Do WE need to have a talk about BLACK Intellectualism?

very good show. So now that we got cocky Charles with us, you know, it's a little tough every now and then, but we're all good. I also want to let you all know, if you didn't catch it, we have an episode with Jennae Nelson, who is tremendous lawyer, the president of the NAACP Legal Defense Fund, who also argued the oral arguments at the Supreme Court of the United States on the Kyli case in Louisiana. So she joins us live on an episode that's already been shot,

and we hope that you'll check that out as well. So, anyway, y'all, what are we getting into today?

there's a lot going on. I think one of the things, you know, we owe it to our listening fan to tune in on, is this what's happening with Letitia James at the attorney in New York. But also how this is sending signals, I think across the country to either break, bend or bow or resist this administration. Powerful statements that she made here.

mother and father in the span of a year. Angie Stone, as we know, passed away earlier this year after a horrific car crash, and DiAngelo was just, you know, part of our culture and innate part of our culture growing up. But one of the things I did want to highlight is I was going through it and earlier this year we lost Heer Gotti from fifty four from diabetes. We lost DJ mister C. We lost Rico Wade early in

his life. As we go through this, we realize that we've had many people from Magoo at age fifty, DMX age fifty, Bis, Marquis fifty seven, Coolio, just Shy of sixty, heavy d who collapsed outside of his home at the age of forty four. And so I think that maybe that's a mini pot or something else that me and Andrew talk about on the side. But all love goes out to Angie Stone, uh DiAngelo endonnesses and particularly to their son. They leave here without a mother and a father.

And then, I mean, I don't like to necessarily do this, but if you were to look at many of the comments these guys made juxtaposed against how these guys look, they look like the comments they made, if that makes sense. I mean, so there was nothing attractive about them, and there was nothing attractive about the words that came out of their mouth. However, these are people that assume leadership, and when you look at leaders right now, you know you have people who are saying, let's not let's not

talk about this at all. This isn't an issue, this is childhood discretion whatever. Whereas Democrats, whenever this has happened, we're the first ones to rush through and say people should not say X, Y Z. And I think The best example is we are moral compass is one that No, I'm not telling Jay Jones to get out of the race, but I'm like Jay Jones, like, what were you thinking in those text messages? You cannot espouse those things, et cetera. Let voters determine whether or not they vote for you,

et cetera, et cetera, et cetera. But Jay, you got to have more discretion in that. You don't see the same balance on the Republican side when you have that racism and you have that misogyny, et cetera.

In a political article that dropped yesterday, I just want to add something.

and talking about turning on gas chambers. Since then, jd Vance has said that the Young Republicans chat pales in comparison to Jane Jay Jones's text.

opponents and opponents in gas chambers. And some of the There were twenty nine hundred pages of the chats and they were shared among millennial and gen Z repeaters Republicans forgive me. And this was between January and August, and it chronicles a campaign to seize control of the Republican Party to be hardliners on the Trump agenda.

referencing Jay Jones. If you can just share with our viewers who that is, what he's running for and the depths behind him.

his peers and colleagues. He was then told to stop, and then he called his colleague and kind of reiterated some of the same views he had about wanting to UH to go down the path of political political violence. And it is now it's caught fire. Stephen Miller talks about it, Jadie Vance has talked about it. Everyone has

talked about it. Because as we know, and I hope our viewers know, the most one of the most important races we have coming up extremely soon is the race in Virginia for not only governor but the entire state lieutenant governor and attorney general as well. And Jay is somebody I know. Jay's a young black attorney, great guy, and I think that even when we make mistakes, I think Democrats sometimes are oftentimes are are reluctant to say, like, what the were you doing? But this is a what

the were you doing? Moment?

Certainly not over a six seven month span of time, where there's no contradiction, there's only a doubling down and the line of thinking, in the line of the way in which they perceive and the way in which they talk about folks of color, black folks and their political opponents.

Jay obviously elected official who in my opinion, really ought to know better and certainly should be questioning whether or not he should have ever been in a conversation one like this, but two with the Republican colleague that he thought was what gonna have his back one day, when these folks have shown us time and time again that that's not who they are. So I'm a little baffled on that one, and I would love a more complete

and exhaustive explanation about what happened. But but I think on the young Republicans part of this thing for a long time, y'all, a lot of us operated by the belief that with time and with progress, that party produces a more enlightened person, It produces a person who is more reflective of their time, if you will, And I just think that we've been shown time and time again.

If it isn't for the Dylan roofs of the world, or the young white male extremists who are right now, you know, frankly the most dangerous thing walking around in America. And when they make us the ire of their impact,

really bad stuff happens in our community. So I'm disabolved myself of the belief that over time we'll get people who are more thoughtful and who reflect a more diverse world around them, because exactly what I think we're getting our throwback to, you know, the nineteen forties, fifties, sixties.

You know, it's like, what is going on. We're talking about interpersonal conflict, you know, breakups or how to navigate finances, but we're not talking about this. So I think what is baffling to me is that one it is not a bigger story. Two that there are folks who would say, oh, they just had a lapse in judgment and give and even call them young people. These are grown men. These are grown men who are grown enough to hold leadership

position in the Republican Party. And here's the part that's said, I'm sure y'all can align with this. It would be one thing if what they put in text did not

translate into policy. And on that right to the point where you know, again, the more progressive side of the country, the best coast I like to call it, has decided that a state of emergency is necessary right in La County given the number of ice raids that are taking place that is just one area where we see these policies being so detrimental, the racist ideology, the white supremacy behind these policies being what is guiding how they interface

with other Americans and other human beings. Okay, that's fine, we can move on. There is there a clip.

work for this administration. It's just getting to the point where it's so dangerous and a conversation I had this weekend. I told you guys last week that I was off to Michael Harriet's for his Standers party. I missed you guys there. You all were busy this weekend. But we talked about what is the point? Was the question I asked, is what is the point when I say, what am

I going to regret six months from now? When they indicted to James, Was that the day that I should have said, you know what, I got to get the fuck out of here. When they started snatch people off the streets and we normalized it, was that the day that I should have said, time to get my passport and gives guy to here. And as we see this happening increasingly and they're flooding the zone with chaos, I fear that people are tuning out or normalizing chaos to

where chaos seems normal and quiet seems eerie. And I just don't know what it's going to take. California is on the front line, but we see what this's happening in Chicago is coming to Portland, like authoritarianism is coming soon to a city near you.

or they just say that there is no connection. But how you get from these young Republicans who are manifesting themselves into leadership and their racism dictating policy. How can we communicate that better? How can I communicate that better? Connecting A to B. Does that make sense?

Project twenty twenty five. The reason they can throw, the reason they can dismiss a quarter million black women off the job and have no remorse, have no care concern in the world for how those folks are going to provide for themselves, their children, their grandchildren, or whomever it is that they take responsibility for them, take responsibility for themselves. They don't have to see the humanity in those folks because they never ever considered it in the first place.

They if you have compared a woman a human to a monkey, right, swinging from trees eating bananas, And that's not to insult the monkey, right, This is outside of that. This is if you consider them non human. They care not, they feel not, They have no needs nothing that resembles what you would want for your family or what you need for your family, then it's easy to castigate them.

When I listen to Stephen Miller and the way in which he talks about the opposition, you would almost think one you would never conclude that this is a human opposition like that. There's no way that these folks live, breathe draw air, you know, oxygen, survive off of the you know the same thing, right, And in his mind's eye, I have to believe that he makes no likeness between him and the people who he opposes. You are nothing,

you will be nothing. You are you know you're not worth this that and the third, how can you muster that kind of animis towards your fellow man or woman. Well, the only way you can muster that kind of animists towards somebody like that is one if you don't see them as equal to you. Right, they are of no equal to you. And I got a funny comparison, but I won't make it here, But basically it's that they screw somebody you like and you kind of got some

issues with them. That's the only time I've ever seen that level of animis directed toward somebody on the opposite side is if you have been thoroughly royally messed over by them, or that you don't see them on your level, not needing the same things you do, not appreciating the same things you do. And I said that sort of jocularly, but in truth, that's the only time I've ever had deep, deep, deep, non humane animists for a person is in those kinds

of stark contrasts. So I don't think people have to make the conclusion, don't think they have to connect them.

But for those of us who are looking on trying to say, why should it matter to me that these guys are raising up yet another generation of racist haters, is because they're racist haters one day become JD bands And but for their pretty words and they're pretty grees, they're acceptable in society, and we never have to trace back to the fact that they don't see their fellow human as you may at all.

This happened on the Joe Budden broadcast this week. Take a list and then we'll discuss on the other side.

he hosted on Al Jazeera English. One of his interviews went viral during a post October seventh where he got the former Israeli Deputy Minister uh Danny Aylin to admit to concede that the response to Palestinians and Gaza was in fact collective punishment. He owns a bookstore. He's an

amazing writer, He's a professor. He was unfortunately dismissed from CNN because he said from the river to the sea while speaking at the u N. If you're like me, you might genuinely wonder why is that considered anti Semitic. Some people of the community consider it so because Hamas

used this phrase in twenty seventeen. Uh and some members of the Jewish Committee community thinks the phrase suggests that as a Palestinian h millik group, militant group and only used in that perspective that suggests that Israel does not

have the right to exist. Mark mont Hill has been incredibly clear that he does not believe that it was a call for justice, and he made the reference when he was addressing the u N and he was just supporting Palestinian freedom which of course I certainly do as well. But this is why I thought I wanted to get my co host perspectives on this. There seems to be the death of black intellectualism, particularly when it comes to who has a microphone and viral clips like this take

up so much space. To me, it was clear that his co host felt small, and you know, even him saying you use tricky words and Mark responding with I use words that are tricky to you. And anytime somebody I think cannot take to be questioned or responds with a full temper tantrum, it is always about that other person, not about like it wasn't Mark. He didn't do anything. And if someone is so small that you can't articulate your point without throwing a temper tantrum or insulting another person.

I'm happy that Mark showed both tides that yes, I'm an intellectual, but don't give up in this studio, you know, And I think it's import and for people to see that yes you can still be an intellectual and demand your respect. That doesn't make you soft. I'm concerned though, in our community because when you look at the just the plain data, you can take my perspectives out of it. There seems to be an erosion. I don't consider myself a member of the black intellectual class, but I do

thrive in that space. I love to be around sometimes Andrew, when you're talking, I forget I'm a host on the podcast, Like I'm just listening to you because you're saying something so brilliant to me, or something that I didn't know. I had no perspective, and I enjoy hearing that I have curiosity.

People keep promoting AI like oh, look at this fancy new toy and not immediately countering it with the dangers of our community. The level of cognitive impairment of even just moderate use of AI like chat GPT is comparable to being concussed. Our literacy rates across black children. I'm only seventeen percent of black fourth graders scored at or above proficiency. Eighth graders could not a significant percentage of eighth graders could not read a paragraph and summarize it

and say what it is. We're in a space we're telling people it's a time for reading books is considered the leitist and it's just frustrating to me. And I have to say, I'm sure we'll disagree here, or maybe we won't disagree, but I hope there are different perspectives than mine, because I have to say I am one of those people. I do not respect everybody's opinion the more like just because you have a microphone, I don't always respect your opinion. This guy who's talking, I don't

respect his opinion. I Andrew, we talked. I'm not Mary, I don't have children. If I'm giving you advice on either, it's totally fine for you to say, what are you basing this on? Where did you get that information from? And I'm not going to be offended by you asking me that, because even if I might be right, you don't have to respect my opinion. I don't respect everybody's

opinion on politics. You might be right on occasion. I don't respect your opinion, So I just think in this environment of these viral clips, I'm curious y'all take on all of this because I don't want to make it just about Mark. But Mark is there because people turn their back on him. Mark should not be on this podcast.

He gets the opportunity to talk to people. But Mark should still be at CNN, if you ask my opinion, Mark should have had a contract soon as seeing this every let you go, somebody should have snatched Mark up and said that. And I just think they put dumb people on TV sometimes just because you have more likes than followers, and they don't celebrate our intellectualism. So I leave it there.

podcast before. This was the first clip I've ever seen of it is with is with Mark on it, and that probably distances me even greater from a lot of folks out there who probably you know, it's the number five or top five or top ten for a reason that means people are going there to subscribe. The reason why I think I value a voice like Marx being able to cut through in a top ten, top five audience is that at least somebody gets an exposure to his perspective that may not have otherwise had it. But

exactly what they're getting exposed to also matters. I don't know if that's the rhythm of it from day to day or whatever's broadcast week to week whenever it shows, but I've got to believe that knowing Mark well enough that on a regular basis, he's probably being able to enter into that conversation, that discussion a higher level of

discourse than what we saw exhibited there. Maybe he's entering into entering into that conversation some terms, some theory of changes, some beliefs that then people go and google afterwards they didn't know before, and now the curiosity has been piqued and they're going to check it out and to that extent, I think that is a good thing. I think it is probably not a good thing in society when sort of our thoughtful folks are only talking to other thoughtful folks.

I think that's probably not the setup that we want. However, I know for sure I don't want to watch that fight every day. I don't want to watch that kind of discourse every day. I don't know that I want to see it any day. To be frank frank with you, Tiffany, what you brought up around some of the literacy rates. What the damage that AI is doing to quote unquote simplify somebody's life. But what is it dus life? Is it dumbing down in the process? That bothers me to

a great extent. My kids know when they walk in the door after they get they snacked, the first thing they doing for the first thirty minutes at home is reading a book. The books are I shouldn't hear your voice. The book isn't talking out loud whatever, you know, And we're conscious about that, we were conscious. My kids hate it. But when they do birthday cards, they write the birthday card one, I'm sick of paying three dollars, four dollars,

five dollars for kids' birthday card. That's crazy to me. But but but more importantly, the art of writing, of just articulating a sentiment. When my son Jackson wrote his first birthday card and it ended up being a paragraph long, I was over the moon because I was impressed by the by the sentiment he was expressing. I don't want our kids to lose that, and I think it's really incoming upon the parents to weigh down on them to make sure that we're curating some of that experience for them.

I know these sound like two separate kinds of kinds of conversations, but it really isn't. Because if you teach your child to come to expect a certain thing to exchange at a certain level of discourse, then that's what they're going to do. But if you put no expectation out there and the world starts to shape that for them, then that's some of what I think you get.

of our square, but particularly not him. He just has so much to the world now, to so much to add to the world.

for himself, for his family, first kids, for anybody. And so what I really want to ask us to consider is how do we resolve conflict when things are heated without name calling, without attacking someone's intellect or lack thereof. I think that we can lovingly challenge people to rise up without calling them them or anti intellectual.

I mean they are killed. They were they they died in their reporting.

his perspective. And clearly, you could take a negro out the hood, but you can't take the hood out the negro. So you might not want to keep leaping at Mark. He might just snap and bust your ass next time.

And what I mean by that, and I think Andrew may recall this from his time as being mayor, is that the way we fund our schools right now is from federal funding, state funding, and local funding. And so if you're from a poor area like where I'm from, I was going to catch twenty two when I was legislating because I couldn't recruit industry because I had poor schools. But I had poor schools because I couldn't recruit industry,

and so it becomes very cyclical about the resources. And I mean, to TIFF's greater point, we're not preparing young people for twenty first century global economy. We're not giving them access. And right now, the proverbial world is flat because when you graduate from Denmark, South Carolina, where I'm from, or Tallaha I see, or Seattle or wherever you may be from, you're now competing with kids who finish all around the world, and it contributes to this culture of

anti intellectualism. I think Mark's purpose there and I love Mark Lamont Hill. We disagree on a lot of things substantively. We hit each other up policy, we try to have these intellectual discussions back and forth. He's somebody who sharpened you. But I think Mark is there intentionally. I think Mark

is there purposefully. I think that it adds the dynamic and I going back to our conversations that we've had in the past, you cannot let things go in a vacuum without them being challenged, and so I do think that there is an added value to having someone like Mark lamon Hill being there. You know, I watch the show every now and then, Andrew, I'm not a I can't consume everything all the time, but I do watch it every now and then. And you know, I know I think his name is Flip. I guarantee you I

know ten flips. I know one of Mark Clamant Hill, because that's just the level of intellect. But I know ten flips at minimum, and I think the way they were able to have that conversation, as cringe as it is, are conversations that happen more often than people actually think,

or they're conversations that people want to have. I'm not in a position to give Mark Lamont Hill any advice, but what I would tell him if I talked to him the day or tomorrow, and I might hit him up on text, is what my daddy told me, which is that you never argue with a fool because people

watching can't tell the difference, right. And so you know, in the South Carolina we say you roll around with pigs, you both get muddy, and the pig likes it, right, And so there's this certain level of kind of checks and balances that goes through your head. But I love the layered dynamic that is Mark Lamont Hill from Philadelphia. I think Andrew has the same thing in him, like there is a certain level of respect that you must have, which is also why I'm pushing back on one of

your points, Tiffany. There is a certain level of respect you must have going into these conversations, right, and it's a respect. We will never have that because we all have that level of respect for each other. And what you saw in that episode was that respect being fractured. And whenever that respect is fractured, you have to be willing to bust someone's ass, right, And you I mean not not literally, but you got to.

for himself in that moment. I think that I respect Flip's opinions, all though they aren't maybe to the level of likening, of intellectual capacity or whatever, but there's so many people that have it that I'm not ready to cast him aside. I want him to have more conversations with Mark Lamont Hill. I want him to approach these conversations with respect. I want Mark to approach those conversations

with flip with respect. I think we have to do that when we're going on college campuses or going out in the world. I mean, you have to have this level of respect because that is the only way information will free flow. The last thing that I'll say is something that you and Andrew said which made me kind of jump a little bit, is it's about It's about AI and the way that we approach it right And I think and I know that we probably will get to the same place, but the way that it was

couched it scares me a little bit. And the reason it scares me is because many times black folk end up in diametrical opposition from the next thing. And what I don't want to do is ever frame us, because it will leave us behind. I want us to be a part of this new revolution. I want us to find our footing in artificial intelligence. I want us to be able to accept it in our communities. I want us to be able to monetize it in our communities. I want us to be able to use it in

our communities. I will it contribute to the culture of anti intellectualism, probably, but we also do we want it to contribute to the culture of anti intellectualism and to leave us behind in terms of being a part of this ship that we know is coming. Or do we take this posture being anti intellectual? I mean, we take this posture being anti AI to a point where again we're talking about man if thirty years ago, forty years ago, fifty years ago, we would have been on the front

lines of XYZ, It's different. This isn't a this is not an indictment on Andrew talking about the way that he integrates books with his children, et cetera, et cetera, et cetera. And I want to be clear about that because I try to do the same thing. I want my kids to be well rad I want that I'm actually going to steal that thing about writing birthday cards, not because I'm as cheap as Andrew, but because I

think it's just a good parenting idea. But I do want us to to kind of posture ourselves with this new innovation is not just looking at the detriment but also looking at the plus. Mind you, I'm not someone who knows all the pluses, but I'm willing to try.

anti intellectualism. Probably the answer is absolutely like we have the data right now this shows that. But I do take your point, and I'm in this debate with almost everybody I talked to about and as Angelin knows, I don't like the debate. But I'm in this debate because people are trying Because people are trying to convince me.

the cheese may stand alone on this one too. I'm not saying it's something wrong with engaging the flips of the world. I would never say Andrew Bacari Angela, y'all should not engage the flips. I'm saying I, Tiffany, have no desire to engage.

otherwise you and do. However, my only point in saying that we have to approach these conversations in respect, and I'm glad that Mark is having these conversations, is that particularly with black folks and black intelligentsia, the gulf between black intelligentsia and those people who are intellectually curious is widening. A lot to do with societal and policy factors, but also whether or not we want to hear this or not, we're pushing them away, and so I think we have

to be very cognizant. And we speaking I'm not speaking French, I mean global weed. I mean we have to be very cognizant that sometimes you want to say, Man, I just want to have a conversation with Andrew Gilloman marcom On Hill. You know, those are the people I want to talk to because those are the people that get me and we can talk about politics with some depth.

And then when somebody asks you a question and they come to you and they're like, man, so again, you know, Steven A was talking about this in Jasmine Crockett on appropriations, and then you don't want to go there with them because of that intellect, actual curiosity, and you push them away. Then they begin to seek out other sources. And so I'm trying to figure out how we how we feel that vacuum. And that's why, you know Mark, if Mark

got it, I'll pay for some boxing lessons. That's what it takes for him to go and be successful on the Joe Button podcast. You know what I mean?

to be. About to impress somebody and to cuddle up to this audience and to make you know, people feel better about this part of that part. And he said, nah, I didn't do that. You think they're big words because you don't always understand them, and dudes like, nah, I don't you just always you know, you're always doing too much. But we can go on and all that, But there were there were not big divides in understanding what the

other was saying. I completely I feel like I followed what the beef may have been or been or may not have been about. And that's why this whole idea that some condescension and the way in which we talk about these things has to take place in order for us to be on the same plane of debate is

a little weird to me. I think a lot of times it may make us feel good to say we got to use a different vocabulary in order for all of us to be on the same page, but at a very different level, I don't think the vocabulary is the problem at all. I'm hearing exactly, I'm picking up exactly what you're putting down. I'm picking it all up. I'm telling you, this is the part about it where you're not gonna come at me that way and you're still coming. But you're not gonna come at me that

way and you're still coming. And so what has to happen is it's not like we're refusing to have the conversation. The conversation is being had. It's absolutely being had. Now, whether or not you're properly interpreting you know, you know my disc versus you're that is something completely different. I resent the idea that you have to speak Why can't we call up instead of acting down or calling down? What is the matter we're calling up into a conversation?

It's just one way at it that I think sometimes this whole idea of meeting people at their level and this sort of thing is an insult to the people for whom you think you're a meeting that sometimes that that meeting can take place at a very common place, at a very decent and respectable place, without us going, you know, without us going outside ourselves.

saying that's Mark's story, but sometimes it is. And you still, nigga, You'll get mad every now and then are like, let me tell you what you shouldn't get confused. And I think that's the part what he was focusing on, Andrews, that you were talking about. The why I heard Mark

almost zone in on the sucker shit remark. He was like, you ain't gonna call me sucker too many more times, And it's because he's constantly having that experience on the podcast, which is why that's my concern for his mental health.

get that. I wasn't sitting there like I mean, y'all all using them tricky words like I'm here too. I'm like, what is that mean exactly?

of hand. But the thing that you got to point out that Angela hit on was something that our brother Marco my Hill should get credit for, which is that he had the emotional intelligence to see a conversation get out of hand at the end of that clip and said let me sit down, let me back away. And Angela highlighted something that I do not want to go unnoticed.

And I'm to be over here. You know, going to be a black man whisperer all the time, but when the point comes up, I will say this that there are a lot of our young boys who do not and cannot because they don't have the tools display the level of emotional intelligence that Mark got and Mark showed, and sometimes they're going to have these discussions and debates at you know, sixth grade, seventh grade, eighth grade, and instead of being expelled from school, which becomes cyclical and

kicked out of school, if they're able to say, wait a minute, let me cool down, let cooler heads prevail. I think that is also a lesson that we can take for Mark Lamont Hill, even if he didn't want to be in that space, because sometimes people get us out of character, and sometimes black folks got to get out of character, and so you know, I think being able to pull yourself back in sometimes and breathe. I give Mark full props for that.

That was AB fifty seven. Assembly Bill fifty seven. Assembly Bill sixty two would have had the Civil Rights Department deal with racially motivated imminent domain, which we know is a big issue in California, but also all over this country, issues like airs property as well have come up, and of course folks lose in property for property tax debt

has been a major issue that also was vetoed. Then there was Assembly Bill seven forty two that were for the Department of Consumer Affairs, the licensing would be preferential for anyone who was a descendant of an enslaved person. And lastly Assembly Bill seven sixty six, this would have provided strategic plans for diversity, equity and inclusion for state

agencies and departments. Gavin Newsome saw it fit to veto not one, not two, not three, not four, but five bills that would have provided some benefit to enslaved people of descendants of people who were enslaved. And I think what is mind blowing about this is what he agreed to was a study. We know over and over again that folks are put into position to review. And maybe it's because this textbook thing that people have been bandoned textbooks long before they were off the shelves, they wouldn't

even look at them to deal with guilt. So now Gavin Newsom, who has found time to engage with white Republicans, especially those who support and lift up white racist ideology saw fit to veto five bills that would have provided some type of restorative or reparative justice for folks who are descendants of enslaved people.

of an enslaved person here in America. And so the ahead of the Black Caucus at the time, who had authored this bill was out and about trying to defend that. They were saying, yes, you have to be a descendant of an enslaved person here in America. So when you think about people, maybe you know your parents migrated from the Caribbean, which also benefit from the slave trade. They were saying, if your mama gotta be it happens to be Jamaican, or your grandma was Jamaican, then you do

not qualify for these bills. So the reparations issue in California has been a huge deal. This also isn't unlike what we've seen in Congress. Angela could probably say more about this on what Congress from Mishila Jackson Lee. Correct me if I'm wrong, angel I think I have this rite I'm pulling from memory. Congress from Mishila Jackson Lee was also a big advocate on just a study, and if I am correct, that study was also never a Congress kept saying no, we won't even approve a bill

to study what reparations would look like. And there have been similar measures all across the country, even including in Maryland. Our friend friend of the Shelle Governor Wes Moore, who also vetoed a reparations bill. So that's the context, and I'm not sure that we'll ever see reparations in this country at the state or a federal level, to be honest. I think the other thing that's important here is he

did approve for measures. All of them had to do with how you file or receive a civil rights complaint, how dollars are being spent in post secondary education. There have been four bills that he approved since August. All of them have to do with study or the ways in which civil rights complaints are decided. And sadly, and maybe this was on purpose, I'm willing to say at this point the way this guy moves it could be

on purpose. He knows that there are federal dollars that would have to help to determine whether or not the Department of Education, for example, in California, can even go through and have the actual funding necessary to address said claims. The other thing that we have to just be clear about is some of the state funding that would go to CSU, which is where one of the bills also

and impacts California State University, also federal dollars. So the moment they do something that is in the crosshairs of the federal government. They will likely lose federal funding. We've already seen that happen. So the bills that.

West did and Governor Newsom did. Governor Newsom and West both tried to triangulate, which is something Bill Clinton made extremely popular. It's kind of going against your base, rising above, you know, having this belief that you're able to kind of rise above the fray on issues that are contentious such as this with some thought that is maybe beyond both Democrat and Republican thought processes. Right, It's like a triangulation strategy. And many times when that happens, four folk,

brown folk, black folk are left behind. The second thing that Governor Newsom's having to deal with now is he's having to explain himself. And I think that Andrew can tell you the basic tenets of politics. If you're explaining, you're losing. So now he has to go out on the road and tell people why he did this, and tell me, you know, what have you done for this

person or what have you done for that person. In Wes's case, when you talked to him about it, he said, let me tell you what we done for black people. And then he began to explain and have to rattle off and do all of those things. And if you're ever in a position where you have to do that, you're losing. I mean, there's a larger conversation about whether or not you will get reparations. I believe all four of us are four reparations of some shape form of fashion.

The question is what do they look like? Right, and how do we get there? But I think Gavin Newsom just displayed to you that he is I mean, I don't think it's a knot, but he's very calculating. And in this calculation that he made the people that lose or people that look like us.

the foil of that was. And I think what's happening now is democrats, certain democrats are deciding that it is an imperative in the democratic presidential primary, meaning it is a must have in the primary to have a Democrat who is willing to strike hard against the Democratic base in some form or another in order to win this movable middle of the electorate out there who will be kinder to them, who may give them their votes if they can show that they have the courage to strike

out against a part of its base, and similar as it was in the early nineteen nineties, ninety two and ninety four and ninety six, black people are going to be at the intersection of this striking out reparations is I think just one form that we're going to see this triangulation take place. I think it's going to happen quite frankly on a number of our issues. And what they're going to try to communicate to voters is that, yes, I believe in the Democratic Coalition, but I'm willing to

tell them hard truths too. I'm willing to go and look them directly in the face and tell them what's good for them and what's not good for them, and what's bad for their people, and that I'm not always going to be on their side, but I want all their votes, and I think we have to be really suspicious of this tactic. I think we have to call the tactic out when we see it. I don't think

it's worth waiting. I don't think we got to wait our way through the presidential primary process to know that this is a key part or some folks are making this a key part of their strategy for winning the Democratic nomination. Whether Gavin Newsom believes this thing or not is a little concern to me. Whether the governor of Maryland believed what he was specially at the time, is a little concern for me. I think the calculation has been made that you have to show that you're willing

to on the Democratic side. By the way, I'm not even saying this is for the replicants, because I don't believe this is a strategy on their side, But on the Democratic side, you have to be willing to strike out against a key element of your base, I eat black people, in order to show that you have the bona feeds to compete and to win the presidency and the twenty twenty what is it twenty eight cycle? And I just think when we see this thing where its head,

we have to call it for what it is. We have to make a demand and then see if they're willing to then recapitulate back to our demand. And so far, somebody has determined that it's a winning strategy to take on reparations and to sideline this issue for black folks and be willing to do it in our face. And we got to be watchful of it.

he runs for president of the United States. But if we cannot be critical of people who look like us doing the same thing, I can't hold Gavin Newsom accountable. I already have enough reasons to dislike Gavin Newsom because he is the most handsome person and the smartest person in the room. Always all you have to do is ask him, right. But I do think that that lack of self awareness shone through in the politics of the day.

He employs the hug of black woman thing which I hate, which is like every time he goes to a place, he finds an old black woman and he hugs it for the camera, and that's like the front page of the Florence newspaper or whatever. So there are a lot of nuances I dislike, but the triangulation that we're seeing and it just it put me in that mind frame. It's like whenever you go through a period of triangulation with your elected officials. I mean, Barack Obama did some

of it. We'ress for office. It wasn't to that ext Black folk, black folk, poor people are in a cross hairs in that.

and how that happened. I was literally walking in city Center. You guys are familiar with city Center, and she came up to me and she was like, you know, you're in perimenopause.

book is called. And so I'm thrilled that she's launching this podcast, so now all of you can listen to her and hopefully. I don't know what the profile will be, but she'll take a fewer questions, I hope, but I've asked her more than one personal question. So please check out the Second Opinion podcast. I think it will be just on YouTube, and I know I plan on being a guest on there, and I don't know if you boys will, but maybe Angela or somebody. It'll probably mostly

be women, I imagine guests on the show. So that's my call to action. Check out doctor Malone.

part of the ninety two percent. My mother was an activist in this civil rights era, so resistance is in my DNA, and I wonder as far as the no Kings protests, should we be involved, should we be doing more as a community, should we be doing more, and what that more might look like. And I'm wondering what your thoughts are on this.

against against this current formation of the enemy. I don't know if you all have deep thoughts on.

in the morning or something like that. Make sure that your your heart is pumping the way it should, and make sure your blood is flowing the way it should, and go see the doctor. Don't wait until your emergency room. And I tried to go and get my and do a colonoscopy and all those other things, and they told me I was too young, and so I was like, I'll pay out of pocket, you know, let me just let me just get I want the whole work up, head from the root to the tutor, as we say

in South Carolina. But I encourage everybody to go out there and listen to your body, get checked up. To black men, all of us for that matter, know somebody know another young black man who died too early. DiAngelo is another example of that. Again, rest in peace, condolences to his family.

versus Katanji because there is a difference. And on that helpful note, I would to encourage you all to remember that all skin folk ain't kim folk. As always, we want to remind everyone to leave us a review and subscribe to Native lamppod. We're available on all podcasts, platforms and YouTube. If you're looking for more shows like ours, check out the other shows on our reasent Choice Media network.

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