Hi, how are you? This is Dr. De Maris, Maria Grossman, integrative family nurse practitioner. And I am today on this mindfully integrative podcast, we're talking and mindful chat with Dr. Vani. Gandhi. She is an infectious disease doctor at Mount Sinai Hospital in New York. And her and I had met wonderfully, if few years back and an integrative health symposium, I was doing some research work, and she was doing
plenty of research work. And we met at one of the talks, and from then on, you know, we kind of connected through social media and such. And we knew that we kind of had that Integrative Health mindset. So she will tell you a little bit more about herself. And Dr. Bonnie, thank you so much for joining in on the show. And I hope How are you today?
Yes, I'm good. Thank you very much. And thank you for inviting me, Dr. Damaris, and I so remember that moment when we first met, and all those few moments that we were interacting at the symposium. And after that, of course, rest is all history, how we stayed in touch. And thank you for reaching out to me for being a guest on this talk. Oh, absolutely. Dr. Ronnie, I
mean, one, I know that you very much so deeply believe in integrative health. And then also, you know, in your work and such, so I, you know, you tell us tell the listeners and those watching a little bit more about yourself and how you got into Integrative Health and kind of where you are now?
Yes, absolutely. So my story actually probably goes way back in India, when I first got exposed to yoga when I was very young, and my parents took me and my brother to yoga classes, you know, maybe initially I might have gone reluctantly. But then I probably enjoyed, I don't remember all the details. But I do remember some things. Going to an ashram and going to a yoga Institute and doing yoga with my mother and my brother was doing
yoga with my father. So that's where I think the basis, but I think it probably goes back even further back there. So my grandfather, who was the doctor was practicing and in those times is a general practice. And most of the physicians doctors use to practice out of their home, in the in the ground level, and then the home is the rest of the building. So I saw him sitting and talking to people and the patient's mixing
his medications in the back. And I would stand and watch him very young, just you know, very naive about whatever this is, but just watching watching, watching. So that's where my problem background comes from, and then went into medicine. And I came here to the US. And in the last several years that I have been doing integral infectious disease, I got more and more into talking about nutrition to my patients, to help them to address their lifestyle, talking
to them about exercise. And then one of our previous managers of the, at that time, called the complementary medicine program, left the program and the director of our institute approached me, she called me over to her office and I said, Oh, am I in trouble. So thinking, and then she said, You know, I want to offer you this position. And she said, You know, I've been watching your growth over the years, and you'll be the right person for
this position. So she put me in charge of the complementary medicine program. I said, okay, but I need to discuss it at home and look into it a little bit more in detail. And I'll get back to you in a week. So I did my own research, and I found the integrative medicine fellowship out of the at the University of Arizona, and I went back to her and I told her, okay, I'll take this position, as long as you approve and fund at least part of my training, and she said, Okay, wonderful. Well,
that's how it started. I did part of my training also with and with my nurse Mike, when I was getting my DNP doctor for nursing, and I did part of mine with them when there Yeah,
so that so it started and said, okay, you started work now. But I said, Okay, I'm gonna do some basic guidance to patients on nutrition. I was already doing a lot of reading anyway. So that's why I got chosen, I'm sure. But then I had to get more serious, got some books and looked up the literature even more and yeah, that's how it started. And then I got more and more into it.
And, you know, after I did the training, it's very much blossomed into a whole different way of thinking for myself for my colleagues, I made sure that training for the rest at our hospital, and then the staff at our department is also part of my work. And, you know, that was agreed upon that that could also be part of my work, I wanted that, that education would be a big part of my work.
And you, you integrate that in your work as well as in every aspect. I mean, you probably do it in every aspect of what you're doing anyway.
Yeah, so that's how it started. And it's a whole different story now, but that that's where the beginnings are.
That's where the beginnings are. Oh, no. So how, like, in reference to like, did you go through a lot of struggles. I mean, I know this past year, COVID, of course, is a been a big struggle, that has helped you even grow more with, you know, not even just integrated, but that has kind of been inspiring through your medical and, you know, career.
Yeah, so, you know, there have been a lot of struggles over the years, then, you know, going to medical school itself is a struggle, during my residency and infectious disease fellowship is a struggle, it's tough, it's challenging and stuff. But you know, we get a lot out of it, you learn a lot in terms of that knowledge and experience, but also as a person, we learn how to, you know, be with people and be able to manage everything
about the person. And in the last year, there's been tons of other struggles, seeing my patients suffer from the consequences of COVID. Thankfully, none of my close family were sick, but some extended family, friends, and
other people did get sick. And, you know, I was the go to person for some months from my family side, my own colleagues from my medical school, who are all either assistant professor or Associate Professor of Medicine, either in the US or other parts, it's suddenly I became the go to person, even though they are very advanced in their training and experience, but because I'm an infectious disease doctor, and especially probably because of integrative medicine tool, they were asking me questions,
is there something else that could be done in most of the time, I could be able to, you know, talk to them and guide them? And, you know, help them? Yeah, and then, you know, in the hospital, I saw, you know, a lot of challenging situations with patients, other workers, other health care workers, nurses, other professionals going through so much, you know, in, in their day to day and in their life, in a personal life. Family Life has really been affected really severely for some people. I know.
Yeah, it's such a struggle. I mean, I was I mean, I don't go into great detail now. But I had my dad passed from COVID and dementia last year. And I've had a number of people and no, no, no, I it's okay. You know, I'm saying, and it's not just my story, but you're, you have been faced with so many people story this past
year. And you've had to find ways people want to connect with you probably ask you questions upon questions about the infection, the disease itself, and then is there other ways to help? And, you know, there are people want things to like, where people are asking you questions on like, what can I take? What can I do?
Yeah, they all wanted to know, can I take XYZ software? Man, this helped me well, that helped me I would say, I don't know, this is new. Most of the time, I would say, I don't know. A lot of I don't know.
Yeah, there's so much research, like I just even read another research article about x, y, z on the milligrams of procera. And, or to curate tumeric. And I was just looking, I'm like, Oh, is this one, right? And so I and someone had asked me that I'm like, I have to look back. And I don't think we don't have enough research on it yet. You know, we're still working in that
direction. Um, was there I mean, in a very fun question, is there something that people don't know about you that you want to share?
Oh, yes, that is a very interesting one. There are a lot of things like that. But one was coming to my mind. Within the last few days. I was saying to my daughter, she knows it, of course. But most people don't know I met Indira Gandhi. Really?
Oh my god, what are you practicing?
No, no, no, I was very small. erase my mom. I was probably in my teens. And my, my father and mother both are very into community service. So they were leaders in their local organization in Mumbai. And so as part of that they were touring places, going to conferences and meetings and so on. So one of the time it was in there, we were going to the north and so they said, okay, we should go and meet Indira Gandhi. Oh my gosh, I'm not gonna say anything.
Yeah, Gandhi to your last name, you know, yes.
So I have a picture with her. And that's so fascinating to see that now, you know, after all these years, so you know, at that time was like, Okay, I
just met somebody who was the Prime Minister, but okay, but that's so amazing. Wow. And then now you kind of take back, it's like, that is pretty cool. Yeah, that's definitely you got to put that in the the books for in Have you had Lamin Well, let's go into like inspiring were there people through your career even in integrative health and and that have kind of helped you along the way, or even just an inspiring quote, maybe even a book?
Yeah, so there have been many points that I can say I've been inspired. My grandfather, as I was saying, who was a practicing doctor, or he was a physician, who was title. I think he received the title of Captain because he did some work through the, through the World War Two. And so you know, I would see that Captain on the board at the door. And that's, oh, this is this is great, not knowing exactly what it meant. But this is something good. Yeah. So yeah, so then I
would see his practice. So that that was one of the inspiring.
So he's like a military doctor.
You know, you could say it that way, but not really, because he probably went one time to do some work. But he received the title. But even other than that, he was the chairperson of the president of the Tamil Nadu, which is a cepr. And he was practicing Tamil Nadu Medical Association. So he was so you know, leader in many ways, within the state and
country. Then later on, my mom is a major inspiring person, woman, she worked all her life, and I would see her go to work every day, you know, pack us up, the kids, me and my brother, and then go to work. Sometimes I used to go to hang out in our office, and it would see she would be administrative level and have several people under her. And, you know, direct that office. And yeah, so she was, she's still, you know, in India, as is still my major inspiration, as a woman and a leader in our
current leader drive a car
and go to work. And there was a time that she had brought in life insurance to the police officers in Mumbai. And so a lot of the police officers in the city used to know her. So when she would dry, they would salute her. So it was amazing to see all that. Yeah. Now, of course, it was tough life being a working woman. And I love that. And you know, there are some negatives to that, too, because she's not home all the time. But, you know, there were
a lot of positives there. So yeah, so during my childhood as my grandfather and my mother, and then later on, it's my daughter now in my personal life, I think my daughter is a major inspiration. She I taught her a lot over the years, and now sometimes she's teaching back to me things that I told her and she said, You told me this before and you need to do this.
That's so great. Oh my gosh, like um, it's kind of like that full circle. I guess now that I'm a new mom, I'm go I hope that I you know, in green and hope, you know, more happiness and love. And I guess that's kind of where we, we always think about like that, just, you know, bringing out love as much as we can and positive thinking to these little ones. And yeah, and then inspire her. Right.
She's constantly telling me something which I might have told her before. Yeah, so I'm in professional life. There have been many leaders. I remember over the years. One of the main ones who stands out here in us is the first professor, who I met Dr. Janet Shapiro's his Intensive Care Unit doctors so practicing here, I met her within the A on the first day when I came into work as an intern. And she taught me so much over the years, I worked number of times, directly with her. And now I see
her, you know, off and on. Or she might send me an email and say, Oh, I'm so happy that you're doing so well. You know, something nice to say something positive. So that's her and then in the integrative medicine field, Dr. Andrew Weil is a major inspiration. And Dr. Tirana Lau dog is a major, major inspiration. She's always that I don't think any of that who's Dr. louder? Yes, she's our herbalist MD and she was a major faculty. At the University of Arizona, and now she has left
that position. But she was very major in that faculty,
I probably have read her wisdom is probably that he would have
definitely multiple books. In publication, I could probably send you some of the covers so much I have, such as she's been one of the major, inspiring woman and leaders and doctors, in my work in integrative medicine. And I have many colleagues also constantly inspiring me, but these are the people who's really stand out.
Oh, that's, that's amazing. I mean, through the time that you've been working, and now that you kind of are, especially this past year, you know, having to implement what are there is there like something that you can maybe tell the listeners or those watching a little mindful thought or way that you kind of helped or implemented with, you know, not necessarily patients, but in your life to kind of get you through, especially like, during this tough times? Yeah, I
think there are many things to consider when we discuss this sort of subject. Yeah, one of the things that comes to my mind is, you know, I usually don't tell a patient or somebody, just go ahead, go do this, I model it most of the time, I'll say, Okay, this is what I do. I walk every day, or, you know, I fruits every day or something like that. So there's one quote, by Mahatma Gandhi, you must be the change you wish
to see in the world. So that's something which I've been always practicing, you know, whether it's in the home or amongst my colleagues, or friends or in professional life, you know, we don't model or practice their healthy behaviors, we cannot expect our patients to, you know, do that it's very tough. No, it's really tough to practice, and very tough to live a healthy lifestyle, and it takes a lot of effort. We know that, and it's even harder for
our patients. So yeah, it's gotten even harder this past year. And I sometimes will say, Okay, this is what you have to do most of the time is a very soft approach. And I'll say, Okay, what do you think you can? Do? I just put it over to the patient and ask them, What do you think you can do going forward? Like, for example, if someone's gained weight? I'll say, what do you think you can
do? What do you want to do? You know, in the next few months, before you come back to see me, so and then, you know, is it only regarding Wait, no, it's about everything else, you know, all of our lives have been scattered in the last year, you know, things have changed. So we don't get together the same way. You know, people are more isolated. So it's, it's very different. So we cannot be harsh on ourselves. And we cannot be harsh on anybody else around us. Yeah.
No, I love that fact. I just I appreciate the fact of you saying, like, you practice what you preach. I also, you know, like, I'm very much about if I'm not doing it, I'm not going to expect others to do you know, it's I'm definitely in that aspect, that the other aspect of just realize kind of meeting where they are, like, right now, it's a very
difficult time. And I call them small wins, like, and you like you're saying for one of them to lose weight, you know, what's part of that, like, the connection that they're losing that the mental health aspects that have gone on and, and it's, even if they can just do one part, you know, it's like, Alright, drink a little bit more water for me today. I'm excited. You know, and, and the fact that, you know, we just are emotionally, you know, right now
has been very emotional. And people have been, you know, you try to bring as much positivity through all of this negativity, right. It's been, it's difficult. I will say it has been challenging. But with just you and your bright colored shirt that you're wearing the nice magenta color, that in itself can even make a difference. Right and just smiling. I just very much so.
Dr. Bonnie, you being on the podcast today, and I was there anything else that you're doing in your work or anything that's upcoming that you'd like to share today? I'd love to make sure the listeners can find you and reach out to you. And I'll have all of that available in the show notes.
Yeah, there's a chapter which has been finalized in the records integrative medicine book, which is getting an update. I think it's the fifth edit edition. So that I just signed the publishers agreement, so I should be coming out pretty soon. There's, you know, several others, small things happening, but I can share them yet.
No, no, no,
this is a major one, they're actually signed the publisher agreement. So I can say, okay, it's, it's it is happening.
Oh, no problem, I'll just, you know, I'll put in ways for them to connect with you. And whenever you know, is available, you let us know. And I just very much appreciate being on the show. And And is there anything more? anything additional you want to talk about today? Before we end the show? Oh, yeah, I
think, you know, again, as you were just saying, trying to be positive, find a little spark, find a little light. wherever we are, at every moment, we need to find that little something positive. Otherwise, you know, it is very hard. You know, life is hard. Now. I'm sure you know, what's happening in India is really, really, really, really tough. So we cannot be complacent. But we don't have to be all the all the time up in the arms and trying
to do stuff. We can, you know, practice some self love self care at every moment, so that we can give to others. Because if you only take only we take care of ourselves that we can give to others. So yes, let's take care of ourselves.
Oh, my God, thank you for sharing that extra. You know, I completely agree with you a little bit of self love. You can a lot. But thank you so much, Dr. Vani, for being on the show.
And I
look forward to you being on again. Maybe we'll talk further and other discussions. So yes. And you thank you
very much. You know, I'd love to be again with you. It's been a wonderful conversation.
We'll go and we'll go into more detail.
Yeah, have a good day. Bye. Bye.