went down there, they brought me this tiny little shower bench to use. It was my first time showering outside my house. And as soon as I reached for the shampoo, I slipped right off and I was all alone. So I reached for the grab bar. That's what those

are there for. Right, my arms slipped in between the grab bar and the wall, and I'm sitting on the floor of the shower with my arm twisted behind me, and y'all, I just started screaming and crying and it was amazing what happened after my twenty minute timber tantrum. Nothing. I was still sitting on the floor of the shower of my arm saying the grab bar, but I felt a lot better. And it was kind of in that moment that I realized life is this whole wave of

emotion and we have to experience all of it. And once all the emotion came out of me, I saw the conditioner there, and I've learned being in a wheelchair you can dive or anything with duct tape or w D forty, and that conditioner might as well have been w D forty because I was then able to squirt it on my arm and a wriggle free. But I truly believe that it was experiencing all of it that

allowed me to have the clarity. So that's kind of how I deal with it, by inviting in whatever experiences I have without judgment and letting them move, because when they get trapped, that's when they turn into something else. That's a good life lesson, I think for everyone right to let to let it go and to feel the pain so you can move on. And I know meditation has helped you enormously with pain management as well, right, Amy,

That's right. And you know meditation is really about witnessing our experience without judgment, just seeing what is and breathing through it and being with it. And so that's how I've managed to control my pain is actually through relaxing. Usually when we experience pain, we tense against it, we try to get away from it, and that creates a

more painful experience typically than the initial stimulus. So what I've learned is that through relaxing eases the pain and I can welcome and breathe through anything, which means I'm really not scared of very much anymore. Freathe through it. Amazing and and and and getting to a high point. You got married last year. I'm so happy for you. So, um, tell me a little bit about your husband. How you met. I know he shy and kind of introverted. I wanted him to come tonight, but he told Amy, go do

your thing. I'll be waiting at home. But he's a teacher, tell me about it. Yes, he's a ninth grade teacher, so teacher, social worker. We get along real well. We have great communication, great communication. He would be rolling his eyes right now if he was here, because he would say I over communicate. But that's another story. But yeah, we met after my injury. The relationship I was in at the time did not make it through that trauma, which was one of the most heartbreaking parts of it

for me. But I got back into the dating world and a wheelchair and all and online, mind you, very interesting experiences were had. But luckily I met this one and he saved me from all of that. Um. It turned out we had about fifty mutual friends on social media when we met, so he actually went to the same school I did, so we had an instant recognition and connection. And I'm so happy for you. What's his name, Stephen, Stephen. We'll tell Stephen. We're so happy for him and for you.

And before before you leave, you once wrote about your accident and your life and you said, if you had to do it all over again, you wouldn't change a thing, And that, to me is quite a miraculous statement. Amy Copeland, Why tell me how were you able to say that? And why are you able to think that? Well, Stephen one. But also I've always had this much energy, Katie, and now I get invited here to talk to you and to share this message with all these beautiful people, and

to start a program, the first of its kind. This is really exciting for me to be able to make this impact, and for me this is the reason, this is the meaning that this happened to me, and for that I will be forever grateful. Well, you're my hero, Amy Copeland. Honestly, thank you for coming. Thank you, I mean, come on when we come back. The story of one of the most remarkable women I had ever met. One

of my last stops was to the Golden City, San Francisco. Uh. The fog made things a little tricky for us to get here, but we got here and we made it. Thank God. The Bay Area is home to one Miss oral Lee Brown. For more than two decades, the Oral Lee Brown Foundation has been paying for kids who are living in some of Oakland's toughest neighborhoods to go to college. It all started on a whim after Earl met a little girl who asked for change outside a corner store.

It was at that moment that Oral realized the kids in these neighborhoods were in trouble and college was their way out. So in n she adopted a class of twenty three first graders, and she made a promise to them that if they graduated from high school, she would pay for each and every one of them to go to college. Now Oral wasn't some millionaire. She was a real estate agent who grew up picking cotton in Mississippi. But Oral kept that promise and she didn't stop there.

How cool is Orally Brown? So I'm super excited because Orally is back, and please welcome her to the stage. Miss Orally drow So, Um, you adopted that first class of first graders, thirty twenty three kids thirty four years ago, and since then, you, Orally Brown, has have sent one hundred and twenty two kids to college. Where me and God God more than me, you and God where I mean, you were just one of the most extraordinary people I've

ever met in my whole career. Orally really, so I want I want people to learn a little more about you. Orally tell us about your childhood, because that makes your story even more phenomenal, well good evening. Um. I was probably born in the worst state in the Union, and that was in Mississippi, and I started working at the age of eight. My father had a saying is that

if you ate, you contributed to the food. So if you ate it, you had to help bring it in, take care of it, or pick it a hot chocolate or what have you. So at the age of eight, my mother started me cooking. I was too little at the time to know what a warm was, so she would take and pick the greens, but everything else onmade cakes. At the age of eight, I was making it and I was standing in the cottonfield and I will just tell God, please get me out of here. I will

do whatever. And you were one of twelve one or twelve kids the baby set up. A little before my twelfth birthday. My mother sent me to stay with my sister because she had eight kids, and so kids was the least thing on my mind. And so when you make a promise to God, sometimes he will make sure that you keep it. Because see my promise was Lord getting me away from Mississippi. I'll do whatever you know.

And so from Babyson to adopting twenty three students and at the time, I'm making for to five thousand miles a year. So I was crazy. You work and and and you. So you started, before you started this foundation, you were doing it on your own. Early you were putting money away every single month. You learned to do that, you were investing it. And by the time those first graders graduated, you paid for nineteen kids to go to college. How in the world did you do that? You're like

an investment gene. No, when God is mother climate, it would go a long ways. And You're right. By the time they graduated out of mind forty five thousand knowledge each year, I was able to save ten thousand dollars, still paid my ties, and still paid my obligation. And one of my friends said to me one day, or how do you do it? And I reminded her that I lived at one time off for two dollars a day. Let me repeat that, two dollars a day, and so living off for two thousand a day, then four to

five thousand, all I was a millionaire. And some sense, what would these kids have done without you? Orally I was thinking about that all these kids that you have helped, because they were from tough circumstances, weren't they. Um At that time, there was at least four or five young people's killed in Oakland every week. You could go to the film home and it's almost like a repeat now with the COVID. But the COVID was a disease. The killing was manifest right there in the Stokeland and it

was no way out. And the kids would tell me, and so many I'm saying, Mama Brown, if it was not for you, I would be dead. And I would say, baby, don't say that. No, Mom is the truth. And so I think we all have an obligation to do. And once again a child, a kid, not me, not me, but see God said, oh, yes, you made me a promise to get you out, and you will do. He got me out of Mississippi and I did. And you know,

you stay in touch with some of these kids. I mean, after all, the first group would have graduated twenty years ago. So do you keep in touch with them? And and do you see them out in the world thriving? And and that must give you so much satisfaction. It does. And not only do I say in touch with them, they say in touch with me, And they remind me. You know, mom, you gotta be there for my wedding.

You gotta be there from when I had my first baby. No, Mama Brown is gonna Oh no, Mom, you gotta be there. So No, they are family. We are a family, and I think the success probably come from some of that because one of the things I've tried to do is always sent at least two kids to college together. There's success rate doubles and maybe even triple because that's right when one want to leave the No, no, just state to the semester and then let's see what happened and

so it works out. So No, they they're on their way. They are on their way. I wish that was some of them. You know. When I interviewed you on the Today's Show back in two thousand two, I surprised you with a couple of your students, and one of them is Jeffrey Tony, And I'm super excited because Jeffrey is also here tonight and he was one of the first graduates. So Jeffrey, come out and tell us how you're doing. Come closer, Jeffrey. I mean, it's so thank you for

first of all, it's great to see you again. Almost insane. Is that you're one of the first of the graduating students that that Ms Brown supported and and sent to college. So tell us a little bit about your journey, where you went, and how you're doing now and what you're doing now. Well, thanks for having me. Uh. This lady sitting to the right of me, I consider her a real life angel. She saved my life. I grew up in Oakland, poverty, single parent, home, drugs, what you name

it violence. He's seeing things you shouldn't see at a young age, and uh, you don't really have dreams and hopes. But this lady came in and made a promise to adopt the entire first grade class because of an experience that she had, and it saved my life. Uh in n I graduated uh Castlemount High School and I attended Columbia College in Chicago and I studied business management. So that is awesome. You know. UM, A lot of people through the years have asked you, Jeffrey, where would you

be without Oralie Brown? And what do you tell him? Dead or in jail? J She saved my life. Like literally, the things that I was engaged in in high school I could have easily died could easily with the jail. But I was out hustling because I was homeless at sixteen, so I was out trying to feed myself and just survive. And that opportunity came and I ran with it, jump on that plane, went to Chicago and here I am, and tell us what you're doing today and how you're doing,

and all is well. Of course, because of Corona, things is a little shaky. Um, but I've turned all of my passions and the hobbies into the revenue stream, so things that I enjoyed doing, like graphic design. Um, I have a recording studio fly Drone, so I do a lot of video work. I just released a poem book called Poetry Hidden behind the Heart. It's on Amazon. Uh you can check that out. And UH, still doing music.

I just got a song picked up from UM sitcom called All American, and they picked up one of my songs because and look, Orally is very proud of you, and I know that you have a found dation now and you've got a whole team that helps you out because um, you're seventy eight now seventy six, sorry, but I know that you want to continue this legacy and you want to pay it forward. Hand this off so someone picks up whenever you decide that you need to take a break. Um, so how are you doing that?

You know, Katie, Honestly, the only thing that can help some students is to be there twenty four hours a day, and a mother and a father. No matter how good you are, you cannot do it. And so my goal is to have a boarding school. I have met with some individuals that almost agree with me. Uh, there's one boarding school in Pineywood, Mississippi, another one in Chicago, and then Marva Collins in in um Cincinnati, and so it's

the way to free them. You know, with a boarding school, they are there twenty four seven, so you know they're gonna get the nutrition. They're gonna get the food. Half of the kids failed because they're not in school. But with a boarding school, there's no truancy. If you're not in the classroom, that Mama Brown is gonna be up in the dorm or someone that looked like me and both of us cannot stay at no dorm between eight and three, so you know, we just can't do it.

So someone have to leave, and it's not gonna be me and so you know, I think that once we get the boarding school up and running, we will be able to say at least four or five students per year right in the Bay area, because the need is there. And and where do you get your huge heart? I mean, to to sacrifice so much and to give so much two kids who have so little, I guess the one thing that always come to my mind. And we was in Mississippi and my mother, just like I said, she

would pick the greens. Because I'm eight years old, I don't know what a warm meals. I mean, I know, but I don't know. If he's supposed to be in the pot, he's supposed to be down on the floor, you know. And maybe they meet for the greens, I don't know. And my mother had put the meat in the pot to cook the greens. And one of the neighbors came down to my mother's house and wanted to

know if she had some salt pork meat. Her mother was cooking greens, and I'm looking at my mother put the salt pork meat in the pot, so I know it's no more, and so I'm waiting for it. Say no, my mother takes the pot off the stove, take the piece of salt pork meat out, cut it in half, put one piece back in the pot and give the other two sister to take the Miss Bess of Main. And I said, Mama, that was our meat. She said, still, I was the ones in the body, the one that

I gave the siss. It's going to Miss BESSI man. And so if you can share a piece the slip for me, God knows, I can give away half of what I have. Yea, Orally and Jeffrey, I'm so happy to see you, more happy to uk you know. I love you. I love you well yeah, yeah, well about my cative right back at you. Thank you so much. And if people want to help and support the work you're doing, how can they do that. It's the Early Orally Brown Foundation dot org and the phone numbers five ten,

four three or three or four one. Just go on the website and look at Early Brown. They tell me it's eighteen pages of literature and students and you know, all the information is there. Well, thank you for everything you've done. Thank you Jeffrey much love you. That was Orally Brown. We'll have links to all the organizations we've mentioned in this podcast. The episode description, and if you're able or in the giving mood this holiday season, I

hope you'll consider donating to their very worthy causes. A huge thank you to Celeste Corkran, Lauren Manning, Tom and Pam Bosley, Amy Copeland, Oral Lee Brown and all of the people I got to talk to on my tour. And actually there's more of the tour to share. This may be the last episode of the season, but keep your ear to the podcast because over the break will be releasing a few bonus episodes featuring some really fun and famous friends who joined me on my book tour.

Next Question is taking a little hiatus, but we'll be back with a whole new season, new guests, new hot topics in early Meanwhile, Happy holidays to you and yours from all of us at k c M. Next Question with Katie Kurig. The production of I Heeartmedia and Katie Curic Media. The executive producers Army, Katie Curic, and Courtney Litz. The supervising producer is Lauren Hansen. Associate producers Derek Clements and Adrianna Fasio. The show is edited and mixed by

Derrek Clements. For more information about today's episode or To sign up for my morning newsletter, wake Up Call, go to Katie currek dot com. You can also find me at Katie curic on Instagram and all my social media channels. For more podcasts from I Heart Radio, visit the I Heart Radio app, Apple podcast, or wherever you listen to your favorite shows.