What does don't half-asset mean to you? If you're going to do it, do it. Say what you can do. Do what you say. If you can't do it, don't say you can do it. Don't over leverage yourself. Don't over leverage your decision and then jump in and kind of dip a toe. I think I'll try it out. Now think if you're going to try it out beforehand but when it's time to go, dive. Finish it. Find out. Come at the other side.
Leave it and go, if I just put it, that keeps me up at night. I think it keeps a lot of us up at night. When you half-ass something, you just don't know whether you failed or succeeded. God, what you wanted didn't get what you wanted. Finding out and looking and getting the mirror and going, I didn't half-asset. I went all the way. I found out. And that ain't for me. Or I found out and you dam right that is for me. That's a great place to get to. But the limbo of not knowing, if you half-ass something, the limbo of going. I hedged my back.
What could have happened? You don't know. Were you surprised when your dad said that to you? Yeah. When you were going to take a pivot in life trajectory. I wouldn't have been in the top 100 things I thought he would have said. I was fully stabilizing in that moment. As I said, I called Tuesday night, seven o'clock. He'll have had a beer. He's already had dinner, not Monday because that's the first full day of the work week. He'll be a little more stressed. Catch him at Tuesday.
When I unload this that I don't want to go to law school, I want to go to film school. And I really thought he was going to go, you want to do what? Again, the family I grew up in, the idea of me thinking that the idea of going into film. It's like very Saturday idea, hobby, idea, not a job. And when I shared it with him, the pause that he took, another beat of sweat started on my way.
Back of my neck before he goes, well, don't have to ask it. Now, we'll say this though, I do know now, and I didn't know it then. I've realized it in the last 10 years. The way that I asked him is part of the reason he gave me that answer. I really wasn't asking him. I called him as a dad. What do you got my command said?
I don't want to go to law school anymore. I want to go to film school. I didn't go. I don't, I don't, I'm not feeling not on my cheer about law school. I think I want, I mean, I think I may want to go to, if I just stuttered into that, I think he would have again heard me half-assing. I was going to get in gone.
In the process of being told to not half-asset, you didn't half-asset. The way I asked, the asked, and he heard my own conviction. And I think what he had in that moment was what I think every parent wants to hope to have with their kids, is that, you know, we raise our kids to go in a structured form, follow this, and you can get most of what you want and like. But what, and that can work.
But what do we really want our kids to do? We want them to follow that and then bust out of it one day and not even ask our permission. And that's when we're going, that's my boy, that's my girl, that's my child. We wanted to break out.
And I think what he heard then was I was breaking out. Without really asking his permission. And I was clear. I spoke up, didn't stutter. My voice was out of my throat a little bit. And I think that was part of why in that moment he gave in the answer. Don't have asked. Do you think that sentiment carried forward into how you got the role for Days in Confused that I'm going to continue to lean in on the front foot and tentos down?
Yes. Now how much that direct sentiment from that night when he told me don't have acid had to do with that. I mean, yeah, I did have something to do. Look, when he said don't have acid, he was, and I talk about this in a book, he wasn't only giving me permission. He was giving me a responsibility. He was going, I knew I knew I was at his word with me in my future decisions. I was making them for more than myself. I had, I wanted to fail less because I didn't want to embarrass him.
And that was extra motivation, extra strength, extra courage, extra sobriety, extra like, well, let's find out. Go for it, man. Go for it. I carried on into other stories of other job, time to kill Joe Schumacher going, I want to lead. That's me going, I want to find out. And dad told me not to have acid back there a few years ago. So if I don't go for it, if I embarrass myself, I'm embarrassing him. So that was also some incentive and some weight behind those moves that I made some of them.
Are you a brave person in that way? Do you think? I don't know, people say that I, I don't think I take enough risk. I'm told that people that who's opinion I admire, so think that that's my greatest asset that I take the risk I'll take. And the bravery I'll take with. And you still have a hunger for more? I think I'm still chicken shit. I mean, not overall, but I think there's many things that I'm not fully asking.
I think there's many things that I'm still could take further that there's still many things that more risk I could take and more bravery I could have. Yeah. Could you tell that story, the Dyson confused story of leaning in of taking that risk? So I mean, the initial when started when I went to on a Thursday night went to my favorite bar at the top of the high it because I knew the bartender he was a film school of me. He'd give me free vodka and tonics. So I went there.
I get there that night. He brings me my girlfriend, vodka and tonics. Tell me, hey, there's a guy at the end of the bar, produce some movie. Let me introduce you to him. A walk over, reintroduce him to four hours later. That man, Don Phillips, legendary casting director who was actually a producer on days to confuse.
We get kicked out of that bar. I've had as many vodka and tonics as he had since I sat down. So I'm not leaving easily either and I'm standing up for my new friend who we hadn't done anything to get kicked out of bar really had and we were just kind of stand on top of the tables, imitating some golf shots we played on similar courses in the past.
So we get not so not so politely escorted out and he's in a cab or when a cab he's ride with me to my apartment and drop me off for his back to his hotel. He pulls out a joint or I pulled out a joint. Start smoking because hey, you ever done anything? And I said, man, I was in a, you know, Trisha Yearwood video for seconds, kind of more of a modeling job. I was in a middle light commercial for about that long. I go, I don't know if you call it acting.
Wow, you might come to this address tomorrow morning 930. You might be right for this part. Just character called Wooderson. This will be days confused. I think you might be right for the part. This is three something in the morning. So 930 came really quickly and I was on time probably five minutes early and we were already pretty tuned at this time. No mind you, I get there, I walk in they go Matthew, I go, yes, they go.
Don't let the script for you. I open it up. It's signed by M. Hey, here's the part. Wooderson. I got three scenes in there, three lines. They're all marked. Check them out. I think you might be right for good luck. Let me know what you call you in for an audition. I go away. I go look at this. These three lines. One of them was what I like to call these a launch pad line. Which is a line that sometimes they'll have an script where.
If that character means that line and that character is not playing that line as an attitude or a wink or a joke. If that character means that line, it can, you could write a book on it. You could write a book based on that reality and that line and days confused from the character, Wooderson was a line when he's leaning against the wall outside the pool hall.
High school girls walk by. He checks one of them's back size. They go by and his buddy says, Wooderson, you got to cut that out, man. You're going to end up in jail. Wooderson says, no, man. That's what I love about those high school girls, man. I get older. They say the same age.
That line. I went, who is that? There's a book on somebody. If that's not trying to be cute. If that guy's not trying to say something, Colleen Clever, if he believes I've got life figured out, man, this is my nor star. So that line informed who the character was. I go. I read for it. I remember the first time I got called back because they said the sound was bad.
And now let come back. I don't know if the sound was bad or the fact that I just need to come back. I just used to come back and read for Richard Link, the director who I did read for and I got the part. Now the role was also based on as I wrote about in the book, who I thought my brother was when I was 11, a 17 year old brother was already my hero. He was cooler than James Dean.
And we had one day where his car was broke down and my mom when I was supposed to pick him up from school and he wasn't where he was supposed to be. We're looking for him. I'm looking at the back of our station wagon. And there I see this silhouette of this guy leaning against a brick wall left boot heel against the brick wall leading back lazy.
He's sigging the right hand smoke and it was my brother and in that silhouette, he was 13 feet tall, coolest dude in the world and just as I went to go, wait, there's path. I remembered always going to get big trouble for smoke and so let's say it's him. I'm going to say I go nothing. But that image in my 11 year old eyes were that was Wooderson. So we get to the set one night and I just go in for what's supposed to be a makeup wardrobe test, meaning put on makeup put on wardrobe.
When the director link letter can leave the set and get to minute he comes checks yet eyeballs gives you few notes and you say goodbye. I'll see you when I come back for work along this night. I come out of the trailer link letter shows up has a look as he's walking up his hands got his toes going. Yeah, yeah, what is soon like peach pants. Is that a new teach like that what's that over there that tattoo as a black Panther tattoo. Yeah, look at the hair to come over. I like it. I like it.
It's a cool about say goodbye. I think he goes say man he goes. You think you know, Wooderson's been with the typical hot chicks in school, the cheerleaders and stuff. I'm like, yeah, he goes you think Wooderson would be interested in the red headed intellectual. I'm like, yeah, man, Wooderson loves all types of chicks. He goes, well listen, the actress from a risk of a bc is over here in her car. She's got her nerd friends in the back. It's the last day of school. You think maybe.
I'm going to pull up and try and pick her up and I'm like, yeah. And he goes, okay, we're going to do it now. I said, give me 30 minutes. I took a walk. Now I'm about to be in my first scene. There's nothing written. I've not done this before, but I'm going over scenarios where are we last day of school. I got some change in my pocket. I'm working with the city. Sure.
Red and next one we're going to go out. I'd probably speak a little Spanish. Bapapapapapap. Next thing I know I'm in the car getting a lot of their mic put on me. I'm getting a little anxious, but I'm going, who is my man? Who is Wooderson? What do I love? What do I love? What I love? As this mic is getting put on me, I'm like, I love my car.
I said, bam, I'm in my 70s. She'll bail right now. There's one thing I got going for me. I said, I love rocking roll. Man, I said, shit, man. I got Ted News. It's trying to hold rocking in the eight track. There's two. I said, I love getting high. I said, well, man, Slater's riding shotgun. He's always got a dooby rolled up. There's three. And that's when I heard action.
And as I looked up and dropped it into drive, thought of the three things I had while I was going to get the fourth and I said to myself, and I love picking up chicks. In drive, pull out three affirmations of the three things I did have on the way to get the fourth. All right, all right, all right. Pull in, have the scene, try and pick her up, ditch the geeks in the back, going to be a, you know, fiesta in the making, whatever it was kind of spoke a little spangeless blah, blah, blah.
And all of a sudden it was over and a lot of people laughing. And Rick comes up and goes, oh, that's great. That's great. I'm great with try one more time to do this. That did the scene to maybe two times, three times. I don't remember. And finish it. I get out. People are laughing. I just had fun. I think we're cockin' in the seats in the Roy Cocker in the actor played Slater in the shotgun. He's giggling. I was like, he's like, that was good, man. That's good. I'm like, cool.
And all of a sudden, I'm about to leave and Rick invites me back the next night. Got put in some other scene. Anyway, he invited me back every night for three weeks. And I worked three weeks. Now what I found out two years ago was Rick also asked me that night on the sidewalk. Hey, you think you'd be interested in redhead an intellectual girl is because Rick had a, he had just noticed that night that they had a story hole.
They didn't know what car they were going to go. I think pick up the arrow Smith tickets in. And who else had a car pick for that car. And I was the only one who had a car and had a little guy who had a job. And he was trying to start to fill a story hole. He didn't tell me this till like a year ago. And that's why he invited me into that first scene at the top notch barbecue where I said those three words.
Which were the first words I sell on screen, which were the three affirmations of the three things my guy did have. And I think they came from not intentionally, but leading up to that role. I was listening to a lot of doors. And there's a live track of a morrison at some doors concert. I don't know where I think is in Europe somewhere where he barks out.
All right, all right, all right, all right. Very aggressively not water since style, but like four or five. All right, all right, all right, all right. And somehow that pot. I had no plans, but it popped them ahead in that moment. As being, and let me take that version, just give three of them for the three things I've got for myself, but in a more laid back cool way. All right, all right, all right, pulled up.
I feel to have that positive reinforcement so quickly out of nowhere, both privately and then publicly after. Well, I mean, it felt fun in the moment. It felt good. And then it became public right there with the crew and the cast. Now, publicly became a year and a half later. I mean, look, privately on that, I remember going that was so much fun. I think I think I think I was good at it. People are telling me I'm good at I'm getting invited back.
And then the other thing was I'm getting scale. I'm getting $330 a day. And I'm working a job at capitalist station, wait tables. And the most I've made there in one night is $73. And now I'm getting three 40 or whatever it was for doing this. I was honestly, I remember going, is this your legal? Is this real? I'm getting in there. I don't know what I'm getting away with. Yes, I'll come back for the pay and because I'm because it's so much fun.
And then you probably know the story five days in my dad moved on. Rick and I would just talk about this the other day because his father just moved on a few days ago. Which I might yesterday. I went home, came back to work. Still had going through morning with my dad, but had that had that sobriety that comes when you lose a loved one to death. You talk about sobering up and courage of the world, even more than my dad tell me don't have as it.
Him passing gave me some real courage, man. I mean, of looking at the world straight at straight in the eye and not being intimidated by mortal shit anymore. And so it really helped me stay and focus on the role had a great time. Probably a little quieter than I was in the first five days more to myself a little bit.
Rick and I because we're Rick and I kind of became more friends than just director actor at that time because he was the guy person I was talking to about how it was feeling and how to deal with my dad's dad. I finished that I go back to University of Texas, graduate film school on the way out, already packed up at the U Hall, get the Texas Chainsaw, mask her job for like five weeks, which is super fun.
Another under the table cash for play that part, unloaded the air U Hall and drove out to Hollywood. And a year after that, I would say when time to kill when all of a sudden I noticed, oh, wow, I'm famous. Life I've cast a new check that I didn't know about where I say the world become a mirror. There was no more anonymity. That's that was a whole new drug. I think one of the themes of your worldview that I've become familiar with is alchemizing bad times into good ones.
A reminder that things that seem bad can end up being good and in retrospect I think it's obvious and almost romantic to think about that alchemy in that way. But in the moment, it's basically impossible. How can people, well, how do you have more of that perspective during a hard time?
Well, a couple things. First off, I probably start off intellectualizing something that I know I probably should believe in but don't believe in it and convince myself even to an extent to trick myself that you know, you know, sitting and go, well, you just tell yourself there's two she'll pass. Okay, great. Well, what the hell's at me, even if it's true in the moment, you're like, what do you fucking talk about, man? I'm in the debit section. I'm in a warning section. I'm in this sucks.
I think that how much I'm conscious of it or not. My undeniable optimism and faith that this is not it is. And if it is, so what? That's okay. Well, then really so what? You know what I mean? What's the big deal to it minimizes? I don't, I seem to have a tendency not to make a bigger deal out of things that other people make a bigger deal.
I don't like to create false drama when it comes in a chart. I am effective. I get the blues. I get sad. I get mad. I'm a shit to be around. I can't get to sleep. I got demons in my own head trying to work trying to work the riddle out. Why did this happen? That's the other thing that's tough for me is I think that any bad thing that happens to me, my initial reaction is what you do wrong to lead to this?
Like in a relationship, Camille and I get an argument. My mind immediately goes, well, what'd you do in the last two weeks to let this get to a point where you just had to raise your voice or she had to raise your voice or voice you?
Usually there's some cues that were not handled to get to that point. So I like it when things are running like this. The challenge when things are running great is we all tend to think, aha, this is it. I've found it. Bottle it. If I, if I, if I realize this, I can maintain this forever in the truth. There's bullshit. No, we can't.
But we can minimize it. There are habits that I notice of things I take care of in my life. Help wise, faith wise, father wise, husband wise that I'm, no, that if I'm doing that consistently, there's less valleys. There's less stress. There's less warning signs. There's less problematic. Oh, shit. How do we get in this?
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I'm fascinated by people who take responsibility for things that aren't their responsibility, who often get told pieces of advice in the modern world. It might not be your fault, but it is your responsibility. And one of the ways to unburden yourself is to assume that everything is, but there is a cohort of people. It's an arrogant, no, it's an arrogant notion. Look at how I, if only I could have stepped in. Yeah, you make yourself.
But also the first side on the reason that I stepped in shit, which is also an asset, even as someone go, why are you giving yourself so much credit for screwing that up? Yeah, beautiful. Yeah. I mean, look, I think part of this for me comes from we didn't get in trouble with my family for the bad deed we got in trouble forget caught. So times where I can screw up and get away with it, I feel better than times that maybe I didn't screw up as bad, but got busted.
Because I got caught because I got busted because I got myself in the pickle because thing didn't go how I wanted it to go or how believed it could go. Is there something that you try to remember about the upside of a crisis during a crisis or do we just need to ride that out? So I think that's a good question. Yeah, right? Zooming out would be so beautiful and in retrospect, if only you could give yourself the gift of distance of time.
Yeah, yeah. And yet you know something hard is going to come again and you're going to be swept away by the wave. I mean, for me, it's an obvious dance to the both because you can't jump to the objective right away and go in Shala. Oh, Fadal, have it. This too, show pass. I'm fine. No, because then you don't deal with the crisis. I do have a good, I do have a pretty quick threshold for being able to laugh, like honestly start giggling when I'm in the shit.
Because I found that I'm able to handle the shit better. If I just start, if quick, I start going, are you kidding me? And I will, and I also my, I'll get objective and remind myself things like, you going to die, McConaughey, which gives me that. Oh, so this is not as big of a deal as I thought. I also quickly somehow comes in my head. Not right now, but one day this is going to make a great fucking story.
I quickly go to that. I'll get, I'll project forward into those places that ease me a little bit and at least maybe look at it with a good eye. You're almost imagining being that future you laughing back at this person. Yeah. And I think that goes back to the faith and belief that, you know, again, I'm nervous for I'm going to go speak or something. I got a little thing in my wallet. You're going to die one day, McConaughey. And I'm like, oh, that relaxes me.
If I'm going in, you know, complacent, I got another note or tell myself, what you're about to say and do will that live you? So you better fucking do it. Well, you know, to get me more on edge. This balance is so fascinating. You know, being able to thread that needle, being able to find the golden mean as our Aristotle talked about. But yeah, I've heard you say that you should make a sense of human your default emotion. Yeah.
Link later and I came up with that in a conversation about 12 years ago. Richard Link later. And we're just talking about how mad and angry and upset and offended people get if they don't know how to react. If they don't have an opinion on something. I mean, we're like, yeah, man, what if it wouldn't be, wouldn't the world be a better place? These are good along with everybody. If the default emotion, if you're not sure how to respond, what was it? Oh, God.
Now, most people think they go, well, that's insensitive. But that's, it's not insensitive. The usually think that means you're not given the crisis credit if you can laugh at it. And I wholeheartedly disagree. Oh, there's some sort of tribute in solemnity. Yeah, that you're not core enough about it, man, whatever that you know what I mean? It's like, oh, you're not taking seriously. You're actually putting me down. And just because you're saying you're not, you don't feel victimized.
And you laugh at this. It's like, you're telling me you're making a lot of it. You're making fun of me being a victim. No, no, no, no, no, no, no, no, I'm trying to deal. Because, especially when we talk about the book, if it's inevitable, too, that's that I laugh a lot quicker when I know I'm in an inevitable pickle. I have no other resource to get out of it that I know of. So I'm going to start giggling a little quicker so I keep my eyes open and figure my way.
Maybe because sometimes the hard work and the endurance and elbow grease the work harder we were talking about that hustle is not the way out. Sometimes it's I need to back up laugh, have a sip of my favorite whatever and dance my way through the raindrops out of this sunbitch. Maybe it's not banging your head on the wall. Maybe it's backing up and seeing, oh, I got a key in my pocket that unlocks the door. I'm trying to have been bloody in my skull along over banging and banging into it.
I do wonder why I like being serious and serious about the things I do. I'm serious about this podcast as you might be able to tell by the fact we've renovated and tie on. But there is something that you can take that too far. The seriousness can become a kind of rigidity as opposed to being dynamically persistent. You know, taking things too seriously, not swaying in the breeze. Right. Presuming that you like the things you do and you want to keep doing them.
The less robust and flexible you are, the more likely you are to break in those ways. And I think that humor is a lovely bit of ballast that helps to balance that out. I would frame it this way. Be very serious about since humor. Be very serious about comedy. I'm extremely serious about comedy. And I, you know, do I take myself seriously? Yes. But also take seriously the shit I don't do. I want to know everything. Yeah.
But I also take seriously the shit that I don't know and go, be serious about that you don't know that. Be serious about that this is frickin' funny or at least it's going to be. So I try to take the comedy seriously. I think we can take sense of humor seriously. And we don't have to create a new category of going, oh, I need to be lighthearted or more careless and carefree. We can just care more maybe about the validity of a good sense of humor.
Yeah. You know, instead of it being a relief, let me let go of the pressure here. Oh, I mean, it's not, it's almost like it's not a, it's not another bucket. It's in the same bucket of commitment and persistence and endurance and talking about that balance between good times and bad times, the lessons that we take from each, heard a quote recently that said, every man knows reflection and introspection when he's at his lowest.
Bad times, you can't do anything other than wallow in retrospective assessment. Yeah. But one of my favorite things I've learned from you is when things are going well, given that that's presumably what you want to have more of, maybe worth deconstructing that. Yes. I wish I could more and I think more of us could all deconstruct our assets. If there's a, there's a, we have happiness, you can't guarantee it, but there is a science to satisfaction.
There you can look at habits that engineered less pain in your life. Maybe more pleasure, but at least less pain. And that's, that's a win. I tried to deconstruct. Look, I don't, do I write it? Did I used to write as much? I didn't know that anybody who's ever kept a diary, what's the old sort of nostalgic idea of a diary? You go there when you're in pain and you share thoughts that you don't want to share with anyone else of those reflections. I did used for some reason.
I don't know why, but would force myself to write every day no matter how happy I was. And I didn't know a lot of times when I go right when I was happy because I was like, no, I don't need to write it. I don't need to become conscious of it. I'm having too much fun. It's getting on the way. Come on, I'm doing it. It's living, it's happening. But, and in writing green, that's when I went back.
That's a lot of the consistencies that I found that I wrote when things were going well, that I was taking some, for some reason, taking time to go, can I, can I try and bottle some science here to why things are going well? And I did find consistencies who I was hanging out with at night, what I was drinking, what bar I was at, what food I was drinking, how exercise, preparation for work for school. And I found things I was like, you were really happy in this segment of your life.
Let's go back and look at what you were doing. Oh, man, I had augmenting those scrolls. I was on them every day. I had some discipline where I was checking in with myself. Oh, you were going to church on Sundays. You were, you were giving, you were, you were saying thank you God before you went to bed each night. You were, you were appreciating more, you were pointing out, you beautiful things and not taking them for granted.
Until I found a list of things, I'm like, and when I get off track, I try to remind myself, you've been slacking on some of those. And I could pull it off. I've evolved. I got different ways. I get away with some now, but, you know, I've definitely found consistencies. And I think we all have them if we just notate them along the way that they're not by accident. Because we sure as hell deconstruct the reasons when we're in the funk. And we don't believe they're by accident.
We can take ourselves to behind the woodshed and show ourselves exactly why we're guilty for every reason and condemn ourselves for every damn reason we got to that spot. Yeah. Well, let's, if we're going to do that, I just say, let's, let's cheers, let's have a cheers on the way for other things that are work for when we have shit going on. Right. Also knowing that it's not forever, that it will, we will have a mountain of climb here shortly.
Isn't it interesting so much of content that people like to consume, books, podcasts, all the biographies, memoirs, is deconstructing the success of others. So we'll happily dissect success in other people. Right. And yet only dissect failure in ourselves. Yeah. This odd asymmetry. Yeah, well, we bestow all of the glory. Right. On those people, well done.
And I must find out how to do it more, even if it doesn't fit me, even if there are different constitution, different background, different time. For me, I'll focus on the negatives. Right. There's a really interesting stat around the likelihood of you ensuring that your dog completes a course of antibiotics is about 95%. The likelihood that you ensure that you will keep complete a course of antibiotics is about 50%. So we're prepared to look after an animal twice as well as ourselves.
I was a wrote and note the other day, man. What does that say on the back of your phone? Stika. Oh, choose to shine. Very cool. My daughter gave me that. Yeah. I wrote the other day. And then most of the what I do is I use this note sap, right? And I wrote the other day. Where is it? It was on that note. I was like, what's my best advice I need to give myself right now is listen to my own damn advice. Yeah. And it followed that up with where is it?
Yeah. Trying to live with less gravity and more backbone is a salty task. What's that mean to you? Kind of live lighter with less gravity. Live lighter, not take certain things so seriously, but still have the principle backbone because I'm getting older. We get older and the black and white turn to gray and then there's a great word compromise we all say, which is such a mature thing to do. And then all of a sudden we let things slide and never we start going, well, change will happen.
Hey, change is inevitable. Let change happen. And I'm not ready. That's part of getting old. I think not just getting older. Same with cynicism. It's a disease of getting too old. And I'm not ready to. I don't want to be ready to give up certain things I'm going, no, man. The beauty of ignorance. Those things that we believed in. I've got to believe so many things because of my ignorance. I would be dead 14 times in this life if I wouldn't have been ignorant of the situation I was at.
And so, yeah, I. You know, not not knowing or knowing what we know. It's a. Anyway, yeah, it's it's more backbone to hold on and be principled what I stand for what I stand against when it becomes easier and easier. To just go with the flow. And I'm not ready to go. Let's just go with the flow. I just want to I want to I don't want to pick the wrong battles. I'm trying trying to be discerning and not picking the wrong fights because I like picking fights and going after challenges.
But I'm in a fight. I'm kind of like, man, it's tough duty to win the fair fights. And there's a lot of unfair fights out there. And why do I want to spend my time? If I got 25 hours, they pick an unfair fight when I'm going to bust in my ass to win the fair one. Well, also picking fights with yourself. You know, you hinted just there at the difficulty of a negative inner voice. You know, you take things seriously. You care about what you're doing. You want to achieve things in this world.
Which means that you need to have high standards. You need to pause it an ideal. But as soon as you pause it an ideal, you then begin to compare yourself to that ideal. And often you find yourself lacking because it's a fucking ideal. I think it's why a lot of relationships don't work. We make her a Wonder Woman and she makes us Superman and neither one is going to live up to it. And that we've got that bulb, that honeymoon bulb turned up to 100 watts. And the honeymoon's over.
We're trying to deal with some real, just some real base stuff. I just leave it 20 watts. We're just lit. But we're not just feverishly, you know, superhuman. And I think a lot of us just purport that on someone else. And they can't live up to us. And it ends up not being fair to them. And then they do the same to us and we both walk away going, I underwhelmed. Do you know the idea of the Michelangelo effect? Have you heard of this?
Awesome. So the Michelangelo effect describes a situation in a relationship, friendship or intimate partnership where each partner sees the best in the other and tries to help bring that out. So the sum of the parts is greater than it is individually. And the reason I love it is why it's called the Michelangelo effect. So the block of marble that David was carved from had been attempted by a number of other sculptors previously. Huge monstrous thing.
If you've ever seen David in person, ginormous people can't, and when you're looking up as well with that angle on the plinth, it's even bigger. Previous sculptures had attempted and failed, but Michelangelo saw inside of the marble what was David. He just needed to get away all of the things that weren't. I love that idea. Yeah, yeah, yeah, yeah, yeah, yeah. I think in life you want to be finding people that believe in you more than you believe in you. That hold you to higher standards.
I think that's the definition of a good friend. I think that's the definition of a good partner. He's a good definition of a good husband, wife. You know, they remind us of the best of ourselves. They shine that light and remind us because we do. I know I do. It gets, I put the blinds on it and I don't see it. A lot of times I'll be reminded. This has always been a thing for me. And I don't know how this correlates, but I've never been as good in my dreams as I am in real life.
I never win the day, get the girl, ace the test. I can perform in my dreams. I never have, never have. As well as I will in real life. I think I'm the same. And I'll get, and I'll be, I guess what I'm saying is I'll be, I'll pull something off. I'm like, everyone see that? And my friends are like, no shit. That's you, bro. What's the biggie? You know what I mean? It's kind of what I like about living in Austin, Texas. They're not really impressed with shit that I pull off.
They were, thought it was cool. I want to ask them, but they were like, well, no shit. And I was kind of like, oh, all right. Yeah, thank you, man. That's, you know, and that's what, that's what friends will do in a way. Loved ones will do that and be like, yeah, there you are. It comes back to that. It's so much easier to be supportive and gentle of other people than of ourselves.
You know, you will happily bestow this sort of gentle reassuring pat on the shoulder when somebody succeeds or falls short when they try their best. Right. Yet, given the fact that you tried your best, you give yourself a kick in the dick on the way out of the door and a harsh word to follow you. Yep. What do you think about when you do succeed? And a lot of people go, oh, that's nothing. I prescribed it.
I think we should take some time to be able to look in the mirror and own that thing that we pulled off and go, good job. That's what you want to, to what you got. At the same time, be able to, as we do more often, look in the mirror when we fail and go, bogey, you did not pull that off. You know what I mean? But I mean, it's kind of big of the ownership idea, the fail or the gain ownership, being really important. And I don't, I'm a fan of the ego. I wish people, someone said this to me before.
Look, oh, this, this, this, this, a queen said this. It came off the cow. I didn't even think about it. She was like, ah, tell me, not that you're so full of yourself. And I, with that thinking, I was like, well, who else am I supposed to be full of? That's a good line. And I stopped that. I was like, that's exactly what I meant. I went and wrote that down. I wish more people were more full of themselves. Not in the arrogant way. Don't talk about a healthy ego to understand.
And I understand the ego's difference between I and me. Me is the objective to know the I. I wish more people. I wish we were more full of ourselves. I wish more people in the world were more full of themselves.
I think part of the challenges in life is, a lot of us are running around half-ass in ourselves, half-fooling ourselves, not full of ourselves, not studying ourselves enough, not holding ourselves to task enough, not patting our own self on the back when we do get what we want enough, not cracking our own whip on our backside when we do. Get out of line even though we knew better. I wish we were more full of ourselves that way. The guy that was sat there yesterday, Dwayne.
I asked him, something not too dissimilar about self-esteem. He took a little while. He said, I like me. I'd buy me a beer. I thought that's so fucking great. Yeah, man. I'd buy me a beer. He's shaking hands with himself. You know? And... She's a man. I got plenty of times where I was sure I'm the last guy I want to have a beer with. I'm happy to say I've got some times where I'm like, I appreciate drinks alone. You know what I mean? I mean, yeah, it'd be nice.
Well, that'd be not more than nice. It's a better word than nice. But if... Go... Go... Try to be today someone you want to have a beer with. It's a pretty good easy way. Pretty good bumper sticker. You know what I mean? Could have been in the book. Yeah. Talk to me about the non-deserving complex. Yeah. It's feels similar. Yeah. So... It definitely... And I think it's called in their term impostor syndrome or something like that.
When I got famous off of time to kill, I had more people saying I'd love you. And I'd only said that four times in my life to four people. And I was like, wow. This is... They mean it. You know? The red carpets in caviar, I started to get that thing. Why me? Why me? There's other people that deserve this word me. And that's back when I had a... I was using the word deserve, which I'm not the biggest fan of now. I prefer earn. But I didn't feel like I deserved it in the big scheme of things.
It was a... I think it's a... We have to... What's dangerous about it? I think it's court. It's a... It's a coping mechanism, but it's a false humility. Yep. Yep. I understand. It's like... It's almost arrogant and think that you're... You did all that, even. You know, it's almost like guilt is an arrogant thing. Like, who makes you the judge and jury of you on that? Who... You know, it's like saying... Being very arrogant and you go, oh no, no, no. Not me. I shouldn't have that.
It does help you deal when it's stimulus of the world's brand new and coming on you. It helps you back up because you don't want to take any more arrows because you're feeling it all as arrows. I sure felt that when I first got famous. Talk about all the options and yeses, brand new, yeses for me in the world. I pushed against it and I even had clumsy times where I got ugly just to counter it. Like I said, I brought the book, I tripping myself running downhill.
I tripped myself because I felt like... Man, things are going too well. I need a bloody nose. Bam! I'll give myself one. Now I feel more. Okay, now I'm where I'm supposed to be. Does part of that come with the fact that I grew up in a middle class, blue collar family, and you value text of 12,000 people from the tattoos? Like you get out there and you earn, you break a sweat. Probably. I wouldn't... So much stuff was coming at me and I didn't feel like I'd broken a sweat to get it.
I was having fun what I did. I couldn't give myself enough credit for maybe he's going, you're good at what you're doing. And I was looking for the proverbial sweat. I was looking for the... Where's the exhaustion of a full working day where I actually... I drew blood, man, I did it. I made it through. Dude, the Puritan work ethic runs strong. I used to struggle at... I ran nightclubs for a long time and...
There was a period where I didn't miss a single Saturday, which was our big event, for 204 Saturdays in a row. And I would go on holiday. The holidays I was having. You know, I'm 2022 to 26, something like that. So prime, young guy, territory. And I'd go on holiday from a Sunday morning until a Thursday evening, and then make sure that I was back in the northeast of the UK. Why did you make sure you got back on the Saturday night?
Because I couldn't bear to have success without having blood for it. Okay. Because if it... There was so many hoops I had to jump through in order for things... For me to get a patent on the back. I had to go well. Because if it went badly, I was less. But not only did it have to go well, I had to suffer in service of it going well. Because if it went well but came easily, that was also somehow lesser. Like, for me, I felt like I was just in almost. Yes. Not a disease, but more of a sin.
I was like, I didn't pay a penny, Sarah, man. I didn't... I hadn't given enough time. I didn't... Break the verbal switch, draw the blood to earn that thing. You know, I'm getting all this. I didn't... I wasn't able to look at the eye. I didn't feel it. I needed things to feel. I also needed at that time anonymity, which I lost. Yeah. And I think everyone needs an anonymous soul. And I had lost mine. And I didn't know what was up, down, left or right. I had... I got through stuff.
If I looked back at my interviews the first two years, I got famous. I bet you they're so damn boring. Because I was... my two rules were be a gentleman and don't lie. Two pretty boring rules. If that's only what you're going in for and you're creative and you got a colorful life. But I was just... Repeat it, stay down the line. It wasn't until later on that was like, oh man. I trust myself enough. I believe myself enough to share how I feel about things.
Yeah. Privacy is one of the privileges that people have born with that they don't realize until they've lost it. Right. And this has been a little bit of a trajectory that I'm starting to dip my toe into over the last few years as well. Of... Lots of privacy, lots of privacy. Lots of increased scrutiny, right? Sense of eyeballs. And even, you know, a micro niche degenerate version of proper fame. But still... This sort of sense of vigilance being watched in some way or another.
And yeah, it's one of those odd inverted privileges. Most people think about privileges, something that is bestowed upon you after you have done X, Y, and Z. But this is one of those things that, as you tend to go on the trajectory, most people want to go on. Yeah. It's something that gets derogated, something that you lose. Sure. And you... People have... You skip the salutations of, hi, how you doing? What's your name? People have a bio on you.
They have an idea, an opinion for you before you ask for it. Sometimes it's hyperbole to the awesome... To overly all exaggerated awesome. Sometimes it's well below. And you walk outside, you don't even have to talk to the world. You know. You feel eyes. You see how people move towards you or move away from you. Or you catch it all and you're periphery and you start going. They... I know what... I know what they think. And maybe that's false.
It feels a lot better when it's maybe false, but to the... Oh, they even think I'm better than them. They think I did better than I did. But still just consulting either way. Either way. It's all fountains because it's not on parts. Why I headed out to Peru after I got famous took the 22-day backpack trip. And I remember writing down, I said, I need... I need to go test my... Who I am, my character, on people who know me as a stranger. And when I left the hugs in...
After 20 days, the hugs and the tears of the strain... No longer strangers up between two days. But the hugs and the tears were coming from people that only knew me as a guy named Matthew. And that's it who showed up and met me from there. No biography of him. He had no idea of his famous, no idea what was in the movies. And 22 days later, two and only two days later, their weeping tears of glitglattinist... And saddened saying goodbye to me. That gave me... Trust, Magnum, I was like, I got it.
I did this. I'm still there. I got it. I can still fix a tire. This whole thing isn't just triple A coming to fix the car. You know, okay. It was... That was... I needed that. It gave me a lot of confidence, come back to Hollywood and look a lot of the... What I was deemed in excess, look at me, I go... I get it. I know I earned getting here. I'm still... I got the goods. All of this, I may not have earned that. I didn't even ask for a lot of this, but I know I got myself here.
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Right now, you can sign up for a $1 per month trial period by going to the link in the description below, or heading to Shopify.com slash modern wisdom, or lowercase, that's Shopify.com slash modern wisdom to upgrade your selling today. Did you ever have a lonely chapter during your trajectory? Looking back, I would say I did. I mean, look, I had some wonderfully fun and healthy and honest single years that were, became sort of revolutions, that became sort of structurally tangent.
And it was fun. Stayed on the surface purposefully, I kept it there, they kept it there. But I was still, you know, I have many lonely nights when a man lays his head on the pillow, no matter who was in the bed, I was sleeping with me. And felt like many times I was in neutral, didn't have something that I was building towards and chasing relationship wise, even career wise, at that time.
I got through it fine, I didn't go overboard and overindulge and didn't get dangers with my health or anyone else's. Mainly because if I did get to, if I get the blues, I'd be like, open your eyes, bro, look around, man. You kidding me? Take your time. And so, you know, I would say ultimately I was lonely in that time because I knew it was a stop, not a stay. And I knew I wanted more career relationships, etc. But I wasn't really fully committed.
I wouldn't, it wasn't, didn't have to maybe, the, the wherewithal, the identity to go actually chasing, go, I know what I want, I want to, I want to live away to attract that. I did try and go, did I have time, I tried to go find it. But as I talked about in the book, I mean, I had time where I was every red light who's over there, produce section, who's over there? Every party, who's over there, you know, looking forward to the one.
And once I was like, uh-uh, I had that great dream of the 88 year old bachelor that I was with all the kids showing up. That dream gave me grace, man, because I quit looking for that one. I did start acting like someone though, my target drew the arrow. I was, I started acting like someone who had a wherewithal and a peace of mind with myself, not needing someone to fulfill that drew her to me that I didn't have before that dream.
You've had a front row seat to some, a variety of rhythms of marriages. Your parents, yours, what have you learned about choosing a good partner? Oh. Well, I'm, and I'm still learning, but... Friends first. I mean, Camille and I become friends first. No, we wouldn't became lovers pretty quickly, but I was, the things I respected about her and saw that she had were things that I valued in a close friend.
Someone who respected their past, someone who had a great sense of humor, but was never gonna lie to put themselves to get what they wanted in front of me or take advantage of me, someone who, you know, was impressed with who I was much more than they were impressed with what I did. Someone who very quickly saw the best in me and was like, I like that. Let's see some more of that, you know, and watered that side of me. So we talked about earlier. Let's see some more of that.
Let me set, let me put some more fuel on that fire, so you can even be more of that. Why not be all of that, you know? Then if you're gonna get together, I think this is a Susan Sarand line when she was married to, this is named Tim. Who was Susan Sarand married to years ago? An entire room of people shaking their heads. Great actor, Shalshink Redemption. Tim Robbins, they had a line. That said, we have similar moral bottom line. It's always stuck with me.
Are you gonna partner with someone, especially if we're gonna have family, I think? Make sure you got a similar moral bottom line. Because in look, Camille and I are going through new challenges now because we have teenagers. Our moral bottom line and do's and don'ts and what's accepted and what we wouldn't accept has been pretty part and parcel up until now. Teens are getting like, well, I'm a little loose over here. Yeah, let them go. Let them go. Get that scar.
Let them go get their heart broke. Whatever that is, let them go try it out and fail or succeed. Let them go negotiate, free play. She's a little more, and so we're, her and I are working on that balance right now. And it's a new balance, having teenagers as they're getting their independence. But having a similar moral bottom line, you know, connected to bringing out the best and the partners is having some of you're a fan of and that they're a fan of you.
You call each other on your shit or you don't have to call it because it looks as enough. And I know. Yeah, that was me, Bogey. You know, or yeah, I got away with that one again. No more cut that out. And then what I'm learning now trying to learn is that seems we're essentially all the person that, for me now, I think I'm essentially the same person I was I was 19 years ago.
You know, it seems, it's certainly the same person I was when I was eight, 51, but our values systems reorder as we grow independently and as a couple, your value system changes for every parent when they become a parent for what's important in their life. So you read, you're moving things different places on the chart and the number one spot, the two spot and three spot.
But to understand that it also happens with us as individuals and going that we do change and how do we, even by being essentially the same person that we fell in love with, we still need room to change along the way and go through things that may seem inconsistent with who the DNA of why we fell in love with that person or what do we love, well, who someone was, but no, there's still essentially that, but give them room to change, give them room to change.
Also the, I think it's the springstein line, you know, you don't, but sometimes you're running and the other one's walking. And it's okay to be ahead, but don't, don't lose sight. Don't get so far ahead that you leave your mate lost back there going, you know, sometimes, you know, somebody's real healthy, the other one's on IR. Oh, still in the same team.
That takes patience by the one who's healthy and takes persistence by the one who's on IR, but you got to, you got to wait up to hold that hand to go, we're still doing this together, even though maybe in this zone right now in my life, I'm flying and you're walking. There's certain things that I find out, well, she's flying and I'm walking, you know?
And so navigating that and how we change as we grow up and measuring that against who we initially fell for in the first place and seeing, well, they are still that. Of course, it changed. Hell, I've changed. I want to say, you know, and a lot of times I know we say it, I know I said, we've changed. I was like, what? Heaven, yeah, I've changed. I'd hope so. You know? And doing that with a partner is part of the work, I think of a relationship.
Sort of talking about transformations, trajectories, pivots, changes, let's escape Hollywood and go to South America and see what's going on over there. Let's escape singlehood, pivot into a married, pivot into family from the dyerads to triad to so on. Yeah. I'm fascinated by the aggressive pivot that you made between different movie categories.
Yeah. And that requires, I think, a lot of courage and hope and self-belief and faith in order to do to let go of something good for the chance that something that you think could be great. Yeah. I think that's something that a lot of people wish that they had a little bit more fuelful. It was a big risk, it was a big chance, and it was no guarantee return ticket. It was a one-way ticket possibly to, I'm a head coach at high school football to this day.
One-way ticket to a dead end, or to something new, but one way ticket to a dead end in Hollywood, it's an act of for sure. Look, it's no coincidence that at that time to have the courage to make that decision that I would have to do. I did have really cool things going on in my life. I'd fall in love with Camilla, she'd just become pregnant with her first child. That gave me some significance of like, ah, that's what I've always wanted to be. It's a father. Here we go.
If I stick with it, this will give me a home base to feel secure in, even though I'm stepping away from what has made me give me significance for so many years and decades in my life. Having her to sit there as much as I knew it was the right decision and it was a 3 a.m. decision in my own soul. She's always been very good with me back going, and I say it out loud, and we're going to do what we're going to do.
If we're doing this, she's the one that said, this could be drive for who knows how long. You may not get work ever again, but if we're going to do this, I'll be here by your side and we're doing it together, and there's no going back. There's no, we're not going to get, we're not going to get nerves at the go-align, if we don't know where the go-align, we're not going to get down the line and go, oh, a pool parachute. Even if it's a full $10 million parachute.
Even if it's $14 million parachute. Even if it doesn't work out, and you become a teacher, or you go become a lawyer again, whatever, this way. So making that a choice that was inevitable, that there was no pull in the parachute on, sheers hell helped with the endurance of me being away for what was 20 months. I learned a lot of endurance in that year in Australia, though. Same way, that gave me a lot very thick skin for enduring something.
So that 20 months was really hard, and I've said it before that proverbial bottle on the shelf was looking better and better earlier in the day, as time went on. I mean, how many more times could I work in the damn garden, man? I'm like, I'm not a gardener for life. I like this, but I gotta come on, man. But she helped me stay steady. I stayed steady. My faith helped me stay steady.
I did have a real belief, whether I was tricking myself or not, that there's a bigger pot of gold for me on the other side of this. If I just out and jur it, I'll out and jur this image. And it became a little like the year in Australia. I started, I started to gain pride and honor with the longer the penance went on and being without what I wanted. And I started to be like, well, I'm definitely back and out now, man. I'm six months in. It turns into momentum all over the year.
I'm like, I'm a year in, man. This is getting good. Okay. Come on. And out of the blue, 20 months later, I've been gone long enough to become a new good idea. Where's my con? Plus, he said no to that $14.5 million off for three months ago. And I guarantee that tells some people in Hollywood, what's this sum of stuff to? You don't say no to $14.5 million off. It was way that it offers too big to get out. And he said no. No. Someone does that. You get a little more attracted to him.
What this dude's on is something. He's got his own programming. He's playing off events on something. He's not just regressing. And I think that also sent a bit of a signal. It was my hunch through Hollywood. And then the fact that it was just honestly 20 months, almost two years later, where's my con? We haven't seen him in a romcom. We haven't seen him on the beach. Sure, it was. Where is he? He hadn't shown up in front of our faces. I don't even know what he's doing.
He wouldn't know he's doing it. Do you fear or did you fear not being sufficiently prolific, not being sufficiently sort of front of stage, keeping your name out there? What if somebody else takes that place of me? What if I become irrelevant? What if people forget? I didn't have any fear of anyone taking the place. Because my place at that time was romcom king. And I was sure I was like, I'm good. I've done enough of those right now. I don't need another one of those right now.
I don't want another one of those right now. If someone steps in and take the place, rob a. I always like to say I took the baton from Hugh Grant. And then I had my time. I was like, who do you think you threw it to? I don't know. The romcoms are not, they're definitely not as healthy as a genre now as they were then. We were rolling in the romcoms. They were like, can't miss her, man. They're medium budget, 30, 35 mil. So the studio's not blowing their wallet on the budget. They come out.
They make good money. The studios make good money. I don't know. All of them kind of worked. Even the ones that didn't work as well kind of worked. You know? You use potential audience. Everybody can go see it. Repeat some Valentine's Day. Come on. You know? So I don't know that did really hand it to anyone who's really jumped in that lane or if that lane's even. Got to help one it sign anything. Got to help one it sign anymore. You know? Did I feel that your relevance?
Sure. I felt the unease of your relevance. I mean, but then I got, I became irrelevant. I mean, it got to the point where I knew I was irrelevant. It got to the point where I remember my agent saying, I said, you heard anything because Matthew, I heard your name in over two months. I was like, and you're my agent. You only have five clients. He goes, yeah. I didn't even heard your name. I'm like, that sounds pretty much like your relevance to me, bro. Okay. All right.
But never... I was shaky, but never was I going to go, okay. I'll go back. Ripcoach. I'll do it. Never was I going to pull the parachute. And, you know, what if I didn't? What if that was a call's never came? Would I regret that sitting here now? I don't know. Maybe I wouldn't be sitting here now. But I bet everything I got, there's no way I'd regret it. Whatever I'd be doing in my life right now, would have said this opened up. We just started off the conversation with this.
The things you don't get. I've given us, put us more in places where we are, where we find our own satisfaction. Then the things that we do get in many ways. I mean, like I say, it's, you know, life's mystery going forward. The science looking back. When you look back, we go, we can all connect every single dot. It's mathematical, scientific, how we got to this table right here. We got plans for this afternoon, but we're not sure what's going to happen.
So, everything looking back, it's all connected. If we go back and look at it. And there's a whole lot of, I thought that was the end. Well, it was the end, but it was the beginning of this thing. Or I caught that red light and therefore made me 60 seconds later to get to that cafe where I met that movie producer or that woman who became my wife or whatever that is. It'll make sense at the time, but we're looking back. It's all science. Trust really is everything when it comes to supplements.
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Plus a free five-night trial of their sleep packs by going to the link in the description below or heading to livemomentus.com slash modern wisdom using the code modern wisdom. A checkout. That's L-I-V-E-M-O-M-E-N-T-O-U-S. .com slash modern wisdom and modern wisdom. Let's check out. Is that quote about the ironic tragedy is that life has to be lived forward but only makes sense in reverse? Yeah. Ironic tragedy. Who said that?
I mean, what do you think about all the life, the ironic tragedy, life is pain. And it just is nothing but pain, but so if we can endure it. Like, my mom, I can't help. She's worn me down with her endurance of the her prescription on life. How old is she now? 92. And she is the absolute proof of the value of denial if you really commit to it. Absolutely. Committed denialist. Committed denialist. And it's not an intellectual trick. There's no, oh, I'll, I'll intellectually deny it.
So then I'll talk myself into, nah, I can't. I'm faking it until I make it. No, it's bam. Yeah, yeah, yeah. Fat and complete. No, it didn't happen. No, mom, it didn't. No, it didn't. I've said it. It didn't. And she's not. You don't catch her in between the lines or off by herself, realizing like, oh, well, it did. No, it's done. Non-negotiably done. Her favorite word is yes. Well, am I thinking you're living so long? Well, I can't imagine not being here.
Oh, that's, geez, oh, man, that's pretty good. No, I really can't. I honestly cannot imagine not being here. So she, she's beaten two types of cancers on aspirin. And we're like, that's not making any sense. And we have to tie her up in all or to the doctor, the dermatologist, if you get something on her leg. Because going to a doctor in her mind is recognition of possible sickness. So you go there, remove a cancer, take some cancer medicine. Do you have cancer? No, I don't.
And you wink and she does not wink. I don't. I don't. What? Anyway, if you're not following soup, you don't believe it. Next question. That's how she is. And she's banned because she's not playing a trick. She does it. It's a full on commitment to denial. And it's, and it's awesome. She would not prescribe to life is painful and you have to get through. She thinks it's, in the mind, she's very anti because she, she's someone who, like I said, I think I touched on the book.
She had a horrible motherhood mother and parent parental growth. She's not know how to be a mother. How did she become a great mother? By saying I'm doing the opposite of what that bitch did. There's value to that of going, well, this sucked. I don't know how to do this, but if I just do the opposite. Dude, I love this idea. So I grew up in a very working class town, northeast of the UK, famous only for having the highest teen pregnancy rating in England. And then it lost that.
So it didn't even have that anymore. And I think there's that idea of food deserts in America where it's areas in which it's difficult to get good food. And I think that Stockton on Tees in the 90s was a role model desert, at least for me. So I wasn't around many people like the person that I wanted to be like. And at the time, I think I was desperately looking like a thirsty man parched for water for somebody that would be that. But in retrospect, again, ironic.
There were a lot of people around me that were people I didn't want to be. And I was able to plant flag poles in the ground that helped me to avoid the catastrophes and the tragedies that would have awaited me had I have done that. So I don't want his relationship with his family. Yeah. I don't want the way that he drinks in order to be able to deal with his emotions. I don't want the way that he speaks negatively about all situations. I don't like the way that.
Yeah. I think much of life is avoiding pitfalls, not necessarily expediting successes. The pitfalls can take you out of the game completely in one form or another. And yeah, I don't like dwelling on the negatives in that way. But also, that's another version of Alchemy that we were saying before, here's something that you think is useless or toxic or not. Yeah. Not valuable. But you can turn it into something that benefited you.
It's the same reason why teaching people lessons that you've gone through from tragedies, traumas, whatever in your life. It's kind of like pointing at the thing that was bad and saying you didn't get me. I'm going to make sure that you're not going to get them either. Yeah. And even looking at the things that are bad and going. Oh, thank you. Appreciate that. I mean, the push off, you have established leverage rather than the create. So, you know, you're going to lean into something.
You also need something to push up. The push off is what you're leaning into is that mystery going forward, right? That ironic choice that you have something to push off. Well, I don't know what I do want, but I do know I don't want that. You have leverage. Yes. You know, it's there. So, I don't know. I mean, we can get into a big discussion on, on, on victimhood here as well. But I, you know, I wrote about in Greenlight to about how, you know, we always say, well, who are you?
You know what she's figured who you are. And we asked you, I tried to, I tried to ask my kids that now. Why won't you know who you are? And a part of that who's helping me is Bob Dylan's line is like, I don't know what all this talk about who we are, man. We are all just, what we create ourselves to be. And that gives me a little, oh, that's relaxing. But the, it's so much easier for you to figure out who you're not.
And if you start eliminating the, who I'm not, by sheer mathematics, you end up moving towards who, more of what feeds you and who you are. And it's a hell of a lot easier thing to go. How can I get rid of some bullshit in my life than it is to go? Well, how do I go to my true self? Do I want to press the accelerator more quickly? Or do I want to take my foot off the fucking break?
Right. Yeah. Yeah. And sit there and, and because I'm, I'm banging my head here and I'm going to eliminate some of that stuff. I want to get some of those things out of the way that didn't have another hangover. I drank the same amount. When I didn't, you don't usually have a hangover. Oh, maybe it was a conversation I was having. Maybe it was, you know, maybe it was the people I was hanging out with, those just clocking. Some of those things and eliminate them. Is it much easier place to start?
You know, and maybe, maybe more, is it maybe more valuable? I mean, I don't know who always like to think that the UFC champ or the boxing heavily champ that believes they are the greatest is more empowering than the one who's out for revenge. But man, the one out for revenge wins a lot of the times. And one who's pushing against, you know, I'm going to get back at you. Rage, nothing gets more shit done than that emotion. Rage. We like to say no freedom and light is the one that carries it.
Man, I don't know. That's maybe two of all for us to really grab a hold of rage and anger and revenge are mighty powerful emotions, man. Yeah. But get a lot of shit done. Yeah, especially in the beginning, especially for a short period of time. I think when you, it's a potent fuel that talks it in the long term. And I think that it's the sort of thing that you use to overcome the activation energy, especially the beginning of a thing. I need something to kick me out.
The chip on my shoulder from the kids that didn't believe me in school. The fact that I felt like I was mistreated or victimized or in some form there was something, some limitation placed on me. It's a pretty good fuel. That'll get you a long way. But you do not want to be using that two, three, four decades down the line. Well, you'll, you'll, what do you call yourself employed? Because you can't recognize your allies from your enemies. And you start taking that on your allies.
We see it in relationship. She started taking that on your mate. She started taking that on your wife, your husband, your lover. And I'm an, I'm, I'm an ally, man. We're on the same team. But you're, you're back to that non-deserving. No, I've got a, I got a bleed. No, I got a, I got a, I got a, I got a, I got a win. I got a good, ain't, no, you, hey. Well, also you've, the lesson that you've taken is enemies are more functional, motivating sources than allies.
Right. Therefore, if I can make enemies out of allies, I will just find Lily Padley, Lily Padley, Lily Padley, Lily Padley, I'll just keep jumping, jumping, jumping, jumping, jumping. Yeah, but that, you like, I think what you're saying is that, that, that, that trajectory starts to go. It's not a lateral thing now. Well, what have you got left? You've got an entire world filled with enemies. Yeah. Or at least no allies. Right.
And yeah, you know, as someone who used a chip on his shoulder for a good while to get some activation energy, I'm much prefer the version that I am now. I mean, a friend have a, three versions of ourselves that we think about. So we have dopamine chris. We have serotonin chris. We have cortisol chris. Okay. And dopamine chris is lean in. He's thinking about plays on the show and how magnificent and big it's going to be in awards and cool money and stuff like that.
And cortisol chris is seeing threats and anxiety. He's looking out for that, that ambient vigilance that I was saying before, he's on edge. And serotonin chris has taken a microdose of magic mushrooms. He's playing pickleball with his friends or he's lying under a tree, looking up at the sky. I want to spend as much time in serotonin chris as possible. You do? Yes. I want to spend as much time in serotonin chris as possible. And I find myself. I want to spend as much time in that as possible.
But that wouldn't have got me out. That wouldn't have been the escape velocity that I needed to be able to leave whatever atmosphere I was in. I needed to use these other very, I needed to run away from a life that I didn't want and run toward one that I did. I needed to escape something that I feared and I also needed to go towards something. But the real bliss is when you go off-loginal to both of those, which is... Let me ask you this.
So when you're serotonin chris, magic mushrooms with your buddies in the hammock, how long can you lay in that hammock before you get to the imposters, the thing, hey, I got to go accomplish. For me, it's going to accomplish something to have some sort of purpose. I've got to, I'm still working on getting better on vacations. My wife knows that I'm much easier to get along with on vacation if I get a couple hours to write in the morning and get a workout in.
I wish I could go two weeks with going, hey, man, whatever. But I get, I get antsy. I get edgy. I'm not present because I need a little time to go break a sweat mentally, physically. And then I can be, then men the rest of the day, I'm great. I love this topic. I've been thinking about it so much recently. Type A people with type B problems, type B people with type A problems. So the insecure overachiever needs to learn how to lie in a hammock.
And the lazy person who's on the verge of bankruptcy needs David Goggan shouting in their face. Now, the interesting thing is, because of culture and because of the way that people have perceived, a person who is overworked but outwardly very successful will always seem to be in a more preferable position than someone who's on the verge of bankruptcy and needs to get a Xbox. So we gift more sympathy because it seems charitable, seems supportive to the person who, you just need to work harder.
Think about what you have contributed to the world, which are movies. In every movie, the training montage of the down underdog is them working hard and learning to get upon time and be disciplined and so on and so forth. I don't know if any movies where a guy learns to log out of slack at 6 p.m. and lie on a beach holiday. Right. How, how, like opulent and transactional and dopaminergic are you that you need to be taught how to chill out.
You don't know this people out there that would kill to be in the position that you are. That's, that's the dialogue right there. That's interesting. How about a movie about the a low handicap movie for the type A that needs to learn how to get off slack and go hang in the hammock and pulls that off. And don't, and don't ask permission to tell it. Don't ask for, don't ask for boohoo's for the, for the character. Just, there's no one, no one's showing that. I mean, look, what do we do today?
What are the things going? You probably know better than I do. There's a lot of, it's like, people got much more in a meditation. Successful people got much more in a meditation. You brought one up earlier, psychosyllis even is psychosyllis now sort of a sort of avant-garde sort of here. Hey, man, this is a way to do. Breathwork, cold plunge, sauna, a sound healing. Yeah. Now, how many of those are we going to look at in 10 years and go? That was a fad.
How many of those are we going to go? That was a really cool discovery. Well, here's the vicious thing about those modalities that a lot of people, I call it productivity purgatory, which is the things that you do for fun. You only do in order to be able to service more productivity when you get back to it.
So why do you do your breathwork? Not because it makes me feel good and I like to do breathwork, but because I watched an Andrew Cuban podcast episode that said that it allows me to work 15% harder the next day. No, no, no. Your recovery modalities should be in service of themselves. Do you think this is a, if we're going to call it a sin or disease, I'm going to do that for stereotypical word.
Do you think this is a sin or disease of the West? Because for instance, I mean, I'm in Italy. We're with this wonderful couple, older couple and they're both like 80 and they were just happy shit together, man. And the lady was a great, she was like, it's great. She was, oh, I, I swimming around the to Island each day. And, and then I swim there and my question was, how far do you swim? She was like, what?
I swim until I don't want to swim anymore. I was like, it's a very Western idea. How far? How much time? She was like, I swim until I don't want to swim anymore. You wanted to quantify it. I was quantifying, I tracked it on straw. Right. You've got a spreadsheet for this. Do you have your, do you have your ring or ring on it? She was like, what? She was confused at my question.
And I was like, ah, a beautiful stereotypical difference in a European thought and a Western thought, but it's similar to that. It is very, I mean, we were playing friends birthday earlier this year in Miami and there was a pickleball court, but we were playing like good British blocs.
We were playing sort of foot tennis instead. And I realized that we were playing to win. And I didn't want to play to win. That wasn't the energy. I want, I was in dopamine, Chris. And I wanted to be in serotonin, Chris. So I said, why don't we change the rules of the game and work both teams separately, but together to try and make the most beautiful game that we can't.
And I just did everyone to be doing trick shots. You want to set up the other side to do trick shots. Some of the guys were good football free stylers, stuff like that. And the first response from my friend that came up with the serotonin dopamine court is all thing. George, his first response was, yeah, and we can count them. Oh, no. Let's keep the mathematics out of this. And that's your lady swimming around. How long? How far? How many times? Yeah. What?
I'm taking this thought to my, I'm going to play tennis for two hours when I leave here. And the girl I'm going to hit with as much as I can. I'll see if I could do it. I bet I can do it for two hours, but I'll see how long I can do it a little bit. Let me try and set her up for great shots and see see how the rallies go. Yeah. But even then, within that, well, was that shot better than the last one? Was that more beautiful?
You know, it's this infinite fucking regress of performance metrics and all the rest of it. Speaking of which, in other news this episode is brought to you by Skims. If you've ever wondered how McConaughey makes everything look so effortless, here's a tip. Start with being comfortable with Skims new box of briefs. That's exactly what you get. No awkward adjustments, no bunching, just a perfect fit that moves with you every step of the day.
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.com. Fastball. In six weeks time, it's the 10th anniversary of interstellar. I think it's being re-released in theaters in 70 Mill I'm X. And I'm X. Okay. How did that movie change you? It's my favorite movie of all time. So thank you for... I have a lot of people tell me that that's their favorite movie of all time. And that's another that a lot of people go. How to go watch four times. There's a lot to take in. There's a lot to take in. Classic Nolan.
Yeah. How did it change me? And you're not talking about like the success of the movie. No. No. I'm not talking about the subject of the entire universe. Either working with Christopher learning about, I mean, you know, Kipthon, fucking the consultant physicist on that show. So much stuff. Well, also, you know, it was in that in that sense, it was similar to when I did a movie called Contact. And I got to sit with Carl Sagan for three and a half hours. And he went through.
And I remember walking away from that gun. Oh my gosh. As a believer. God's back yard to a whole lot bigger than I thought it was, which is a very humbling and empowering thought. I mean, look, the main thing was I think on the on the human side of the real me personally. I was like, oh, you don't leave your kids to go do what your dream is. And then when I changed dream, what your dream is to go do what you're meant to do,
what you were born to do that you have an ability to do like nobody else. I'm just like, oh, well, maybe you do leave your kid. That, that argument and that leaving, which is that countdown. That's I remember that's where I was. That's the scene I'm remembering is the price you pay, the cost, the consequence of chasing death. And I had my initial thought was, oh, Cooper's being selfish in the wrong way. You know, don't. And then it's a good argument though. I don't think you can easily say that.
There's a major consequence with that, but look at what? And I look, I deal with it now. I got three kids do my favorite, my favorite job. What I think I was, I feel fine. Stream and endless purpose in and parenting. But I'm dabbling in different versions of leadership that have to do with the betterment. Maybe I hope of more people. But it would become a consequence of being there and being present like I want to be from my three children and my wife is our family.
And not anything that I believe is worth that at the sacrifice of this yet. And my argument with myself there is the best exports we can have if we do it well as our children. Nobody export you can put out a better extension of yourself. No better way to, you know, affect create like a world.
Then do it then hopefully having some healthy children that can go be independent enough and of you know, and you taught them on they see they see the world in the right way and can chase down things that they love and they hopefully love the right things. So contributing to anything in place of that is a net negative. Well, that'd be my argument at the sacrifice of fewer that I feel like, oh, that's that's millennia. I've really got it.
I've got it. That's I'm helping give them the pallet to paint on and I'm handing the right colors to them and letting them fall from the right heights of the wrong the right trees, you know, to where they get bruised but hopefully don't break an egg, you know what I mean. So, but I don't know, but it's a good argument. One that I understand on the other side and I have friends that go have sacrificed that.
I have friends that have been very successful, even in the career of being an actor in Hollywood and a successful actor in Hollywood. You know, it brings me back to when we first had kids before Camilla pulled the goalie to get pregnant. She goes one condition. You go, we go. And my first reaction was, hey, hey, hey, I'm lone wolf artist here, man. I go off my air stream with my dog. I'm a solo, you know, coyote here, man.
And while I'm saying that I heard my mother's voice go, you better nod your head and say she's giving you a gift. Say yes, man. And I did. Yes, man. And that we've done that. I have a 16 year old, a 14 year old, an 11 year old. No doubt that has a major contribution to how to whatever strength our family is. I think our family is very strong and the security that my kids have and the courage that they have that because we've never been away from each other that long.
They picked up came with. There's another side I understand you go got opportunities that can do great things like a share art or leadership in the world that I'm going to be away. And maybe that's even there's argument that that could be better for your children later on or maybe better for their children.
Well, this is a, you know, we're talking about that infinite regress of being mean to yourself or emotions about emotions and stuff. Thinking about the decision that Cooper needs to make and also the decision that you need to make.
It's you can always continue to kid yourself a little bit more. Is it more virtuous to stay at home with your children to raise your children despite the fact that the likelihood of them surviving into the future and their kids surviving into the future is lessened by that.
Okay, but then if you go and do the thing you leave them you're making that sacrifice. But are you doing it because you want to save the world or are you doing it because it's your dream or the fact that you can get something virtuous out of something that's also your dream is that fucking Puritan work ethic we were talking about before, which is I the only way that this can be a virtuous decision.
Is if I suffer more it's only suffering not just that it's good for the future, but also that I don't want to do it because if I don't want to do it, then I know that it's really, really true. It's a high price that I pay because go pull it off and this is the as far as I can see the curse of the deep thinker. Amen. Amen. Amen. A curse and gift because it does do one thing that we hadn't brought up at a very base level. And I think this goes along with stress, anxiety, but the very base.
It means it means something that we can't take for granted because not everyone has it means you give it down. Yes. And let's not throw let's not throw that out like, oh, yeah, of course, no, because not everybody does. It means you give it down about more about more than just yourself. And that is a high, that's a high in value and not an old fashioned nostalgic thing to go, oh, it's so 1950s bullshit. That's a real thing.
So some people can't care or some people struggle to care about things. Yeah, we're entitled people to go through the lives. It's odd, especially in the UK. Living things being too keen, right? Americans kind of have permanent first line cocaine energy. Yeah, very excited. Yeah, and I like it. I like excitable people. I like enthusiasm. However, the UK doesn't necessarily have that quite so much.
And I always think how much more I would, how much I wish I could gift that back to the UK, but how much that positive reinforcement was saying it before that first scene that you do. And the guy next to you guys, hey, that was pretty good. Yeah, yeah. The right encouraging word, the right time. Where would that push people to? And okay, if that's what you want for you in the world.
Right. Have the opportunity to be that for other people. And maybe it's going to start to come back around and maybe we can begin to change culture a little bit by doing this. When will that English or does it? Does it have someone though that it is constantly like that. Bullocks that goes in succeeds that the English culture goes. I can bravo. Really?
So interesting stat around the UK globally so far in 2024, the UK has the second highest number of millionaire exits on earth. What's a millionaire exit? A millionaire that has left the country and is now living in a different. Different nation China first 15,000 UK second nine and a half thousand, but the UK is 3% of the population of China. So pro rata we have got by far the most million as leaving by far.
We do not have a good culture around supporting success around people doing different things. Another great example of this, the UK has got three universities and two or three universities in the top 10 in the world as does America. So it'll be Oxford Cambridge, maybe kings or Durham in the UK and there'll be Yale Princeton Harvard, something else in the US and a couple of others.
And we have 20% the number of startup founders. Despite the fact that we have the same number of university graduates going from top flight universities. Why? Culture. What's speaking of that? What did you learn? You did the gentleman with Guy. Yeah. You spent a good bit of time presumably and meshing yourself into British culture. What did you learn while you were there? Well, so there is still a royal dance to play the part and do in that I found that interesting and quite entertaining.
I remember that everything has, there's a costume and a timing and who goes here when and here's a seat there and this is how we do this and I found it very interesting and plump and stuck and stunts. Yeah, it was all there and I indulged and played that part and enjoyed. But it wins the now when I went out and they saw that I was actually very good shot at present. I got a few hit. I got a few out of the way. Bring me American over here. I like you now, right? Good with guns.
And then I remember this one though where the term is do where the posh went overboard but nobody seemed to notice it but me. And we were at this dinner and it was one of those dinners where 24 people on this side, 24 people on this side, misses is down there and misters down here. Misses has a 24 foot by 18 foot oil painting of herself over her chair and Mr. as an 8 24 foot by 18 foot over his chair and it was just apps.
It's just all this fucking great. Everyone had their own waiter that saw a thing on time and this is just absolutely great. Well, after the dinner, the youngsters, the sons and the daughters had come over with their friends. And they were all these also posh to smoke the cigarette. Yes. And I remember this one get flicking the ash. There's an ass tree right down the table. Boom on the carpet. I was like, dude. And without even saying it's like, no, man.
It's it's what posh. It's it's it's it's it's it's it's it's cooler to go. I'm I can drop my hash on on on your $550,000 per person. Rugg then it is to put it in the ass tray and I was like, well, that one I think I went over. I think you went out of bounds on that one. But the fact that that was a game is games but they but they were doing it and consistently. And it fascinating the Americans are basically blind to class. You've had to use the word posh almost in speech marks there. Right.
It's like a word that yeah, yeah, there is not a single school child that doesn't use the word posh in primary school once a day in England. Everybody and it means class. It means this person is well to do from a well to do background. Okay. And there's you know, I remember there was a guy that I played cricket with. Cricket still working classport in the UK. It's not necessarily upper class. There's very working class town.
And it was a kid who got a class Mercedes used for his 17th birthday, which is when you can drive in the UK. I was like, wow. Danny's from a posh family. I never really knew that much. But I knew I had money. He always had nice kid. He always had new new boots at the start of each season. I was like, wow, he got a Mercedes in retrospect. It's maybe a seven grand car, 10 grand car, something like that. For me, I'm like, oh, posh the rush. Yeah, yeah, yeah, yeah, yeah, yeah, yeah.
Is there something though going on with the as the royal family and the king and the queen losing power and that's becoming is these these millionaire exits? Is this still a bit of a how dare you become that wealthy in the private sector? You're not a royal or no, I certainly don't think with regards to that.
But there is definitely skepticism around the monarchy at the moment. And I'm really not sure where I stand on that one of my friends is a very compelling argument that we should do away with it. Doesn't like the word your highness higher than what? But also what was it that you were just saying? Like what if we got if we don't hold on to the culture and the things that people know us for?
And I like the pomp and circumstance when I graduated from Newcastle University, there's this 10 minute procession of different mace bearers, literally wielding medieval weapons, dotting their caps to different people in different sequences in order to show who and where and why. Like this is fucking cool. Whatever it is, it's still because America weird whether we know that we're hungry for ritual. Yes, and we don't have near as much rich, not established.
Right? This trees that are older than your country. Yeah, we're just just puppies. I hope that you don't get watered down to where yeah, because you all have amazing ritual laugh, giggle at it or not. Do it and appreciate it and go this is a different place and it's been around it's been around a while. Yeah, posh class. Okay. Yeah, a little bit well to do. Okay.
You mentioned there about some of the prices that people need to pay in order to be who they are. Yeah, I'm fascinated by this question. I'm fascinated by the cost of entry price of doing business to be a person that other people admire because I think that it helps to humanize others success and it helps to mitigate jealousy and envy because you.
You see what someone has had to go through in order to be in a position that you think you want to be and they go, oh, you get to see this much by the way, there's this monster hiding behind. What do you wish more people knew about the price of success in life? Well success is taken on different definitions over time. It used to have to do and some people listen to this will be like, oh, come on, my kind of you have to do it and.
I think it was a word that was in the definition of 1901 or 11 and now you know money fame that's your definition of success. So it seems to be that and always has been to some extent. Whoever has more success for more access for money, you're the winner. The last for a lot. That is, I'm not saying it's a race to the red light, but I am saying the fourth quarter of that being your goal.
The residuals decline on quality of life. I've met many more very rich men who chased that dollar to be successful and to be relevant for having the most money that the last 15, 20, even younger years or be welded lost had no relationships. I didn't have purpose chasing the dollar they did it. They were good at it and made it happen but they didn't feel what they were doing they couldn't even say what they were really good at just good deal makers or made the right calls and certain mathematics.
But that's definition. It's also why I wasn't surprised when Trump first got elected. It fame and money. We sell that every day in the West as this is how you make it America. That's America. That's America. Yeah. So I was not surprised because that's what we're getting fed. What a success. I just let me prephrase it with this. We all want to be relevant but I think we all forget to ask yourself relevant for what before we chase our relevance or chase success.
I think there's a different way of success and profit. Being profit does pay you back. Can you do things and I love money. I'm all for it. But there I see a lot of one way tickets that are you can get successful when have more money but not be making a profit in your life. How many times we sacrifice quality for quantity? The two don't have to be separate. Now you may have to make some sacrifices of quantity to have more quality.
But I think we should give quality more credit than we do. Well, we're not ultimately having more quantity in the hopes of more quality. That's not a quid pro quo. It doesn't it doesn't equal out to that. We believe it. It will and hey, it can access. I mean, I got a lot of things now for money I've made that I'm like, damn right, man. I'm glad I have that that makes my life.
Not even more convenient. I actually like that more. I like what I can do with my family more with that. I like what I can do is a husband wife. I like what I can do solo. He more to enjoy it. And it get it feeds me. But would I be any less would I be any less happy if I had a 30 of 40 of 50th of what I have right now. No, I know that there's no I know I'd be any less happy. No way I'd be less happy.
Don't want to give all that away and say, well, I'm going to make me poor sometimes I'm like, hey, you need to be more poor other times like no, no, no, no, don't be getting the imposter syndrome on this one. You're using it for use it pretty good. You could use it even better. But don't be don't get mad at it. You know what I mean? I think we just need to ask ourselves that question relevant for what and also in the pursuit of quantity, which is what the world rewards.
Ask ourselves read the watch out district of the Guley and go, what is the quality what do I want? And again, that's a hard question of what I value the most. What I really value the most and it's a hard question answer. But if we can answer that make sure you're you're it'll make you make this answer the quality question of what we want more of.
And not just the quantity question because a lot of us I've done it to been blind is going to be chasing the quantity to see let me see if I get the biggest number. A dopamine method. Dopamine Matthew and I'm pretty damn good at it. If I want to put on my business that go that's all I'm going to be right here found out I'm pretty good at it. But I don't want to stay in that dopamine Matthew on that on that. Because I don't get the reward I get the reward the acquisition.
But the acquisition does not equally pay back the dopamine of the getting it's the conquering that's the that's the hit. You know read a fine everyone can have their own definition of success and ask yourself can I have quality with the quantity and can have profit with my success. And profit goes into leaned into relationships. I think profit ends up to be a spiritual question too.
And how we treat ourselves and others I think it's a longer game. This chase for just success if that's money and quantity is a is a short sided game. If that's all if that's all you're after now understand some people out there can't pay their rent or sick and trying to make to the next day or listen would listen this and go easy for you to say.
And I say you are correct speaking from where from my position is you asked me to get some people that are going I'm not this is a high hyperbolic conversation you have and I'm trying to make it to the next day type B person with the type a problem things what a champagne issue that is.
It's it's it's it's it's a real one and and apologize for it but I understand the different but I would just I would say that if more people that are type A and or maybe things are working out just check your quality as you're chasing your quantities make sure that whatever you're succeeding as giving you actual profit and actually paying you back.
Matthew McConaughey ladies and gentlemen dude I really appreciate you I love the way that you think I love your insights about life congratulations on the new book congratulations on the tequila and thank you.
Thank you for coming today I really really enjoyed this I did too Chris very much glad to be here man met up top and a barn somewhere in Austin where I was looking down to even know where I was going so what a barn I was like oh this is where we are yes it is seems on brand for you I like it. Thank you dude until next time until.
Thank you very much for tuning in luck we went to a lot of effort to get to McConaughey here and convert an old barn that's from the 1800s in Texas so I really hope you enjoyed it. I'll see you next time.