Tal Ben-Shahar: Happier - Learn the Secrets to Daily Joy and Lasting Fulfillment

[Music] hello and welcome to the moonshots podcast it's episode 192 i'm your co-host mike parsons and as always i'm joined by the man with the plan mr mark pearson freeland good morning mark hey good morning mike i'll tell you what the plan today is to carry on our series on happiness which i'll tell you what i'm already learning a lot and thoroughly enjoying how about you me too i mean technically we should all be 10 happier from our episode uh two shows ago uh we then added in a little reflection i think that gets us to 15 happier yeah and boy today i think we're going to shove it into the 20s maybe 30 happier what do you think mark yeah i totally agree today listeners and members we are digging into as show 192 tell ben shahar's happier learn the secrets to daily joy and lasting fulfillment i mean mike remember when we had our show with dan harris and we were reflecting on the title and that was that was getting you and i pretty pumped i think tal ben shahar is doing a thoroughly good job in at least having the runner up for the most promising title within the series i think you're right i mean who doesn't want a you know a little bit of joy in their day but then on the long term kind of uh thing lasting fulfillment i mean they're so big and amorphous i mean i'm really looking forward to breaking them down into things that i can do so i can get a little bit of sparkle in my day and feel good um for the longer term so i didn't know a lot about uh tal ben shahar and his book called actually titled happier i didn't know a lot about it before we studied it for the show mark but it promises some really good thinking some really practical things that you can do around happiness but more importantly perhaps he really challenges us challenges us in a very moonshot way that happiness really isn't pleasure there's a lot more to it than just that isn't it yeah i think as we were finding out within dan harris it was uh almost uh having a moment you know he had that fantastic i mean not fantastic for him but very vivid uh story where he had this this panic attack and then he went on his own sort of self journey to understand a little bit more about what makes him happier what we're now going to see as we dig into the world of talben shahar is i think much more of a science approach you know he was a a teacher at harvard university and he ran the most popular life-changing course as some people described it to all of his students and it was highly oversubscribed and i think that revealed the intention that a lot of us have when it comes to this amorphous or most strange ideal of happiness yeah and as we're going to hear from tal during the course of today's show he reflects on studies research references maybe even some advice from some of the self-help individuals that are out there and he does this fantastic job of trying to weave it all together so that you and i readers and listeners we can all get a better understanding of this concept of this perhaps crazy idea of happiness and how to be yeah yeah how good how good and he definitely what i love about him is he has this idea where he's got the scientific academic body of work the practical application and also he's not proposing to us the easy path but definitely the path of more meaning so mark i'm keen to get stuck in where do you want to start yeah yeah i think you're right if if there's any ever show that's all about moon shots it's going to be today's show with tal ben shahar so let's hear from the man himself talking about how he reversed his unhappiness and also introduces you and i to the idea of selfish or selfless i became interested in happiness because of my own unhappiness it didn't make sense to me because looking at my life from the outside things looked great but from the inside it didn't feel that way [Music] we're told from a very young age whether explicitly or implicitly that it's all about success it's all about the attainment of the next goal of the next milestone and yet achieving these goals does not bring us to a happier place certainly not in the long term and i wanted to figure out what is it if anything can lead us to a better happier more fulfilled existence and that is what i've been doing over the past 30 years looking for answers [Music] now what drew me to studying happiness was of course first and foremost my personal experience i wanted to feel better i wanted to be happier one of the issues that people have with the pursuit of happiness is that it's a selfish endeavor or is it because when i pursue happiness when i contribute to myself i'm in a much better place to also help others the problem though doesn't lie in the pursuit of happiness but rather in our concepts so is it selfish or selfless well it's neither in both it's self full [Music] selffulness synthesizes the best of both worlds of selfishness and selflessness and they work together reinforcing one another in an upward spiral of generosity and benevolence because we have mirror neurons in our brain and when we encounter an act of generosity that has an impact on us we're more likely to then act generously and benevolent so giving is contagious now there is a double standard when it comes to cultivating happiness in every other endeavor in life we understand that we need to practice we need to put in the time similarly with happiness it's not enough to read a book or hear a lecture or come up with an idea as good as it may be for us to become happier what we need to do is invest invest time and effort [Music] invest in finding meaning in what we do in life go out and exercise engage with text or nature invest in our relationships not just rely on the fact that there is good chemistry or connection we need to put in the work when we put in the work that is based on science on evidence-based ideas that is when we increase our levels of happiness and because happiness is contagious we do the same for others what an interesting uh juxtaposition of helping yourself so you can help others mark i think the risk when we talk about this is that it can all become so abstract what kind of stuff is do you think he is encouraging us to do what habits should we build so that we can be more self-full well i think immediately when i hear tal break down this or his his interpretation and theory on happiness is similar to what we've understood on the moonshot show when it comes to management of people or leadership you cannot necessarily be the best leader unless you work on yourself you have to study it you have to put it in practice you have to like ken blanchard would say with my one minute manager encourage feedback as well as receive it and i think what's interesting and possibly a direction that i did not appreciate we would go in with regards to this emotion of happiness instead it's something that you physically work on it's a practice you put in the hard work so when it comes to like you say habits and and what to do i think it really comes down to the essential rules of treating each other like we would like to be treated you know as as step one don't blame others for perhaps the stresses that you might be having because at the end of the day they probably have stuff going on as well so it's down to giving each other benefit of the doubt because that's probably what you would like yourself don't you think yeah and um it reminds me of when we talked about adam grant and he talked about give and take and there's givers takers and matches i think there's this really interesting idea about you know fulfillment and and satisfaction and feeling uh complete and and you know all of that uh sense of realizing your your potential comes from giving sharing and helping of others but doing so in a way where you help yourself so you can help others and that's like this big continuous loop like as somebody who is a husband and a parent and someone who works in teams i'm very mindful of in order to contribute you know i have to put others before myself but in order to to be somebody who is generous and supporting that i need to be in a good place because if i'm exhausted i just won't be able to bring my best self and i can't support people or i'll be just too i'll just be too tired to help and when when um tal ben shahar has been you know a lot of people have questions about this idea of this intersection of selfish selfless which is called self-full it's a balance um he he shares this quote from the dalai lama and i want to read it to you and i think this really kind of uh points to something like if your intentions you want to do the right thing it cannot come at too big a cost to yourself because in the end you don't end up doing good so here's the quote from the dalai lama caring for others based on only on your sacrifice doesn't last caring must also feed you now what i take from that is um when i look at the work that i do with colleagues and partners and clients what i invariably love what i search for is the capacity to work on something that not only that i enjoy but to be in a place where i can create some sort of value for the other person it might be that we build a product together or it might be that i share with them some techniques for them to build a product to me that's the the giving or in the context here of being selfless i'm i am giving i am teaching in them what i get back is working together enjoying this but also i in order to enjoy that loop of giving and taking i need to make sure that i am sleeping eating exercising that i don't have too much work on so i kind of see this self-full as the capacity to be generous to care to help people around you to support people around you but to do so in a way that you get something back from it the delight the satisfaction sometimes it's acknowledgement or praise if you're always giving and you get nothing back i think that's the enemy here right yeah yeah yeah exactly i think if you are not getting any um you know like the dalai lama would say in the quote you just read if you're not getting anything back if it's not feeding you if it's not feeding your um soul i guess then you're only doing it for the sake of other people which is of course good in itself but when you can similar to a habit when you can see or feel or give yourself the mindset that you know treating others as in in a better way and caring for them then has a positive effect on yourself i think therefore you're more likely to do it again because you have started to built in that ability to notice it is a positive reinforcement on yourself and therefore it becomes more of a habit and easier right easier that's what we're looking for right yeah so i think like a flag here is like if you find yourself um professionally in a team where um the giving comes at a huge cost or if you're in a personal relationship where your giving comes at a huge cost i think that's a flag to open up this book from tao ben shahar and ask yourself hmm am i experiencing enough joy and fulfillment and it can start you on a path of investigation to ask yourself are you are you kind of caring for others based on only your sacrifice or are you getting fed to and i think that that's a great place to start a second place you could go is to become a member of the moonshots podcast you can become our patron and market is so exciting we are almost at the tipping point we're almost at 50 members and we get the chance to welcome a new member uh today so i think mark it is time to shine a light on all our wonderful moonshots members right yes the individuals who are learning the secrets to daily habits motivations as well as giving us all the support that they can and we in turn give them a luna powered dose of good karma goes out too bob and niles john and terry nile marjolin ken dietmar and marjan connor rodrigo jasmine and lisa sid mr bondur maria paul and berg cowman and david joe and crystal evo christian hurricane brain and samuela kelly and barbara bob and andre matthew eric and abby josie and joshua chris and kobe damian and deborah gavin and lasse tracy steve craig lauren javier and daniel our brand new member welcome once again to our members and our supporters thank you for giving us your uh support as well as your ears every single week and every single month and mike all it costs is just a simple cup of coffee a month isn't it it's crazy and we really appreciate uh your support because it helps us pay the bills and um you know as our shows get more and more popular the hosting goes up the bills get bigger um and uh it is so exciting to know that uh we are our work is being appreciated by you actually it feels really good for us there's our little secret to daily joy is right mark we we see or literally 55 000 people every month just on the podcast not on not including youtube and the website are tuning in and we love it uh to see that because it tells us when you become a member that we're creating value that you want to support us in this endeavor as we get up very early uh every tuesday morning to record the show don't we i mean it's like this is uh in the early wee hours of a sydney morning isn't it well and similar to what you were saying previous mike with regards to caring for others and and trying to be the best version you know you and i we're not going out late at night are we we turn up fresh-faced and rosy-tailed to record our shows and that's really just about putting our best foot forward isn't it it really is so thanks once again to all of our members thank you to you daniel uh we really do appreciate your support and if you do want to support us head over to moonshots.io go to the members section and then you'll you'll get connected to patreon and you can do all of that goodness with just a few clicks what else what's going to take you a little bit more than just a few clicks is getting through some of the challenges in life and we've got a couple of clips now where tal ben shaha is going to really kind of set up maybe a challenging idea that uh this pursuit of happiness isn't as easy as you might think there are only two kinds of people who do not experience painful emotions the first kind are the psychopaths the second kind are dead there is a false understanding or expectation that a happy life means being happy all the time no learning to accept and even embrace painful emotions is an important part of a happy life and the study of painful emotions is an important part of the field of happiness studies my name is tal ben shahar i'm a student and teacher in the field of happiness studies there is a very important concept that was introduced by nasim talib and that is anti-fragility anti-fragility is essentially resilience 2.0 resilience 1.0 is when we put pressure on a system after the pressure is lifted that system goes back to its original form anti-fragility takes this idea a step further you put pressure on a system it actually grows bigger stronger we see systems all around us and within us for example our muscular system we go to the gym and we lift weights we're putting pressure on our muscles what happens as a result we actually grow stronger we're an anti-fragile system on the psychological level you know what that's called ptg post-traumatic growth so where post-traumatic stress disorder ptsd is about breaking down post-traumatic growth is about growing stronger as a result of pressure stress it's anti-fragility the role of the science of happiness is to teach us what conditions we can put in place to increase the likelihood of growing from hardship mike i mean this is i think tal ben shahar must be a moonshot listener if he's not yet i don't know but i mean this seems bang on with where we go with the moonshot show doesn't it it it really really does and um i think it's so easy to to sit in our minds and think oh everything is so hard like you know i i for me it's the build of oh work ah i have to work on uh you know supporting uh my parents ah then i have my partner oh then i have kids like everything is calling on me it's like it's work work work work work work work and it's very easy to kind of almost spiral uh and just say why is it why is it so hard right why do i have to fight so hard to actually get on the other side and i think we all suffer a little bit from that don't you like just like it feels like life is permanently like work in progress well i think you're always when you're in that mindset and i've certainly been there as as we all do you're looking for the next relief on you the next attainment the next thing that you can tick off the list and move on and i think where tal is leading us here is to not always try and turn the page try and get to the next thing get through it grin and bear it and you know maybe take it out on others because you're feeling a little bit low or unhappy along the way instead what he's really calling out with this idea of post-traumatic growth and this this resilience 2.0 from taleb's anti-fragility is this embracing the embracement i suppose of those experiences and those challenges that come along the way which i think mike you and i are both thinking the same thing it's yoko willing again isn't it yeah challenge and and and we're so um tempted to avoid challenge struggle and pain and tal ben uh shahar says in the book the the the pain associated with the fear of failure you know is often stronger than the pain of failure itself i could believe that yeah how how often i mean we're our own worst enemies aren't we it's mark manson with the subtle art of not giving her a woo hoo you know we are often uh we have more pain within our minds as we're fearing a potential experience more so than the actual experience itself when you shift your mindset towards maybe embracing those painful experiences and instead you're getting something out of it you're learning how you respond to a challenge where you might be able to grow then suddenly it becomes almost dare i say fun yeah um like for me it's like as soon as you don't resist pain struggle and hardship and just say oh um that is part of life like once you accept that it happens and then as a build on that then you say oh and that is really the path to reward and satisfaction because everything that you fight for it feels really good mark manson talked about that a lot in the show we did on him it is um something that joe rogan talked about a lot who wants to win the lottery because actually if you really earned it and did the work how good is the the millions the rewards that come from the hard work and uh there's this great idea from from uh mark twain where he says i've experienced a great deal of pain and suffering in my life most of which has never happened ah now i like that how good is that but it's so true isn't it it's so i think i think we're just allergic in many ways to to pain and challenge what we have learned whether it's goggins or here today with tao ben shahar just accepting that it happens life is hard it is not easy pleasure is not a default right as soon as you do that you've changed your expectations and said all right so it's going to be a little tricky it's going to be hard i'm going to have to soldier on there'll be times when i feel like stopping but i can't i need to go through it the beauty of if you accept that what we all know like to use what uh you know tell ben shahar was talking about you're in the gym and you're working out and you're really going for it with the weights you can feel how hard this is on your muscles and we know that technically there's a sort of a tearing of the muscles and that's why the day after you feel sore because the muscle is growing back but it grows back stronger so this is the next big point so if you accept the pain then you can be prepared to get the reward on the other side so let's have a listen to tao ben shahad talking about what's on the other side you can essentially situate all our experiences on a continuum so we have the you know on the ups on the positive side we have you know joy and and success and and fun and gains and on the you know then we have the neutral and then on the on the negative side we would have pain and sorrow and struggles and anxiety and most people think that dealing with happiness is about dealing with the the upside when things are going well um however happiness the science of happiness can help no less when things are not going well so yeah it can help us go from a five to a seven it can also help us deal with the with the negative five and the negative seven and in order to understand that we need to understand an idea that was introduced just a few years ago by nassim talib nassim taleb is a professor at nyu and he talks about the idea of anti-fragility and what is anti-fragility you know as i've studied it i've come to call it resilience 2.0 so you know so what is resilience 1.0 traditional resilience so to speak actually a term that comes from engineering and it's the ability of material of something to go back to its original form after pressure has been put on it so we have you know a piece of rubber we squish it put pressure on it it's resilient it goes back or we have a ball we drop it it bounces back this is what resilience is about bouncing back anti-fragility takes that a step further so if you put pressure on a system it doesn't just go back to where it was before it goes to a better stronger higher place so you squish material it goes back and becomes bigger you throw a ball it bounces back up higher than it was before now the thing about anti-frigidity is that we see anti-fragile systems all around us you know i'll give you uh just one example or two examples one physiological one psychological the physiological example is your muscles your muscular system you go to a gym and you lift weights and you're putting pressure on your uh on your muscles as a result of that pressure you go once you go twice a week later you go again and again as a result of the pressure that you're putting on the system it doesn't just go back to where it was before you actually get stronger bigger healthier that's potentially an anti-fragile system so this is physiologically psychologically we also see it you know so um most of my students in my classes most not all are psychology majors and i always ask them this question and usually i'm not the first psychology class that that they take so i asked them the following question i said put your hand up if you know what ptsd is ptsd post traumatic stress disorder the overwhelming majority of students psychologists or not put their hand up then i said to them okay great put your hand down i have another question now i'd like you to put your hand up if you know what ptg is now i'm sure many people from this audience know what ptg is the overwhelming majority of my students have no clue ptg post traumatic growth now here is the thing according to the research by tedeschian calhoun ptg is twice as likely to happen as ptsd twice as likely if and this is a very big if first you know about the possibility the existence of ptg so if you don't know about this possibility well then it's unlikely to or less likely to happen the second thing it's to know what conditions you can put in place in order to increase the likelihood of ptg you cannot guarantee pgg sometimes trauma does lead to a to ptsd to disintegration however if you know what conditions to put in place you can increase the likelihood significantly increase the likelihood of growing from trauma i mean mike again this is a really interesting and reveal as we are within our happier and happiness series of the concept of what it means to a struggle and find things quite difficult but also be come out the other side and maybe be that a little bit more happier or at least comfortable with the experience that you've gone through yeah and what he goes into in the book is these five key areas that you can explore with ptg like how you can grow after like a real challenge hardship trauma whatever it is i mean i think the um the first let's let's let's have some fun with this mic we'll kind of we'll get in the locker room and let's let's pep ourselves up and all of our listeners i think you go through something really tough okay [Music] the first thing you can do is just say i survived like there is growth in that idea like if it doesn't kill you it makes you stronger and um i really relate to that when you do like a really intense or long physical exercise and you really push yourself once you've got across the finish line you're like dang i'm still alive and i did it like i recently did a marathon and my wife posted yep first marathon done no heart attack still alive thank god shared it with all our friends but but there's so much truth that you can appreciate that you went to your boundary maybe if you were goggins like you went through what you thought was your boundary and all of a sudden you're like wow this is amazing like after some enormous challenge you can just have an appreciation for life itself right um and i think the same is true uh perhaps to a less clear or you know transparent extent when you do struggle with things in your career you know i think you're totally right with the with the physical element but i think it's true from the psychological piece as well isn't it whereby you are relieved to have survived you know it sounds a little bit dramatic but i survived that project or i survived that experience of working with so and so and yes it can help as you as you reflect back on it can't it and you know the second part is it's all about relationships as well so you know very often we go about these things um with others we're in it it's a team sport life is a team sport so you can look at each other and say hey we did it so not only i survived but we did it together and you can appreciate the bond and the companionship that you have with those but you know very much what uh you know first time runner's experience is like holy hell i didn't know i could do that what else have i previously thought impossible that now might be possible if you had said to me a year ago i was gonna run a marathon i'd be like no way jose but now that i've done it i'm like oh what else um and then you can start to say well you know if i built a system to go and do a marathon or work on a really hard project well then you know in yourself that you're battle ready so you can bring almost a confidence from say something in your personal life or on the sports field you can bring that to your professional life because you know you have that inner strength it doesn't matter whether it's work or or personal or on the sports field it's all coming from the same place isn't it mark yeah it really really is that personal strength is something that you can control and if you know and are comfortable with where you can lean towards and you know that you can rely on yourself to experience and therefore get through a particularly difficult patch that's pretty encouraging isn't it mike and i think that in turn leads to where the fifth outcome of uh ben shahar's work on post-traumatic growth is this spiritual change because then it can lean into either an area of you know faith or it can in turn lead into an area of increased happiness and the maybe if if happier is the all-encompassing word it's comfort it is the acceptance that where i am right now is good i'm happy unpleasant and it's that appreciation of and gratitude of the now which i think is is something again that we've really delved into with um you know all of the work we've done on being gratitude and in the moment and i think this is one of the big ahas when we're digging into ben shahar's happier is the fact that we can learn these you know potential patterns that you see when you're doing something really difficult like let's say a marathon training knowing that at the end you might have this uh newfound appreciation for yourself or life or maybe others is going to help you and stay motivated throughout that experience of challenge prior to the event don't you think absolutely absolutely and i think you know we we use the idea of a marathon just because it seems so daunting and all of that but it could be a project it could be um something you do at home something with friends with your community or it could be in the in the office with your your colleagues i think the point here is after going through a challenge and you know to use this marathon analogy it is traumatic on the body the body is like you're running 42 kilometers for three or four hours are you mad the body isn't hating what are you doing this is bonkers and um you know those that last uh five or ten kilometers those last five miles oh boy on your first marathon do you meet the maker you're just like whoa this is hard but the sense of completeness that you have at the end because it is such an intense endeavor the the satisfaction and fulfillment uh when you finally can stop knowing that you just gave it your all is epic awesome worthwhile and that's what we just can learn from tal ben shaha we should train ourselves on a two-step process except that it's not all going to be easy and that there's going to be hard work and the other side of the hard work the challenge even maybe the trauma of it we are stronger for it and if we can hold that to be true we can fight off you know that those survival instincts of take the easy path cut the corner you don't need to because all sorts of goodness is there and mark something that's not nearly as daunting is uh leaving a review for the moonshots podcast but it is equally rewarding wouldn't you say i mean the reward if we start at the uh the act you know it's quite a simple little process isn't it mike if you listeners are enjoying what you're hearing and learning uh out loud with myself and mike and the moonshots team pop along into your podcast app of choice and leave us a review or even a rating you can do that in the apple podcast app you can leave us some comments and also you can leave a rating within spotify 2. and this really really helps mike the result of that input which is getting out into the ears of more listeners around the world we hear from uh listeners and and fans very very regularly from all four corners of the globe and mike i mean it gives us so much motivation as well as gratitude doesn't it when it comes to creating the show when we're hearing from our listeners because we really are just trying to put out a product into the world that is providing some benefits some information on happiness productivity motivation we're learning out loud and we're glad that listeners from all over the globe are learning out loud with us every single week but it really comes down to the customers and you guys and the listeners just giving us a little rating or review because it does that algorithmic work doesn't it mike oh it's it's it's like it starts a snowball effect and you know uh in the last week we've had um lots and lots of new listeners from wait for this this is what a collection of countries norway india singapore hungary slovenia vietnam estonia nepal like how awesome is that that because you guys get in there you give us a thumbs up you give us a star a rating or a review this helps us to be discovered by people all around the planet so thank you so much and if you haven't had a chance to do it yet open up the app right now it literally i think it's like a three to five second process give us some love because we get love back and that is what it's all about now as we kind of turn our minds we've we've kind of learned that there is a certain need to get over challenge to get over hardship to get through the pain and the trauma because on the other side uh there's all sorts of goodness and what is really important now that we're discovering this system from tal ben shahar is we're going to go next level into some key steps that you can take in the pursuit of happiness now there is a paradox when it comes to pursuing happiness on the one hand we know that happiness is a good thing whether in and of itself or as a means toward other ends at the same time we also know from research by iris moss and others that people who say to themselves happiness is important for me i want to pursue it those individuals actually end up being less happy in fact the more likely to experience depression so the paradox is that on the one hand happiness is clearly a good thing on the other hand valuing it as a good thing is problematic so what do we do the way to resolve this paradox is that we pursue happiness indirectly think about sunlight so if i look at the sun directly it's going to hurt my eyes however if i break down sunlight into its elements into its constituents i can look at the colours of the rainbow so i'm indirectly looking at the sunlight enjoying it savoring it in the same way pursuing happiness directly can cause more harm than good but breaking it down into its elements can lead us to enjoy the indirect pursuit of happiness and by extension to raise our overall levels of happiness [Music] what are the metaphorical colors of the rainbow when it comes to happiness here we have what i've come to call the spire model and it can trigger the anti-fragile system spire is an acronym that stands for spiritual physical intellectual relational and finally emotional well-being spirituality is about finding a sense of meaning and purpose in life at work and at home if you wake up in the morning with a purpose you're more likely to overcome barriers when it comes to physical well-being the most important idea to look at is stress the silent killer in the united states more than half of the employees do not use up their vacation time and even those that do close to half are still tethered to their work the problem is not the stress it's the lack of recovery with intellectual well-being there's research showing that people who are curious who ask questions are not just happier they also live longer another important element is not just asking questions it's deeply engaging with material it can be text a work of art even nature relational well-being is very important the number one predictor of happiness is quality time we spend with people we care about and who care about us and it turns out the number one condition that we can put in place to increase the likelihood of anti-fragility of growing through hardship is the quality of our relationships finally emotional well-being so embracing painful emotions is critical but how do we then cultivate pleasurable ones specifically the emotion of gratitude cicero talked about gratitude as the mother of all virtues when we appreciate the good in our life we have more of it so happiness is much more than pleasure happiness is whole being these five elements together create that sunlight happiness i don't think there is a point before which one is unhappy after which one is happy rather happiness resides on a continuum it's a lifelong journey and knowing that we can have realistic rather than unrealistic expectations about what is possible i do not think that things necessarily happen for the best however we can learn to make the best of things that happen oh mike i mean what a what an epic clip that we have within this show i mean we could have done a whole show just on that clip right we really really could have because i mean we're gonna try and break down as much as we can right but the thing that stands out right away to me mike which i think is is something to start with it's actually something that tao says right towards the end of the clip which is the fact that happiness happy inverted commas or feeling content is a lifelong journey and once we have that in mind we realize that we aren't rushing towards it we're not waking up every morning feeling unhappy because we're not happy instead once you accept that it's something you just have to work on like anything like a muscle like anything you have to put into practice it's suddenly i i personally think feels more achievable and instead of judging yourself and how you're feeling today perhaps instead you're looking into ways and habits and mechanics that can help you get at that little bit closer towards that destination rather than trying to be unhappy with where you are right now how do you hear from that well i think um a big theme in his pursuit of happiness is resetting expectations and i know this is something that i'm coming back to a lot in the show but i think this is where it all starts not having and perhaps i was a victim of this and that's why it's really jumping out at me is the reality of what he's saying is like just be prepared for the harder path it's not going to come easy it's not going to come instantly but it's something that you have to kind of build daily habits for um and when i look at his spire these five steps we'll we'll have a link to these in the show notes which you can get at moonshots.io i mean this is what a playbook like let me just play it back to you like you know leading a meaningful life and mindfully saving the present caring for the body engaging in deep learning nurturing constructive relations feeling all emotions mark i i think there's so many great starting points to feeling more satisfied not only with life but just joy in your day and a bit of fulfillment for the longer term what i was wondering should we try and nail five habits and to unlock these five steps uh are you ready oh yes all right here's your challenge name me one moonshot habit to get a more meaningful life and mindfully savouring the present all right i think mike unfortunately i'm going to be stealing the one that you probably wanted to say which is reflection yeah it's journaling it's what we heard with matthew mcconaughey last week in the show and what we're hearing from tal if you don't give your time to recover you're not necessarily getting the most out of it very good uh for the physical for this is the p of the spire framework uh what's one habit you could uh adopt a moonshot habit uh caring for the body and tapping into the mind-body connection i mean it's got to be exercised hasn't it it definitely does and if that's too much for you you can throw in a little bit of breathing uh work big breath work right yeah four seven eight breath work very good for connecting mind and body okay intellectual so we're at the eye of the s p i r aspire framework engaging in deep learning where that would have to be listening to moon shots right exactly exactly it's it's learning something new every day you know robin sharma when we'd when we broke down his 5 a.m club one of the core pillars of his structure strategy was to learn yes learn something new every day it doesn't matter what time it is you don't all have to wake up at 5am but it's learning something new each day allows you to have curiosity and encourage your brain to keep on ticking relational this is the uh nurturing a constructive relationship with self and others what would you do there well i think this is really encouraging us to reach out to those people who are around us whether it's teammates or colleagues or partners and instead of closing them out maybe it's staying away from your digital space i mean obviously digital connections are great it's important to pick up the phone and message people if they don't know physically around you but actually having the real life interactions i think is what i'm getting from ben shahar here emotional this is the last one of the spy steps feeling all emotions reaching towards resilience and positivity what would be the habit you would do there well obviously it's coming from eckhart tolle and the power of now isn't it it's noticing the present it's some of the tips that eckhart had for us you know even when you're brushing your teeth it's the feel of the bristles it's maybe the vibration of the toothbrush it's the taste of the mint with the coldness of the floor it's really appreciating your sensory connections to what's happening right here right now the chair i'm sitting on the warmth of the room the movement of my laptop screen as you and i are recording this show that for me mic is is where the emotional connection's coming from well there you go that's five practical moonshot habits you can do to get your pursuit of happiness with the spy steps from talbin shahar in order and going in the right way but mark we have we have just one more final clip and it it's a it's an absolute cracker why don't you set us up for the last bit of wisdom from tao bencher well we've certainly learned a lot from tal today with regards to self-fullness the acceptance of pain and looking maybe not directly at the sun but looking at happiness from a different angle so let's hear from tell just one more time today as he breaks down this critical misconception about happiness and his study of happiness back in 2015 i was on a transatlantic flight when a question came to mind how is it that there is a field of study for psychology philosophy history medicine geography you name it and there is no field of study for happiness yeah there is positive psychology but that's just the psychology of happiness what about what philosophers like lao tzu or aristotle had to say about it what about what literature remarked on happiness or neuroscience or theology or economics why isn't there an interdisciplinary field of study that looks at life's ultimate highest goal i resolved on that flight to help create a field dedicated to the study of happiness there are two main critiques that people have for the field of happiness studies the first one is that it's superficial the reason is that they equate happiness with pleasure so when people say i went to the beach i was so happy or this ice cream just makes me happy well that's not happiness that is pleasure happiness is much more than pleasure it also includes our ability to deal with painful experiences finding a sense of meaning and purpose cultivating healthy relationships and intellectual development the second critique of the field of happiness stems from the false understanding that a happy life is a life devoid of painful emotions it's not it can never be part of a happy life is the vicissitudes of daily life overall happiness includes life's ups and downs the signs of happiness can strengthen our psychological immune system because as i see it the role of the science of happiness is first of all to introduce us to concepts like post-traumatic growth which is growing stronger as a result of hardship and second to teach us what conditions we can put in place in our homes in our organizations in our schools in our countries to increase the likelihood of growing from hardship hardship is inevitable what we do with a hardship well here we have a choice we have a choice mark and that is really how we want to perceive the mindset that we want to have to the ups and downs and i think what we've heard today is tal ben shaha has given us quite the road map to face those ups and downs and we don't we just don't have to start with expectations of perfection but rather simple habits that we can do every day i mean this is on point moonshot kind of stuff isn't it well isn't it fun that the series of happiness is already revealing such uh new ways of thinking of reflecting and looking at this concept of happiness mike i mean it's certainly much more than as tao was saying in that final clip more than just the feeling of pleasure or feeling maybe joyful instead happiness is a journey like anything in life it's something you put in the practice the time and the effort and then you get the result out of it and i think what's really surprising as we're going through all of these episodes on the concept of happiness is how it's something that we really really do need to work on both physically as well as mentally i think this is really uh enjoyable and revealing isn't it it is and he gave us a new acronym ptg uh he gave us a framework of five steps spire of all of those which one's getting gonna get an extra bit of attention from you mark uh over the coming days oh this is that well that's actually pretty challenging one isn't it i think it's this reveal that happiness is not um a one-stop shop it's something you've got to work on so i think for me it's the e with emotional within the spire model mm-hmm healing the emotions being present but also working towards that major moonshot mantra of resilience and that reveal of resilience 2.0 with anti-fragility is such a big takeaway what about you mike what are you really taking away from today's show uh i think i'm a bit similar to you um that spire those five steps sound very good and i think it's all about just setting the right expectations um so lots of work to do there and um well mark we're really in the thicker things in happiness and i just want to say thank you to you in joining me on this adventure where we learn out loud and i want to thank you our members and listeners too for today was a big part a big step in the happiness journey here on the moonshots podcast it was show 192 where we studied the work of tao ben shahar his book happier learning the secrets to daily joy and lasting for fulfillment and boy it started with look you have to help yourself if you want to help others and that was the idea of self-full and part of our journey towards happiness is accepting pain and accepting that there is growth on the other side of challenge we can appreciate life relationships new possibilities personal strength and personal and spiritual change it's all there on the other side of any challenge so we can lead a much more fulfilling life a life that is those five key steps spiritual physical intellectual relational and emotionally good they can be both good in the long term and daily habits in the short term because we're going to need them because life will be full of ups and downs but if we hold true to the science of happiness from tal ben shahar we will be able to learn out loud together we'll be able to be the best version of ourselves and by the way that's what we're all about here at the moonshots podcast that's a wrap