When I look at my team today and I say, Okay, we've never done this before. Maybe Anderson has never done this before, maybe this team has never done it before, but we're gonna figure it out, and if it goes sideways, we'll figure that out too.
Today's guest is Ellie kanips, a marketing professional with over 11 years of experience in the building materials industry, Ellie spent her first seven years at Cambria, and for the past four she has been at Anderson windows, where she's made a big leap into her social and content focused role. Despite having no formal experience in those areas, that leap pushed her out of her comfort zone and sparked
tremendous professional growth. What sets Ellie apart is her deep connection to the builder community, something she credits to both her husband, Casey, who first introduced her to the industry, V Instagram, and her relentless curiosity. She's made it her mission to bring customers voices into the organization, bridging the gap between large manufacturers and the real people on job sites, from backing trailers into loading docks during college internships to betting on
herself with every career jump. Ellie is someone who thrives when the stakes are high, whether it's workforce development, sustainability or the ever evolving content landscape. She's at the forefront, always learning, always adapting. At her core, Ellie is driven not just by the work, but by a love for the people who do it. She believes in Romancing the grit, artistry and everyday excellence of
builders and makers. We're pumped to dive into her story, her strategies and the mindset that helped her build a standout career. So we at modern craftsman are lucky to not call, not only call Ellie, a partner with the podcast, but also a friend. And lastly, she mentioned that the hardest thing she had ever done was give natural childbirth, and that our
audience probably would not appreciate that. So as someone who witnessed childbirth, not even natural firsthand, it is the most out of body impressive thing I've ever seen in my entire life. And if you guys have ever seen her husband, you would be even more impressed, because there's no way that that was a small baby, either one of them that came out of you. So everyone listeners, everyone here included, needs to give Ellie some respect and love for that alone, let alone everything
industry related. How about that intro? Yeah, that was ridiculous. I feel like you had to have been talking about someone else. This podcast is brought to you by Anderson windows. When a family in Minnesota had a net zero goal for their home amid the extreme climate, they turned to pros who needed the right kind of windows
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about. Next build. Ellie filled us in on a lot of background information for the podcast, which I found very intriguing, very interesting, and one of which was the the natural childbirth. So yeah, very impressive. Major props to you. I think when I, when I witnessed Rachel's childbirth, I thought her head was literally gonna pop off. Yeah, super intense. Well, it feels, somehow it does like
that. Oh, so for listeners who don't know you, I know that I gave you an introduction, but give us a quick recap of your path into this industry and what, what motivated you to transition from Cambria to your role at Anderson? Yeah,
um, let's see. Well, when I started, when I started my career, um, I was in grad school, so I was in grad school and I was working for a media agency, and I knew that I wanted to be client side, meaning I knew I wanted to work for the brand and not be at an agency, really, because I love organizational cultures, and I think organizational cultures when You're at a brand is so different than organizational
cultures at an agency. And so when I started to look for places to go on a brand side, I really wanted something in the home space. I think it was just because that was something that interested me in my personal life, and I felt like if I could do marketing work for an industry that I liked or found industry, you know, that's a win, win. And when I was at Cambria, it was great. It was very it's very interior focused, though. I mean, you're thinking about tile, you're thinking
about plumbing fixtures, you're thinking about lighting. You're thinking about countertops like that's so it's a lot of interior designers. And as I was there, we started to develop more and more customer marketing focused roles that were looking at builders or at remodelers. And I started working on the stone
fabricator audience. And I found that so interesting. And I found, yeah, the technical and the saws that they use, and like we would go to park industries, which is the manufacturer that makes all of their wet sauce and their jet cuts, and that part was so cool. And I found myself being like, yeah, famous interior designer, like, famous Instagram design influencer,
cool, like, nice to meet you. But tools go tools. I want to go talk to the stone fabricator who has figured out how to, like, do soft seats around a fireplace and, like, the cool technical
part of it. And so I did that for a while. I worked on fabricators, but then I started to meet like I met the two of you while I was at Cambria, and I met Brad while I was at Cambria, and I started to meet these kinds of builders that were really into the performance of what they were doing and really taking their builds to the next level in the way that they were educating themselves and the way that they were presenting themselves to their clients. And I was like, that's
the community that I want to work more with. And I mean, I met you guys while I was working on countertops, but I don't think we would like sit down and talk about countertops for a long time. So and I feel like, like, the transition Anderson too, even we
visited both companies, right? And work with both companies, and it feels like you're so much more attached to the people and the product, or Anderson and the people behind the product as well, where, yeah, like, Cambria kind of just feels like a countertop company. And I think that this, this position, in this role, probably gives you far more opportunity connect with the boots on the ground type people who are putting a product in their houses that they they can really feel
attached to. Well, just to speak to stone in general, I think there's the product, and then the way the product is then fabricated. And I think in the simplest form, that product, in my opinion, is just kind of bland. It's just, it's a, it's a, it's a slab, yeah. And the reason I mentioned that is because what I have found, especially in our projects, we we oftentimes push the limit of what that product can do, and that's just through
everything. But stone is a great example of it. And a lot of our projects, we have to work through those details really, really closely with the fabricator to to make something that is above and beyond what is expected. And I think when you're talking about meeting with the fabricator and the saw and understanding the technical side of it, it's because, I would guess, that it's because you're you're starting to understand the possibility. Theory of what something could
be. And with someone like Anderson, it's, you know, you're getting into that immediately, because it has to. It doesn't just have to look good, but it has to perform. And the the technical elements that go into performance is deep rooted as we as we learned when we tour the facility. But it's like there's a lot that goes into every one of those decisions in order for that to perform. And then you and then on top of that, you have the ability to customize it. Yeah,
yeah. And I think as I, as I started to work with more and more builders while I was at Cambria, it was like, What could we do that's interesting here? And then I would get into other parts of their projects, and I was like, I actually want to
learn more about that. That's cool. And so since I've been able to make the transition to Anderson and spend more time there, I feel like we're more integral part of the project, and we get to experience more of the project alongside the builder than than I did on the countertop side, because everything's already done at that point. And it's such a critical aspect of the build that needs to be integrated from everything, from the frame stage and water
management stage through finish. It's not just like at the end of the day, you can throw whatever product that you want that build. It doesn't really matter. You're making that decision, oftentimes, that decisions being made before there's a hole in the ground. And not that it can't be replaced, just like a finished material, but it's, you know, like Tyler said, it's, it's so integral to the
performance of the project. But also it's touched all the way through, like I said, you know, you're ordering before the hole, you're installing it, you're prepping the framing you're coordinating. It's, it's something that is, you know, really, really, you know, involved, like, involved in the whole process.
All right, so you went to grad school, undergrad, and then grad school, you said that during some of your internships, or one of your internships, you were driving gooseneck trailers and box trucks across the country, and had no background in doing that. How did those figure it out? Experiences shape your approach to leadership and what you're doing with Anderson
today? Yeah, so that, I mean that I think about that experience a lot, because I think recently in my career, I've been back at that point of, like, you're back in trailers for Windows. Thank God the teamsters were out. No but like, back at the point of, I don't know how to do this. I mean, in that internship, I was working for a company there called dektronix, they make LED video boards. So if you go to Meadowlands, right, like the big video screen in the stadium.
That's what they make. And we had to drive that stuff across the country. So I was driving from South Dakota to Arizona in a dually with a gooseneck trailer and a huge section of a digital billboard on my truck. Yes, for real, they'll hire anyone, clearly. And it was like, here's the car rental we use go rent something and here's your log book. Because we had to, we had, like, trucker log books. We had to go into the way station. Yeah, you sold D, o, t,
and they didn't tell us anything else there. Was like, that's it. So, I mean, I literally had to figure it out. We drove straight trucks, and then we we would drive to convention centers, and then we would have to back into the loading dock. But our our trucks were shorter than the loading dock, so you had to back up onto the little risers. You know, they're like a foot wide, and you have to back your truck up onto them again. I have no
idea what I'm doing. And there's a full, you know, union cruise watching, watching you try to do it when you hit a loading dock, like the first time you think it's cushy, it's not cushy. I think that experience was literally the first time though that someone was like, lit, look, this is on you. You have to figure it out. You have three days to get there, and it's you own it so, so figure it out. And good luck. And I was like, I don't know, 19, yeah. And had no idea what I was doing, but you
figure it out. When your car breaks down in the middle of, like, Colorado somewhere, you find an international dealer, and you go and get your truck fixed, and, like, It's wild. It was wild. I don't I don't think I'd want it. I'd be intimidated doing that now, like I had sub it out. I'm not gonna lie. Yeah, I'm not
gonna lie. I took Rachel's car to the airport because I was, like, my pickup truck's not gonna fit in the overnight parking so I took her car, and she was like, All right, I'll drive your truck, but I'm not gonna do the pickup and the mobile water pickup at target with your truck, because I can't back into that spa. But then she did, and she sent me a picture message of it, so pumped that she did it. She's like, made it into the spot. I was like, all right. Sweet.
Yeah, so, but I think it was good, because your fate, you learn early what that feeling feels like when you're faced with something you've never done before, and there was no one to ask. So you you just have to start. You just have to pick a spot and start and learn as you go. It's always scary like that, that apprehension, that anxiety doesn't go right away, you just better understand and have the
tools to cope with it. Like every time I do something new or something that I'm not confident in myself, I still get those same feelings like you probably backing up to a loading dock, but I understand that I have the tools that I can handle that and deal with that appropriately. Now, how important of a role do you think that plays in your career, or anyone's career, like you're talking about, you know, going into something, knowing nothing, but being asked to figure it
out? Because I think you know what a lot of people struggle with, and I, and I experienced this firsthand, is that a lot of people want clear direction, and some of you know, I've had employees that, you know, require explicit direction, where it's like, Hey, you're going to do this, and then the next step will be that, and then after this, you do this. And I would watch the failure point, where it's, if I didn't give them all the way to Z, they would, they would stop at, you
know, step V, and I'm like, What are you doing? They're like, well, what's my next step. And I think what you're explaining is like, I'm, you know, I look for the people that are like, hey, I need this, and you're here. So you figure that out, yeah, how you speak to that in terms of, like, how that relates to your career, but how important you think it is for anyone in any
career? Well, I think it, I think it's played a big part in my career, because I think that my every, every moment that I've had a win comes back to a moment that someone was like, Hey, we kind of need this thing done, but we don't really have a system for it, or we don't really know how we're going to do it. But do you want to work on it? And and saying yes in those moments when you're
like, I have no idea how we're gonna get there either. I have no idea how to do this either, but knowing that you can figure it out, it's like a is a confidence. I think that I found from that internship where I knew I trusted myself, then enough to say I can figure it out. But I also think I was lucky enough to have people around me at those times who weren't creating an environment of me being afraid to mess it up. So like when I look at my team today and I say, Okay,
we've never done this before. Maybe Anderson has never done this before, maybe this team has never done it before, but we're going to figure it out. And if it goes sideways, we'll figure that out too, like it doesn't have to be perfect. We can make a misstep, we can go too far one way, and then, and then correct. And I think where, where it ends up being going really wrong is when you don't give your people enough space to kind of make those mistakes, or you don't have that conversation with
them. Of like, I don't have a step one, step two, step three. So I want you to help me figure out what those steps are. Yeah, I think it also goes back to your original point of confidence. You know, if you've listened to this podcast, you've heard me say it before, but you know, when you make a decision, the best decision you can make is the right one, and the second
best is the wrong one. The worst decision is no decision. And I've always kind of expanded on that, saying, even if you make the wrong one, the chances of it being detrimentally wrong is is less than 50% because if you make that decision like there was some sort of you know, understanding of like this is what I think should happen. And even if it goes off the rails, like you said, the chances are you can probably bring it back, and if it goes wildly wrong, like, hey, shits gonna happen.
Like, let's, let's course correct. And you have a support system around you that says, hey, this is what's going on, you know. And I need you know whether I need support or not, but the confidence to make a decision and not stall out is, I think, the the the skill set that people lack, and it's, you know, and then they get stuck in this idea that I can't make a decision because I don't know which one is right. My, my expansion on that too, is, you know, the the unreasonable
confidence going into to things is what drives me right. Like, I unreasonable, huh? Unreasonable, reasonable confidence. I like that's the way I look at it. And because thing that's called arrogance, what we can name it, what it is, right? But the reality is, I do a lot of things that people tell me don't do that. You can't do this. You can't accomplish it. And I fully believe that I can until I'm until it absolutely.
Doesn't happen. I will never believe that I can't do it and, and, but I will pair that with the fact that if it doesn't, if it goes sideways, I fail, it's gonna be okay. Like, okay. Like, that was then, then it was always going to fail. But I push, I push, push, push, push, push, as much as I could to get the result that I had hoped for. And if I give up, or if it fails, like, great, I have that lesson now. Let me see if I can move this in this direction.
When you when you are experiencing you know, whether it's people on your team or people you work with that have that moment of stall out. How much of that do you think is accredited to the fact that they think someone does have all the answers, or someone does know and they just don't want to be wrong. It's always that, and usually it's like, for me, you know, it's because maybe I micromanage someone, or micromanage a situation, or I've come on a job site and said, Hey, I would have
done it differently. And I do that too much, to the point where it's like, well, now every time I do it, it's wrong, yeah, and that's a that's a delicate balance, where it's like, if you're going to be a real leader, you need to allow, like you said, you need to allow someone to go through that motion and make that mistake and not not course correct them in
the moment, in the moment. And I think you know specifically to scaling and thinking about building a business and employees, we as owners oftentimes forget, or leaders, oftentimes forget that we make a bunch of mistakes, that when we hire someone that we're it's our job to prevent them from making the same mistakes, but when the reality is they won't have those same lessons, and they'll never kind of equal out with you or Be a support, because they never experienced the, you know, the
trials with those mistakes. I think that's what important also working for a company like Anderson that's as big as Anderson and like the hierarchy, hierarchy of leadership that affords you an opportunity to, like, move through that path, experience those mistakes you're big enough to absorb, like the learning curve of trying new things for the first time, right? It's not like you're working for a mom and pop shop where it's like every mistake
that you makes literally taking food off my kids table. So I feel like that's the opportunity that a company like Anderson, that's been around for so long also provides, like, we got a mistake budget. Yeah, yeah. One of my The reason I asked you that, though, is like, one of my best bosses, I would come to her all the time and be like, okay, so I did this, and now you know, what do
you want me to do, or what's the next step? And I was that person, and she finally looked at me and was like, There's no rule book. There's no plan written out that you don't know about. So I need you to just do what you think should be done and trust your judgment, because you keep coming to me thinking like I know exactly what the next step should be, and we, we that doesn't exist, that plan doesn't exist, and there's nobody that that knows this part of the business better than you,
so you should just do it. And that that was, that was like an aha. I think that that was one of the the key leadership things I learned early on is when someone comes to you, like, in that case, you go to your boss and say, what, what do I do at this point, flipping that back and saying, Well, what do you think we should do? And when and when they when they you know, and when they're responding saying, Well, I think we should do X, Y,
Z, and you support that. They, they slowly realize that they're making these decisions, and they're building confidence. It's when you're giving them here's, oh, do this okay. Now I know that that's my shortcut. I just ask and I receive, hey guys, quick break from the podcast. Headed over to modern craftsman.co. Scroll all the way to the bottom and sign up for
our newsletter. You're gonna get a weekly email from us, but you're also gonna get some episode recaps with actionable items that can help you improve your business and be more profitable. Now back to the podcast. So Ellie, your new role, obviously talking about having somewhat of a lack of confidence, like you were not in this social role before transitioning over to Anderson and now you've been a part of a ton of ad campaigns. Just recently learned that you were spearheading a lot of the Drew
and Jonathan Scott and obviously modern craftsman. But what? Yeah, we go above that. What did and what do those processes teach you about the storytelling and the audience connection within our industry, because I think that that realistically is why you wanted to join forces with Anderson, and that that's the opportunity that you saw, the connection and being able to really be a part of those stories with builders. So how
much did this process in this new role? To teach you about how critical that storytelling and that audience connection is. So when I moved to Anderson, I had been, I had been watching what was happening on Instagram for like, two years, three years at that point, and I at that point, I think, like, you know, Casey was redoing a bathroom or something, and called you on how to do a curbless cement and, like, what are the angles, and
how do I, like, make sure that I do this right? And I was watching this amazing community connection, like, impact my actual personal life, because at that point, you guys had never met. You just know each other from Instagram. And then I came home, and he's like, I talked to Tyler, like, on the phone today, and I was like, awesome. That's so cool. But then there's a shower done, yeah, finish the bathroom. But then it just becomes, like, we come to JLC, and I meet
people in real life that I followed forever. And there was, there's something honestly, really special about what people like you have built in that space. And that was so cool to me. And it was so cool the whole collaboration over competition and the sharing and like, the more we can share and learn from each other's mistakes, the better we all are. And there's like all all of that feeling just felt so refreshing and felt
so honest and good. And when I went to Anderson, that was like, my the first thing on my list of we're gonna do something to become part of this community. And did you, did you put that on the table? Like, was that an initiative that you wanted to put in place, and you, like, brought to the table all because you hopped on a call your case? I feel like we're not charging enough.
No, but it's true, because I would watch, I would watch the way that people were authentically talking about products that truly improve their lives or improve their products. And it didn't feel like an ad. It didn't feel like I'm, you know, pushing a product or a manufacturer. It felt like a true relationship, and I think that's what I wanted to bring into the organization, is attention to this amazing community that existed. And then, how can we benefit each
other? How can we as an organization learn from what you guys are talking about, because you're experiencing our product on a daily basis, and then how can we better serve you while you do that? What I think, I think what I am appreciated about, obviously, our partnership, is that the storytelling is very much that it's here's how to do something. It's not here's the best thing to do, or the best product, or this, this is the only way to do
it. It's very much a storytelling of you know, you can do a cement shower example, there's 100 ways to do a shower. That's that doesn't mean that that's the best. It's just,
here's how you do that particular thing the best. And in, in what we've done in the video series, and visiting the the Black Diamond residents, and seeing that firsthand, it's always been about just the story behind what it is, what that project is why, you know, we talk about why those decisions were made, what the impact was, the pivot door that you guys supplied on that project. You know, there was all of this, like, deep rooted story behind why Doug had installed those.
And I think, like that was something that you wouldn't necessarily know if it was an ad, right? And it was more just like, let me understand what's going on here. Let me understand the story behind it. And we were taking it in live, you know, even when we've toured the factory. I mean, you guys gave us a pre tour on a million square feet, but then we walked around and it was we were reacting to like, Wow. This is how this goes together. Wow. This is, this is what they're
thinking about when they're when they're installing. I specifically remember the the one piece gasket around the
window, and being like, that's so smart. And it was like, that was something that was obviously thought about, the way it's the way it's installed, and to be able to experience that, and then, of course, share that with people you know that watch that content you know, made me realize and really appreciate what you've done in terms of building that story that that story telling in the content that that we're creating.
And I think, I think the Black Diamond residence is an interesting example, because so you guys shot three videos that hands down the favorite video from like my team is the first one, because they want to learn about the panelized construction. They want to see what the inside of that shop
looks like. They want to hear. Are from Cape Cod panel on, like, like, how that happens, and that's why I think that that's like, the way, like, part of the conversation I want to have with you is, like, how, as as a listener, as a contractor, how are you developing the rapport and cultivating these relationships with your partners, right? Like, with fenders. How do you ensure
they're a good fit? And what you guys are in do are doing and not only investing in like you could have easily just sent us to film that door installed on Doug's job. And they're like, this is a beautiful door, and that's it. But no, like you sent us to Cape Cod lumber, but we toured the factory, then we went to Cape Cod lumber, then we went back to the rough stage, then we went
back to the finished stage. And you invested in documenting all of that with all of the trades people, all of the teams for Yeah, your finished product, but everything that went behind that, and that's what creates the authenticity for me. That's what builds and develops our rapport and our relationship that like, yeah, we get there and we meet everyone, and we learn every single hand that's touched that product, and get to meet them in person, and that helps us create the best content
for you. And you're not just investing in one person or one item. It's like, it's how comprehensive that entire process is, for me, that is like the secret sauce in the vendor partner relationship. I think part of that is because we are very intentionally, that's my word, thinking about the content that we bring to our teams as well. Like I don't want to arm our teams with content
that is only about our product, right? We're one product that goes into a wall assembly that creates a full project, and we're only going to be able to deliver the best products if we're thinking about the, you know, hundreds of ways that that wall could be built, and what you need and expect from our product in that wall assembly, it's crazy to think that, like for me, you think of content creation, or you think of a brand partnership, or marketing
in general, and typically the basis for that's going to be external marketing, right? How are we going to reach our customer base, our clients, our builders, our homeowners, and you're approaching this content generation from an internal perspective, like, how is this going to help our own employees and our own team understand this as well. Yeah.
I mean, I think that's an aspect, but I also think I think that's an aspect, and that's been something that has been part of the journey so far at Anderson, is to use what kind of stuff we're doing to to bring the rest of the organization along on that journey as well. But I do think, for someone like the two of you, would you rather sit down and see just that piece
on a pivot door? Or would you rather understand that this was a panelized job, and here's how the walls were made, and then they were shipped here and here, like it is for our team internally, but I think the first priority is, how do we make another builder interested in this, and they don't want to see just the pivot door. I mean the technical aspect, regardless if you ever install we'll use that door, for example, regardless if you ever install that door, it's interesting to understand what
it took to install that door. Understand, like the what goes below the threshold that you will never see again, the adjustment points. And I think a lot about cooking content. I'm not a cook. I can't cook like I can figure I can cook a steak, but that's about it. But I'll watch a full video of someone cooking like an amazing dish, because it's interesting to understand how they get from raw ingredients to the end, and that that like, that's interesting to me. I think, you know, that's
something that we've preached for a long time with content. Is like, show what how to do something. And early on, there was this whole misunderstanding of, like, if you show exactly how you do something, everyone's just going to do it themselves, and it'd be this competition. It's like, that's not the case. You know, from a client's perspective, number one, if they're going to do it themselves, they're not a
client. But number two, it builds respect for what actually what it took to get there and to understand what it took to get that door in, and the tolerances that that door had to be built within. It's like, Oh, wow. Now I understand, like, really, how impressive a door like that is. So Ellie, you had mentioned that you consume what your audience consumes. And when it comes to like you guys, hiring people to create content or forming these partnerships, there's this
objective aspect of it where it's like, yeah. We need, we need to make sure that we hit these marks and these measurables and these metrics. But how are you understanding what your audience wants to consume from like, more of a design or a subjective perspective, where it's like, what do we want to produce content around, like, what's important to you? Is it based on what, what your marketing team
wants? Is it based on what you think is going to perform? Is it this, this just idea that you have in your head where it's like, I really want to create something based around this product, a combination of all those things? Yeah. I mean, I think it's the intersections, right? So for us from a business standpoint, we may be saying, Hey, we really want to talk about our triple pain offerings, and we want to talk about, you know, the performance aspects of a series
and the fact that it's passive certified awesome. So we could go make a video about that, or we could find a project where triple pain is needed. We could talk about why it's needed in that market. We could talk about why, you know, the performance is better in this series, or, you know, and that, that would be an idea of something that's important to us, getting getting
pushed out into the market. But at the same time, I think, I mean, there are nights when I get home from some kind of evening event and Casey is literally on the couch watching YouTube, and it's like, one of your videos, or like, I know at one point we talked about the eye mouse, the tape measure sound that your site visits used to start with, yeah, that that was like a recognized sound in the house. I will hear that, and I would be like a auto
Doug. What is the tape measure audio? It's, what is it called? Our Sonic brand. He we we saw, sorry, sidetracking, but we saw something about Sonic branding years ago. And I was like, we need to think of a noise. And he went home and he recorded the tape measure. And I'm like, that it works. So I'll come home and he'll be watching YouTube, something on the on the TV, and like, I'll sit down and we'll be chatting, and the half an hour go by and I'm like, we're so
lame. We're literally it's like, Sorry, no offense. Friday night and we're watching, you know, some ridiculous builder content on YouTube, but some Instagram builder Yeah, right, that that's the kind of stuff, though, that is ideation time for me. So I'm I've listened to the podcast forever. I'll listen to I'll watch the YouTube videos, or, um, we've been sponsoring the Building Science Symposium. What do you have to make sure nobody was around.
Well, volume was changing. Oh, I've been listening to tons of content on control layers and trying to understand what Ross trethui is saying when he goes through his indoor air quality and like, mechanics of Ross gets inside. Yeah, I love it, though I love it, but that's the kind of stuff where I'll be watching something that is clearly over my head, yeah, but partnering with the kinds of people that I can go up to afterwards and be
like, Okay, I think I got it. I think I understood that this then as or whatever my question is, and they will take the time to explain it to me, and then I can start ideating around content that because if they're talking about it to their peers, then it's obviously interesting to them. So then if I can make content about the same kinds of things, then I know that I am on the right track.
So from your side of the table, from your perspective, what does a great partnership look like, is it somebody like like that who's willing to take the time to walk you through this and and instill that confidence in you to understand the process, to relay the necessary information? Like to me, having the relationship with you and with Anderson is when we create a video and you text me and say, Hey, is this an issue with this
video? I'm concerned about this. And we hop on a phone call and discuss what we saw, what the potential feedback could be, and what may be good or bad with that. Like to make sure that
you're protected. We're protected, giving us the freedom to make the content that we need, but then when you have questions being able to come to us, and it's not like you have to redo this, this isn't right, like having that, that mutual relationship, where we're looking out for each other, but we also could just have an honest conversation with each other. I
think the first thing for. Me is this is not an easy industry, and we do not have an easy product, easy and in the not easy in the sense that it's, it's complicated, there's, there's like in the kinds of pieces that go together, in the kinds of materials, in all of the different ways that you can optimize or update one product or another. There's a lot to know in the window and door space, and there's even more to know in in the whole building industry. My profession is in
marketing. I am not a builder, right? So the most important thing to me is that I have a partner on the other side of the camera who is willing to spend a little bit of time with me to make sure that I understand what's going on, and who also understands that when they call with a technical question, I'm
not going to be the one that answers it. I don't know I can help with lots of other things, but I can find the person, and sometimes when you don't have that kind of agreement on both sides, there's frustration that builds, right but I need to be able to, we just filmed in Goodyear, right at the at the Goodyear plant, I was able To not go to that and feel really comfortable, because I knew that, if you know the other people on my team that were there, had a question about
whether something was being done right, you guys would hold their hand through that and like, be okay. And that, that level of trust, I think, is important, and it doesn't happen overnight, but it's, it's something that comes from having open conversations about things and setting expectations. Clearly, I think the setting expectations is the part that that gets really tricky with people who are friends, yeah, and I
mean, that's the same thing as our job. Like you're the success of your job is based on the expectation you set forth from the outset. Like, no matter how good it is on the back end or how bad it depends on the expectation of a set forth and agreed upon or contractually signed on. And I think that understanding that and being open and having that communication, and then when things go bad, understanding
that it's going to be remediated and resolved. I do have one bone to pick with you about that trip that you didn't tell us that we were going to be staying in and, like, resort, because I would have stayed at least an extra day, because we, like, flew in and then took the red eye out, and I was like, did it water slide? I've never stayed there. I did. It was nice. And apparently it wasn't that much money, easily would have gone
out of pocket for a day. You know, no kids. I'll work on that next time I'm ready to go back to Goodyear, I'm gonna, I'm gonna give you kudos on what you were talking about earlier, about what makes a good partner for you. But in the projects that we work, have worked on together, you do exactly what you just said is, you don't always have the answers, but you get the answer. And I have that. I have appreciated that the most specifically working with you,
where it's we hit you with super technical questions. I have a team of people that are very technical above me, but they will ask very specific questions. And you get asked the question, and I'm like, Ellie's not the Oh, she she got the answer. We're good, like, she's got it. And you've always, you've always up. I've had phone calls with her where I'll, I'll tell her what's going on, and then she'll be quiet or silent, and then I'll
repeat it again. She's like, No, I understand what you said. I'm just thinking. And I'm like, I just assumed I had to repeat it again and run it by you. She's like, No, I'm I'm good. So you've talked a lot about the importance of betting on yourself and saying yes, even when it may be scary, even with your transition over to your new role. Can you share another moment in recent history of when that paid off for you? Yes. So we just, we just did, it's March right now. We're
going, we're in, is it still March? Yeah, where we did a new ad for March Madness this year aimed at homeowners, trying to, you know, just bring, continue to bring the brand to the forefront of the mind for for homeowners. And we shot it with Drew and Jonathan Scott in LA, I had never done a commercial shoot before. I had never been involved. It's just part of the job. And it was like a big production in LA, two production crews like our brand agency.
I saw him getting makeup, and the window was getting makeup too. Yeah, I saw and we had a certain number of hours with them, and it was like, we're gonna shoot the commercial, but then we're also gonna try to shoot all of this social content. And you're in charge of the social content. There's. So they're super efficient, so they can do a lot, figure out, make sure you don't have any downtime. So I scripted and blocked out all of this social content. I think I had, like, 30 pages of scripts,
because I did not want any downtime. Like, if we could walk out of there with 30 pieces of social content, that would be amazing, but that was, like, the first time I had felt nervous for something work related in a really long time. And it felt really good to feel nervous, like to feel challenged in a way that you were like, Okay, I'm really nervous for this. And we got there, and I, like, produced and directed all of their stuff, and we got an insane amount of social content, and that was
amazing. But I could have easily been like, I don't know how to do that. Yeah, this is too much. I feel like those opportunities are the ones where you're looking you almost want to have one foot out the door, because you're like, This is too stressful. It's creating too much anxiety for me. And then you finally double down and do it, and you're like, I'm super proud of what I did. Like, I can accomplish so much more. I had that in the bag the whole time.
And then you're like, Oh yeah, no question, yeah, it was really fun, but it was out of my comfort zone, yeah, for sure. I mean, that's what you got to do. That's how you grow. I feel like doing the same thing over and over again. We're not looking looking for challenges. It's not how we how we grow as people. It's not how we better our relationships. Getting on a podcast. I know that you are very uncomfortable doing this, but you did great.
The second thing, you were nervous about him working a long time, but I feel like you're ready to be a regular. So we appreciate you taking the time out of your busy schedule. We know that there's probably people around here want to sign autographs for natural childbirth, but the podcast will do we appreciate it. Thank you. Thanks. Ellie, thanks for everything. Listen to my favorite video. I trust my mama. You're no match for my bad karma. You.