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Welcome, Welcome. For every mountain side, let freedom ring. And when this happens, when we allow freedom ring, when we let it ring from every village and every hamlet, from every state and every city, we will be able to speed up that day with all of God's children, black men and white men, jos and Gentiles, Protestants and Catholics will be able to join hands and sing in the words of the old Negro spiritual Free at last, pre ad Last, Thanks God Almighty, we are pre Admas Well.
Welcome home, everybody.
This is a very special edition of the Native Land Podcast because it is Martin Luther King Day.
Nothing else important is happening today.
All we care about is the dream that doctor King once had that appears to be coming in the form of a nightmare.
On this very day.
But I won't say what that nightmare is. I'll allow my calls to do that. I'm answer the rhy.
I'm here with Tiffany Cross and Andrew Gillim.
You guys, what could possibly be ruining doctor King's dream for America.
Today, Well, I just want to say just really quick back and I love that we came into doctor King's word free at last, Free at last, because that and Angela is gowned appropriately in her MLK gear today, because that really is had such credo to black folks. That is what we have, It is our birthright, it is what we arrived in this country seeking. You know, we were free beings who were kidnapped, rates have the humanity beat out of us, and so for so long in
this country we have sought freedom. And so to hear those iconic words every year, I still get goose bumps. I still I remember when The Cosby Show did a special episode and they played those words.
It just it means so much to me.
So my honor and respect to the King family today and your work and your sacrifice. Special shout out to doctor Burneath King who stay woke and stay out there carrying on her father's legacy.
It is striking Angela.
I'm heartbroken that inauguration is taking place on Mlkday because the Republican and conservative right wing MAGGA extremists are so skilled at co opting his words and perverting them to promote ideas, ideals and ideology that he did not stand for.
They always cherry pick his language when really he has some pretty quote unquote woke language out there and holds a lot of conservative white people to account, and they never play those So I'm disgusted that inauguration is has taking place today.
It's heartbreaking.
Yeah, it is the worst kind of oxymoron, Andrew. I'm eager to hear what our resident diplomat has to say about this horrific occasion on such a very special day moday that we had to fight for, by the way, even fight John McCain, who I probably would prefer being inaugurated at this point.
If he was.
You know what, I appreciate one about MLK Day, but Martinuther King and the civil rights movement and struggle, the struggle toward our collective liberation, and it didn't start at the Civil rights movement. It dates back back, back, far back. And what I know is true about it is that the words, the hymns, the prayers prayed from then to now have always been aspirational. They've never been just about
the moment that we're in. And I think for survival purposes, our ancestors had to project bright the future, a day of freedom, a day when we could decide, a day when there'll be no more sorrow, no more pain. You know. I just think about the songs and the hymns that carried us over, the speeches, the words, the poems that have carried us have almost always always spoken truth to what the moment is, and then try to take us higher, try to take us, lift us out of our grief
into a higher plane. And so I'm acknowledging this day as another one of those days that while reality may feel bleak, while on one screen we might have the Devil incarnate and his crew about to take the helm, we also still have the example of Doctor King, of our freedom, fighters, of our movement, leaders, of our ancestors. To put our attention on something higher. And I really I'm clasping to that, y'all, because the right now can feel really defeated. The right now, this moment can feel
like a letdown. It can feel like god Lee, I thought we had made so much progress and today feels like a complete and total throwback. And it does. But I also know that progress is almost always followed by this kind of a reflexive verberation, and then in a few years, be they two, be they four. You know, we whiplash the next direction, and all kinds of progress can be made. I just think for me, I'm making it by lifting up out of what's today and embracing what's today for the future.
Well, my neck urge from whiplash, so hopefully we don't have to keep doing it. Yeah, I'm curious.
American struggle, the Black Americans.
Struggle, especially black and I'm just am tired. I would like to if we can't, speaking of Black Americans, go into something that we talk about often and ask who all gonna be there? And so Andrew's talking about a throwback talk about My argument is that you are our resident Barack Obama, uh, and Tiffany is our resident Michelle Obama, not because y'all married, but because this is these are
the two houses in which y'all sit. I feel like I don't think so okay, well let's see, because I feel like you had the biggest argument for why Joe Biden should have invited Donald Trump into the White House, whereas.
The Boss should have I should have What do you mean I don't have an argument about that? Period. To be quite honest, I know it came fiercely down, but I thought presidents have for traditional purposes this symbolic after the election passing of the torch, we're leaving and you're coming in. And it didn't to me read as a complete and total collapse of of I don't know protocol. It's just okay, well that's.
What I understood you to be saying, Andrews. So I want you to correct me if I'm wrong.
Is that yes, that that is the people elected Donald Trump, and it is protocol for the president to invite him to the White House, and that should happen. That should not be disrupted just because we don't like the election results.
Do I Well, fundamentally, I don't think they're different. I just said I didn't bring I would not make an argument Joe Biden, you how to invite such and such and such and such. I'm also not going to lay down on the train tracks over him having done so by keeping with tradition, we just ran a race about democracy, the the need to not change our opinions on what's right based off of who gets elected.
But people should go to inauguration.
No, I wouldn't encourage people to go.
I'm sorry, I don't mean people like gen pop presidents sit on that dais and watch him be sworn in.
I think former presidents can choose to do that and keeping with the tradition and the peaceful transfer. I, however, believe that their wives, family members, or anybody else is obligated to the same. Michelle Obama never took an oath of office to the United States of America. I want
to buy. The reason why that's important to me is because we should have a bifurcation of a bifurcation should exist between what are these traditions that are held because of constitutional purposes and then individuals who just make a choice.
I don't know what the Constitution says about presidents being invited former presidents being invited to the oval or especially when they're threats to democracy, or what it says about presidents having to attend inauguration.
I've never seen that.
But I guess what I'm curious about before we get to.
The whyll transfer?
Okay, how do you peacefully transfer power to someone who you say is a threat to democracy.
By keeping with the traditions of the office that inert to the same which is, you know what, we win this election. We competed. The election is now over. There is one president at one time, and that will be that son.
Another tradition is the vice president normally invites the incoming vice president to the Naval Observatory for a tour so they can see where they'll be residing before they take office. Kamala Harris did not do that.
Well, I think we Kama Harris provided presided vice president. Kamala Harris provided over the opening of the electoral vote and the counting of the electoral votes in the authentication process of the man who defeated her in the race for the presidency. As far as I'm concerned, she has hailed with the traditions of her office, and.
That's not true, right.
I just I think that she didn't that is her constitutional responsibility success. I'm sorry I didn't say anything about her presiding over the Senate. I was.
That's what I said, because that's what I think is important.
I understand.
I don't care about the visit.
I understand.
Okay, so that's what I'm curious about. I don't know why you're you don't care about that visit, but you do care about the other visit.
I didn't care about the other visit either, you did. I just happened to disagree with your conclusion.
Well, Andrew, I get the point that you're taking because you're you're I think what you're saying is, I'm not advocating. I'm not out there like Joe Biden, you better invite don Trump. But the fact that he did, You're like, okay, that that is traditional.
So this is to me, this.
Gets to the heart of the conversation, because yes, it is tradition, that is what happens. And what I think Angela and I are saying is but he is a threat. He himself is a threat to democracy. I think the question that's more philosophical than it is political, is that is how we feel what happens when a Democrat gets elected and they say this democrat is a threat to democracy. Not that any of us are mouthpieces for the party, but there were people who felt like President Obama was
a threat to democracy. There were people who felt like President Biden was a threat to democracy. There are people who would have felt had Vice President Kamala Harris become president elected, that she would have been a threat to democracy. So in keeping with that, and I don't think these are I think it is a false equivalency to talk about what republicans and how they are a threat to
democracy andmocrats. So I'm not trying to compare the two, but I think it gets to the heart of the question of how much do we want to play by the rules here in anticipation that one day the vowels of power will shift and the expectation that we.
Have right as they always do.
I got it.
I'm like, go the rules out right. That is the thing. People presuppose that this is just a normal time.
Republicans in our office is going to be bad four years and I'm saying, ring the alarm, this is not normal.
I say, throw out the rules. That's what they did. They threw out the rules.
They just decided this is not it. They treated it like the pixie dust it is. So my thought is, let's imagine this democracy as a blank slate. F you inauguration. I'm not going to if I'm President Obama, I ain't about to sit it you inauguration on MLKA. Then I want my daughters to know I stood up on this day and said if that I ain't there.
The way Obama. I know he won't, but but it'd be different to me if Obama, as in the first case, were transitioning the presidency from himself to mister Trump. He did. He showed up, as did Michelle. She was very much so not happy to be there. We could all read that on her face and demeanor, right, But he, as far as I'm concerned, held to his part of the bargain. Trump and his loser ass attitude didn't have what was required to do the same for his successor, and all
I'm guys the reason why. So first of all, let me finish this point. So, as far as I'm concerned, previous presidents who are not the current sitting office holder are free to do whatever it is they want to do there. They are no law. They are not a threat to democracy because they no longer attend the inaugurations of the party they disagree with. That's that's that's a
that's a fair choice. I came down, however, on the side of if you are the sitting president and your pat and you are transitioning between administrations, that we have to we have to show that there can be some reconciliation here, because, like your point and I don't mean reconciliation, like we all agree and we're we're holding hands on and skipping in whatever down the stage. But this is
what it sets us up for. If we can just decide we don't like the person, and therefore we no longer have to respect any of the rules are guard rails, the same will happen to us, and so on and so forth, and so on and so forth. And I think what's been what what there is about this democracy that is defendable is that at the end of the day, we don't have to torch the country because we lost in a transaction of an election, all right, got to
that's that's that's, that's it. And I get that there is a sentiment to throw out all the rules, to buck into this and the say f you, and let that message be resounding. And I find myself terified of the consequences of that when it comes down on us.
I'm curious your thoughts of Angelo, because that's I mean, that is an institutionalist, that's a traditionalist.
What are you?
What are your thoughts?
Yes, and I respect that's what I call I call Andrew often jokingly our resident diplomat, but he's always going to take the high road and do what isn't necessary to preserve the institution. I'm making the argument that by virtue of this man's elections, the institutions are gone.
I'm making the go ahead.
No, I just wanted to correct myself and say, I believe some institutions need to be leveled. So it's not protect the institution at all costs. It's not protect the institution because what there.
Was to be leveled, I just don't know if they're going to be leveled in the way that you would like.
And I think, well, but but by advocacy before, if there is a thing that needs to be taken away to be leveled, it ought to be leveled and put energy into that. But I'm not going to put energy into the things that to me are not on the whole importance.
Okay, here's the consequential. Here's my thought.
I think that we have and I'm saying I feel like I've been lied to. I feel like I've been betrayed. I feel like when people told me that there was sound evidence to support that Donald Trump is a threat to democracy and his election would need the end of the thing that we know is imperfect, but that we are since our ancestors were here, have been working to better even when it didn't benefit us.
If it is truly an.
Endto democracy, I don't understand how you welcome that into your house. I don't understand how you welcome that into the bodies of government. I don't understand any of that. I don't understand how you clear the pathway for him not to serve time in prison. I don't understand how you have strong evidence to support a conviction for him, and you don't work to ensure that the day.
Of justice or that justice has served. I don't understand that.
What I think, what I think is the problem now is that there are a number of people who are watching Barack Obama at Jimmy Carter's funeral, talking to Donald Trump NonStop, who are seeing that he's at the inauguration, who understood, who understand that Michelle Obama stood her ground and did not attend for another reason. Who understand that Kamala Harris, who was called trash by jd Vance, did not welcome her into her home until it's time for
her to move out. I think that we are saying one thing, asking people to stand with us and saying that thing and doing something very different, and that is more dangerous than the threat that Donald Trump could ever be, because what happens is you lose credibility with people because you don't look honest.
I feel lied to because.
Everything that I've seen says that this man does not care about the rules. The fact that Elon Musk will have an office on the White House campus, the.
Fact that tech companies writ Lodge large bought their way into Donald Trump's pockets by funding the inauguration, that Coke gave him the first commemorative inauguration bottle, like the way that these these companies left and right are throwing out DEI,
we are not acknowledging the true threat he is. If our leaders, the people we've elected, the people that we've campaigned for, the folks that our parents and everybody else has donated to, are no longer saying the same thing, that is far more dangerous than.
Any constitutional protection we could ever have.
It is far more dangerous than any area of decorum thing that we could say is just the right thing to do. Damn that I'm not welcoming the devil into my house. The Bible says resist the devil and he will flee from you. Then we got to resist get the break.
I want to get on the other side. Well, on the other side of this break, I want to get into who's not going to be there, and that is forever flowed as Michelle Obama, and I want to remind our viewers how she feels about Donald Trump and why she might not be there. And I want to get back in some more of what you had to say, so we'll see you on our side.
We will never benefit from the affirmative action of generational wealth if we bankrupt the business.
If we bankrupt the business.
Or choke in a crisis, we don't get a second, third.
Or fourth chance.
If things don't go our way. We don't have the luxury of whining or cheating others to get further ahead. No, we don't get to change the rules, so we always win. If we see a mountain in front of us, we don't expect there to be an escalator waiting to take us to the top.
No, we put our heads down. We get to work.
In America, we do something.
So those, of course, were the words forever flows Michelle Obama, who tossed the deuce of city inauguration today, she said, count me out. I ain't got com I love that so many people have been sending around all these pictures of Michelle Obama talking about if I'll send you this, I ain't coming. She she is me, I am her.
I would not be there. And I think this is kind of the point Angela was making, because Angela, some of the things that you were talking about, and someone from across the aisle someone could say those are policy differences, like DEI, you could say, those are policy differences, not necessarily a threat. That is, that is like the baseline
of how they're threatening us. The more scary thing, I think is what you talked about about the tech companies and what they touched and how they have bought their way into this administration, which quite frankly, we have not dug into deep enough. I don't mean we native Land, I mean we the country. We the constituents of America, have not examined that very dangerous relationship, the threat that we are on the global stage with all of these
people who are inept leading these agencies. So I think you had raised a really good point about normalizing this when we see people normally, when you are engaging with this man who questioned your very citizenship, who said that you were born in Kenya, who disrespected key key after that, And you know what it reminds me of. I'll tell
y'all which y'all all of us can appreciate. In the green room on some of these cable news hits, okay, there are people who are MAGA extremists, Trump apologists, and they're on with people who you know are democratic exposed people, people on the left, and in the green room they all ki ki in and hahan and oh oh.
Did you you and your family went here? Blah blah blah. I won't tell you.
I never did that shit in my life. I wasn't never out there performing. I wasn't playing no character, ain't no key key. I don't give a damn with you and your family did over the weekend. I'm not talking to you about it. We can talk about policy when we get on air. You're not my friend, I'm not trying to reach across the aisle. You're not my good
distinguished person. And sometimes I think those performative antics do more harm to our democracy by pretending the thing that we see, the clear and present danger that is before us is not a clear and present danger, and the quite the quiet truth that should be allowed truth is Donald Trump is an existential threat to not only America, but our lives as American citizens, as black people, and our livelihoods as people of this country.
So I just disagree with the politeness. Uh, I don't.
I don't. I don't think so. Your example of not sitting in the green room kicking, I've never done that either. It's not my thing.
Any of us.
No, I just want to be clear up about the difference. I don't and I don't and I don't in Florida with wishing people happy birthdays who don't believe in my existence and yeah, all that that is performative. I have no obligation to that. I don't think. You know, many people don't have an obligation. Michelle Obama has never taken an oath of office to the country, not as first Lady,
and not in any way prior to that. I'm not saying that to say she had loved the country and it is fighting tooth and nail to protect it for herself and for her daughters and their porogeny all that, But she doesn't have an obligation in regards to the levers of power. In the exchange of that, all good.
She can I just real quickly in her She's not.
For the games. I love that about her, and I love that she gets to show her protests in this way. I wish her husband had joined her to add even greater weight to that, because I don't think he himself is consequential to this passage of power. I do think that the current president and administration are the fact that the vice president didn't invite dance and his wife is of zero import Number one, he has no job responsibility except to wait for the president to die. Uh, and
that that he gives them. Yeah, they have no constitutional obligations of the constitutional obligation to any duty other than to stand in in the absence of the president.
Yeah, so.
You're off the hook. As far as I'm concerned, I not that not a tradition.
She did.
She held her Are we mad at her because she presided over the accounting of the electoral vogus?
I wish that she would have been more contentious about it, sure, but no, I'm not mad at her for doing what was her obligation. I think there's obligation and decorum.
Though we both we both signaled that the difference, which is I can't give it a about t at the House. I didn't give a damn about at the House first time either with Vice President with Biden. What I care about is that we don't get to throw out the guard rails simply because we remember.
It's not that we lost.
It's like, I want to make sure that we're really clear about the fact that this isn't and George W. Bush felt like an existential crisis too, right, George W.
Bush, this isn't.
That was the example I was about to go to, Yeah, it's.
It's it felt like that, But.
This is, this is democratic.
This is this is still very That was awful, and
this is still very different. If we listen to the campaign ads that were run, if we listened to the rhetoric of every talking head, every spokesperson, every surrogate for the campaign, if we listened to the Vice President herself in the debates, if we listened to Joe Biden talk about this man in twenty twenty when he ran against Donald Trump, this is very different, or all of that was a lie, And so we have to come to terms with the fact that either he is a threat
to democracy and we treat him the same way we would teach any treat any other world leader that is a threat to democracy, or he's not.
But we can't have it both ways.
Well, But so first of all, I don't I don't disagree with you, which is why I think people have to be really careful about rhetoric. You have to be very careful about the words that come out your mouth and how you assign them to other people. But that being said, we don't if he is going to assume all of the levers of power, it does us no good to go underground and pretend that he won't be making these decisions he and his administration for the next four years that impact us. I no, I get it.
But but we're to what end. I guess what I guess in what end?
I think that Andrew we Here's here's the part where I'm gonna just say. This is where I feel like Republicans have balls. I think they have balls on the wrong things. I think their balls are false. But here's where I think they have balls. I think that if the roles were reversed, were reversed, and they really thought that this person that was elected that beat their team was a threat to democracy, there would be more of
a proachest. I'm not suggesting in January sixth, what's gonna be my next point, But what I'm saying is there is a difference between tearing up your own house and saying these are the ways in which I won't engage with you because you are a threat to everything I stand for. And I just think that we say that with the rhetoric, We say that at rallies, we say that in debates.
But when it's come time, it comes time for.
A leader to have passed away, to pass the baton, we'd be like, good job, man. It's not an NBA playoff game. This ain't the finals. Like this is not just like the better team won. That's not what this is. It's very different. We are going into a war for our livelihood. We know, you know from the last administration.
What's at stake. You were a target.
This is not.
Somebody who you welcome into your space and say, now, how can I make this transition easier for you?
That no.
So my question, I guess back to the two of you, is when the election is over and the new administration is sworn into office. Is the argument then to people to not engage any That's.
What I'm but no, I don't think you're saying That's what you're saying is but that. But that is a question to talk about because and that's legitimate, because that's what happened the first time around. He was inviting Steve Harvey for some dumbfuck reason to talk about policy, Like, I hope that people don't let their hubris lead them into an office that they don't belong.
But that is the question.
If you know, if you're there to advocate, if you're there to fight, do you show up to the meeting? Do you meet with his sick of fans? Do you meet with his cabinet members? Try to, you know, sway them to your side, knowing that it probably won't happen. I don't have the answer to that question, Andrew. Honestly, my immediate thought, without giving it its due consideration, is no, because I don't think that you can squeeze justice from this turn up. I don't think that these are people
who are good actors. I don't think that they are acting in good faith, So I would say no. But what do you say do you disagree.
Well, we talked before about, for instance, the common cause that might exist on some level of policy around the Justice Department accountability being you know, there were some things that I think, while they may have arrived at their position for the wrong reasons, we know them to be costly and devastating and life disruptive, if not ending, for our communities. And so if the window exists for us to level that part of the system, do we walk through that door or not. I don't believe that you
participate in stagecraft. I don't believe that you are. I don't think you willingly and ignorantly go into into being a prompt. It's why I refuse to do a post meeting after I lost. We're not sitting down to talk about my agenda and what advice I have. I've never been governor. I can't give you advice on what that looks like. And you rejected my agenda during the course of this race. There's no progress to be had there. No, I'm not going to sit down with you for it would be a useful idiot.
If he says I want to talk to you about a black agenda, would you sit down and talk so so here's.
The thing without preconditions.
Yeah, and I think that's the important part. What we know about Donald Trump from the last administration, and sadly that's all I have to go on is he loves to have the conversations for the photo op. I'll never forget that meeting with all those HBCU presidents piled into the Oval office looking like Sardine's.
It was humiliating.
So I think for me, what I would what I would have to acknowledge is I'm not likely a voice that he can hear from. I am not opposed, as you guys know, to being behind the scenes figuring out who those spokespeople are somebody who wasn't as somebody who wasn't as critical of his agenda as somebody who he thinks might be a friend.
But they're actually.
Gonna be a Frederick Douglass to an Abraham Lincoln kind of a maybe there's that. I'm definitely not opposed to figuring out how we get our stuff across the finish line, because I'll be honest with you, I am so disappointed by the Biden administration and the last and final days and how our stuff wasn't handled. So if there's an opening in the Trump administration. By all means, let's strategize. That does not mean that I want to go tomorrow Lago, key key, and ro Smores with your ass.
I'm not doing that.
So I think it's different, And I do like that stretch of like, well, what would it take for us to get there? Who are those players? Who are those people? What's on the agenda? Our genda changes nineteen seventy two would arguably since eighteen sixty four, you know, like it has been the same, and it is. It is freedom, and we are still striving for it is. It is not here, and it is not lasting. It is but for a moment, and it is far too fleeting. We
have an agenda that we need to get accomplished. That as black liberation at all caps. The CBC says, no permanent friends, no permanent enemies, just permanent interests.
We got to see if we can ride that thing out.
But right now I'm hot this hell, and I probably should not be the person y'all send it to the oval.
I'm just all right, Well, let's take it. Let's take a quick break.
Yeah.
On the other side of this, I want to talk about protests because what is also happening today, there are protests across the city.
What you will not see is a lot of black.
People at this protest. So we should get into that on the other side of the break'll get me into a chance to cool down, because she how cool? All right, we're back. So I look, I the first pussy hat I see. I'm rolling my eyes at it, like y'all got it.
If it wasn't a thought, i'd smack it off, right.
I just I don't care about it. I'm not protesting on this day. I am enjoying time with our community with Michael Harriet about the dream.
Yes, exactly exactly.
I just and but I think this kind of goes to what you were saying, Angela about engaging like you're still in the fight. You're willing to sit down with them and figure out strategically what it is. I have to say. I'm I'm probably to the left of you on that. I don't want to even do that. I don't want to sit across from these people. I think people like you probably should, you know, but.
I said I should not go. I said I was sending people in.
But behind that, like you, you can behind the scenes try to advance something. I just don't trust these people, you know, I don't think that there. I don't know what areas we could find common ground on and work on something. I think I'd rather put all my energy and effort into protecting the community, because you know, that's where the most harm comes. Unfortunately, FBI, we talked about that before.
If they're talking about agetting, and this was Andrew's point, I think earlier on there are.
Some institutions that should be level because they've never seen this.
But but I think I'm very clear when they talk about level in the FBI cash Hotel, is no talking about we got to crush operations like cointel prone. We can't do that. He's talking about how can we weaponize these institutions to serve our King, Donald Trump. We don't have a president, ladies and gentlemen, we have a king, and that is what we are are looking at in this landscape. I don't want to participate in it, and I don't know how to do that and protect our people at the same time.
But I'm sure as hell gonna try to figure it out.
I think there's a lot of crossover between harm, you know, protecting our people which basically equals harm reduction, like don't advance, Like, I don't expect you to make me the millionaire, but I expect you not to drag me back, not to
drag me backwards. Now again, I don't know that I have to trust these people or their motivations for why they want to do a thing, because I think I can say pretty clearly from Jump Street that they're going to be self motivated at every turn that if we can just walk into the room anticipating that whatever they do, whatever we walk away with is going to be to their advantage more than it's going to be to mind. Their reasons for getting here are going to be different
than the reasons I have forgetting here. But if it still takes aim at that same motherfucking policy that got us here, then let's take aim at it and blow it away.
Well where do you stand on protests? Like I feel like black people have done so much.
I just I don't know how I can add, like does our protest still look like marching?
Are we you know?
Circulating petitions? Are we showing up? Are we being disruptive?
Are we you know?
I don't know. I think it depends on the stakes I definitely don't think it's a I don't think it's a strategy we rule out. I do think it depends
on the stakes of the fight at the time. But I also think, just like our civil rights leader, which we should take lessons from today, that we had a Malcolm and a Martin who the world experienced as being completely separate thisoint know, disconnected move ments and body mens represented as you know, one of peace loving, god fearing you know, uh, a leader of the of the army, and the other being radical, untraditional, willing to go to the hilt for our people, and they both I don't
think any one of us would say there wasn't equal relevance and import from from both if we were to look at it that way, they were both. I think that's what I'm again, I don't think the lines are as I have just described. I think that is the super observation of what that was. But I agree none of that, to me is the truth of the matter.
But what I know is the truth of the matter is is that, just as Angela acknowledged, I may not be the person that sent into that room, but we should think together about who that right is so that when after that meet not go on TV and blast them that they understand from whence I come. My blasting is necessary to give them greater leverage in the room
toward the negotiated end that we're fighting for. And I still think that black people know this lesson, and I don't think we should ever betray this lesson that advances are to be made and we all got roles to play and how we get there. Some of us gonna throw the bombs from outside, others are going to set the trap inside, and still others are going to drag us over the finish line and other ways. So I just think we have we are dexterious, and we got to show that dexterity.
Now I agree with that.
I want to switch gears slightly to the pomp and circumstance of it all because I remember in twenty sixteen, we had strong feelings about people who chose to perform at Donald Trump's inauguration. Recently, Woopy Goldberg had this to say about Carrie Underwood performing.
People do what they do for whatever reasons. It's like Joe and Mika.
Did what they did.
They felt that's what they needed to do, And I gotta stand behind them, yeah, you know, and I stand behind her if she's no, no, not or not, because if I believe I have the right to make up my mind to go perform someplace, I believe they have the same right, of course, and so I have to Yeah, I gotta. I have to support. Doesn't mean I'm particularly interested in what I won't be watching, you know, but that's me.
But I'm just curious because last time there was such blowback, blowback, especially for black performers, it was Chrissette Michelle, I Am christ Michelle. No more was Travis Green Travis and Apologize Gospels thinger. So I'm just curious to know has the temperature changed. There are now we see in this as a strategy move.
No.
I honestly, I think will Be Gobert probably would have felt that same way about Chrissette Michelle and I. Actually I'm glad that we heard the exact clip because I actually agree with a whoopee now that I've heard what she said, I don't expect anything from Carrie Underwood. I remember the little bit that she did on Obama Care with Brad Paisley. I think it was at the CMA's or somewhere wherever it took place. Well, So yet this is behavior I'd expect from her. I do expect better
from black people. I did expect better from Chrissette Michelle. I did expect better from Steve Harvey. I did expect better from people who were so eager to drink from the white man's cup that they scurried the ass is over there to you know, to do something, to tap dance for them, all of it. And we hold ourselves to a higher standard because we are we have first hand experience with how damaging and harmful this system can be.
So when you go and perform for the face of this system that is taking this system even further back, even further to the right, even more oppressive, even more draconian.
Then I do have to wonder what is your intention? So I agree with Whoopee if she wanted to perform, who gives a damn. I can't name three Carrie Underwood songs don't really care about her, and people who listen to her imagine it's gonna be a lot of other performers performing too. But if Lol Wayne showed up, I'm like messing with Little Wayne, Like that's an embarrassment and he was kind of out. That's why I wasn't on that Super Bowl conversation because I'm like, he was out
here real maga for a minute. Y'all dont want to buy an informative foot bowl. I don't care.
I got plenty of other people I can support other than anybody who was supporting as president.
What the reason why he was shounding real crazy in his last couple of performances. So even if even if it wasn't maga issuees because the quality of performance is gone down.
I'm just saying karma is a But the truth is is that for these folks who make their living off of our buying into what it is they do, what it is they're selling, how it is or whatever, these choices have consequences, right and both ways. Right regardless of which side wins, these choices have consequences. And I can every day vote with my wallet on whether I'm going to be a consumer, continue to patronize you or or what.
But I have the same stance that y'all have as a relations to the folks who went to the first Trump thing, and not just that, but on a whole range of issues. When you show up on the opposite side of where I am on issues that are consequential to my life existence. Were gonna have problems and you might not know me from tom Adam Cat, but just know none of my money is coming to you. It's going to a New York benefit.
Y'all were talking about going to these meetings. I just want to just do another throwback because I love our forever flowtus. Michelle Obama in two thousand and nine was invited. This was something around inauguration.
It was like.
The after the inauguration, the Senate lunch.
Yes, that's what, thank you.
She was seated next to then I think House Speaker John Baber leader beleader Leader John Banner is the speaker.
He was speaker. I'm sorry, I said, I thought we were talking about Mitch McConnell.
No, no, no, this was House Speaker, Republican John Banner from Ohio. We're going to roll this clip. There's no sound for those of you who are listening and not watching. Those of you who are watching, you can see that. Yes, she when I tell you, she ain't got no time for whatever this man was saying. He could have been saying, these are the winning lottery numbers. She got irol after irow she and her food. She ain't given him, no
eye contact, She's barely looking her way. And you can tell how disgusted she was that she's supposed to sit there and pretend that this man wasn't part of a
machine that was calling her husband. I'm not saying he was not an American who was questioning his qualifications, who was questioning his integrity, who had accused them of doing a terrorist fist bump, who had talked about her physically, who has talked about her personality, talked about everything she said, she wasn't about to be Therefore.
She was terr right.
So she said there.
Everything about her body language said fuck you. From the South side of Chicago to my spirit, from Whitney Young High School to the Wild Hundreds, I'm telling you, double middle finger to you, I ain't got it for you. And I have to say in these times, in that time, I remember some people even in our community, being critical like, oh she could have been nicer, blah blah blah. No, at that time, she was doing the right thing. This time she's doing the right thing.
I'm not even going I agree.
I know that, And she did.
You see it all over her fail being. In fact, it would be a hard thing for me to ask her to join me at X thing. You know what I mean, Like, I may have an obligation, he perceived obligation. I don't want anyone to think that I don't get what it means to send non verbal signals to people that by your presence, by your existence, you are connoting something to the people who are looking.
ERTI lobby and corporate movements who are having like these welcome inauguration parties, and people are like, oh, I have to go.
It's for my job.
I don't want to, but I work for Coke, I work for this company or law.
I can't speak to none of that, but I do know as it relates to obligation. There are things that I understand to be obligatory and I and I by and large will defend those things. And then they are the things that are just your choice, that are like, Okay, you know what, I could have done this or not done this, and it wouldn't have been a world of
difference to the consequences of the exchange of power. But then there are the choices that you can make that show as real protests and what Michelle Obama has given us is I think a will and by the way, we've assigned meaning to this because her statement ain't say nothing about what she's doing and why she ain't going. But I have to read it from it exactly. All of us can read it from understood. Not it need not be stated, right. She ain't got to say a
damn thing. We know exactly what's going on. We need that too, We need that too, that that somebody's reminding us that it ain't right. Yeah, And I think she has sent and will continue to send powerful reverberations by her not being there and I and I embrace it. And I, as I said before, with your husband would join her.
DNA.
He's officially the president. Angelo, what is keeping you up at night? Not that this man is officially the president for those Angela just let out a deep side.
Because you know my blood pressure trying to keep my blood pressure load. I'm serious, I literally got to take it every day. Uh hmmm.
I think they're pledged to go after political enemies. I think the super litigious nature of those who Trump is rehired into the administration, the things that they will litigate. You know that it's or people would just kind of let go of the settlements that we've already seen happen from media companies, the fact that there's such a severe double standard, and what that says to our children, you know what, the ways in which crafty and intelligent world
leaders will take advantage of this administration. I think the real lack of separation. We used to have talk about the separation between church and state. Now there's no separation between corporate and state. And I think that the blending of you know, how you get to power is through money and privilege is really a very dangerous precedent.
So there's so much.
Well what would you I mean, as we're officially in this administration now, what would you guys like us to focus on on the podcast? Because there's going to be so much happening all the time, So should we like, how do we go forward in terms of what we do here? I mean, I don't want us personally, I don't want to talk about Donald Trump all the time. It's going to be hard not to, But I would like us to offer something else to people other than
what this administration is doing. How do we strike that balance or do you all think we need to I.
Thought your question was going to the direction of if we have to cover them, what pieces of it are we trying to track and because thousand percent that we should be across the range just showing fine, we can't look at the national model as a true example of representative democracy, but let's look here at the state of Maryland and let's assess that if we had our what what would this look like? And then what decisions might flow from it. Let's highlight some of that. So I'm
with you. You know, we talked about that before, and I think that those are really important bright spots that must be held up for us at this time. But I also think it's we have to be ever vigilant that while we were sleeping, that we didn't lose something very important, critical fundamental to our existence now in the future because we were sleep And so watching him and covering them
is not about following Trump. Watching them and covering them is going to be about the threat or opportunity it presents to our community.
For me, yeah, we have to and that's the thing I hope that we can center more. And Andrew, you hit on this earlier today, center more on what it means to protect us and advance our causes. And so if this, if this podcast can be a part of an organizing body, I'm here for it. Like I never wanted to do media for media's sake. It It was
always for the advancement and liberation of like you. And so to the extent that we can use this platform, utilize this platform, utilize the gifts and talents that God gave us to do that. I am down so we can coverage. We can do coverage for oversight, but we also need to do coverage for strategy and moving by. So I would like to see that. Even though Tiff was asking an audience, consider me part of the audience, and then.
You a good point. That's a good point. We should ask the audience, like, what do you guys want to hear from now that we're officially in this administration? What do you guys want to hear from us? What role do you want to play in the podcast? You know, we have a very open table, So we invite your comments, your questions, your videos.
Even when y'all get mad.
Even we play y'all videos and y'all get mad.
I read your YouTube comments. Whatever the good, bad, and ugly, I see it. All because it's his community, you know, and we hold each other to to to a higher account than I think we know.
If you didn't answer the question oh yet either you just say you don't want to.
What would you like to see us cover?
Oh?
I would like us to see what's below the fold, you know, not what's above the folte on A one, but what's on you know, F three below the fold.
And I think you know I have right job about criminal justice.
I care about what's I want our people who are behind bars and know they're not forgotten. For the past few weeks, I'll tell you guys, we had that gentleman who's a member of Alpha Bay Alpha Fraternity Incorporated, asked a question about disability. So for the past few weeks, I have been looking into that. So stay tuned because I will come back and talk about the intersection of people of color, black people and disability and policies around that.
So that's something that I'll be talking about. Of course, I have a lens of foreign policy and how we show up on the globe. I just don't want to get caught up in like the outrage every week. You know, Donald Trump said this, and his cabinet member said this
in this exchange happened on Capitol Hill. I'd like to have deeper, more philosophical discussions around what some of these things mean and keep in mind our people, to give our people something to believe in again, because it's so easy to check out, but we have to remind people, hey, this country for eight years was an amazing place to be, even though we had a lot of challenges.
But we can do that again and do it better this time, So we'll see.
I mean, I know, sometimes it's going to be hard not to talk out the shiny object. You know, it's gonna be hard not to address the disrespect or the insult or the fist fight that happens on Capitol Hill, which I am predicted you're gonna I'm predicting because they getting real froggy and at some point somebody gonna leave.
You know, you got it, but you know to they said that we are in talking about the what's above the fold, We're going to talk about it through a lens that centers our experience and how it is going to impact us. So that doesn't worry me because I think we've had an exhibited example of trying to show like Look, this isn't going to be the generic talk you're getting on M and NA nah and that yeah, this is going to be all right, Well, how is
this landing with us? Because we're really ever considered in this conversation right.
Well, I just I want to just say one tiny little thing, and that is that I have always had an eye or try to be true and authentic and live in service to community, which is why it's a pleasure to do this with both you guys, because we all have that in common. And trying to gain favor, you know, or secure things outside of that has never been my intention.
And you know, people come and go.
But I think what people know about all of us here is we have never tried to appease the people who come and go. The corporate structure can like you today and hate you tomorrow, but we have stayed true to our community. And I just want to take this moment of the hundreds it felt like thousands, maybe it was thousands, but the thousands of people who this week, this past week, I should say, have reached out, tweeted, posted tag.
DM all of it.
I have seen your comments and I just appreciate you all for acknowledging the work that we do here on Native Land and how I've always tried to show up for community despite who was in what position of power.
So I thank you all for riding.
With me at the emailk everybody, and.
We still have a dream.
You have a dream, and we work for freedom.
Always of all powers to the people. Welcome home, y'all.
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