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Listen to Skin Curies on America's number one podcast network, I Heart. Open your free I Heart app and search Skin Curies. BBC Sounds Music Radio Podcasts This week's episode of Miss Me contains very strong language, some very adult themes and lots of stuff in between. So just listen out for those things if you are easily offended. I'm in Italy, I'm in a lovely house that I've rented near the town city of Siena, which
is in Tuscany and it's absolutely glorious. The weather is beautiful, the food is delicious, the company is great, I cannot complain and I went to a vintage shop yesterday that I got some sick purchases at. No fuck off. Italy vintage shopping must be on a next level. Oh my god, I got like an old Gilles Sander Raffemanns era. No! Jacket. It's the best thing I've ever seen in my life. Okay. Do you want me to get it for you and just show you?
I'll send me a picture later. I'm sitting here in the rain and he sent me a picture later. Okay, okay. I think lounging in the sunshine in Italy has just done wonders. You're glowing. Thanks so much. Can I say that I got little jealous this week? I don't think I love when you go on holiday with other friends. Oh! That is me. I know what you mean. I was like, all right, well, having a good time. I was like, well, not too much of a good time. How much of a good time are you having?
I'm having a really good time. This is the interesting thing because this is the second leg of your Italian tour over the summer and this is with friends and not husband. I always feel like when you share a house with other couples, even though they're your best mates and yes, you see their life on Instagram, but that's when you really start to see how the dynamics between your friends in their relationships find it fascinating, actually. Well, you know, everyone's great. I'm really happy here.
Everyone's a children and charming. Oh, come on. You can't. I'm joking. Everyone's, actually, I'm having a really nice time. I am having a really nice time. How many kids, how many adults? There's four kids, five grown-ups. Lovely. And my kids are not here. They're with their dad in Wales, Shropshire, borders. And yeah, this is sort of my little, the last, it's not really the last leg because I'm going, coming back from Italy and going to... What's next?
London, again, for a few days and then I take my kids to summer camp in Massachusetts. And oh, and then I'm going to San Diego with my husband. And I'm going to LA to do some work. And then I'm going back to Massachusetts camp for the weekend, my kids camp, which I'm not looking for. Whoa. Yeah. You're joining camp. That's like the two that I'm having such a nice summer, but there's these two nights that are like staring at me from a month and a half away.
I can't feel like you deserve it after all these beautiful dreams. I know what you mean. I know what you mean, but me and a blow-up mattress, new think, whoo. Wow, soaking the sort of 16th century farmhouse you seem to be in today. I think I'll have to like get involved with sort of activities and things and I'm just really not looking forward to it. Oh my god, treat it like you're in the parent trap and just like really get involved for those two days.
Do you know I tried out for the parent trap? What's your in the film? The Lindsay Lohan version, yeah. I went for an audition for that. Oh, I would have been so fucked up if you'd got that. Imagine if I'd had Lindsay Lohan's career as a result of being in the parent trap. Yes, all life. How it would have ended up. Well, what a life you're having. Probably similar to how it is now. Yeah, it wouldn't be that different. No, I'm happy that you're summering.
Let's not forget how many summers for your whole life you've worked. So this is lovely. If you were in London living what we're all living, you would probably feel as kind of one says it's miss you. It's just so rare. It's just so rare. It's getting really like we can't talk about it anymore. So it's like this dark dirty secret that I want to discuss the weather. It's been a week of winning Labour Party one. I think Louis Hamilton won something. England won.
And that was actually a really beautiful game of football. Don't worry, I won't bore you with the details. No, I actually watched it because I'm one of the kids that I'm on holiday with is a football obsessive. And he was sitting on my side of the table and we went out for dinner at a restaurant. And it was quite a posh restaurant. And we were really excited. And we were like, good game. Shouting, you know, little moments of joy when we scored goals. And everyone else in the restaurant hated us.
Of course. I felt very like, let on to what we... It was quite fun. I told you if we started winning, I'd get involved. You said by the semis. By the semis you'd be invested. So welcome. Welcome to the Euros now, Lily. I'm out even by a shirt when I touch down in London town. So I'd like to talk about our new government. OK. Someone said to me, there is the potential for positivity and hope. So not actually positivity and hope, but the potential for positivity and hope. So I thought, OK.
So people are almost starting to feel something, maybe dent too. Wow, it's quite a lot of new energy. Did you listen to that podcast I told you to listen to the rest of politics where Angela Rainer was on and she talked all about her upbringing and how she was a carer for her mum from the age of 16. She didn't finish school. She had her kids very young. She was a grandmother, like in her early 30s, I think.
And she has come up against some true hardships and has made her way to the second most powerful position in government in such a relatively short period of time. And it's fucking impressive. And she said something about like, oh, I sort of had an opportunity and there was just one opportunity where I was able to create real change, but like nothing else yet. And I was like, oh, she's hungry. That is her intent. Her intent is to create change. She took a fucking kicking.
She was on the front covers of every paper nationally for what seemed like weeks because of some tax issues around her second property. And she was cleared by HMRC and we're great to Manchester police, I believe. It takes a strong person of any gender to survive that kind of vitriol and she's a woman and a relatively young woman. How do you think the press will be with her now that she has all this power? Do you think they'll just come for her harder? Of course.
But she doesn't strike me as someone who gives a shit. Should I read you some stats? Sion Abba is the first black mother. Mother of the house. Female mother of the house. David Lamy is the four-in-sector. He's in the cabinet. This is quite interesting. It is the most state school educated cabinet in history. 84% of the cabinet went to state schools and only two ministers went to private school. And this means that for the first time, the cabinet closely reflects British society.
Yeah, I also think it would be interesting because there's been such a focus and I suppose curiosity and concern about things like free school meals. And I feel like if there are people who genuinely have that life experience and have lived in that way, they'll have a completely different kind of approach to things like that. So private schools have, up to this point, been a VAT exempt and now they are not going to be a VAT exempt.
So that money will be funneled back into the state education system, which I have no view on. Yes, I have. But thank you for telling me, Steve. Pundit. More people in the cabinet who were born in the northeast than going to Eaton. However, ethnic representation has fallen. Record 89 minority ethnic MPs were elected to parliament overall. However, David Lamy, the foreign secretary will be the only black cabinet minister in the Starmer's government. Is it only, so it's only one?
I thought it was two. Wow. OK. I think what people feel is change. And I think change is a number of things, terrifying, exciting, hopeful and discombobulating. Discombobulating. Discombobulating. And my mum always said to me, when I used to say, I'm really worried about this. I'm really worried about that. She said, we're not using that word anymore. We're now going to say curious. I'm really interested to see what happens. Do you know what's crazy?
It's just crazy to think that there's a new government after 14 years. That just feels kind of like fresh in some way, like just change in that way. Just feels like, ooh, been quite an interesting way. The week, the first week of Labour actually, they're very much looking like they're doing all the things they said they would do. But you know, that's first week. I reckon six months until the tide turns and people start hating them. It's like a first date, right?
Like, this week has been like them showing us they're like, you know, most attractive side. Like, well, they're best pub. You even like, so you don't look like they did in their picture. But who knows what they'll be like by, you know, the end of the month, when they've worn the same underwear for a couple days in a row, fired in bed. Yeah, let's see what they're firing in bed. Let's see what happens when we're last days. What an incredible metaphor for today's government.
How's it going over a foot towers? Foot HQ. Everything going all right? Foot HQ. How is it going? I mean, it is going very well. Let's just keep it brief. Go on. What you got this? I don't know if we can, because it is quite a, it's been like a real eye opener. Obviously, like, after our podcast last week, it had been like, quite widely reported about me and my foray into content, creating feet content. And I've had, you know, a lot of disparaging, you know, horrible messages in my DMs.
Well, I've seen both. No, but I'm talking like really personal nasty. What kind of stuff? You're disgusting. You should be ashamed of yourself, aren't you embarrassed? Your children are going to see this. It seems to me what I'm taking from these mainly men is that women should only really be selling images of herself or access to her body when it is an absolute last resort. Like she's, you know, like, losing her home or being fired from her job or can't put food on her table.
I think it should be a sort of act of desperation rather than an honest way to make a living. I think it's like a socio-economic issue in a lot of ways. The fact that I'm making money from this podcast and that I'm in a relationship, which, by the way, you know, a relationship where my husband happens to support the choices that I make. I mean, I shouldn't be stooping so low as to be, you know, profiting from my own body, right?
But also there's also, it comes with this sort of wave of autonomy, which I think makes people feel uncomfortable, because it is, it's all you, you're doing it and the reward is coming back to you. And there is no other person in charge. I think that's it. And I think that, first of all, I have to like, you know, I've had quite a lot of people that work in this industry from people that, you know, make foot content to people on the complete other end of the spectrum of like sex work, right?
And everything in between. And I think, first of all, I have to state my position of privilege, right? I feel completely comfortable and uncompromise in taking pictures of my feet and putting them up on this website and charging people for the pleasure of being able to look at them. But I'm also fully aware that I can walk away from that at any moment when it becomes not so cute or not so fun. A lot of people are not able to do that. It's their only source of income.
And they are marginalised within society because of it. I actually put up a picture of my feet in Rome with a Trevy fountain in the background and linked it to my foot page. And I was slapped by Instagram with a solicitation notice and it was taken down. And I went and looked at the sort of tees and seas of what was, you know, allowed and what wasn't. And I thought, actually, this doesn't infringe on any of those.
Could someone in theory send a link to their, I don't know, Etsy page or their absolute page or their? Absolutely. But because it links to this particular website, which is associated with adult entertainment or, you know, sex work, I think there's an automatic, you know, take it down. Anyway, however, I contested it and it got put back up again. But I think I am very much in the minority.
I think most of these women are marginalised, they have very little power in the world and their accounts are deleted, you know, like they are not able to advertise anywhere. So I think that you're right. It's an issue of the woman profiting from it herself because let's be honest, there are women on Instagram posing in bikinis posing in their underwear, pouting for the camera, puppy dog eyes.
And as long as their link or whatever they're selling has a sort of middleman, so if it's like a single that they're promoting or a link to a fashion retailer or, you know, my tours just gone on sale, that's fine. That's okay. As soon as that money is coming directly into that person's bank account, for that content, there's an issue. We're not having that. We're not having that. And I think that, I think that that is wrong.
It's interesting how much it's, it's in very much it's, it's, how much it's, riled people up. Truly. I was quite surprised. I mean, this is, it's like sex is a commodity, right? It is a resource. Men need to have access to women's bodies, not only just for their gratification, but because, you know, continuation of our species depends on it.
And I think that ultimately women could actually be more powerful than men if they were allowed to monetise access to their own bodies without fear, without shame, without it being so dangerous. I, why are we making it so hard for women to profit over something that could put them ahead? It's interesting that you say that because we are all in the same game every day anyway on Instagram. Exactly. And it's just got a different coat on.
And I think maybe it's like linked to what we were talking about in our virginity episode. It's like, why is there so much shame around women and virtue and purity? Yeah. Is it all because there's just this huge conspiracy to stop women from being able to profit from her body, which is something that, you know, a lot of men in the world want free access to or they want to be able to oppress. Do you know what I mean? It's nice to have autonomy in your sex life.
Yes, it's actually very important to have autonomy in your sex life. Yes, and even, and in your sex business, but let's not call it a sex business. You're talking about me. Well, me being a sex worker. I actually don't mind. I did think that I was kind of uncomfortable with people referring to it as coming under that umbrella, but I think that's part of the like patriarchal shame associated with it. Yes, absolutely.
And I think it also leads into me, because I told you I want to talk about masturbation today. And I thought to myself, oh, I'm a bit embarrassed to talk about that. And I thought, why am I embarrassed to talk about that when I have grown up with men talking really loudly and really overtly about whanking and that being part of their life and a kind of right of passage and something to be really vocal about and proud of, actually. And it's kind of part of your identity on your young teenage boy.
But for me, it was shrouded in secrecy and disgust. You know that I never even wanted to do it until you bought me a vibrator. Yeah, thanks for liberating me. Very pleasure. And I was asking some people today about like the ages that they started masturbating. And it seems to me too, Cancer. It seems to be like a camp of people who accidentally stumbled upon being able to pleasure themselves. It's sort of like 9, 10, 11.
And then the other group of people that I'm talking to sort of people that discovered it in their teens or their 20s. I didn't start masturbating until I was in my 30s till you got me the vibrator. I actually got it for me in my 20s and I was terrified of it for about five years. No, we were in our 30s. I started in my 30s too. I started. No. After I'd had kids. But you were like 20 and that, oh, okay. Right, like after Dan. No, after I started when I was with Sam. Sorry. Oh, yes. Sorry.
I started it in my marriage. Because of him, it was just like I was on a, you know, path of like sexual liberation and discovery and so. But how do you feel talking about that? And I was on tour. That was it. Because I went away on tour. It was after I'd had money and I was on tour for long periods of time and I was horny as fuck. Um, about also you had a past of like not having an orgasm for such a long time. Or till you were later in life. So I feel like you and I were a bit more.
Like I didn't. I had an orgasm when I was young early in my first relationship. But you didn't for a long time. So I was quite surprised that you were so open to the world of pleasureing yourself. Because I thought that whole world just freaked you out. No, I mean, now when I've started coming, I was like, hello, everyone I need. We need to talk about this. Everyone needs to be doing this all the time. All the time. All the time. Everyone was like, no, we know that. I know.
Well, it was like famous saying who was it? It was like, why would you have sex? What do you can do the real thing on your own? Yes, for that. I say, I say dangerous sentence. Is it? What? Interesting. You use danger, why? Because propagation of the species needs to stay intact. What was that film called? There was a film. And it actually made me even a TV show with Michael Sheen called Masters of Sex or something.
And a Masters of Sex was about that professor who did like a sort of investigation into people's sexual habits in the 50s. Right. The great professor he decided like in the 50s to ask people really honest conversations about the way they have sex and sexual pleasure. And it was like groundbreaking. But then there was also another film that's about what doctors did to women to stop them masturbating in like the sort of the 1800s or something.
Yeah. It was very much seen as something that was, you know, almost a despicable habit for women. I think that they like only started doing like proper scientific studies on literal pleasure like relatively recently like in the late 70s or 80s. Like really? I think you can say like naughty. No, but I mean like, like when you're like, yeah, since the beginning of time.
So that means in the 70s we weren't allowed to have a mortgage without a husband and a man signing and we weren't allowed to masturbate and have any female pleasure. That was quite recent. Yeah. Why would you have sex and then you could do the real thing? That's why I started because I was seeing that asshole and I was like, I just need to go see him and you're like, why do you need to see him? And I was like, just really quickly.
You just need to go see him and you were like, do you just want to have sex with him? I was like, yes, I just need to have sex with him. And you were like, use that thing I got you. And the minute you realized that you don't need him for that, you will never see him again and I did it. And it worked and I never saw him again. I was like, oh, do not need you anymore. You're fine. And it actually, you know what, it actually set off voluntary celibacy for a few years.
I was like, I don't want to have sex. I just want to focus on my career. How can I do that? Oh, yeah, I've got this thing. I actually saw Julia Fox talking about voluntary celibacy. So do we sell it? It's very interesting. Because I think there's like a wave, like a movement of girls in America, young women who are taking a, like an oath of celibacy in reaction to row versus wave not being reinstated. Wow. So they're like, okay. Wow. You don't want to give us our reproductive rights.
You're not having sex with you. Whoa. That's powerful. Very powerful. It's very powerful. Have you ever done it? Involuntary celibacy. Sorry. Voluntary celibacy. Involuntary celibacy. Yeah, definitely done some involuntary celibacy. I just dropped it. I called it a dry patch though. No. But it was really interesting. I watched the documentary about this woman who was the first black female model agent and turned into sort of a behemoth of the industry in New York from the 70s onwards.
And she did it for 10 years while she built her business. Wow. I thought, oh God. That's quite a commitment. But it's something very interesting happens when you take sex out of your life because you want to. And everything becomes kind of laser focused.
You realize how much sex and just the games of sex, whether you're having sex or sort of having sex or flirting or dating, all those things, they just, they take up time and energy and if you really want to focus on something else, it really works. It really does work. But I'm over that now. I've done that. How long has it been? All right, let's have a break. I'll see you in a minute. Tamp check. What kind of summer are we having this year?
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Give it a try at midmobile.com slash switch. $45 upfront for three months plus taxes and fees, promoting for new customers for limited time, unlimited more than 40 gigabytes per month, slows, fullterms at mintmobile.com. I was working with my mother a lot this week. God, we have the worst fight of all time, Mr. Linner. I had to do that thing. We have to literally drag the love from the bottom of your feet up to the top of your mouth and apologize.
The reason I had to apologize, no, because I love my mum and I'm trying to be a bit of human being. But the second reason I apologize is because we had a lot of work together this week and I was like, this just isn't going to work. If, as she said, she couldn't stand to be anywhere near me. Which is up to me. It's what you said to me, Mill. But so I asked, but they're up to today. Sorry, mum. I love you and I meant every word.
But one of the jobs we were interviewing, one of the work days, we were interviewing Adjuu Wattando, who plays Lady D'Ambri in Bridgerton, what a woman. She is 61. She's the same age as my mother. And they are both from the countryside, outside of towns in England, growing up as the only black person in their area in the 70s. And they both discovered punk and it changed their lives. So they were just having a great time. But they were also talking about the marginalisation of women over 50.
Oh, for 50 and all. That's 10 years away, Lily. 10 years. That's going to go so quick. And it's going to go like that. And I doubt we'll feel much different. Yeah, we will, because we'll be on age, Adjuu Tee. Oh, God. Is there any way that men and women happens often? Is it definitely, does it ever happen at 60, or is it between 45 and 60? You are asking the wrong person.
I do know that I started googling HRT last night, because somebody that I know is on it and they said it's a real game changer. Is it someone that you know that's our age? No, a bit older. Not that much older. Yeah, because I mean, maybe I have a different fit because I haven't had kids yet. But it is starting to trickle into my thoughts quite a lot. I'm thinking like, OK, so like what? Like four years, maybe five. Maybe that's still right. Maybe less.
Apparently, it can be dangerous to start taking HRT when you're over 60s. If you are going to go that route, then you want to start doing it. I'll see you in a little later. I've already ordered mine. Have we not? Have we just not? Like, I'm trying to have like a real summer of sex and love. I don't even know what my HRT plans. Hang on, you're going to have the men of pause and still be having sex. Yes, absolutely. And you can also fall in love. But I do want to have a baby.
So that needs to be in the next sort of three or four years. God, that's so intensely soon. But we do know a lot more now. My poor parents, my mother, and Nana, auntie Nana, test blind, blind. And my grandma states that she doesn't believe the men pause like this. She thinks it's a state of mind. State of mind. Mind over matter. I was like, now that you can't mind over the men of pause, she's like, yes. So they were just all clueless.
And of course, we now have this incredible environment with people like Davina McCall, yes, Davina, making television shows and radio shows and documentaries and constantly telling people more and more, which is just like we just never had that before. So do you feel like you know quite a lot about what to expect? When you're not expecting. I don't actually. I sort of like zone out. It's one of those things where it's just like, no, no, no, not for me, not for me, not for me.
Just Alison, yeah, she's, you know, got the goods. I don't know if you like talk about people being on HRT. Yeah. Okay, my mom's on HRT. It's fine, my mom's proud of it. My mom's really proud of her HRT. She never shuts up about it because it's, I think at one point it becomes such a life saver that you, you want to discuss it and so much of menopause is shrouded in secrecy. So it is their job and now ours, Lil, to take that shame away.
Like I don't think you need to start talking to Marmy and Ethel right now about the menopause. God, I've still got to have the proper sex talk with them. That reminds me, Jesus. Have you talked to them about masturbation? Yeah. Wow. I've talked to one of them about masturbation, but only because we were on the subject of sex and I was like, you know, talking about having sex with boys and then I, and I just said, there's no pressure to have sex with a boy.
Like your, you know, the reason that people have sex is because they want to feel good, right? They want to feel good with somebody else, but you can make yourself feel good on your own. You don't need to have somebody else in the equation. Marmy was like, Marmy, I thought, I thought, well, you would tell Ethel the old one. I thought, but you'd probably tell Marmy first, wouldn't you? I feel like she should know first. Little adventurous thing.
And she was like, oh, something to ponder, Marmy, thank you. We should probably mention that not only did Lily give me my first vibrator and awaken masturbation in my life in my 30s, she also supplied many to the women around the country because you did a line of, I was going to say, masturbators, vibrators. Clips are all stimulators. And they were great. I think we can talk about it because they're not on sale anymore, so it's not promoting. But yes, I did a line of clitoral stimulators.
And they were very, very successful. People loved them. You gave me one, the whole family got one. Yeah. Lots of people there. I gave them lots of messages still. Yeah, I'll see what I think to do though, as someone that didn't have an orgasm until, like, later on in their life. And that's what I mean. I was like, guys. Let me tell you about this. I'm going to make a toy. I'm going to make a toy. I'm going to make a toy. I think someone's done that. OK, well, I'm still going to make a toy.
I'm going to plaster my face all over this thing. It's quite funny. I still go into, there's like a sex shop on Oxford Street. There is. And up until about six months ago, I'd go in there and there'd be like this big cardboard cutout. No way. Just checking it out. The face of female sexual pleasure. Check you the fuck out. Yeah. How full circle is that? Good for you. Well, did you bring your vibrator on holiday? Did I bring my vibrator to Italy? Yeah. Did. But you know what?
I think it must have been set off in my suitcase because I tried to turn it on early on today. And it run out of batteries. But luckily, I had a battery operated little in my wash bag that I bought at the airport for about 18 pounds. I did the trick. But my worst nightmare is insecurity. It going off and vibrating through that bit. That happened to me several times. Yeah. It's so embarrassing. Oh, it's amazing.
I was like, no. Someone else Lauren told me it happened with her and her dad and I was just like mortifying. Like, yeah. Yeah. Yeah. No. Yes. No. Imagine like me and Chloe. Lauren, what's that? Anyway. The sun is coming and I'm going to see you. I actually really miss you. Don't have too much fun with those other people. Don't worry. No danger of that. Okay, good. I will see you in real life this weekend. I can't wait. We're celebrating our cousin's 40th. Oh, yeah. Flipping for God's sake.
I need to get her a birthday present in like the first two hours of Saturday morning because obviously... Can you get something from Italy? No. I think I'll get her some. No, don't talk about it. She's an avid miss me, listen. And this goes out. Oh, shit. Yeah. For her birthday. So just, just, just, just, just, I'll call you after. I'm really happy that you're there. The house looks fantastic. Like, I have to say, it's incredibly beautiful here. It really looks it.
I want you to go and enjoy your last few days there. I'm really so cut up. Because you're going to be busy, busy. I do feel very much like I am winning at life right now. I've got to say. We're all winners today. Go enjoy your holiday. I love you. I'll see you in real life this weekend. I'll see you for a little bit on Monday. God. Bye! Bye! Thanks for listening to Miss Me with Lily Allen and a Makita Oliver. This is a Persephoneica production for BBC Sounds. Exciting times, Ellis. Oh, is it?
Why? Well, our brand new podcast is here. Two releases a week and we get to leave behind the shackles of live radio and draconian vaping laws of broadcasting house. Ellis, we are the pioneers of digital Britain, grasping the opportunity to redefine the audio landscapes through powerful, impactful, dynamic conversation. You and I will inspire the next generation of free thinkers. What are your aims and aspirations for this new dawn? I'll try to arrive on time and not eat mongoone. You know what?
I'll take that. The Ellis James and John Robbins podcast. Outdone Tuesdays and Fridays. Listen, on BBC Sounds. Hey, I hear you think podcasts are all about true crime, huh? Well, wise guy, the I Heart Radio apps got all kinds of podcasts. We got stuff you should know and stuff they don't want you to know. We got Bobby Bones, Big Boy and Lou Later. We got SpongeBob, Binge Pants, and exotic erotic story time. We got Doe Boys, two dudes in a kitchen, Green Eggs and Dan. Hey, we got Elf Quest.
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