You know what it is. That's right. It's time to talk money with your money nerd and financial coach. Now, tighten those purse strings and open those ears. It's the money talk with Tiff podcast. Hey, everyone. I am so excited because I have Doctor Hans on the line now. We met back in 2022 at Fincon, and his expertise is in digital assets and nfts. And so I wanted to bring him on, on the podcast to kind of talk about that with us because I am no expert. I'm
just gonna be real. So, hey, Doctor Hans, how are you? Oh, very, very well, Tiffany. So, so, so great to. To be on here. Yes. Thank you so much for coming finally. Yeah, it's been a long time in the making, so let's just hop right in. My first question for you is, what are your thoughts on the role that digital assets and cryptocurrencies and nfts and all these different things that we hear about plays in an investment
portfolio? Yeah. You know, when I came into understanding wealth building and investing, right, I noticed that the general kind of education or advice out there was, you know, get a. Then just invest in the S and P 500, right. And obviously, that is a broad basket of the top 500 companies in the US at any given time. And historically, this has been the main benchmark for investment returns. Right. It's been averaging about 10%
year over year for the past 80 to 100 years. So most individuals view investing as, this is how you diversify, get the S and P 500. Right. What I noticed, though, was that there were some individual companies within the S and P 500 that had phenomenal returns. And like Apple, right. For the past 15 years, Apple has been compounding at about 31%. Right? So that is three times the returns of the S and P 500. And with digital assets, bitcoin, it's been averaging 150% for the past 13 years.
Even last year, bitcoin was up 150%. Now, I'm not saying it's 150% every single year. That's the average. You could have some years where you will have a drawdown or a pullback. So when I saw this, I was like, okay, S and P 500 averages about 10% in some individual stocks, if they are good companies and they have incredible growth, can average anywhere between 20% to 30%. And you have digital
assets and crypto where you can get, like, upwards of 100%. So for me, diversification is just making sure that I have exposure to all of these different types of vehicles, whereas most investment kind of educators and advisors will say, oh, just buy an index fund. And the truth is, that is the safe and ideal way to go if you just want to steadily build wealth. But for people in our community, often we're catching up, right? We're behind as it relates to the wealth gap. So I
view it as we cannot just go with the status quo. We need to give ourselves an edge. Right? So then when an individual is able to combine, you know, the S and P 500 with individual stocks, and then you kind of sprinkle some cherry on top. Right. That's your digital assets and crypto that can exponentially make a huge difference. And I'll just share this one example. Let's say $500 invested over 20 years. If that $500 is compounding at 10%, you'd end up with about $300,000 over a 20 year period.
If that $500 compounding at, let's say, 25%. Now, if you remember the examples I gave you, I said s and p was 10%, stocks, somewhere around 30%, 20 to 30, and bitcoin has been averaging 150. So when I say when I use an average of 25%, even though it might seem high to the average investor, when you combine these three, it doesn't seem kind of impossible, like looking at historic returns. So at a 25% compounded return over 20 years, you're looking at $2 million. Right. So that's the edge that
I look at. And I say, you know, I cannot just settle for just a 10% average return. Yeah. And, you know, when you put it like that, it makes complete sense. I do want to throw out there really quick, a little disclaimer. This is not investment advice. We are just providing information for educational and entertaining purposes. So treat it as.
But you make a really valid argument for why you would want some diversification as it comes when it comes to individual stocks, cryptocurrencies, things that are not just the index funds. Yeah. Have that as your base, but then kind of diversify, you know, outside of that. Now, what if people are listening? They're like, okay, I hear you, Doctor Hans, but what about the risk? Yeah, there is risk for anything that
has the potential for an upside return. It has equally a similar potential for a downside return. Right. So, in essence, if you have an asset that can be up 150%, if the economy is not great, if liquidity in the financial system isn't there, meaning that banks aren't really lending a ton of money, the Federal Reserve isn't really pumping money into their system, or let's say the Federal Reserve is increasing interest rates, so it's tightening the economy.
In such an environment, you could have these kind of risk assets that do really, really well, like bitcoin. And certain stocks, like growth stocks, fall, you know, 50, 70, 80%. So an individual just has to understand that, yes, the same assets that can build you exponential wealth in economic environments that are not favorable, you could see significant pullback. So just mentally
understanding that and educating yourself. Right, to know what you're getting into and positioning yourself for the long term, instead of trying to kind of day trade or look for some kind of short term money, right? And that's why I give the example of 20 years. And that's why I was, when I spoke about bitcoin, I said for the past 13 years, it's been averaging 150%. But each and every year, it kind of depends on the economy, how it's doing, liquidity and things of that nature. Gotcha. Gotcha.
Okay, so now I want to dive into Nfts a little bit, because personally, I'm so confused on how all of this works. So first of all, what are they, how do they work? And how would one buy, what could they possibly look like too? And then how does one go about buying them? Yeah. You know, when most people think about nfts or they hear nfts, right? They just think about pictures of
apes, right? Because bored apes was the most popular NFT, and at a certain point it was worth over $400,000, even though originally they were purchased for about $250. So most individuals think about nfts as images of some kind of animal, right? Apes, monkeys, zebras, penguins. And I saw that happening kind of in their space. And I said to myself, people in my community are not going to take their hard earned money to buy pictures of animals, right? It didn't make sense to me.
So I wanted to create something that would, um, speak to individuals in our community. But before kind of diving into how I personally used nfts, let me take a step back and kind of share with you the definition of an NFT. So the simplest way to think about an NFT is, is that, well, NFT stands for non fungible token, which means a unique token, a special token, right? It's, it's pretty much one of a kind, right? Non fungible means you can't
interchange it. So the simplest way to think about an NFT is that it is a token, right? We've already said it's special and unique. So it's a token that shows ownership of something or another way to say that is, it's a token that authenticates ownership. And the reason why this is so important is because it takes away all of the hype and it allows you to understand exactly what it does. So, for example, in the future, let's say an individual buys a ticket to a Beyonce concert, right?
Well, those tickets can be issued as nfts. Why? Because individuals can be given or sent special tokens to their phone, and because that token is unique to them, right. If they show up to the concert with that NFT, we know that, okay. Yes, you're able to attend, right. It's a unique token, and it authenticates that you are the owner of that ticket. So in the real world right now, the way we authenticate ownership is via paperwork. If you go buy a car, you have to fill out documents
at a dealership. If you buy a house, you have to fill out documents, a deed, all of these things. So, pretty much paperwork kept at, you know, some kind of company in a database authenticates ownership. Nfts allow you to authenticate ownership using the blockchain, because all of that data is stored on the blockchain, which is globally accessible to everyone. So another way of saying that is that you can authenticate who owns something, and that information is available for
everyone to see. And it's a powerful concept, because all of a sudden, when you own something, let's say you own a token that represents a picture, right? Now, that token can also represent a house, it can represent a car that you just purchased. It's just that that is so far in the future, it's not happening right now. But it's a much better way to authenticate ownership. When you own that thing, it means that you have the power to be able to sell
it because you own the token, right? So then I want individuals to think about NFTs as a way to authenticate ownership. In terms of how to buy nfTs, an individual will need to educate themselves pretty much about how things work in their crypto ecosystem. They'll need to know about metamask, which is a wallet. They'll need to know about Opensea. I kind of teach about all of these things.
But going back to that example of images of monkeys selling for hundreds of thousands of dollars, you might ask, why is it that it was worth hundreds of thousands? And the simple answer is, because other people were willing to buy it from you for that price. It became kind of like the cool thing. It's almost like it was a status symbol. And if you ask me why, I have no idea. It was one of the first NFts that were created. So it's like if you have it,
it proves that you are an OG. Like you were in this ecosystem very early and for some reason people were willing to pay hundreds of thousands of dollars for it. So I was looking at all of this going on and I said to myself, no, no, no. There has to be a better use of this technology. And that's where the idea of the royals came to me. And it was, I want to create an NFT that represented african culture. As you can imagine, there wasn't any representation of us in this kind of a crypto
ecosystem. A lot of the things out there didn't represent kind of minorities or Africans or different cultures. So I just wanted to make sure that similar to how the Internet took off back in the day, and you didn't really have a lot of individuals in our communities participating in building the Internet. When Google and Facebook and all of these companies, Amazon's, were being created, PayPal's, you didn't see us represented. So I just wanted to make sure that we were represented or we are
represented. And that's what led me to create the royals. So the royals is the first NFT to showcase Africa's royal culture. And every single token holder, right, had an invitation. When we launched that year, 2022, they had an invitation to actually visit Ghana and their token allowed them to have a one week experience in Ghana leading up to what we call the royal gala. So, yeah, we had almost 300 to 400 royals join us for our royal gala in 2022. We had an absolute
blast this year. We're going to be going back in March. And the individuals who had the NFTs, depending on the type of NFTs that they had, you either get a discount on this year's trip or you can actually attend the royal gala for free this year. So we're looking forward to continue to use this NFT as a way for individuals to experience the african continent and hopefully in the future, even beyond Africa. Yes, yes. And y'all, he is not telling a lie. I saw all the stories and the videos and
the pictures. I had some serious FOMo because I knew a few people that went as well and they said they had a blast. So I'm looking forward to the next one so I can participate. But I love how you took the NFT concept and moved it to more of experiences versus just a picture of a monkey or, you know, I see the penguins all the time, or pictures of penguins. It's more of something that people will have a lifetime memory of doing this thing. And it was well worth it. You know what I'm saying? Yes,
yes. I like to say we, we created a royal family on the blockchain, right? One that it brings us together and we have experiences. And I wanted to also create something that when some, like before a person purchases it, they can kind of almost determine the value. Right. Because we had two nfts, the Ankara NFT, which there were about 2800 of them, was about $200. So imagine you pay dollar 200 and you get to experience like a full week in Africa. Mind blowing,
right? Absolutely. And we had the kinte NFT, which, you know, kinte fabric is like the official royal fabric in Ghana. Like, you only wear kinte when you're going to, like a wedding or like a very prominent event. Right? So the kinte NFT, that was a $2,000 price point. But the kind of benefits or perks that come with that kinti NFT is an individual who has the kinty. And we only created 200 kinte nfTs. With the kinti NFT, you can visit any of our future royal galas completely for free.
So it's just before an individual purchased that NFT like this, we wanted to create something that allows individuals to be able to kind of know the value and also have a digital asset that represents them, especially for us. Right. We need, we wanted to focus on retelling our story, right. As, you know, an immigrant, and I know there are other cultures, but for blacks, Africans, African Americans, it's like other people are telling our story, but we know our story. We are from
a royal background. We are royalty. And I just wanted to put that as the forward facing message in this ecosystem. So I continue to believe that in the future, right, over the next two to three years, I'm confident Apple or Google will make access to NFTs in their smartphone devices and it will make it even simpler to buy and sell. And once that happens, I believe individuals will look back at, oh, what was the OG project, right, that represented
african culture? And I honestly believe royals would be one that they look back at and say, wow, it's this. I could absolutely see that myself as well. And one thing I just wanted to, you hear me stumbling over my words because I'm over here, I want to get to this question, which is, you mean to tell me $2,000.01 time, or is this like a recurring or one. Time the kinty nfts one time, $2,000 purchase? Yeah. Wow. And then you have access to all of the royals trips
going forward. So what it sounds like to me and how I'm kind of formulating this in my mind to kind of make it to something that I do know. Right. Yeah. It's like a membership. Kind of. Exactly. So, like you can get in at this price. It may go up later on, but you're still grandfathered in and it's only a one time charge. And then, you know, later on maybe the price increases, whatever, but you are still in because you bought that membership at that time.
100%. But it even gets better. To remain a member, you need to have and own the token. Right. So let's say you had plans to sell one. Let's say you had plans to remain as a member, but you purchased two or three nfts. And it could either be Ankara or Kinte. It doesn't really matter. Right. Because you are saying to yourself, I feel like others might want to be members in the future. Right. So then let's say you bought three nfts in the future.
You are the only individual that can determine what price you are willing to take for those tokens or those membership spots. Does that make sense? Yes. Yes. So kind of like, for instance, like in the stock market, there's only a certain amount of stocks out there. The reason you can buy them is because people are selling them. And so with this, you're like, okay, our limit is 200. Whoever gets it, gets it. And then later on they'll just have to purchase from the people that already bought it.
Exactly. Exactly. Got it. Oh, interesting. Okay. Well, I hope there's some of the some left because, you know, also what I'm equating it to and not saying that this is what's gonna happen, but you know how people buy up tickets and then they start scalping them, you know, outside because they can sell it for more. Exactly. And I would honestly compare NFTs to tickets, honestly versus stocks. And the reason is because when you are buying, let's say, a ticket, you know that you're going for an
experience. But imagine you buy a ticket that gives you lifetime access to that type of event. So the question is, if you had the opportunity to buy, would you buy just one or would you buy several because you know that others might want it from you. Does that make sense? So, yeah, it provides that opportunity. But you also want to own an NFT where you believe that the individuals that issued it are going to stay true to their word. Right. Because if they, you know, if it just,
they don't host any other events, it just disappears. Which unfortunately happened to about 95% of NFT projects. Then you are left holding something that's worthless because no one else would be interested in it. That is a good point. And that was something I had thought about too with these pictures and stuff. And even in this case, what is stopping someone from saying, well, you know what, I'm going to just take them all down or people, it won't be
worth anything anymore. I'm glad you bought that point up. But I hear in this particular situation that as long as you make it to one, you at least get your money's worth. Exactly right. 100%. As long as you make it to one, you get your money's worth. Absolutely, absolutely. I envision royals honestly as cause it's a total of 3000 NFTs. 2800 Ankara 200 Akinti I just envision it as just kind of this group of individuals who are, they appreciate, you know, african culture.
They want the world to know that Africa or african culture represents royalty and they also love to travel, have experiences, right. And the goal honestly is to continue to offer these experiences and with the Ankara NFTs provide incredible discounts. Like so for example, this year an Ankara NFT would get you anywhere between five hundred dollars to one thousand dollars off of our packages. And the packages include like you wanted hotel stays and things of that nature.
So if you can imagine, you bought the NFT for $200 you're getting $500 to $1,000 off of a travel package. That's amazing. The kinty NFT, once you have it, you can attend the royal gala and any royal gala that we have in the future without having to pay anything for the gala. But once again, if you wanted like hotel stays and things of that nature, kinte members get even a higher discounted rate off of those reservations.
Gotcha, gotcha. Well, this was enlightening for me and I'm glad that you put it in terms where I could understand and therefore my audience can as well. And so I have a better understanding. I can leave this conversation and say, I know what nfts are now and. You'D be one of the very few, right? Less than 1% of individuals truly understand it. They view it as some kind of fad or like you know it. But at the end of the day, an NFT is just a token that authenticates or confirms that you own
something. That's it. Gotcha, gotcha. So thank you so much for sharing all this information. And you know, we say a low percentage now, until they listen to this episode, I understand it. So make sure you all are sharing this. But thank you so much, Doctor Hans, for coming on the show today and teaching us about nfts and the importance of diversification. Now, if people were interested in learning more about you or the royals experience NFT, how could they find you?
Yes, thank you so much for having me. I feel like more of this conversation will be so, so helpful because often with our community, we miss out on, you know, developing or up and coming tech opportunities investments. And when I say investments, I'm not even specifically referring to the royals. I could be referring to, like, bitcoin and other digital assets. So I think this dialogue is so, so, so important for those listening that want to connect with me.
You can find me on Instagram, heinvesting tutor, and also on Twitter or x if you're on threads. I'm at the investing tutor there as well, and my website is theinvestingtutor.com dot. I'm sure the links and the information will be placed in the show notes, but yeah, it was just such an incredible conversation. Thank you. Yes, yes. Thank you for that. And I will definitely have this in the show notes. And y'all, I'm over here scrolling through the different Kente nfts available and they
all are like different colors. And I'm like, oh, she looked cute. I want her, you know, that type of thing. So we, we put a lot of thought in that, right? We're like, what, what do our people care about? We're like, we want to look good, you know? So we had different outfits and different expressions. It is something that I just believe is going to represent us so, so, so well in, in this digital ecosystem. And yeah, thank you so much for having us discuss it.
Yes, I love it. I love it. Well, I hope you have a wonderful rest of your day. You as well. Bye. Thank you for listening, joining and being a part of the money talk with TIFF podcast this week. You can check Tiff out every Thursday for a new Money
talk podcast. But if you just can't wait until next week, you can listen to previous podcast [email protected] or follow TIFf on all social media platforms at Moneytalk with T. Until next time, spend wise by spending less than you make a word to the money wise is always sufficient.