Ep 95: Tim Burgess

So I just grabbed a pen and walked over and asked him for good zhotograph, and he said, if I fucking.

Must, we will find out who Tim Burgess is talking about in the course of this episode of Midnight Chat's Number ninety five. Thank you for listening. My name is Stuart Stubbs. I am tonight's host. It was Greg's turn last week when he spoke to idols. This week is myself and Tim Burgess, who you will know as the lead singer of the Charlatans as well as a solo musician in his own right, or maybe you know Tim

I've only been to London once since since Lockdown Agown and that was last week, but I was, you know, kind of it wasn't really for a length of time. So I fan spending spending a day in the city, which is you know, quite a neat well not a new thing for you know, definitely a thing for me these days.

So you're out in Norfolk, right in Norfolk?

Yeah, it's kind of a small village near the sea, but in kind of wooded kind of area. So it's sounds really a lot. It's amazing, but.

I do make it sound good, but you've you've been there a long time. This is the thing? Is it like? It doesn't in a weird way, the whole lockdown thing. It just like levels everything, doesn't it even if you live in paradise. Yeah, lockdown has just made everybody sick of where they are.

Yeah, right, yeah, I think I don't think I could have been anywhere better. It's it was a fine place to spend lockdown, but I'm excited to be in London.

Did you deal with the situation, well, generally speaking, the lockdown thing, Yeah, I think it did. You've got through it.

Oh yeah, I've had moments, you know, I think, but I feel very very lucky.

What's the thing that you missed.

Things that I missed. Well, I realized that I'm I really like spending time with people, sharing, sharing things, and so I missed that. I also realized that I really missed the gym, and I got because I go to the gym pretty much every day, and that's where I listen to music, and it's I do the same thing. It's like forty five minutes on the treadmill with some

So how long have you been a gym guy?

I've been a gym guy for about well since Los Angeles got me into being a gym guy, because it was it was the alternative to the lifestyle that I was leading before the gym, the complete opposite. Because you lived in LA for like about thirteen year yeah yeah, twelve years yeah wow, and that's from like what years are we talking for that? So ninety eight until twenty ten?

Wow, it's a stint. Yeah, how how did you. I mean, obviously you liked Obviously you liked it. Oh yay, that long.

I liked it. I liked it more than probably any other place that I've ever lived. But with that we're sort of like, you know, things that I didn't make it very easy. For the bar and being in a band from the UK, I I enjoyed myself maybe a little too much in some for for a while. But you know, it was the place that kept me. It was the actual place that kept me there because I love it so much.

You know, what was it that made you want to move there?

I've been going to this one part of Los Angeles and it was it was It's Hollywood and it's by the Capitol Records Building, and there's some bars there and some you know, cinemas and places, you know, and I've kind of found like a center and I'd been gravitating towards it since ninety two and we played, you know, we played some big shows there and always went to after parties in this place called the Cat and Fiddle, which is like an English pub in the count Boulevard.

Is it quite? This is just something I've always wondered when people moved to and like musicians moved to LA. Yeah, is it an easy thing to do in the sense of, you know, if I wanted to move to l A, I don't know, like, you know, the green card thing and all of that. When you're a musician, do you kind of get is there an easier way in when you're working within entertainment and then you're an entertainment Well.

Yeah, I mean I just went there and fell in with some friends and I got an apartment and I didn't have a green card, but just kind of like I kept going for appointments for green cards and things like that, and appointments and I actually went for I actually went to get a citizenship the day that I actually left LA because I'd got finally got around to it. I thought, you know, I'm going to try and get a citizenship. Just before I get on the plane home and I went.

For my past the test.

But I had not spent enough time in LA because you know, I had to do lots of work with the band and go on tour and things like that. So I missed out by about two or three days days a year or something in LA and past the test. You know, we had to revise and all that kind of stuff.

Did she what kind of things are on the test?

I just said on my iPod, it's like, you know, about the Fifth Amendment and things like that, and everything that I learned I've forgotten because I only learned it for that one thing.

For that moment. Yeah, yeah, yeah yeah. So what was it that made you kind of come back after twelve years where you did you just feel I kind of need to go home now, this is I'm done.

I felt that I felt that I'd been done for a few years before I left. I there's a few things that happened. I gave up.

I gave up.

You know, the party lifestyle, drinking drugs, and kind of had three years.

In LA going to start. That's where the gym thing came.

And I just found that no one was really following my you know, so I was kind of just on my own in a lot of ways. I was just kind of like, you know, just spending a lot more time on my own and didn't really have any didn't really have any people who had the same sort of musical tastes as me. I was coming to London a lot and just kind of ended up just moving to Seven Sisters.

And it feels like now there's a lot of people kind of within our world, like within independent music. Yeah, who are like musicians who are going out going out there now to work on like TV and film stuff like I think like Graham Coxon's just moved out there to like write for TV and stuff. Right, it's so great. So is that something like did you do any of that while you're there? Do you have any interest in like writing for no? I didn't.

I mean there was opportunities, but you know, I mean things like, you know, I get things like that kind of often, you know, and it's it's and I respond to the emails and then there's response, and then lots of things fall to nothing, you know, and you know, people just like to sort to me an email, and so lots of things like that did come and didn't come, and I made a solo album out there. I made it at Sharlison's album out there that I think is possibly one of our better one, well best one. I

And the listeners Tim is putting his arm high in the Wonderland is great. I think, like you know that that album. I was at university when that album came out. I came to see you play. You played it at Wembley Arena we did on that tour. I came to that and it was, yeah, I love that record. I'm glad. It's nice to hear that that's your favorite record.

I just think it's kind of like, I think it's crazy, crazy record. And it was like, you know, we didn't have master tapes, you know, it was all you know, WAVs and and and and we did it on Aida, I think, but you know, we were literally kind of moving from one studio to the next and being locked out of studios until we paid bills.

And things like that.

It was a real kind of ramshackleie thing. Yeah, it was just amazing. And we worked we've done any saber and we did some stuff you know, downtown La and and and then we finished a lot of it off in in our own studio in Cheshire and it was there's lots of like you know, and we just managed to piece it all together and and it just sounds fantastic.

Yeah. It was also the record where you started that the Falsetto singing came in. Yeah, and that's kind of like I've not you've not done that much on records since. Have you done it at all on records?

I think I think I have since bits and pieces.

Yeah.

But I so I had this idea mark about the idea of you know, men needing to be told what to do. I thought it was quite a good, you know, quite quite a good idea. And I sang it, and I sang it in falsetto because I wanted to sound like I was saying, you know, we're talking about Neil Young and it.

Was kind of like the opposite of a man needs made. Yeah, but I wanted to.

Sing it in the Neil Young kind of way, and then we had that song for a while and we just kind of left it, and then I wanted to sing everything in falset after that because that's kind of you know, naturally, I'm kind of a bit like that. Quite get really excited, and.

That is the sound of that record. There's like, you know loads where you're in, which is what I think makes it. If you did you meet Neil Young when you were out there? Have you met that guy? I haven't. I haven't. Now he might be one of those that it's maybe best not to me, do you know. I've just got that feeling.

I'd love to see him across the road.

Yeah, watch it, just watch him. Would you approach him? It ends? I mean a lot of the time I do approach people. Yeah, I think that's a good rule to have. I know some people who would don't at all. H a rule don't meet the people you admire. And I know some people who are just like, this is my only chance. I kind of like that. I'm more of the other way because I've always I understand that put them on a pedestal. But I do like the idea of being like, well, that's Neil Young. It's my

Oh yeah, yeah, I mean I spoke to lou Reed.

Did you. I bet he's worry. What did you what was your what was okay? Where did you see him? And what was your opening way in? What did you say to him?

So it was around about the time of set the Twilight Reeling album, so it's like nineties. He was sitting on his own in Manchester Piccadilly train.

Station, wow, about to catch a train, about to.

Catch a train, and know what, you know, I was looking at him for a while and thinking, no one, no one knows, but that's Neil.

That's certainly read.

And so I just grabbed a pen and walked over and asked him I could have a photograph and he said if I fucking must, He said yeah, and it was grumping, you know, made a few noises and things like that, and then passed me the pen back and then was kind of like nice then a little bit you know, okay, yeah, because I was just like, yeah, do you mind, you know, because I was all kind of you know, I built it up a little bit.

And he just have you still got the signature? Yeah? Who else have you got? Or is he? Is he an anomally? Is there not many people you've told that?

Col Barrett I've got, I've got cor Barretts, got cow Barretts.

That one's worth that's worth a lot. That's the one that you can retire on. Yeah.

But I mean I like to see people, and I've now I always I always speak to Neil Tenant. I make a point of seeing it. If CM I always I always go and say it's Tim. Remember, only pick up his glasses and go.

So it t is one one person I know you met in La or actually I don't know this. This is a Wikipedia fact. This might be completely untrue. Is Joaquin Phoenix? Oh yeah, did you? Did you record a record with him? For? Like his record?

It was it was a very strange ten days.

Okay, this is like how long have you been in La at this point?

Well, I'm thinking that it was probably about two thousand.

And eight okay, And he was making a record himself which hasn't come out right, this is recording yees.

So Anthony Langdon it's in a bun called space Hog, all right, And so he's from Les right, and Joaquin was writing lyrics and they were both kind of collaborating on music for an album that Anthony was singing. But Joaquin was writing all the lyrics and you could tell, okay, it's kind of everything. His whole life was in these lyrics.

We got there and it was so at that point, did you know you were going around there to like, yeah, I think he liked britpop.

Okay, okay, some you know kind of.

Bring me, bring me a britpop, bring.

Me someone from britpop. So I went to this house and and and then to a studio where they were mixing and and dismantling it. It went from being quite heavy, kind of kind of very very very Bowie right and Book, you know, Book probably also, but kind of more American rock as well, I suppose, But and then it became really stripped down acoustic, ye kind of Bowie style, and

Is that I'm not I'm not here. Yeah, look it up.

We'll get and and and that. And Anthony's in that film, and I.

Don't know if i'd meet him. Actually, he's quite He strikes me as quite an intimidating guy because he's obviously so quite intense.

He likes to blend it. He likes to blend in or disappear possibly, say so you see him on a on the street and he's almost hiding.

You know.

It's a little bit like right, okay, and always kind of.

Yeah, definitely definitely.

Doesn't want to stand out. But then we went to a club and they weren't going to let us in, and he whispered something to this guy into this guy marketing Phoenix, and then he said, man, don't maybe do this, do this, And then we went in and then within minutes it was like just everyone was around our table right the whole building, and it was like, yeah, it was well, did.

You enjoy that? Like, because I think one of the things I love about la I've only been a couple of times, but one of the things I like about it is that you can sense that that world's there. I mean I didn't get anywhere near it, you know, but like there's such something so allure about it. I know it's ridiculous. I know I should be I know I should be like, I know it's not called s out. I should just be more like dismissive of it, But

Well? I think living actually, you know, in Hollywood in that area, it was pretty good because like Silverlight was quite silver Light was closer to Beverly Hills, yeah, you know what I mean, And it got Beverly Hills a few times. But it's kind of like, you know, that's like walking down you know, Regent Street, you know basically, so yeah, it's just another world.

It's a visit.

Silver Lake was somewhere where I, you know, played with other musicians and you know, met Anton from Bran John San Massacre and those guys and and uh, you know, we'll go to shows there. There's lots of really good clubs there, and and and that. Really seeing people film things. I didn't find it alluring really, I just but I

So reckon that that record, that work in Phoenix record. It might might have come out one day. Might it suddenly just arrive? Well, I have no idea.

I mean what I heard was that they were using the bits on the the rap record.

It was going to come.

Oh yeah, which didn't come out either, So I have no idea. I mean, as far as I'm concerning to me, it's there with the the Chaps mythology. Yes, the which brings us back to col Barratt Ahotograph's is gonna be worth a lot?

That was the Chaps. Where are we at with the Chaps? I feel that we brought it up well Chams, I should explain for anyone who is not familiar. Was I'm going to use the term supergroups you Cobraratt who else was in it?

And that was this gig and Martin Duffy and then that changed quite quickly to Stephan from Clacson's.

That's it, Yeah, and was Jamie from Claxton Yeah, yeah, yeah.

We had two drummers for a while as well. But I say for a while we only did three gigs. But and then you know, we split up very unacrimoniously and have not spoken for years.

You know. Okay, there you go, and that's the story of the Chads. Yeah.

We had a five gig plan to get us from the Tapping Tin and Chatter and Chatter That was to the Caunugy Hall within five within five gigs and I like that drive and we wrote a song that lasted for an hour and that's all the hour.

That's all I can remember. Okay, that's all right, isn't it? So I wanted to talk to you about the listening parties because that's been a big thing during Lockdown. I was saying to Greg, who did this podcast with we take turns to interviews, we were saying, we can't make We've got to make sure we don't make all of this series about COVID and about Lockdown. But essentially we have to talk about this because it's been such a

At a certain time, a designated time, people all over the world listen to an album and someone who made that album, a significant member of the band or an artist you know, involved, tweets.

Tweets a long along as we listen. It's a great it's a brilliant idea because it's so simple. Why didn't someone else come up with this years ago? But you actually did, right, you did. The first time you did this was ten about ten years ago.

Yeah, I was actually watching you know with Twitter, you know, I joined up and got a few thousand fans and would post about upcoming gigs and things like that and didn't really get didn't really know what all the fusses about.

In the film, right okay.

And I thought that is amazing. Right, So this is years ago, this is like, this is like ten years ago, and I thought, I'm going to do a Charlatan's album and tweet along.

And about what you remember from recording I remember from track.

And yeah, exactly exactly, And it's like, so I put it to you know the Twitter, my Twitter followers, and they thought it was a good idea, and by the end of it, it was like, wow, this is great. So I did the next album, and did the next album, and you know, I'd done all Charlaton's thirteen albums by

So he was the first one that you did of some bit of a different artist essentially was Alex Carranos.

So yeah, and Dave Rowntree was pretty close, you know, behind and all of a sudden.

So were they getting in touch with you saying this is I mean, well, you.

Know, they're quite active on on Twitter anyway, so you know, they they saw that I was announcing that I was going to do you know, some friendly and they kind of were responding, and I thought Dave would choose I don't know, I don't know which album we would choose, but he wanted to do Part livee okay, and after and Alex wanted to do the debut Ferdinand album. This is like really great of them to do that, you know. Bonad did definitely maybe, and Wendy Smith, Steve McQueen and

So it's like brilliant.

And by the end of it, he realized that he could have a coffee table book if he wanted. Me I'm sure, I'm sure he hasn't thought about it again since that night, but you know, he just had all this like memorabilia and like lyrics that Damon had kind of like half written and he was presenting to Phil and you know, and then and then Bonet obviously had you know, the enormity of kind of like you know,

It's amazing the one that there was some really good things, some good like facts because by these people being involved and sharing the kind of stories about it, there's loads of things that you obviously nobody knows because it's not come out in interviews or whatever. I liked that Bonet shared. I wasn't boned. I think it was the guy who designed the sleep Yeah posted what Liam wanted the sleeve to receive it and it was like a block of butter with a knife in it, just said definitely maybe

Actually, well, he would never get asked that question.

Yeah, Yeah, what was that picture going to be yeah, and and and that.

You know, that's a really great thing to bring up because you know, people ask me all this and what is it that makes it?

You know, and I always think that.

This time passed, you know, between the making of the album and musicians open up a lot more, you know, as time goes on, I think. But you know, that's a really good point, you know, bringing in up the other people like who you know, the people who had significant roles but maybe weren't asking any questions at the time.

And I also didn't realize one of the things that that Bonead said, this is just a g I think this is a great nerdy fact. I didn't know this, but like Morning Glory is over too vinyls because it's too loud to go on to one and that's because the grooves. I didn't realize this. But the louder song, the wider the groove on a record, right.

Wow.

Wow that I feel like I've been educated by Bonhead here in a big way. He's been incredible. He's quite a Twitter guy is and he's quite active on Twitter.

He's been he's been really fantastic and and you know, really got it and and then and then finally did help with the liam on as well.

Yeah, so how is so? So how does it like work now? In terms of oh, one thing I was gonna ask, is anyone as like, is there anything what's the most surprising thing that you that you can remember that someone said? Is there anything that stands out like that? Like a record? The record groove thing.

Or someone said that I headline reading and I didn't believe them until they.

Put you're just gonna remember that. What year is that?

I know, we didn't we didn't, we didn't, I didn't didn't do that.

I don't know.

I mean, it's just everything is that, everything's a surprise to me. It's just like, yeah, I mean it's three hundred and fifteen hour of them.

Wow, and did you do didn't you do one day? Where you did like loads in one day? Yeah?

We're done festivals. Yeah yeah, yeah, And it's starting at eleven and finishing eleven. Yeah.

It's such a great, as I say, it's so great because it's so it's kind of so beautifully simplar. The best ideas are normally like the simplest ideas and stuff. But do you where are you now with it? Like the people, the prs get in touch and say hey, can you do yeah next can you Oh yeah, you're now part of like people's promotional campaigns.

Well yeah, I mean that's that's definitely been an increasing thing and and I think that's I think that's fine. But I also like the idea that someone would do it for because they like the listening party and because they because they follow what's going on because they're fans of it. So even if even if they do want to do their new album, I try and encourage them to do an older album first, you know, because I think then it doesn't you know, it's just more it's

And I keep it like that really and it's kind of no, no, sorry, I was just gonna say, it's kind of almost key that it's an old album in a way, because, as you say, with that distance from the record, they're maybe a bit more open about it. They remember different things. I suppose when someone's talking about their new record that's still in like I'm in promotion mode and I'm saying the things I need to be saying at this point to sell this record.

That's true, that is true. I mean it was great. You know, most people have got into that, have got into that spirit, you know, and and every and everyone loves and everyone loves it after they've done it and can't believe how exciting it it actually is. And you know, Kevin Rowland has been a huge advocate of person, you know, and just you know, he's doing doing all his all his records. But I think, you know, it's it's an

Listen, because obviously it started, I mean, it started so long ago, but then Lockdown has kind of given it this new lease of life and super charged.

It is the longest Silver Knight sensation.

Do you intend to just carry on doing it? Now? Is there like we're in this weird world, aren't we now? I mean just in the sense that Lockdown is ending and things will eventually get back to normal. And I think there's all these things that have been set up that people are like, is this my life? Do I is this my thing?

Like?

What? Like? How do you feel about it? Do you think I feel it?

It's my thing in some in some ways, you know, I meant at the time I jokes on on on Twitter that you know, you know, I am the Twitter guy. You know, now.

You're a Twitter celebrity.

But some people met two guys both called Liam, who never met each other before, fans of what I do, and and they helped to do the replay thing, which I think was an amazing really helped with everything. So if you miss it, you can actually like listen to it in real time on your on your own, which I just think is an amazing thing. And they also helped me with the diary because at first I had, like, you know, people, five people booked in the same spot.

But you know, I love it really.

I love the complicatedness and craziness.

Yeah, it's great. Yeah, it's great, and I think it's yeah, you're right, like I feel like the format it's in is the format it should be in. Yeah, it's like it's it's complicated. Yeah, yeah, don't mess with success, you know, leave it alone. One of the other things that you've had to that you and lots of artis have had to do, You've released a record in lockdown, which is like,

EA.

I always thought that's rough, you know, to have to be in that position. But equally, I think it's probably been tough for returning musicians, doesn't matter how long you've been releasing records, Like you put all this effort into making something and then you have to kind of release it now because it's we don't know when we're coming out of this and all of those sorts of things. How did you find it was it? Was it tough? Were you just okay with with doing it that way?

And yeah, I mean I didn't want it to not come out because I recorded it and finished it and started the process. In October, we were going to go to south By Southwest, and obviously that got pulled first, one of the first festivals to to to to not happen. But we booked tickets and there's a festival in New

An album for the Lockdown, you know. I mean, I think it a strange I think maybe in like his history, I think certain people will remember certain records as being

Time me too, and I think for for that concentrated time, I think records became very important, you know, to people, And I think that's why the listening party works as well, because people were the most common thing that was said was that I've not listened to another minutes in Taris for years. Yeah, you know, because it's all you know, you know, ye street things, don't you or you listen to one track and things like that. And and I was very pleased that my album came down. I came

Like?

You know, it's got to be good, and you know it's got to be like one of the most important ones. And you know track four Yeah, that's you know.

There your two numbers for well, you know, they're all important over track one, right, yeah, track one's always good. If it's not good at track one.

Track is important because if it fails, it too you like, what's the point that's true?

Yeah?

Yeah.

And then there's like there was a time when like this is maybe like mid nineties early nineties thing, which is when I guess I really started getting really into music and hold bands. I guess where I don't know what track it will, maybe it would be track four would always be the acoustic number. And they would be like, well, we need an acoustic one, No needs his song. Now I think maybe it was an old thing. No, maybe

I mean I just think, you know, I like the idea of making an album and and and the thought process that goes with the INN album. So for it to come out during lockdown when people were actually giving albums mhm.

And before we finished, can ask you one question about an interview I read with you about posting drugs back to yourself in Jamerico Records, because this is what I loved about this that if you were caught, you could say, well I don't listen to Yeah, yeah, well that was then can you can you take can you just do you mind telling this story? I think it's great? Yeah? So uh yeah, I mean I would post.

Things that I needed and uh, envelopes that had you know, Jamerica his name on on it, because when I received it, if someone would kind of like, you know, catch me, I could. In my head, I could. I was thinking that they would believe me because I wouldn't listen to his music.

I told it very badly.

But I kind of don't feel the same as I did when I wrote that thing, and and I thought it was legit.

You know, would would you? You'd buy the record?

I still have the record. I still have the record, right, okay, right, there's a recurring thing. Oh so you just take the Okay, I get you take right, that makes more sense. So you take the record with you and you post it back to you as the decoy record.

Record. Yeah, record, Yeah, and I still have it.

I still have it at the Sallaton studio just in case I relapse.

It's also a brilliant defense. Yeah, that would stand. I think it would stand up being caught. Well, they can't. They can't be mine saying that.

I would love your Miqui to do a listening part.

Okay, JK, if you're listening Tim takes that back about the record, that'd be a good listening part.

I mean, you know, the thing is with the listening part is that everyone who's done it, you know, an eternal fun because it's really it really did help people through you know, a very very difficult time and and I feel, I feel really, you know, quite passionate about that.

Great it should it's a it's a brilliant thing. And thanks for coming on the podcast. Has that been all right? I've been I'm rusty. And it's hot in here, isn't it.

It's really hot in here.

And I hope it was good for you. It was good for me.

I mean, I always say too many ers and I always have a few vacant marriage staring space.

That's all right, we can close those gaps. Thanks y, you know, but you can keep that bit if you want. Anyway, good night,