My partner who's not here, but he wanted me to tell you that Isaac Shelby is one of his great great great grandparents, as is f from McDowell.
Yeah, Isaac Shelby's candlesticks are in this room over here.
Stop it now. Every governor leaves.
Something in the mansion, and they were silversmith's and so his candlesticks.
Are right in there.
That's amazing.
He's our first governor.
And then he came back in the War of eighteen twelve because he was an actual.
General and they needed a governor who was a general.
How extraordinary. Well, there we are. So that's my Batucky connection.
That's a good one.
Hello, I'm mini driver. I've always loved Proust's questionnaire. It was originally in nineteenth century parlor game where players would ask each other thirty five questions aimed at revealing the other player's true nature. In asking different people the same set of questions, you can make observations about which appear to be universal. And it made me wonder, what if these questions were just the jumping off point, what greater depths would be revealed if I asked these questions as
conversation starters. So I adapted Prue's questionnaire and I wrote my own seven questions that I personally think are pertinent to a person's story. They are when and where were you happiest? What is the quality you like least about yourself? What relationship, real or fictionalized, defines love for you? What question would you most like answered, What person, place, or experience has shaped you the most? What would be your last meal? And can you tell me something in your
life that's grown out of a personal disaster? And I've gathered a group of really remarkable people, ones that I am honored and humbled to have had the chance to engage with. You may not hear their answers to all seven of these questions. We've whittled it down to which questions felt closest to their experience, or the most surprising, or created the most fertile ground to connect.
My guest today on many questions is the Governor of Kentucky, Andy Busheer. Governor Vasher is currently serving his second term, and his father, Steve, was also Governor of Kentucky. Andy Busheer is an all too rare example of how the schism between left and right can actually be bridged. He
is a Democrat in a predominantly Republican state. He is a deacon of his church with a strong faith, who is also pro choice, And in these challenging times where it feels like there needs to be a new, more extreme word for partisanship, it's encouraging to see leadership that holds on to its values whilst also speaking to and
serving all the people that represents. Governor Basheer has steered Kentucky through COVID, the deadly tornado and flooding of twenty twenty one and twenty twenty two, respectively, and most recently the terrible flooding that happened in the state last week. I so enjoyed talking to him and was galvanized by the reminder that calm, strong leadership that listens and so still exists. Can you tell me when and when you are happiest.
I am happiest when I'm with my kids and my wife, and that's saying something because my kids are now teenagers. I have a fifteen and a fourteen year old, but their births changed my life forever. I was a practicing attorney. We were doing well, but just looking at those two kids a year and three days apart. It definitely gave me motivation that what I leave to them has to
be more than just financial support. It has to be a better world, a country that's not broken, and that really motivated me for the way that my life changed. They give me purpose every day. They're both so smart and such interesting human beings. Just being around them when they're willing to be around me, now.
Even they're both teenagers, is pretty special.
Do you find because I know I have this with my son, who is interested in theater and is a really good actor, but there's an interesting relationship between him and it because of what I do for the thing. And I wonder that when you see your children and you observe like who they are.
Like, do.
You see the lawyer in them? Do you see the politician in them? Do you go goodness? Or is it free wheeling and you're kind of letting them tell you who they are.
Well, they get asked about it a lot, because of course my dad was governor, and well of course first father son set of governors in Kentucky's history, and so they get that question. Maybe they even get that pressure from folks. But right now, it seems like they both want to pursue their own paths.
I want to be supportive of whatever path they choose.
My son, I think, has gotten a little more interested in it over time. He ran for Beta Club vice president for the state and one which was pretty incredible because in high school I ran for everything and lost every time. And I think part of it is I didn't have my why. You know, the why you're running, the authentic why that I think is so important, not
just in politics, but in leadership. It was what I thought I was supposed to do, and so I would run, and if there were three people running, i'd come in fourth. But they always say you shouldn't peak too early.
By the way, I think that being humbled early in your chosen field is actually integral to finding your way in it. I actually think it's necessary because you have to keep choosing it.
I tell Henry that a lot.
Actually, so there's no such thing as failure because it's all your journey to whatever it is that you are choosing to do.
I think that's right.
And I also think that it helps you to have a smaller ego and to not get eaten up by what your profession is. You know, you see a lot of people who are in elected offices that get in there and they get so eaten up by the partisanship that that becomes what they do instead of trying to come in every day and create that better world for your people.
I know it's a really tough question, but in terms of happiness and kind of where we are, how do you approach that the schism between what someone else's happiness looks like and what someone else's happiness looks like and where sort of where we are in the world.
You know, you're leading a.
State of very very different people from eastern and western Kentucky, you know, from the urban areas to the deeply rural, Like, how do you speak to the schism of different happiness?
Hey, you start with the recognition that when people wake up in the morning, they're not thinking about politics.
They're not thinking about.
Their party, and they're not thinking about the next election. They're thinking about their job and whether they make enough to support their family. They're thinking about their next doctor's appointment for themselves, their parents, their kids, and they're thinking about the roads and bridges they drive every day, and think about the school they drop their kids off at, and they're thinking about whether they feel safe.
In their community.
If you don't feel secure in those areas, now, it's hard.
To be happy.
It's hard to reach other things that people argue about that divide people. But those more areas are how I govern, and they speak to everyone. You know, the goal of governing shouldn't be to make Democrats better off or Republicans better off.
It should be to make everybody better off.
And when you provide opportunity, when you open a new hospital, when you open a road that saves somebody twenty minutes each way on a commute, now that gives them more time to make those memories with their families that improve
their happiness. So what I've seen is being a Democrat in a state that typically votes heavily Republican, but having a really high approval rating is about, you know, first that focus that these are the things that matter the most in your life, and we're going to make sure that we spend eighty percent of our time there. But I think the second piece is you've got to talk to people and not at them. You've got to listen to make sure that we're all using the same vocabulary.
I mean, we've gotten into sanitize advocacy speak in so many different areas, Like we use the term substance, use discory order for addiction. Right, everybody I know that's gone through addiction calls it addiction. People that are hungry are hungry, They're not food insecure. And so when we start using these terms, we lose the meaning and the emotion, and we're talking about folks that are going through something very difficult and emotional. And then I think the last pieces
is sharing your why. And for me, that's my faith. And so when I make a decision that other people might disagree with, especially one of these hot culture war type issues, I try to tell people.
Why and genuinely why I made the decisions.
So when I was running for reelection, our legislature passed the nastiest anti LGBTQ plus bill that we'd ever.
Seen, and I vetoed it.
And I vetoed it because I believe that all children are children of God, and I didn't want anybody picking on those kids. And a whole general Assembly was picking on those kids that already far too many people pick on. I wanted them to know that their governor had their back.
So I explained it that way, and the next day I remember somebody walking up to me and I thought, oh, I know what's coming, and instead he stuck out his hand and I shook it, and he said, I'm not sure I agree with you, but I know you're doing what you think is right. And so if we can get there as people, not just in politics, because sometimes right now just the background of politics is keeping people
from speaking and being good neighbors. But if we can get to that, why at least we can understand each other a little bit better.
Yes, I agree completely.
The fundamental tenets of being a human being are fundamental regardless of your politics, for sure.
And I think when you said human being, what's missing right now out of our federal government is humanity.
I couldn't agree with you more.
It's a lack of empathy or really even sympathy. I mean, to have people that are being laid off, veterans, people who have.
Given service to the minds to this country.
And then you can understand sometimes if you need to downsize something, but to be gleeful about it, to tell them it's their fault, to dance around on stage with the chainsaw during it, it's just mean and it's cruel, and that's not how our government should act.
It is so extraordinarily in conflict in that none of it makes any sense. There's no follow through with the cruelty. It seems cruel for cruelty's sake. In the moment, I don't believe that that is sustainable. I think that it is taking a sledgehammer right now. But it's impossible to gut this many lives and for that not to be ramifications for that. So I hope the midterms are a reflection of the American people experiencing what everybody has been experiencing since this administration began.
And it's not who people are. Yeah, we're absolutely we're not through flooding again. And what I see every time during and after our whole group of people inside someone's house helping the mucket out and dry it out. And most of those people haven't even started on their own house. They're going to start with their neighbor, showing that humanity. You're going to see people that have never had someone
walk up and offer to help. You're going to see people take shifts in the public school that's open with cots for people to have a warm place to stay. If there is a bright side to having been through so many natural disasters. It's that you see people are fundamentally good kind that don't like cruelty, and I think the country's going to wake up and ultimately reject what we're seeing.
I agree with you, I ready do.
What is the quality you like least about yourself?
I will admit I am pretty self critical, and I carry mistakes with me for decades.
Sometimes they're funny, but I still carry them.
During the pandemic, I remember having someone walk in who was helping us with unemployment because so many people needed the help and our system, which was older than I am, was getting overwhelmed. And he told me somebody had applied for benefits under the name too Pak Shakurt. And I heard that and I got all angry, and I went out to my daily update and I said, I can't believe this is happening. People are trying to take advantage
of us at a time that's so difficult. I can't believe somebody filed for benefits under the name Tupac Shakurd. Well turns out there was a guy in Lexington and his name is court h and he's he's a good guy. And I found out about it that night right after I'd said it in front of millions of people.
Wow. I mean I.
Basically run over it. I hadn't intended to, but I still had. And so I called him that night and I said I'm sorry, and he was very graceful about it. It is very supportive, even with all of this and all the text messages and calls he'd been getting.
So what did I do The next day?
I walked out, looked at the same cameras and said, I'd made a mistake. And even though that made some late night TV shows, that's not how I thought I'd be on Jimmy Kimmel. I still to think about the fact that I cause that individual pain, and I just wish I could go back in time and have taken an extra breath. Knowing that that's a human being who, at least for that period of time, probably felt pretty bad about what his governor had said about him.
Well, I think that that's all any of us can do right is own our errors. I was having a conversation with my son the other day and saying, it really is, if you do it with your whole heart and you really are sorry, it doesn't need to go any further. You don't have to keep on fighting, and you don't have to keep on carrying it with you if you've really said that you're sorry.
I think I.
Think that's true personally. I also think it's true politically. I mean, we've seen, whether it's this administration or some others, make some real mistakes, but you rarely see somebody come forward and say we messed up another weren't.
When we're talking about the tariffs and the president is saying that they are negotiable, and then his chief of staff or his pressure is coming out saying they are absolutely categorically non negotiable. There's no follow through, there's no accountability, and that, as I said before, I just don't believe that that is sustainable. And I think we have to keep trusting in the American experiment and that it is an experiment, and that the pendulum has just swung very far to the right.
Well, and I think a lot of people out there feel that the pendulum maybe was too far to the left and now is too far to the right.
Now most of them just wanted to stop.
Yeah, I agree, to.
Be able to go on vacation with their family and not have to turn on the news.
And say what happened now?
And I think the way that we pushed through this faster isn't some voice from the Democratic Party.
It's everybody's voice together.
Yeah.
It's taking a picture of how much more your bill is at the grocery store and posting it with your story. If you've been laid off from the federal government, you were doing a great job. You were serving your country, telling your story. It's all those collective voices together that I think can make such a difference.
Groundswell, I agree.
Can you tell me about something that has grown out of a personal disaster.
This one's a hard one for me because tomorrow is the two year anniversary that I lost my friend.
Tommy in a shooting. So it was sorry.
It was hard and to have to be governor when you're headed to the scene instead of being a friend. To have to call his widow because no one else would. Once I got the information, and actually tell somebody you know and care about that their husband is gone. It's one of the hardest things I've ever done in my life. I can still see in my head where I was standing when I made that call. There's a room in the hospital that we went to where she was that I just can't walk in it just it is too painful.
And this was such a great friend.
Remember how we met, which was funny in and of itself. We'd gone up to something and Frankfurt, we were both living in Louisville, hadn't met, but we're on the same trip, and somebody came in and just blasted my dad, not knowing I was in the room, and he left and we all burst out laughing because it was so uncomfortable, and started a conversation.
Ended up saying we want.
To get everybody together to go to dinner the next week, And it turned out we lived four houses away, and we didn't find that out until we were at dinner. I became my banker, I became his lawyer. We built a lot of all of this together. But what I'll say is I get to take the best parts of him,
which were kindness and acceptance. I've formed a stronger relationship with his kids, and maybe a little more sympathy and empathy for others that have gone through tragedy and have lost people, especially under really difficult circumstances.
The thing about.
Grief is it can creep up on you so fast. I mean, there are some days where this feels like it happened twenty years ago and some days where it feels like it happened twenty minutes ago. You know, trauma and grief, you can be taken right back to the moment that you got the first text that something was happening, that you got in the car going as fast as you could that on the tenth time that you're trying your friend and they can't pick up that, you start knowing.
And then when you look at the officer that you know there and you ask the question, you can just you can see it in their eyes. It can grab you again pretty quickly. But also now being able to recognize that and other people you know, Sydney Clove that ever wanted to be a part of. But when you are, your ability to be there for other people that are going through tough times is maybe you're just a little bit better at it because you're going through it.
Absolutely.
I think that is the great gift of grief, is that there is someone who can walk with you through it, who has been through it as well, and that once you've experienced it yourself, you can offer that grace and that service and that love to someone else because you're right. Grief it no, it has no sense of time. It
can feel just like yesterday or twenty years ago. It's interesting I wrote about when losing my mum, and I learned about how to show up for the pain through writing about it, and have definitely passed that on to friends of mine, just the little things of how do
we accommodate the agony of unbearable loss. So again I feel like Feather, you had to show up for your friend under terrible circumstances, but also as a leader, and you can give good counsel, you know, as a result of that, which is truly amazing and truly when I ask this question, the idea of things that grow out of our agonies are personal agonies.
There is growth.
Maybe that's the blessing and that's the gift.
Well, it's always really important to me that someone's life is not defined by their death.
That we don't let.
One horrible moment cloud all the incredible memories, the fun memories that you had of your mom or I had of my friend. I want to make sure that ninety nine percent of the time I'm thinking about Tommy, I'm thinking about all those great memories and just teaching me to treasure every single one of them because life's short and our job is to be kind to each other and to do good things.
Yeah, I agree, be kind to each other and do good things. Can you tell me what relationship, real or fictionalized, defines love for you?
Well, i'd say too.
First, my wife and I just celebrated our nineteenth anniversary.
Oh congratulations, Wow, thank you.
I could not be more blessed. She is is incredible, She is patient. She has gone through this entire journey at my side, or I've gone through this entire journey.
At her side.
She fights harder for me, and I fight harder for her than anybody else in this world. When we had our kids, two kids very quickly. Her parents live in California, so a long way from Kentucky, and my parents were serving as governor and first Lady at the time, So it was just us trying to make it in the very first house that we'd own. But having to go through that together, having to build out our lives together, make all of our friends together, has been so special,
and I think why our relationship is so strong. We don't like being a part even we have to take trips with one of the kids, or to go somewhere more than a couple of days is.
Just too much for me. She's kind of my anchor in this.
World and what keeps me stable and able to process all the difficult things we're dealing with right now.
Sure, so when you decided to run for a second term, like, is that a conversation because essentially you're doing it together, you're both She's coming back to the governor's mansion, like your family is going to be there again. Like do you sit down at the kitchen table and go, Okay, I want to do this again, And where do you stand?
Yes, these decisions you make together from the start. Yeah, if you don't, you're going to have a very unhappy life at home. But the sacrifices that Brittany and my kids make are greater.
Than the sacrifices that I have to make.
How their lives are impacted, how some kids or people will look at them just because of me or our party. There's no question that they give up a lot and then they go through a lot just to be a part. But they do feel like a part. They're proud of the things we've done together. I mean, we've created more jobs than any other administration in history, more private sector investment.
We broke our ex sports record. You know, we're.
Booming here, and so we as a family get to be that there's a better life not just for my kids, but everyone else's kids in Kentucky right now, more opportunities than we've ever seen before, and so I try to encourage them all to be a part of that, but also got to give them the space to choose what they want to do, what public events they want to be a part of, to make sure that that's working for.
Their life as well.
But the other place that I see that love, and we just talked about it, is love for your neighbor. And to me, that's that golden rule, and I just see it playing out. Whether it was after tornadoes in twenty twenty one nearly wiped out my dad's hometown of Dawson Springs entirely hit Mayfield in a way that I think the country had never seen before. After flooding took
forty five lives six months later in eastern Kentucky. Just to see other Kentuckians, the rest of the country and the world pour out their hearts, give dollars to try to help bring resources in at a level that we never seen before. I mean that love that you show to someone that you don't know. That's pretty incredible. That you're willing to take your time and or your resources and help a fellow human being solely because they're suffering, And that's really special.
It is incredibly special, And it must also really hit maybe harder for you who lives in a world of partisanship in the country with really a two party system, to see what makes politics subordinate, which is the best of who we are as people, The kindness, the compassion to.
Be reminded of that as you lead.
That's what gives me faith better parts of our humanity is what will eventually lead us back to a hope being more together in this world, less separate, less disparate. But yeah, it's nice to hear a leader talk about that kindness.
It grounds your leadership too.
It's pretty easy to brush off the political attack of the day when you're standing with someone looking at what you see to be their house and they're trying to figure out what's the first step to take. But when you've been through a number of these I'm now in the position where I can put my arm around them and say, you're going to make it, but you're not going to do it alone. You're going to have so many people that you know and so many that you don't.
They're going to rally around you and help rebuild this life, this building, this business. We've seen it over and over and I wish my people didn't have to go through it over and over. But that's also love. I mean, it's an incredible expression of love. After the tornadoes, we opened a fund and people gave fifty two million dollars to help rebuild, so we were.
Able to pay for every funeral.
We were able to give people help right away on top of FEMA, and now we're building new neighborhoods in eastern Kentucky.
We are almost through every.
Family that lost their home, every family that's in need, and that's only because of the love of so many people pouring out to help our communities.
Wow, amazing. So what would be your last meal?
Oh?
So right now, I've developed a little bit of an allergy to red meat that I'm working through. You know, I live in Kentucky and so I miss Dake and Hamburger so much. But I'm trying to do that healthy thing and get through it. I think it's going to take about another year. But if it was my last meal, I think that would be okay.
Yes, I agree.
But if it's your last.
Meal, do you want just one thing or do you want like a steak wrapped in pizza which may sound gross, But if it's the last time you're going to get a chance, then then maybe you do that and then you fry it.
Wait a minute, steak wrapped in pizza and then you fry it.
It's last meal. You don't have to worry about the calories at all.
If it's still very Scottish in Scotland deep for our year, elbow and make it taste good.
It must be Scotch and bourbon exactly.
There you go.
That's that's the connection and the connections with both.
And you know a lot of Scotch is now being aged in bourbon barrels, so a really strong connection.
Oh my gosh, is that true. That's really interesting. Oh I would like to try that.
You know, these tariffs don't just cause the price of the product to go up, but ultimately they cost the price of that barrel to go up. It makes the costs on making Scotch that much higher.
Yeah, I mean, I'm quite apart from what will happen for the consumer in America, what happens with the rebouncing of like the economic topography of the world with China now joining with Japan and South Korea. Like what he has set in motion is without precedent and without thought for any kind of collective future.
It feels in what it does to our global security.
Yeah.
You look at Canada, which.
Has been more of the closest allies and friends of the United States, has followed us into every every situation we've been in, even when maybe they shouldn't have, and this president is kicking them and is demeaning them. You look at Europe and how critical that relationship is for global security. And you've got a vice president on signal talking badly about Europe, and then you just gave an
incredible example. Two of our most important allies are Japan and South Korea, and to drive them to China first, that's very difficult to do, but he just did it exactly.
That's what's extraordinary.
It's you know, again, unprecedented. But what will that mean for global economic security?
It may go back to that same thing, that lack of sympathy, empathy, or humanity, because we are safer and better off when our allies are also doing well too. Yes, so a strong America is better with a strong Europe, a strong Japan, a strong South Korea. I mean that makes us all better off. And the idea of global security is based on alliances where you actually have.
To be nice to each other, exactly work together. You have to want good outcomes for everyone.
We've gone full circle back to the idea of being a good neighbor, of being a kind neighbor. And I mean how this administration is treating Canada is a fair indication of how they see being neighborly. I know I've repeated this is the third time I've said it, but I simply don't believe that that kind of incoherent thinking and follow through with insane policy is sustainable. I don't, And I think that people are better than that and
kinder than that in their hearts. Can you tell me what person, place, or experience most altered your life.
Well, I have incredible parents, and I was really lucky and blessed growing up.
I think about the things that pushed.
Me even when you asked me the earlier question about what is the thing about yourself?
Yeah, your quality like least Well, I.
Think I got the self critical for my dad, and I got some stubbornness from my mom, and both have helped me succeed. And both my parents are still with us, which is a blessing, and they're still together, going strong.
But just to be lucky enough in this world to be raised in a household with two loving parents that want to invest in you, that want you to have the best education, and are supportive of you even now, Even now, when something happens, when I've got something challenging, I call my parents and I listen to their thoughts. It doesn't mean that that's what I'm ultimately going to do, but just to have that relationship, and they do the.
Same with me.
I actually never intended to get into politics. My dad had lost a governor's race in nineteen eighty seven.
I was ten years old, and it was just devastating.
This is superman in your life, and how could people not want to vote for him.
He'd been the rising star.
He's younger than I am right now, and I just I still remember in that hotel room sitting on that bed and my dad looking over.
And sant it was going to be all right.
This was the toughest moment of his professional career, and he spent it telling me that everything was going to be all right. And then that moment still sticks with me. Nineteen eighty seven, he lost a race that he should have won. In two thousand and seven, he decides to run because no one else will in a race he should have no shot at winning.
And I went to work.
You know, I was thirty at the time, and my wife and I were the campaign in the largest city in Kentucky. That's where we started in our one and a half bedroom home, trying to build out that part of the campaign. And he won, and he achieved this dream that he thought was dead. And so to just I thought the thing that I would do most important in politics was help a dad achieve a dream he thought was dead. Wow. And then I got to watch
him in office. I got to be in those meetings and he had a chance that he took to expand Medicaid and about four hundred thousand Kentuckians got healthcare coverage for the first time ever. I'll never forget being in an elevator with him, and somebody walks in and just starts crying, and I look at her and I say, what are you okay? And she says, I'm alive because of your dad. That I could not get coverage, that people would not cover the conditions that I had until
Medicaid was expanded. It just such a powerful moment that showed that even though the news often does the back and forth about politics, in these jobs you can make a real difference.
Do you believe in divine timing? Does your dad not winning in nineteen eighty seven but then going ahead in two thousand and seven, like, do you filter it through that lens?
I do?
I mean, I look back in nineteen eighty seven, and in that moment, while crushing for him, ended up being incredible for our family.
I got my dad back.
He had been probably overly involved in the job, and I make sure that I carve out time for my family because I lived through that at a young age.
But I got him back.
He coached baseball with me. I'm not going to say I played baseball because that's an operative verb.
I was on a team and just.
To have him there, and even though he pushed so hard, in school work.
To have him there pretty special.
So I do believe in divine timing, both for our family and how it ultimately worked out. And he served eight years. He guided us through the Great Recession. I think about being the governance created the most jobs and the most private sector investment.
Guess who's second?
He is? Wow?
And I get to call and tell him that every night.
He must love die wait for that. Cool. I can't wait for Andy to tell me I'm second.
But also thank you. I mean to go through the tough times. That gives us a chance to hopefully have the better times.
Yeah, gosh, it's the most extraordinary thing that your father was governor and that you were governor. It must be like staring up a mountain.
For your kids.
They must be like, whoa am I supposed to be the governor too?
And we try to tell them every day.
Now, you know, I'm going to wrap our arms around our kids to make sure that they know that they are loved and cared for, that they have an opportunity to pursue whatever pathway they choose. I just want them to be them. I want them to be happy, I want them to be successful. At some point, I want to close the Royal Bank of Dad, but I know that, I know that's further in the future.
Please, I would like to close the Royal Bank of Mom as well.
Great.
I remember at our wedding, Brittany's dad said that and he meant it because it occurred the next day.
That was It's all on you now.
I cannot thank you enough for giving your time coming on the show, particularly in this moment for Kentucky that is.
Once again suffering.
So we just send so much love to the great Stay of Kentucky and so much thanks to you for showing up today.
Thank you now, thank you, And it's been a good experience. We actually just dropped the first episode of the Andy Basher podcast Aha, trying to get out there and communicate directly with folks and to do a little bit of what we've done here. It's to process a difficult world with a conversation with friends.
Great.
We can't have enough of those conversations, I don't think. So that's fantastic. I'll definitely be checking out your podcast.
Thank you very much.
Oh, thank you so much, Guvnor. I really appreciate your time.
Thank you.
Mini Questions is hosted and written by Me Mini Driver Executive produced by Me and Aaron Kaufman, with production support from Jennifer Bassett, Zoey Denkler and Ali Perry. The theme music is also by Me.
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