This week, the crew digs into two timely stories providing some new perspective on this crazy little thing called music. First, they dig into the rising influence of so-called “super fans”: folks who consume content from their favorite artists along 5 or more distinct channels. According to recent research they are not just a thing—they’re increasingly driving the industry. What does this rampant physical consumption tell us about the digital world? Does it follow the endless trend for infinitel...
Jul 22, 2023•1 hr 3 min•Ep. 79
"Ambient Music" has seen a renewed interest for reasons that we can only speculate. 2016 election? Increased atomization of individuals? The multi-headed hell-scape of pandemic + climate change + economic woes? Sure. Whatever the reason, the past decade as seen a revival of soundscapes and synths that is both helping us escape from the toils of our everyday and also, more darkly, making us more functional subjects in the service of Capital. Starting from the conceptual ideas of John Cage and Eno...
Jun 30, 2023•1 hr 7 min•Ep. 78
Early this year, K-pop was the site of some truly Succession level drama, as Hybe (the company that launched BTS) attempted to steal SM Entertainment (a longtime mainstay of the industry) out from under Kakao (a Facebook + Spotify level media conglomerate). The story had it all: legendary businessman refusing to go quietly, alleged stock market manipulation, patricidal nephews, alleged corruption, Wall Street know-it-alls in WAY over their head, and at least one climactic stock-offering battle. ...
Jun 16, 2023•1 hr 11 min•Ep. 77
It used to be so simple. There were the major labels (all 6 of them, or whatever) and there were the independents or "the indies." Over the 80’s and 90s, a position initially adopted out of economic necessity grew into a distinctive cultural mode, with a host of aesthetic and political dimensions. Now things have changed and being "indie" no longer means the same. To understand this shift, we take a look at the Merlin Network, powerful grouping of independent labels that banded together to grab ...
Jun 01, 2023•1 hr 2 min•Ep. 76
Everyone is talking about AI—and that includes the music biz. No one is disputing the wide-ranging potential of these new tools, but is our rapidly-approaching deep-fake future really (or at least, FULLY) being driven by technology? Sam and Saxon offer a dissenting voice to the cloud of excitement hovering around our up-and-coming machine overlords—arguing that the entertainment landscape we end up with isn't actually going to be determined by technology in and of itself. And if recent major dis...
May 12, 2023•49 min•Ep. 75
Five years ago, Robin Thicke and Pharrell Williams finally lost the (musical) lawsuit of the century. Their song, “Blurred Lines,” had been an inescapable summertime hit, a wedding-DJ-standby, and the center of a very Obama-Era debate over whether it was creepy to have a song called “Blurred Lines” in the first place (it was.) Now, it was also found to have violated IP owned by Marvin Gaye’s estate, specifically the classic song “Got To Give It Up”—a brilliant track that VIBED a lot like “Blurre...
Apr 24, 2023•1 hr 8 min•Ep. 74
In the digital economy, recommendation algorithms get…a LOT of attention. To some, they’re the special sauce behind everything from Spotify’s personalized playlists to Tik Tok’s “For You” page. For others, they represent a dark, vibe-generating demiurge slowly sapping music’s social power. But for all the discussion of how these programs are transforming our world(s), there’s surprisingly little analysis of what—exactly—they are, or how they’re meant to work. Answering these seemingly simple que...
Apr 10, 2023•1 hr 5 min•Ep. 73
No one knows anything about the streaming economy. Not Really. That’s the stark message at the heart of Public Knowledge’s new whitepaper “Streaming in the Dark,” which catalogs the remarkable “wall of NDAs” operating at every level of the modern music industry. The relationship between labels and streaming services? NDA. The relationship between distributors and streaming services? NDA. and on and on and on. As a result, the most important questions about how the business works—for example... a...
Mar 24, 2023•59 min•Ep. 72
For this episode, Saxon and Sam check in on Spotify, which is…not in great shape. Even in the best of times, the company was handcuffed to the majors, and threatened by mega-sized competitors like Apple & Amazon. And these, my friend, are no longer the best of times. But it’s okay! They’ll get...faster! And more efficient! And, um, remake their homepage? That’ll do it. Definitely. Meanwhile, the majors are starting to make noise about the need to change the streaming ecosystem. It used to be...
Mar 08, 2023•1 hr 12 min•Ep. 71
In the '90s, a remarkable sound was being developed in Houston—its cavernous drums, booming, crawling vocals, and distinctive, hiccuping rhythms reflect the indelible influence of DJ Screw. During the latter half of the decade, the hardworking musician produced hundreds if not thousands of tapes, mixing regional classics with on-the-fly freestyles to develop a new template for southern rap. While Screw's life was cut tragically short, his musical style has lived on, influencing everything from D...
Feb 18, 2023•1 hr 18 min•Ep. 70
The success of YouTube has been inextricably linked to the music business. Initially a remarkably effective streaming pirate, recent years have seen the site pivot to industry ally, paying out millions in royalties for the copyrighted material played on its platform. But who gets the money? And how? And…who is making sure it goes to the right people? These are the questions opened up by Billboard journalist Kristin Robinson in her fascinating discussion of a remarkable YouTube scam that saw a ha...
Feb 01, 2023•1 hr 1 min•Ep. 69
It was revealed just this past week that basically all of Reggaeton is being sued. No, really. As you may or may not know, the massively popular genre from Latin-American and the Caribbean is actually based mostly on a few Jamaican riddims (the instrumental background or “rhythm” in contemporary Jamaican music). Now the production duo of Steely & Clevie, who wrote the riddim behind the massively popular early '90s hit "Dem Bow" by Shabba Ranks, want their bag for the riddim's use in Reggaeto...
Jan 16, 2023•1 hr•Ep. 68
The music industry is becoming increasingly disenchanted with Tik-Tok, finding it difficult to bend the wildly popular app for its own profitability...let alone find the next mega-star. Does that mean we might see the big three start to put the squeeze on Tik-Tok for dipping into its massive catalog without much of a payout? It worked well with Spotify for Lucian Grainge and co. But can the same sort of profit be siphoned? Also, Sam and Saxon dive into the the coming A.I. apocalypse. Well, okay,...
Jan 02, 2023•1 hr 11 min•Ep. 67
Taylor Swift made headlines recently by grabbing all top 10 spots on the Billboard Hot 100 chart — a first in its 64 year history — with the release of her latest record Midnights. Cool. Good for Taylor and her Swifties. But….what does that actually mean? You might think it's a simple answer, but actually the Billboard charts are a complex beast with a long and winding history that didn’t even start in music. On this episode, we ask how the charts help us narrativize music in a consumerist socie...
Dec 19, 2022•1 hr 5 min•Ep. 66
The modern music industry is defined, in large part, by major labels and centralized digital services. To try and imagine a world without (or at least around them), we’ve been looking backwards to the 1980s, when a thriving underground economy enabled a remarkable flood of American rock. If one label could be said to define that moment, it would be LA’s SST Records. Founded in Hermosa Beach by Black Flag guitarist Greg Ginn, SST would spend the decade releasing an unbeatable string of albums fro...
Dec 01, 2022•53 min•Ep. 65
Our good friend David Turner celebrated five years of Penny Fractions earlier this month with a live show at Nowadays. On stage, David was joined by our very own Sam Backer along side heavy-hitters Liz Pelly and Cherie Hu . Enjoy this live recording from the show as the crew run through everything you'd expect from a M4N discussion on the current state of the music industry: criticisms, hot takes, laughs, shade, shout-outs...oh and lollipops. Subscribe to our newsletter! Follow us on Twitter!...
Nov 16, 2022•1 hr 2 min•Ep. 64
It’s a tale as old as Nirvana. A band (ideally punk or punk influenced) forms and gets some buzz. Major labels swarm. The kids sign on the dotted line…and are promptly thrown to the wolves. Fade to black. And while that often-repeated story isn’t exactly false, it doesn’t do much to capture the shifting dynamics that shaped the economies of rock over the 90’s and 2000’s—an era when the relationship between independent artists and the major label mainstream was central to American musical culture...
Nov 01, 2022•1 hr 11 min•Ep. 63
In the past few months, the insane flood of money that has been flowing into the purchase of music rights (and really, into financial and tech related firms of pretty much all stripes) has begun to slow down. Crazy what rising interest rates will do, huh? These changes have prompted a wave of takes about the potential collapse of a host of music rights firms that overpromised, overpaid, and now seem poised to underdeliver—Hipgnosis, the industry leader, first among them. But…is all lost for thes...
Oct 18, 2022•58 min•Ep. 62
You might know Damon Krukowski from his role in the groundbreaking indy band Galaxie 500. Or maybe you’ve listened to his podcast, “Ways of Hearing” or read his excellent newsletter, or his widespread journalism. More recently, however, he’s put on another hat, as an influential rabble rouser for Union of Musicians and Allied Workers . A new group that emerged from the disruptions of Covid, UMAW has worked to change the conversation about everything from streaming and touring to major label cont...
Sep 23, 2022•52 min•Ep. 61
A foolproof way to hit number 1 is what the Time Lords—AKA the JAMS, AKA the KLF—promised the readers of “The Manual,” their 1988 book. After all, they had just done it, with the insipid brilliance of their Gary Glitter Meets Dr. Who mashup “Doctorin’ the Tardis.” And if they could do hack it, so could you, right? But if you did…would it even matter? Today, we’re talking through the careers of Jimmy Cauty and Bill Drummond, following them on their remarkable journey into the dark heart of pop mu...
Sep 08, 2022•1 hr 17 min•Ep. 60
At this point, you’ve probably seen headlines about the insane (like $5K+ insane) prices for some tickets to see The Boss on his latest tour. It’s the type of music-biz story that breaks out into the wider world—legendary poet of blue-collar post-industrial collapse, selling out to the I-95 yuppies with the help of the hated Ticketmaster. To try to better understand why Bruce (and his fans) did what they did and felt what they felt, we put the story into the broader context of a live industry bu...
Aug 12, 2022•1 hr•Ep. 59
Over the last few years, K-Pop has taken the world by storm. Groups like BTS and BLACKPINK have reached pinnacles of music-biz success both traditional (selling out stadiums worldwide) and distinctly modern (see: serving as the center for a vast and dedicated online community of fans across the globe). But while such groups have received mountains of breathless hype from the western media, this coverage has consistently failed to explain what K-Pop really is—or how it works. To help us learn mor...
Jul 18, 2022•1 hr 22 min•Ep. 58
If you’ve been anywhere near…really, any music playing device lately, you’ve probably noticed that Kate Bush (Misty-Moored British Chanteuse and Big Boi’s favorite artist) has a full-blown new-old hit in a way that we really haven’t seen before? Her song “Running up that Hill (A Deal With God)” was featured heavily in the latest season of the hit Netflix show Stranger Things and it’s sort of taken on a life of its own. As Ms. Bush busts through chart-record after chart-record, we take a step bac...
Jul 06, 2022•32 min•Ep. 57
The music industry isn’t a monolith and few scenes have a more distinctive structure than electronic music. As it developed from house and techno to today’s endless array of genres, the music traded the artist-heavy focus of rap or rock for constellations of high-profile DJs, faceless producers, and—most importantly for today’s episode—a host of iconic independent labels. In a hyper-consolidated, major label world, these indies have not only survived but (sometimes) thrived, defining the aesthet...
Jun 20, 2022•1 hr 22 min•Ep. 56
If you haven’t noticed, things have gotten...hairy in the economy. Inflation is up, the stock market is down, and the fed’s money machine? It stopped going “brrr.” All of this suggests that we might be leaving the VERY long, frothy period where companies (looking at you Uber!) didn’t need to muddy their hands with things like “earning profits” in order to reshape our lives, cities, communities, and consciousness. But if that’s REALLY happening…what does it mean for the music industry? Saxon and ...
Jun 07, 2022•54 min•Ep. 55
We all know that the musical landscape has changed in recent years. Tik Tok, Youtube, playlist culture, social media, and on and on and on—they’ve all remade how we listen, and what we listen to. But when folks (including us?) discuss those changes, they all too frequently focus on the big picture at the expense of the details. Streaming is over a decade old now. How…has it changed? That’s why we were so excited to talk to Andrew Unterberger, a journalist at Billboard who recently wrote a fascin...
May 24, 2022•50 min•Ep. 54
Mike Park has been running Asian Man Records out of his mom’s garage for over two decades with a refreshing approach that might seem unusual by today’s standards: there’s no advances and every release is a handshake agreement. “I do this for the love of music,” writes Park on the label’s About page. “Not for capitalist gain or status recognition. I try my best to do the right things ethically and to believe in helping others instead of striving for profit over people.” Somehow its worked, with A...
May 05, 2022•52 min•Ep. 53
It’s a debate that’s all the rage. New data suggests that catalog recordings (anything released over 18 months ago) had begun to outstrip new music in the streaming economy. Is this the end of pop as we know it? Is it because the kids just don’t like culture? Is it because….the INTERNET? Well, maybe. But first we need to look at how we get those stats and dig into some quick boomer-listening habit history. From the vagaries of Tik Tok virality to millennials leaving the pop zone, a lot is going ...
Apr 21, 2022•1 hr•Ep. 52
Part 2 of our conversation with Mat Dryhurst on Crypto’s evolving place in the music industry, both major and independent. Dryhurst has long been one of the most active and articulate proponents of these technologies (and the social formations developing around them) and has a deep well of experience and knowledge in this fast-moving space. While we don’t agree on everything, it was very much the kind of conversation that’s needed to push forward our understanding of the billionaire-backed, cont...
Apr 04, 2022•40 min•Ep. 51
Over the past year, we’ve devoted more than a few episodes to discussions about Crypto, NFTs, and Web3—projects that we’ve been, it feels safe to say…fairly skeptical about. Given that skepticism, we were delighted to have the chance speak to Mat Dryhurst , who hosts the Interdependence podcast with Holly Herndon, for a discussion about Crypto’s evolving place in the music industry, both major and independent. Dryhurst has long been one of the most active and articulate proponents of these techn...
Mar 28, 2022•1 hr 7 min•Ep. 50
