Hey, guys. Welcome to the podcast. My guest today is Prashant Desai. He's a senior MSL at AbbVie, and we talk about mentorship and why it's so important for MSLs and aspiring MSLs. Great conversation. Prashant's awesome. I think you guys really gonna enjoy this. Don't forget to follow us on YouTube and Instagram and LinkedIn and Clubhouse Live. Thanks, guys. Welcome to MSL talk with Tom Caravella, a podcast specifically designed for MSLs and all things field medical. Hey, Prashant.
How are you doing today, buddy? Great. How are you, Tom? I'm awesome. I'm awesome. I'm really excited to catch up with you and talk to you. I know, we've known each other for a long time, and we've kinda been going back and forth with this a little bit. But this is an awesome topic, and I'm just grateful that you're here. Yeah. And thank you for having me on, and thank you for creating such a beautiful platform for us to to be able to share this information.
Listen. You're very welcome, and I I I wanna thank everybody that has, tuned in and listens to it. And, I wanna actually, quick shout out to my friends in Romania. We actually have a new market. We're number 4 last week in the rankings in the careers category in Romania, the number 33 in the business category. So that's pretty cool. Yeah. It's amazing. So, yeah, man, let's get into it. Why don't we start with an introduction?
Why don't you tell everybody who you are and what you're up to these days? Yeah. So Prashad Desai, you know, I've I have worked in the biopharmaceutical industry for about 20 years. I've worked for it's all been biotech. I've worked for the laughing joke is I've worked for all the gens. So I started with Amgen, and I launched Aranes for Neulasta. Those became blockbusters. Then I subsequently went to Biogen and worked on new, Avonex, which is for multiple sclerosis.
And then I was really interested in immunology, even though my background's in oncology. My interest is in immunology and I really saw a gap there in terms of being able to treat people. Rheumatologists were infusing people with gold at the time. I mean, biologics came along and really changed the way we treat, not only that, but changed people's lives. And so I saw this product called Humira. I it was called d2e7. It was acquired by Abbott, which was a small nutrition company at the time.
And I was like, you know, I'd love to work on a product like that. Well, I didn't realize how challenging it was to get on that team. Jerry Stewart, who's actually one of my mentors, is somebody who, led that team, and Jerry was ambitious in building a world class team. So she interviewed 400 people. It took her 1 year. It was all face to face, and she was hiring 19 people. And I happened to to make that cut.
So I feel very blessed to be part of that and to have worked on the largest drug in the world. Well, it's funny. So we the topic of this podcast is we're gonna talk about mentorship and why it's so important, for MSLs and aspiring MSLs. And you had told me you just mentioned her name again, but you had told me prior that, Jerry was was one of your mentors. So let's talk about that. Let's start there. Let's talk about your journey.
So, you know, how did you find mentors, and how did the mentors develop in your career? So I look at mentorship kinda like friendship. You know, it's akin to friendship to me because you if you're friends, then you can, you know, teach each other. It's a reciprocal relationship. Mhmm. Only you learn from each other. You grow with each other. You have very aligned philosophies on things.
And so with Jerry, specifically, I mean, she was somebody who led me but taught me so many different things about the role. I mean, I've had, I would say, 5 or 6 people that have been super influential in my life when it comes to the MSO role. Kimberly Adler, who hired me first at Amgen, who taught me all about the business. Mhmm. Then Jerry Stewart who and Craig Biggs, who hired me for, ab Abbott at the time for Humira.
John Oman, who was my manager for a significant part of my career, and then my, field director today, Mahesh D'Al. These guys have been incredible in in my growth, in my learnings, and it's been very reciprocal. I you know, when I talk to them, they tell me, I learn more from you than, you know, I teach you, but I feel the opposite of that. And so I think mentorship can really turn into friendship, which can turn into long lasting friendships.
And I have so many friends now that I could just pick up the phone and say, hey. You know, can you help me with this? And they can pick up the phone and say, hey, Prashant. I know you know a lot about COVID right now. Can you help me with this? So it's been it's been a beautiful journey. I would say that a lot of my mentors are very, very close friends of mine Mhmm. And people that I have, you know, strong relationships with. But I've also mentored over a 150 in themselves.
Yeah. You got a great story to tell. But let me not I don't mean to interrupt you, but it seems like it it's come really easy for you. And you're you're just creating relationships, and you're making friends. But what advice do you have for someone that might be new in their career, like someone who's a a newer MSL or an aspiring MSL or anybody, really, anybody in general that's that's younger in their career, how do they go about this part of their career, finding and developing mentors?
That's a great question, and I think it's a a skill that I think you're gonna use in the MSO world. So it's a skill that you you definitely wanna work on and and, you know, continue to evolve. When you when I think about this, I think about some of the greatest athletes that ever played. Mean, I think of Tom Brady, I think of LeBron James or Kobe. And I think those guys who are great with skill, they still needed coaches, right, to teach them pieces of how to do things. The same holds true here.
You know, I needed I have skill and I have will, but I needed people to teach me certain things. And I would tell aspiring MSLs or MSLs that reach out, be authentic in in the communication. You know, always give before you get. I've always found that to be a great philosophy that if you give somebody something or you do something for somebody, then you ask them, hey. Can you help me with this? They're more likely to do that.
And align yourself with people that you truly believe in philosophically. Right? So for me, it's somebody who's very authentic, somebody who's very kind, somebody who's very humble. These are the things that matter to me, and I align myself to people that represent those same philosophies but are still leaders in their field. And that's how I found my mentors. Some of my mentors have come from outside the pharma space, and I've been mentors to people that way too.
And it's it's been a fun journey. I've learned a lot. I've but I think you have to be authentic in that process. Yeah. I think that's a great word. I think authenticity is important. I think a lot of time, people feel like they need to go outside themselves and maybe try too hard to maybe be something they're not and go out of their way.
And I think people will appreciate your true authentic self and wanna be you you mentioned the word friends, colleagues, what whatever the term is, they're going to genuinely be attracted to the person that you are, especially if you have if you're in alignment with your goals and values and some of the things you just talked about, I think it should be easy. It should be kind of a natural progression. So now are you so you have created mentors and you've mentored other people.
Are these relationships that you maintain and, like, it's ongoing? How does that work? That's a great question. And, you know, I you have to maintain relationships. It's part of continuing to grow and evolve and like, Jerry is at a different company. She's a VP at a a collegiate firm in Myspace, and I have constant communication with her. The same holds true for even John, who's retired, or other people that have been in my life.
I feel like you have to continue to, you know, drive that relationship forward, learn from that relationship, and and get to know people in in ways that you haven't gotten to know them. I mean, these are folks who helped who helped me through really tough times in my life too. I mean, it's never always been, you know, it's the good and the bad, and you've gotta, you know, take the ups and the downs together.
And, so I have a, you know, a a quote that, you know, I I developed that my company used that I I really think exemplifies what a great mentor does for you, and it's your brilliance awaits you at the edge of your comfort zone. And that's my quote. Abby's used that quote at a meeting.
What I mean by that is a mentor will see things in you and then those gifts that you have, because we all have gifts, and then they will take that gift and push you outside of your comfort zone to truly appreciate that gift that you don't even see in yourself. I think it's it's the best way to represent what a great mentor does, And it's what I try to do when I meet people and talk to people and and learn from people. And at the same time, they've taught me the same.
So you you I love that quote, by the way. I think it's awesome. And I think, I have a guest, Kathy Andorfer, who talks a lot about going outside your comfort zone and how important it is to bring you up to the next level. And, coincidentally, she and I are having our 2nd podcast tomorrow when we're going to talk more about that. So this is kind of like an ongoing theme, and I think it's, I think it's I think your quote is spot on.
But I don't wanna talk too much about that because I don't wanna steal the thunder from what we're gonna talk about with Cathy because that's her thing. But what I do wanna do is I wanna talk to you about you have another quote that you told me, and I wrote it down. I thought it was awesome. And this is this is the quote I associate with you. And you said, when you raise others, you raise yourself.
So has that been kinda your philosophy in becoming a mentor and why it's important to be a mentor to other people? Absolutely. I mean, I learned that early in my life. I learned it from my father who always said that you should, you know, elevate others. And when you get to the pinnacle of your career, you have you have this inflection point where you've you know that you've kind of hit the mountain top.
At that point, it's really your opportunity to allow other people or show other people how to do the exact same thing. And as you elevate them, you yourself get elevated because you are part of their journey. You are a small piece of their journey, but they will attribute that to you. And I've had so many people come back to me and say, you know, you sent this to me or you told me to do this, and it worked out great. And look at where I went to and look what I became.
And you are a big piece of that. And not that you're looking for credit, but you are looking to make an impact in somebody's life. And that, to me, is your legacy. That is the way you do things. I even have a hashtag on LinkedIn that's associated with me. That's leaders create leaders. Because if you are a leader, your goal is not to create followers but to create more leaders.
Yeah. And so it it all kinda lines up together, in terms of, you know, raising others, leading, and and helping other people lead. It all works all in tandem, and I've I've been very fortunate to be able to do all of it. And you you mentioned this before, but, obviously, as you're talking, I keep coming back to this idea that this is such a reciprocal thing. This this isn't just, hey. I'm doing a favor for somebody out of the kindness of my heart. I'm paying it forward.
And and I'm gonna feel good about it. But there's gonna come a time when that person has a sense of indebtedness and and may feel like they need to do a favor for you, or they made it need to be there for you. And that could take on a lot of different shapes and and types of of, you know, maybe favors or interactions. So how important is it to pay it forward, in the whole reciprocal relationship? Oh, it's super important. I mean, I think it's actually one of the most important things.
It's to pay it forward and continue to pay it forward. And I've always said stack the karma deck in your favor, and that's what I mean by that is always continue to pay it forward and do it with intent. So be intentional in that process, yet don't expect anything from it. If you do those things, I think everything works out for you. You know, I've I've I've said before that, you know, when you want to achieve anything in life, it's never done by one person. It's always done by a team of people.
And you won't believe this, Tom, but many, many times, things that I've done for people that I I just think of as very menial things or, you know, making a phone call for somebody getting them into a hospital system because I had a connection there. Turns out to be so big for them that they come back and they say to me, you know, hey. Listen. I have a job opportunity because they're a VP somewhere. Hey. You know, the first person I thought of was you before I post the job.
Is that something you'd be interested in doing? Or, hey. You know, I've got tickets to a game. Do you wanna go? I mean, these are things I never expected from them. I just did it with intent and with the right intent and, you know, paid it forward. And I my dad would always say that everything you put out there in the world is what you get back. So if you put out good, you'll always get back good. And I've I've lived by that, and it's it's worked for me. That's awesome.
Yeah. I mean, I could see it. I could just see it. You know, you're you're, a very well liked, very popular guy. You won the MSL of the Year award. Was that 2 years ago? 2 years ago. 22 years ago. That's when we met. I think that's when I met you. First time they ever gave it out. Yeah. Yeah. That's when I met you.
So, so in in helping people to get better at this because, you know, there's I have conversations and where people say things like, well, I'm not that's not my personality, or I'm so busy. I don't know when to fit this sort of thing in. What tools and how how because it seems easy now because we have LinkedIn. We have email. We have text. We have social media.
So how easy is it nowadays, and what tools would you recommend to people in order to get them to be able to even if they're not comfortable, to start to to really reach out and put themselves out there? Yeah. That's a great question. And I I you know, I'm a I'm more of a LinkedIn celebrity than a Instagram or TikTok celebrity, so to speak.
But I I I would say that, you know, I I did this through basically connecting with people, networking with people, and putting myself out there a little bit, you know, being outside of my comfort zone a little bit. It get uncomfortable being, you know, get comfortable being uncomfortable. Right? And so I have over 25,000 followers now on LinkedIn. I'm sure I'll get a lot more after this podcast.
I have lots of requests from people that are asking me how to break into the MSO role, but I have to I have to tease that out. But I would tell somebody who is new or starting off to reach out start reaching out to MSOs. We're not people that are not friendly, that are not helpful. We understand the road that you're going down. I've helped a lot of people break into the MSO role by just giving them advice or trying to connect them with somebody. And I'm sure my colleagues would do the same.
I mean, it's a very close knit society, and it's one that is predicated on if we wanna help patients, we clearly wanna help people come into this area because we need talent here. Yeah. You saw COVID be the biggest example of that. I mean, the talent that that is needed in the biopharmaceutical industry is, larger than it's ever been because the challenges that we're facing in medicine today are much larger than they've ever been, and and AKA the pandemic and what we've had to deal with there.
So I would just say go out. Don't be shy in connecting with people or sending somebody a a request for a connection, and then try to build a relationship with them and get to get to learn about them and know them. And I've actually met so many people who have gone that route, that have jumped on the limb and and sent me a request, and then they've said, hey. You know, down the road, they've said, hey. Let me tell you about myself. Let me tell you, you know, what I'm trying to do.
Is there any way you could help me? And I've had to be a little selective, in the way I've done it because you can't be all things to all people. I mean, I would turn into Tom Caravelli if I did that. Like, I I can't. And there's only one of that guy? No. There's only one famous Tom Caronrell. So Come on, man. You're making me blush. Right? But I can help them at least be part of that journey to getting into the MSO, and I I feel blessed to be able to do that. And you're doing a great job.
You're doing an amazing job. So do you think it makes sense for people to start internally within their own company to with people that are closest to them so that instead of, like, having to consider going out into the big bad world that exists is it just makes sense to say, hey.
Start within your own, you know, within your own company, within your own team, within your own organization, and see what you can do to step out and help somebody or offer to be a mentor or ask if you're brand new, if there's someone on your team, if they would be willing to coach you to mentor you. Does that make that seems to make sense. Absolutely. Absolutely. Start low. Right? Start low and go slow. Kind of start with your own core in your company and then work your way out. Right?
I also think there's another great way to do this if you're gifted in certain ways, whether it be, you know, putting out content or things of that nature. Start putting out content and people will automatically want to connect with you because it's stuff that will resonate with them. It's things that they would want to learn.
I've learned so much on LinkedIn and YouTube and all these other places, and I've been able to connect with some of these people, and and it's really helped changed my life. It's changed the way I think about things. It's changed the way that, I view the world and how I help people in the world. And, ultimately, I think human beings want to leave a legacy because one day they're not gonna be here. Yeah. And the legacy you leave are the people you touch. Yep. That was my father telling me that.
I'm his legacy. I'm trying to build my own now. And the more people I touch, the bigger that legacy. And I have a challenge every day, like, I challenge myself every morning to touch somebody's life in a positive way each and every day. And before I go to bed, when I reflect on my day, I ask myself that same question. Was I able to do that? And today, I will ask that exact same question.
Wow. I think that, you know, people should definitely take these two approaches that we put out there, and I wish them the best. And, you know, at some point, I'd love to get on and talk about some other topics too. I mean, this is a amazing topic, but there's so much out there that we can share with people. Well and and not to jump into another topic, but you you mentioned content. And I think it is great advice, especially in this day and age for everybody to establish your own brand.
And the best way to do it is through a medium like LinkedIn or Facebook or, you know, you know, Instagram from a business standpoint doesn't really resonate, even Facebook. So let's talk about LinkedIn for a second. So maybe it's it's not a bad idea to start thinking about as you develop your career. Okay. What am I an expert in? What's my brand? And how do I how do I get my message out there through content?
And when I have conversations with people like this, the first thing I would say to them is, well, I don't know what to write. I don't know what to post. I don't know what to publish. So what advice do you have for people that are kinda, like, not sure where to start or they're stuck? Because it seems like it's coming easy for you. So what would you tell people if they're starting out and they're trying to get their brand out there? That's a great question.
So find the things that really motivate. For me, it was leadership. It was empathy. It was, you know, teaching people how to connect with other people. These are all soft skills I think you use in every facet of your life. Find what motivates you and turn that into your passion, and then put content out around that because you're passionate about it. And so you're willing to put in the time.
And, you know, I've gone on hiatuses for a couple of weeks on LinkedIn at times where I haven't put out any content. And I get a barrage of emails like, are you okay, Prashant? Or, hey, when are you putting out your next post? And, you know, it's so touching to me that people read it and are touched by it. I had one post that had over a 1000000 hits. It was trending on LinkedIn. Yeah. And I was just like, wow. I cannot believe this.
But, you know, you'd be surprised at how many people you can touch by doing something that you're passionate about. And so that would be my advice to them. I mean, it's like what you're doing with this podcast. You're passionate about MSLs. You've made a remarkable impact in the MSL world. I think you're one of the the best recruiters there is, but not only a recruiter, but a friend and somebody who would help somebody great break into the MSO world. It's not just a job for you.
It's very personal for you. And if you make it personal for you, then it's not a job anymore, and it's easy to build that content. That's a great point. I I appreciate you saying that. But you're right. I mean, I I don't look at this as a job. I mean, I think this is just me. This is who I am. This is what I do. And I I enjoy it. I look forward to doing it. I feel that I'm very fortunate to be in a career that I really do love. And I get excited to come to work every day, not every day.
But, you know, I I really do love it. And I love doing this podcast. I love talking to people. I love helping people. And I think that's what it's all about. So it's funny. We're coming full circle because we use the words in the very beginning, you said authentic and authenticity. And I feel like that's, at the end of the day, be yourself, but also look to see, as you said, look to see how you can help others and let that motivate you. And I think that's a great takeaway.
I mean, I I love the fact that you challenge yourself every day and ask yourself, what did I do today to help somebody else? And that's that's holding yourself accountable for keeping this mentor attitude and this leadership responsibility alive. So good job, man. You're awesome. I I I knew you would be. I couldn't wait to have you on. And now we gotta think about what's our next topic gonna be. Yeah. Definitely wanna come on again and be famous one more time with Tom Caravaggio. Come on, man.
You're making me blush again. Prashant, you're awesome. Thanks for coming on. This was great. I hope a lot of people got I'm sure people got a lot out of this. I know I did, but we're, we're gonna have to do it again. Thank you, Tom. Really appreciate the time and the opportunity. Keep up the awesome work, man. You're a good dude. You really are. Appreciate you. Thank you. Thank you so much for listening to the show.
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