What's up everyone on Tory Deal And I'm Anissa Ferreira and this is MTV's official Challenge podcast.
And this week Anisa, we're playing Dirty, Won't Get Dirty Down and Dirty Muddy.
Mm hmm.
I loved this challenge. It looks like so much fun.
Oh my gosh, I'm I'm This is one of the ones that if you're going to get a heights over water challenge, this is the signd of This.
Is the one you want. You're sliding, You're literally sliding.
You're literally going to the water park and you're going up the steps because there's no line and it keeps sliding down. But there's a little puzzle at the end, a little poosley. Yeah, who doesn't like one of those. It's not a far swim. I mean, this one was fun.
Not only that so many teams competed well during this challenge that I had zero idea who was gonna win this, Like, yeah, so many people can competed well, and it's always nice to see that many people do well because you want the competition to be stiff, like that is that the right word stiff?
Stiff comes you. You want the competition to be stiff.
Is that right, Steep.
Yeah, well, okay, their stiff competition means that they're they're hard competition, but it's okay, well.
We're gonna let it go right now.
Speaking of stiff competition, Adam and Steve win.
So so good, thank god they needed that.
But Frank and Sam get a damn star. Yeah. So they went from winning the last challenge and start in the pot, set shit up, slam dunk, and then now they have a star, so now they can run the final.
It's really great knowing that. In the trivia challenge, literally right before everyone was saying Frank and Sam were the weakest team, they end up winning that challenge. Obviously, they shake up the game by throwing in the two guy guy pairs against each other, you know, rip t R Guy Dave and Leroy like but still like it was a really big move for the entire house, and now
they get their star. So I think it's just like and watching them hug at the end like that, like watching Sam like so hype, Like it got me hype for them. I'm like, wow, that's it's cool to watch somebody's trajectory go up like that.
I could play a lot of video games a big gamer. Uh, that's what I like to do.
Yeah. I also really like watching Nanni and Turbo compete in this one. I think that he was so calm with.
Her, and Nannie's really good at this wordle type of game, like we've seen her win eliminations like this in the past, where she's organized letters like this was Nannie's jam, So I almost.
Thought for a second maybe Nannie and Turbo were gonna win.
Yeah, totally. I think that she needed to trust him more mm hm, and maybe they maybe they could have. I mean, we can't talk about what could have happened but didn't ye right, I think going forward, uh, hopefully trust is being established more so where they can work and work together well and win a challenge.
I also thought that Big Tea and Corey could have won because Corey's strategy of oh my god, literally snowing that was amazing. Mike had a great strategy.
He really did, but it did take a lot of time, but yeah, it was a good strategy. My favorite was eliminate Wait there's no other e.
Yeah. Victim's so cute.
She's like oops, premature.
She is a fierce competitor, but also like such a jokester along like through and through.
Oh, she's so funny. She's so funny. So that was that was great.
I think that like this episode was really really rich in terms of competition, but then also obviously strategy and political play.
And I actually really liked how it.
Opened up with Davon and Shane because we really haven't seen a lot of them, and now we know why they.
Have been floating in the middle in the best way for them.
Like that is truly the spot that everyone likes to be in because that spot carries you far into the game and.
So you're not making the decisions. You're not winning exactly. I don't think you're a threat, you're not losing, so people don't think that you'd be a layup. Yeah, but I also think that they they really don't have a choice because because their alliances are on different sides. Yeah, so the best way to not make it too much friction is to be in the middle exactly.
I mean, for sure, and it's a spot that you don't choose to be in. You're kind of gifted it based on your previous relationships coming in. But it was like really cool to actually get a peek into what they've got going on. And then obviously, I mean, this whole thing breaks out with Veronica and Katie and.
Like you just can't. I can't give Veronica enough credit.
You can't give her enough credit, and Katie too, like the master Class music again, it's so good.
So the funny thing is, and I think I brought it up before, like CT had CT's pro tips on forty. The crazy thing is that Katie hadn't seen forty. Wasn't we were filming.
Oh yeah, that's so much.
Master Class that I'm like, come on, Era one, just being smart coming up with shit. These are ultimate gamers, you know what I mean, Like when you realize when a game changes so much from when you started and you just have to keep adapting. It just it just shows versatility and it and it shows just that quick witted kind of like I mean, you don't have a lot of time to do a master plan, you know. But but Veronica had her power dress on. She said, I'm making moves in my son dress.
And speaking of Veronica's dress, her in her in her interviews, she looks gorgeous.
I have that on. I know, I'm like, I can't even with that Free People number looking like a little bit of fucking honey.
I loved it, not honey mustard.
Yeah, I know. I didn't get the whole word out because it's it didn't sound like a compliment when it was coming out of my mouth. But she looks stunning. And it's great because she's not trying to deny it in these interviews. She's literally like, this is what I'm doing. Yeah, oh it's great, and I think it's incredible. This makes her great television. This is what viewers want to see.
Absolutely, And it's interesting because I think that there's a lot of players in the game at this point that I wouldn't say a lot, but like there's a handful of people who think they are maybe puppet mastering, but like there are I think a few standout ones who are because there's a lot of big strategic personalities in the game. You have Veronica, right and Katie who are playing very strategically. Then you have Frank who was doing
the same who I would put right up there. Oh yeah, his game just wasn't it didn't need to be necessarily highlighted in this round.
But I think that he definitely sent this one off and we're gonna I mean talk to him in the future about it. But I think his little conversations in the beginning was just like a sprinkle and then the ball starts rolling. Yeah, I think him and Veronica together are dangerous of him, Veronica and a splash of Katie dangerous cocktail, dangerous mix, but I'm here for it.
Yeah.
Also, Corey Lay and Big T like and Melissa, I don't think they realized how gamed they got this episode, because obviously big T and Corey voted the way they voted, thinking that they weren't going to be thrown in by Adam and Steve. Yeah, and bamboozled, bamboozled, totally buzzled. Then also watching Melissa, like, obviously it's sad your friend going home, But watching Melissa's reaction to when Big T lost and Corey lost, She's like, no, I know, I know, it's so like Disney Princess.
Like, yeah, I was like telling Novilla dramatics. I loved it. I mean, I mean it's just it's I mean, they do love each other immensely.
Yeah, oh yeah, they're best friends. You know, it's got to be hard.
People did people got gamed. I mean they did, But if you think about it, You're in a controlled environment where you have zero control, you have no escape, you have no distractions. So when someone's like, hey, so I heard someone was talking to you talking about you, you literally take that at face value because you're like, oh my god, maybe they are, maybe they're not. Like all you need is one drop of doubt to mess up your whole mindset. It doesn't have to be true at all.
Yeah, And the other thing is is once people have information, they it's very difficult to withhold that information from your partner because you're looking for someone to confide in. You're also on the same team. So another shout out to Davon. In this episode, she mentions that she doesn't necessarily have to tell Shane everything because she recognizes that it's not for the best of her. And I think that is amazing, Like to hold all of that information inside you and
to not crack. That speaks to the strategy of a Big Brother player.
Of course, well, she says something. She risks him saying something exactly. Veronica and him are very close. Veronica and Davon are playing different games. She risks her own gameplay, you know, like Jess, because we're partners. Doesn't mean we need to play the same way. You don't need to know everything. I'm thinking there's no trust right there with that pair, So it's interesting. It's going to be interesting to see how they fare and what happens and if they're going to get on the same page.
Yeah, there was a lot going on this episode. And I also love that we got to see a lot more of Dario and Ashley. I feel like we saw them in the beginning when they won their first star and then you know that he started to wow, wow.
Yeah, Daros darysh.
You mean that, Yeah, and then he had his conversation with Devin, the.
Ultimate Devin Dario debacle, Yeah, of twenty twenty five. And now we get to see them win an elimination together, and I just think it's it's really cool to watch them step up perform. Well, I'm really curious, like what that was like for her to be back with Dario since they broke up. You know, we got to like peek into their relationship for the first time. It took half the season to finally get this convo.
Right, So glad we got it. Yeah, exactly, thanks for that ownership, Dario, totally. Yeah, well, if we're really gonna dive deep into this, we're gonna need somebody to talk about it with. We have Ashley Marie Kelsey coming to the podcast right after this break, so stay tuned, we'll be right back.
Welcome back, everybody. I am so excited because this is.
My favorite part of the podcast where we get to interview one amazing challenger and you have not seen this woman since Invasion of the Champions. She is the champion of Battle of the Seasons and hands down, one of the most gorgeous challengers to ever grace the screen.
Please welcome Ashley Kelsey.
What an intro. Thank you so much.
Welcome.
It felt so good to be back. Honestly, I had been gone for far too long and I felt like the timing was just right.
Oh yeah, I mean, it's so good to see you back. It's been a really, really, really long time.
I know, it definitely has been forever, and I was extremely nervous to come back this season. Let me just say that, did.
You enjoy your Dario Ashley pairing intro music?
You know, I've I feel like it fits us perfect.
It was slow and seductive.
It was.
I mean, watching you two work together I mean, you guys are a good team, but it you know, even playing alongside you didn't hear like the little conversation. So watching the dynamic is so is so fun from this side.
Yeah, I mean, going into it, I was definitely not I didn't really know how it was going to go. You imagine not seeing somebody that you really love for six years straight, no phone calls, no text, no nothing. It was like we are done and we did not. It was like neither one of us existed anymore. So then being like you're going to be partnered and playing together, it's a little.
So much, you know, and sleeping in the same room.
So I didn't really know how the dynamic was going to go, and it was definitely very uncomfortable at many times prior to having like a solid conversation about it, just because I feel like it needed to happen. You know.
I give you a lot of credit because I'm definitely the person who is like, if we have to talk about it, we got to talk about it now. And I feel like it was very clear that you were like, no, I'm gonna let Dario come to me on this one. And I just think that's like really honorable because I could have never done that. So talk to us a little bit more about the patients. It took for you to not just jump the gun on the conversation and let it happen naturally.
I kind of felt like if it didn't happen naturally, that it would have been forced, and then the answers that I would have gotten would have not been true, or they wouldn't have been, you know, the ones that he wanted to give me, because Dario definitely had sat on this for many years and I wanted it to make sure that the conversation when we finally had it was like I was actually going to get answers and I wasn't going to sit there and be like, you know,
him just saying what he felt like he needed to say. And if he didn't do that on his own terms, he's a guy. You know, guys need to do that when they're ready, not when you're ready. That it just wouldn't have been as authentic.
Yeah, I think that's a fair thing to say, and I just again think that that takes a lot of strength as a woman to do that.
So oh yeah, you know, I was like, I was like, what is this going to happen, like, is he going to talk to me? Like I I would definitely ask, Like me and Franquent have conversations about it all the time because he's like my number one go to man, you know, my bestie, and he's like, you know, I just feel like he's not ready for it yet. He
even he would talk to him too. It was kind of like Frank was that middle man girlfriend in the situation where like, yeah, he's the one that we both were going to but weren't talking to each other, you know what I mean.
He as your therapist. So do you think that now that you've had this conversation that you guys are going to work better together? Do you think it's going to be easier. Are you more comfortable now that you've had the conversation going forward?
I think that it makes it more comfortable. I don't. I think we're going to play well together regardless, because we kind of shut it out when it comes to
the challenges and just compete. But in terms of like being in the house and being able to hang out and like adding another dynamic to our relationship is only beneficial to trusting him more because you know, if you look back at the Heights Challenge on the side of that damn building, Like I was so nervous, and I and Frank had said to me, it's like, if you were with me, I don't think you would have been as nervous. I think you trust me and like you
would have just fallowed my lead. But like, this is someone that you broke your trust in the past, so you're still trying to like get that back. And that played into me not feeling as secure as I probably could have been up there. And I was like, wow, that's a good way of looking at it, because I didn't trust him, you know.
Yeah.
I mean the challenge producers knew what they were doing when they brought that Height Challenge in so early, because none of the pairs had the opportunity to fully resolve anything yet. So the amount of arguing during that challenge, the amount of people who didn't go through with it, I mean.
Yeah, no, I still don't want it. I don't care. If God was up there holding my hand, I just would have been like, I don't know about this one. Dj oh No.
It was absolutely terrifying, Like it was the scariest thing ever. And I don't care about heids over water, Like people usually get nervous about that. Me, I'm like, put me up over the water. I feel like because I know I'm going to land and like we got the water down there, I'm fine, but like it's like I'm gonna be dead, Like there's just no way, you know what I mean. And that fear is just in my soul.
I don't know totally.
It's okay, it's natural, Ashley. It's a natural response. People that like fear, I mean in heights and and all of that thrill seeking shit. They're a different breed of humans. I don't think everyone is meant to do that. Yeah, I'm not. I'm so you've been away for a while. Do you think the game has changed a lot? Do you think it's forced you to play a different game?
I think that I normally sit back and let everybody. That's why I said I want a man to lead in the challenge. And this is why I stated that is that's how I played in the past, Like I let my teammates lead me. You know, I was with on a team with Zach and Frank or it didn't matter, which is that anyways, you know what I mean? So, like I kind of stop back and just let them do their thing. And that's what I was used to in the past, So I think that's where that came from.
Where I was just like, Okay, you tell me what to do, I'm gonna follow suit and we're gonna make this happen. But then I started really as the challenge went by that like I was actually smarter, and not that him, but just smarter in general. Like I knew how to play the game, Like I knew what moves
were happening. I could see things, and I was like, I need to, you know, have more trust in myself in the fact that like I can still play my game, you know, not just rely on him doing it because that's kind of what I was doing in the past.
Wow, I really love that for you.
And I feel like, you know, up to this point in the season, we haven't really had a lot of you and Dario because you know, you guys have been flying under the radar a bit, with the exception of the fight that Devin had and Leroy had with Dario. But it's interesting because I feel like we're starting to see a lot more of you now and I'm just like curious, like, what are what were your first impressions just based off this episode after you saw it, because you guys were pretty centered.
I mean, you guys went into elimination and everything.
Yeah, well, what's crazy about that is we didn't see that coming at all, Like when I tell you, we were chilling by the pool, like like nothing was going to happen because our name was never brought bamboozled you in any conversation with anybody, Like even if looking back and watching those side conversations, obviously I didn't see my name was still not brought up. It was totally different people. And then all of a sudden, out of nowhere, it was like boom got pushed into it. And we were
so taken back by that. But to be honest with you, it gave us such confidence going into that elimination. I'm not even joking because when I said, like, I'm not holding any grudges against anybody, like I'm going in to play, like I really felt that way. I was like, whatever, this is a game, Like I'm not going to sit here and cry and like get mad at everybody, like
we're going in. We're going in. I have to go in with that mentality in order to come out successful, and I feel like that's what made us play that game.
So well, yeah, you guys crushed the elimination for Yeah, you guys did crush it.
I wish they showed like how like I was just like grabbing the stars like they were nothing. I was just like, I'm just going to do this as fast as possible. And I actually thought.
I killed it a little ticker bell were little ticker bell.
Think, Well, I think that mentality of being like, you know, if I go in worst case scenario, if you go in, I mean it's always you go home. But you know, as we've as we know you personally, and also you've mentioned on the show, you know you have Snow back home.
Who shout out to Snow She got a shout out in this episode, So knowing that she's at home and there for you, and then you also have like obviously the competition happening in the challenge, does it alleviate some of the stress, Like, well, if I go home, I go home to my kid.
Oh yeah, it was my number one little phrase I said. I was like, if the worst thing that happens to me, say is I go home to my daughter, Like I'm already winning. So I used to say that all the time, and I felt like it really just made me play a better game. Like in the past it was like I want to say, I want to say, and like not that I don't want to say. Of course, I want to stay and win, like that's the whole point of being there, but at the same time, like I'm
not going back to a life that I hate. I'm going back to the life that I love. And so it's like love. I don't know. I think it just gave me a different sense of confidence this season that I haven't had in the past, and snow has made me a different person. And I can even see that in just watching my interviews in the way that I talk, and that just much more confident in myself.
Oh I love that.
Talk a little bit more more about that, Like what other qualities do you think that you've gained from being a mother that have now transcended being a mother.
And have helped you in the challenge experience.
Well, being a mom is so challenging and hard, and especially a first time mom and figuring it out and knowing that like because I was you know, she's almost well now she's three and a half. It's like you just like I said, the sense of confidence that comes from it's like, Okay, she survived. We're here at three years, like especially because I'm a single mom and I do it all by myself. But yes, like obviously her dad's involved,
so like I'm not saying that at all. He's still there, but she's with me full time and I do it alone. So like if anything at being there, I was it was like a vacation. I felt like I was like, what do I do with myself every day? Because I'm always on and I got to be off for the first time ever.
That's why we nicknamed it Moms on the Loose because when the moms were out, they were on the loose. They were there were just so many moms they were on the loose.
And like Daryn said, I was trying to enjoy myself as well, you know, like and that's one thing that was happening. There was a little I didn't love about me and him. Is like Daryl Steele was at He was out a little bit more than he was in previous seasons, but he still was to himself a little bit, you know, And I was like, I don't want to be that person. Here, like I want to be out and having fun with everybody and enjoying this time, and so that's what I'm gonna do.
You know, I basically saw some growth in him. I mean when we were on thirty together, that's like the last time I saw him. Yeah, and you guys were dating at that point, Yeah.
He was dating.
You guys were dating. I remember having conversations. We had conversations with that too, about her.
Yeah, about you.
He was like, I'm with an older woman and we were younger then, so it was just like, she's not really that much old, are you, idiot? But I've watched him grow too. I think he definitely came out of his shell more on All Stars because I think he knows who he is.
What's so funny, Toy is like, when you guys were filming, I hadn't met you. I didn't know who you were, and I was and people kept saying, you know how, people like you know, report back online that he was always talking to some girl, And I'm like, who is this girl that he keeps talking to? It? You know, I because I never met you, And it's just funny now, all these years later, I'm like, oh, it's my friend who is to like, what is going on?
You know, it's talking to some random girl. Literally, he was talking about you. I mean, that was the only thing we talked about.
Was you, he start, I didn't really talk about much.
But yeah, well this this episode, watching him apologize, I was really impressed with him, because it takes a lot of growth for somebody to be like, I didn't give Ashley, you know, the communication that she deserved.
I just walked out. I mean, dude, for a guy to say that, yeah, that's huge.
I'm a dick. I was a dick.
I mean this part of the conversation that we did have there, as I said to him, you know, I think what happened was we were in our love bubble, you know what I mean, like after the show and we lived together and stuff, and then he started working down at the pools in Vegas and getting attention and girls were like, hi, attention again, and he was back in the scene. And that's when I felt things shift, and I felt him going out and like never inviting me and things like that, you know what I mean.
So when he says I didn't want to see you cry, because I was so upset all the time, because I was like, I know what's going on, and you're just not telling me, so you know what I mean, So to make me emotional because I was just like I'm sitting here in a state that like I don't even want to live in for you, and you're not even giving me the time I deserve. That's like where things started getting really rocky with us. And then at the end,
like it was just it was bad. It was one of those things where it was like I left keys on a desk and was like peace like kind of thing, you know what I mean. So it was and I think that that's what I meant by also like we had real drama in our real life and not challenge drama that is just from the show. So like that's deep rooted and it can cause chaos and some problems if you don't talk about it, which is why I wanted to talk to him about it totally.
But I think you guys still before that conversation still worked well and you even see it in this week's challenge.
Yeah, I think me and him had a good dynamic and we you know in terms of just like how we play and even our stature and our size, like we just work really well together alongside each other, do you know what I mean? And like yea, And because I think I can take a step back and let him lead if I obviously I'm going to still speak. And that's where I think people were like, oh, you
want a leader. I'm like, that doesn't mean I'm going to be mute because I say I want someone to lead me, like I can still give my opinion, but like I think, because I can step back and let him do that, but also at the same time, can like be like, listen, we're not doing it right. We need to do this, like, which is what I think that That's how our communication got so well because we could bounce off each other.
Well do you think that you use that and this and this week's challenge where I mean, what's the strategy going into it?
Oh my gosh. So we went third heat, so we got to kind of we didn't really get to see anybody because the board was not facing us, but we got to like hear what people were doing and we were like, okay, well why did someone swim there so early? So me and Dara were like listen, like we got to clean this board as fast as possible. But also like I was going to solve the puzzle because I was always better at puzzles like that. It's just naturally
like he doesn't feel confident as I did. So I was like, I'm gonna go go down a few times and I'm swimming there as soon as we see the first person go towards that board, because regardless, because we were going against Steven Adam, they're a really good team. And I was like, if Steve and Adam are heading that way, we're heading that way, regardless if if we got this board clean or not. I'm just gonna have to try to figure it out from the other end.
It was definitely one of my favorite challenges to watch the season. I think like there was a lot of people showed a lot of their strengths, and then obviously like Steven Adam winning, I just thought was great because this entire season they've been going in so yeah, but it shook the house up entirely, like let's get into this politicking, which was absolutely insane, epic.
It was so good. I love that I was confused. I didn't know who to trust and I wasn't there no.
Watching it back, I'm like, I don't even know if I still know what was going.
On, like, oh my god, it was so and like I said.
I didn't even realize my name was even part of it because it was it until it was you know what I mean?
Were you having conversations with people like did you know who you were going to pick before going in? Like how did that go? Who's in your alliance? What's happening?
So with that, you know, we always were working with the same people. But the crazy part about it is like what set the tone about kind of like our team's being targeted a little bit. I feel like was the Festi and Amber voting you guys Like I think that set the tone of like you guys are supposed to be working together, Like why would you vote on somebody that you're working with like I and they directly did. It wasn't even like it was part of the house vote.
It was like, oh no, it wasn't. We were a non factor exactly.
So I feel like that kind of set the tone.
We should have never gone it, but it shows people's cards.
Yeah yeah, of everybody else being like, oh well, then we can kind of do it. Because at first I think people were scared. I think people didn't want to go against a strong team, and they were like, let's
go for the weaker teams. Let's go for this, and like it definitely switched up, and I was like, oh gosh, but we always had a plan obviously, and you know, Frank being my trust I mean, I trust him with my whole life, like he was someone that was doing most of the politicing for me, to be honest with you, looking back, and I said this to him, I should have done a little bit of my own because I just was like, what's going on? What are we doing?
Like you know what I mean, Like I'm down. And then looking back though, it's like his game in my game. As much as we wanted to be the same, we are two different teams and we are not winning together. And so I think I should have done a little bit more on my own terms, just to kind of know what was going on a little bit more, because I shouldn't have been that blindsided by that, you know, that vote unless everybody in the house was just like being mute to us.
But it was so good, No offense to you, but it was so I mean, all of a sudden, it was just everybody, So.
It was it was so good to, and then I realized that it was big Ta and basically like Corey picking us because they're like, let's get them out ourselves, and I'm like, and then we got them out, which made that like ten times better because I felt like I didn't realize they were the ones who said I honestly thought it was Bronica and Katie, but looking back, like,
I didn't see them really say our name. They were saying other people's, but they were polanting the seeds and other people's, you know, so I thought it was them, and I was so mad, like when as soon as they said, like I heard our name, I was like, what.
Yeah, watching it like as somebody who wasn't there at all, and like Anysa, you were there, so like I I'd love to get your input on this too. I feel like there our alliance is shaping, but it's kind of difficult to see as a viewer because everybody's a little connected, Like are there clear alliances formed in the house, and if so, what are they?
We?
You know, mine obviously are Frank and Sam and then Amber and Festi were like my second up, like and but then hearing some of the comments that Festi makes sometimes about like I don't give a fuck what I have to do, and like things like that, like Amber didn't say anything, so I'm not putting on amberbo. I'm like, oh, okay, like are you know what I mean? Like I never but obviously like they're gonna play their own game too. But I always knew in the back of my mind
with that. I was like, you know, they're my number two in my because obviously Frank's my number one and in my life, but like they also have their number ones too, you know what I mean. So like as much as you try to play with somebody and you want to continue to play with somebody, it's like you got to also be aware of like what they're doing too.
Who were their number ones?
I don't know. I was thinking Nanni the whole time.
Yeah, I think that makes sense.
I mean in a way, like you saw the conversation between Fessi and Nannie in this game.
I mean, at this point, it seems like.
This is what threw me. This is what threw me. I didn't know that Davon INFESTI had some type of agreement, Like I had no clue about that girl.
I'm so over It was like what I felt like it was hunger Games and people were doing whatever they needed to do at the time. Some people are just not loyal to anyone. I saw you and amberget really close, so I automatically was like, they're going to protect each other. And yeah, obviously, Frank, but Nani in FESTI have never worked together.
Ohkay, see here they have, well.
They have, but they have, you know what I mean, Like, I've never seen Nanni and FESTI even like, I don't know, it was just for me.
I thought, like because he was so close to Casey and like exactly, and maybe it was just what I was told because honestly.
I forgot about that part.
Prior to going into the season. I had not seen that man play on one episode of him playing in the game. I didn't know anything about his backstory of playing. I didn't know how he works. I didn't know. I didn't know anything about you two, and looking back at like what he had done to you and Lisa in the past.
Oh, girl, I don't know how you would have trusted him to begin with.
Girl. Listen, I just I figured, I figured. I mean, we talked all the time. We talked a lot in during rivals this season, so I didn't expect it. But that's the whole thing, like you never really know what's going on until you're the vote. Yeah, exactly, And I think that's the weird thing about like number ones and number two, and also there's shit I'm like, but really, then you watch it back and you're like, damn, how
did I get in here? And then you see it unfold and you're like, oh, I thought we were cool. So unless you're number one to somebody and you like really know it, I don't know where anyone falls.
Yeah, all right, we have to take a quick break. We'll be right back after this.
All right, let's get into Veronica, because hey, let's get into it.
Lover or hater. She's the goat of politicking.
I had never seen somebody really move the way she moves.
She is so smart. She is so smart. Her and Katie literally turned this house upside down.
And obviously it wasn't for your benefit, Ashley, So I can understand why maybe your feelings are you know, a little bias from your perspective, but as just a pure viewer, not putting any emotions, I think we got to give her some credit for being able to flip this thing.
Around.
Yeah, but also Katie too, and Katy that was so unexpected.
Yeah, she was like, no one's gonna be able to trust us ever again.
No funny. I loved Katie like I never met her before, and I wish I just loved her. I love her personal I think she's so freaking funny, like she's stunning, like she's just fun to be around. But like watching that back, I'm just like I had always felt that they were people that I didn't know, even in my final in my interviews, okay, guys, Like I'm literally like,
can I trust them? Can I not? Like I don't know because one minute Frank's saying they're fine, you don't have to worry about them, like his Frank was close with them obviously, and then the next minute, I'm like, but look, what does it happened? Like how?
Like what? That's interesting?
I didn't know what to do, and I brought them up a couple of times, but if what I didn't notice until watching this back is like a lot of people kept bringing them up of like let's get them out, let's get them out, even people in my own alliance, And I'm like, shit, we should have talked about this because we were trying to do that many times and we didn't.
But why would you want to get them out?
What do you mean why would you want to get Veronica and Katie out?
I get that they're smart in the gameplay, but like, what.
Do you mean they just flipped the whole house upside down?
I know, it's incredible, it's incredible.
That's the thing, Anisa. It's not always about out like if they're like the strongest team or not. It's just like who's going to fuck your game up? Like, and who's going to like you know what I mean? I think that's what Veronica was saying all along, and she was just like, you know, I got to play with the cards that I have right now, and I got to mess this whole entire house up because it's the
only way I'm safe. Yea. And for me, I'm like, I wasn't looking at them like that because I didn't think I had to look at them like that.
It worked out perfectly.
It was wild.
Yeah, did you see her?
Because I know that you had mentioned like Frank was in your ear telling you do not worry about them, and then you had some moments where you're like, but.
Really, I legit was sleeping in their room at one point because we got kicked out of ours. So me and Dario were like bunking with that.
Sorry, sorry, why did you get why did you get kicked out?
We had six beds in our room. We had three bunks, so it was like me and Ashley, Dario and Ashley and then Sam and Frank. And then we came back and they were like, we have to we move to bed out and I'm like, well, I'm not moving. I'm happy here. And I didn't want to go on the top bunk because I'm forty three. I don't go on top bunks and it's I'm a fall risk. It's a safety ha. So that's a good one. I told them. I'm like, I forgot my life alert bracelet at home,
but this is real. So Ashley is so sweet and Dario they were like all right, well, we'll just go in the other room. And I'm like, well, I love you.
Oh that was nice.
Ye, So we were bunking with them for a little bit, okay, yeah, and then once they left, they like basically told us to go back in the other room. So like we were like okay, fine, and Dario didn't want to be on the top bump, so he made he stay on the top and he went to the bottom.
These men, Frank was on the bottom too.
But looking back at it, we should have just stay in the dang room. We would have known everything going on.
Maybe maybe not, Like.
It's really hard to tell what these these secret spies.
Yeah, well what the other thing I want to mention is I did really.
I mean, obviously you didn't have much of a choice.
You were getting so many votes at that point in time when people were getting voted into when you guys were getting voted into elimination. But you were like, well, you know what, We're just gonna throw the vote on ourselves.
And I think that like so smart, so smart.
It's so smart.
You know, you're not showing your cards even when you could be angry and your back could be against the wall and you could kind of do something a little bit like nah, like you didn't and like speaks again to your level.
You know you could have just yeah, you.
Guys are like, we wouldn't have done that, But I.
Mean, I don't know how I would have handled it.
You handled it with like such cute queen energy, like truly queen energy.
Oh I would have done the first people that said my name.
I was like, what's the point at this point voting for anybody else besides ourselves, because it's just going to put a target on us, which I always thought we were going to have a target from the stuff from the jump, because I felt like people didn't look at us as the strongest team, but they obviously knew we were strong, So we were going to be the ones at the star was going to be constantly being tried to be like, they're going to come for us. That's
what I felt like. Yeah. One thing they didn't show too is I actually told Frank to vote for us, like, so I don't want it to look like he to. I looked at him, I said, vote for us. There's no point we're going in anyways, Like don't don't risk your cards too, like, just vote for us. And so oh he did too.
You're a good friend, yeah, because a lot of people would have got but hurt like you just you didn't have to say my name like a lot of people would have. You know, shows growth because a lot of people get upset about that.
Well yeah, I mean I sometimes you know, get fogged up a little bit too, because I am someone that trusts a lot of people and I need to. I know you can. You can definitely relate to this, like I trust people. I feel like, oh everyone's telling the truth, no one's you know. I'm like definitely more of like that type of player because I just have like a
very it's just like where my heart is. Yeah, but also at the same time, like this game opened my eyes, so like I can't really play like that because if you play like that, you're you're gonna get fucked over because you're an easy target for people because they're like, oh,
she won't care. That's what happened to me with Champs Versus Pros is like I was voted in, not because anybody wanted to, but they were all doing Dirty thirty together and they said Ashley won't care, like she's not coming with us, Let's just vote her in because she'll be gracious about it. And I was like, I hate fuck all of you. Like I was so mad because I had they had no reason to pick me, and they did just because of the fact that they thought I wasn't gonna care.
You know, wait till we come back and we're raging bitches. And nobody's safe, and we remember everyone who's ever voted us in, you're all fucking going in.
I mean, honestly, why not? Why why not?
I'm making a list and I'm checking it twice.
Well, what people have to realize every time you go back into this game you have to play a different game. You can't play the same game you played before. And if you do, yeah, everyone, it's very it's very telling, and you can see it very quickly because, like you know, at this point, we've all played game. It's very rare that you're on a season that you haven't played, like at least with four or five people that are there, you know what I mean. Like for me, I was
gone for so long, so it's a little different. I didn't really know a lot of people. But for most people you've been you've played with almost everybody, you know.
Yeah, yeah, I definitely think playing multiple games in a row it requires a different strategy, like the strategy we're seeing from Veronica and Katie.
Obviously they kind of have to play like that right now, but also.
Like Katie did mention, like it's gonna be very difficult to come back from a strategy that's so aggressive like politically aggressive, and even with Frank, like in a lot of Frank's interviews.
Frank's gonna have a He's gonna have a time too.
And the thing is is, I also think we're gonna eventually talk to Frank, so I'm excited. But you know, in all of most of Frank's interviews, he's like, the only person I'm in here protecting is Sam, which makes sense, it's his partner. But in reality, I know how close you and Frank are, Like I just I think a part of him is like playing it up, and I think like he wouldn't really turn his back on you.
And then he said, like, you know, you've mentioned that you're very close with Frank too, So I think, like it's interesting. Some people are very playing, like very aggressively political games, and I'm wondering how in the future, if they come back, how they're gonna pivot because it's hard to come back from something like that because people are afraid to trust you. It just brings a big question mark in people's minds.
Oh yeah, that's very very true, And I've said that too to him. I'm like, you know, you can make all these aggressive moves, and that's really good for I mean the whole Devin and Lebart thing. And that was a move that honestly like he made for everybody in a way, Like he the fact that they won that day, it was the only opportunity that was ever going to come up that that would be like on him and not on anybody else, do you know what I mean? Right? And I think he like was like I'm going to
bite the bullet. I'm going to do this our one chance, Like everyone just has to, like, you know, vote how we were always voting and stuff, So like that was a very aggressive move if you think about it, but no one cared because everybody wanted one of those teams out.
Yeah, if that makes sense totally. They're so strong.
So it's like, yeah, it was an aggressive move and like he planted that seed. But at the same time everyone was really happy about it that no one like looked at it as like ooh, that was an aggressive thing. They were just like, whoa, you know, one team out, Let's work on the rest of them now, you know.
Well, I think it's also one of those things like people were too afraid to and frank one one thing about him is that he knows how to shake some shit up. But he also doesn't fear a lot of things.
So he's a good player. He's very good.
Definitely is yeah for sure.
But yes, what you said, Tori, Frank was always going to have my back, Like there's no I mean, I would be shook if I saw anything against that. I mean, obviously there's much more to come, So there's always like a possibility of you hearing something that you're like, oh, okay, But he was always gonna come at that.
Yeah, And I feel that. I feel that. But yeah, we'll get into it when we actually interview Frank.
Right now, we are interviewing you, and I specifically have a question on how you feel about the Devin and Dario fallout. Obviously you were there in real time. What do you think about their argument and is.
This the first time you've ever played with Devin?
Honestly, Tori, I love Devin. Yeah. I would sit there the very first night, we sat there in the corner and like had this long conversation. He was saying how he wanted to set up like dates for me and Dario and like have this whole light thing go on. Like he's just so freaking funny, and I truly enjoyed him, like I'd never wanted to go against him in that way, Like I just thought he was great. But when I all I heard was screaming. I'm not even joking you.
All I heard was them yelling each other. I'm like, what the fuck is happening? Because it went from it like being a tom day and nothing was going on and like smooth sailing to like full chaos, and I was like, it is my partner on top of it. So I'm just sitting there. I remember I was sitting there and refesci. I'm like, do you guys hear what's happening right now? Like this is my partner, Like what
is going on? And then he told me that like he was trying to have a conversation with Lee Roy about it because obviously, like you know, they're setting it up to be that Dario was the one that planted that seed. He wasn't. Let me just make that very clear, like he was told about it, and it was a conversation that was like do you want to do this? But he was not the one that came up with that idea. And then definitely it definitely looks as though he did. And I think him and him and Devin
are just like both very prideful people. But I think Devin's also like he was just like trying to hit him. Whar it hurt? He was trying to say whatever, you know what I mean, like, and I don't. I didn't even know what actually.
Was picks, that's it.
That was hilarious. I was like, and Dario's very much about his teeth, Like he had his visil line there, He's got these bling white teeth. He's very into his I was like, that's like probably like the worst blowout of all of them.
You know, people are just saying things in the heat of the moment. I mean like Daria was calling Devin ugly.
It's like you're ugly, Well, your breast thinks your mom's.
Fat, Like it's just kindergarten.
God.
Yeah, it felt like recess.
I just didn't like it because it put a target on our back and I knew it did. And I also knew that what I think Melissa, I don't remember who said this and during the episode, but like it gave people a reason to not trust him. Yeah, same thing, to be honestly, the same thing with like Bessie when he voted you guys in because it was like we'd flex. Yeah, Like no one thought you guys were like besty besties, but everyone thought you were working together, you know what
I mean. And so when you do things like that and you make those moves, it makes you look like, Okay, now we can't trust this person, and it just gives people a reason to vote for you.
Yeah, they'll use it. They'll use anything. Yeah, actually, they'll use anything. So I want to get.
Into what you were saying, because Big T and Corey did come up with this idea that they could potentially escape goat the vote onto Dario and use by saying that Dario was untrustworthy and Melissa, Yeah, like watching the.
House rally against you.
Obviously you're seeing these conversations after the fact, But what was it like to watch them and see the interviews of them saying these things?
Now, well, I don't think anybody really wanted me to go, and that's fair, no, But looking back at it, I just was like shook at where it started. I did not think it was going to be with Corey and Big Teeth. That's not where I thought. Like the initial our name was brought up, Like I really didn't think that. I thought it was Veronica and Katie, so I was like, okay, that's expected, like whatever, they're playing messy right now. They're trying to like you know, stay there as long as possible,
so I could have see that. But I was like, oh, yeah, that's interesting because I genuinely liked hanging out with both of them. We all were like hanging out at the house at night, you know, like everyone has their fun times or whatever, and they were a pleasure, Like Corey is,
I love him same, But I understood. I honestly understand looking back at like his strategy with that, to be honest, like you know, I, like I said, I always knew we were going to be targeted a lot, and that's why I was fearful of even getting a star at first. And I said, that's Stario. But Dario's like a we win or we lose type of person if you come in second, like you might as well have not shown up that day, Like that's his attitude and that is
not mine at all, like very very different. And but I was like, if we win the star, like we might be targeted all the time and have to go on eliminations and that's like terrible, Like why don't we why don't we like, you know, kind of go and ply under the radar, kind of like a Katie Ronica thing and like get it last money. He's like, but what if we don't get it and then you're stuck
there at the end with no star. I'm like, yeah, that's traumatic, it sucks, But would you rather want to get targeted all the time?
Right?
And so I kind of like knew that was coming, I just didn't expect to come when it did, Like that was what was unexpected. It was a little earlier than I thought.
But then how good was that win? Though?
It was amazing? And I I led that whole thing, and yes, it actually was. Because Frank was like screaming at me, being like he could see what was going on, so he could see if we were tilting one way or whatever, and he was like, don't do this, do this like whatever, and I was like trying to pay attention to what they were saying, but also focus on your you know what happens in elimination if you paid
too much attention to everyone else, you lose. But I definitely heard some things he was saying, and I was like Okay, we got to do it this way, and to win knowing that, like you were one of the main reasons why is like a good feeling. You know, It's not because I relied on somebody else. It's that we worked together and we like did it so it felt good.
Yeah, you guys were great. And then so big T and Corey get their fifteen minutes back at the house to pack and say goodbye. Yeah, how do you feel about him warning people?
Yeah, Amber, Yeah.
I think it's smart because I think it's smart, but also could be messy because like Corey and Amber though we're friends, so that's not the messy part. But if you come up to somebody and you plan a seat, like it's very easy for you to plan a seat and leave, you know what I mean, Like, if you're about to leave, whatever you didn't you did win the game. So like, if you want to be a messy player, perfectly, Hey, listen, this is what happened. That's what happened, and this is
what happened. And maybe only one of those three things is true, do you know what I mean? So it is easy to kind of like mess with people's heads at the same time, or you could be one of your friends, you know.
Well, Also the fact that he said he's almost certain it was Veronica, he wasn't like fully certain, So it's interesting. It's like, you know, I think if you know something for fact, yeah, then it's a little bit different.
Yeah, but to like for speculation that that is.
Like kinda I'm certain, I'm ninety eight percent certain.
But the truth is he wasn't like totally wrong either.
So it's just for the viewer, it makes it very interesting because now we're like, well, how is this going to unfold? Veronica and Katie were seated so so I wouldn't say comfortably because obviously their name was getting thrown around, but they had put themselves in a good spot and now it almost just like puts a question mark back on where their stance is going to be in the game, especially after seeing the preview for next week's episode where Veronica is like, are you with us or against us?
You know? I think Veronica puts the fear of God and people and they're like, oh she does, Like it's scary if she gets upset. You're like, what do you need to hear? I'll tell you whatever.
You know she got that she got that fire.
She does love.
The thing is is like Corey I think was trying to be like helpful to Amber, but also what if, knowing Amber, like he should have known that that could be a little detrimental to Amber's personal game because she overthinks things a lot and she is very like you know, she she was friends with Veronica, well in her mind, you know, she she would always say like, oh, I'm cool with Veronica, but like to say that like now it's like you're telling somebody that says they're friends with
them trust them that now they can't and now you're leaving, so you can't even have a full conversation about that, So it almost like mess your friend's whole psyche up, you know what I mean.
At this you know, Amber's not gonna and Amber is not going to go up to Veronica and talk to her about Like Amber is such a she gets she's so docile, you know, and.
Then that's the sweetest thing.
She might internalize it and then you know, like in the game, very.
With her, Yeah, with her mental game, But I get why, like you would want to warn her at the same time, you know what I mean, Like, if you're friends with someone, you want to warn them about like this, what's going on behind your back? Kid? Geta go bye, But at the same time, like.
This person's talking about you bye.
Well, honestly it's I think Amber has shown time and time again that she will speak up for herself, and so I don't think like she's gonna I think she's definitely smarter than people give her credit for her.
She is so smart. I don't think it's smart. I think she just cares a lot and she has a really.
Big, big heart, forward person.
She wants to love and trust everybody, just like the rest of us, and like it's a game at the end of the day. And I don't know if, like you know, you have to really know that some people you really can't trust or that they're going to eventually start playing for themselves regardless. Like so I think that I don't know. I love Amber.
Is there anything you can tease about the rest of the season. Now that we know that seeds are being planted and people are are ruthless.
Let me just say things are about to get wild. Like you thought that episode was chaotic, just wait to what happens. Like That's all I can say is it was so chaotic one day that like all of our heads were spinning. We all had to like literally go to sleep afterwards because nobody knew what the fuck just happened. Like that's how crazy.
I love it. I can't wait. Yeah, I can't wait.
It definitely gets way way more messy. So if you think this one was confusing, buckle up, because it's gonna get even more confusing.
I'm not ready.
What a teaser. Ash.
Well, listen, it's been a pleasure to see you back grace our screens.
Thank you so much for coming on the podcast.
I had so much fun thing for me.
Yes, and and like.
When we see you obviously, like the season's not over for you, so we're excited to continue to watch your journey on it. But like, do you see your comeback and the Challenge franchise being more after this, Like what we see you again in the future.
You know, this is my test to see how I can handle myself leaving my daughter. It was the first time I'd ever left her, and that's my big factor. Like I would have came back in the past, you know, I've been asked before and I was like I just couldn't. I couldn't mentally handle it. You guys, see how sweet
and cute this little girl is. Like it's devastating to leave her, but I built such a confidence in being there and like my ability to kind of like break away and like have my own little time, and like, I feel like all it did was make me want more. And I'm like, oh, I could do this, you know, I could come back and like it'll be fine, you know what I mean. So I I hopefully get asked again and come back in the future.
Oh I love that.
Awesome?
Yes, Ash, Well, we're excited for you.
I hope I get to play with you again in the future, hopefully if stars alive.
I bring it up every time. I'm like, I want to to there because that's good for such fun season for me in particular.
But oh my god, everyone's like, no, no, no.
Not Tori. I'm like, why, I don't scare to you?
You know how it is?
Well, Well, even if we don't get to play again, it's still an honor to follow you on social media and to watch you on the show.
So where can people follow you and support you?
And is there anything that you want to shine light on so that the fans can support any projects you're working on or anything that you want people to follow.
I'm well, I'm on all the same Ashton, Mary Kelsey, Instagram, Snapchat, the whole nine yards. Like I do like to show an inside of my life and just being a single mom, and I think it's important for people to see that. So if you're another single mom, let's go join force. It's jin my team. Now. I love that. Yeah, that's pretty much it for me right now. You know, I've been focused on being a mom at this point in my life and that's just where my energy is going towards at this moment.
You're doing a great job.
Yeah. You can follow me on TikTok, Instagram and Snapchat and you can argue with me on ACT.
Thanks so much, ash Yeah, thank.
You all right, guys, bye, thank you.
That was such a lovely interview with the sweet Barbie Doll Ashley. She is so kind no matter what happens, She's just so gracious, winning or losing. So I feel that it's a nice I don't know, it's it's nice to watch that because she's she's definitely different than a lot of other players.
Oh for sure. Yeah, she's like true, like a sweetie.
At heart, like if you were to like bite into Ashley, it'd be she'd be full of twinkies or like some like sweet velvety cream.
That was so strange, sweet velvety crime.
Let's just keep it rolling, Anissa, where's sweet velvety cream? Where can we f gettles starbursts?
I'm trying to move on from this.
I said something weird, all right.
Anysa, where can they follow you on Instagram and look at your sweet velvety cream?
Oh god, to say find my cream. You can follow me on Instagram at Anissa MTV. That's a n E E s a m TV Tory. Where can they find you? Follow you and send you some sweet treats?
Thank you? You guys can absolutely send me sweet treats.
You can follow me at Tory Underscore deal and thanks for joining us for another episode of MTV's official Challenge podcast. Tell all your fellow Challenge fans to listen, rate, and review us, and also, if you've reviewed us in the past, don't be afraid to do it again.
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